PDA

View Full Version : St Ken of Enron leads Bush’s new Christianity



Seshmeister
07-17-2006, 10:35 PM
St Ken of Enron leads Bush’s new Christianity
Andrew Sullivan

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,176-2271801,00.html

And so it was that at last week’s funeral for Kenneth Lay, a man who presided over one of the greatest con jobs in the history of American capitalism, the congregation was treated to a eulogy.
When someone dies, you might expect some deference to the deceased. You certainly don’t expect a piling on. And, out of respect, the thousands whose pensions were destroyed by Lay’s malfeasance did not protest.



But what few expected was that Lay would be described not just as a flawed but loved family man, but as the emblem of Christian sacrifice — an icon of fundamentalist victimology, almost a saint. In fact, the minister who gave the sermon compared Lay to Martin Luther King and, yes, Jesus Christ.

In the pews were a former president, George Bush, former first lady, Barbara Bush, and the Bush famiglia dignitaries, James Baker and Robert Mosbacher. And then the coup de grace: the white-collar convicted criminal was compared to an innocent black man, James Byrd, brutally lynched in Texas not so long ago, tied to the back of a truck and dragged through dirt roads until his body split in two.

“Ken Lay was neither black nor poor, as James Byrd was, but I’m angry because Ken was the victim of a lynching,” the minister said to huge and hearty applause.

Welcome to the strange new world of conservative evangelical Christianity, where government torture is no big deal, Lay is a martyr, and the death penalty is God’s will. In this version of Christianity what matters is not so much what you do — but what’s in your heart. And if you have committed to Jesus Christ and attend the right church, a little corporate larceny is no big whoop.

And so a president who has abandoned the Geneva conventions and signed more death warrants than any other American alive is regarded by many as sincere in his desire to do good, to help others, and to bring healing to the world. In this George W Bush is like Lay — a man who, while bilking share owners and employees out of their livelihoods, was, by all accounts, personally generous, charitable and devout. A true Christian. A giver. Of other people’s money.

That’s as good a description of Bush’s domestic policy as any. One of the great mistakes about Bush is to conflate his foreign policy conservatism with his domestic record. At home, there is barely any social programme he doesn’t want to spend money on. He makes Gordon Brown look like Margaret Thatcher. His liberal spending record beats any president, Democrat or Republican, since FDR.

While federal tax revenue, announced last week, now accounts for 18.3% of gross domestic product (GDP), slightly higher than the average 18.1% for the past 50 years, federal spending has been more than increasing to match. In fact, if spending had stayed at late-Clinton levels as a proportion of GDP, there would be almost no deficit at all right now.

This is no accident, no fit of absent-mindedness. The philosophy behind the record was baldly stated by the president three years ago: “We have a responsibility that when somebody hurts, government has got to move.” Or as Andy Card, the former chief of staff, once put it: “This president sees America as we think about a 10-year-old child.”

For Bush government is the great healer of private wounds, the salve for anyone’s pain. Unlike Clinton, who merely felt the pain, downsized government and balanced the budget, Bush is best described as an evangelical leftist. In fact, Bush has increased domestic spending at twice the rate of his predecessor. And last year, despite an election pledge to rein in spending, Bush increased it by another 9% in one year alone — the largest annual increase since 1990.

As the conservative Heritage Foundation has pointed out, homeland security and warfare account for only a third of this increase. The vast bulk is on social programmes and entitlements — for pensions and healthcare and any number of other schemes to help the poor or vulnerable. Federal education spending has gone up 137% in five years; health research and education has soared by 78%.

More interestingly, anti-poverty spending, during a period of rapid economic growth, is now more than 3% of GDP for the first time in history. Spending on healthcare for the poor — Medicaid — has risen by more than 50%. Bono is right about Bush: he wants government to help people. And he’s spending more government money on the disadvantaged than any Democrat in history.

And this is not counting the future. By far the biggest increase in spending was the president’s endorsement of a budget-busting programme to provide state-of-the-art prescription drugs for the elderly. The costs will soon spiral as 77m baby boomers retire and tap into Bush’s Christian largesse.

One number captures the extent of Bush’s “compassion”. When he took office, according to the non-partisan Government Accountability Office, the total unfunded future liabilities of the US government amounted to $20.4 trillion. In four years the Bush Republicans increased that to $43.3 trillion. Almost all of it is on healthcare for the elderly. That debt hangs over the American and world economy like an axe suspended by a thread.

Some of this can be attributed to Bush’s famous lack of interest in fiscal affairs — he hasn’t vetoed a single spending bill in his term of office. Some can be attributed to political pressure — the push for more drugs for the elderly was intense. But much is also a key part of what Bush conservatism is about: using big government and massive spending to prove one’s Christian credentials.

The European left don’t want to concede this: it would muddle their angry, cartoonish picture of American conservatism. But Bush’s domestic charity is integral to his redefinition of American conservatism into Christian socialism. He wants to spread freedom abroad while bestowing endless charity at home.

It’s a grand and stirring Fabian vision — more ambitious than any Democrat has dared argue for. It’s just a pity that the younger generation will be forced to pay for all of it — with interest.

FORD
07-17-2006, 10:42 PM
Good to see that Bareback Andy finally woke up. I seem to remember him beeing happy with the BCE when this Iraq nightmare began in 2003.

ELVIS
07-17-2006, 11:50 PM
I suppose God took Lay to Heaven to oversee Heavenly pension plans...:rolleyes:

FORD
07-18-2006, 12:22 AM
Originally posted by ELVIS
I suppose God took Lay to Heaven to oversee Heavenly pension plans...:rolleyes:

God didn't take Ken Lay to Heaven, period, nor will He ever.

I doubt the bastard's dead, actually. But if he is, he's now trying to triple Satan's monthly heating bills.

Cathedral
07-18-2006, 01:10 AM
Originally posted by FORD
I seem to remember him beeing happy with the BCE when this Iraq nightmare began in 2003.

There were several of us in this country that had that flu.

Though i still support the war in Iraq, it is apparently for very different reasons than why we went there.

However, the big difference is that my reasons are legit but, wouldn't have had the support of our allie's.

It is very clear to me why the damned WMD excuse was bolstered so much.
Rumsfeld, what a tool, he even said recently that he never said we knew exactly where the weapons are.

It was a great Geraldo moment when they weren't there...but with disasterous results.

let's just call him Geraldo Rumsfeld, it fits.

BigBadBrian
07-18-2006, 01:05 PM
Originally posted by FORD
God didn't take Ken Lay to Heaven, period, nor will He ever.



Why not? For one who professes to know of the Christian faith: What are the requirements to getting into heaven?

Do you actually know? Your statement above leaves me wondering.

ELVIS
07-18-2006, 01:46 PM
Let's see...

He never got to defend himself in a court of Law, and he had plenty of time to repent and ask for forgiveness...

Guitar Shark
07-18-2006, 01:54 PM
So you can steal and swindle thousands of people out of their money and rape the American energy buying population in the process, and all is forgiven if you repent and ask for forgiveness?

What a great religion... sign me up!

Nickdfresh
07-18-2006, 02:00 PM
And of course Gandhi is burning in hell, because he didn't go to Elvis' church.:D

Guitar Shark
07-18-2006, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by ELVIS
Let's see...

He never got to defend himself in a court of Law

You are also mistaken about this E... Lay was tried and convicted. In fact, he testified in his own defense at the trial.

He was awaiting his sentencing hearing at the time he died, maybe that's where you're confused.

ELVIS
07-18-2006, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
and all is forgiven if you repent and ask for forgiveness?

That's exaxtly correct, although true repentance is a motherfucker...;)

Jesus came, and died, and rose again to wipe the slate clean.

What a great religion... sign me up!

Lord Jesus, I need you. Thank You for dying on the cross for my sins. I open the door of my life and receive You as my Savior and Lord. Thank You for forgiving my sins and giving me eternal life. Take control of the throne of my life. Make me the kind of person You want me to be.




:elvis:

ELVIS
07-18-2006, 02:07 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
You are also mistaken about this E... Lay was tried and convicted. In fact, he testified in his own defense at the trial.

He was awaiting his sentencing hearing at the time he died, maybe that's where you're confused.

I stand corrected, sorry...

ELVIS
07-18-2006, 02:07 PM
He still had time to repent...

Where there's breath there's hope...

LoungeMachine
07-18-2006, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
So you can steal and swindle thousands of people out of their money and rape the American energy buying population in the process, and all is forgiven if you repent and ask for forgiveness?

What a great religion... sign me up!


Yep.

The Christian "Get out of Hell Free" card :rolleyes:


What bullshit.



And according to WarBOT, Brie, et al......Gandhi is in hell.

He never took Christ as his personal Saviour:rolleyes:

FORD
07-18-2006, 04:13 PM
Ghandi was actually known for saying I really like your Christ. I just can't say the same about some of your "Christians".

One of the pastors at my old right wing Reagan (not Jesus) worshipping Baptist church said at least one thing which actually stayed with me over the last 23 or so years since I left that place.

You might be the only "Bible" that someone ever reads

The concept made so much sense that it drove me out of that very church a short time later due to their hypocrisy.

Maybe some self-professing "Christians" need to consider that reality?

WACF
07-18-2006, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by LoungeMachine
Yep.

The Christian "Get out of Hell Free" card :rolleyes:


What bullshit.



Nothing is free.

You must actually be sorry...and repent...any asshole can just say sorry.

Cathedral
07-18-2006, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by LoungeMachine
Yep.

The Christian "Get out of Hell Free" card :rolleyes:


What bullshit.



And according to WarBOT, Brie, et al......Gandhi is in hell.

He never took Christ as his personal Saviour:rolleyes:

The problem is, nobody knows if that card actually works.
The thief to the left of Jesus on the the cross never lived for God.
I often wondered how that actually turned out.

The idea that you can live a life of sin to get to a point where you know you are going to die and THEN you decide to let Christ in?

I dunno about all that...but i guess it all depends on if your heart is true in the request.
But in all reality, or desperation, fear can be pretty convincing.

If i died right now i'd be hell bound for sure.

FORD
07-18-2006, 10:46 PM
Originally posted by Cathedral
The problem is, nobody knows if that card actually works.
The thief to the left of Jesus on the the cross never lived for God.
I often wondered how that actually turned out.



Bit of a unique situation there. Not many of us get the opportunity to stare down the Son of God while we're still on this side of the Pearly Gates.

This guy KNEW he was talking to God, so his repentance was sincere.

Was Ken Lay's?

I doubt it. As I said, I'm not convinced yet that his death was even real.


Not saying that you can't do a deathbed confession, but rather that you can't go through life ripping off your own employees and the entire West Coast like Lay did and think it's all gonna be cool with the Man.

Because if the bastard DID die, then it happenned in his sleep. And he didn't have much time for confession or repentance.....

Seshmeister
07-19-2006, 12:35 AM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
And of course Gandhi is burning in hell, because he didn't go to Elvis' church.:D

I'm always one to be stirring it but Ghandi was a real racist guy. Not a fan of black people at all. Google 'Ghandi Racist' and check it out. Maybe under the christian superstition that would make him have to go to hell?

Cheers!

:gulp:

Seshmeister
07-19-2006, 12:44 AM
Originally posted by Cathedral
The problem is, nobody knows if that card actually works.
The thief to the left of Jesus on the the cross never lived for God.
I often wondered how that actually turned out.

The idea that you can live a life of sin to get to a point where you know you are going to die and THEN you decide to let Christ in?

I dunno about all that...but i guess it all depends on if your heart is true in the request.
But in all reality, or desperation, fear can be pretty convincing.

If i died right now i'd be hell bound for sure.

You just summarised problem #7982a of the belief system.

Someone spends their whole life working for nothing as an aid worker tirelessly trying to help people in abject poverty but has serious doubts about the existance of the christian god. He dies and is tortured forever.

Pedophile who kills a dozen 5 year old children after raping them and abuses dozens of others over a 50 year period has a moment of genuine serenity and prays for forgiveness 5 minutes before he dies. An eternal joyous afterlife in heaven.

What a great belief system...

Cathedral
07-19-2006, 12:49 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Bit of a unique situation there. Not many of us get the opportunity to stare down the Son of God while we're still on this side of the Pearly Gates.

This guy KNEW he was talking to God, so his repentance was sincere.

Was Ken Lay's?

I doubt it. As I said, I'm not convinced yet that his death was even real.


Not saying that you can't do a deathbed confession, but rather that you can't go through life ripping off your own employees and the entire West Coast like Lay did and think it's all gonna be cool with the Man.

Because if the bastard DID die, then it happenned in his sleep. And he didn't have much time for confession or repentance.....

I doubt Lay confessed to anything before going, which is unfortunate for him.
But the thought of having to give back a shit load of money was probably too much for the old ticker.

Cathedral
07-19-2006, 12:54 AM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
You just summarised problem #7982a of the belief system.

Someone spends their whole life working for nothing as an aid worker tirelessly trying to help people in abject poverty but has serious doubts about the existance of the christian god. He dies and is tortured forever.

Pedophile who kills a dozen 5 year old children after raping them and abuses dozens of others over a 50 year period has a moment of genuine serenity and prays for forgiveness 5 minutes before he dies. An eternal joyous afterlife in heaven.

What a great belief system...

I don't think it is that cut and dry, but it is a valid point just the same.
We, the living, can only percieve it from our perspective.
but the fact is, nobody knows except the deceased what they were actually in for in the afterlife.

I've been pondering this very situation for personal reasons lately, and i am going nuts knowing i won't find that answer in this life.

I, am totally and completely confused.

Seshmeister
07-19-2006, 09:48 AM
"After the service the minister delighted the congregation of multimillionaires by repeatedly threading a camel from a local petting zoo through the eye of a needle."

Nickdfresh
07-19-2006, 10:34 AM
:D

Nickdfresh
07-19-2006, 10:43 AM
Originally posted by Seshmeister
I'm always one to be stirring it but Ghandi was a real racist guy. Not a fan of black people at all. Google 'Ghandi Racist' and check it out. Maybe under the christian superstition that would make him have to go to hell?

Cheers!

:gulp:

Well, I've read a little, and Gandhi may well have had some racist attitudes earlier in his life while living in South Africa. Then again, there seemed to be a generous portion of quoting him out of context in his early writings...

The word "Kaffir," the South African equivalent of "******" was like it's American counterpart, once a term not considered to be racist, but merely a description of African slaves; it's negative connotation came later in it's association to oppressive racial subservience and hatred...

Cathedral
07-19-2006, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Well, I've read a little, and Gandhi may well have had some racist attitudes earlier in his life while living in South Africa. Then again, there seemed to be a generous portion of quoting him out of context in his early writings...

The word "Kaffir," the South African equivalent of "******" was like it's American counterpart, once a term not considered to be racist, but merely a description of African slaves; it's negative connotation came later in it's association to oppressive racial subservience and hatred...

Nice Post, Nick!

Social culture changes and so do the meanings of many words and symbols.

For example, The Confederate Flag...
At one point in our culture it represented the Rebel, now, people like me who wear it on a shirt or on a hat are seen as people who support a return to slavery.

You should see the looks i get when i wear my Rebel Racing lid, lol.
On one side it's a checkerd flag, on the other a Confederate Flag.

Nickdfresh
07-19-2006, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by Cathedral
Nice Post, Nick!

Social culture changes and so do the meanings of many words and symbols.

For example, The Confederate Flag...
At one point in our culture it represented the Rebel, now, people like me who wear it on a shirt or on a hat are seen as people who support a return to slavery.

You should see the looks i get when i wear my Rebel Racing lid, lol.
On one side it's a checkerd flag, on the other a Confederate Flag.

You should watch that "Pen & Teller: Bullshit!" on the whole 'reparations for slavery' nonsense...

It's great!

Cathedral
07-19-2006, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
You should watch that "Pen & Teller: Bullshit!" on the whole 'reparations for slavery' nonsense...

It's great!

I've never been a big fan of those guys, but i'll check into that.
I could use a good laugh anyway.

FORD
07-20-2006, 02:51 AM
"American Jesus"

I don't need to be a global citizen
because i'm blessed by nationality
I'm member of a growing populace
we enforce our popularity
there are things that
seem to pull us under
and there are things
that drag us down
but there's a power
and a vital presence
thats lurking all around

we've got the american Jesus
see him on the interstate
we've got the american Jesus
he helped build the
president's estate

I feel sorry
for the earth's population
'cuz so few
live in the U.S.A.
at least the foreigners
can copy our morality
they can visit but they cannot stay
only precious few
can garner the prosperity
it makes us walk
with renewed confidence
we've got a place to go when we die
and the architect resides right here

we've got the american Jesus
overwhelming millions every day
(exercising his authority)

he's the farmers barren fields
the force the army wields
the expession in the faces
of the starving children
the power of the man
he's the fuel that drives the klan
he's the motive and conscience
of the murderer
he's the preacher on t.v.
the false sincerity
the form letter that's written
by the big computers
he's the nuclear bombs
and the kids with no moms
and i'm fearful that
he's inside me

FORD
07-20-2006, 03:55 AM
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/svLSSXj13uw"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/svLSSXj13uw" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>