Broadband Making Record Labels Irrelevant

[Hardrock69]

06:34PM Monday Oct 08 2007 by Karl

In the minds of two major acts, broadband has made the record label an irrelevant middleman in the effort to get music to consumers. Radiohead this week will independently release their new album "In Rainbows" for whatever fans want to pay for it.

Meanwhile Trent Reznor of Nine Inch Nails today posted this message to his website:


Hello everyone. I've waited a LONG time to be able to make the following announcement: as of right now Nine Inch Nails is a totally free agent, free of any recording contract with any label. I have been under recording contracts for 18 years and have watched the business radically mutate from one thing to something inherently very different and it gives me great pleasure to be able to finally have a direct relationship with the audience as I see fit and appropriate. Look for some announcements in the near future regarding 2008. Exciting times, indeed.



Reznor, annoyed by the high prices retailers were affixing to his albums, recently encouraged fans at a concert to pirate his music until the record industry changed their ways:


Has anyone seen the price come down? Okay, well, you know what that means - STEAL IT. Steal away! Steal and steal and steal some more and give it to all your friends and keep on stealin’. Because one way or another these motherfuckers will get it through their head that they’re ripping people off and that that’s not right.


Reznor has been releasing his music as open source and remixable, the result of which has been the creation of double albums worth of content by fans, subsequently distributed via BitTorrent.


http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Broadband-Making-Record-Labels-Irrelevant-88259

[katie]

http://www.takanoriniida.com/images/news/1025_s1.jpg

It looks like the days of the gold and platinum discs are over then.

I wonder wHat the awards for 1 milion downloads will look like?

[Diamondjimi]

Great quotes. The recording industry is helpless and soon to be nearly realevant anymore. Their greed will be their downfall. Fuck 'em !

WHO FARTED?

[bueno bob]

I have no problem with that. Inside of 5 years, there'll be no record labels left anymore. With as easy to obtain as recording equipment is these days, pretty much anybody can record a good sounding album in their garage and throw it up on myspace and limewire for free. Only thing that leaves is touring expenses, and I know of several bands who make a living doing that on their own anyway without label help. If they sell any copies of their album at all, it's as CDRs they sell at the clubs and bars they play for a buck or two. Easy to market, easy to produce, people don't mind paying a few bucks for them. No record label ever comes into the picture.

Not a bad deal. No wonder the vultures are circling over the labels.

[Hardrock69]

Hell, by selling a cd for 5 bucks, you will still make more money than you would have by getting a major label to sell it for ya.

And then, if you put a single on itunes, and it somehow becomes a smash hit, with 500,000 downloads, you have just made a shitload of money without spending any at all on advertising, radio promotion, etc.

Granted, iTunes gets a piece of the action, but you call the shots, and don't have to deal with any A&R whores trying to tell you they want to hear a single, and that they want you to record some power ballad their faggot boyfriend wrote.

I love this setup....the sorry ass fucking radio conglomerates are also now TOTALLY irrelevant.

Not only that, the Scottish equivalent to the RIAA is going nuts right now....suing anyone who just happens to have a radio on at work, as they claim that if more than one person can hear the radio, it is actually STEALING the fucking song.


It is THIS BULLSHIT that is assisting in the demise of the major labels.

They are slitting their own throats.

I for one, will support the bands I really like by actually buying their product. Heaven & Hell for example.

HOWEVER, as the RIAA is the New Gestapo, I am more likely to advocate downloading major label releases for free, as they (as I have said numerous times) have been fucking the public as well as their own artists in the ass for decades.


Karma is biting them in the ass.

Poor babies will have to sell their summer home in the Hamptons, and get rid of that Maserati.

Waaaaah!!!
:rolleyes:

[Satan]

I just hope when the artists start torrenting the stuff instead of selling CD's, they release the whole fucking songs i.e.WAV files, and not goddamned lossy MP3 or any other such format. Because this Devil will not pay for that shit. Or even trade their souls for it.

[binnie]

Downloading is great, but I'll always prefer actually having a CD and linear notes in my hand.

Just personal preference....

[katie]

In the future there will always be some record labels even if they just look after back catalogue material.

Bands like Radiohead could exist without a major label as they have already got a huge worldwide fan base to sell to.

How did they get this fan base?

A fan base that was built on the teamwork of Radiohead, Record company press office, marketing department, plugging department, A&R, video production + touring etc etc.

As a new band starting out there is nothing wrong with DIY downloads/cdrs, but how are new people going to know that you have released a single if you can't reach them? This is where a promo team is always needed.

In a way the major labels have had it too good for far too long, they should have embraced the download technology from the outset, instead they treated the computer age/internet as a fad and it has proved to be there undoing.

[DrMaddVibe]

How did Franz Zappa Build his fanbase?

He didn't have those jackasses promoting him.

Gimmie a break, now the entire business is promoting?

LMAO!

The internet isn't going anywhere.

[Ellyllions]

Candlebox has been encouraging demanding that fans share their music since I saw them last year. Right along with all of their personal projects: RedLight Music, HiWatts, etc.

I was impressed by their demeanor about it because they're not, nor have they been a major player in the music scene at all.

What's gonna hafta happen for this artist movement to really take off is that the music is really gonna hafta take precedence, while the lure of big, fast money slides.

Artists who have already made their money will be more inclined to go this route. Artists who want the sign-on bonuses won't.

[katie]

Originally posted by DrMaddVibe


The internet isn't going anywhere.

http://www.collecting-tull.com/Albums/LivingInThePast.jpg

[MAPRamone]

Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
How did Franz Zappa Build his fanbase?

He didn't have those jackasses promoting him.

Gimmie a break, now the entire business is promoting?

LMAO!

The internet isn't going anywhere.

Record labels have been parasites for too long, giving artists shitty deals while making tons of cash off of them. That said, i certainly don't think Frank would have liked to see an "everyone can download everything for free" age either. I mean he had a campaign call Beat The Boots, which saw him release boots that were beneath his standards just to take money away from folks who were making money selling unlicensed Zappa/ Mothers Of Invention bootleg stuff. I do like seeing a more direct relationship between artists and fans coming into being. But on the other hand i can't help thinking of the millions of people out there claiming to be big fans of an artist/band yet all the stuff they have from said artist/band is downloaded illegally for free.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

I hate downloading albums...

[Steve Savicki]

Originally posted by katie
I wonder wHat the awards for 1 milion downloads will look like?
LMAO. And someone could tamper with the figures like Diebold Machines.

[Mezro]

Originally posted by katie
I wonder wHat the awards for 1 milion downloads will look like?

A bank statment showing a positive balance in the artists checking account.

Mezro...cash...the final frontier and the only award that matters...

[DirtyDeeds]

Congratulations everybody for jumping onto the trend of killing the music business and fucking our own ears over because you can't be arsed to pay $10 for something that will last you for life. Way to go.

You act like paying for a product is the biggest injustice the world has seen.

[Steve Savicki]

Originally posted by Mezro
Mezro...cash...the final frontier and the only award that matters...
Just give the award to Simon Cowell and all the American Idols who recorded CDs. How are paid songwriters paid... hourly wages?:p
I never knew songwriters wrote for companies... until I heard of Cowell.

[Steve Savicki]

Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
you can't be arsed to pay $10 for something that will last you for life.
Actually, I understand that CDs wear out for the same reason camera flashes destroy museum artwork (which is why museums don't allow cameras in some cases:) the light wears down the (CD) material.

Don't mind paying for http://woundedbird.com/ . The older music is the better material then whatever's being composed/written these days.

[Ellyllions]

Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
Congratulations everybody for jumping onto the trend of killing the music business and fucking our own ears over because you can't be arsed to pay $10 for something that will last you for life. Way to go.

You act like paying for a product is the biggest injustice the world has seen.

What brand of crazy is this mentality?
Buying albums doesn't pay the artist, it only pays the record company. This whole disussion is how the artists are finding ways around the record companies reaping the lump of the cash from the music the artists create.

Duh!

[DirtyDeeds]

I have CDs from the 80s that still work great. Actually... I tend to believe the CDs in the 80s were built better than the ones now. It seems the ones I buy now can have the slightest scratch in them and skip like nuts, and the ones from the 80s have some monster gashes in them and play fine.

Now this issue is one to look into....

[Ellyllions]

Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
Congratulations everybody for jumping onto the trend of killing the music business and fucking our own ears over because you can't be arsed to pay $10 for something that will last you for life. Way to go.

You act like paying for a product is the biggest injustice the world has seen.

What brand of crazy is this mentality?
Buying albums doesn't pay the artist, it only pays the record company. This whole disussion is how the artists are finding ways around the record companies reaping the lump of the cash from the music the artists create.

Duh!

[DirtyDeeds]

Originally posted by Ellyllions
What brand of crazy is this mentality?
Buying albums doesn't pay the artist, it only pays the record company. This whole disussion is how the artists are finding ways around the record companies reaping the lump of the cash from the music the artists create.

Duh!

Record companies to need to be kicked in the butt... they need to sign quality musicians, but besides that I want them around.

OK, an artist releases a fucking lame CD-R directly for $5. They sell a whopping 25 copies. But they get all the profits. Congrats. They go through a record label and make 50 cents a copy but sell a million copies. Guess which is better!

And now that anybody can put any fucking turd out there for sale, we are going to be flooded with shit, and the people who make decent music will play for 10 people in a bar for five years before realizing it's hopeless and they quit music and become accountants (no offense to any accountants out there).

But oh, I'm sorry. I forgot that there is a trend of hatred for anything big these days. It's lame to play any place bigger than the House of Blues. I want to feel "connected to my audience." It's cool and indie to not sell shit and play shitty small venues as all the people dance around waving their cell phones in their skirts with leggings. Big productions with money put into them are so lame.

You know, that's kind of funny because I heard once that you guys like Van Halen.

But that's right... all the music in the world... even the music you didn't pay for... belongs to you. You have a right to it. Fuck those big music companies that made it possible to rock out to Dave and Eddie in arenas and stadiums. Fuck them.

[SparkieD]

Originally posted by DirtyDeeds



But oh, I'm sorry. I forgot that there is a trend of hatred for anything big these days. It's lame to play any place bigger than the House of Blues. I want to feel "connected to my audience." It's cool and indie to not sell shit and play shitty small venues as all the people dance around waving their cell phones in their skirts with leggings. Big productions with money put into them are so lame.


Once upon a time, getting the much coveted major label deal usually meant (unless you were just a tax write-off) that if you produced worthy material, you were going to get backed by that label, not just your disc manufactured and released. Back then, bands like Van Halen could afford to go on arena tours because they had the financial backing of the record label. The labels actually believed in their product and weren't afraid to drop some cash in the form of large advances so these acts could put on a proper show. That's the real reason bands only play small venues now while hiding behind the "it's-just-not-cool-I-wanna-get-closer-to-the-fans" facade:rolleyes: Many of the knitwits with a contract these days would cream their little panties if they could just fill an arena to one quarter it's capacity.



You know, that's kind of funny because I heard once that you guys like Van Halen.

But that's right... all the music in the world... even the music you didn't pay for... belongs to you. You have a right to it. Fuck those big music companies that made it possible to rock out to Dave and Eddie in arenas and stadiums. Fuck them.

The record companies have now found that it just isn't necessary to spend the cash these days because the new flavor of the week is right around the corner. It's a lot easier to cash in on an act who is just so thrilled to have a contract that they will bend over and do whatever the label tells them to, unlike seasoned vets who can do it themselves. Ever heard the old saying "You've got to spend money to make money?" Well, that is still very true today, possibly even more so. Why the fuck do the record companies deserve our money if they aren't going to do the same things they did when everybody was eager to BUY the music? So yeah, for the most part, FUCK THEM!

[Shaun Ponsonby]

As far as I'm concerned...an album is more than just a group of random songs

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Satan
I just hope when the artists start torrenting the stuff instead of selling CD's, they release the whole fucking songs i.e.WAV files, and not goddamned lossy MP3 or any other such format. Because this Devil will not pay for that shit. Or even trade their souls for it.

Some are. Sara McLaughlin (https://www.werkshop.com/sarahmp3/details.jsp?product_id=117) sells her music in the MP3, Apple Lossless, & FLAC formats at her site...




I have no idea where all this is going...

Perhaps we'll see smaller record labels managed by those that are passionate and care about music and the artists such as Righteous Babe Records. But I dunno...

The record labels surely fucked themselves by keeping the price of CDs artificially high, especially on their back catalogue sales for years as production prices plummeted. And I'm talking about right before the MP3 boon of downloading...

I doubt people would have been nearly as zealous at grabbing 5MB files over their 28/56K modems if they could have grabbed the CD for $5. I'm not celebrating the death-knell of the music industry, though few industries are historically scummier. But they need to get off their asses and high horses and stop relying on dated technologies and trying to sue their profits back, and produce audio visual products that people will actually pay for rather than expecting people to re-buy their audio collections several times over, which is what really gave them the enormous boon-time profits in the 1980s...

[DrMaddVibe]

Originally posted by Shaun Ponsonby
As far as I'm concerned...an album is more than just a group of random songs


For most of what sells that is long gone.


I know what you mean, but when you really take a look at what artists are putting out...you won't even hear the random song.


Take Cheap Trick with "Rockford"...that got no play and now with The Cult "Born Into This"...zip, zilch, nada. It's prolly their best work since "Sonic Temple".


The labels are more interested in putting teardrop tattoos and crunk on people then pushing established acts on the air.


Their entire business model is flawed and has been for a LONG time. They got fat off of us re-buying our stuff on cd's and somehow thought that gravy train would last forever.


Paying middle management jagoff's to sit around and dream up tomorrow's next big flavor without putting anything into acts already signed shows that they just want the money.


Artists would be very wise to look at what Prince started and move in that direction.


Holding on to yesterday doesn't make the radio or MTV any better to listen to today.

[MERRYKISSMASS2U]

All I have to say is viva la torrent.

Even though I don't like Radiohead, I support them and respect them for doing what they did with In Rainbows.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
For most of what sells that is long gone.

I know what you mean, but when you really take a look at what artists are putting out...you won't even hear the random song.

Take Cheap Trick with "Rockford"...that got no play and now with The Cult "Born Into This"...zip, zilch, nada. It's prolly their best work since "Sonic Temple".

The labels are more interested in putting teardrop tattoos and crunk on people then pushing established acts on the air.

Their entire business model is flawed and has been for a LONG time. They got fat off of us re-buying our stuff on cd's and somehow thought that gravy train would last forever.

Paying middle management jagoff's to sit around and dream up tomorrow's next big flavor without putting anything into acts already signed shows that they just want the money.

Artists would be very wise to look at what Prince started and move in that direction.

Holding on to yesterday doesn't make the radio or MTV any better to listen to today.

I know exactly what you mean...and the labels are real twats...and the ones who aren't go out of business (the only solution is that every artist oin the world signs to Sanctuary...I can't think of one artist who has a bad word to say about it).

And legal downloading has done a lot for artists. But...then there's illegal downloading which doesn't give a penny to the artists and the majority of the music-listening population does it. Also, when you do this, the chances are that if you download a whole album, you'll probably accidentally put a couple of tracks the wrong way round...and you can't do that with some albums. I mean, "Tommy" hardly makes sense as it is, switch a couple of the tracks around and you'll be even more clueless.

I'm just not looking forward to losing well-constructed albums with artwork.

You know what else will be lost? Box sets. I love a good box set...I love reading through the booklets you get with them...most have rare photos, essays, new interviews etc...you can't download that.

[MERRYKISSMASS2U]

Originally posted by Shaun Ponsonby

Also, when you do this, the chances are that if you download a whole album, you'll probably accidentally put a couple of tracks the wrong way round...and you can't do that with some albums.



Um.... no. A high quality download will have art, be titled, have ID3 tags, and have an m3u file (playlist file) accompanying it.



Originally posted by Shaun Ponsonby
you can't download that.


Yes you can ;)

I sure do try.

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Originally posted by MERRYKISSMASS2U
Um.... no. A high quality download will have art, be titled, have ID3 tags, and have an m3u file (playlist file) accompanying it.



You'll be surprised how few people do that and how many do it illegally. I don't know anybody who uses legal downloads...they all use Limewire and Kazza and whatever else...More people use that stuff rather than the official downloads.

[binnie]

In my eyes, downloading will never be able to replace the feel I get on having a CD in my hand, the linear notes to read and the artwork to look at. We are losing the materiality of listening to music.

Yes, I am a geek. But it makes me happy :)

I have over 1000 CDs and counting (that's what you get for working in a record store for seven years...)

[Shaun Ponsonby]

Exactly...I'm much happier with a wall of CDs and LPs than computer with random songs on it...it looks better.

[Hardrock69]

Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
Congratulations everybody for jumping onto the trend of killing the music business and fucking our own ears over because you can't be arsed to pay $10 for something that will last you for life. Way to go.

You act like paying for a product is the biggest injustice the world has seen.


Bullshit.

MY opinion is that the record labels should stop fucking the public as well as THEIR OWN ARTISTS in the ass.

I am not in favor of illegally downloading officially released music. That DOES hurt the artist. In a small way. It hurts their record label even more.

Why?

Because the label stands to make more money than their artist. So if they get fucked over, it is a bigger loss to them financially.

Sure it hurts the artist if the label goes bankrupt or takes a heavy hit, but if they had been giving their artist a square deal, the artist would be taking it on the chin instead of the label.

I do not like to see artists lose revenue, but I do like to see the Corporate Asswipes getting fucked over after fucking everyone else over for the past 70 years.
:rolleyes:

Karma will bite them in the ass.

If the labels had been selling records, cds, etc. for a fair price, and giving their artists a fair piece of the pie, then I would not be so harsh on them.

But no. They are getting what they deserve.

Oh and I also prefer to have cds with cover art, etc. that are provided by the record labels.

In fact, I am disappointed in the demise of LPs, as the cover art for a CD is not nearly as impressive as cover art was for vinyl.

[Hardrock69]

Originally posted by Steve Savicki
Just give the award to Simon Cowell and all the American Idols who recorded CDs. How are paid songwriters paid... hourly wages?:p
I never knew songwriters wrote for companies... until I heard of Cowell.

Staff songwriters are not paid a real salary. They are paid weekly advances on future royalties.

My sister was signed to Acuff-Rose (the largest Country music publisher) for 6 years. She wound up owing them about $95,000, though that was not the total of her advances. She brought in enough revenue with her cuts to pay back some of the advances.

[Hardrock69]

Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
Record companies to need to be kicked in the butt... they need to sign quality musicians, but besides that I want them around.

OK, an artist releases a fucking lame CD-R directly for $5. They sell a whopping 25 copies. But they get all the profits. Congrats. They go through a record label and make 50 cents a copy but sell a million copies. Guess which is better!

Financially it is obvious.

But if it is a piece of shit album, and the label knowingly signs them and sells the crap to the public, then on an artistic level it cannot be seen as 'better'.

They are just masters at promotion and marketing.


Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
And now that anybody can put any fucking turd out there for sale, we are going to be flooded with shit, and the people who make decent music will play for 10 people in a bar for five years before realizing it's hopeless and they quit music and become accountants (no offense to any accountants out there).

When is that new? That has been a fact of life for musicians everywhere ever since the advent of recorded music! Even Jimi Hendrix said in an interview once that you can find the most amazing musicians playing in shit-hole dives while people with less talent are making millions.


Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
But oh, I'm sorry. I forgot that there is a trend of hatred for anything big these days. It's lame to play any place bigger than the House of Blues. I want to feel "connected to my audience." It's cool and indie to not sell shit and play shitty small venues as all the people dance around waving their cell phones in their skirts with leggings. Big productions with money put into them are so lame.

Again, that is nothing new. Why was it the punk revolution happened in the late 70s?

And don't lay the blame for such a thing at our feet.

Complain all you want about it, but I doubt anyone here has said anything about hating an act solely because it is successful.
:rolleyes:




Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
You know, that's kind of funny because I heard once that you guys like Van Halen.


Any you don't? Why are you even here then?


Originally posted by DirtyDeeds
But that's right... all the music in the world... even the music you didn't pay for... belongs to you. You have a right to it. Fuck those big music companies that made it possible to rock out to Dave and Eddie in arenas and stadiums. Fuck them.


So you are in favor of record labels stealing from everyone? Even their own artists?

You must be sucking the Music Industry Corporate Cock in some way then.

Well, when you are done sucking it, turn around so they can ass-rape you some more. They are expert at it.
:rolleyes:

[Hardrock69]

Report: Universal prepping revolutionary free music service

By Nate Anderson | Published: October 12, 2007 - 12:18PM CT

Universal has a plan to change the music download business: give people free, unlimited music subscriptions with the purchase of portable devices.

Universal boss Doug Morris is trying to launch a new, label-owned subscription service called Total Music, according to BusinessWeek. I know, I know... but stifle the groans long enough to hear this idea out, because it could be killer.

Given 1) the content industry's past attempts at creating compelling download services and 2) the general lack of forward-thinkingness among major labels, many observers might be shocked to find truly innovative ideas emanating from their boardrooms. Morris' plan could certainly be a game-changer, though. He wants to wrest control away from Apple and from iTunes by launching Total Music, which will provide subscription music at no charge to the consumer. It will also emphasize other devices, such as the Zune, in order to help break Apple's chokehold on the market.

According to BusinessWeek, the plan is to have companies subsidize the cost of the subscriptions, estimated at five bucks a month. Wireless carriers could offer unlimited music on their cell phones, for instance, and simply build the cost into the monthly fee. Hardware makers who sell "Total Music"-branded devices could build the cost into the price. To consumers, the devices all appear to come with unlimited free (and legal) music from the biggest acts in the business.

What about DRM? This remains unclear, but if the labels are already assured of getting their revenue through hardware sales, their DRM anxiety might fade. Universal is already experimenting with DRM-free MP3 downloads at stores like Amazon, so it's certainly possible.

Still, the last bastion of DRM holdouts has been subscription services, which argue that they need DRM to prevent consumers from subscribing for a month, downloading a bajillion songs, then canceling the service and keeping the music. The Total Music model could change that, but we're skeptical.

Our take: to be truly revolutionary, Morris and company need to drop the DRM and open the service up to anyone. A continuing roster of new albums should keep the subscription revenue flowing in, as will Total Music hardware purchases. Dropping DRM also allows the company to work with the iPod, the Zune, the Sansa, and the Zen lines without any hassles or even the permission of the vendors. It's risky, sure, but only if you don't think that all this music is freely available already on P2P networks.

It's unclear if Total Music will allow consumers who don't buy the devices to subscribe to the service. We hope that it will, though, and a $5-a-month service from the three biggest labels in the world could appeal to plenty of folks (though DRMed subscription services have largely failed to take off, in large part because they don't work with the iPod).

Such a move could explode the current model for acquiring music, it could bring a good chunk of the P2P crowd in from the cold, and it would generate massive goodwill toward the labels (and how often do you see that?).

In any event, even a more limited service that offers access only to buyers of Total Music-branded devices remains interesting. No official announcements have yet been made, but this is definitely one we'll keep our eyes (and ears) on.


http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20071012-universal-prepping-free-subscription-service.html