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View Full Version : Matt Lauer equates U.S. Founders with terrorists



John Ashcroft
11-11-2004, 12:51 PM
In an interview with second lady Lynne Cheney, the "Today Show's" Matt Lauer equated the Islamic radicals in Fallujah terrorizing Iraq with George Washington's Revolutionary War army.

Questioning Cheney about her new children's book, "When Washington Crossed the Delaware: A Wintertime Story for Young Patriots," the NBC host asked Cheney, in light of the current offensive on Fallujah, to apply to today the lesson of a "rag-tag group" going up against a powerful, well-equipped army.

Lauer was rebuffed by the vice president's wife for equating Washington's troops with the radical Muslim terrorists then clarified his line of questioning.

"I'm just saying, but the insurgents believe they're fighting for a cause as well," Lauer explained. "They don't believe any less than we believe."


The conversation Tuesday was recorded by the Virginia-based Media Research Center.


Lauer: "Let me talk about this idea that a rag-tag group, not well-fed, not well-clothed, completely under-equipped as compared to this great British army and the Hessian could accomplish this. And let me ask you to think about what is going on in Iraq today. Where the insurgents not well equipped, smaller in numbers, the greatest army in the world is their opposition. What's, what's the lesson?"
Cheney: "Well, the difference of course is who's fighting on the side of freedom. Ideas motivate people. And the idea of freedom is such a mighty one. There's a very good book by a man named David Hackett Fischer has written a book called Washington's Crossing. And I spent a good deal of time talking to him. He talks about how this is an entirely new thing. These are people who are fighting not because they had to, they could walk off. At one point Washington had to convince many of them to stay."

Lauer: "I think he promised them more pay, actually."

Cheney: "He did. But he also told them they were fighting for a mighty idea. And I think the same has been true. The same advantage has been at the back of Americans forever. We have a mighty cause in which we're fighting."

Lauer: "I'm just saying, but the insurgents believe they're fighting for a cause as well. They don't believe any less than we believe. And yet -- "

Cheney: "Well, but Matt, you're being awfully relativistic here. I mean, the insurgents are killing Iraqis by the hundreds, Iraqis by the thousands. It's not as though this is a matter between just 'on the one hand on the other hand.' We are on the side of freedom. We are on the side that I think that idea is so powerful and does give us wind at our back."

Similarly, in an Oct. 18 interview on MSNBC's "Hardball," the Media Research Center noted, host Chris Matthews painted the Iraqi insurgents as modern Minute Men in his discussion with former President Jimmy Carter, author of a novel set during the Revolutionary War.

Matthews asked Carter whether in the Founding Father's "insurgency against a powerful British force, do you see any parallels between the, the fighting that we did on our side and the fighting that is going on in Iraq today?"

Carter replied, "Well, one parallel is that the Revolutionary War, more than any other war up until recently, has been the most bloody war we've fought. I think another parallel is that in some ways the Revolutionary War could have been avoided. It was an unnecessary war. Had the British Parliament been a little more sensitive to the colonial's really legitimate complaints and requests the war could have been avoided completely, and of course now we would have been a free country now as is Canada and India and Australia, having gotten our independence in a nonviolent way. I think in many ways the British were very misled in going to war against America and in trying to enforce their will on people who were quite different from them at the time."

Link: here (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41396)

Nickdfresh
11-11-2004, 01:13 PM
Lauer and Cheney both have points. The insurgents do believe in their cause though I am mystified as to why Lauer would bring it up in that context.

Warham
11-11-2004, 01:36 PM
I don't remember reading about how the Colony troops used wagon bombs to blow unsuspecting British civilians into a million pieces and sending their children out with bombs strapped to their bodies to blow up the local town hall.

Lauer is a cunt.

Mezro
11-11-2004, 01:47 PM
Originally posted by Warham
I don't remember reading about how the Colony troops used wagon bombs to blow unsuspecting British civilians into a million pieces and sending their children out with bombs strapped to their bodies to blow up the local town hall.

Lauer is a cunt.

Lauer is a cunt with a bad hair cut and dreams of being Bryant Gumbel's gumbo.

Mezro...morning TV is such fluffy crap...

Nickdfresh
11-11-2004, 02:05 PM
Originally posted by Warham
I don't remember reading about how the Colony troops used wagon bombs to blow unsuspecting British civilians into a million pieces and sending their children out with bombs strapped to their bodies to blow up the local town hall.

Lauer is a cunt. [QUOTE][i]

I do remember hearing how American Revolutionary war guerillas often abducted "Tories" or British sympathizers an lynched them in the middle of the night, especially in the South where we were overpowered by the British and we were fighting a very (mutually) nasty guerilla war. I have also heard of rapes, extra judicial killing, and torture used by both sides as torture or psychological warfare.

A few years ago, when "The Patriot" came out, British historians were upset at the portrayal of Lord Tarrington's calvary as murdering despots in South Carolina (which was true, they were) without showing a "fair and balanced" portrayal of the terrorist tactics used by the Patriots.

I learned that we used terrorism in the Revolutionary War in the U.S. Army while going through a course on the subject.

While the aims of the American Patriots were as noble as the aims of the Iraqi insurgents are despotic, have no illusions about the glorious Revolution my friend.

Matt Lauer has a point. Though he is misguided in the direct comparison.

aesop
11-11-2004, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
[B]
Lauer: "Let me talk about this idea that a rag-tag group, not well-fed, not well-clothed, completely under-equipped as compared to this great British army and the Hessian could accomplish this. And let me ask you to think about what is going on in Iraq today. Where the insurgents not well equipped, smaller in numbers, the greatest army in the world is their opposition. What's, what's the lesson?"

"Dont Tread on Me" the American Revolutinaries' motto lives on........
Big government, left-wingers, and terrorists aim to prohibit your LIBERTY.
Show your DEFIANCE!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.foundingfathers.info/stories/images/gadsden-flap.gif

Warham
11-11-2004, 03:49 PM
I'll always consider the Revolution glorious. It got us out from under that filthy bugger, King George.

FORD
11-11-2004, 03:57 PM
I hope nobody's confusing Matt Lauer with the "liberal media", because he is indeed a cunt. A neocon cunt to be specific.

It's a valid question to ask though: what is terrorism, and who is a terrorist?

Did old King George and the Brits consider George Washington a terrorist? I think it's safe to assume they did.

The Jews in Israel consider the Palestinians "terrorists" and the Palestinians feel the same about the Jews. So who's right? both? neither?

Iraqis no doubt think the BCE and US troops are the terrorists. Can you blame them? Their country was invaded without cause and the occupation continues. And whatever reasons are given, they ain't buying it.

It's all a matter of perspective I guess. And my perspective is the whole fucking mess could have easily been avoided by not going there in the first fucking place.

Warham
11-11-2004, 04:02 PM
I guess we could have avoided the mess in the 1700's by not going to war against Great Britain.

Just think, Prince Charles' glorious profile could be on our two dollar bill!

BigBadBrian
11-11-2004, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by FORD
I hope nobody's confusing Matt Lauer with the "liberal media", because he is indeed a cunt. A neocon cunt to be specific.


You're joking, right?

Warham
11-11-2004, 05:49 PM
Nobody on the Today show is a conservative.

Katie Couric could have worked on Kerry's campaign, she was so biased.

FORD
11-11-2004, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by BigBadBrian
You're joking, right?

Obviously you didn't see his ass kissing interview of Junior, nor his assault on Michael Moore. His right wing bias is blatantly obvious to anyone who's watched his weasel ass.

Denny
11-11-2004, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by FORD
I hope nobody's confusing Matt Lauer with the "liberal media", because he is indeed a cunt. A neocon cunt to be specific.

It's a valid question to ask though: what is terrorism, and who is a terrorist?

Did old King George and the Brits consider George Washington a terrorist? I think it's safe to assume they did.

The Jews in Israel consider the Palestinians "terrorists" and the Palestinians feel the same about the Jews. So who's right? both? neither?

Iraqis no doubt think the BCE and US troops are the terrorists. Can you blame them? Their country was invaded without cause and the occupation continues. And whatever reasons are given, they ain't buying it.

It's all a matter of perspective I guess. And my perspective is the whole fucking mess could have easily been avoided by not going there in the first fucking place.

The English are Fucking Terrorists.


RIP Bobby Sands 1954-1981

http://www.bobbysandstrust.org/images/pic.jpg


:(

Nickdfresh
11-11-2004, 06:22 PM
Originally posted by Warham
I guess we could have avoided the mess in the 1700's by not going to war against Great Britain.

Just think, Prince Charles' glorious profile could be on our two dollar bill!

They'd be pound notes in that case. I too consider the Revolution glorious. I'm just saying the world ought not be viewed through a prism of black and white.

BigBadBrian
11-11-2004, 06:25 PM
Originally posted by Denny

RIP Bobby Sands 1954-1981



Bobby Sands took it in the arse. :spank:

Nickdfresh
11-11-2004, 07:29 PM
Bobby Sands: My God it's like the Cult of Mary or something! Can't this shit wait until St. Paddy's day.

Sands didn't take it in the ass, but he did smear his prison walls with his own shit as a protest.:gulp:

Viking
11-11-2004, 08:02 PM
Originally posted by FORD:

It's a valid question to ask though: what is terrorism, and who is a terrorist?

Did old King George and the Brits consider George Washington a terrorist? I think it's safe to assume they did.

I don't recall the colonials strapping kegs of black powder to little kids, shipping them back to England, and having them blow themselves up in the middle of London. There is a marked difference between the general populace drawing a line in the dirt and defending it, and sending the unbalanced and coerced to do the job you don't have the brains, balls, or spirit to do yourself. And if you try to equate the draconian, oppressive dogma that those Islamic fanatics espouse to what men like Washington truly put their lives on the line for, I'll cut your fucking tongue out of your head on their behalf. I was born and raised in the cradle of where this country sprang forth - we place it only second to God. You pay lip service to it while you piss on it's memory. I'll slice you into bacon if you care to attempt to debate it with your quiver full of tinfoil-hat revisionism.



The Jews in Israel consider the Palestinians "terrorists" and the Palestinians feel the same about the Jews. So who's right? both? neither?

Funny - I don't recall the Israelis going into the Gaza Strip and setting off car bombs lately. Or ever, for that matter.


Iraqis no doubt think the BCE and US troops are the terrorists. Can you blame them? Their country was invaded without cause and the occupation continues. And whatever reasons are given, they ain't buying it.

To you, the 80% of the positive news that comes out of there is ignored and/or trumped by the 20% of the distorted drivel that your cronies at CNN and NPR force feed you. But, to you - like with your whole miserable cadre of Marxist do-nothings - think that, heeheehahahahahaha....the United Nations is the answer to everything. Hussein would still be in power until he died a natural death, if it were up to the likes of you. How many thousands more would have died? Oops - I forgot that ideology means more to you than moral imperative. Oh, and by the way - I will be one of the Americans working hard to have the likes of National Propaganda Radio defunded. That slanted PR arm of the DNC will not be paid for by the tax money of REAL Americans - including me. Stand the fuck by for the occasional news updates, right on this fucking channel. Don't like it? Then emigrate, or join the hordes of your fellow juveniles threatening to secede. You are children. :killer:

Nickdfresh
11-11-2004, 08:15 PM
Your arguments have already been covered in the previous portion of the thread Viking. Try to keep up and do your homework before posting. I am watching "Saving Private Ryan," I'll get back to you when I have more time.

John Ashcroft
11-11-2004, 08:48 PM
And while you're hating America, it's founding fathers, and everything it stands for, why don't cha find a new place to live. mkay?

Nickdfresh
11-11-2004, 09:03 PM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
And while you're hating America, it's founding fathers, and everything it stands for, why don't cha find a new place to live. mkay?

Talkin' to me. Actually my "Liberal" ideology is far more in line with the founding fathers than your mindless, pseudo-patriotic bullshit. Why don't don't you go goose step off to the Michigan Militia or something, and pretend that what you want to remake America into is in anyway related to the Constitutionality of our founding fathers.

JCOOK
11-12-2004, 12:11 AM
Did I miss something here, We said fuck you England we're outta here.they didn't like it and tried to get us and this country back. These"freedom fighters" kill anyone who they deem as infidels.

Ally_Kat
11-12-2004, 12:42 AM
Originally posted by FORD

Did old King George and the Brits consider George Washington a terrorist? I think it's safe to assume they did.


I think they viewed him and the colonists more as rebels.

aesop
11-12-2004, 08:41 AM
Originally posted by JCOOK
Did I miss something here, We said fuck you England we're outta here.they didn't like it and tried to get us and this country back. These"freedom fighters" kill anyone who they deem as infidels.

Most excellent observation, cookie! And you know it was kick ass patriots who staged the boston tea party inspired by my fav founding father J.Q. Adams!!! Hard to believe that the east coast actually had people with brains and balls at one time.

Nickdfresh
11-12-2004, 08:45 AM
Let me make one thing clear because apparently people don't read my posts closely (or at all) before they jump to conclusions.

What I said was that SOME American Patriot guerillas in the southern part of the country used forms of terrorism to terrorize Tory's and the Crown sympathizers. The British and their Tory lackeys ALSO used terrorism in a very nasty part of the American Revolutionary War.

It is my understanding that, with rare exceptions, the "official" American continental Army and the the British Army did not use terrorist tactics on the whole.

aesop
11-12-2004, 10:06 AM
Some of the signers of the constitution had their sons killed publically by the Brits in a show designed to kill the will of the Americans. One signer (I forget which one) had both his sons held prisoner in a NY jail, and he had 24 hours to surrender or have his sons tortured and killed. He didn't surrender...

That's how much they loved this country. And the first sign that terrorism cannot win if your resolve is strong.

John Ashcroft
11-12-2004, 10:20 AM
You mean they didn't strap explosives to their sons and send them into British controlled areas???

Figs
11-12-2004, 10:34 AM
This reminds me of "The Savage Curtain" episode of Star Trek where Kirk, Spock, and Abraham Lincoln et. al. have a fight with Genghis Khan, Kahless et. al. while being "observed" by a higher power (a big rock in this case).

The big rock noticed while Kirk's team was good and Khan's team was evil, they both used the same means to achieve their goals.

Indeed, in another parallel, Kahless is regarded as evil in this episode, but we later find out in is the Next Generation series that Kahless is the most revered figure in Klingon lore.

aesop
11-12-2004, 11:07 AM
Found it:

New Jersey signer, Abraham Clark:

He gave two sons to the officer corps(55) in the Revolutionary Army. They were captured and sent to the infamous British prison hulk afloat in New York harbor known as the hell ship "Jersey," where 11,000 American captives were to die. The younger Clarks were treated with a special brutality because of their father. One was put in solitary and given no food. With the end almost in sight, with the war almost won, no one could have blamed Abraham Clark for acceding to the British request when they offered him his sons' lives if he would recant and come out for the King and parliament. The utter despair in this man's heart, the anguish in his very soul, must reach out to each one of us down through 200 years with his answer: "No."

Loki
11-12-2004, 11:24 AM
surely thine lack of humility 'twill prove thine undoing, fools. In sooth, two opposites oft become one in such matters.

aesop
11-12-2004, 11:38 AM
Humility towards whom? Please expound on this tasty morsel of wisdom...

Angel
11-12-2004, 02:40 PM
George Bush is the Osama of the Christian World. :(

diamond den™
11-12-2004, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by Angel
George Bush is the Osama of the Christian World. :(

Enough of that BULLSHIT.....missy.

:mad:

Nickdfresh
11-12-2004, 02:45 PM
Some Patriots abducted and hanged enemy Tory supporters in the middle of the night. There were also cases where daughters (on both sides) were raped in order to shame the fathers/husbands/brothers on the opposite side of the conflict. They didn't have technology to make time bombs, but prisoners were often shot or cut after they surrendered and often time no quarter was given. Patriot guerillas often raided Tory sympathizer villages and burned the houses and killed the inhabitants. As did Tory militia units.

If you go to the Bunker Hill Monument on the Freedom Trail in Boston(actually the battle was fought on Breeds Hill), they have an exhibit of letters by mostly the British Soldiers and Marines in the city circa 1775.

I read a letter where a Brit Marine officer complains that the "traitorous rebels" used dirty ammunition or musket balls that were poisoned or designed to explode.

And also, thousands of American Loyalist Tories fled to Canada after the war. If we didn't use some forms of terrorism, why didn't they stay? Why did these people leave their property behind and lose the equivalent of Billions in today's dollars? Because they were threatened with revenge! Several post-war murders took place in order to "ethnically cleanse" America.

Angel
11-12-2004, 02:50 PM
fuck off.... LOSER!

So, I'm Missie now, eh? What happened to Commie? Like I said, it's Canuck BITCH to you!

FORD
11-12-2004, 02:53 PM
Just ignore Tulip Boy. He will be leaving us very shortly.

Nickdfresh
11-12-2004, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by Figs
This reminds me of "The Savage Curtain" episode of Star Trek where Kirk, Spock, and Abraham Lincoln et. al. have a fight with Genghis Khan, Kahless et. al. while being "observed" by a higher power (a big rock in this case).

The big rock noticed while Kirk's team was good and Khan's team was evil, they both used the same means to achieve their goals.

Indeed, in another parallel, Kahless is regarded as evil in this episode, but we later find out in is the Next Generation series that Kahless is the most revered figure in Klingon lore.

Good post Figs! You actually make more sense than most here!

ODShowtime
11-12-2004, 03:00 PM
FORD, that's the best policy. The two threads devoted to his bullshit are most assuredly making his day. Hopefully they represent the apex of his career here.

Figs
11-12-2004, 03:03 PM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Good post Figs! You actually make more sense than most here!

Crap! I just wanted people to think I's fucked in the haid.


Spock! Help me, Spock!

Nickdfresh
11-12-2004, 03:08 PM
Don't worry, we still think you are very illogical..and yes, as you emotional humans put it Doctor, fucked in the head.

Loki
11-14-2004, 10:29 AM
aesop, thine grecian title doth a disservice to that ancient sage, for thine wisdom is but a speck compared to that lofty palace.
thine love of rhetoric hath blinded thee to the truth that thine forefathers were not all saints & cavaliers. in sooth, no combatants are ever stainless, rather oft discord rules among their ranks.

Wayne L.
11-14-2004, 10:39 AM
If you take what Matt Lauer of the Today show says seriously then you're just as stupid as he is.

Nickdfresh
11-14-2004, 12:09 PM
Matt Lauer is another clueless talking head, true enough. Some producer probably told him to say that through his tele-puppet earpiece in order to generate controversy and hence ratings..

Nickdfresh
11-14-2004, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by Angel
George Bush is the Osama of the Christian World. :(

I am no fan of Bush, er...at least not George Bush. I certainly didn't vote for him. But that seems like a serious bit of hyperbolic overstatement.

BITEYOASS
11-14-2004, 09:13 PM
Wasn't this Matt Lauer Punk caught snorting lines not too long ago? No fuckin cokehead is gonna convince me that those ragheads are freedom fighters!

McCarrens
11-14-2004, 11:35 PM
What this bitch said is as much an insult to America as Ford's continuing bullshit posts.

I wish thye would both just learn to shut ther damned yaps.

The world (and Roth Arny) would be better for it.

Oh, and Ford, I forgot, what is the man's name who is going to be America's president for another four years?

Cathedral
11-15-2004, 12:21 AM
Ok, when everyone chooses to stop attacking each other we can all meet in the middle and see to it that this country gets directed in the right direction.

An American President only has 4 to 8 years to serve, which in my opinion is a short amount of time given where we came from and where we are going.

So, lets stop playing tug of war with America, find a common ground, and build from there.
This bullshit will not get any of us anywhere at all.

If a Democrat that is worth a damn runs in '08, you'll have a chance, Kerry wasn't him, move on, get over it.

Neither side is willing to be strong-armed into the others policy, that much is clear, but dammit, this back stabbing, ankle biting bullshit is worse for our country than either man who ran for the office.

We are stronger together than we are divided, period.

John Ashcroft
11-15-2004, 08:14 AM
Yes, let's all get together on the issues.

We can do this, so long as democrat's (the losers) are willing to change their platform to the following:

Tax cuts for all, abolishment of the IRS as we know it, abortion = illegal, military = strong = good and will be properly funded, terrorists will be all killed, governments that sponsor terrorism will be replaced, welfare will be abolished (as we know it), the government will never take over any further aspects of health care (or any other social venture), Social Security will be privatized, Conservative judges will be confirmed in various positions around the country, the most ridiculously liberal judges (who reside in mainly "blue" states) will be impeached and replaced by conservative judges, and finally, socialism will be labeled for the failure it is, then be denounced and made illegal.

That should about do it. So let's get to work on our "togetherness", shall we?

FORD
11-15-2004, 09:23 AM
Fine. Let's abolish ALL federal taxes.

And watch the red states (and the BCE military-industrial complex) sink like a rock.

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 09:55 AM
I'll go along with abolishing welfare if you make salaries for CEO's over $200,000 a year illegal. Also, if you abolish corporate welfare which costs U.S. taxpayers far more than welfare does and get rid of the outrageous severance packages that CEO's receive for getting fired for incompetence, then we'll talk about welfare.

By the way, what about the poverty hell kids that aren't aborted will fall into in inner cities? Is this yet another case of worrying about fetus' and basically adopting the attitude of "fuck 'em once their out of the womb.?"

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 10:01 AM
Originally posted by BITEYOASS
Wasn't this Matt Lauer Punk caught snorting lines not too long ago? No fuckin cokehead is gonna convince me that those ragheads are freedom fighters!

Not to defend Lauer, but I don't think that was exactly his point. I think what he was trying to say was that the insurgents are as committed to their ideology (which varies depending on the group; i.e. Saddam loyalists, Islamic extremists etc.) as our founding fathers were to theirs ( democracy, a state founded on the age of reason, constitutional law, etc.). I don't think he meant that they are moral equivalents, just that some of their methodologies are similar.

ODShowtime
11-15-2004, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
I'll go along with abolishing welfare if you make salaries for CEO's over $200,000 a year illegal.

I don't mind the $200K salaries so much. What I do mind is the multi-million $ performance bonuses they get. The should all be halved, at least, right now. Those sharks would still be filthy rich. Maybe then they wouldn't be so willing to commit fraud and all that other bullshit they do to meet earnings expectations. Or be so willing to sell out their countrymen for a reduction in labor costs.

bunch of bums up there

John Ashcroft
11-15-2004, 11:09 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Fine. Let's abolish ALL federal taxes.

And watch the red states (and the BCE military-industrial complex) sink like a rock.

So now liberal's are against welfare???

Interesting how you types like to give hand-outs all around, so long as the masses vote for you. Now that they are not, it's time to take your ball and go home, huh. Pussies.

Also, how do you think the wealthy have felt for years? Your type has been taking from the "haves", and redistributing wealth to the "have nots" since the New Deal! And the dependent class you've built consistently voted for more! If the rich in this country shared your attitude, they'd pick up shop and move to another country. What would that do to all your precious pet social programs?

FORD
11-15-2004, 11:19 AM
Originally posted by BITEYOASS
Wasn't this Matt Lauer Punk caught snorting lines not too long ago? No fuckin cokehead is gonna convince me that those ragheads are freedom fighters!

But you let a cokehead convince you that they are "terra-ists"??

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 11:26 AM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
So now liberal's are against welfare???

Interesting how you types like to give hand-outs all around, so long as the masses vote for you. Now that they are not, it's time to take your ball and go home, huh. Pussies.

Also, how do you think the wealthy have felt for years? Your type has been taking from the "haves", and redistributing wealth to the "have nots" since the New Deal! And the dependent class you've built consistently voted for more! If the rich in this country shared your attitude, they'd pick up shop and move to another country. What would that do to all your precious pet social programs?


Free Ken Lay!! Save Enron. Maybe they can move to another country. I like how they redistributed wealth to themselves by paying bonuses as the company tanked and took the stock market with it.

I guess we should just completely destroy the middle class, oh we already are.

FORD
11-15-2004, 11:37 AM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
So now liberal's are against welfare???

THIS Liberal has always believed that anybody physically and mentally capable of working should do so. Which isn't always easy in a BCE economy. And obviously, corporate welfare is a fucking outright fraud. Especially when it's for companies making shitty products - I.E. the Chrysler bailout of the 80's - or companies whose main product line serves no legitimate purpose and deserves to go out of business. I.E.subsidizing tobacco companies

If the rich in this country shared your attitude, they'd pick up shop and move to another country.

They're already doing so. Or at least off-shoring their corporations as a tax dodge. Which is bullshit. If the corporations want war for profit, let THEM pay for it out of their 7 figure CEO salaries. The fact that this country has allowed these fucks to dodge their fair share of the taxes while shifting the burden to the middle class is beyond appalling.

And guess whose getting hit with a big chunk of that??

Apart from Warren Buffet in Omaha, a few oil criminals in Texas, and those fascist pigs the Waltons in Arkansas, there ain't a lot of really rich people out in the sea of red dirt, is there?

So who is subsidizing them? That's right, YOU are. Hope you enjoy Great Depression II, and I can't wait for Mush to blame it all on Clinton's dick.


:rolleyes:

John Ashcroft
11-15-2004, 12:22 PM
Wrong answer.

And you know it. The top 1% of income earners in this country pay 38% of the federal pie. You soak them some more, they'll simply lay off people and/or close shop. This is simple economics, whether you think it's "fair" or not. Whether your jealousy drives you insane or not...

After all, that's what it all comes down to with you libs anyway. What's the "right" tax rate for the rich, 50%??? 75%??? It's really "unfair" that they make more money than you anyway, right?

FORD
11-15-2004, 12:35 PM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
Wrong answer.

And you know it. The top 1% of income earners in this country pay 38% of the federal pie. You soak them some more, they'll simply lay off people and/or close shop. This is simple economics, whether you think it's "fair" or not. Whether your jealousy drives you insane or not...

Bullshit. The majority of them use every loophole, deduction, and semi-illegal shelter they can get away with to get out of paying taxes. Brainless Leader even admitted this himself on the campaign trail on at least three seperate occasions. Do they try to soak the people? Yes, but that's where reform is neccessary. Pass a law that says that they cannot pass taxes on to customers. I don't get to pawn my taxes off on anybody. Why should they?


After all, that's what it all comes down to with you libs anyway. What's the "right" tax rate for the rich, 50%??? 75%??? It's really "unfair" that they make more money than you anyway, right?

Depends on the situation. In my opinion, rich people who earned their own money by inventing something that somehow bettered society deserve a benefit for doing so. On the other hand, the grandson of a man who financed Adolf Hitler shouldn't make one goddamned dime off of the blood money of 6 million dead Jews and millions of others who died as a result. Taxing the BCE out of existence would not only be justified, it's necessary for this country's very survival.

And even without that extreme example, I don't believe anyone deserves to sit on their ass their entire life because of what their great great grandfather did.

Myself, I would support a reasonable flat tax if - AND ONLY IF - there were absolutely no loopholes, shelters, or passing on to customers of any kind. When Steve Forbes proposed such a thing, the concept was interesting, but I didn't trust him to implement it fairly, as he's an inheritance billionaire himself.

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
Wrong answer.

And you know it. The top 1% of income earners in this country pay 38% of the federal pie. You soak them some more, they'll simply lay off people and/or close shop. This is simple economics, whether you think it's "fair" or not. Whether your jealousy drives you insane or not...

After all, that's what it all comes down to with you libs anyway. What's the "right" tax rate for the rich, 50%??? 75%??? It's really "unfair" that they make more money than you anyway, right?

The top 1% own over 50% of the country. They should fucking pay there fair share based on that! Then you could cut taxes on the middle class all you want.

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by Figs
This reminds me of "The Savage Curtain" episode of Star Trek where Kirk, Spock, and Abraham Lincoln et. al. have a fight with Genghis Khan, Kahless et. al. while being "observed" by a higher power (a big rock in this case).

The big rock noticed while Kirk's team was good and Khan's team was evil, they both used the same means to achieve their goals.

Indeed, in another parallel, Kahless is regarded as evil in this episode, but we later find out in is the Next Generation series that Kahless is the most revered figure in Klingon lore.

KAAAHHHHHHNNNNN!

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 01:38 PM
Originally posted by BITEYOASS
Wasn't this Matt Lauer Punk caught snorting lines not too long ago? No fuckin cokehead is gonna convince me that those ragheads are freedom fighters!

Why not, people around here get their information from oxycontin "Little Baby Blues" boy Rush.

John Ashcroft
11-15-2004, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
The top 1% own over 50% of the country. They should fucking pay there fair share based on that! Then you could cut taxes on the middle class all you want.

What's the color of the sky in your little, liberal world?

Is it nice there?

Nickdfresh
11-15-2004, 01:50 PM
Blue, little baby blue. Quite being a dittohead and look at real statistics.

John Ashcroft
11-15-2004, 09:26 PM
I have, and have posted them here at least twice.

But they don't jive with your jealous paranoia...