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DrMaddVibe
08-02-2006, 07:27 AM
Congressman Discussed Killings Involving Serviceman's Squad in Haditha, Iraq

By Josh White
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, August 2, 2006; Page A05

A Marine Corps staff sergeant who led the squad accused of killing two dozen civilians in Haditha, Iraq, will file a lawsuit today in federal court in Washington claiming that Rep. John P. Murtha (D-Pa.) defamed him when the congressman made public comments about the incident earlier this year.

Attorneys for Frank D. Wuterich, 26, argue in court papers that Murtha tarnished the Marine's reputation by telling news organizations in May that the Marine unit cracked after a roadside bomb killed one of its members and that the troops "killed innocent civilians in cold blood." Murtha also said repeatedly that the incident was covered up.


Murtha argued that the questionable deaths of 24 civilians were indicative of the difficulties and overpowering stress that U.S. troops are facing. The congressman, a former Marine, has been a leading advocate for withdrawing U.S. forces from Iraq.

In the court filing, obtained by The Washington Post, the lawyers say that Murtha made the comments after being briefed by Defense Department officials who "deliberately provided him with inaccurate and false information." Neal A. Puckett and Mark S. Zaid, suing for libel and invasion of privacy, also wrote that Murtha made the comments outside of his official scope as a congressman.

Telephone calls yesterday to Murtha's office in Washington were referred to his district office in Pennsylvania, and calls there were not returned. A Marine Corps spokesman declined to comment yesterday on the Haditha investigation or the lawsuit.

The suit could have interesting legal ramifications because Wuterich and the other members of his squad have not been charged and have not received any official investigative documentation about the Nov. 19 incident. A Naval Criminal Investigative Service investigation is expected to determine possible charges this summer, said officials familiar with the case.

Zaid said the filing is designed partly to force Murtha to disclose what information he received from the Defense Department and the Marine Corps commandant to form his opinion, essentially trying to speed up the discovery process in a potential criminal trial.

"This case is not about money; it's about clearing Frank Wuterich's name, and part of that is to identify where these leaks are coming from," Zaid said in an interview. "Congressman Murtha has created this atmosphere that has already concluded guilt. He's created this environment that really smells, and he's the only one who has done that."

The move by Wuterich is rare, as statements made by members of Congress generally are protected under the "speech or debate" clause in Article I, Section 6, of the Constitution. But legal experts said the clause grants immunity only for what lawmakers say in legislative proceedings and does not apply to news releases, speeches and other public comments.

Rodney A. Smolla, dean of the University of Richmond Law School and a libel expert, said yesterday that Wuterich would have the burden of proving that he is innocent and that Murtha's statements were false, but he added that the quotations appear to be actionable in court. He said the suit shows that Wuterich probably thinks he did nothing wrong.

"Part of the subtext of this is it's a showing of confidence and a preemptive strike of sorts," Smolla said. "The congressman's statement does not sound as if it is merely hyperbole or opinion or name-calling. Instead, it conveys the idea that the Marines violated professional standards and perhaps the law."

Wuterich, through his attorneys, has maintained his innocence and has said that the Marines killed two dozen people that day because they were engaged in a firefight with suspected insurgents. He told his lawyers that he and other Marines used grenades and rifles to clear two houses they thought were hostile. Another Marine's detailed account of the incident, obtained by The Post, corroborates Wuterich's version.

Donald Ritchie, associate historian in the Senate Historical Office, said that such defamation suits happen from time to time but that they tend not to go anywhere because of the constitutional protections members have. He said the most famous case was in 1979, when the Supreme Court ruled that Sen. William Proxmire (D-Wis.) was not protected when he made defamatory statements to constituents in a newsletter.

"The Supreme Court has suggested that speech and debate has limits to it, and that makes people vulnerable in certain areas," Ritchie said

DEMON CUNT
08-02-2006, 08:50 AM
Yeah, good luck with that.

http://www.revolution-austria.at/images/ghraib/Abu%20Ghraib%20Series%203-06%20-%2030.JPG

Nickdfresh
08-02-2006, 10:23 AM
LOL Yeah, big leg to stand on. Gotta love frivolous lawsuits...

Guitar Shark
08-02-2006, 11:24 AM
I am pretty sure there is a congressional privilege protecting these types of comments.

DrMaddVibe
08-02-2006, 11:38 AM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
I am pretty sure there is a congressional privilege protecting these types of comments.

When they say things in the House, not when they talk to reporters on the steps outside!

Guitar Shark
08-02-2006, 11:40 AM
It's not that clear cut Vibe.

DrMaddVibe
08-02-2006, 11:45 AM
I dunno about that...Murtha was privvy to some sort of briefing on the matter and then spout off to reporters using the guys name.

Nickdfresh
08-02-2006, 12:08 PM
Dupe.

Nickdfresh
08-02-2006, 07:04 PM
Haditha Report Could Implicate Marines

Article Tools Sponsored By
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS (http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-Haditha-Investigation.html?_r=1&oref=slogin)
Published: August 2, 2006

Filed at 5:44 p.m. ET

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Evidence collected on the deaths of 24 Iraqis in Haditha supports accusations that U.S. Marines deliberately shot the civilians, including unarmed women and children, a Pentagon official said Wednesday.

Agents of the Naval Criminal Investigative Service have completed their initial work on the incident last November, but may be asked to probe further as Marine Corps and Navy prosecutors review the evidence and determine whether to recommend criminal charges, according to two Pentagon officials who discussed the matter on condition of anonymity.

The decision on whether to press criminal charges ultimately will be made by the commander of the accused Marines' parent unit, the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force at Camp Pendleton, Calif. That currently is Lt. Gen. John Sattler, but he is scheduled to move to a Pentagon assignment soon; his successor will be Lt. Gen. James Mattis.

Investigators conducted a wide range of interviews but did not obtain permission to exhume the bodies of the 24 who were killed, one official said.

The case is one of several involving alleged unjustified killings of Iraqi civilians that have emerged this year, damaging the military's reputation for humane treatment of civilians and triggering calls by some Iraqi leaders to end the arrangement under which U.S. troops are immune from prosecution by Iraqi authorities.

The Marines initially reported after the Nov. 19, 2005 killings at Haditha that 15 Iraqi civilians had been killed by a makeshift roadside bomb and in crossfire between Marines and insurgent attackers. Based on accounts from survivors and human rights groups, Time magazine first reported in March that the killings were deliberate acts by the Marines.

A criminal investigation was then ordered by the top Marine commander in Iraq, Maj. Gen. Richard Zilmer.

A parallel investigation is examining whether officers in the Marines' chain of command tried to cover up the events. The probe, which has not been made public, faults some officers for failing to pursue obvious discrepancies in the initial reports about what happened in Haditha and for not launching an early investigation.

Public attention on the Haditha case grew after Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., a former Marine, asserted publicly on May 17 that he had learned from Marine Corps officials that innocent Iraqis had been killed ''in cold blood.''

Lawyers for Staff Sgt. Frank D. Wuterich, one of the Marines under investigation, argued in a lawsuit filed Wednesday in federal court that Murtha falsely accused Wuterich of murder and war crimes. The suit maintains that Pentagon officials ''who have briefed or leaked information to Mr. Murtha deliberately provided him with inaccurate and false information'' and that the congressman subsequently ''has made repeated statements .... that are defamatory'' to Wuterich and his fellow Marines.

Among the other cases of alleged deliberate killings of Iraqi civilians, seven Marines and one Navy corpsman have been charged with premeditated murder and other criminal acts in connection with the killing of an Iraqi man in Hamdania on April 26. Also, five soldiers and a former soldier have been charged in the March 12 rape-slaying of a young Iraqi woman and the killings of her relatives in Mahmoudiya.

EAT MY ASSHOLE
08-03-2006, 02:37 PM
Jack Murtha IS sex.

DEMON CUNT
08-03-2006, 08:53 PM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Haditha Report Could Implicate Marines

Article Tools Sponsored By
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS (http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-Haditha-Investigation.html?_r=1&oref=slogin)
Published: August 2, 2006

Filed at 5:44 p.m. ET

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Evidence collected on the deaths of 24 Iraqis in Haditha supports accusations that U.S. Marines deliberately shot the civilians, including unarmed women and children, a Pentagon official said Wednesday.


Not looking good for our troops.

Was the lawsuit filed the same day this news broke?

LoungeMachine
08-03-2006, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
I dunno about that....


There's a shocker.

You "dunno" about much, Clay.

:rolleyes:

Cathedral
08-03-2006, 11:25 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
I am pretty sure there is a congressional privilege protecting these types of comments.

There is, for everyone but Murtha.

That picture of the Muslim with the hole in his head...did anyone here see one of our boys do it?

Thanks, the Bart Simpson Defense will suffice here:
"They didn't do it, nobody saw them do it, can't prove anything".

NEXT!

Cathedral
08-03-2006, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by Guitar Shark
It's not that clear cut Vibe.

True, no case is clear cut in this country anymore.
It all depends on the judges political leanings, and his mood of course.

Justice in America is a pipe dream.
The proof is on this website, i'm talking about the idea that people are guilty until, well, never...If you're a registered Republican and a Bush supporter, you have no Due Process afforded you in the eyes of a Liberal.

But, Murtha did open his mouth before that investigation was complete.
it's a pretty good case against him from that standpoint..but is it enough to win it?

That remains to be seen.

LoungeMachine
08-03-2006, 11:34 PM
Originally posted by Cathedral



..If you're a registered Republican and a Bush supporter, you have no Due Process afforded you in the eyes of a Liberal.

.


:rolleyes:


Oh,, please.


And if you're a "Liberal" :rolleyes: , you're convicted of being a troop-hating communist without a trial in here.

Give that shit a rest already.


It goes both ways in here.

Cathedral
08-03-2006, 11:39 PM
Originally posted by DEMON CUNT
Not looking good for our troops.


Yeah, it does, Lounge...can't argue that one.

Cathedral
08-03-2006, 11:41 PM
Originally posted by DEMON CUNT
Yeah, good luck with that.

http://www.revolution-austria.at/images/ghraib/Abu%20Ghraib%20Series%203-06%20-%2030.JPG

And this post, Hmmmmmm, i don't see any proof of who shot that poor man in the head.
Maybe, just Maybe, it was done by insurgents?

Oh, i dunno, i'm just sayin'...innocent until proven guilty, my brother.

DrMaddVibe
08-04-2006, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by LoungeMachine
There's a shocker.

You "dunno" about much, Clay.

:rolleyes:


Quick, make me laugh...again...how's the band?


LMAOAY!

DrMaddVibe
08-04-2006, 09:17 AM
Originally posted by Cathedral
True, no case is clear cut in this country anymore.
It all depends on the judges political leanings, and his mood of course.

Justice in America is a pipe dream.
The proof is on this website, i'm talking about the idea that people are guilty until, well, never...If you're a registered Republican and a Bush supporter, you have no Due Process afforded you in the eyes of a Liberal.

But, Murtha did open his mouth before that investigation was complete.
it's a pretty good case against him from that standpoint..but is it enough to win it?

That remains to be seen.

That's all I'm sayin'!

LoungeMachine
08-04-2006, 09:34 AM
Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
Quick, make me laugh...again...how's the band?


LMAOAY!

It's broken up.

Why can't you grasp that?


Yet here I sit, not having to work thanks to it.

How's your music "carreer" progressing? LMAO

Failed bass player married to the fat wife in FLA.

Wow, Living the dream, baby!!!

:lol:

DrMaddVibe
08-04-2006, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by LoungeMachine
It's broken up.

Why can't you grasp that?


Yet here I sit, not having to work thanks to it.

How's your music "carreer" progressing? LMAO

Failed bass player married to the fat wife in FLA.

Wow, Living the dream, baby!!!

:lol:




When's the "World Tour"?

LMAO!!!!!

Nickdfresh
08-04-2006, 10:05 AM
Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
When's the "World Tour"?

LMAO!!!!!

http://www.ticketliquidator.com/tix/american-idols-live-events.aspx?utm_source=google&utm_medium=ppc&utm_content=American+Idol+tickets&gclid=CKv9j-yZxoYCFTuSFQodbAiimA

DrMaddVibe
08-04-2006, 10:09 AM
Exactly!!!!

WTG...douchemachine on the Idols tour...LMMFAOAY!

LoungeMachine
08-04-2006, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
When's the "World Tour"?

LMAO!!!!!



Years ago...


When was your's, Asspipe?

LMAO

Ever gig out of FLA?

Make it as far as GA?

Ever in front of more than 100 people?


Have a nice day at work, Clay:D

LoungeMachine
08-04-2006, 10:16 AM
Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
Exactly!!!!

WTG...douchemachine on the Idols tour...LMMFAOAY!


Well, at least I'd know you'd be there. :D

DrMaddVibe
08-04-2006, 10:36 AM
Yeah, hold your breath..."star"!

DrMaddVibe
08-15-2006, 07:53 AM
Lawmaker Apologizes To Marines For Remarks

By Josh White
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, August 15, 2006; A03



A Republican congressman apologized yesterday to the Marines under investigation in the killings of two dozen civilians in Haditha, Iraq, last November, saying that statements he made about the case were taken out of context and that he did not mean to imply the Marines were guilty of wrongdoing.

Rep. John Kline (R-Minn.) issued the apology as part of an agreement with lawyers for Marine Staff Sgt. Frank D. Wuterich, who alleged that Kline had damaged Wuterich's reputation.

Wuterich, through his lawyers, has denied any wrongdoing in the Haditha case. None of the Marines involved has been charged.

Wuterich took the unusual step earlier this month of filing a federal lawsuit against Rep. John P. Murtha (D-Pa.), alleging that statements Murtha made about the Haditha deaths were libelous. Murtha said after the lawsuit was filed that he did not mean to prejudge Wuterich, but the representative has not responded to a settlement offer that seeks a similar public apology, according to Wuterich's attorneys, Mark S. Zaid and Neal A. Puckett. The lawyers set last Friday as a deadline for Murtha's response.

Wuterich had threatened to sue Kline as well. But Zaid said yesterday that Kline responded to a settlement request within an hour of its arrival Aug. 4. Kline wrote that news outlets used incomplete statements that gave the false impression that he had concluded the Marines broke the law.

"I am, of course, very concerned regarding any allegations surrounding misconduct by U.S. troops in Iraq," Kline wrote in his statement. "Such allegations must be taken seriously, but we should never rush to judgment before all the facts are known and the military criminal justice process is completed."

Kline, a member of the House Armed Services Committee, said he was briefed on Haditha by Marine Brig. Gen. John F. Kelly, the legislative assistant to the Marine commandant. At the time of the briefings, the official investigations were not complete, and Kline emphasized that "conclusions have not been reached."

"As a retired Colonel in the U.S. Marines, I am especially proud of the sacrifices our men and women make day in and day out, especially in combat situations," Kline wrote. "And as a Marine officer, I would never want to publicly insinuate, implicitly or explicitly, that I have prejudged what took place that day on the battlefield or afterwards."

© 2006 The Washington Post Company