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Hardrock69
08-08-2006, 11:47 AM
Not only that, they think that it is possible that dinosaurs were on Noah's Ark, but died due to "the great climatic changes that followed the Flood".

These people are so lacking in intelligence they do not even deserve to be alive. All they are doing is taking up valuable oxygen and other resources that could better be used by people who have a brain! :mad:

They are of the same caliber as people who still to this day believe the Earth is flat.

Enough ranting...read the article:


Group wants to reconcile dinosaurs, Bible
Some Adventists say science flawed, call for discussion

By ANITA WADHWANI
Staff Writer

When confronted with questions from her middle school students about dinosaurs, Seventh-day Adventist teacher Laurel Baker says she usually skirts the issue and changes the subject.

Seventh-day Adventists believe in a literal six-day creation of the world described in the biblical book of Genesis. It's written there that God created Adam and Eve and the animals of the earth on the same day — about 6,000 years ago, according to many Seventh-day Adventists.


Most mainstream scientists believe dinosaurs existed hundreds of millions of years ago, predating the evolution of human beings.

Now, however, some in the denomination are making new efforts to reconcile these contrary beliefs by asserting that many of the techniques and assumptions of science are simply flawed.

Scientists date dinosaur fossils using "the distribution of isotopes, but those processes have very little to do with time," said geologist Elaine Kennedy, who has spent her career examining dinosaur eggs and nests and now serves as adjunct professor at Southwestern Adventist University in Keene, Texas. "You're talking about phenomenon that can happen very quickly."

Such dating, she said, doesn't take into account the impact of the cataclysmic flood recounted in the Bible, for example.

Kennedy believes that dinosaurs were created during Biblical times, thousands rather than millions of years ago.

Her book, "Dinosaurs Where did they come from … and where did they go?" is being featured at this week's convention at the Gaylord Opryland Resort & Hotel of about 6,200 educators from Seventh-day Adventist parochial schools across the country.

The educators attended workshops and bought books Monday that offered biblical-based and scientific explanationsto curious students who have grown up on movies like "Jurassic Park" and "The Land Before Time."

At a standing-room-only workshop called "The Dirt on Dinosaurs: Created or Evolved," David Stair told about 150 participants that God created dinosaurs on the sixth day of creation, when the Bible says: "And God made the beasts of the earth according to their kinds and the cattle according to their kinds, and everything that creeps upon the ground according to its kind."

Contrary to traditionally accepted science, dinosaurs roamed the earth along with humans until the great flood recounted in the Bible killed all living things that did not board Noah's ark, he said.

It's possible that some dinosaurs were small enough to enter the ark and survive, only to be killed by the great climactic changes that followed, said Stair, principal of Joshua Adventist Multigrade School in Joshua, Texas. A baby T-Rex, for example, was probably small enough to fit on a person's shoulder.

The denomination has about 1 million adherents in North America and 14 million worldwide.

Two years ago, Seventh-day Adventists reaffirmed their belief that the "seven days of the Creation account were literal 24-hour days forming a week identical in time to what we now experience as a week; and that the flood was global in nature."

At the same time, the denomination called upon all educators at about 1,000 Seventh-day Adventist schools in the United States, Canada and Bermuda to uphold and advocate the church's position while also educating children to "understand and assess competing philosophies of origins that dominate scientific discussion in the contemporary world."

Dinosaurs, according to some Seventh-day Adventist theories, either never existed, their bones were scattered by Satan on earth to confuse people, or they were animals created by God but altered by Satan after the fall of the Garden of Eden.

But a growing number of adherents believe they must do better at offering an explanation for dinosaurs that is faithful to scientific data and supportive of biblical beliefs.

Connie Reynolds, principal of A.W. Spalding Elementary School in Chattanooga, says she was picking up a copy of Kennedy's book not only to help guide the education of her students, but to help her when she is challenged by her 15-year-old son to provide answers to natural phenomenon not easily explained by the Bible.

Reynolds says she believes dinosaurs were originally created in some form by God but were warped by Satan, and they died in the great flood described in the Bible.

"My son reads National Geographic. If I say something wrong, he'll say, 'Mom, why don't you know that.' If I don't have answers, it may make him question if the other things I say are legitimate."


http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060808/NEWS06/608080339

Satan
08-08-2006, 11:54 AM
Originally posted by Hardrock69

Dinosaurs, according to some Seventh-day Adventist theories, either never existed, their bones were scattered by Satan on earth to confuse people, or they were animals created by God but altered by Satan after the fall of the Garden of Eden.



Right........

Like I, the Chief Executive Officer of Hell, have time to run around Earth moving fucking brontosaurus skeletons???

I didn't alter anything after the Garden Party got cancelled. God made the animals mean and pissed off and hating humans, not me. The only thing I did back then was to make snakeskin suits fashionable. But when everyone else around you is wearing fucking fig leaves, that wasn't too difficult. :cool:

distortion9
08-08-2006, 12:03 PM
Originally posted by Hardrock69
[B]

They are of the same caliber as people who still to this day believe the Earth is flat.


It's not flat? Link?

Ally_Kat
08-08-2006, 12:45 PM
Originally posted by Hardrock69
Dinosaurs... were animals created by God but altered by Satan after the fall of the Garden of Eden.


Awesome.

binnie
08-08-2006, 01:08 PM
Two words: Bill Hicks!

Check out his sketches on fundamentalist Christians. fuuniest stuff you'll ever hear.


Now, Im not saying evolution has all the answers, but the earth being 6,000 years old!!!!

Come on.......

Hardrock69
08-08-2006, 03:15 PM
Ok so I wonder what they looked like before Satan altered them? I mean, if that is true, then there should be fossilized bones of the creatures as they were BEFORE The Lord Of Darkness changed them!


I did a little research on the net. Here is a page called "A Biblical Approach To Geology" that was written by the woman mentioned in the above article, Elaine Kennedy.

http://www.aiias.edu/ict/vol_26A/26Acc_503-527.htm#_ftn13

Here is a direct quote from this page:


"A new generation of flood geologists and other scientists are urging their colleagues, the general public, the Christian community and especially Christian educators to refrain from seeking scientific arguments to bolster their faith in the Bible. It is particularly vital that science educators refrain from using scientific arguments in the classroom to support the biblical narrative.
The biblical accounts of creation and the flood are supported by faith, not science because all science is tentative. Scientific data may be presented as evidences consistent with the biblical account of earth's prehistory but neither evidences and theories with the biblical account prove the events, nor evidences and theories contrary to the biblical account disprove the events."


And then towards the end, this person writes:


"It is my hope that geology will be taught in Adventist schools in such a way that students will be drawn to a knowledge of Jesus Christ and that their faith will be firmly grounded, not in science, but in God and His Word."



This woman is a perfect example of an "educated idiot".

If a class in a school is entitled "Geology", it should be about "Geology".

Not some fucking philosophical fairy tale about the reasons why a big flood happened millennia ago.

If you are going to teach kids about SCIENCE, teach them about fucking SCIENCE..not RELIGION!

If you place a table in front of someone, and ask that person what it is in front of them, and they reply "That is a Fruit Of The Loom automated buttfucking machine mounted on a bright yellow diesel locomotive!!!!" then that person is obviously out of touch with reality.

The same thing applies here. Teaching a class on religious beliefs and labelling it "Geology" indicates the faculty is clearly insane.

It is no wonder our kids are growing up uneducated when religious zealots are more interested in teaching their kids about some fantasy-land, when they should be teaching them about the REAL world!

It is one thing to believe in (insert deity here), but to have parents send their children to such schools is actively preventing them from being able to survive, function and possibly even prosper in the REAL world as an adult.

I can understand someone believing that (insert deity here) created the Earth. But not in such a manner that is impossible in the physical universe.

I mean, if God created the Universe, he also created the laws of physics, right?


All that these parents are doing is raising kids who believe their parents are stupid. That can be seen from the article, where they are trying to teach parents and educators how to explain why they believe in fairy tales instead of reality, and why the kids should believe the same.

Teenagers already think their parents don't know jack.....but children of 7th Day Adventists know for a fact their parents are delusional.

Anyone with common sense can understand the Earth is far older than 6,000 years old. Hard science has proven this in ways too numerous to mention.

But in every crowd you will have a subset of delusional crackpots.

I feel sorry for kids whose parents force them to believe such foolishness. Not only are they being limited in their knowledge of the real world, but they most likely suffer the ridicule of their peers.

binnie
08-08-2006, 03:52 PM
I actually think that it's ok to teach creationsim and evolutionary theories in school side by side.

Tell kids that they are both theories and let them decide (I know which one my money's on)

From the articles in this thread, these guys aren't even opening their minds to other possibilites - that's what wrong.

For my money, I'd rather have both sides of the coin....

Mr. Vengeance
08-08-2006, 04:02 PM
These fucking religious dopes can never be shown the reality of evolution. They've been brainwashed since the day they were born by other brain-dead religous dopes who hate everything about science and believe in a stupid book, written by man, to try and control others by SCARING THEM. If the church scares people into thinking that a vengeful God awaits them, they'll do whatever the "leaders" tell them to, including giving them their money.

Unreal how stupid these people really are.

Ally_Kat
08-08-2006, 07:10 PM
Originally posted by binnie
I actually think that it's ok to teach creationsim and evolutionary theories in school side by side.

Tell kids that they are both theories and let them decide (I know which one my money's on)


And which creation story are you going to teach the students? Just the one dealing with the Abrahamic religions? There are more creation stories than that. This is why I believe the Theory of Evolution should stay in Science class and why we should have a separate Religions of the World class -- especially with today's world climate. Let the kids get an academic understanding of religions and I bet it'll help them a whole hell of a lot in History class AND understanding the news.

But the students need to learn that many scientists, including Darwin, wrote theories and revelations with Providence in mind. That included with the classical theory was the thought that nature and a higher power were influencing organisms, which is why most Abrahamic religions can accept the classical theory because they view it very similarly to the creational story. It's the wacky, strict Protestant denominations who insist that 6 days and 6,000 years are actual 6 days and 6,000 years as humans know it and not as a divine entity might know it that ruin it for the rest of us sane religion peeps.

Coyote
08-08-2006, 07:14 PM
Do whatever the fuck is right. Just shut the fuck up!!! :D


(And don't forget to mention all the slaughter done in the name of the Big G to the kids in Religion classes, OK?)

stringfelowhawk
08-08-2006, 09:39 PM
I've always found it hypocritical for religion to claim they want to save your soul to put you on the path to heaven but charge you 10% of your income to do it. It's an ultimatum, basically pay or don't come to church. I've actually witnessed that and one other occasion convinced me ALL religions are a moot practice. I don't need to go to church to believe in God. A few years ago my uncle who had been going to this non-denomination church for about 5 years at the time was pulled aside by the pastor and told that several members of the congregation had complained to him about how long his hair had grown. You're gonna love this shit! Here's the kicker: He grew his hair out to play a role in a religious play the church was puting on around Christmas time and which the congregation asked him to play the role of Jesus on the cross because of his "likeness" to most of the pictures and the description the bible gives of him. Do I need to explain why it required long hair or is everyone clue'n in here? And I don't mean that in a sarcastic way.

I once had a pastor with a Theology degree tell me I was going to hell because I liked to read Stephen King books.
IMHO religion is just organized bigotry and hypocrasy

Hardrock69
08-08-2006, 09:43 PM
I also agree kids should be allowed to decide what they want to believe regarding religion.....adults cramming it down their throat is not always going to work, as the kids are going to make their own minds up someday anyway, and might even tell their parents to go fuck themselves...

I believe in seperation of religion from education.

That way kids can learn in an environment that is free from religious pressure.....


Kinda like I believe religion has no place whatsoever in politics.

I can see enacting laws out of common sense, like you do not steal from, hurt or kill anyone.

But to enact a law simply because you do not like the consequences (for OTHER PEOPLE) of life without a law prohibiting such behaviour....that is fucking stupid.

Like fer instance, laws banning victimless crime, or gay marriage. Or fucking POT!!!

**sigh**

It is an imperfect world, full of idiots...but right now it is the only one we have....

jhale667
08-08-2006, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by binnie
Two words: Bill Hicks!

Check out his sketches on fundamentalist Christians. fuuniest stuff you'll ever hear.


Now, Im not saying evolution has all the answers, but the earth being 6,000 years old!!!!

Come on.......


"Go back to sleep, everyone---we figured it all out for you!" :D Hicks was a fucking comedic genius.

THIS is what's wrong with organized religion. It's basically saying "Ignore the FACTS, let US do the thinking for you, and by the way, you're going to HELL if you question this!" :mad:

Hardrock69
08-08-2006, 10:13 PM
People who are unwilling to accept responsibility for their actions need some kind of scapegoat. So they use religion as a crutch.

"Oh it is the will of GAWD".

Yeah...sure it is...and you are rowing a boat up the river DeNial.....
:rolleyes:

Ally_Kat
08-09-2006, 12:12 AM
I feel bad that you guys have had such crappy experiences. There are assholes apart of everything and it's a shame you guys haven't had much experience with the good people that are apart of it.

Just remember that to all religions there are two sides -- the human and the divine. The human can get corrupted but what the message is suppose to be is normally steadfast. And if any Christian tells you that you will go to Hell because of something, just remind them that their faith has it laid out that no man is above the diety they have chosen and that only that diety can make the choice of who goes where. They can not believe in something or not favor something, but to tell someone flat out that they'll go to Hell is wrong.

binnie
08-09-2006, 03:10 AM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
And which creation story are you going to teach the students? Just the one dealing with the Abrahamic religions? There are more creation stories than that. This is why I believe the Theory of Evolution should stay in Science class and why we should have a separate Religions of the World class -- especially with today's world climate. Let the kids get an academic understanding of religions and I bet it'll help them a whole hell of a lot in History class AND understanding the news.

But the students need to learn that many scientists, including Darwin, wrote theories and revelations with Providence in mind. That included with the classical theory was the thought that nature and a higher power were influencing organisms, which is why most Abrahamic religions can accept the classical theory because they view it very similarly to the creational story. It's the wacky, strict Protestant denominations who insist that 6 days and 6,000 years are actual 6 days and 6,000 years as humans know it and not as a divine entity might know it that ruin it for the rest of us sane religion peeps.

Thanks for that post, it was really interesting. I'd like to see an educational programme thant is very philosophical and looks at the issue in depth from as many angles as possible.

If nothing else, it'd show kids that life isn't black and white, and that there is a limit to what we can know.

Soul Reaper
08-09-2006, 08:24 AM
It's funny how Christian sects don't believe in the 'impossiblity' of evolution, but believe a woman gave birth to a baby without ever having sex....

but anyway, that's another subject....

yes, we should be able to choose what we want to believe....education should be more open minded....this leads to a thinking and philosophical society and not a dogmatic and persecuting society.....

I hate it how they tell us that God must exist because of miracles....things like how (about three people) people got 'healed' at Lourdes, so therefore it must be holy....what about the millions of people who go to Lourdes and don't get 'healed'? so God let's some people die but let's others live? supposedly, according to the Bible, he cares for ALL of us....

Religion should have no place in politics, science and philosophy....

I like Jesus, not Chrisitanity.....

binnie
08-09-2006, 08:30 AM
Originally posted by Soul Reaper



I like Jesus, not Chrisitanity.....

Good point, there is a big difference between individual belief and organised religion....

Soul Reaper
08-09-2006, 09:12 AM
Originally posted by binnie
Good point, there is a big difference between individual belief and organised religion....

if Jesus ever came again...that's IF he comes again....I bet Christianity will be the ones who'll crucify him....

Hardrock69
08-09-2006, 01:55 PM
My problem is not with people who are sensible and have a certain set of religious beliefs....

It is the idiots whose beliefs interfere with their ability to function in the real world as a sensible human being.

It is bad enough when people have some belief in the second coming of Santa Clause (hey it is just as likely as the resurrection and return of a pile of dusty bones in the Middle East), but when you start claiming that the Earth is less than 6,000 years old, or that the end of the world is going to come on (insert date here), and forcing your kids to believe it as well, that is where I draaw the line.


I read in the paper about 10 years ago about some idiot preacher in South Korea who convinced all of his followers to sell their houses and all their worldy goods so they could go wait with him on a remote mountaintop in Korea for the end of the world and Second Coming on a certain date back then.

When the Second Coming did not happen, he was forced to publicly apologize to everyone whose lives he had ruined, and of course he became the laughingstock of Planet Earth.


The early Christians in the First Century A.D. thought Jesus was going to return again back THEN, but of course it never happened, and their bones are still waiting.

The bones of Jesus are still waiting also.

:rolleyes:


I suppose it is ok for these people to be idiots...I mean out of the human race there is always a set percentage of stupid people.

It just that I am bothered by the negative effect it has on the people around them. They did not ask to have a moron for a relative....but they have to suffer for it nonetheless.

binnie
08-09-2006, 03:15 PM
The problem is not relgion per se, it's fundamentalism.

They deny the evolution of their own faith, it's ability to react to new climates and challenges, as well as denying evolutionary theory.

Satan
08-09-2006, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by stringfelowhawk

I once had a pastor with a Theology degree tell me I was going to hell because I liked to read Stephen King books.


True enough. And we have all of them in Hell's library! :)

Mr. Vengeance
08-09-2006, 07:04 PM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
I feel bad that you guys have had such crappy experiences. There are assholes apart of everything and it's a shame you guys haven't had much experience with the good people that are apart of it.

Just remember that to all religions there are two sides -- the human and the divine. The human can get corrupted but what the message is suppose to be is normally steadfast. And if any Christian tells you that you will go to Hell because of something, just remind them that their faith has it laid out that no man is above the diety they have chosen and that only that diety can make the choice of who goes where. They can not believe in something or not favor something, but to tell someone flat out that they'll go to Hell is wrong.

See Ally, if all religious thought was like that, there wouldn't be such division. Good post.

Mr. Vengeance
08-09-2006, 07:10 PM
I really only have a problem with religion and religious people when it interferes with common sense and they try to tell me what I should do with my life.

I have really had it with the new, G.W. Bush-led, anti-science attitude. This whole idea that science is bad because it proves that religious doctrine is fake...well, not fake....just not factual....makes me mad.

The same way science can determine that matter is made up of atoms and elements- It can prove the past. So for religion to just try and shove that aside because it doesn't mesh with their teachings, just drives me up the wall.

Hey, if YOU want to believe that we were created by a guy up in the sky...go ahead. But don't tell me that I am going to hell for accepting that we evolved from apes.

Soul Reaper
08-10-2006, 07:19 AM
Originally posted by binnie
The problem is not relgion per se, it's fundamentalism.

They deny the evolution of their own faith, it's ability to react to new climates and challenges, as well as denying evolutionary theory.

that's why we have so much trouble with the Muslim community....because they believe the Koran is the literal truth and are very passionate about that......

but you get that in every religion....it just seems more visible in the Muslim community....

binnie
08-10-2006, 07:23 AM
Originally posted by Soul Reaper
that's why we have so much trouble with the Muslim community....because they believe the Koran is the literal truth and are very passionate about that......

but you get that in every religion....it just seems more visible in the Muslim community....

True, but there are also plenty of fundamentalist Christians equally as belligerent (if not resorting to terrorism), and intollerent.

Soul Reaper
08-10-2006, 07:27 AM
Originally posted by binnie
True, but there are also plenty of fundamentalist Christians equally as belligerent (if not resorting to terrorism), and intollerent.

but teaching (or brainwashing) kids that their religion is the literal truth without any thorough evidence is just as wrong (ok, maybe not as wrong as blowing someone up, but it's still wrong)....

binnie
08-10-2006, 07:31 AM
Originally posted by Soul Reaper
but teaching (or brainwashing) kids that their religion is the literal truth without any thorough evidence is just as wrong (ok, maybe not as wrong as blowing someone up, but it's still wrong)....

True, couldn't agree more. I am of the opinion expressed earlier in the thread that all such theories should be taught side by side in a very philosophical way in order that people make up their own mind.

At univeristy, I was surrounded by fundamentalist Christians, and they are very intollerent people. The best type of relgious person are the ones who want to benefit people: that is when it becomes a force for good, not restriction.

Soul Reaper
08-10-2006, 09:56 AM
Originally posted by binnie
True, couldn't agree more. I am of the opinion expressed earlier in the thread that all such theories should be taught side by side in a very philosophical way in order that people make up their own mind.

At univeristy, I was surrounded by fundamentalist Christians, and they are very intollerent people. The best type of relgious person are the ones who want to benefit people: that is when it becomes a force for good, not restriction.

another problem I have with Chrisitanity is when they state that non-Christians will go to 'hell'.....

they also say that we will all be judged by God.....

they also say that God is a perfect being....

but if God sends other religions to hell, just because they're not Christian, then he can't be perfect.....he must be a favoritist or an elitist....and that must be a flaw....

binnie
08-10-2006, 10:09 AM
Originally posted by Soul Reaper
another problem I have with Chrisitanity is when they state that non-Christians will go to 'hell'.....

they also say that we will all be judged by God.....

they also say that God is a perfect being....

but if God sends other religions to hell, just because they're not Christian, then he can't be perfect.....he must be a favoritist or an elitist....and that must be a flaw....

Again, that would be the fundamentalists; their are lot of Christian groups who have thoughts about how other religions can be saved.

To Christians God is a perfect being: even if he was favortist or elitiest to them that wouldn't be a floor. If you believe that God is a higher being more intelligent than our humble human understanding, then we cannot expect him to conform to our understanding of what is good and bad, right and wrong.

That is what Faith is: trusting that whatever happens, however it appears to us, God is doing it for our good and loves us.

Now, I have no faith, but I find religion very interesting.

I reiterate that I have no problemwith Christianity or any other relgion, the problem I have is with fundamentalism.

Jimmy Jingles
08-10-2006, 11:56 AM
I thought that Jesus would have posted by now...

Ally_Kat
08-10-2006, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by Soul Reaper
another problem I have with Chrisitanity is when they state that non-Christians will go to 'hell'.....

they also say that we will all be judged by God.....

they also say that God is a perfect being....

but if God sends other religions to hell, just because they're not Christian, then he can't be perfect.....he must be a favoritist or an elitist....and that must be a flaw....



Originally posted by Ally_Kat
And if any Christian tells you that you will go to Hell because of something, just remind them that their faith has it laid out that no man is above the diety they have chosen and that only that diety can make the choice of who goes where. They can not believe in something or not favor something, but to tell someone flat out that they'll go to Hell is wrong.


To add -- the thought comes not that God is favoritist or any of that, but that is is a rule of the faith to keep holy the day set aside for rest and to give credit where credit is due -- the whole going to church thing, spending a day out of the week reflecting on your faith and all that. This goes in step with the whole picking who your diety is. For Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, it's God/Abba/Allah. It's the same guy. But for a Buddist and a Christian, two different things; No shared diety. So for one of these funamentalist Christians, it's you pick God/Jesus and if you don't, you're going to hell. But with that, just like I said in the quote, I tell those fundamentalists that it's not my job to judge who is wrong on this Earth. I live my life best to the teachings and insight given to me thru my Lord and my theological study and leave it be to a Higher Authority. But some people won't stop and all you can do is wish them the best and try not to let them give you the wrong impression of all the others who are not like this. I think that's what hurts me, sometimes, in all of this -- that people like to group everyone who has chosen a denomination of Christianity in this group and the ones who honestly try to be the best they can get punished for the bad seeds.

Hardrock69
08-10-2006, 10:30 PM
Haha....no it is not YOUR job to judge, Alley, it is the FUNDAMENTALIST'S job LMAO!!!

Seshmeister
08-11-2006, 12:06 AM
Originally posted by Ally_Kat
the whole going to church thing, spending a day out of the week reflecting on your faith and all that. This goes in step with the whole picking who your diety is. For Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, it's God/Abba/Allah.

I point blank refuse to set aside a day each week to listening to Abba.

I guess a lot of gay guys are going to be saved by accident though which is kind of ironic...:)

Seshmeister
08-11-2006, 12:20 AM
What pisses me off is the almost uniquely American creationist bullshit where they try and set Darwin up as as alternative Christ figure, use the word theory a lot and then fight the argiment on that basis. Its just so fucking stupid. It's like saying that there is no gravity because Newton had a theory on it or because Newton couldn't build a space shuttle then he's full of shit.

It skips over 100 years of science. The evidence for evolution is overwhelming but if a lot of people in the US want to go for the medieval pretend shit like the nutcase muslims then that's fine. Sit back and watch while all the multinationals move their Bio Chem research to Europe. Suits me, it'll help pay my pension.

If you are happy to let superstitions hold your country back like the Islamic countries don't worry. Just like DNA or the World Wide Web we'll do it for you and you can continue to borrow trillions from China and ban science in favor of invisible friends. We'll find the cure for cancer and sell it back to you.

Cheers!

:gulp:

jhale667
08-11-2006, 12:23 AM
Originally posted by Seshmeister


If you are happy to let superstitions hold your country back like the Islamic countries don't worry. Just like DNA or the World Wide Web we'll do it for you and you can continue to borrow trillions from China and ban science in favor of invisible friends. We'll find the cure for cancer and sell it back to you.

Cheers!

:gulp:

Somebody needs to tell that to Chimpy....:( The U.S. is SOOOOO dropping the ball on things like stem-cell research.

Soul Reaper
08-11-2006, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by binnie
I reiterate that I have no problemwith Christianity or any other relgion, the problem I have is with fundamentalism.

well, religion can do some good....but I just hate fundamentalists who don't think of thinks reasonably....


Originally posted by Ally_Kat
To add -- the thought comes not that God is favoritist or any of that, but that is is a rule of the faith to keep holy the day set aside for rest and to give credit where credit is due -- the whole going to church thing, spending a day out of the week reflecting on your faith and all that. This goes in step with the whole picking who your diety is. For Christianity, Judaism, and Islam, it's God/Abba/Allah. It's the same guy. But for a Buddist and a Christian, two different things; No shared diety. So for one of these funamentalist Christians, it's you pick God/Jesus and if you don't, you're going to hell. But with that, just like I said in the quote, I tell those fundamentalists that it's not my job to judge who is wrong on this Earth. I live my life best to the teachings and insight given to me thru my Lord and my theological study and leave it be to a Higher Authority. But some people won't stop and all you can do is wish them the best and try not to let them give you the wrong impression of all the others who are not like this. I think that's what hurts me, sometimes, in all of this -- that people like to group everyone who has chosen a denomination of Christianity in this group and the ones who honestly try to be the best they can get punished for the bad seeds.

I'm not blaming Christianity for the faults of a couple of fundamentalists....I just think young kids shouldn't be forced to believe a certain religion....which gives birth to more fundamentalists....

I wonder if Jesus ever came back and saw Christianity today, I wonder if he'd approve?

not that I fully believe in the second coming.....

Coyote
08-11-2006, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by Soul Reaper
I wonder if Jesus ever came back and saw Christianity today, I wonder if he'd approve?

Propably not. One look, and he'd hit "delete".

BITEYOASS
08-11-2006, 09:45 PM
I met my fiancee off the DLRML website, no BS!

Seshmeister
08-11-2006, 09:49 PM
Originally posted by jhale667
Somebody needs to tell that to Chimpy....:( The U.S. is SOOOOO dropping the ball on things like stem-cell research.

Biosciences is going to be bigger than IT is now in the next 10-30 years.

BITEYOASS
08-12-2006, 10:57 AM
damnit wrong thread

kathleenvh
08-12-2006, 09:12 PM
"their bones were scattered by Satan on earth to confuse people"

LMFAO

jhale667
08-12-2006, 09:39 PM
Originally posted by kathleenvh
"their bones were scattered by Satan on earth to confuse people"

LMFAO

Funny yet sad...that's another cop-out zealots use when confronted with logic...anything that doesn't fit their agenda is "the work of Satan".....:rolleyes:

FORD
08-24-2006, 08:16 AM
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Ellyllions
08-24-2006, 08:59 AM
To this day, my parents believe that the entire dinosaur thing is an elaborate plan by science to turn people away from God. They don't believe that dinosaurs ever existed in any form, nor do they believe that the earth is millions of years old.

It's a little scary actually, to know that over the years I don't believe the way they do nor will I ever be able to convince them otherwise. Growing up, I strayed further and further away from their belief system...and Daddy used to tell me, "The educated shall become as fools..." Meaning that the more education I got, the less I'd believe in God's ways. Not true at all.

Things that have ALWAYS bothered me is that their religion makes them seperatists amongst us all.

-They don't believe in swearing on a Bible. Even to "tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth". Which leaves them sometimes as victims refusing to defend themselves in a court of law. That makes the door wide open for "Christian persecution" views. See Revelations.

-"The meek shall inherit the earth" to them means that they need to stay poor to know God. BUT, they don't believe that Heaven is here on earth. So that interpretation is an oxymoron in terms.

-The staying poor thing goes on with sermons of walking on streets of pure gold...shows aspirations of riches after judgement. Bitterness, jealousy...but holding themselves down to attain it...resentment?

-Staying as uneducated as possible because it will turn you away from God. Dad was real hard on me when I decided to send myself to college. He refused to help me at all because he honestly thought that it was an unGodly thing to do.

I equate the entire thing to the message of God being lost in translation and the struggle of the potential power that man could achieve with masses following religion. Even my grandfather knew that there were many books kept away from the public for one reason or another.

I don't believe that God will punish me for trying to better myself through education. I don't believe that I have to be poor now to get to Heaven later. I do believe that Dinosaurs roamed the Earth. Doesn't the Bible speak of "Dragons"? And I don't believe that defending myself in court will send me to Hell.

I believe that the real problem with the way my parents believe is that it focuses on trivial things. I believe the saving or condemning of the soul goes much deeper. I don't know when judgement happens, only the dead know that and they're not telling.

The rest of it is all about the inability to have faith. Real faith. Some people need harsh rules, threats, and structure to cling to in order to behave. And those are the ones who are adamant about making a big stink over traditional values. They don't have enough faith to just quietly believe what they believe. It isn't real to them unless they have an army of people who agree with them.

That's poision.

Jimmy Jingles
08-24-2006, 10:33 AM
Who is Jesus Christ?

Hardrock69
08-24-2006, 11:08 AM
Hey Elly, I am sorry to hear of this.

Your parents (please excuse me for this) are a perfect example of what I find wrong with religious fundamentalism. It interferes with real life. In fact, it interferes with the real life of everyone around them (you in particular) when they never asked to have that problem.

Would they listen to a priest or a known religious scholar? Or would they just continue to believe as they do regardless of reality? For instance that going to college does not lead one further "astray"? Though of course it can...just watch "Animal House". ;)

I can only hope they live a happy life despite their religious beliefs.

And kudos to you for deciding to send yourself though college. There seem to be more and more slackers arriving on Earth these days, and not enough driven and determined people such as yourself.

Best of luck to ya.

:cool:

Ally_Kat
08-24-2006, 11:22 AM
Originally posted by Ellyllions
-Staying as uneducated as possible because it will turn you away from God. Dad was real hard on me when I decided to send myself to college. He refused to help me at all because he honestly thought that it was an unGodly thing to do.


Did you tell him that many denominations have founded their own colleges?

I mean, that ridiculous. There's nothing in the Bible that says you have to limit yourself educationally to be with God. Nowhere does He say that if you go beyond this level/degree that you're on a highway to hell. I mean, if that were the case, then there wouldn't even be seminaries, which are colleges.

I'm sorry he did that you, hun.

Ellyllions
08-24-2006, 12:29 PM
Aw, thanks guys.

I still adore my parents I just know that I can't change them.

And you're right, this kind of thing is the root of religious fundamentalism....but doesn't seem somewhat "Jim Jones'ish"...? I hate to say it but all through my life I wondered if my parents were sheep following God....or sheep following a preacher?

It all just seems so controlling doesn't it? Even running into someone's personal success in life....

FORD
08-24-2006, 12:58 PM
Originally posted by Jimmy Jingles
Who is Jesus Christ?

The Son of God.

Jesus Christ
08-24-2006, 01:06 PM
Originally posted by Ellyllions
Aw, thanks guys.

I still adore my parents I just know that I can't change them.

And you're right, this kind of thing is the root of religious fundamentalism....but doesn't seem somewhat "Jim Jones'ish"...? I hate to say it but all through my life I wondered if my parents were sheep following God....or sheep following a preacher?

It all just seems so controlling doesn't it? Even running into someone's personal success in life....

If thy parents' church is preaching something other than My teachings, then it is the doctrines of man.

And as for thy questions about the institutions of higher learning, why would My Dad give you a brain if He did not expect you to use it?

Many of My children believe that I, the Son of Man, travelled through many countries in My so called "lost years" which were not mentioned in the Gospels. I will not give details of those travels, but I will use it to say that educating oneself is not limited to what ye do in a classroom. For Dad and I created an entire universe for you to learn from.

Pretty cool, huh? :cool:

Jesus Christ
08-24-2006, 01:06 PM
Originally posted by FORD
The Son of God.

Indeed I am, My son :)

Ally_Kat
08-24-2006, 02:17 PM
Originally posted by Jesus Christ
Indeed I am, My son :)

Hey, Jesus. What's up?

So I'm thinking you and me on a road trip across America taking photos of Jesus sightings and creating an awesome picturebook about it.

EAT MY ASSHOLE
08-24-2006, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by jhale667
Funny yet sad...that's another cop-out zealots use when confronted with logic...anything that doesn't fit their agenda is "the work of Satan".....:rolleyes:

"Logic" and "faith" are two different beasts entirely. And none of us are to say which is right.

Ellyllions
08-24-2006, 03:28 PM
Originally posted by EAT MY ASSHOLE
"Logic" and "faith" are two different beasts entirely. And none of us are to say which is right.

Sure we can. Both are perception based so in effect.... right for each person.

Even the insane claim logic. And in their mind it makes perfect sense.

It's when they cross over into someone else's boundaries that we get confused.


:D I took philosophy in college too :D

Hardrock69
08-25-2006, 12:46 AM
Ok so philosophically speaking, is that you showing your boobs in your avatar?

Enquiring minds wanna know!

(Gotta keep up the reputation that I am a sex-starved beast, ya know... ;) )

Ellyllions
08-25-2006, 07:33 AM
Yep.

Hardrock69
08-28-2006, 02:09 PM
May I please have permission to drool, Mistress?

Ellyllions
08-28-2006, 03:21 PM
Of course.


heh, that golf ball in a tube sock look always gets em.....LOL!

PlexiBrown
08-28-2006, 03:52 PM
Most religions are fear based and they hold the "afterlife" over your head. Each religion claims to be "right" and the others wrong. More and more people are waking up and realizing that the religious beliefs that they "inherited" are bullshit. You don't need to belong to a religious group to believe in or know God, the Infinite or whatever you want to call it. Spirituality is closer to the truth than organized religion. Religions separate people and exclude. Spirutality brings people together and includes. It all boils down to thinking for yourself and common sense. The answers (the truth) are within each person but people are brain washed from a young age to seek outside of themselves. Some religions actually say, "give us your child until age 5 and we will have him for life". Most of the leaders of the organized religions are the false prophets. They are misleading the masses. John Lennon had it right!

Hardrock69
08-28-2006, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by Ellyllions
Of course.


Ok!
http://iran.worldcupblog.org/upload/shocked.jpg


heh, that golf ball in a tube sock look always gets em.....LOL!

Well, it's nice but you have the capability of silliness too.....that is worth more in my book!
;)