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View Full Version : Gas prices go down to $0.70 a gallon



Steve Savicki
06-25-2005, 10:05 PM
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_mike.html

Okay, well maybe not gas, but fuel nevertheless. By going biodiesel, you will:

- increase national decurity by lowering our dependence on foreign and domestic oil

- support American agriculture instead of some terrorist, and our own corruptible oil-marinated politicians

- reduce major greenhouse gases:
- CO2 cut by 70%
- unburned hydrocarbons (HC's) by 50%
- particulate matter (PM's) by 90% (which contribute to "brown cloud" & asthma problems)
- Zero sulfur so no SO2 acid rain- however, oxides of nitrogen (NOX) emissions typically increase by a mere 2%, but that's well worth the trade-off in other emissions!

- have performance cleaner than dino-diesel, gasoline, LPG, or CNG. Only slow, limited range all-electric vehicles and too-expensive hydrogen performs better.

- have increased engine life due to it's far superior lubricity over finite petroleum-based fuels. Just 1% blended with regular diesel increases lubricity by 65%.

- have 100% domestically grown fuel- which in turn creates American jobs.

- have fuel that has, unlike petroleum, a biodegradable level of sugar, and less toxic than table salt. But beware hunger pangs, because the nearly smokeless exhaust smells yummy like french fries.

- have fuel that has a "closed carbon cycle" or "carbon neutral", meaning what little emissions are produced are readily consumed by the next generation of crops. In fact, during their growth cycle, soybean plants absorb between 4 to 6 times the CO2 created by burning biodiesel fuel. Yes, it actually reverses greenhouse-gas buildup thus mitigating global-warming every mile you drive!

- have fuel that is completely interchangeable with standard #2 diesel, so it can be mixed right in the tank to any proportion. Absolutely no expensive engine conversion/modification is necessary to make it run. Any stock diesel can burn it today.

- have the only alternative fuel to have passed both Tier 1 and 2 requirements of the EPA. It's also endorsed by the Department of Energy for military and commercial diesel fleets.

- support your local economy and creat jobs because it can be produced locally on any scale.

- support USA farmers and agribusiness instead of oil sheiks, terrorists, and wealthy fossil-fuel promoting politicians.



Why didn't Bush wake up and see this instead of wanting to go straight to Alaska?

freak
06-25-2005, 11:30 PM
We're looking into BioDiesel now for fleet vehicles.

It's no longer a question of if, but when.

freak
06-25-2005, 11:35 PM
Originally posted by Steve Savicki
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_mike.html

Why didn't Bush wake up and see this instead of wanting to go straight to Alaska?

People have been pushing it for years. The administration in charge has nothing to do with it. As long as the oil companies dig in their heels, it won't get anywhere - At least on a large scale.

That said, there *ARE* places where you can get the stuff now.

We just talked to a company that will deliver a tanker right to your door and give you what you want. Means nothing to the average Joe, but its' a start.

DLR'sCock
06-25-2005, 11:59 PM
Biodiesel is the way to go.....damn they have cars that run on hemp and even water...

Steve Savicki
06-26-2005, 12:07 AM
Cock, do you have a link to some of these cars?

Unchainme
06-26-2005, 12:12 AM
I read about this in Popular Mechanics they said this could happen at least with in the next 25 years. I would love to see this happen I mean you kill three birds with one stone, You solve the oil problem, the average American Farmer makes more money, and are energy supply is safe from terriosts because its not in there back yard. Unfortunately I can imagine one of the big oil companies trying to block this. We really should try to phase this in. One question would this Work on Commercial Airliners, and Rockets for the space program?

FORD
06-26-2005, 12:30 AM
Not only should the oil companies be prevented from blocking this, they MUST be prevented from owning the industry which does emerge.

I have NO sympathy for Exxon, Chevron, Shell, or BP and will happily dance on their corporate graves. Those companies have harmed this planet with war and greed long enough, and deserve to go under.

Biodiesel is viable now with existing technology. The only shortage is the fuel itself. Dropping the archaic laws against industrialized hemp would be a great help in this, though biodiesel can be made from used vegetable oil (which is why exhaust from BD vehicles often smells like french fries- french fries were probably cooked in the very same oil previously. So where ever there's a fast food joint with a deep fryer, there's a source of biodiesel.

Pretty cool huh?

Steve Savicki
06-26-2005, 08:54 AM
Hopefully this biodiesel solution will cause conservatives to see some light.

twonabomber
06-26-2005, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by FORD
So where ever there's a fast food joint with a deep fryer, there's a source of biodiesel.

Pretty cool huh?

yeah, but they don't always throw out a big quantity of oil. a lot of it is cleaned/filtered and recycled back into the fryers.

Nickdfresh
06-26-2005, 11:30 AM
I believe this is part of the reason why New York State has repealed the ban on diesel powered passenger cars like the Volkswagon TDI. Of course this ban was a joke anyway since the TDI's (Jetta, Passant, & Golf) emissions are far below that a tracker trailer.

Big Train
06-26-2005, 01:02 PM
Originally posted by Steve Savicki
Hopefully this biodiesel solution will cause conservatives to see some light.

As a conservative, it is always about $$ for me (If I hear my detractors correctly). The energy problem has intrigued me for a long time and it represents a huge opportunity, to big to ignore, oil companies or not.

I have heard conflicting reports about bio stuff though, although I have not had enough time (too busy surviving in my own business politicians don't care about) to really put effort into it. The knock I have heard on bio products, corn based in particular, is that the supply is tough to produce (conversion process) and susecptible to a whole host of other ills which would spike prices (i.e. dust bowls, crop failures etcc..). The demand for energy is constantly going up so whatever the solution becomes will have to have excess capacity for increased demand over time. Are you confident biodiesel can handle it?

kentuckyklira
06-26-2005, 01:36 PM
Biodiesel is available most everywhere in Germany.

That΄s one of the good things you get from having the Green Party being a part of the government!

FORD
06-26-2005, 01:44 PM
Originally posted by twonabomber
yeah, but they don't always throw out a big quantity of oil. a lot of it is cleaned/filtered and recycled back into the fryers.

It's true that fast food places do filter oil and re-use it, but that can only be done so many times, as the grease (like any oil) gets darker every time it's heated. That can't be filtered out, as it's a chemical change.

When I worked at Skippers back in the mid 80's, we would start a new block of grease in the first fryer, filter the fryers every night, cycling the grease into the next one, and on the 5th day, after going through all the fryers, the grease was pumped out into a tank outside.

If you use grease much longer than that, the color of your food will look like shit, and probably won't sell very well. Not to mention the local health department probably won't be too happy.

Nickdfresh
06-26-2005, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by FORD
It's true that fast food places do filter oil and re-use it, but that can only be done so many times, as the grease (like any oil) gets darker every time it's heated. That can't be filtered out, as it's a chemical change.

When I worked at Skippers back in the mid 80's, we would start a new block of grease in the first fryer, filter the fryers every night, cycling the grease into the next one, and on the 5th day, after going through all the fryers, the grease was pumped out into a tank outside.

If you use grease much longer than that, the color of your food will look like shit, and probably won't sell very well. Not to mention the local health department probably won't be too happy.

I've heard McDonalds reuses their grease more so than others. And that's why, as much as I hate Mickey-D's, their fries are so damn good.

FORD
06-26-2005, 06:27 PM
French fries always get the new oil, because they can be light in color. I've never worked at Mickey D's but I'm guessing they have one fryer for the french fries (and maybe apple pies) and another for the chicken mc nuggets, which use the older grease.

Nickdfresh
06-27-2005, 07:28 AM
June 26, 2005

To Replace Oil, U.S. Experts See Amber Waves of Plastic
American crops could be used in place of many products' petroleum base, some scientists say.

By Stephanie Simon, Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/la-na-grain26jun26,1,6073251.story?page=2&track=mostemailedlink) Staff Writer

BLAIR, Neb. — He operates 90,000 feet of hissing pipes and dozens of enormous churning vats — an industrial jungle with a single, remarkable purpose: "Essentially," plant manager Bill Suehr says, "we've got corn coming in at one end and plastic coming out the other."

In a hot, noisy factory that smells of Frosted Flakes, yeast and wet farm animals, agribusiness giant Cargill Inc. has set out to lead a new industrial revolution — one fed by the green fields of the Midwest rather than the oil fields of the Middle East.

Sprawled across a square mile of prairie, a series of automated assembly lines turns raw corn kernels first into sugary syrup and then into white pellets that can be spun into silky fabric or molded into clear, tough plastic.

The end products — which include T-shirts, forks and coffins — look, feel and perform like traditional polyester and plastic made from a petroleum base. But the manufacturing process consumes 50% less fossil fuel, even after accounting for the fuel needed to plant and harvest the corn.

With oil prices near $60 a barrel, goods made from grain also compare favorably on price. So chemists and engineers are racing to figure out how to substitute Iowa's bounty for Iraq's. The goal: to use crops, weeds and even animal waste in place of the petroleum that fuels much of American manufacturing.

The Energy Department is so enthusiastic that it is aiming to convert 25% of chemical manufacturing to an agricultural base by 2030.

Cargill is the first to commercialize the technology, producing 300,000 pounds of pellets a day — but its rivals are not far behind.

DuPont Co., which invented polyester and nylon, has its own corn-based fabric in the works.

An Arkansas firm called BioBased Technologies just opened a factory that uses soy instead of petroleum to make polyurethane for use in seat cushions, shoe soles and spray-foam insulation.

The clothing firm Of the Earth, based in Oregon, sells T-shirts and yoga pants made from soy fiber.

University professors across the Midwest are turning their labs into miniature bio-factories, transforming soybean oil into mattresses and chicken feathers into golf tees — even, if all goes well, corn into cellphones. One professor sponsors an annual soybean technology contest; past winners have turned beans into ski wax, candles and nail polish remover.

"Anything you can make out of petroleum, I can make out of corn and soybeans," said Larry Johnson, director of the Center for Crops Utilization Research at Iowa State University.

Skeptics question the economic viability of such projects.

When Cargill launched its factory in 2002, its pellets were far more expensive than equivalent material made from oil. Wild Oats Markets, an early customer, paid 50% more for takeout containers made from the bio-plastic.

But over the last two years, the Cargill plant has gotten more efficient — and oil prices have soared.

The result: The "corn-tainers" in the deli now cost Wild Oats 5% less than traditional plastic, Wild Oats spokeswoman Sonja Tuitele said.

Other products made with the corn-based pellets are pricier. Depending on how they process the material, some manufacturers report that using Cargill's pellets raises their costs by as much as 25%. But a growing number in the United States and abroad is willing to pay that premium for a product perceived as environmentally friendly.

As Kathleen Bader, chief executive of Cargill's subsidiary NatureWorks, tells her customers: "We're using material that's renewable in 90 days instead of 90 million years."

Converted into a biodegradable plastic, the pellets are molded into water bottles, portable CD players, auto parts and even coffins (sold in the Netherlands). The plastic is also used as packaging for Del Monte fresh-cut fruit and Newman's Own organic salads.

Other companies are processing the pellets into fibers that can be used for T-shirts, carpets and super-soft diaper wipes.

The Pacific Coast Feather Co. has rolled out a line of linens made from the corn pellets. Faribault Mills is marketing a $100 wool-and-corn blanket that CEO Michael Harris calls luxuriously soft. (One drawback: If you leave it in a hot dryer too long, it has a tendency to melt.)

"We care about the environment," Harris said, "and we just thought: Wow, wouldn't this be cool, if we could replace our petroleum-based acrylics with corn."

The technology that turns corn into blankets — and so many other consumer goods — is actually decades old.

In the 1920s and '30s, Henry Ford experimented with using crops, mostly soy, to make auto parts.

But petroleum proved easier to convert into plastics; at the time, it also seemed a much more modern, forward-looking material. Plus, it was cheap. As late as 1970, oil cost about $3 a barrel — not much more than a bushel of corn.

These days, corn still costs about $2 a bushel. It makes a good substitute for $60-a-barrel oil because, like petroleum, it contains carbon, the essential building block for plastic.

In theory, any carbon source would work in these new factories. Engineers say they'd like to replace corn one day with a crop that requires less fertilizer and pesticide, such as wild grass. They may even be able to use agricultural waste, such as the cornstalks left in the field after harvesting. For now, though, raw kernels are the easiest to process.

Even if it takes off, biomanufacturing will never wean the nation entirely from oil.

Roughly 7% to 10% of the fossil fuel consumed in the U.S. is used to manufacture plastics and fibers, according to the Department of Energy. If corn replaced petroleum in every factory, the nation would cut oil consumption by hundreds of millions of barrels a year — but would still require billions more for heat, power and fuel.

Given that limitation, some critics view all the hoopla as an agribusiness con, more about selling corn than saving the Earth.

"The main motivation is there is only so much high-fructose corn syrup you can pack into sodas," said Tillman Gerngross, an associate professor of engineering at Dartmouth College who specializes in biotechnology. "This is another way to turn corn into products people will buy."

But other scientists maintain that the new technology offers genuine environmental benefits, beyond the reduction in fossil-fuel use.

In particular, they point to the huge problem of "e-waste," the 2.2-million tons of cellphones, computers and other electronics dumped in landfills each year. If those products were made of bio-plastic, they could be composted. In the right conditions — warm and humid — they would degrade within months, dissolving into carbon dioxide and water.

At Purdue University, Bernie Tao, a professor of agricultural and biological engineering, believes so passionately in the future of turning crops into consumer goods that he has developed a science kit for children that uses corn and soy to make crystals, crayons and adhesives.

"We need to teach our young students that chemistry is nothing to be scared of," he said. "It's all about the stuff growing outside their windows."

Nickdfresh
06-27-2005, 07:31 AM
Oil hits another record, above $60
Undeterred by high fuel costs, strong U.S. demand drives crude to fresh highs.
June 27, 2005: 6:02 AM EDT

SINGAPORE (Reuters) - Oil prices jumped 1 percent to a fresh record above $60 a barrel Monday as robust U.S. demand, apparently unimpeded by high fuel costs, strained global production and refining capacity.

Light sweet crude for August delivery rose to $60.49 a barrel, up 55 cents in electronic trading, extending a rally that has added 12 percent to prices in two weeks and 39 percent since January.

U.S. crude contracts are trading above $60 for every month until August 2006 with December 2005 hitting a peak $61.90 a barrel. London Brent crude gained 81 cents to $59.17 a barrel, also a record.

"It really has been a momentum-driven push to $60 over the past week. We've seen the funds really pile in hard in an effort to push it over (that level)," said Daniel Hynes, resource analyst at ANZ Institutional Banking.

Prices have risen as investors bet refiners and producers will struggle to meet winter demand in the fourth quarter.

While high prices are eroding some strength from the world economy, the overall growth picture remains solid, central bankers meeting in Switzerland said at the weekend.

This has encouraged speculators to keep testing consumers' ability to absorb higher costs, with some analysts saying only a significant pull-back in demand from an economic slowdown will tame prices.

"The market is testing higher to see what price levels this demand can endure," said Naohiro Niimura, vice president at the derivative products division of Mizuho Corporate Bank.

Central bankers, meeting in Basel, said expectations were for oil prices to remain high for some time to come.

"There was a general consensus that we will have high oil prices for at least the next two or three years," said Martin Redrado, Argentina's central bank governor.

Victory in Iran's presidential election for ultra-conservative Mahmoud Ahmadinejad also helped support prices.

Ahmadinejad said he would flush out corruption from the country's oil sector and favor domestic investors, although analysts do not expect a big shift in production policy.

Held back by U.S. sanctions, OPEC member Iran has struggled to lift output capacity in the world's fourth biggest producer.

The president-elect also said his nation would press ahead with its controversial nuclear program, which the United States sees as part of an effort to build atomic weapons.

Dealers were undeterred by OPEC's largely symbolic output hike earlier this month and now producers are consulting on another increase, cartel president Sheikh Ahmad al-Fahd al-Sabah said Saturday.

But another increase of 500,000 barrels per day is unlikely to make much difference. Traders say it is a shortage of refining capacity, not crude, that is driving prices higher. And Saudi Arabia, the only OPEC producer with any spare capacity, says it is already meeting customer demand for crude.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/06/27/markets/oil.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes