I Want This Asshole To Burn In Hell!

[High Life Man]

How 'bout a little Flappo justice for this cock?

name: Rene L Gonzalez
department: Campus Activities
mail: rene@student.umass.edu
phone: (413) 253-9639
class level: Doctoral
major: Political Science

Thursday, April 29, 2004
UMass grad student: Tillman's not a hero

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ESPN.com news services

AMHERST, Mass. -- A University of Massachusetts student has openly criticized Pat Tillman, calling the former NFL player a Rambo-like idiot in the school paper.

The column in question was submitted by graduate student Rene Gonzalez and published Wednesday in the Daily Collegian. It was titled "Pat Tillman is not a hero: he got what was coming to him."

Gonzalez writes that Tillman was a "Rambo" who probably acted out of "nationalist patriotic fantasies." In his own neighborhood in Puerto Rico, according to Gonzalez, Tillman would not have been considered a hero, but a "pendejo," or idiot.

The column drew harsh criticism from many on campus. University president Jack Wilson says the op-ed piece was "disgusting, arrogant and intellectually immature."

Tillman, who gave up his NFL career to join the Army Rangers in 2002, was killed in combat one week ago in Afghanistan. The military announced on Wednesday that he has been posthumously promoted to the rank of corporal and awarded the Purple Heart and Meritorious Service Medal.

"You know he was a real Rambo, who wanted to be in the 'real' thick of things," Gonzalez writes in his column, which is posted on the collegiate paper's Web site. "I could tell he was that type of macho guy, from his scowling, beefy face on the CNN pictures. Well, he got his wish. Even Rambo got shot in the third movie, but in real life, you die as a result of being shot. They should call Pat Tillman's army life 'Rambo 4: Rambo Attempts to Strike Back at His Former Rambo 3 Taliban Friends, and Gets Killed.'"

Gonzalez also says that Tillman's service was not "necessary."

"It wasn't like he was defending the East coast from an invasion of a foreign power. THAT would have been heroic and laudable," Gonzalez writes. "What he did was make himself useful to a foreign invading army, and he paid for it. It's hard to say I have any sympathy for his death because I don't feel like his 'service' was necessary. He wasn't defending me, nor was he defending the Afghani people. He was acting out his macho, patriotic crap and I guess someone with a bigger gun did him in."

In a letter to its readers Thursday, the Daily Collegian says Gonzalez' opinion in no way reflects that of the newspaper's editorial board. A column by one of the editors praising Tillman's sacrifice ran in the paper next to the one by Gonzalez.

"We do not hold back from printing news stories, columns or editorials that may upset our readership -- instead, we seek to both inform and stir debate through our publication," the letter, also posted on the Web site, reads. "Our decision to publish Gonzalez's column -- an opinion piece written by a member of our campus community -- is the only way for us to live up to this ideal."

Tillman will be eulogized at a public memorial service in his hometown of San Jose, Calif., early next week, and funeral arrangements are pending.

The body of Tillman arrived at Dover Air Force Base in Delaware on Monday. His brother, Spc. Kevin Tillman, also a Ranger with the 2nd Battalion of the 75th Ranger Regiment, was expected to accompany the body to the funeral home, Lawrence said.

Tillman was killed in a firefight on a road near Sperah, about 25 miles southwest of a U.S. base at Khost.

After coming under fire, Tillman's patrol got out of their vehicles and gave chase, moving toward the spot of the ambush. Beevers said the fighting was "sustained" and lasted 15-20 minutes.

The Cardinals said they will retire Tillman's No. 40 and name the plaza surrounding the new stadium under construction in suburban Glendale the "Pat Tillman Freedom Plaza."

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.

[Mr Grimsdale]

Rene L Gonzalez - knob end
...and he's wasting his time on some Mickey Mouse subject like Political Science.

[Dr. Love]

Ph.D - Piled Higher and Deeper.

It's my experience that most Ph.Ds are full of shit and love nothing more than to hear themselves talk.

They are legends in their own minds.

[Mr Grimsdale]

Thanks.

[High Life Man]

Originally posted by Dr. Love

It's my experience that most Ph.Ds are full of shit and love nothing more than to hear themselves talk.



Except, it seems, Mr. Grims. But he's probably got a PhD in Nuclear Science or auto-repair or something important like that. ;)

[Ally_Kat]

I remember reading in another thread here whre it was said these comments weren't common.

They might not be, but this is the third one of this type about this guy that I have read.

Professors and some of the left-leaning politcally active students at school say that Iraq is turning into Vietnam again. The only part of that comparison that I agree with is tha I think our boys and gals will slowly start being treated and reguarded to as our boys were when they got home from that war. I fear a very strong anger at those that served brewing.

[High Life Man]

Ally,

Anyone who thinks this is "turning into another Vietnam" obviously knows nothing about Vietnam. It's not even a close comparison.

I have to disagree with you on your second point - the troops will be treated with respect. Unfortunately, the only people the press covers are those who scream loudest. I know that a majority of people don't think about Tillman the way this asshole - nor do I think a majority of the people think that we are in the wrong over in Iraq.

Interesting note, war was not officially declared over in Japan until 1952. That's 7 years after we stopped fighting. We will be in Iraq for a long time, but we will succeed in what we set out to do. Assholes like Rene expect immediate results. Believe me, Iran and Syria want nothing less than a stable federalist government in their own backyard.

[Jesus Christ]

I will decide who burns in Hell. But that does not mean I agree with the comments. For it is not the soldier that beareth the responsibility for the lies of Caesar. Only the results of those lies, unfortunately :(

[Dr. Love]

I should qualify that I've never met any type of Ph.D except American ones.

The British might be different, who knows, but the American ones are pretty bad at times.

[Roy Munson]

Here is the fuckwad's homepage...



Photo of the "Fuckwad" (http://www-unix.oit.umass.edu/~jbcp/rene.html)

Rene "Fuckwad" Gonzalez (http://www.fortunecity.com/underworld/stunt/187/index.html)


Send him a couple of emails to let him know what you think of his editorial. I did.

Roy

[Ally_Kat]

dude, he needs to get a webpage without those ads.

[Mr Grimsdale]

Originally posted by High Life Man
Interesting note, war was not officially declared over in Japan until 1952. That's 7 years after we stopped fighting. We will be in Iraq for a long time, but we will succeed in what we set out to do.

Seriously? I thought that was just the San Francisco Peace Treaty which ended the mission of the Allied Council for Japan.

If so what was the signing of the official surrender on the deck of the USS Missouri on 2nd September 1945 all about?

I was thinking about this last week and thought that perhaps one of the reasons things are proving a little troublesome in Iraq is because there was no official surrender ceremony. Then again the population is so fragmented they probably wouldn't have paid much attention and unlike Japan and Germany Iraq was not subjected to sustained heavy bombing.

One of the reasons the Middle East and much of Africa is so unstable is because the borders are a relic of past empires: British, French, Dutch, German etc. All the ethnic and religious groups have been forced together and were only held together by strong leadership, either the likes of Saddam or their earlier imperial rulers.


Originally posted by Dr. Love
I should qualify that I've never met any type of Ph.D except American ones.

The British might be different, who knows, but the American ones are pretty bad at times.

Oh, we've got some twats over here too. Me? I'm just fookin' wonderful.

Without your US PhD guys n'gals you wouldn't have much of a space programme and your military would be minus most of its toys.


Originally posted by High Life Man
Except, it seems, Mr. Grims. But he's probably got a PhD in Nuclear Science or auto-repair or something important like that. ;)

Close. It was actually The Response Of Female Kids TV Presenters Under Conditions Of Obscene Oral Excitement. I spent hours collecting the data and formulating my theories. My Professor said it was one of the most disgusting theses he'd ever had the chance to read. I took that as a compliment.

[John Ashcroft]

Dude, you rock!

The PHDs that they're talking about are PHDs in BA type of programs (or programmes if you prefer). You know, Poly Sci, English, Psychology, Middle Eastern sexual patterns, etc...

I don't think anyone here has an ounce of disrespect for PHDs in medicine or science. And you're damn right, our technology owes alot to hard-science PHDs. But you can't discredit the Engineers either...

The wonderful thing about our country is that if you have a great idea, ambition, work ethic, and a bit of luck, no PHD is necessary to change the world (and make millions in the process).

[GAR]

Originally posted by Roy Munson
Send him a couple of emails to let him know what you think of his editorial. I did.

Roy

How about sending the spics homepage to hell in a handbasket?

http://www.medsmex.com/xcart/customer/

Happy now?

[Roy Munson]

Originally posted by GAR
How about sending the spics homepage to hell in a handbasket?

http://www.medsmex.com/xcart/customer/

Happy now?


Holy shit you're a fuckin' weirdo.

How about you shove a pipe cleaner up your ass? How about jumping in front of a bus? How about drinking a bottle of Drano? Do something productive.

[knuckleboner]

sorry to break it to you guys, but the author's right; dying didn't make pat tillman a hero.

it just made it easier for the average joe to see it. pat tillman was a hero the moment he decided that he would voluntarily take a job that would put his life at risk in order to save/protect others.

is pat tillman's brother, kevin, any less of a hero because his number hasn't come up yet?

sure, the 346 NYC firefighters who died in the WTC are heros. but so's the firefighter currently sleeping comfortably in his bed in demoines, iowa. he hasn't had to give his life yet. and he might never have to. but the fact that he willingly took a job to save people, where he MIGHT have to give his life is enough to make him a hero.

just like pat tillman.




(and grims, goddamn...you're ruining your image here...i agree 100% on the artificial borders. don't worry, though, outside of the warzone, i'll still hold you in low esteem :D)

[lucky wilbury]

everyone should read the full colum.it says things things like "G.I. Joe guy who got what was coming to him."

http://www.boston.com/news/education/higher/articles/2004/04/29/umass_president_criticizes_students_column_on_fell ed_soldier/

UMass president criticizes student's column on felled soldier
By Associated Press | April 29, 2004

AMHERST -- A University of Massachusetts graduate student who wrote a campus newspaper column saying former NFL player Pat Tillman was not a hero for being killed while fighting in Afghanistan was sharply criticized Thursday by the school's president.

UMass president Jack Wilson issued a statement saying Rene Gonzalez' comments in The Daily Collegian "are a disgusting, arrogant and intellectually immature attack on a human being who died in service to his country."

In his column, which ran Wednesday on the opinion page and was posted on the newspaper's Web site, Gonzalez called the former Arizona Cardinals safety a "G.I. Joe guy who got what was coming to him."

"That was not heroism," Gonzalez wrote. "It was prophetic idiocy."

His column, which ran next to a column praising Tillman as a hero, also criticizes America's military response to the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.

Tillman, the San Jose, Calif., native who gave up his NFL career to join the Army Rangers in 2002, was killed in combat April 22 in Afghanistan.

While recognizing Gonzalez' right to free speech, Wilson said the student owes Tillman a "debt of gratitude," and said he should apologize to Tillman's friends and family.

The state Senate on Thursday approved a resolution of condemnation, with one member, Sen. Robert Hedlund, R-Weymouth, calling Gonzalez a "nitwit."

Jared Nokes, president of the Student Government Association, also issued a statement condemning Gonzalez' column.

Gonzalez did not respond to telephone and e-mail messages left Thursday by The Associated Press.

In a response to the controversy generated by the column, the paper's editorial board ran a letter to readers in Thursday's edition saying Gonzalez's views do not reflect The Collegian's opinion.

"We do not hold back from printing news stories, columns or editorials that may upset our readership -- instead, we seek to both inform and stir debate through our publication," the letter said. "Our decision to publish Gonzalez' column -- an opinion piece written by a member of our campus community -- is the only way for us to live up to this ideal."

------

On the Net: www.dailycollegian.com/

[High Life Man]

Originally posted by Mr Grimsdale
Seriously? I thought that was just the San Francisco Peace Treaty which ended the mission of the Allied Council for Japan.



Yep, I just heard about it the other day. I think yesterday was the 52nd anniversary of it.

There must have been an agreement not to take arms with the understanding that the "official" end of the war would be later. A sort of cold truce like the one standing in North Korea.

I'll have to do some research on this.

[Mr Grimsdale]

Originally posted by knuckleboner
(and grims, goddamn...you're ruining your image here...i agree 100% on the artificial borders. don't worry, though, outside of the warzone, i'll still hold you in low esteem :D)

awww shucks, you say the sweetest things

re: the artificial borders - if we still had the empire we wouldn't have let the instability happen

rule britannia...

hehehe

[Mr Grimsdale]

Originally posted by John Ashcroft
Dude, you rock!

The PHDs that they're talking about are PHDs in BA type of programs (or programmes if you prefer). You know, Poly Sci, English, Psychology, Middle Eastern sexual patterns, etc...

I don't think anyone here has an ounce of disrespect for PHDs in medicine or science. And you're damn right, our technology owes alot to hard-science PHDs. But you can't discredit the Engineers either...

The wonderful thing about our country is that if you have a great idea, ambition, work ethic, and a bit of luck, no PHD is necessary to change the world (and make millions in the process).

I hate to break it to you but you can achieve just about anything in a lot of countries with those things you mention.

...although if you want to create a space programme and design stealthy vehicles it helps to have a PhD. ;)

Not too sure that Johnny from across the block with a basic high school education could handle finite volume analysis. ;)

I certainly wasn't discrediting engineers, I was one. I've got 7+ years of university engineering under my belt. Unfortunately there's not much call for engineers over here and the US quite rightly looks after its own so I jumped ship onto the IT bandwagon.

[Mr Grimsdale]

...and there was me thinking those Japanese were such nice, quiet and respectful people.

[Mr Grimsdale]

oops!! meant to quote HLMs' last message above

[High Life Man]

Originally posted by Mr Grimsdale
...and there was me thinking those Japanese were such nice, quiet and respectful people.

They're fine people when they're not crashing planes into boats. :D

Good food too!

[GAR]

Originally posted by Mr Grimsdale
...and there was me thinking those Japanese were such nice, quiet and respectful people.

Well, how wrong could one be?

You didn't know they were an island nation of fucking Cunts, devious in all ways and devoid of social responsibility, politeness and compassionate consideration.

Let alone their world-reknown status as non-sympathetic robots lacking emotion and self expression.

You didn't know any different, you only see the "public Japoid face" and not the other social retardation that breeds repressed connotations such as Slasher Manga, mudsports and other freakishness.

I say we nuke all of the Orient. I say we plan it out today and carry thru once and for all or this discussion will carry on for another 300years.

[GAR]

Originally posted by Roy Munson
Holy shit you're a fuckin' weirdo.

How about you shove a pipe cleaner up your ass? How about jumping in front of a bus? How about drinking a bottle of Drano? Do something productive.

"Weido"? You call that WEIRD???

It is not your job to stand in back and caution about "trouble" while consoling our other-site hostess Vonnie with that searing case of Chlamydia you decided to dose out because he was the locomotive in your fuck train with them 12 Filipino bus boys Michael Jackson fucking limo-gulped down Back At The Ranch.

You just keep your ass where I can see it, that'll be YOUR job. And stay the fuck outta the REAL trouble - that's why we have our Bold and Brazen MAIN mods, mmkay?

I'm fine with what Little forum I got stuck there with you, and I just might want to throw some salsa around this joint sometime, so stay lockstep and we'll get along just dandee..

.. and it's none of your fucking business what I intend to use the salsa for.

[ELVIS]

LMAO!

Classic...:D

[GAR]

Well, that Tillman-hater is Toast.

---------------------------------------------------------------

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Date: Wed, 05 May 2004 10:43:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: GAR <gar079@xxx.xxx>
To: rene@student.umass.edu
Subject: Did you really write that shit about Tillman, you fucking
retard?

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[High Life Man]

Love the title of your email GAR.

This moron will be getting punched off barstools for the rest of his life. He better hit the weight room and take some karate classes ASAFP.