If Hendrix had lived until 1977...

[Mr Badguy]

...What would the punks have made of him?

This question came into my mind when I was reading an article about how the punks hated self indulgent musicianship and grandiose musical concepts.

Hendrix wasn`t impartial to rounding out his concerts with long drawn out, free form and, yes, self indulgent guitar solos.

However, in the late 1960`s, Hendrix was the most anti-establishment figure in the music world, which would have earned him respect from the punks.

Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Yes, Genesis, ELP and bands of that ilk were all targets for punks vitriol, all bands of superstars with their roots in the 60`s, of which Hendrix would have been by 1977.

This is all conjecture of course, as Hendrix could have been well out of the rock sphere by the late 1970`s and well into jazz.

Your thoughts?

[BruinJer]

I know one thing... death is a great career move because he wouldn't be the legend he is today (if he was still alive).

[Mr Badguy]

Originally posted by BruinJer
I know one thing... death is a great career move because he wouldn't be the legend he is today (if he was still alive).

You think?

Look at the Stones or the remaining members of Led Zeppelin.

They haven`t recorded anything near as good as their early stuff, yet they are still regarded as legends.

Whether Jimi made any more landmark music or not (and I think he would have), he did headline Woodstock and broke new ground in both guitar playing and rock music, that would have been enough to make him legendary alive or dead.

[PutOutTheLights]

ZZZZZZZ

Hendrix suxx.

[Wawazat]

Originally posted by PutOutTheLights
ZZZZZZZ

Hendrix suxx.

Your verbosity is exceeded only by your stupidity.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Never been much of a fan of the guy's music, but never, in a million years, would I deny his impact or even his ability.

I think he may have just stopped making music after a few years, to be honest.

[binnie]

Ok Hendrix was a genius, not just a guitar genius, a musical genius: those records still sound fresh, and there are so many crazy arrangment and conceptual ideas that don't overwhelm the songs, but add to their impact.

To get back to the subject of the thread, I reckon the punks would have hated him: he may have been anti-establishment, but so were a lot of hippy musicians, and the punks REALLY hated them.

For them, his music would have been too self indulgent (although to these ears only Band of Gypsies could really be called sel-indlugent), even though he didn't really have that much in common with the prog bands that they were trying to kill off.

However, we don't know what Hendrix would have put out between 1970 and 1977: maybe he would have stripped his sound right down to a more straight blues, and that might have been acceptable to the punks, you never know...

[FORD]

As long as he never made a goddamned disco record. Then I would have had to kill him myself!

[StretchOnBass]

Originally posted by FORD
As long as he never made a goddamned disco record. Then I would have had to kill him myself!

I think he would have laughed his ass off the first time he heard the Bee Gee's

I played with Mitch Mitchell, saw Jimi several times and honestly, he was leaning towards jazz and acid rock fusion. I think that would have been just as much a wake up to Jazz as he was to rock.

[BruinJer]

Originally posted by Mr Badguy
You think?

Look at the Stones or the remaining members of Led Zeppelin.

They haven`t recorded anything near as good as their early stuff, yet they are still regarded as legends.

Whether Jimi made any more landmark music or not (and I think he would have), he did headline Woodstock and broke new ground in both guitar playing and rock music, that would have been enough to make him legendary alive or dead.

He is one of the GREATEST guitar players EVER and I LOVE his music... but I just don't think he'd be the legend he is today (if he were still alive). The same with Randy Rhoads...

[DrMaddVibe]

After listening to the "Saturn" tapes, Jimi was taking off into a very new direction. Just like Zeppelin was with ITTOD, they never got a chance to show us where that path was going.

If Jimi was alive in '77 I believe he would've been a force to be reckoned with. I also don't think he would've taken Johnny Rotten lying down either. I could see him remaking "God Save The Queen" and rubbing their noses in it.

[Terry]

From all I've read, I'd guess that had Hendrix lived, by the late 1970s he'd have forsaken the 'rock star' aspects of his act, and just be concentrating on his music to the exclusion of all the other bullshit...

Plus, the man had so much goddamn talent that would it really have MATTERED what John Lydon and the rest had to say about him? Perhaps in the UK, but in the USA punk in the 1970s had a very small impact on what people bought and listened to.

Hendrix was on the verge of firing his management, completing his studios and his record contract with Warner Brothers was up in 1972...the common theme from those who were close to him around the time when he died was that Hendrix was sick of playing large festivals, tired of all the groupies and hangers on, and frustrated that he was being bled dry financially by his management. He was talking about doing short tours in smaller halls using solely his own equipment in order to get the sounds he wanted, filming those shows then sending them to theaters around the country...

We'll never know for sure, but I think if Hendrix had lived until 1977, he couldn't have given a shit less what the punks had said about him.

[rustoffa]

Originally posted by Mr Badguy
This is all conjecture of course, as Hendrix could have been well out of the rock sphere by the late 1970`s and well into jazz.

Your thoughts?

I agree with the idea of Jimi getting into Jazz by the mid-to-late 1970's. The Punk rocking fuckers wouldn't have given him a second thought until Neil Young called him (Jimi) out in a song. Next thing you know, Jimbo's doing a project with Roky Erickson and Wayne Kramer. Forget 'post-punk'...'New Wave' wouldn't have happened!
;)

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Originally posted by Terry

Plus, the man had so much goddamn talent that would it really have MATTERED what John Lydon and the rest had to say about him? Perhaps in the UK, but in the USA punk in the 1970s had a very small impact on what people bought and listened to.



In the UK, punk did have a major impact, but it only lasted aboot a year. It was a fad. They say punk killed prog, but most of the original proggers did their best business after punk (Pink Floyd. Yes, Genesis etc). Also, in the year the Sex Pistols came and went, Pink Floyd released "Animals" (a fan favourite), Yes released "Going For The One" (one of their biggest albums, even had some hit singles), Rush released "Farewell to Kings" etc...etc...

[binnie]

Originally posted by Shaun Ponsonby
In the UK, punk did have a major impact, but it only lasted aboot a year. It was a fad. They say punk killed prog, but most of the original proggers did their best business after punk (Pink Floyd. Yes, Genesis etc). Also, in the year the Sex Pistols came and went, Pink Floyd released "Animals" (a fan favourite), Yes released "Going For The One" (one of their biggest albums, even had some hit singles), Rush released "Farewell to Kings" etc...etc...

True 'dat, it didn't kill Prog.

However, I would say that one year might be a bit of an under-estimation of Punk's impact (although I agree entirely about it being a fashion fad): think about the Clash and other punk bands in the early 80s...

I'd say Punk was a pretty major musical force in England 1977-1982, but not to the detriment of all other kinds of music...

[Shaun Ponsonby]

I'm talking aboot as a major MAJOR success.

As a massive movement, it was only a year.

[Mr. Vengeance]

Pretty much impossible to predict since no one knows where Hendrix would have taken his career. But, my feeling is that the original punk movement looked at any old acts as "dinosaur", so I think they would have called him a dinosaur.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Which proved that punks were hypocrites.

[Mr Badguy]

What puzzles me is why Punk is still so revered in the UK.

Every other kind of music has been trashed by the next generation (prog, Heavy Metal, 80`s pop, New Romantic, Ska, Acid House, Techno), but Punk seems to have got away scot free.

And it was all a pile of shite.

Even Johnny Rotten will tell you that.

It was never really about the music, it was about fashion.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Well, admittedly, New Romantics stemmed from punk (despite the fact as they are aboot as alike as a foot and a hedge), so I suppose it kinda lived on through that, I suppose.

[hideyoursheep]

If Hendrix would have made it to '77, he would have probably had his own label. I could see him getting back to what he really loved eventually, sort of like Clapton-but with bigger balls. That man played and recorded out of the box....I have a funny feeling he and EVH would have known each other pretty well.

I don't think the punks would have anything to say about Hendrix...his style was too eclectic for them to pigeonhole as "hippie rock" or "arena rock". He wanted to get away from that, but ran out of time.ELP would have been alot different had he been there, that's fo' sho' !

An all-black rock band playing on new years eve '69-70? Way ahead of his time-It would have been up to the rest of us to catch up with HIM!

The FUCKING GREATEST.

[PHOENIX]

Sometimes I wonder what direction Jimi Hendrix would have gone musically had he lived longer than 27 years. Would he have met up with Frank Zappa at some point? Another interesting collaboration would have been Hendrix and bass player Jaco Pastorius. Also, did Jimi Hendrix and Bob Marley ever meet? If only they had a chance to play music together. I’ve pondered him getting into classical music, jazz, funk…imagine Jimi and Bootsy Collins gettin’ down tonight. But these things were never to be as Jimi died too soon in 1970.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Originally posted by PHOENIX
imagine Jimi and Bootsy Collins gettin down tonight.

Now, THATS a colourful image.

[Mr. Vengeance]

Originally posted by Shaun Ponsonby
Which proved that punks were hypocrites.

How so?

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Well, some "dinosaurs" had to influence the punks.

Lets put it this way...Johnny Rotten is a Van Der Graaf Generator fan.

[Mr. Vengeance]

I suppose. But Johnny Rotten has always admitted he was a rocker in his teens. I believe he sang 18 by Alice Cooper when he auditioned for Malcolm

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Exactly, exactly

Everybody has to be influenced by SOMEBODY.

[FORD]

And the Ramones did a cover of a pathetically cheezy Phil Spector song.......

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But it doesn't change the fact that their first album inspired a generation to turn awaw from the excess and back to the real roots of rock n roll. Indeed the whole Ramones look and even their name was a nod to the Hamburg - era Beatles.

[Mr. Vengeance]

I love that clip because Johnny is so clearly EXTRA pissed that they're performing that tune. He hated the song, and although he said later in his life that he was happy to have been able to work with Spector, he hated working with him.

[FORD]

I think Johnny's pissed in that clip, because he didn't actually play one note on that song and he has to stand there miming to a song that probably doesn't even have a guitar part at all, and definitely not one of his. From what I remember, Spector used session musicians on a lot of that album. The remastered CD has demo versions of some tracks which I actually prefer to the "official".

Ramones produced by Phil Spector was a great concept in theory, but the results weren't as good as they should have been, because they let him get away with far too much.

"End of the Century" probably ranks as #2 only slightly behind "Let It Be" as albums destroyed by Phil Spector.

[Unchainme]

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This pretty much sums up how The Ramones were influenced.

IMO this song needs to be drilled into every Radio DJ's Brain so they can quit playing shitty ass emo and nu metal.

[Mr. Vengeance]

Phil Spector is the worst producer in history. I have the Rhino remaster of EOTC, and it is correct that the bonus tracks, without the Spector garbage on them are better.

How are you going to tinker with the Ramones with your "wall of sound" when the Ramones are ALREADY a wall of sound?

In the documentary End of the Century, Johnny talks about how the idiot Spector made him replay that first note on Rock n Roll High School dozens of times trying to get some "sound"...and between each take, he'd scream and yell and throw things, and berate the engineer. Fuck Phil Spector!

[Atomic_Rob]

Punk: Some of the music was great but the people and fans were absolute fucking faggots serious attitude problems.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Originally posted by Mr. Vengeance
Phil Spector is the worst producer in history. I have the Rhino remaster of EOTC, and it is correct that the bonus tracks, without the Spector garbage on them are better.

How are you going to tinker with the Ramones with your "wall of sound" when the Ramones are ALREADY a wall of sound?

In the documentary End of the Century, Johnny talks about how the idiot Spector made him replay that first note on Rock n Roll High School dozens of times trying to get some "sound"...and between each take, he'd scream and yell and throw things, and berate the engineer. Fuck Phil Spector!

I actually like Spector's production, at least in the 60s.

[binnie]

Originally posted by Shaun Ponsonby
I'm talking aboot as a major MAJOR success.

As a massive movement, it was only a year.

Ok, I understand now.

I was just saying that some punk bands did pretty well into the early 80s: The Clash etc.....

I've never really been a fan of Brit Punk though: The SKids, The Uk Subs, The Damned, all alright but not spectacular.....

[Shaun Ponsonby]

A lot of the punk bands wern't really punk bands, though.

I've never seen The Clash as a true punk band.

[binnie]

Yeah, they border on to Ska don't they?

I've never liked the clash: I appreciate them, in that I can see that they were good, and that Joe Strummer meant it, it's just not my cup of tea...

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Exactly, exactly...

Most of the bands that came out in that period were labelled as punks, even ones that had a horn section (true).

What I really hate aboot them is making up a history, bands should be true to their roots.

[Jérôme Frenchise]

Maybe those shitty-assed punks, had they played one tenth of what Hendrix made, could have said a little thing or two about great Jimi's work - so long as they could say anything about Zeppelin or the Stones, BTW.
But... as there isn't the slightest shit to save from anything those lame brats did, when you know a thing or two about music history, you don't even bother searching for what they could say that is musically relevant.
In addition, those guttersnipes had been smashed years before in their alley by the Stooges, anyway.

As for the disco thing, there are a few tracks on "First Rays of the New Rising Sun" that aren't far from the genre at all, IMO. Just IMO. :cool: