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View Full Version : SIEG HOLY!! Ratzinger selected as new Pope



FORD
04-19-2005, 12:09 PM
Details as they come in. Hope it's not the Hitler Youth guy....

Jesterstar
04-19-2005, 12:31 PM
Of course it's going to be a Hitler Youth.

FORD
04-19-2005, 12:45 PM
SIEG HOLY!!

It's that Hitler Youth neocon Ratzinger.

The Beast has his False Prophet :(

academic punk
04-19-2005, 12:47 PM
Well, looks like Dave's days on this planet are numbered...

alexpgrimes
04-19-2005, 12:51 PM
I hope they elect a black pope. put some spinners on the popemobile. he can have one of those gold crucifixs. all the nuns have to wear booty shorts.. should be real fun..

Carmine
04-19-2005, 12:52 PM
Pope Benedict The 16th.

Ratzinger wins

Carmine
04-19-2005, 12:53 PM
LOL @ Popeapalloza 2005, Ford!!

FORD
04-19-2005, 12:55 PM
I'll admit I stole that from Jon Stewart.

Carmine
04-19-2005, 12:58 PM
Originally posted by FORD
I'll admit I stole that from Jon Stewart.

:)

Nickdfresh
04-19-2005, 01:00 PM
German cardinal elected new pope

Joseph Ratzinger will be Pope Benedict XVI

Tuesday, April 19, 2005 Posted: 12:54 PM EDT (1654 GMT)
Pope Benedict XVI gestures to the crowd in St. Peter's Square on Tuesday evening.


VATICAN CITY (CNN) -- Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger of Germany has been selected by the Roman Catholic church as the new pope.

Cardinal Jorge Arturo Medina Estevez of Chile made the announcement to a cheering crowd in St. Peter's Square.

Ratzinger, who took the name Benedict XVI, appeared on the balcony of the Vatican Basilica to greet the people and deliver his first papal blessing.

Earlier, white smoke rose from a Sistine Chapel chimney and bells rang Tuesday, signaling the selection of a new pope.

The crowd clapped and waved flags as the smoke began to billow over Vatican City about 5:50 p.m. (11:50 a.m. ET).

Suspense built as the throng waited for the symbolic ringing of bells, at which point the crowd broke into a roar of jubilation.

The conclave of 115 cardinals had voted three times previously -- once Monday night and twice Tuesday morning -- before selecting the new pope.

The cardinals' morning ballots were burned at about 11:50 a.m. (5:50 a.m. EDT).

Chemicals are added to the ballots to turn the smoke white or black.

Pope John Paul II, who died April 2 at age 84, had decreed that white smoke be accompanied by the ringing of bells, to avoid a repeat of the confusion after his election in 1978.

Ratzinger needed two-thirds of the votes to be selected.

Speculation rife

There has been a great deal of speculation about who may be chosen to succeed John Paul II, who died April 2 at the age of 84, but cardinals have been mum.

Some taking part in the conclave said they are looking for a leader who presents a hopeful vision, who can "generate some dynamism and some optimism within Catholicism," CNN Vatican analyst John Allen said.

The first clues to the process of finding a successor were sought during the homily or sermon delivered by Ratzinger at Monday's public Mass.

"Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the church, is often labeled today as a fundamentalism," Ratzinger said.

Allen said Ratzinger delivered a "very blunt" message for the church to "stay true to itself."

That was a strong indication that Ratzinger, 78, wants a "traditionalist" elected the next pope, Allen said.

John Paul was widely credited with extending the reach of the papacy. He spoke more than a dozen languages and set an unprecedented pattern of pastoral travel, drawing huge crowds all over the world.

He was also strictly traditional on issues of sexuality and the role of women in the church, which won him support among some Catholics but alienated others. Similar disagreement exists over the next pontiff's stances on issues such as birth control,

Nickdfresh
04-19-2005, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by Carmine Raguzza.
Pope Benedict The 16th.

Ratzinger wins

Auf March! Auchtung Baby! :confused:

Matt White
04-19-2005, 01:02 PM
WE HAVE A WINNER!!!

Roy Munson
04-19-2005, 01:07 PM
Why don't they try to elect someone younger? I can never understand that. It's the same with the Supreme Court. Too old is too old.

DrMaddVibe
04-19-2005, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by FORD
I'll admit I stole that from Jon Stewart.


Like he wrote it to begin with!

Nickdfresh
04-19-2005, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by Roy Munson
Why don't they try to elect someone younger? I can never understand that. It's the same with the Supreme Court. Too old is too old.

I heard that they wanted someone older so the guy doesn't hang around too long and is more conservative in his outlook. God forbid Catholics can use birthcontrol, get divorced, or allow priest to get married!

FORD
04-19-2005, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by Roy Munson
Why don't they try to elect someone younger? I can never understand that. It's the same with the Supreme Court. Too old is too old.

Maybe this page can explain the choice.

http://www.catholic-pages.com/grabbag/malachy.asp

You will notice that the last Pope will be named Peter (or Petrus Romanus) and it will be he who is in league with the Antichrist. But his predecessor will be from the Benedictine order.

So by design (whose design-God, Satan, or other- is open to interpretation) they may have chosen Ratzinger specifically to BE a short-timer Pope.

According to this prophecy then, this Pope isn't the false prophet, but the predecessor of the false prophet.

But the fact that he was a Hitler youth and a neocon is certainly troubling in any case

Guitar Shark
04-19-2005, 01:52 PM
FORD, I'm waiting for you to demand to see the ballots.

I'm sure the BCE is behind the selection of this neocon somehow. :D

Figs
04-19-2005, 01:55 PM
This happens at the same time as the "salt stain Mary" appears.....

creeeeeeeepy.....

FORD
04-19-2005, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
FORD, I'm waiting for you to demand to see the ballots.

I'm sure the BCE is behind the selection of this neocon somehow. :D

Well they did say on TV, that Junior called a meeting with the American cardinals immediately after JP's funeral, which was something no American president had ever done before. So it's possible he may have tried to influence the vote.

In any event, if Junior is the Antichrist, then we know that Pope Placeholder won't be around long.

Mr Grimsdale
04-19-2005, 02:04 PM
PANZER MARSCH!

Figs
04-19-2005, 02:08 PM
Again, my hopes for a "Pope George Ringo" are dashed......

BigBadBrian
04-19-2005, 02:12 PM
France better start shoring up it's eastern approaches. :gulp:

Nickdfresh
04-19-2005, 02:18 PM
Perhaps Vatican Cardinals are big fans of THE DUMP after all!:D

alexpgrimes
04-19-2005, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by Figs
This happens at the same time as the "salt stain Mary" appears.....

creeeeeeeepy.....
Looks like a piss stain from a bum to me....

BigBadBrian
04-19-2005, 02:40 PM
***BREAKING NEWS***

Al Gore is headed to Rome to demand a recount. :D

FORD
04-19-2005, 02:41 PM
For the record, Pope Rattie is also a member of Opus Dei which is basically the Catholic version of the Dominionist (http://www.rotharmy.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19934) cult.

This can't be good.

FORD
04-19-2005, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by BigBadBrian
***BREAKING NEWS***

Al Gore is headed to Rome to demand a recount. :D

Gore's not Catholic. He's a Southern Baptist. You should have said "Kerry".

Guitar Shark
04-19-2005, 02:43 PM
Where is the proof that he's a member of Opus Dei? I'm not doubting you, I just haven't read that before.

FORD
04-19-2005, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
Where is the proof that he's a member of Opus Dei? I'm not doubting you, I just haven't read that before.

How about their own website (http://www.opusdei.org/art.php?w=32&p=4761) ?

Guitar Shark
04-19-2005, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by FORD
How about their own website (http://www.opusdei.org/art.php?w=32&p=4761) ?

Page won't load. Maybe it's overloaded at the moment with people trying to figure this out.

WACF
04-19-2005, 02:57 PM
Originally posted by Roy Munson
Why don't they try to elect someone younger? I can never understand that. It's the same with the Supreme Court. Too old is too old.


We are talking about the oldest union here...the guy has seniority!!!

Jesterstar
04-19-2005, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by FORD
SIEG HOLY!!

It's that Hitler Youth neocon Ratzinger.

The Beast has his False Prophet :(

I told you that before the news did. YOUR OWNED!!!!!!!!!! AGAIN,.

FORD
04-19-2005, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
Page won't load. Maybe it's overloaded at the moment with people trying to figure this out.

Keep trying the link. It took me a couple times to get in. I'm not sure what the problem is. Could be server overload, I guess.

Anyway, the link goes directly to an article by Ratzinger himself, praising the founder of Opus Dei.

Guitar Shark
04-19-2005, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by Jesterstar
I told you that before the news did. YOUR OWNED!!!!!!!!!! AGAIN,.

How are your plans coming along to get FORD de-modded?

FORD
04-19-2005, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by Jesterstar
I told you that before the news did. YOUR OWNED!!!!!!!!!! AGAIN,.

Fuck off, Jizzystool. I told you before you told me.

OWNED.

FORD
04-19-2005, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by WACF
We are talking about the oldest union here...the guy has seniority!!!

So John Paul I must have been their Jimmy Hoffa?

Jesterstar
04-19-2005, 03:03 PM
Originally posted by FORD
Fuck off, Jizzystool. I told you before you told me.

OWNED.

Fuck that. Check out the fucking Beggining of this thread. PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING. OWNED.

BigBadBrian
04-19-2005, 03:10 PM
Originally posted by Jesterstar
Fuck that. Check out the fucking Beggining of this thread. PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING. OWNED.

Don't you have a widdle puddle to sail your widdle boats in? Hmm? :rolleyes:

academic punk
04-19-2005, 03:14 PM
Does even this thread have to become about what a fucking unappreciated genius you are , Jester?

Really. When FORD and BBB are both telling you to drop dead, you've really fucked up.

Go make a tape for the dump, will ya?

Or even better, go tape your ass cheeks shut and try to take a dump.

kentuckyklira
04-19-2005, 04:02 PM
It´s actually pretty good news IMO. Here in Germany, no one but a handful of unltra hard-core Catholics like that guy. He´s sure to alienate even more Germans from the Catholic church than his predecessor. In the end that means the Catholic scum will have less and less influence over German society.

Go abuse a choirboy, cardinal Ratzinger!

DrMaddVibe
04-19-2005, 04:25 PM
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1572667,00.html

WACF
04-19-2005, 05:10 PM
Interesting article.

Warham
04-19-2005, 06:37 PM
I can't believe the vast amount of sheer nonsense I read on this forum, and specifically in this thread.

Dr. Love
04-19-2005, 07:27 PM
That is one mean lookin' mofo. The picture of him on CNN looks downright evil.

kentuckyklira
04-19-2005, 07:31 PM
Originally posted by Dr. Love
That is one mean lookin' mofo. The picture of him on CNN looks downright evil. He was a Hitler-Youth member after all. He learned early!

Guitar Shark
04-19-2005, 07:34 PM
Originally posted by Dr. Love
That is one mean lookin' mofo. The picture of him on CNN looks downright evil.

This one?

http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2005/WORLD/europe/04/19/pope.tuesday/story.pope.benedict.01.jpg

FORD
04-19-2005, 07:45 PM
Maybe Malachy was off by one, and Ratzie is the False prophet after all :(

Dr. Love
04-19-2005, 08:44 PM
This guy doesn't look very popely. :(

And yes, that's the picture.

Ally_Kat
04-19-2005, 08:51 PM
Originally posted by FORD
But his predecessor will be from the Benedictine order.



You do realize there is a difference between picking the name Benedict after St. Benedict and being of the Benedictine order, right? Two totally different things and of what I've all read about the man, I have not read anything about him being a priest in the Benedictine order.

And besides, that so-called revelation said it would be some olive thing going on. He is not from the Meditteranian OR olive skinned.

Warham
04-19-2005, 09:15 PM
I think folks are misinterpreting scripture, to tell you the truth.

Jesterstar
04-19-2005, 09:23 PM
Another pair of underwear destroyed. Gotta stop eating that chili...

Dr. Love
04-19-2005, 10:27 PM
Dude, if that's you...


You look like a total fag.

Nickdfresh
04-19-2005, 10:28 PM
Originally posted by Dr. Love
Dude, if that's you...


You look like a total fag.

He he he!:D

Warham
04-19-2005, 11:04 PM
Shit, and I thought Jester couldn't look any worse than that chap in his avatar. Guess I could be wrong about something. :D

BigBadBrian
04-19-2005, 11:20 PM
Originally posted by kentuckyklira
He was a Hitler-Youth member after all. He learned early!

I really doubt he had a choice in that matter. You forgave your ancestors for that, right?

FORD
04-20-2005, 12:37 AM
Originally posted by BigBadBrian
I really doubt he had a choice in that matter. You forgave your ancestors for that, right?

I suppose he didn't have a choice to be in an anti-aircraft unit of the nazi military either, which was guarding an airplane factory which used concentration camp labor.

The young Karol Wojtyla (JP II) resisted the Nazis. Ratzinger did not. I don't think the Catholic hierarchy is sending the right message by choosing this guy.

BATMAN
04-20-2005, 12:53 AM
Originally posted by FORD
I suppose he didn't have a choice to be in an anti-aircraft unit of the nazi military either, which was guarding an airplane factory which used concentration camp labor.

The young Karol Wojtyla (JP II) resisted the Nazis. Ratzinger did not. I don't think the Catholic hierarchy is sending the right message by choosing this guy.

FUCK ME!!!

Ally_Kat
04-20-2005, 12:54 AM
April 20, 2005

A Theological Visionary With Roots in Wartime Germany
By DANIEL J. WAKIN

OME, April 19 - The man who has become Pope Benedict XVI was a product of wartime Germany, but also of a deeply Roman Catholic region, Bavaria.

As the Nazis strengthened their stranglehold on Germany in the 1930's, the strongly Catholic family of Joseph Ratzinger moved frequently among villages in rural Bavaria.

"Unemployment was rife," he wrote in his memoir, "Milestones." "War reparations weighed heavily on the German economy. Battles among the political parties set people against one another." His father, he wrote, was a determined anti-Nazi.

The Roman Catholic Church, Cardinal Ratzinger recalled, was his bulwark against the Nazi regime, "a citadel of truth and righteousness against the realm of atheism and deceit."

But he could not avoid the realities of the day. In an episode certain to be scrutinized anew, Joseph Ratzinger was briefly and unenthusiastically a member of the Hitler Youth in his early teens, after membership became mandatory in 1941, according to a biography by John L. Allen Jr., who covers the Vatican for The National Catholic Reporter.

In 1943, he and fellow seminarians were drafted. He deserted in 1945 and returned home, but was captured by American soldiers and held as a prisoner of war for several months, Mr. Allen wrote.

Along his way to the papacy, he built a distinguished academic career as a theologian, and then spent nearly a quarter century as Pope John Paul II's theological visionary - and enforcer of strict positions on doctrine, morality and the primacy of the faith.

In addition to his subtle and powerful intellect lies a spiritual, almost mystical side rooted in the traditional Bavarian landscape of processions, devotions to Mary and small country parishes, said John-Peter Pham, a former Vatican diplomat who has written about Cardinal Ratzinger.

"It's a Christianity of the heart, not unlike that of the late pope's Poland," he said. "It's much different than the cerebral theology traditionally associated with German theology."

His experience under the Nazis - he was 18 when the war ended - was formative in his view of the function of the church, Mr. Allen said.

"Having seen fascism in action, Ratzinger today believes that the best antidote to political totalitarianism is ecclesiastical totalitarianism," he wrote. "In other words, he believes the Catholic Church serves the cause of human freedom by restricting freedom in its internal life, thereby remaining clear about what it teaches and believes."

Totalitarianism, indeed, critics might say.

They cite a long list of theologians Cardinal Ratzinger has chastised for straying from official doctrine; his condemnation of "relativism," or the belief that other denominations and faiths lead equally to salvation; his denunciation of liberation theology, homosexuality and feminism; his attempt to rein in national bishops conferences; his belief that the Second Vatican Council of the 1960's, which led to a near-revolutionary modernization of the church, has brought corrosive excesses.

In effect, he has argued for a purer church at the expense of size.

Hans Küng, one of the theologians who ran afoul of him, has called his ideology a "medieval, anti-Reformation, anti-modern paradigm of the church and the papacy."

"To have him as pope will be considered by many Catholics to mean that the church is absolutely unable to reform itself," he said, "and that you are not to have any hope for the great process of the Second Vatican Council."

Along with Bavaria and Nazism, a third influence helped shape the new pope: the leftist-inspired student unrest of the 1960's at the dawn of domestic German terrorism. He said it made him realize that, sometimes, there is no room for discussion.

Even before becoming the supreme pontiff of the Roman Catholic Church, Cardinal Ratzinger wielded immense power. John Paul appointed him prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the former Holy Office. It was a deeply personal choice, made without his usual wide consultation.

Their regular Friday discussions were said to be often freewheeling.

The cardinal expanded the power of the role, ruling on a wide range of subjects. He was the first professional theologian in the job in more than a century, one equipped with a strong intellect and decisiveness.

"This is a man who can deal with a lot of difficult material without becoming upset," said the Rev. Augustine Di Noia, who was the under secretary of the congregation.

John Paul was said to have given Cardinal Ratzinger wide latitude; some called him the "vice pope." Other Vatican officials have suggested he served as a lightning rod, diverting criticism from the pope.

As dean of the College of Cardinals, he was also the most powerful of them - their leader in the period after John Paul's death, the celebrant of his funeral Mass and their guide during the conclave.

Behind his fearsome reputation lies a "a simple person," Father Di Noia said. "He chuckles. There's a simple childlike quality to him." Others speak of his dry sense of humor and modest demeanor.

He is a diminutive man with deep-set eyes and white hair, and speaks Italian - the language of the Vatican - with a strong German accent. Unlike John Paul, he had little time for sports or strenuous activity, other than walks in the mountains.

Until now, he lived in a small apartment near the Vatican and walked to work. He was perhaps the best-known cardinal, appearing at Vatican news conferences and known to many through his books and profiles of him in newspapers.

Joseph Alois Ratzinger was born April 16, 1927, in Marktl am Inn in Bavaria, the youngest of three children. It was a part of a region long within the orbit of Salzburg, in Austria, Mozart's birthplace. A pianist, Cardinal Ratzinger expressed a great love for the composer.

Partly because of his father's opposition to the Nazis, he wrote, the family moved four times before Joseph was 10. His mother was a hotel cook.

He entered the seminary in 1939. After conscription, he served in an antiaircraft unit. He has said the unit was attacked by Allied forces in 1943, but he did not take part in that battle because a finger infection had prevented him from learning to shoot. After about a year in the antiaircraft unit he was drafted into the regular military, sent home and then called up again before deserting in late April 1945, according to Mr. Allen. He told Time magazine in 1993 that while stationed near Hungary, he saw Hungarian Jews being sent to death camps.

In discussing his war experience, Mr. Allen wrote that he publicly expressed little of the explicit horrors that were around him; of the resistance to the Nazis by groups other than Catholics; or of the anti-Semitism of a prominent great-uncle.

In the fall after the war ended in 1945, he returned to the seminary, where his brother, Georg - who was soon to be a prominent church music director - was also enrolled. The brothers were was ordained in 1951; two years later Joseph Ratzinger earned his doctorate at the University of Munich. His dissertation was titled "The People and House of God in St. Augustine's Doctrine of the Church." He earned his teaching licentiate in 1957.

One of his most influential books was an early work from his university lectures, "Introduction to Christianity." He also wrote "Dogma and Revelation" and "Eschatology."

In his view, the church does not exist so that it can be incorporated into the world, but so as to offer a way to live. It is not a human edifice but a divinely created one. And theology is not a dry academic exercise. Theologians should support church teaching to serve the faithful, not depart from it. ( Amen!)

His career as an academic began immediately after he was licensed. He spent two years teaching dogma and fundamental theology at the University of Freising and 10 years at the University of Bonn. He also had stints at the universities Münster and Tübingen. Alienated by the student protests at Tübingen, he moved to Regensburg in 1969.

In a 1985 interview with The New York Times, he called the protests "a radical attack on human freedom and dignity, a deep threat to all that is human." Such actions taught him, he said, that to discuss terror was to collaborate with it. "I learned where discussion must stop because it is turning into a lie and resistance must begin in order to maintain freedom."

Already in 1962, at 35, he achieved prominence at the highest levels of the church. A mutual acquaintance introduced him to Cardinal Joseph Frings, archbishop of Cologne. Cardinal Frings asked him to serve as his expert assistant at the Second Vatican Council. Father Ratzinger was credited with pushing Cardinal Frings to join French and other German bishops in standing firm against the Vatican Curia members who wanted to hold back council reforms. He also helped write a speech criticizing the Holy Office, the predecessor to his future home, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. The speech called it outmoded and a "source of scandal to the world."

Yet within a decade he came to express deep worry that the church was drifting to the left and losing its ecclesiastical rigor.

In 1977, Pope Paul VI appointed him archbishop of Munich, and made him a cardinal in just three months. That same year, he met the future John Paul II, although some have said that they might have met at the Second Vatican Council. They both spent their youths under totalitarianism, but they also had a feeling that the church was adrift in a permissive sea, and that there was a need to return to the fundamentals.

John Paul appointed him to the doctrinal congregation in 1981. Soon, he was taking action against liberation theology, the Marxist-inspired movement of priests in Latin America to help the poor by radical restructuring of society. The congregation denounced the movement in 1984; Leonardo Boff, a Brazilian liberation theologian, was summoned and silenced for a year.

Other theologians were chastised. Charles E. Curran, a theologian at Catholic University of America, was barred in 1986 from teaching at a Catholic institution for refusing to recant his challenge to church teaching on sexuality. The Rev. Tissa Balasuriya, a Sri Lanka theologian, was excommunicated in 1997 after being accused of challenging fundamental Catholic tenets like original sin and the Immaculate Conception. More than a dozen others have been disciplined by the congregation.

With the end of the cold war, Cardinal Ratzinger turned his attention to fighting "relativism." His congregation's 2000 declaration "Dominus Jesus" - "Lord Jesus" - said other religions could not offer salvation, and were "gravely deficient." An uproar from other religious leaders followed, but John Paul publicly defended the document.

Even as he celebrated the Mass leading into the conclave on Monday morning, Cardinal Ratzinger called relativism a "dictatorship" under which the ego and personal desires are paramount.

One of his major efforts, which many say has been successful, was to sap national bishops' conferences of power - and even here he harkened back to the war. The German conference issued "wan and weak" condemnations of Nazism; the truly powerful documents, he said, "came from individual courageous bishops."


http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/20/international/worldspecial2/20profile.html?pagewanted=print&position=

Dr. Love
04-20-2005, 01:41 AM
Den, don't spam.

kentuckyklira
04-20-2005, 04:28 AM
Originally posted by FORD
I suppose he didn't have a choice to be in an anti-aircraft unit of the nazi military either, which was guarding an airplane factory which used concentration camp labor.

The young Karol Wojtyla (JP II) resisted the Nazis. Ratzinger did not. I don't think the Catholic hierarchy is sending the right message by choosing this guy. As much as that Polish prick was an asshole IMO, at least he didn´t chose the easiest way during WWII. Ratzinger on the other hand!

Mr Grimsdale
04-20-2005, 04:46 AM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Perhaps Vatican Cardinals are big fans of THE DUMP after all!:D

Cardinal Grimsdale has a nice ring to it.

Mr Grimsdale
04-20-2005, 04:49 AM
Originally posted by BATMAN
FUCK ME!!!

Are you a choir boy?

Mr Grimsdale
04-20-2005, 04:51 AM
Originally posted by Warham
I can't believe the vast amount of sheer nonsense I read on this forum, and specifically in this thread.

Oh come on, Cardinal Grimsdale sounds really good.

Warham
04-20-2005, 06:51 AM
:D

Jesterstar
04-20-2005, 07:52 AM
Originally posted by Dr. Love
Dude, if that's you...


You look like a total fag.

I knew you'd be Jealous. That is me. Your OWNED.

Feel free to adress me by my real name. DASH HANDSOME.

Dr. Love
04-20-2005, 08:58 AM
You know, narcissism is a personality disorder.

FORD
04-20-2005, 09:15 AM
Originally posted by Dr. Love
You know, narcissism is a personality disorder.

In Jizzystool's case it's probably the least of many.

Warham
04-20-2005, 09:29 AM
FORD, aren't we supposed to delete pictures of cocks?

FORD
04-20-2005, 09:30 AM
Originally posted by Warham
FORD, aren't we supposed to delete pictures of cocks?

Good point. Consider it done ;)

Seshmeister
04-20-2005, 10:52 AM
This is nothing new.

http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/hitler%26bishop.gif
Hitler wth Archbishop Cesare Orsenigo, the papal nuncio in Berlin, 1935

On April 20, 1939, Archbishop Orsenigo celebrated Hitler's birthday. The celebrations, initiated by Pacelli (Pope Pius XII) became a tradition. Each April 20, Cardinal Bertram of Berlin was to send "warmest congratulations to the Fuhrer in the name of the bishops and the dioceses in Germany" and added with "fervent prayers which the Catholics of Germany are sending to heaven on their altars."


http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/Hitler-with-Muller.jpg
Hitler greets Müller the "Bishop of the Reich" and Abbot Schachleitner

http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/hitler_cardinal4.jpg
Another friendly cardinal invites Hitler to lunch.


http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/Bishops-salute-Hitler.jpg
Catholic Bishops giving the Nazi salute in honor of Hitler


http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/hitleratchurch.jpg
Hitler was brought up as a strict catholic

http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/HitlerWithFan.jpg
Hitler signs an autograph for a fan.


http://www.nobeliefs.com/images/priests-salute.jpg

Ally_Kat
04-20-2005, 11:55 AM
And JP2 denounced all that crap that went on.

How come everyone's so willing to bring up that part of old news but not how it was corrected?

Nickdfresh
04-20-2005, 12:07 PM
You have to mention that the guy did 'desert' the German Army.

Guitar Shark
04-20-2005, 12:09 PM
Interesting pictures Sesh.

FORD
04-20-2005, 12:26 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
And JP2 denounced all that crap that went on.

How come everyone's so willing to bring up that part of old news but not how it was corrected?

JP had credibility in doing so because he actively resisted the Nazis as a young man. Ratzinger may or may not have had a choice to join the Hitler Youth, but he definitely did NOT have to provide anti-aircraft defense to a Nazi airplane factory that used concentration camp slave labor. That makes Ratzinger an active participant in the Nazi war machine.

While God may have forgiven him for his war crimes (and I'll leave that up to God) I find it hard to believe that a worldwide church with over a billion members can't find a better candidate to be their leader.

Warham
04-20-2005, 12:44 PM
FORD,

It's called forgiveness and moving on.

I think we can take Peter as an example of someone who turned away from his Lord, only to be made the rock upon which the church was built.

WACF
04-20-2005, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
And JP2 denounced all that crap that went on.

How come everyone's so willing to bring up that part of old news but not how it was corrected?

Because that does not make as good a story...

DrMaddVibe
04-20-2005, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by FORD
JP had credibility in doing so because he actively resisted the Nazis as a young man. Ratzinger may or may not have had a choice to join the Hitler Youth, but he definitely did NOT have to provide anti-aircraft defense to a Nazi airplane factory that used concentration camp slave labor. That makes Ratzinger an active participant in the Nazi war machine.

While God may have forgiven him for his war crimes (and I'll leave that up to God) I find it hard to believe that a worldwide church with over a billion members can't find a better candidate to be their leader.

I concur.

Not to mention the Catholic posturing and slap in the face to other religions this one guy has done throughout his "career". They should've looked deeper within their ranks before settling on this guy and his baggage. The good news is that at age 78...he won't be there too long!

The only satisfaction I can muster from the guy is the headline that I read that he's pissing off liberals.

THAT'S funny!

WACF
04-20-2005, 01:21 PM
He will hold the line on gay/lesbian marriage and abortion...that is what the cardinals were after right now IMO.

Warham
04-20-2005, 01:22 PM
They will always hold that line.

Gays looking to get married in a Catholic church might as well look for another denomination. They'll be dead before they see it happen.

BigBadBrian
04-20-2005, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by FORD
but he definitely did NOT have to provide anti-aircraft defense to a Nazi airplane factory that used concentration camp slave labor. That makes Ratzinger an active participant in the Nazi war machine.



How so? Explain yourself.

DrMaddVibe
04-20-2005, 01:56 PM
BBB...I posted a link to a story(I think its on pg2)...details it.


Two years later Ratzinger was enrolled in an anti-aircraft unit that protected a BMW factory making aircraft engines. The workforce included slaves from Dachau concentration camp.

Ratzinger has insisted he never took part in combat or fired a shot — adding that his gun was not even loaded — because of a badly infected finger. He was sent to Hungary, where he set up tank traps and saw Jews being herded to death camps. He deserted in April 1944 and spent a few weeks in a prisoner of war camp.

He has since said that although he was opposed to the Nazi regime, any open resistance would have been futile — comments echoed this weekend by his elder brother Georg, a retired priest ordained along with the cardinal in 1951.

“Resistance was truly impossible,” Georg Ratzinger said. “Before we were conscripted, one of our teachers said we should fight and become heroic Nazis and another told us not to worry as only one soldier in a thousand was killed. But neither of us ever used a rifle against the enemy.”

Some locals in Traunstein, like Elizabeth Lohner, 84, whose brother-in-law was sent to Dachau as a conscientious objector, dismiss such suggestions. “It was possible to resist, and those people set an example for others,” she said. “The Ratzingers were young and had made a different choice.” "

WACF
04-20-2005, 03:10 PM
Originally posted by Warham
They will always hold that line.

Gays looking to get married in a Catholic church might as well look for another denomination. They'll be dead before they see it happen.


Yes they will...I just think with the new pope he will not mince words.
He will be very clear.
The crybabies I hear on the news know they will not get their way and have started whining.

There is some talk of him coming down hard on US bishops pushing for a "American Catholic Church" and a much more liberalized social and theological, agenda.
Just something I just caught on the news.

What is up with that?
I have never heard of that before.

Nickdfresh
04-20-2005, 03:28 PM
Originally posted by FORD
In Jizzystool's case it's probably the least of many.

The FL Mods are on a roll!:D

Nickdfresh
04-20-2005, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by Warham
They will always hold that line.

Gays looking to get married in a Catholic church might as well look for another denomination. They'll be dead before they see it happen.

I guess they'll just have to be Priests!

Rikk
04-20-2005, 03:47 PM
What a joke. Like I'm going to let some 78-year-old ex-Hitler youth tell me about absolute moral values.:p

Nickdfresh
04-20-2005, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by Rikk
What a joke. Like I'm going to let some 78-year-old ex-Hitler youth tell me about absolute moral values.:p

Maybe he'll give all those dirty homos a nice 'shower!'

Ally_Kat
04-20-2005, 04:31 PM
Originally posted by WACF


There is some talk of him coming down hard on US bishops pushing for a "American Catholic Church" and a much more liberalized social and theological, agenda.
Just something I just caught on the news.

What is up with that?
I have never heard of that before.

Wouldn't shock me. Of what I've seen, American Catholics tend to be more liberal than Catholics from other regions.

Some of the stuff I've heard fellow Catholics I know bitch about and want makes me question if they really are Catholic anymore.

Seshmeister
04-20-2005, 05:28 PM
Originally posted by Warham
They will always hold that line.

Gays looking to get married in a Catholic church might as well look for another denomination. They'll be dead before they see it happen.

I could care less about gays getting married in a catholic church.

I'm more cuntcerned about this dinosaur continuing the spread of AIDS in the Third World with his inhuman superstitious doctrine on the use of condoms.

FORD
04-20-2005, 05:28 PM
Originally posted by Warham
FORD,

It's called forgiveness and moving on.

I think we can take Peter as an example of someone who turned away from his Lord, only to be made the rock upon which the church was built.

Peter made a momentary bad call (or three of them) but he didn't participate in the murder of 12 million people. There's a bit of a difference. Like I said, forgiveness is one thing. Elevating a Nazi to the head of the church is another. They had literally hundreds of cardinals to choose from. Somebody had to be better than a Nazi neocon Opus Dei fascist.

And even if he isn't a nazi anymore, he IS very much a fascist by involvement with Opus Dei, the Catholic version of the dominionists.

Even if the prophecy of Malachy didn't explicitly spell out that there would be 268 popes (Ratzi is #267) common sense would tell you that by embracing such a horrible man as leader, the church will be dragged down with him. How ever short Ratzi's term as Pope is, he will definitely make life easier for the False Prophet (partner of the Antichrist) who follows him.

Seshmeister
04-20-2005, 05:30 PM
FORD this prophecy shit is idiotic.

McCarrens
04-20-2005, 05:45 PM
Everything Ford posts is idiotic but it is fun to read and laugh at.

I view Ford's posts as being equivalent to the stuff you buy in airport book stores to keep you entertained on those long flights.

But has anyone noticed that Ford seems to mix Nazi-lore into all his little theories?

Soon, he'll be shouting that an undergound number of Nazis is running the world.

And after, I wouldn't be surprised he began preaching about Hitler (or Hitler's clone) still being alive and living in a cave with Osama Bin Lamam th eBCE and some MK Ultra Operatives.

FORD
04-20-2005, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
FORD this prophecy shit is idiotic.

Well, for being "idiotic" this old Irish monk has called things pretty damn good.

He said that Pope #265 would be the Pope of the new moon and that his reign would be short. JP1 was elected Pope during a new moon, and died about one month later - during the next full moon.

Pope #266 was associated with the "labor of the sun". The day that Karol Wojtyla was born, there was a solar eclipse. The day he was buried, there was another.

Pope #267 was predicted to be associated with the Benedictines. When Ratzi chose the name "Benedict", it was assumed he was honoring the last Pope Benedict, who was in office in the WWI era and tried to bring peace. But Ratzi has since said that it was Saint Benedict who inspired his choice of names.

Looks like Malachy was 3 for 3 on the last 3 popes.

And admittedly, I'm not Catholic so I never heard of this prophecy before yesterday morning. But I'd say that the old guy was onto something.

McCarrens
04-20-2005, 05:47 PM
Originally posted by FORD
And admittedly, I'm not Catholic so I never heard of this prophecy before yesterday morning. But I'd say that the old guy was onto something.

Oh look, Ford is talking shit about stuff he knows nothing about.

Why am I drawing attention to this? It happens every day!

FORD
04-20-2005, 05:49 PM
Originally posted by McCarrens
Oh look, Ford is talking shit about stuff he knows nothing about.

Why am I drawing attention to this? It happens every day!

Kinda like you commenting on anything that happens outside the trailer park?

Warham
04-20-2005, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by FORD
Peter made a momentary bad call (or three of them) but he didn't participate in the murder of 12 million people. There's a bit of a difference. Like I said, forgiveness is one thing. Elevating a Nazi to the head of the church is another. They had literally hundreds of cardinals to choose from. Somebody had to be better than a Nazi neocon Opus Dei fascist.

And even if he isn't a nazi anymore, he IS very much a fascist by involvement with Opus Dei, the Catholic version of the dominionists.

Even if the prophecy of Malachy didn't explicitly spell out that there would be 268 popes (Ratzi is #267) common sense would tell you that by embracing such a horrible man as leader, the church will be dragged down with him. How ever short Ratzi's term as Pope is, he will definitely make life easier for the False Prophet (partner of the Antichrist) who follows him.

I used to believe that the antichrist was going to be a person and I used to think that there would be a specific false prophet, but now I believe that the Bible is referring to them throughout history, in their many forms and ideas.

From a Dr. Henry Alford:

‘It cannot be disguised,’ he remarks, in treating of this very point, ‘that in several important particulars the prophetic requirements are very far from being fulfilled. I will only mention two,---one subjective, the other objective. In the characteristic of 2 Thess. ii. 4 ("who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God," etc.) the pope does not, and never did, fulfil the prophecy. Allowing all the striking coincidences with the latter part of the verse which have been so abundantly adduced, it never can be shown that he fulfils the former part---nay, so far is he from it, that the abject adoration of and submission to legomenoi qeoi and sebasmata (all that is called God and that is worshipped) has ever been one of his most notable peculiarities. The second objection, of an external and historical character, is even more decisive. If the Papacy be antichrist, then has the manifestation been made, and endured now for nearly 1500 years, and yet that day of the Lord is not come which, by the terms of our prophecy, such manifestation is immediately to precede.

McCarrens
04-20-2005, 06:29 PM
Originally posted by FORD
Kinda like you commenting on anything that happens outside the trailer park?

Maybe you should spend less time making up crazy conspiracy theories and more time working on your retorts.

Seshmeister
04-20-2005, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by Warham
I used to believe that the antichrist was going to be a person and I used to think that there would be a specific false prophet, but now I believe that the Bible is referring to them throughout history, in their many forms and ideas.

From a Dr. Henry Alford:

�It cannot be disguised,� he remarks, in treating of this very point, �that in several important particulars the prophetic requirements are very far from being fulfilled. I will only mention two,---one subjective, the other objective. In the characteristic of 2 Thess. ii. 4 ("who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God," etc.) the pope does not, and never did, fulfil the prophecy. Allowing all the striking coincidences with the latter part of the verse which have been so abundantly adduced, it never can be shown that he fulfils the former part---nay, so far is he from it, that the abject adoration of and submission to legomenoi qeoi and sebasmata (all that is called God and that is worshipped) has ever been one of his most notable peculiarities. The second objection, of an external and historical character, is even more decisive. If the Papacy be antichrist, then has the manifestation been made, and endured now for nearly 1500 years, and yet that day of the Lord is not come which, by the terms of our prophecy, such manifestation is immediately to precede.

There have been some incredibly evil bastards who were pope. They could all be cuntsidered antichrists.

This prophecy shit is just a way of feeling like your life is in some way happening at the crux of human existence. Like the big Y2K end of the world theories.

Of course I bet you FORD still pays into a pension...:)

FORD
04-20-2005, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by Seshmeister


Of course I bet you FORD still pays into a pension...:)

For now..... Jesus did say that we wouldn't know the day or the hour, so you have to cover yourself in the mean time.

Nickdfresh
04-20-2005, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by McCarrens
Oh look, Ford is talking shit about stuff he knows nothing about.

Why am I drawing attention to this? It happens every day!

Do you ever comment on anything besides FORD's comments McCarrins? Why am I drawing attention to this? It happens every day!

Warham
04-20-2005, 09:59 PM
That's the problem with a rapture, tribulation, etc. You would have a general idea of when He would be coming if you followed that interpretation of scripture, with the seven years, etc.

Jesus' coming will be like a thief in the night. It's quite impossible to sneak into somebody's house when they have all their lights on and are waiting on him.

Ally_Kat
04-20-2005, 10:21 PM
Originally posted by FORD

Pope #267 was predicted to be associated with the Benedictines. When Ratzi chose the name "Benedict", it was assumed he was honoring the last Pope Benedict, who was in office in the WWI era and tried to bring peace. But Ratzi has since said that it was Saint Benedict who inspired his choice of names.


But picking a name has NOTHING to do with the order. Was Benedict Arnold in association with the Benedictine monks because of his name? No.

Ally_Kat
04-20-2005, 10:24 PM
Originally posted by Seshmeister

I'm more cuntcerned about this dinosaur continuing the spread of AIDS in the Third World with his inhuman superstitious doctrine on the use of condoms.

You keep mentioning it Sesh. Why don't you go on a mission to Africa to preach the benefits of birth control if it is that close to your heart?

Guitar Shark
04-21-2005, 10:54 AM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
You keep mentioning it Sesh. Why don't you go on a mission to Africa to preach the benefits of birth control if it is that close to your heart?

He keeps mentioning it because it's a good point. Don't tell me you believe the Catholic church's prohibition of birth control doesn't have disastrous consequences in the Third World. It's absolutely ridiculous. A simple change in church policy from prohibition to tolerance would go a long way towards improving the lives of millions of people.

twonabomber
04-21-2005, 02:03 PM
send your congrats...

benedictxvi@vatican.va

Warham
04-21-2005, 02:44 PM
The Catholic church is wrong about birth control, as the Bible never states whether man could use it or not. I think they are taking the story of Onan a bit too the extreme.

Guitar Shark
04-21-2005, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by Warham
The Catholic church is wrong about birth control, as the Bible never states whether man could use it or not. I think they are taking the story of Onan a bit too the extreme.

Ham... you ok dude?

We're starting to agree far too much these days.

Warham
04-21-2005, 02:46 PM
I'm fine. :D

I was raised Catholic, and I think they are too bound by traditions and man-made beliefs instead of just relying on the Word itself.

Ally_Kat
04-21-2005, 03:20 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
He keeps mentioning it because it's a good point. Don't tell me you believe the Catholic church's prohibition of birth control doesn't have disastrous consequences in the Third World. It's absolutely ridiculous. A simple change in church policy from prohibition to tolerance would go a long way towards improving the lives of millions of people.

They have a choice on whether they will use birth control or not, just the Catholics here and everywhere else in the world who use birth control against the Church's wishes.

Guitar Shark
04-21-2005, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
They have a choice on whether they will use birth control or not, just the Catholics here and everywhere else in the world who use birth control against the Church's wishes.

That's a very weak argument. Most Catholics in developing countries are such fervent Catholics that they follow the church's rules to the letter. Mexico is a good example. There is no such thing as 'choice' to many Catholics and they would never consider it acceptable to disobey the Vatican. Mexico just happens to have one of the highest birth rates in the world. American Catholics operate differently of course, but that is the exception rather than the rule.

Also, where do you draw the line? The Catholic Church prohibits abortion. Under your logic, Catholics everywhere can choose to abort their unborn babies against the Church's wishes if they want.

GAR
04-21-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
And JP2 denounced all that crap that went on.

What the hell does Denouncing have to do with anything?

The pictures clearly show Catholics hailing with the Nazi salute.

Look at this one more time: now tell me, how many Nazi salutes can you count? Looks pretty intentional to me.

Ally_Kat
04-21-2005, 10:49 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
That's a very weak argument. Most Catholics in developing countries are such fervent Catholics that they follow the church's rules to the letter. Mexico is a good example. There is no such thing as 'choice' to many Catholics and they would never consider it acceptable to disobey the Vatican. Mexico just happens to have one of the highest birth rates in the world. American Catholics operate differently of course, but that is the exception rather than the rule.

Also, where do you draw the line? The Catholic Church prohibits abortion. Under your logic, Catholics everywhere can choose to abort their unborn babies against the Church's wishes if they want.

And so is your argument if you take it back to the AIDS path we started and I commented on and off the population path you took it to. If they are such fervent Catholics, why are they having pre-marital sex or sex with someone other than their spouse? Because not only does the Church say that's wrong, but God announced that one.

See, that's what I don't get. It's normal for people within the faith to go against something the big guy upstairs stated, but the Church's interpretation (for lack of a better word) of a situation stops them in their tracks and brings harm upon them? I'm sorry. I don't buy that completely.

And there are tons of Catholics who do things even thought the Church says it's wrong. Show me a Catholic who had an abortion because the Church said it was okay because there are Catholics who have abortions.

Ally_Kat
04-21-2005, 10:55 PM
Originally posted by GAR
What the hell does Denouncing have to do with anything?

The pictures clearly show Catholics hailing with the Nazi salute.

Look at this one more time: now tell me, how many Nazi salutes can you count? Looks pretty intentional to me.

He apologized. He flat out said the Catholic Church was wrong with it's official stance on hating the Jews "because they killed Jesus." He said that the views of those were not the views of the entire Church at that time or this time. He reached out to the Jews. He visited Isreal.

There are pictures of him doing that too. Why aren't those accounted for?

I'm sure I can go into a photoalbum of your pictures and find something you consider embarassing or something you wish you never did. And then I could bring it up over and over again despite how much you talk it down.

tobinentinc
04-21-2005, 11:30 PM
I'm confident, that if the catholic church appointed Karl Marx as the new pope, Ford would still say he's a neocon.

FORD
04-22-2005, 12:51 AM
Originally posted by tobinentinc
I'm confident, that if the catholic church appointed Karl Marx as the new pope, Ford would still say he's a neocon.

Karl Marx is dead, so he's ineligible. And he wasn't a dominionist either.

Mr Grimsdale
04-22-2005, 05:10 AM
6-4 it's Cardinal Grimsdale next time.

Mr Grimsdale
04-22-2005, 05:14 AM
Originally posted by Warham
The Catholic church is wrong about birth control, as the Bible never states whether man could use it or not. I think they are taking the story of Onan a bit too the extreme.

Wasn't he played by Arnie?

Arnie's been described as looking like a condom packed full of pickled walnuts so I guess it's beginning to make sense.

kentuckyklira
04-22-2005, 05:37 AM
Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
“Resistance was truly impossible,” Georg Ratzinger said. “Before we were conscripted, one of our teachers said we should fight and become heroic Nazis and another told us not to worry as only one soldier in a thousand was killed. But neither of us ever used a rifle against the enemy.”

Bullshit!

Just imagine what would have happened to a guy in the Wehrmacht whose officers noticed they weren´t firing at the enemy!

kentuckyklira
04-22-2005, 05:47 AM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
He keeps mentioning it because it's a good point. Don't tell me you believe the Catholic church's prohibition of birth control doesn't have disastrous consequences in the Third World. It's absolutely ridiculous. A simple change in church policy from prohibition to tolerance would go a long way towards improving the lives of millions of people. I´ll start considering showing respect for the Catholic church when they start selling off their riches and feeding and treating every AIDS orphan and feeding every starving kid in Catholic parts of the third world. And providing a decent education as well!

kentuckyklira
04-22-2005, 05:52 AM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
They have a choice on whether they will use birth control or not, just the Catholics here and everywhere else in the world who use birth control against the Church's wishes. Don´t you think actually telling people (especially in regions with little or no access to decent education) that condoms are a sensible thing to use might help.

Those poor people can´t make choices considering options they have hardly heard about. It´s like expecting a kid from a slum in Haiti to know how to program a video recorder.

Nickdfresh
04-22-2005, 07:37 AM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
They have a choice on whether they will use birth control or not, just the Catholics here and everywhere else in the world who use birth control against the Church's wishes.


So I guess social problems like the massive overpopulation epidemic, five billion people and counting, will have to be solved inspite of the Catholic church, and not (partially) because of it. Hallelujah!:rolleyes: No wonder why many Catholics choose to "ignore" the teachings of the church!;)

I am a "Cafe' Catholic" all the way!

Nickdfresh
04-22-2005, 07:54 AM
Originally posted by kentuckyklira
Bullshit!

Just imagine what would have happened to a guy in the Wehrmacht whose officers noticed they weren´t firing at the enemy!

You know I've heard that, to a certain extent at least, the concept that individual resistance was not necessarily futile. I wonder if being German you heard this story?

A German SS (no less) junior officer, a lieutenant or captain, refused to carry out orders to massacre a small village either in Poland or in Russia. He was told that he would be court martialed and possibly executed if he did not carry out the order, he again refused saying the order was illegal and he would sooner die than carry it out!

He was taken back to Berlin, under arrest, to be tried and hanged for treason or something like that. The Nazi German prosecution began to gather evidence for their case against him. As they researched, something interesting happened, they found out that technically the lieutenant was correct, it was illegal to slaughter innocent civilians according to German military law. What saved the guys life was the fact that they publicly reported on the case through the Nazi propaganda machine in order to make an example out of those that violated their oath to the Fuhrer.

The charges were quietly dropped as a public trial would be too embaressing and the guy was released. I think, but am not sure, that he then defected to the Allied side and served in either British or American Intelligence.

kentuckyklira
04-22-2005, 08:37 AM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
You know I've heard that, to a certain extent at least, the concept that individual resistance was not necessarily futile. I wonder if being German you heard this story?

A German SS (no less) junior officer, a lieutenant or captain, refused to carry out orders to massacre a small village either in Poland or in Russia. He was told that he would be court martialed and possibly executed if he did not carry out the order, he again refused saying the order was illegal and he would sooner die than carry it out!

He was taken back to Berlin, under arrest, to be tried and hanged for treason or something like that. The Nazi German prosecution began to gather evidence for their case against him. As they researched, something interesting happened, they found out that technically the lieutenant was correct, it was illegal to slaughter innocent civilians according to German military law. What saved the guys life was the fact that they publicly reported on the case through the Nazi propaganda machine in order to make an example out of those that violated their oath to the Fuhrer.

The charges were quietly dropped as a public trial would be too embaressing and the guy was released. I think, but am not sure, that he then defected to the Allied side and served in either British or American Intelligence. Most stories like that didn´t end that well for the guy involved.

FORD
04-22-2005, 10:27 AM
Originally posted by Mr Grimsdale
Wasn't he played by Arnie?

Arnie's been described as looking like a condom packed full of pickled walnuts so I guess it's beginning to make sense.

Yeah, it was "Onan the Wanking Barbarian". But it was a PG-13 movie, so there wasn't much actual wanking taking place.

Guitar Shark
04-22-2005, 10:49 AM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
And so is your argument if you take it back to the AIDS path we started and I commented on and off the population path you took it to. If they are such fervent Catholics, why are they having pre-marital sex or sex with someone other than their spouse? Because not only does the Church say that's wrong, but God announced that one.

See, that's what I don't get. It's normal for people within the faith to go against something the big guy upstairs stated, but the Church's interpretation (for lack of a better word) of a situation stops them in their tracks and brings harm upon them? I'm sorry. I don't buy that completely.

And there are tons of Catholics who do things even thought the Church says it's wrong. Show me a Catholic who had an abortion because the Church said it was okay because there are Catholics who have abortions.

:confused:

Ally, you're smarter than this.

What possible good can come from the Church's prohibition of birth control?

And what is the purpose of a religion where you can simply pick and choose which of the "rules" apply?

Ally_Kat
04-22-2005, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by kentuckyklira
And providing a decent education as well!

Their educational system is better than the NYC public one.

Ally_Kat
04-22-2005, 08:03 PM
And what good can come from other beliefs other religions hold?

Catholicism is one path in life, and according to you guys, everything wrong in the world is it's fault. I realize there's A LOT of anti-Catholicism in the world. you guys helped show me that. Thanks.

I still refuse to believe it's the reason for everything evil in this world. I will repeat what i said the last time because apparently it was not understood --

It's said that they are faithfully Catholics and will follow teachings to the T, eh? The church teaches, waaaay before they mention anything aobut birth control, that God said no hanky panky beofre marriage. So these Catholics, who you say are so faithful that they will do whatever the Vatican says to justify your position on a matter, are out getting AIDS and dying because of the Church's stance on birth control. If they are so faithful to God and all, why do they ignore what He said, yet listen only to the bc belief? I don't buy that it is all the Church's fault there. Sorry. You're going to have to come up with some other excuse for that one cuz if they are such God-fearing Catholics, they'd stop before bc and fear more about doing the deed.

But, if we hold on to the logic you presented that they won't listen to even God's word on the whole deal, I don't see why they are so faithful to a word of a fellow human beeing, position in the Church or not. If they can ignore a diety, they can ignore the pope. The pope is not higher than God, not even in those countries. I would bet money there are Catholics in Latin America, Mexico, South America, and Africa that do use bc or have had an abortion (back alley or straight up). Maybe the numbers aren't the same as the US, but I'd still bet money there are those that do.

So continuing with this, if they go and have pre-marital sex or have an affair, I don't see why they hold such weight on a birth control stance.

And I'm not promoting an religion where people pick and choose what to follow. Everyone is saying that AIDS is spreading and it's the fault of the Catholic Church because of the interpretation on marriage, sex, and birth control. I'm saying if is it and it is among a huge part of the Catholic population, then obviously people are picking and choosing what beliefs to follow. If a married someone who doesn't cheat got AIDS by let's say blood tranfusion and passed it to their spouse, then there would be a contained number of AIDS victims. Yeah, there would be a large group, but it wouldn't be expanding like it is.

Jesus Christ
04-22-2005, 08:54 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark

And what is the purpose of a religion where you can simply pick and choose which of the "rules" apply?

Good question, Matthew.

And the answer is, that ye should stick to the rules which cometh from Me and My Father and do not heed the ones which man hath added unto them.

kentuckyklira
04-22-2005, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
[BCatholicism is one path in life, and according to you guys, everything wrong in the world is it's fault. I realize there's A LOT of anti-Catholicism in the world. you guys helped show me that. Thanks.

[/B] Nope!

Naturally, considering the Polish dick´s death and my scumbag countryman´s election, the focus is on the Catholic church. I, and quite a few others, don´t see much of a difference in Islam and Judaism.

Religion sucks, it´s for people who don´t trust their own common sense!

The Scatologist
04-22-2005, 09:21 PM
Anyone see this yet? lol

Dr. Love
04-22-2005, 11:30 PM
Yeah, we were talking about that at work.

Nickdfresh
04-23-2005, 11:45 AM
Damn he's a ringer, and just before the new Star Wars flick! Maybe FORD IS correct! Maybe this IS the 'END TIMES!':confused:

WACF
04-23-2005, 12:23 PM
Ally...good posts.

I would love to add to it but you are right on the money.

Seshmeister
04-23-2005, 08:52 PM
Originally posted by FORD
For now..... Jesus did say that we wouldn't know the day or the hour, so you have to cover yourself in the mean time.

You see you post stuff that you don't actually believe in.

I bet you voted Republican...

FORD=5 Year Troll...:)

Seshmeister
04-23-2005, 08:59 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
You keep mentioning it Sesh. Why don't you go on a mission to Africa to preach the benefits of birth control if it is that close to your heart?

Fuck off.

I have no effect on Africans. I am neutral to them no better no worse.

Your superstitions are killing them. It's all about future investment for you people. At some time in the future the Africans will have some money and you can take it and make jewel encrusted fucking goblets out of it.

Find people and wow them with new technology and lies and then stop them using rubbers because it just doesn't feel the same for the priests when they're fucking the kids?

What a crock.

You should be ashamed of yourself. I realise that your parents predjudices have made you like this but by now you should be realising that their superstition baggage was bullshit.

Cheers!

:gulp:

FORD
04-23-2005, 10:34 PM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
You see you post stuff that you don't actually believe in.

I bet you voted Republican...

FORD=5 Year Troll...:)

I've voted for a republican exactly 3 times in my life, and two of those were in the primaries to vote against the guy I hated the most. I.e McCain over Junior in 2000, and a similar moderate over far rightist in a governor's race here. I call it strategic voting. I don't believe a President McCain would have been as good as a President Dean, but he would have been a Hell of a lot better than pResident Bush Jr. I doubt he would have chosen the PNAC cabinet, and as a result, their "PERLE Harbor" wouldn't have occurred. And as a rule, McCain's agenda would have been far less corporatist as a rule. Overall, it probably would have been a respectable record, like Eisenhower, or what Nixon might have been if years of working for the BCE hadn't made him paranoid and a drunk

er, no offense, Sesh.

Seshmeister
04-24-2005, 06:16 AM
But I'm sober in the morning while you're still expecting the end of the world and paying into a pension...

kentuckyklira
04-24-2005, 07:02 AM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
But I'm sober in the morning while you're still expecting the end of the world and paying into a pension... Sober in the morning!

What kind of a fucking Scotsman are you?

Nickdfresh
04-24-2005, 12:32 PM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
But I'm sober in the morning while you're still expecting the end of the world and paying into a pension...

SESH, I noticed you mentioned "pensions," more than once. I was listening to an American radio discussion on 'Privatizing' Social Security, and an English woman, now living in the States, called in and basically said don't do it! She said that retirement privatization took place in the UK and many lost out big and young UKers seemed to be rather skeptical of pensions now in general as a result, and just saved their money and hoped for the best. Is this what you mean?

Ally_Kat
04-24-2005, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by kentuckyklira
the focus is on the Catholic church.

Dude, when it comes to how religion is wrong, the focus is always on the Catholic Church. That's the first thing I learned here.

Ally_Kat
04-24-2005, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
Fuck off.

I have no effect on Africans. I am neutral to them no better no worse.

Then stop bitching if you aren't willing to do something to stop it.


Originally posted by Seshmeister
Your superstitions are killing them. It's all about future investment for you people. At some time in the future the Africans will have some money and you can take it and make jewel encrusted fucking goblets out of it.

Find people and wow them with new technology and lies and then stop them using rubbers because it just doesn't feel the same for the priests when they're fucking the kids?

What a crock.

You obviously haven't read my other post.


Originally posted by Seshmeister
You should be ashamed of yourself. I realise that your parents predjudices have made you like this but by now you should be realising that their superstition baggage was bullshit.

Cheers!

:gulp:

Dude, you go fuck off. Just because you think the "superstition baggage was bullshit", doesn't mean everyone else in the world think it is or is obliged to think it is. And fuck off again because my parents had NOTHING to do with how I ended up religiously. My mother stopped going to Church because of the lecturers giving out Communion. My father is Congregationalist. I went to a Lutheran high school. Almost all of my friends are Jewish. Prejudice? Go drink yourself blind again, asshole. I picked my religion. I know quite a lot about different religions and the basis of what they stand for. I'm all about people picking a faith that works best for them. The only negative thing I've ever said about a faith was that freaky, out-there Pentacostal church my friend belongs to that condemmed her to hell, and treats her as such. because she is the only one that doesn't start shaking in the middle of a prayer spouting off babble and because she doesn't want an aranged marriage. And I know other Pentacostals to know that this treatment doesn't happen in every church across the denomination.

You don't believe in God, fine. I have no problem with it. You obviously, on the other hand, have a problem with me believing in God. You're the one who calls or makes out anyone interpretations within their faith or anyone morals from a faith "superstitious." Who are the one telling someone to be ashamed of themselves because they have faith in a higher power. Who's the one with the prejudices against someone? Sure in the hell not me.

Seshmeister
04-24-2005, 04:22 PM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
SESH, I noticed you mentioned "pensions," more than once. I was listening to an American radio discussion on 'Privatizing' Social Security, and an English woman, now living in the States, called in and basically said don't do it! She said that retirement privatization took place in the UK and many lost out big and young UKers seemed to be rather skeptical of pensions now in general as a result, and just saved their money and hoped for the best. Is this what you mean?

I don't have a pension. Pension funds haven't been performing well here recently in any case.

No my point was that FORD posts every other day prophecies that the end of the world is coming soon yet pays money into a pension.

If he had the courage of his convictions what's the point?:)

Cheers!

:gulp:

Seshmeister
04-24-2005, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
Then stop bitching if you aren't willing to do something to stop it.



You obviously haven't read my other post.



Dude, you go fuck off. Just because you think the "superstition baggage was bullshit", doesn't mean everyone else in the world think it is or is obliged to think it is. And fuck off again because my parents had NOTHING to do with how I ended up religiously. My mother stopped going to Church because of the lecturers giving out Communion. My father is Congregationalist. I went to a Lutheran high school. Almost all of my friends are Jewish. Prejudice? Go drink yourself blind again, asshole. I picked my religion. I know quite a lot about different religions and the basis of what they stand for. I'm all about people picking a faith that works best for them. The only negative thing I've ever said about a faith was that freaky, out-there Pentacostal church my friend belongs to that condemmed her to hell, and treats her as such. because she is the only one that doesn't start shaking in the middle of a prayer spouting off babble and because she doesn't want an aranged marriage. And I know other Pentacostals to know that this treatment doesn't happen in every church across the denomination.

You don't believe in God, fine. I have no problem with it. You obviously, on the other hand, have a problem with me believing in God. You're the one who calls or makes out anyone interpretations within their faith or anyone morals from a faith "superstitious." Who are the one telling someone to be ashamed of themselves because they have faith in a higher power. Who's the one with the prejudices against someone? Sure in the hell not me.

Ooof!:D

In the words of Bill Hicks well "Forgive me then Christian".

As for my use of the word superstition, the dictionary agrees with me.

su·per·sti·tion P Pronunciation Key (spr-stshn)
n.
1.An irrational belief that an object, action, or circumstance not logically related to a course of events influences its outcome.
2(a) A belief, practice, or rite irrationally maintained by ignorance of the laws of nature or by faith in magic or chance.
(b) A fearful or abject state of mind resulting from such ignorance or irrationality.
(c) Idolatry.


Cheers!

:gulp: