Pirates' Chatter 2005

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Hey, if the fookin' Detroit Lions can have a chatter thread, well so can the Buccos gosh darnit !!! ;)

[Va Beach VH Fan]

This would be a very good signing IMO.... Burnitz is no typical ham-n-egger that the Bucs just love to keep hanging on (see Wilson, Craig...)....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05029/449832.stm

Pirates in negotiations with agent to land free-agent slugger Burnitz
Saturday, January 29, 2005

By Dejan Kovacevic, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

The Pirates are engaged in talks to sign free-agent outfielder Jeromy Burnitz.

General manager Dave Littlefield contacted Burnitz's agent, Howard Simon, two weeks ago and has been in touch frequently since then. Simon declined yesterday to characterize the negotiations but acknowledged that the Pirates are a team for his client.

"We're having some talks, but that's about all I want to say," Simon said. "You always have a positive reaction when a team is interested in your player."

Burnitz, 35, is coming off a rebound season in which he batted .283 with 37 home runs and 110 RBIs for the Colorado Rockies. He hit 24 of those home runs in the thin air of Coors Field. A left-handed hitter, he has a .254 average and 275 home runs in 12 major-league seasons.

His pay dropped to $1.25 million last season after he had two down years, but his strong showing last season emboldened him to decline an option for 2005 worth $3 million and try free agency.

He shopped himself to several of the major leagues' highest spenders and was asking for two years at $5 million per, but that price could be falling.

Burnitz had been in talks with the Arizona Diamondbacks and Houston Astros, but those broke off earlier this month. Now, it is thought that only the Pirates, Chicago Cubs and Tampa Bay Devil Rays are pursuing Burnitz. Simon would not divulge which other teams are talking to him.

Littlefield has said that he would prefer to acquire a right-handed power bat at first base or a corner outfield position, either through trade or free agency. But he has not ruled out getting a left-handed bat if circumstances warranted.

Burnitz, a solid if unspectacular defensive performer, has played left or right field most of his career, but he spent 69 games in center last season and would prefer to stay there. The Pirates are sure to start Matt Lawton in right and could use Jason Bay in left or center. The other outfield spot is open.

The Pirates have $29.29 million committed to the 12 players signed for the coming season, minus an unknown portion of Lawton's $7.25 million salary that will be paid by the Cleveland Indians. If the final 13 players on the major-league roster are paid close to the minimum salary of $316,000, the total payroll would be $33.4 million minus the Lawton portion.

The team has projected that the payroll would end up close to $40 million, which would appear to leave Littlefield enough room to fulfill his wish list of a power bat and another starting pitcher.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

About fucking time McClatchy opens his cheap-ass mouth.... The other small market teams need to join the party....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05029/449731.stm

Owners disappoint Pirates' McClatchy
Baseball salary binge irks him
Saturday, January 29, 2005

By Dejan Kovacevic, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

There was a time, Kevin McClatchy will admit, when he thought it best to keep quiet while Major League Baseball owners increased players' salaries exponentially year after year.

That time, apparently, is over.

Speaking in emphatic terms at the Pirates' annual media luncheon, McClatchy, the team's managing general partner, said he was "very disappointed in the other owners" for their spending surge this offseason and for the damaging effect he predicted it will have on his and other low-revenue franchises.

"I don't know what happened, if they drank some funny water, but they all decided they were back on the binge," he said. "And, you know, the tough thing about it, it just hurts the industry."

He expressed surprise at many of the contracts, adding, "Some of the signings -- and I'm not going to name names -- are ridiculous. ... At best."

MLB's current labor agreement was ratified before the 2002 season, and it initially resulted in a cooling of player salaries. From 2003 to 2004, the average salary dropped 2.5 percent, from $2.37 million to $2.31 million. It was the first decrease since 1995 and the third since records first were kept in 1967.

The freeze ended this winter with a flurry of dollars aimed at free agents.

The highest-priced contracts still were given out by the wealthiest teams, but those are not the ones that have raised the most eyebrows within the game. Rather, it is those handed out by teams that usually are low spenders.

Among the highlights:

The Florida Marlins, trying to draw public support for a new stadium, signed first baseman Carlos Delgado for four years and $52 million. Their payroll will top $60 million for the first time. Delgado is coming off his worst season in seven years. Baltimore Orioles owner Peter Angelos called the Delgado signing an indication that "fiscal insanity" was back in baseball.

The Cincinnati Reds, operating in a market similar to Pittsburgh's, signed left-hander Eric Milton for three years and $25.5 million after he gave up 43 home runs last season, one every 4.7 innings.

The Arizona Diamondbacks, documented to be $200 million in debt, signed pitcher Russ Ortiz to four years at $33 million after he won two of his final 10 starts last season, then signed third baseman Troy Glaus to four years at $45 million months after he had shoulder surgery.

"When somebody goes out and pays an average pitcher $7 million a year, then anybody who's an average pitcher says they need $7 million a year," McClatchy said. "That makes it very difficult."

Of teams spending while in debt, he said, "What you don't want to see is some of these guys spend themselves into bankruptcy. That becomes a liability on all of us. I'm not sure some of these people are writing checks with money they necessarily have."

The New York Yankees' payroll will top $200 million and represent a record in professional sports. The Pirates' payroll is expected to be at $40 million, among the lowest in the game. They have yet to sign a free agent to a major-league contract this offseason, choosing to wait until players' prices go down.

The Pirates have benefited from the labor agreement, as increased income from revenue sharing and a luxury tax brings in more than $15 million annually. But McClatchy said that income, while welcome, cannot keep pace with the increase in player salaries.

McClatchy supported MLB's current labor agreement, but he made clear that he plans to take a more aggressive stance when it expires after the 2006 season. He serves on MLB's executive council and long-range labor committee.

"I think, as we go toward a new agreement, there's going to have to be some form of constraint because these guys can't control themselves," he said. "I know it sounds a little harsh, and I'm criticizing my other owners, but that's the way it is. I'm tired of other people affecting the marketplace and making it more challenging for small-market teams."

He paused and added, "I'm not sure if they knew it, but they may have created a hawk."

McClatchy reiterated his support of the National Hockey League owners who currently are locking out their players in an attempt to implement a salary cap similar to those used in the National Football League and National Basketball Association.

In the past, MLB has had difficulty forming unity in its ownership ranks on labor issues. But McClatchy said he sensed that is changing and that more owners are in favor of controlling salaries.

"I've been talking to a lot of owners, and a lot of us are concerned," he said. "And we're going to speak up."

Officials at MLB headquarters in New York did not respond to a request for comment on McClatchy's remarks.

[redblkwht]

Really wouldnt mind the Pirates in th hunt..I dig the coach alot.
He's all class.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

You're on your own with that one bro, I think McClendon is a fucking idiot...

Can't manage his pitching staff worth a shit...

Afraid to bench his starters....

Makes shitty decisions nearly every game...

Besides that, yeah, he's great....

[High Life Man]

Plus he's been there for what, like 17 years? ;)

Brew-brew-BREWERS!

[Va Beach VH Fan]

No, he's only been there since 2000, I believe...

Just seems like 17.... ;)

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Byrnes would be a nice addition, let's hope the don't give up the farm for him though...

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/sports/pirateslive/s_305385.html

Pirates step up pursuit of Byrnes

By Joe Rutter
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Saturday, February 19, 2005

BRADENTON, Fla. -- An already crowded outfield situation could get even more jumbled for the Pirates in the near future.
It is believed the team has stepped up its pursuit of Oakland Athletics left fielder Eric Byrnes and that a deal could be struck within the next week.

The Pirates apparently have agreed on a list of players, most likely minor-league prospects, from which the Athletics would choose. It is thought the Athletics would get two players in return for giving up Byrnes, a 29-year-old right-handed hitter who batted .283 with 20 homers and 73 RBI last season. He also led the A's with 91 runs scored, 39 doubles and 17 stolen bases.

General manager Dave Littlefield, who has been actively seeking another hitter, already has said he would part with a pitching prospect in order to upgrade an offense that finished 13th in runs scored among National League teams last season.

The Pirates began pursuing Byrnes earlier this month after attempts to sign free-agent outfielder Jeromy Burnitz failed. Byrnes will make $2.2 million this season and he'll get a $25,000 bonus if he is traded. Littlefield, though, has about $4 million remaining in his budget.

If the Pirates complete a trade for Byrnes, they could move Jason Bay to center field and use Matt Lawton or Craig Wilson in right, depending on whether Daryle Ward starts at first base.

Even without Byrnes, the Pirates' outfield situation is complicated. Tike Redman and Rob Mackowiak are in the center field equation, with Redman trying to hold onto his starting job.

"As we speak right now, it's his job to lose," manager Lloyd McClendon said Friday.

McClendon didn't discount using Bay in center field "from time to time" this spring.

McClendon also admitted he'll have difficulty finding playing time for everyone.

"Those are nice problems to have and we hope those are the kind of problems we have," he said.

[POJO_Risin]

I like Byrnes at this point...better than Burnitz...thing is...I'm hearing lots of talk from the Buccos at this point...and not a lot of Do...

We'll see...

Byrnes would be a good addition...

[POJO_Risin]

The Buccos should be shooting for Aubrey Huff...I heard a couple of weeks ago...that they were discussing that possibility...

solid player...when healthy...

[Anonymous]

Pirates' Chatter 2005

Hey, is this thread about Monkey Island?

Cheers! :bottle:

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Originally posted by POJO_Risin
The Buccos should be shooting for Aubrey Huff...I heard a couple of weeks ago...that they were discussing that possibility...

solid player...when healthy...

From what I heard the Rays were asking for a helluva lot, and talk died down quickly after that....

[POJO_Risin]

They are asking for a starter?

Isn't that what the Pirates are offering?

What the snag is...is Huff making a cheap 4.5 mil this year...

and an expensive 6.8 next year...

but he's a better all around player than Byrnes and Burnitz...and would pay the extra money for him...

can't figure out WHY the DRays want to dump him...

I'd be shopping Baldelli...who brings a certain luster since he can play CF...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Last time I checked they wanted Zach Duke, who's gonna be a stud in at least AAA this year, and another player....

[POJO_Risin]

"gonna be..."

famous last words...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Don't I know it....

Their minor league Pitcher of the Year in '04....

http://www.rotowire.com/baseball/player.htm?id=7887

[POJO_Risin]

I like Huff...but I wouldn't give up my best pitching prospect AND another player for him....not when you can use him later in the year to get you an established starter if you need one...or a better bat from a non-contender...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Another year down the drain for House, just shitty luck for this guy...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05051/460297.stm

House faces shoulder surgery
Sunday, February 20, 2005

By Dejan Kovacevic, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

BRADENTON, Fla. -- There was a time when catcher J.R. House was the jewel of the Pirates' system.

Now, at age 25, he could be facing his fourth major surgery in four years and another significant delay to his career.

House learned yesterday from the Pirates' medical staff that he has a dual injury in his right shoulder, a torn labrum and a 30 percent tear of the rotator cuff. He will be examined tomorrow by Dr. James Andrews in Birmingham, Ala. If Andrews determines surgery is necessary, it will happen Tuesday.

If he has surgery, he likely would miss most or all of the coming season.

"I'm not optimistic it can be avoided," House said. "It's frustrating, but it's out of my hands now."

House hits and throws right-handed, increasing the potential impact of the injury on his career, although position players generally recover more quickly from shoulder surgeries than pitchers.

Team officials did not discuss the injury in detail, but they did express hope that House would rebound again.

"I understand how tough those things are, particularly when they set you back in your progress," manager Lloyd McClendon said. "Hopefully, he can be back out here soon."

House's injury was detected when pitchers and catchers had physicals Friday morning. A magnetic resonance imaging scan revealed the tears, and the news was relayed to House yesterday morning. Unlike the previous day, he did not dress with his teammates, instead preparing for the flight to Alabama tomorrow.

Although House described the injury as chronic, he pinpointed the start of the current trouble to his ninth game in the Dominican Republic's winter league two months ago. He played two additional games there, then returned home to Charleston, W.Va.

"I tried to rehab it on my own, which is something I've done with this shoulder for years," he said. "I figured I had 6-8 weeks before I needed it to be ready for spring training, and it might take care of itself. I kept trying to throw at home and ... it didn't work out."

General manager Dave Littlefield said the Pirates were aware of House's chronic shoulder pain for an extended period of time.

"As it is with a lot of players, you try to manage situations as best you can," Littlefield said. "It's come to the point where it's bothering him enough that we, along with he, feel like he's got some problems."

House, the Pirates' fifth-round pick in the 1999 amateur draft, was regarded so highly that he caused a public stir in Pittsburgh two years later when he wavered between sticking with baseball or honoring a commitment to play quarterback at West Virginia University.

He chose baseball but has never stayed healthy for long, having each of his past five seasons interrupted by injury or illness. That includes three surgeries in 2002, one to repair an abdominal muscle, another for a hernia, another to reconstruct his right elbow.

House played 99 games last season for Class AAA Nashville and hit .288 with 21 doubles, 15 home runs and 49 RBIs. He also had two stints with the Pirates, his first sustained action in the majors, but played sparingly and went 1 for 9.

House, who two years ago became a born-again Christian, said he is leaning heavily on his faith while waiting to learn of his fate.

"When I've had surgeries in the past, I didn't know the Lord, so I didn't know how to handle it," he said. "I have such a different, more positive attitude now. Hopefully, God blesses Dr. Andrews and all goes well."

[POJO_Risin]

There's nothing unlucky about it...

chronic is more like it...

he'll end up doing something somewhere though...if only for a couple of years...

we'll see...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Can't say I'm surprised, like I said, the guy couldn't stay on the field...

http://pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20050308&content_id=961718&vkey=spt2005news&fext=.jsp&c_id=pit

House's run with Bucs reaches end
Oft-injured catching prospect released Tuesday
By Ed Eagle / MLB.com

BRADENTON, Fla -- J.R. House's once promising career with the Pirates organization came to an abrupt end Tuesday when he was given his unconditional release.
House, 25, was the Pirates' fifth-round selection in the 1999 First-Year Player Draft. He was selected as the organization's top prospect by Baseball America prior to the 2001 and 2002 seasons, and appeared well on his way his way to becoming the Pirates' next star. However, a string of serious injuries continuously sidetracked his development.

Since 2002, House has undergone reconstructive elbow surgery and surgeries to repair tears in his labrum, rotator cuff, and abdominal muscle and suffered a hernia. The labrum and rotator cuff procedures, which were performed in February by renowned surgeon Dr. James Andrews, are expected to sideline House for the entire 2005 season. His inability to play this year and the fact that he would be out of options next season led to his release.

"It's certainly an unfortunate story because, at times, we had high hopes for J.R., but at this point in time we don't see him making the team," said Pirates GM Dave Littlefield.

"With any player there is a clock that starts when a player is on the [40-man] roster, and there is an option status that is a function of every player's career path and the timing of it."

As per the basic agreement between the teams and Players Association, any player released before March 16 must be paid just one-sixth of his salary. After that date, waived players receive at least 45 percent of their salary. With House scheduled to make at not near the Major League minimum of $316,000 if he spent the season on the 60-day DL, the Pirates saved approximately $263,000 by releasing him Tuesday.

Despite the financial benefits to the team, Littlefield said the move was not motivated by money.

"It's really an issue of us feeling he is not going to make the team," said Littlefield. "You have to achieve throughout your minor league career regardless of where you were drafted or how much of a bonus you signed for or whatever you did in high school or college. At some point in time, you've got to get it done to be able to prove that you are going to be a Major League player."

House, who appeared in six big league games with Pittsburgh during the past two seasons, was shocked by the news of his release.

"It was out of the blue," said House. "They told me in the meeting that through all of the injuries and everything that they didn't see me as being a part of the organization anymore. That's tough to take for your ego to be told that. I understand where they are coming from. It's up to me to get healthy and put a good product on the field to where other people will be interested in me."

House, obviously cognizant of how his career has gone off path in recent years, has done his best to remain upbeat despite the numerous setbacks.

"I'm on the top, and then I'm on the bottom where I'm released. I've experienced both sides of it," said House. "It definitely makes you grow as a person. I'm just looking forward to getting better again and playing in the big leagues."

If House clears waivers, which is likely considering his injury situation, he will essentially become a free agent. He hopes to be back on the field in time to play winter ball.

"I'm looking forward to that. But I really wish I would have been able to play baseball with the Pittsburgh Pirates," said House. "It is really where my heart has been."

A career in football is also an option for the former scholastic gridiron star who was heavily recruited by West Virginia University among other Division I football programs.

"If I get to the point where I'm just not good enough to play baseball and I can't make it, then definitely [football is an option]," said House.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Major scare today, looks like he's gonna be OK though...

http://pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20050308&content_id=961604&vkey=spt2005news&fext=.jsp&c_id=pit

Bay out at least a week
Second-year outfielder hurt diving for line drive
By Ed Eagle / MLB.com

BRADENTON, Fla - Pirates left fielder Jason Bay will be out at least one week after suffering a bone bruise on his left wrist.
Bay, the defending National League Rookie of the Year, jammed his left wrist while attempting to make a diving grab on a sinking liner by Reds slugger Adam Dunn. After lying on the ground momentarily, Bay conferred with manager Lloyd McClendon and the training staff before walked off the diamond.

An MRI and X-ray performed immediately after the game revealed no fractures or ligament damage in the wrist. However, the bone bruise is expected to keep Bay out of the lineup for seven to 14 days.

Bay, who hit .282 with 26 home runs and 82 RBIs in 2004 on his way to becoming the first Pirate and Canadian-born player to take top rookie honors, is expected to be ready for the start of the season. Bay missed the first month of the 2004 campaign while recovering from shoulder surgery.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

This could get interesting if they're busted on this...

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/sports/pirateslive/s_311357.html

Bucs' spending could result in violation of CBA

By Joe Rutter
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Wednesday, March 9, 2005

BRADENTON, Fla. -- If the Pirates violated the spirit of baseball's collective bargaining agreement by using revenue sharing money to pay off debt, the players' association will know about it within a few weeks.
Mike Weiner, general counsel for the players' association, said Tuesday that all owners receiving revenue sharing money must file a letter of certification to the commissioner's office by April 1. The letter details how those funds were spent.

The Pirates received $13.3 million in revenue sharing last season, an increase from $6.4 million in 2003.

The basic agreement states that teams must use revenue sharing money to "improve its performance on the field." But Pirates managing general partner Kevin McClatchy admitted in a December newspaper article that not all of the money his team received was put back into the system.

"We're also trying to get the team back afloat to balance the ship with our debt," said McClatchy, who claimed in 2003 that the franchise had lost $30 million since the opening of PNC Park. "We lost a significant amount of money there in a short amount of time."

The basic agreement also states the commissioner's office may impose penalties on clubs that violate the revenue sharing agreement.

Weiner declined comment on McClatchy's remarks, but said if the Pirates violated the revenue sharing rules, it will be detailed in the forthcoming letter of certification.

"We have regular discussions with the commissioner's office about whether there is regular compliance," Weiner said.

Weiner said the commissioner's office shares the letter of certification with the players' association.

Weiner was one of several officials that attended the union's annual spring training meeting with Pirates players. Executive director Donald Fehr was not available for comment.

Players were briefed on the new steroid-testing policy that is being implemented this year, the CBA that is set to expire after the 2006 season, licensing issues and the possibility of a World Cup tournament being played next spring.

Fehr also updated the Pirates on the labor discord in the NHL and how it might relate to future union negotiations with ownership.

"It's too early to tell how that is going to play out and impact us," Weiner said.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Woohoo, 9-2 Brewers !!!!!

One game down, already in the cellar !!!!

The bastards...

Oh dear departed Pope John Paul II, can you throw some guidance down here and finally tell these knuckleheads in PNC Park that McClendon has to go ???

I didn't get to watch the game live, I'll watch it delayed here in a few minutes, but this guy has got everyone scratching their collective heads now...

The idiot starts Tike Fucking Redman in the #3 spot in the batting order...

That's right, I said #3....

Not Bay, or Wilson, or Ward, Wigginton, or even Lawton for that matter....

Then after Ollie Perez is shaky in the 1st five innings, they're down 4-1, and Santiago triples with 2 outs....

So what does 'ol Lloyd do ?? Let's Ollie hit !!!!

And good 'ol Tike is kicking balls around center field like he's fucking Pele....

This has to be year for McClendon to go, IT HAS TO BE....

[High Life Man]

I see VA has already jumped on the Brewer bandwagon. It's not too late for the rest of ya...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Dude, the press is just HAMMERING the Bucs after only one game....

I mean everywhere, Post-Gazette, Tribune-Review, Beaver County Times, message boards, talk shows, EVERYWHERE....

The main consensus was that all the talk about improvement was basically bullshit after witnessing that sad display on Opening Day....

It doesn't take much after 12 straight losing years, as I'm sure you know, as the other team with 12 straight losing years....

I like the Brewers lineup, have for a few years now actually...

If they can get some horses to work with Sheets, they'd get over the .500 hump....

I don't see the Bucs getting close to that, their starting pitching will kill them...

Ollie will get his wins, he's just too nasty most of the time... I don't think one start in April is going to phase him too much...

But I see Kip Wells struggling again, and probably on the trade block by July...

Josh Fogg is a poor man's Tom Glavine in terms of velocity, but without any accuracy.... Maybe 10 wins from him, if he's lucky...

Mark Redman looks like a left handed version of Fogg... Throws high 80's, he was getting pounded all spring training long... The A's must be pissing their pants for only giving up Redman and Rhodes for Kendall... Another "maybe" 10 wins....

Their #5, Dave Williams, won it strictly by default, meaning he sucked the least... Vogelsong got lit up again in spring training.... And they got scared at the last minute and didn't give the job to top prospect Zach Duke, saying they didn't want to rush him.... What the fuck could it hurt ??

Sorry to say, this team may be looking towards 100 losses, maybe that will finally kick McClendon and his sorry-ass staff out the door....

Aaaah, baseball's back.... ;)

[Va Beach VH Fan]

And the beat goes on towards 100 losses, 10-2 to the Brew Crew again...

And as I predicted, Wells got lit up....

[High Life Man]

Yay!

And we get to play you guys 3 more times next week.

Woo hoo! The march to the World Series has begun! :D

[ALinChainz]

Didn't the Bucs have a slew of minor leaguers fail steroid tests?

[Va Beach VH Fan]

3 of them, all of them scrubs....

[High Life Man]

Woo hoo!

I wish we could play the Pirates more often.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Yeah, another sparkling performance by Wells...

3 gopher balls....

I tell ya, the "McClendon must go" rhetoric is really picking up steam, and I like it....

The common opinion I've seen in the press is if they're sucking around Memorial Day, they'll make the move....

Jimmy Leyland, come on back !!!!!

[Gmoney]

What's worse....the Pirates or Pilates?

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Very funny, about as funny as "your" show is... ;)

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Pretty impressive win last night vs. Zambrano and the Cubbies...

Overcame 3 different two run deficits...

And David Ross, courtesy of a 75,000 trade with the Dodgers, hits his 3rd HR in 19AB's with the Buccos, hitting .421....

They've got a decision to make when Cota is finished with his rehab at AAA.... Cota is out of minor league options, and they've already got Benny Santiago....

But this Ross guy is hitting the hell out of the ball, gonna be interesting what they do...

What am I saying, they'll fuck it up....

[POJO_Risin]

They'll probably trade them all to the Mets for Piazza's yet to be born son...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

But he's gay, right ??? ;)

[POJO_Risin]

Originally posted by Va Beach VH Fan
But he's gay, right ??? ;)

You're hoping...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Bastard....

[POJO_Risin]

Wouldn't you call me a bitch?

lmfao...how you doin' Va...

and hey...you started it you slappy bitch...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Little minor league report action for ya today...

Took my youngest son to watch the Indianapolis Indians (Buccos AAA) vs. your hometown Norfolk Tides (Mets AAA) this afternoon...

Did my research online to see who would be on the mound this weekend for the Indians, and decided on going today so we could watch Zach Duke hurl....

For the majority of the time, the dude was just throwing BB's.... Gave up a 2 run dinger late in the game, which Indy won 8-4... Overall it was a pretty much dominating performance....

This guy should be in a Buccos uniform this year, as should Ryan Doumit, their top catching prospect....

Doumit cranked a 3 run dinger in the 1st inning....

My son got about 5 autographs or so, including Rich Thompson, another prospect they're predicting will be heading to the Burgh one of these days...

Kinda disappointed in Duke and Doumit though... All of the other players signed for autographs for the kids, but those two did not... Maybe because it was after Duke's warmup session in the bullpen, but it wouldn't have hurt him to sign 10 autographs....

[POJO_Risin]

...especially in AAA...

the Pirates have some serious youth...

honestly...I hope they don't waste it...

Having Pittsburgh roll with the youth and keep some of them does us shit markets good...

I would Love to see a Pirate/Indian series...a couple of years from now...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

I'm starting to get the impression that they're really getting gunshy about promoting these guys to the dance....

I mean really, what the fuck could it hurt ??

Let's pretend for a second that I'm Littlefield, McClatchy, and McClendon all rolled up into one (no snide comments please... ;) )....

Right off of the bat, I do everything in my power to trade Tike Redman, Ty Wigginton, Craig Wilson, Daryle Ward, Kip Wells, Josh Fogg, Jose Mesa and Benito Santiago, asking for prospects in return....

Now I realize that the return on these guys isn't going to be optimal, but the more prospects, the better the chances they might turn out to be eventually MLB-ready...

Then, I promote Ryan Doumit (for Santiago), Zach Duke (for Wells), Ian Snell (for Fogg), Rich Thompson (for Redman), Brad Eldred FROM AA (for Wilson AND Ward), and another pitcher to replace Mesa's spot... Note I didn't say for Mesa, Mike Gonzalez should be the closer now, and for the forseeable future....

And let's not forget, they've already got Sean Burnett and John VanBenschoten out for the year with arm surgery....

Then with the roster revamped, out the door goes McClendon, and Littlefield is right behind him....

I struggled with Littlefield's dismissal, but for every Giles for Bay/Perez trade, there's a Aramis Ramirez/Kenny Lofton for Jose Hernandez/Matt Brubek/Bobby Hill trade....

[Va Beach VH Fan]

A couple of excellent articles this morning about the Pirates ownership and their finances....

First, the finances...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05121/497194.stm

Pirates' profit is there, but where is it going?
Sunday, May 01, 2005

By Dejan Kovacevic, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

The Pirates do not, as a rule, divulge their finances. Not even when a third-string shortstop signs a contract.

But one dollar figure always is available to the public through other means, and that is, perhaps, the most relevant one for a team in jeopardy of a 13th consecutive losing season:

The player payroll of $33.6 million is second-lowest in Major League Baseball.

This is no radical departure, of course. The Pirates have been at or near the bottom of that scale most of the past decade.

The difference now is that only three teams -- the Pirates, Kansas City Royals ($36.9 million) and Tampa Bay Devil Rays ($29.7 million) -- are below $40 million this season. Only five others are below $55 million. The Pirates' payroll is less than half the average of $73 million.

Where once the Pirates could point to a wide array of have-nots and primarily blame economics for their annual failures, they are increasingly stark in their isolation.

And that raises three fresh questions this year:

Why did the Pirates' payroll increase by only $1.4 million from 2004 while two teams in similar markets, Milwaukee and Cincinnati, increased theirs by more than 30 percent?

Why has the dramatic upswing in national revenues being distributed by MLB to the Pirates made little visible impact?

What is the Pirates' ownership doing with the profit it made last year and the profit it anticipates this year if it is not spending it on the players?

The only people who can answer definitively are the Pirates' owners, but they are a private company and have no legal obligation to open their books. The team rejected the Post-Gazette's request to divulge specific financial information for this article.

A Post-Gazette analysis of the team's finances -- compiled over the past two months with the help of sources familiar with the finances of the Pirates and other teams, sports economists and trade publications -- projects that the Pirates will make a $12.8 million profit in 2005. That is before debt payments, interest and taxes, and it is assuming no additional money spent on players.

The average team last season made a profit of $4.4 million, according to Forbes magazine's annual survey.

Kevin McClatchy, the Pirates' managing general partner, is adamant that the ownership group is following a prudent business course and that it is not pocketing profits.

He said the team has chosen to apply most of that profit toward a debt that is estimated by knowledgeable sources at $110 million. The rest, he added, is being used for capital projects such as the $2 million scoreboard the Pirates bought for PNC Park this year.

"Not one owner in this group is taking dividends," McClatchy said. "We put any money that we make right back in the franchise."

Sharing the wealth

MLB's current labor agreement, ratified in 2002, was the first to bring significant revenue sharing. The system requires teams at the upper end of the revenue scale, such as the New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox, to trickle down some of their locally generated money to teams at the bottom.

Because large-revenue owners feared their money would go directly into the small-revenue owners' pockets and stay there, a rule requires teams to spend all revenue-sharing income to "improve performance on the field." Teams that receive revenue-sharing money must file a letter of certification with MLB each April that details how they did so.

The Pirates received $1.8 million in revenue sharing in 2001, the last year before the current agreement. Last season, they received $13.3 million. This season, MLB projects that they will receive $18.1 million or more.

That is roughly $17 million the Pirates were not collecting in 2001, the year that PNC Park opened. But the player payroll has fallen by nearly $25 million since that year, when it was a franchise-high $57.8 million. The team reported a $1.2 million loss after their first season in PNC Park.

Commissioner Bud Selig said last week that MLB never has had to "confront" the Pirates or any franchise about compliance with the rule.

"There is no team that has received revenue sharing that's not spending it on the team," he said.

Bob DuPuy, MLB's president and chief operating officer, said revenue-sharing beneficiaries are not limited to using the money on major-league payroll.

"Some clubs have used the funds to directly impact their major-league roster, some have used them to sign draft choices, others to improve their minor-league system," DuPuy said. "The Pirates have clearly utilized the monies received as revenue sharing to improve their team."

It is not difficult to circumvent the way revenue-sharing spending is reported, some experts say. Owners easily can disguise which money goes where by saying that it all is lumped into one central pool. From there, they can do anything with it.

Two leading economists believe that approach is common.

"Revenue sharing has enabled teams to put more money into player payroll. But the fact is, a lot of them are not doing that," said Andrew Zimbalist, noted author and professor of economics at Smith College in Northampton, Mass. "You could be paying off debt. You could be paying front-office people. You could be expanding your facilities. Or you could be taking profits. That's what's happening in some places, and I wouldn't be surprised if McClatchy was doing it."

Allen Sanderson, economist at the University of Chicago who studies baseball's inner workings, said low-spending teams now can find a way to profit from being losers, thanks to revenue sharing.

"You have owners who are doing the right thing and making their teams better, and you have owners at the other end," he said. "You could have an owner who says, 'Hey, I can go to the bar and put nine drunks out on the field and maximize my profit.' Even a bad baseball team wins 40 percent of its games. Why should he spend an extra $50 million to win that extra game or two each week?"

Sanderson made clear he was pointing to the Pirates.

"It's conceivable that somebody could just market the ballpark as having nice views of Downtown, great food and giveaways. At that point, if you can sell that, the quality of the team might not matter at all. It might not be what the fans or taxpayers of Pittsburgh want, but it's lovely from the ownership standpoint."

In December, the Post-Gazette asked McClatchy if the Pirates had spent all of their 2004 revenue-sharing money in the minor-league system. Clearly, it was not used to boost the major-league payroll, which had decreased.

"No, we didn't pour all of it into the system," he replied. "We have spent more there than we had. Much more. But we're also trying to get the team back afloat, to balance the ship with our debt."

Paying debt is not one of the permissible uses of revenue-sharing money. McClatchy has since denied using that money to address debt.

"We are in full compliance with all regulations," he said.

One way to ensure that teams spend the money appropriately would be to implement a minimum payroll. MLB's owners offered to install a $40 million payroll floor when bargaining with the players' union in 2002. But Donald Fehr, the union chief, rejected it on the grounds that the union opposes a salary floor just as it opposes a salary cap.

Sanderson said the union has been hurt by that stance because, in his view, teams such as the Pirates are not paying as much to players as they could be.

"Donald would be better off being less consistent on that position," Sanderson said. "The league should be able to say to its member teams that there is a price of admission to participate, whether that's $40 million or even more. If you don't want to pay $40 million after you're getting revenue sharing, you're better off selling the franchise."

"The rules are in place now, but they're not being enforced by the commissioner's office," Zimbalist said. "And this just doesn't make sense when you look at teams like the Yankees and Red Sox that are putting tens of millions of dollars into McClatchy's pocket and into other pockets. The idea is to create more of a balance so that teams like Pittsburgh aren't always dragging at the bottom of the division. Eventually, people in Pittsburgh will just stop going to games, and that will hurt all of baseball."

Selig and DuPuy defended their system for monitoring how revenue sharing is spent. Selig added, though, that it will "tighten up" in the next two years.

Selig expressed confidence that revenue sharing will take a greater role in restoring competitive balance to the game as the pot grows. The total pool has gone from $169 million in 2002 to $220 million last year to, Selig projects, $300 million this year.

"There are teams today that are competitive because of revenue sharing, but there's work to be done," Selig said. "There is ample revenue sharing. Do we need more? Yes, we do."

McClatchy recently criticized some of his fellow owners for what he felt was an irresponsible increase in free-agent spending. "I don't know what happened, if they drank some funny water, but they all decided they were back on the binge," he told reporters Jan. 28.

"I'm sensitive to Kevin McClatchy's comments," Selig said. "Baseball needs to succeed in those markets. We need to succeed in Middle America. Kevin McClatchy's arguments are correct in that we can't afford to do that. We think we're on the road to resolving those issues, but there's work to be done."

Counting the money

More national money is heading to the Pirates this year than the $18.1 million in revenue sharing.

They will make $19.3 million from MLB's television contracts with Fox and ESPN. They also will receive their first annual payment of $1.96 million from MLB's recently signed 11-year contract with XM satellite radio.

MLB Advanced Media, baseball's umbrella for Internet ventures, could bring the Pirates $6 million to $8 million annually in the near future. But the team is not receiving any money from it this year.

The Pirates also do not benefit directly from MLB's luxury tax that large-revenue teams must pay for having payrolls above $128 million. That money goes into a general pool for player benefits, an industry growth fund and developing foreign talent.

Total projected national revenue for the Pirates: $39.4 million.

That is enough to cover their entire major-league payroll, with almost $6 million to spare.

At the local level, the Pirates will receive $10 million for their FSN Pittsburgh television rights and $2 million for their KDKA-AM radio rights.

Revenue from ticket sales will not be known until after the season, but it is not difficult to project.

In 2001, when all teams opened their books for Congressional hearings, the Pirates reported $48.6 million in ticket sales after averaging a franchise-record 30,837 fans in PNC Park's first year. The average ticket price that year was $19.51, but the team's actual take at the gate was $19.95 per patron when luxury seats were included.

The average ticket price today is $17.08. Average attendance last season was 21,107, but season-ticket sales are up by 2,000 this year, which points toward a general attendance increase. If the team were to average 23,000, including the luxury seats, that would bring $32.6 million.

There also is revenue from ballpark concessions, advertising, a $2.3 million payment from PNC for naming rights, minor parking revenue and other ancillary income. In 2001, the Pirates reported $26.2 million in such income. Taking 76 percent of that figure to account for the drop in attendance -- then adding 4 percent to account for increases in the price of concessions and other variables -- the adjusted projection for this year would be $20.9 million.

Total projected local revenue: $65.5 million.

Grand total for revenue in 2005: $104.9 million.

The total revenue reported by the team in 2001 was $108.7 million.

The Pirates' expenses beyond the major-league payroll include the partial funding of their minor-league system, signing bonuses of draft picks that can reach seven figures, travel costs, salaries of front-office staff and $11.5 million to operate and maintain PNC Park. The latter is the team's second-largest expense. This year, the team also budgeted $3 million for capital projects, including PNC Park's new scoreboard, and $775,000 to major-league players whose contracts were bought out last season.

In 2001, the Pirates reported the sum of those types of expenses to be $58.5 million.

If that figure is the same this year -- the Pirates had 11 front-office layoffs in 2003 and PNC Park has reduced its usher staffing by more than a quarter, but the costs of scouting, developing talent and maintenance of facilities has risen industry-wide -- that would put total expenses at $92.1 million, including the major-league payroll.

That would leave an unspent $12.8 million.

Roger Noll, a professor at Stanford University with a specialty in sports economics, described that amount as "marginally profitable."

That excess could be wiped out quickly, too, if the Pirates choose.

General manager Dave Littlefield is authorized by the owners to increase the major-league payroll up to $40 million, should he choose to acquire new players. When other expenses are counted, that leaves Littlefield about $4 million in real wiggle room.

Another variable is how much the team elects to use to pay down debt. The Pirates' estimated debt of $110 million -- about $10 million less than the industry average -- generally would require an annual payment in the range of $6 million.

Debt includes all future years of contracts and deferred payments owed to players, as well as stadium cost overruns and general loans. All are issues for the Pirates. They owe $25.1 million in future contracts and deferred payments, and they still owe toward their share of the $44 million they were required to contribute toward PNC Park construction.

McClatchy, who has said that the Pirates lost $30 million in their first three years in PNC Park, described the team's debt as manageable, but he made clear he would like to reduce it.

"We're better off, I think, if we go ahead and pay down debt than if we put it into one $3 million player who isn't going to make an impact for us right now," he said. "This is the part that people aren't going to like to hear, but I'm not going to let happen to this franchise what happened to the Pittsburgh Penguins under their previous ownership."

The Penguins declared bankruptcy in 1998.

"We've done the difficult part," he added. "I see things improving from here."

McClatchy said ownership's plan is to address debt so that the Pirates can stay within MLB's required debt-to-franchise-value ratio of 40 percent and be able to sign young standouts such as Oliver Perez and Jason Bay to long-term contracts. The Pirates narrowly are in compliance with the ratio now, according to multiple sources.

McClatchy cited the Aramis Ramirez trade of two years ago as a "glaring example" of the team's failure to follow such a path. Ramirez was dealt to the Chicago Cubs for much less than his worth because the Pirates were under pressure to move salary quickly to fall into debt compliance.

"I think we're getting into shape now where we can sign who we want to sign out of our group," McClatchy said. "I think we need to keep these guys that we have, and I think we will. I see things getting brighter. I see us going in the right direction."

The Pirates have another large chunk of revenue coming their way soon, although it will be a one-shot deal.

The Washington Nationals franchise is owned by the Pirates and the other 28 teams, who united in 2002 to buy it for $120 million when it was the Montreal Expos. That franchise is for sale with a price tag of $350 million. At least seven individuals or groups have filed applications to enter the bidding, and a sale is expected by July.

The Pirates' profit if the asking price is met would appear to be $7.94 million, but the Expos/Nationals have incurred additional expenses since the original purchase. That money will be deducted from the sale profit.

Closing the books

The Milwaukee Brewers are the Pirates' cousins in too many ways.

They share 12-year losing streaks that are the longest current slumps in any of the four major professional sports. They moved into their new ballparks in the same year, 2001. They promised their fans that those facilities, funded mostly through tax money, would allow them to compete with the big spenders. And they failed to deliver. On and off the field.

Attendance soared in the Brewers' first season at Miller Park, but when the team performed poorly, attendance dropped dramatically. That brought huge losses and forced ownership to infuse capital of $11.7 million the year after the stadium opened. The franchise's debt reached a peak of $171.3 million.

Citing those hardships, ownership dropped the payroll last year to $27.5 million, lowest in baseball.

There are two differences, though, between the Brewers and Pirates.

One is that the Brewers' payroll is up to $40.2 million this season, a 46 percent increase. Cincinnati, another National League Central Division rival, did likewise, the Reds raising theirs from $46.6 million to $61.9 million, a 32 percent increase.

Two is that the Brewers have addressed the public's concerns about their finances by opening their books.

Last year, the team ceded to intense pressure and allowed two panels -- one from the Wisconsin legislature, the other a group of business executives -- to audit nearly every aspect of its finances from 1994-2003, even executive pay. The Brewers said they wanted taxpayers to understand that they were not pocketing national money or the rewards from the new stadium. MLB officials called the act unprecedented.

The Pirates' choice to keep their books closed, despite the public subsidizing of PNC Park, is their own. DuPuy, the MLB president, said, "The decision to publicly disclose club finances is entirely up to the individual clubs."

The same is true of the Reds, who made a profit of $10 million last year and will not discuss payroll, even now that they have boosted it.

There is another difference between the Brewers and Pirates.

The Brewers have a new owner, Los Angeles investor Mark Attanasio, who bought the team for $220 million in January from the Selig family, which had owned it for decades. Attanasio immediately boosted the payroll, then, last week, signed star pitcher Ben Sheets to a four-year, $38.5 million deal. He predicted that payroll could increase to as much as $55 million within a year or two. He also called for additional investors to help address the team's debt of $100 million.

The Pirates are not for sale. McClatchy allowed in December that "there could be a time when I look at taking myself out of this job," but he added that he had no plan to consider altering his role until after 2006, when the Pirates will play host to the All-Star Game.

A decision to sell the franchise would not be McClatchy's alone, even though he is the only voting member of the four-man board of directors who has two votes. Limited partner G. Ogden Nutting, a West Virginia newspaper publisher, has had a greater influence in the franchise's workings in recent years. He increased his stake with a capital infusion last year and had his son, Robert Nutting, added as a limited partner. The other limited partner is North Carolina businessman Donald Beaver.

If they were to sell, the owners could expect quite the payday. McClatchy and his original partners bought the Pirates for $90 million in February 1996. The team had the lowest revenues and attendance in baseball just before that and shared Three Rivers Stadium with the Steelers.

Because of PNC Park, the franchise reasonably could be expected to bring a price similar to the Brewers' $220 million. Forbes magazine estimated the Pirates' current worth at $218 million.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

And now, the ownership...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05121/497197.stm

Smizik: McClatchy has broken his promise to fans
Sunday, May 01, 2005

By Bob Smizik, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Elsewhere on these pages there is a thorough examination of the Pirates' finances and a discussion of whether owner Kevin McClatchy is in violation of, at least, the spirit of the Major League Baseball revenue-sharing plan. The money the Pirates receive from revenue sharing -- which was about $13 million last year and could be as much as $18 million this year -- is, according to the agreement, to be plowed back into baseball operations. Some people think McClatchy is not doing that.

Truth be known, it's nearly impossible to determine whether McClatchy is in compliance with the letter or the spirit of that agreement.

What is not impossible to determine is that McClatchy is in flagrant violation of the spirit of another agreement, a far more sacred one. The agreement in question is the one he has with the baseball fans of the Pittsburgh region, the one that stipulates he owes it to these fans to field a competitive team.

When McClatchy first broached the idea of building a new baseball stadium shortly after buying the team in 1996, there was strong opposition to public financing of it. In fact, a referendum that would have allocated public money to the project was overwhelmingly rejected by the voters of the region.

But the dream of a new ballpark didn't die despite the clear message sent by the voters. It didn't die because a new stadium carried with it not just the continuation of the century-old tradition of baseball in Pittsburgh but the very real possibility of a return to winning baseball. The politicians and civic leaders saw to it that McClatchy got his stadium, and, in defiance of the voters' wishes, they built it mostly with public funding

Implicit in the construction of what was to become PNC Park was the promise -- made by McClatchy -- that the Pirates would field a competitive team. We heard time and again the new stadium would be a panacea for what ailed baseball in Pittsburgh. The revenue it produced would allow the Pirates to not just compete but to be a contender.

That was a bold-faced lie.

The Pirates have had a losing season in every year of McClatchy's ownership. In his first five seasons -- 1996-2000 -- the Pirates averaged 73.7 wins a season. PNC Park opened in 2001, at which time the Pirates became worse -- not better. They averaged 70.5 wins in the first four seasons of PNC.

Time and again McClatchy has broken the spirit of the agreement he had with the fans. Not only have we seen nothing but losing baseball, but we've also seen massively disheartening moves that have weakened the franchise.

Within the past 22 months, the Pirates have traded their three best players, Aramis Ramirez, Brian Giles and Jason Kendall. Before that, they traded their best pitcher, Jason Schmidt. These were exactly the kind of trades the Pirates were not supposed to have to make once PNC Park opened.

The most egregious of these trades was the one that sent Ramirez, the best hitter the organization had developed since Barry Bonds, to the Chicago Cubs for practically nothing. But that wasn't the half of it. In making the trade, the Pirates showed they were in such a financial disarray they couldn't live up to the terms of a contract that had been drawn up little more than a year earlier.

There was another punch to the face to baseball fans this season when the Pirates' payroll came in at $33.6 million, the second lowest in baseball. The team might as well be playing at Three Rivers Stadium.

But now come the most mystifying words of all. In the Post-Gazette's examination of the Pirates' finances it was learned the team will have gross revenue exceeding $100 million this year.

In the first season of PNC Park, McClatchy let it be known the team had exceeded $100 million in revenue. It was an astonishing figure at the time and enabled McClatchy to have a payroll of almost $58 million.

Now similar gross revenues can't come close to allowing such a payroll although the Pirates have revenues to cover that payroll before they sell so much as one ticket.

McClatchy has an explanation for it all. Some of it makes sense, some of it doesn't.

Some of it probably has to do with the fact McClatchy does not control the team the way he once did. West Virginia publisher G. Ogden Nutting has put significant cash into the team in recent years and because of that has had more say in how the team is run. Nutting is a mysterious guy. Not much is known about him. But what everyone knows about him is he's a bottom-line guy.

If it were up to McClatchy the payroll probably would be higher.

But that does not alter one basic fact. McClatchy has broken his promise to Pirates fans and the way the team is going it's not likely he'll ever be able to make good on his word.

[POJO_Risin]

All that being said...

there are Leyland rumblings...

[High Life Man]

Leyland won't come back.

I love our new owner. He also bought into our hockey team and has been rumored to be pumping a couple of mil into local theater companies and other arts related groups.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Originally posted by POJO_Risin
All that being said...

there are Leyland rumblings...

Nope, that ain't happening...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05122/497721.stm

Cook: Leyland, Pirates not a match
Monday, May 02, 2005

By Ron Cook, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

It almost seemed like piling on to bring up the subject with Lloyd McClendon after yet another hideous Pirates loss. It's not as if he doesn't have enough worries with a team that can't hit, can't hit for power, can't run, can't play defense, has a combined 3-6 record and 6.06 earned-run average from the two pitchers at the front of its rotation and is absolutely dreadful at home.

But it was there in black and white in Sports Illustrated this week.

Former Pirates manager Jim Leyland, who has the itch to manage again, is the logical successor if Pittsburgh continues to slip and Lloyd McClendon is fired.

That's all McClendon needs about now, Leyland hovering like some kind of vulture.

Not that Leyland would.

"I don't want Lloyd McClendon's job," Leyland said yesterday before the Pirates got another abysmal performance from alleged ace Oliver Perez in an 8-3 loss to the San Francisco Giants that left them with the worst home record (3-9) in the National League.

"Lloyd is my friend."

It was Leyland who stopped by McClendon's office early yesterday, just to tell him to keep his chin up. That's not the first time that's happened. Leyland did it a couple of weeks ago after the St. Louis Cardinals -- who employ him as a scout -- pounded the Pirates, 11-1 and 7-1, on consecutive nights at PNC Park.

"I've been there," Leyland said. "Being the manager can be a lonely job. Your coaches are there, but it's really just you after the losses. It's tough."

Leyland managed McClendon a lifetime ago, back in the days when the Pirates actually were a competitive team. He taught McClendon much of what he knows about baseball. McClendon called him "a mentor, a confidant, a father figure, even though he's not nearly old enough to be my father."

"Lloyd McClendon is a good manager," Leyland said. "I've been very impressed. I've never seen him not prepared. I've never seen him not ready for a situation."

Even if Leyland and McClendon weren't so close, there's no chance Leyland would want to manage the Pirates again, at least not under Kevin McClatchy's ownership group. It's true, Leyland does have some interest in getting back into a dugout. Sports Illustrated had that part right. Leyland tried to get the Philadelphia job after last season and probably was as shocked as the rest of us that the Phillies decided to go with Charlie Manuel.

But working for McClatchy again?

There's just no way.

Leyland tried that for one season, 1996. He said publicly he was going to stay with the Pirates for the long haul, then quickly changed his mind after new owner McClatchy reneged on his pledge to increase the team's payroll and, instead, cut it way back. It turned out to be the best move Leyland ever made. He won the World Series with the Florida Marlins in 1997. The Pirates haven't had a winning season since.

"Contrary to what some people think, there was no hard feelings," Leyland said. "I understood what Kevin did. He took a look at his books and did what he had to do.

"But does anyone really think I wanted to leave here? I live here. I was sleeping in my own bed every night. Even during the season, I was only gone two weeks out of every month. How do you beat that?

"I just didn't want to start over again. I did that once here."

That was back in the late 1980s. Leyland took over a Pirates team that lost 104 games in 1985 and led it to three consecutive division titles in the early 1990s. That earned him respect as one of the game's great managers. The championship with the Marlins merely cemented his reputation.

"If Jim Leyland wanted my job, I'd step aside in a minute," McClendon said. "I'd work for him any day. That's how much respect I have for him."

That's funny, Cardinals manager Tony La Russa, who is headed toward the Hall of Fame, has often said the same thing about Leyland.

But as good as Leyland is, he's not good enough to win with the Pirates. This is America. You get what you pay for. McClatchy's ownership group, depending on whom you believe, can't or isn't willing to pay enough.

"People talk about how easy it is to manage when there aren't any expectations," Leyland said, speaking in general now and not specifically about the Pirates. "But, as a competitor, you want to have a chance to win. It's no fun going to the park every night knowing everything has to go right for you just to have a chance to win a game."

That's why Leyland won't be joining the Pirates any time soon.

Someone might replace McClendon at the end of the season, if not sooner, if the Pirates continue to play horrible baseball.

It won't be Leyland.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

The top hitting prospects in AAA Indianapois, hopefully in Pittsburgh sometime this year....

Eldred is a big 'ol cornfed motherfucker.... I watched Doumit here a couple of weeks ago, he hit HR's FROM BOTH SIDES OF THE PLATE...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05123/498180.stm

Hitting cavalry?

The team announced last night it will promote first baseman Brad Eldred, its top power-hitting prospect, to Class AAA Indianapolis today. He hit two more home runs last night, giving him 13 in 21 games with Class AA Altoona. That home run total is the most in professional baseball. In 60 Class AA games, Eldred has homered 30 times.

The team also is trying out catcher Ryan Doumit in right field and first base in Indianapolis. Management does not feel Doumit is ready to catch in the majors, but it is confident he could hit in Pittsburgh now. He is batting .344 with six home runs and 18 RBIs.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Do my eyes deceive me, or are the Buccos waking the fuck up ??

Three in a row, and have a better record than the Yankees....

Bay is getting hot (thanks for releasing him), and hit a MONSTER shot to center field....

Aaah, what am I saying, they'll tank it eventually....

[Va Beach VH Fan]

STOP THE PRESSES !!!!

Buccos at .500 after a 18-2 drubbing of the D-Rays....

Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday at the Evil Empire !!!!

[POJO_Risin]

Dude...when's the last time Pittsburgh and Cleveland were BOTH at .500!!!!!

Cleveland...30-30

Pittsburgh...30-30...

and they'll sweep NY...who blows ass...

[POJO_Risin]

Top of the 13th...still 5-5...

[POJO_Risin]

Who did Cleveland get for Lawton?

Which shit heal?...

[POJO_Risin]

Alex Gonzalez...2 run homer...

DRays are up 7-5...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Originally posted by POJO_Risin
Who did Cleveland get for Lawton?

Which shit heal?...

Arthur Rhodes...

You're welcome... ;)

They're going to trade Lawton before the deadline, he ain't worth 8 million a year, and they won't sign him long term, especially since he's a shitty outfielder and baserunner....

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Unfuckingbelievable... I think this is going to give either Zach Duke or Ian Snell some good opportunities to show their stuff....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05180/530071.stm

Perez out after toe broken
Left-hander put on DL, might miss six weeks
Wednesday, June 29, 2005

By Dejan Kovacevic, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

WASHINGTON -- The Pirates are unhappy with Oliver Perez, but not unhappy enough to kick something.

Perez, the talented left-hander expected to be the staff ace this season, was placed on the 15-day disabled list yesterday after his left big toe was broken while kicking a clubhouse laundry cart Sunday in St. Louis. He has three small fractures in the toe and is expected to miss a month, possibly six weeks.

He did not accompany the team to Washington, so it is not known precisely what prompted his action. Presumably, it was in frustration after allowing four runs in six innings of what turned out to be a 5-4 Pirates victory.

Whatever the explanation turns out to be, it is safe to say management will find it unsatisfactory.

"It's unacceptable behavior," general manager Dave Littlefield said. "It's immature and unprofessional. Obviously, it's setting him back personally. From a team standpoint, it's selfish. To do something like this is ... selfish and immature."

He did not rule out a fine for Perez but said that had not been discussed yet.

"Not only does he let himself down, but he also lets his team down," manager Lloyd McClendon said. "I'm sure he feels horrible about it. But it hurts the club not having him in there, and I wish he had thought about that when he did it."

To replace Perez, the Pirates promoted smooth-hitting outfielder Nate McLouth from Class AAA Indianapolis, though his stay is expected to be short.

The team will promote a pitcher from Indianapolis by Saturday, which would have been Perez's next start, and revert to its standard 12-man staff. That almost surely will mean the return of McLouth, who, McClendon said, will not make it into the starting lineup this week.

It is not known which pitcher will be promoted, but the logical choice for a starter would be left-hander Zach Duke, the Pirates' top prospect. He is 12-3, the best record in all the minor leagues, with a 2.92 earned run average. His most recent start was four days ago, which means he would be plenty rested by Saturday.

Another possibility is freshly recalled right-hander Ian Snell, whose arm is built up to 120 pitches after going 9-2 at Indianapolis. If the Pirates choose Snell, they probably would bring up a reliever from Indianapolis rather than Duke, most likely Mark Corey or Mike Johnston.

"We wanted to give Lloyd an extra bat between now and the next time Oliver would have started," Littlefield said. "But we also want to stay with 12 pitchers, so we're going to get back to that. We just haven't decided how we're going to handle Saturday yet."

Perez's incident occurred during the game Sunday, shortly after he was removed, and McClendon did not learn of it until afterward. X-rays revealed the injury Sunday night, and he was sent to Pittsburgh.

His left big toe is critical to his pitching motion, McClendon said, because it is the only part of that foot that touches the ground in the final part of his follow-through.

Perez's season has provided one exasperation after another, particularly coming off an outstanding 2004 in which he had a 2.98 ERA and struck out 249 while going 12-10.

He was chosen to start opening day at PNC Park but lasted five-plus innings in a 9-2 loss to the Milwaukee Brewers. He lost three of his next four decisions, then was placed on hiatus for two weeks to address flawed mechanics. He rebounded for three consecutive victories and appeared to rediscover his form, then failed to top six innings in his final three outings before his injury.

Overall, Perez is 6-5 with a 6.16 ERA and 20 home runs allowed. He gave up 22 home runs all last season.

McClendon praised Perez not only for overcoming his poor start but also for his showing in St. Louis, where he allowed home runs to Reggie Sanders and Yadier Molina but limited the Cardinals to a 4-3 lead before his exit.

"I really thought he took a step forward there, the way he stood through the intensity of a close game and the heat," McClendon said. "It's really a shame. I really feel he was turning the corner. It's a tough break for us."

[Va Beach VH Fan]

So my son and I went to the Nats-Buccos on Wednesday night....

Got front row seats next to the ball girl on the 3rd base side....

Top of the 3rd, Nats up 1-0, the skies open up.... 2+ hours rain delay.... Spent it in the concourse talking with other Bucco fans, as well as watching these two drunk fucks hit on the Ice Cream Girl, who I must admit was fucking hot...

Rain stops, and on the 1st pitch Macowiak plants one in the 2nd deck....

But of course, they find a way to blow the game...

8th inning, Guillen smacks one down the 3rd base line and, of course, Macowiak boots it.... The ball rolls right to us and kicks to Jack Wilson...

Game doesn't end until 1AM, and we don't get back to the hotel room until 2AM....

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Wow...

Talk about starting a shitstorm... The blogs and message boards are flooded with speculation, premature that it is....

Of course, fans are taking it the next step and putting words in Cuban's mouth.... Meaning, all he did was just say that IF the team went up for sale, he would be interested....

Mcclatchy's group bought the Pirates in '95 for 85 million, so obviously they would make some serious money if they would ever sell, with the new ballpark....

Knowing my luck, they'll just keep pinching pennies....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05197/538914.stm

Cuban interested if Pirates for sale

Mt. Lebanon native also amenable to joining current ownership group if asked

Saturday, July 16, 2005

By Paul Meyer, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

CHICAGO -- Billionaire and Mt. Lebanon native Mark Cuban said yesterday he would be interested in investigating buying the Pirates if they became available.

The flamboyant owner of the Dallas Mavericks of the NBA also said he would be amenable to joining the Pirates' current ownership group -- if asked -- if there were a risk of the baseball team leaving Pittsburgh.

Pirates owner Kevin McClatchy didn't return a phone call last night, but he did say in a statement, "There's no chance of the Pirates moving away, so it's really a nonissue."

Cuban made his comments at the Pirates' game against the Chicago Cubs at Wrigley Field, where he led the crowd in the traditional singing of "Take Me Out to the Ball Game" after the top of the seventh inning.

"It absolutely killed me to sing 'Root, root, root for the Cubbies,' " Cuban said. "I asked the broadcasters later if anybody had ever put in the other team."

Cuban also wore a Cubs jersey with his name on the back during the song, but he quickly reaffirmed his loyalty to the Pirates and Pittsburgh when he met with reporters after leaving the WGN broadcast booth.

"I'm a baseball fan," he said. "I'm a huge Pirates fan. I'm a Pittsburgh fan."

Cuban, who will be 47 July 31, was asked if he'd be interested in purchasing the Pirates.

"If they ever decided to sell, I'd definitely be interested in taking a look," Cuban said. "But I'm certainly not the type to be proactive about it because that's not fair to Kevin.

"They've done their best with the Pirates, getting the stadium built. I think the Pirates have a great young nucleus for the future."

Cuban, who made his fortune by selling his streaming video company, broadcast.com, to Yahoo in 1999, bought the Mavericks in 2000.

"I look at the Pirates kind of like the Mavericks," he said. "People didn't have a lot of expectations when I bought them. All of a sudden, the switch flipped and things have been going great ever since. That's because we had a great young nucleus, and I think the Pirates have that opportunity as well."

The small-revenue Pirates seem en route to their 13th consecutive losing season. Would Cuban -- if asked -- join their ownership group, presumably to supply a large infusion of cash?

"It's something I'd consider," he said. "Like I said, I'm a Pirate[s] fan. And if it ever got to the point where there was the risk of them being moved out of Pittsburgh, then, yeah, that's something I would consider.

"To me, it's important that [Pittsburgh has] our complement of [professional] teams."

Cuban plans to be in Pittsburgh Monday. He'll give a speech at a fund-raiser for St. Clair Hospital -- "I don't know about what yet," he said -- then he'll attend the Pirates game that night against Houston.

"Hopefully, we'll have a better showing," he said, referring to the Pirates' 11-1 loss yesterday.

Cuban plans to attend the game with his father, his brother and some high school friends. He's well aware that his attendance might spark speculation that he's going to buy the team.

"There was an article in [a Chicago] paper [yesterday] about me buying the Cubs," Cuban said. "You know, wherever I go, someone's going to speculate.

"I just want to go to the game [Monday], sit in center field and just eat hot dogs and drink beer."

Somebody asked Cuban if he could have already bought the Pirates if he just had the money he has paid in NBA fines over the years.

"No," he said, then added with a laugh, "but I could put a down payment down."

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Thought I'd pass this on...

Probably the best writeup I've read on the Pirates woes...

http://www.baseballfans.net/pirates/article.php?story=20050729101944736

What Went Wrong
Friday, July 29 2005 @ 01:19 PM CDT

By Wilbur Miller

Some of the discussions here recently led me to think about the reasons for the Pirates' plight over the past 13 years. Much of the discussion centers, of course, on bad decisions at the GM level, because as fans that's what we notice: trades, free agent signings and the like. When you're a Pirate fan, these moves can take on added significance, because they've been so bad most of the time. Most baseball fans probably don't even know what the Rule 5 draft is, but I'll bet virtually all more-than-casual Pirate fans do.

I don't think focusing entirely on player moves really gets to the heart of the problem, though. That's not just me, either. The St. Petersburg Times ran a series last March on what's wrong with the Devil Rays. The opening article focused on the owner, and started right off with comments from industry execs saying that when you have no success over a lengthy period, there has to be something wrong right at the top. The article made the point very firmly that chronic failure comes from upper management.

So if you want to look at what's caused the Pirates' soon-to-be 13-year losing streak, you can either look at the very different sets of bad decisions that were made under Cam Bonifay and Dave Littlefield, or you can focus on the larger problem of an ownership that's responsible for those situations. The mere fact that the team has had a consistently poor record under two very different GMs, by itself, should indicate that the real problem may lie higher up. Bonifay and Littlefield couldn't be much more different, in terms of both their personalities and their approach to baseball issues, yet the Pirates right now seem to be settling into the same, unsolvable pattern of chronic losing under Littlefield that existed under Bonifay.

I look at the issue as a series of problems that ownership caused or allowed to exist. With that in mind, here's a sort of undated timeline that attempts to explain what got the Pirates where they are today, and why the ownership is responsible for the team's problems:

1. Ownership failed to identify the team's needs in the GM's office. Bonifay wasn't qualified to run a team, or at least not this one. His experience was mainly as a scout and the Pirates, with their budgetary problems, needed somebody with strong business and organizational instincts. The result was, among other things, an organization that was staffed very poorly, especially the scouting and development areas. Until late in his tenure, Bonifay never really had a scouting director. His drafts were run, in some instances, by people who were obviously unqualified. He didn't settle on a capable, experienced scouting director until he brought in Mickey White to run the department in his last three years. Bonifay never had a competent development system, leading to poor coaching and bad decision-making in trying to develop prospects.

2. The scouting and development budget was totally inadequate until White took over. The Latin American scouting operation, once the best in the game, fell apart. The team also was forced to make signability picks in the draft, culminating in the ridiculous choice of Clint Johnston in the first round.

3. Bonifay had the right plan (build through the farm system with power bats and arms), but was incompetent at implementing it. He was hampered by a manager, Gene Lamont, who disliked rookies and hated playing them, leading to an inability to integrate young players into the major league team. Bonifay made numerous bad choices about veteran players, as he seemed to develop an increasing inability to decide whether he was rebuilding or trying to win right away. This problem may have stemmed in part from interference by ownership, which became paranoid about young players after the team's late-season collapse in 1998. This led to still further reluctance to follow the ostensible plan of building through young players, which was in fact the only viable option the Pirates had, and the only one they still have. Ownership failed to recognize Bonifay's shortcomings and allowed the team to lose all sense of direction.

4. In the wake of Bonifay's firing, the team went back to being cheapskates in the scouting and development areas. It abandoned the highly successful strategy pursued by White of targeting difficult-to-sign players in the later rounds and then signing them. It decided not to pursue top prospects in the international market, including the Dominican, a decision that has cut the team off from significant sources of talent and left it severely handicapped in comparison to other teams.

5. Financial mismanagement led to the disastrous decision to give away Aramis Ramirez. This had two devastating consequences. One, obviously, was the loss of the most precious commodity in baseball, the shortage of which is now by far and away the Pirates' single biggest problem: a young, middle-of-the-order hitter. The second consequence was the spin campaign—or to be more blunt, lying—about the reason for dumping Ramirez, as Littlefield spent extensive time telling the fans that the move was made to allow the team to bring in better players. Since then, the team's personnel moves have been influenced heavily by (often inaccurately) perceived fan reaction. The Pirates continue to believe that their fans don't want to see young players and prefer to see mediocre veterans. This is all a direct result of the team's lack of adequate financing and foolish decision to spend money on veterans in 2003 in the hopes of jumping into contention and increasing attendance.

6. Bonifay was replaced by a GM with firmly entrenched, unimaginative, traditionalist views, who lacks the analytical ability or inclination to search for ways to succeed with limited resources. Little is known about the reasons that went into Littlefield's hiring, but it shows an inability on the part of ownership to grasp the Pirates' need for innovative thinking. Given Littlefield's propensity for, and skill at, spin games, it also seems likely that his hiring had a great deal to do with his ability to tell ownership what it wanted to hear. Some rumors at the time held that any GM candidate who was honest enough to tell Kevin McClatchy that turning the team around would take time was quickly shown the door. As a result of this decision, the Pirates have made no attempt to find approaches that might work for a low-revenue team, and continue to employ the same personnel philosophies as teams like the Yankees, only without the money. Under Littlefield, the Pirates overvalue veterans and major league experience. This tendency is especially damaging to a franchise that can only afford veteran players whom no other team wants, thus consistently leaving it with bottom-of-the-barrel players. The scouting approach is rigidly skewed toward tools, especially speed, which is the least useful tool. The team's scouting approach, in contrast to more successful organizations, places little emphasis on performance, leading to terrible decisions like the one to let go of Chris Shelton. As a result, the team under Littlefield has had a series of poor drafts. The rigid adherence to traditional notions, like "pitching is 90% of the game," has led to bad approaches like trying to build the farm system almost entirely by accumulating young pitchers, baseball's most unreliable commodity. This approach has not succeeded for any other team in recent years that I've been able to identify. The overall management of the team shows almost no inclination toward analysis of any kind, and instead seems to rely entirely on clichés. In my view, this is an ownership problem, because the owners are not insisting that management strategy be based on principles or philosophies that can be shown analytically to be viable. There also is no accountability, as shown by Ed Creech's continued presence as scouting director despite bad drafting and a completely unproductive international scouting program. Like the team's scouts, ownership shows no inclination to use performance as a measure.

7. A perverted economic system built on subsidies from taxpayers and successful teams allows the ownership to make a healthy profit with a bad product. The Pirates' owners have found that they can make money simply by maintaining a minimal payroll and ensuring that the team remains just talented enough to win 70-75 games each year. There is no economic incentive for the team to take any approach that might lead to greater success. Ownership's goal of simply "not being TOO bad" informs nearly every decision the team makes, effectively eliminating any realistic chance of greater success.

This can all be pretty easily summed up. The Pirates started off with ownership that was unqualified from a business or leadership standpoint, and inadequately financed, to run a major league team. That evolved, through extensive bungling and eventually the disastrous Ramirez trade, into a cynical, greedy, small-minded ownership that has found a formula for producing healthy profit at the cost of a consistently bad product, with no motivation to improve the product. The team, like its ownership, has gone from directionless to a tight, unwavering focus on the wrong direction.

The evolution in the focus of the ownership has been reflected in the team's fortunes. Under Bonifay, the team at times truly was close to being a good team, especially in mid-1999 at the time of Jason Kendall's ankle injury. The lack of direction and some bad luck, however, caused the team to veer quickly toward disaster, culminating in the 100-loss season in 2001. Since then, the tighter focus on being just mediocre enough to keep attendance from collapsing has produced much more consistent, mediocre teams that seem unable to break out of the 72-win cycle. These are fundamentally ownership problems and won't be solved until there's a different ownership.

[POJO_Risin]

Who are you passing it along to?....lmfao....

[Va Beach VH Fan]

It's actually a good read...

But yeah, I just felt like copying it... :D

[Va Beach VH Fan]

It's kinda like my own little blog.... ;)

[POJO_Risin]

Well...I'll read it...lmfao...

the fucking VA Beach...blog...

I was listening to Mark Madden the other day...talking about the Pirates...dude can be pretty fucking funny...but damn dead on...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

FINALLY !!!!!!!

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05249/566544.stm

McClendon out as Pirates' manager
Tuesday, September 06, 2005

By Paul Meyer, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

The Pittsburgh Pirates, heading for a record 13th consecutive losing season, fired manager Lloyd McClendon today. McClendon presided over five of those losing seasons since being named manager in October 2000.

Pete Mackanin, 54, the Pirates bench coach, will manage the team for the rest of the season, Pirates General Manager Dave Littlefield said at an afternoon press conference at PNC Park.

"This is a difficult day for the Pirates since Lloyd has been a loyal member of our organizations for 15 years," Littlefield said. "However, this is a very important time for our franchise, and from a baseball standpoint we believe we needed to make a change."

The Pirates indicated they would be looking for somebody with big-league managerial experience to replace McClendon.

"Our execution wasn't improving. I think we've under performed, and at this point in time we need to move forward," Littlefield said.

Mackanin, the bench coach for three years, joined the Pirates in 2001 and was manager of the Hickory Class A team that season. In 2002, he led Lynchburg to the Carolina League title, and he managed in the Venezuelan Winter League the past two years. His record is 917-849 in 13 years as a minor league manager.

"I feel terrible for Mac. It's been a difficult last couple of weeks," Mackanin said. He indicated he would make a few changes, but he wasn't specific. "I don't have a magic bullet. We'll try a few different things."

When asked if he would be interested in the permanent job, he answered: "Yes."

"I have aspired to be a major league manager. I'm happy that Dave Littlefield thinks I can handle the chore for the rest of this season."

If the Pirates lose tonight's game against the Arizona Diamondbacks, the team would clinch a 13th consecutive losing season. It also would tie for the fourth-longest drought in Major League baseball history. The Philadelphia Phillies set the record at 16 in 1933-48.

[redblkwht]

I agree, he did stay 2 seasons
too long IMO..