Yaaaay!!!! Close The Mexican Border Already!!!

[Hardrock69]

New US migration laws vex Mexico

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4544699.stm

Thousands of illegal immigrants cross into the US every year
Mexico is to make a formal complaint to the US over tough new immigration measures signed into law by President George W Bush on Wednesday.
The new law will allow a border fence to be completed in the Californian city of San Diego to deter illegal migrants.

It also makes it harder for people living illegally in the US to obtain driving licences.

Mexico's President Vicente Fox and Interior Minister Santiago Creel have said it will harm bilateral relations.

Millions of Mexicans live in the US, many of them without legal documentation, and Mr Fox said it was his duty to defend them.

He said Mexico would make "a firm and formal complaint against the option that has nothing to do with the harmonious development of relations between the US and Mexico".

Mr Creel, who announced on Thursday that he would seek to succeed Mr Fox as president, said the new law was "overly extreme".

The interior minister added that Mexico had given assistance to the Washington in stopping Central Americans crossing its territory to enter the US and had received "absolutely nothing" in return.

Many Republicans in the US Congress have been pressing for a clampdown on illegal immigration since the 11 September 2001 attacks. They argue that poor security on the Mexican border could be used by terrorist groups to move their members into the US.

Senior Mexican and US officials met in January to discuss border security and a proposed immigration deal.

The two failed to make progress on a programme to give Mexicans a right to work temporarily in the US.



ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE COIN...OUR GOVERNMENT DOES NOT WANT TO ENFORCE IMMIGRATION LAWS!!!
:mad: :mad: :mad:

FUCKING BASTARDS!!!

Border Patrol told to stand down in Arizona

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20050513-122032-5055r.htm

By Jerry Seper
THE WASHINGTON TIMES


U.S. Border Patrol agents have been ordered not to arrest illegal aliens along the section of the Arizona border where protesters patrolled last month because an increase in apprehensions there would prove the effectiveness of Minuteman volunteers, The Washington Times has learned.
More than a dozen agents, all of whom asked not to be identified for fear of retribution, said orders relayed by Border Patrol supervisors at the Naco, Ariz., station made it clear that arrests were "not to go up" along the 23-mile section of border that the volunteers monitored to protest illegal immigration.

"It was clear to everyone here what was being said and why," said one veteran agent. "The apprehensions were not to increase after the Minuteman volunteers left. It was as simple as that."
Another agent said the Naco supervisors "were clear in their intention" to keep new arrests to an "absolute minimum" to offset the effect of the Minuteman vigil, adding that patrols along the border have been severely limited.
Border Patrol Chief David V. Aguilar at the agency's Washington headquarters called the accusations "outright wrong," saying that supervisors at the Naco station had not blocked agents from making arrests and that the station's 350 agents were being "supported in carrying out" their duties.
"Border Patrol agents are the front line of defense against terrorism," Chief Aguilar said, adding that the 11,000 agents nationwide are "meeting that challenge, head-on ... as daunting a task as that may sound."
The chief -- a former head of the agency's Tucson sector, which includes the Naco station -- said that with the world watching the Arizona border because of the Minuteman Project, agents in Naco "demonstrated flexibility and resilience in carrying out their critical homeland security duties and responsibilities."
But Rep. Tom Tancredo, Colorado Republican, yesterday said "credible sources" within the Border Patrol also had told him of the decision by Naco supervisors to keep new arrests to a minimum, saying he was angry but not surprised.
"It's like telling a cop to stand by and watch burglars loot a store but don't arrest any of them," he said. "This is another example of decisions being made at the highest levels of the Border Patrol that are hurting morale and helping to rot the agency from within.
"I worry about our efforts in Congress to increase the number of agents," he said. "Based on these kinds of orders, we could spend the equivalent of the national debt and never have secure borders."
Mr. Tancredo, chairman of the Congressional Immigration Reform Caucus, blamed the Bush administration for setting an immigration enforcement tone that suggests to those enforcing the law that he is not serious about secure borders.
"We need to get the president to come to grips with the seriousness of the problem," he said. "I know he doesn't like to utter the words, 'I was wrong,' but if we have another incident like September 11 by people who came through our borders without permission, I hope he doesn't have to say 'I'm sorry.' "
During the Minuteman vigil, Border Patrol supervisors in Arizona discounted their efforts, saying a drop in apprehensions during their protest was because of the Mexican government's deployment of military and police south of the targeted area and a new federal program known as the Arizona Border Control Initiative that brought manpower increases to the state.
The Naco supervisors blamed the volunteers for unnecessarily tripping sensors, disturbing draglines and interfering with the normal operations of the agents. They said that their impact on illegals was "negligible" and that civilians should leave immigration enforcement "to the professionals."
Several field agents credited the volunteers with cutting the flow of illegal aliens in the targeted Naco area, saying the number of apprehended illegals dropped from an average of 500 a day to less than 15 a day.
More than 850 volunteers, in a protest of the lax immigration enforcement policies of the White House and Congress, sought to reduce the flow of illegal aliens along a popular immigration corridor on the Arizona-Mexico border near Naco by reporting illegals to the Border Patrol as they crossed into the United States.
Their goal was to show that increased manpower on the border would effectively deter illegal immigration. Organizers said the protest resulted in Border Patrol arrests of 349 illegal aliens.
Area residents, in a half-page ad in the Sunday edition of the Sierra Vista Herald, told the volunteers: "Thanks for doing what our government won't -- close the border to illegal aliens. It was the quietest month we've had in many years ... You made us feel safe because the border was closed."

[GAR]

Originally posted by Hardrock69
New US migration laws vex Mexico

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4544699.stm

Mexico's President Vicente Fox and Interior Minister Santiago Creel have said it will harm bilateral relations

".. because Spixicans living abroad illegally send almost one-hundred billion dollars annually back to Wetxico."

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by GAR
".. because Spixicans living abroad illegally send almost one-hundred billion dollars annually back to Wetxico."

What's a matter GAR, did they take your produce picking job racist cunt?

[GAR]

I am an equal-opportunity fornicator, don't never say I'm racist!

HUGG THE RAINBOW~!!

[TEUFEL HUNDEN]

I agree build a wall so damn high that only birds can fly over. Either come to this country legally or we'll hunt you down!!
Oorah!!

[FORD]

Originally posted by TEUFEL HUNDEN
I agree build a wall so damn high that only birds can fly over. Either come to this country legally or we'll hunt you down!!
Oorah!!

But what about the Mexican birds, Adolf?

[Guitar Shark]

Originally posted by FORD
But what about the Mexican birds, Adolf?

African or European swallow?

[TEUFEL HUNDEN]

Originally posted by FORD
But what about the Mexican birds, Adolf?

As a United States Marine currently in the Reserves, first Id say thankyou first to me defending your God given right to your free speech response. Respect mine and Ill respect yours. (Notice I didnt call you some stupid childish name?) If I were to visit your home and enter without your permission or not abide by your rules, what would you do?? Probably kick me out or think of me as an intruder and let me have it. Think with your brain and not your feelings on this one. Cause you sure seem like you are. 38 yrs old and you call me Adolph?? Grow up. Probably never served in the military either.

[FORD]

Your alias doesn't impress me Adolf.

Semper Fuck Off.

[Nickdfresh]

Meathead! He puts the Jar in the JARHEAD!

[DrMaddVibe]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Meathead! He puts the Jar in the JARHEAD!

In the same manner that you put the shit in shithead!


:lol:

[BigBadBrian]

Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
In the same manner that you put the shit in shithead!


:lol:


:D


:gun:

[BigBadBrian]

Originally posted by TEUFEL HUNDEN
As a United States Marine currently in the Reserves, first Id say thankyou first to me defending your God given right to your free speech response. Respect mine and Ill respect yours. (Notice I didnt call you some stupid childish name?) If I were to visit your home and enter without your permission or not abide by your rules, what would you do?? Probably kick me out or think of me as an intruder and let me have it. Think with your brain and not your feelings on this one. Cause you sure seem like you are. 38 yrs old and you call me Adolph?? Grow up. Probably never served in the military either.


He didn't.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
In the same manner that you put the shit in shithead!


:lol:

Well you put the Ass in ASSVIBRATOR;)

[DrMaddVibe]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Well you put the Ass in ASSVIBRATOR;)

???

That doesn't make any sense?

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
???

That doesn't make any sense?

Like you, unable to comprehend the jist of basic articles...

[DLR'sCock]

Under GWB for the last 4 years, over 3 MILLION MEXICANS A YEAR have been illegally immigrating to the US.

There must be at least 20 - 30 million illegals here in the US if not more. I see hundreds and hundreds of them(maybe thousands??) in New Brunswick, NJ alone....

[FORD]

Originally posted by BigBadBrian
He didn't.

And I doubt Adolf did either.

[mwsully]

Ahem, correct me if I'm wrong, but illegal immigrants right now play a huge role in our economic well-being, specifically agriculture and those other jobs that no American-born person would ever want to touch. Illegal immigrants work their asses off. Sure, there may be some that try to work the system, but we have plenty of American-born people here legally that work the system and basically live their lives as a parasite.

Many people here legally for some strange reason feel entitled to certain things that are considered privileges -- that they are above picking strawberries for a living.

Illegal or not, they are definitely an asset to our economy.

[Big Train]

Again , most of America misses the point. Let's do some feel good action like building a huge fence, which will only have a gaping hole in it in a month. Walls and guns, yea, that'll do it.

But let's cloud all this with taking the tough guy "wetback/spic" talking route. It's all about your job at FedEX being protected.

Bottom line is they will come until there is no incentive to come. THAT is the immigration question/argument. Building a wall and not issuing driver's licenses are fine, solid steps, but they do absolutely nothing to remove incetive to come here.

[DLR'sCock]

Kool, then by that basic logic we should just open all borders and let everyone that wants to come in, come on in.


Or, is it only the people that you say are "OK" to come in illegally that are ok....


3 Million a year is the average of illegal entry into the US, so in 10 more years that is 30 million more on top of the 20 or 30 million already here illegally. Of course once you have your anchor baby, you're good to go...



Oh, and jobs that no one supposedly wants? Well, if a company knows that they can get away with paying someone $5/hr for work or less, then there ya go.

Just like a company knows they could pay an H-1B visa worker less than a US citizen. Just like why should a US company pay a US citizen to do a job when they can just ship the job overseas for $2/hr. Programming jobs, help desk, tech support, call centers, etc etc etc...

[Big Train]

Your always such a reactionary dumbass, cock. First off, EVERY FUCKING TIME I post something like that, some numbnut says what you just said. DID I SAY let them all in? Scroll up two inches and show me...

I'm all for controlled and real immigration. Always have been. I just think wasting billions putting up a symbolic wall isn't gonna help your job. Call Centers, Tech Help, is no different than what has happened in factories for the last 30 years.

The jobs are changing and going away because of a global economy. You want it to go back to the Industrial Age, disconnect from the Internet, get a type writer and urge your congressman to produce legislation that says US companies can only hire US workers. Get that passed and I'll be the first to say ok. Never will happen.

We need new industries and dominant positions in them period. Which is harder to do nowadays, not just because of cheap labor, but the non-chalance of attitudes towards intellectual property, the only thing america really DOES anymore.

What I'm saying about Mexico is that leaning on them to get Mexico in order is the only way to stem the tide of immigrants in a meaningful way. Otherwise immigration will just be much more costly and useless than the drug war.

[DLR'sCock]

Originally posted by Big Train
Your always such a reactionary dumbass, cock. First off, EVERY FUCKING TIME I post something like that, some numbnut says what you just said. DID I SAY let them all in? Scroll up two inches and show me...

I'm all for controlled and real immigration. Always have been. I just think wasting billions putting up a symbolic wall isn't gonna help your job. Call Centers, Tech Help, is no different than what has happened in factories for the last 30 years.

The jobs are changing and going away because of a global economy. You want it to go back to the Industrial Age, disconnect from the Internet, get a type writer and urge your congressman to produce legislation that says US companies can only hire US workers. Get that passed and I'll be the first to say ok. Never will happen.

We need new industries and dominant positions in them period. Which is harder to do nowadays, not just because of cheap labor, but the non-chalance of attitudes towards intellectual property, the only thing america really DOES anymore.

What I'm saying about Mexico is that leaning on them to get Mexico in order is the only way to stem the tide of immigrants in a meaningful way. Otherwise immigration will just be much more costly and useless than the drug war.

Dude, I wasn't responding to you. I was responding to mwsully. You must have posted just before I did.


But, anywho greed pushes work out of the hands of capable people to other people more desperate to take the work and get paid less. The middle class has been getting fucked for the last 30 years and it is getting worse. The point being, companies that have been LUCKY ENOUGH and privileged enough to grow and thrive here in the US would rather lay off workers and have slaves if the law allowed. It is the nature of the simple to wish to control all and have all. You grow in a community that allows you to, then you give back. Give and take. Globalization is only great for the upper echelon of society and it will get worse. The shrinking middle class is creating a greater divide of haves and have-nots.

But, I do agree Mexico needs to get their own house in order. It is a must. Although, I am most assured that the haves don't give a shit about the have-nots in Mexico. See the current political situation there. Such is the nature of man and economics and history. Around and around she goes, wash rinse, repeat, wash, rinse, repeat...Greed, greed, me, me, me, me...

Oh, and I have written my Congressmen about the direction our country as been taking for the last 30 years with regards our ahrd working middle class who have given so much of themselves and their lifes blood to create this nation. We're pretty much a plutocracy at this point, and all I know is that I have to adapt to survive.

Again, I repeat, I was not initially responding to you, but to mwsully.

And thanks for the good words Mr. Record Executive dude!

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by DLR'sCock
...But, anywho greed pushes work out of the hands of capable people to other people more desperate to take the work and get paid less. The middle class has been getting fucked...


Then don't you think a more effective action would be to penalize corporations that outsource jobs overseas by chipping away a little at their corporate welfare?

I really don't think too many middle-class Americans work in the Agricultural field...

[Nickdfresh]

! Fuck, double post sorry!

[Hardrock69]

If people wish to immigrate to the United States, that is all well and good.

Let them do so LEGALLY!

Once the Iraq war is over, our troops will need something to occupy their time.

Let them round up ALL THOSE PEOPLE WHO CANNOT PROVE THEY ARE HERE LEGALLY AND SHIP THEM BACK TO WHERE THEY CAME FROM!!!!

If they are here legally (green card, citizenship, etc.) then they should be allowed to stay. Certainly if they are working, paying taxes, and contributing.

If they have nothing proving that they entered the US legally, they must be loaded into boxcars and shipped back across the border.

PERIOD!!!

It is ILLEGAL to come here without going through the proper channels.

GEORGE W. BUSH IS A FUCKING CRIMINAL!!!

Why?

Because he will NOT enforce the immigration laws!

IF he truly believes in the Rule Of Law, and wants to show us that he is a law-abiding LEADER of the United States (theoretically...in reality he is just a stooge puppet), then he MUST order our law enforcement authorities to DO THEIR MOTHERFUCKING JOBS!!!

The Border Patrol MUST DO THEIR FUCKING JOBS!!!
Because right now they are not.

The Bush Administration decided to make this huge song-and-dance routine about how we must prevent terrorists from getting into this country, yet they actually DO NOT WANT TO DO SO!!!!

GODDAMNEABLE HYPOCRITES!!!!!

THEY NEED TO BE TRIED AND CONVICTED OF FUCKING HIGH TREASON!!!
Their very actions show they are only interested in the destruction of the United States OF America!

They are worse than any terrorists on the fucking planet!!!!

[Big Train]

In that case Cock, I apologize. Wife is out blowing my money today, while I stay at home and work on bills...got me a little WOUND Up...

[mwsully]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by DLR'sCock
[B]Dude, I wasn't responding to you. I was responding to mwsully. You must have posted just before I did.


My point is not to open borders. I'm completely pro-controlled immigration, but as BT says how will walls, etc., make any difference?

Go to the source of the problem, not the symptoms:

Corporate Greed.

[kentuckyklira]

Originally posted by TEUFEL HUNDEN
As a United States Marine currently in the Reserves, first Id say thankyou first to me defending your God given right to your free speech response. Respect mine and Ill respect yours. (Notice I didnt call you some stupid childish name?) If I were to visit your home and enter without your permission or not abide by your rules, what would you do?? Probably kick me out or think of me as an intruder and let me have it. Think with your brain and not your feelings on this one. Cause you sure seem like you are. 38 yrs old and you call me Adolph?? Grow up. Probably never served in the military either. Wow, you´re a prime example for the truth behind most of my prejudices concerning the US forces!

[BigBadBrian]

Originally posted by kentuckyklira
Wow, you´re a prime example for the truth behind most of my prejudices concerning the US forces!

Why? Because he asked for a little respect and common courtesy without name-calling? Imagine that. You probably couldn't. You probably don't know what a civil conversation is.

[kentuckyklira]

Originally posted by BigBadBrian
Why? Because he asked for a little respect and common courtesy without name-calling? Imagine that. You probably couldn't. You probably don't know what a civil conversation is. I do when I feel like it!

But why should I respect a guy just for his stupid carreer decision!

[DLR'sCock]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Then don't you think a more effective action would be to penalize corporations that outsource jobs overseas by chipping away a little at their corporate welfare?

I really don't think too many middle-class Americans work in the Agricultural field...

That would be an effective action Nick, by taking away the Corporate Welfare, becuase if you are not giving back to the community by offering at the least modest income earning jobs, then you don't deserve the perks. Hell I say tax them more. How many people spent Billions of dollars going to school for IT and now the vast majority of work is overseas? And yes, most middle class people don't work in agriculture. Although, I do not know what the pay scales are, but I am sure if they were at least modest, maybe more local middle class people would take work. Most people will do any kind of work if it at least pays enough, if they can't find their nitch. There are so many jobs that people won't do because the pay is laughable.

At the same time there are many jobs that are really temporary jobs that illegal Mexicnas end up working. These are jobs that young kids used to do while earning money in college or high school like oh let's say landscaping, labor, working in a restaurant, etc etc. I do not have kids, but I have parents tell me how their kids can't find summer work anymore, or it is very difficult.

[DLR'sCock]

No prob BT.

[Figs]

-----------------------------------------------------
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050515/ts_nm/mexico_usa_dc_3
-----------------------------------------------------

MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican President Vicente Fox's office said on Saturday his comments were misinterpreted as racist when he said that Mexican migrants do jobs in the United States "that not even blacks want to do."

In a Friday speech, Fox had criticized the latest anti-immigration measures in the United States and defended the role of undocumented Mexican workers north of the border.

"There is no doubt that Mexicans, filled with dignity, willingness and ability to work are doing jobs that not even blacks want to do there in the United States," he told a group of Texas business people meeting in Mexico.

The comment was published and broadcast by local and international media, and Fox said in a statement from his office that he regretted that some had interpreted his words as racist.

"President Vicente Fox expresses his enormous respect for minorities whatever their racial, ethnic and religious origin and that is why he regrets and disagrees with interpretations that yesterday's comments were racist," his office said.

"Their purpose was none other than to make clear the importance that Mexican workers have in the development and progress of U.S. society," the statement said.

Mexico has been seeking an accord with Washington for years to make it easier for millions of illegal Mexican immigrants to live and work in the United States.

Hopes were raised early last year when President Bush proposed a temporary worker program but it has become bogged down in Congress.

A key partner in U.S. border security, Mexico said it plans to formally protest new U.S. controls on foreign-born people expected, including tougher rules to obtain drivers' licenses and plans to extend a fence on the border between California and Mexico to stop illegal immigrants.

[BigBadBrian]

Originally posted by DLR'sCock
How many people spent Billions of dollars going to school for IT and now the vast majority of work is overseas?

The vast majority of IT work done by US companies is not outsourced. Move if you cannot find work you are trained for. :gulp:

[Big Train]

Figs,

I'm glad you posted that article as it shows a large part of the problem. Fox's only thought to better his economy is to send millions of mexican men away from their families to work in another country and possibly migrate there permanently. INCREDIBLE shortsightedness on his part, which shows he has no intention of fixing his countries problems. The real problem is the US has been allowing this although I feel the tide turning.

It is my sincere hope that people will forget or at least minimize the race aspect of this. The entire fucking problem is economic and it is stupid to put focus on any other thing than money. All these things that I feel bubbling with these "minutemen" numbnuts (national pride, racial bias), have nothing to do with the real issue and the one nobody wants to talk about: $$$...

[Nitro Express]

The reality is if we deported illegal alliens, the food supply in the US would shut down because agriculture couldn't run. Construction would come to a halt, hotels couldn't get the rooms cleaned.

What has happened is these jobs use to be done by Americans but our increased prosperity or the illusion of it has made grant money or loans available for the Americans to go to school.

It used to be you were stuck being a farm worker or maid. Maybe you worked those kind of jobs while working yourself through college. I worked construction jobs to help pay for my tutition when I was getting a bachelors degree.

Now college is so expensive, people no longer can work themselves through it. They can get loans and camp out in school. The Americans who used to do the work the Mexicans now do, are partying their asses off in college, making homemade porn, cooking meth, and oh yeah, going to school and graduating (if they do) with huge amounts of debt. The ones who get jobs usually get govt. jobs and they become part of the problem.

[Nitro Express]

My home town is a college town. It used to be the college obviousely was a large part of the local economy but people also worked for the railroad, financial institutions, were medical proffessionals, manufacturing, or ran their own business. There was a solid middle class based on mid management.

Now the university is the biggest employer. All of the manufacturing including high tech has been outsourced. The university is bigger than ever and the amount of money spent on it is bigger than ever. It's awash in grant money and people are building large homes that work at it. The city atmosphere is now anti-small business and while the university and big retailers like Wal-Mart get tax breaks and subsidies from the city, the small business owner pays more and more taxes.

Everyone is going to college and running up huge debt to do so. For some it will pay off but we are also graduating a glut of political science and social service majors who will do nothing to decrease our trade deficit.

I'm all for education but much of what I see in education now is smoke and mirrors. It's people lying to themselves or trying to leach off the govt. while real entreprenueranism seems to be vanishing.

[TEUFEL HUNDEN]

Originally posted by BigBadBrian
Why? Because he asked for a little respect and common courtesy without name-calling? Imagine that. You probably couldn't. You probably don't know what a civil conversation is.

Thankyou.