Social Security

[Redballjets88]

Does anyone know what Obama plans on doing about Social Security? This used to be a big topic prior to the economic collapse.

I'm tired of getting my paychecks and seeing money I made go to a program I'll never see the benefit of.

[LoungeMachine]

You want you info from here?

Google: Obama. Social Security. Plan


http://www.barackobama.com/issues/seniors/

And you can get the info RIGHT FROM THE SOURCE

:rolleyes:

:gulp:


Idea for a better thread:

Here is Obama's SS plan, and here is why I agree/disagree/still have some questions about it

:cool:

[FORD]

President Obama and Vice President Biden are committed to ensuring Social Security is solvent and viable for the American people, now and in the future. Obama and Biden will be honest with the American people about the long-term solvency of Social Security and the ways we can address the shortfall. They will protect Social Security benefits for current and future beneficiaries alike, and they do not believe it is necessary or fair to hardworking seniors to raise the retirement age. Obama and Biden are strongly opposed to privatizing Social Security. As part of a bipartisan plan that would be phased in over many years, they will ask those making over $250,000 to contribute a bit more to Social Security to keep it sound. Obama does not support uncapping the full payroll tax 12.4 percent rate. Instead, he and Joe Biden are considering plans that will ask those making over $250,000 to pay in the range of 2 to 4 percent more in total (combined employer and employee).

More on this at http://www.whitehouse.gov/agenda/seniors_and_social_security/

[Redballjets88]

you are really on your game today guy. but will do.

[LoungeMachine]

I'm tired of getting my paychecks and seeing money I made go to a program I'll never see the benefit of.

Then vote for people who want to STRENGTHEN SS, not PRIVATIZE IT.

SS could be made solvent for YOUR CHILDREN by simply raising the cut off rate for the tax.

Why shouldn't people making over $110K continue to fund the program?

Or better yet, have the "donut", wherein there is no SS payroll tax from $110K - $250K, but people making over 1/4 million a year pay into the program.


But no, I suppose it's easier to bitch about seniors getting a check every month.

:gulp:

[Redballjets88]

Seems like raising the age and the taxes might just even it out. Not to mention the growing number of non-senior citizens using social security. But shit it will be sometime before I'll know whether or not I will receive my benefits. But then again if I get a teaching job then I won't need it.

[TongueNGroove]

President Obama and Vice President Biden are committed to ensuring Social Security is solvent and viable for the American people, now and in the future. Obama and Biden will be honest with the American people about the long-term solvency of Social Security and the ways we can address the shortfall. They will protect Social Security benefits for current and future beneficiaries alike, and they do not believe it is necessary or fair to hardworking seniors to raise the retirement age. Obama and Biden are strongly opposed to privatizing Social Security. As part of a bipartisan plan that would be phased in over many years, they will ask those making over $250,000 to contribute a bit more to Social Security to keep it sound. Obama does not support uncapping the full payroll tax 12.4 percent rate. Instead, he and Joe Biden are considering plans that will ask those making over $250,000 to pay in the range of 2 to 4 percent more in total (combined employer and employee).

More on this at http://www.whitehouse.gov/agenda/seniors_and_social_security/

In other words, forget about trying to get well off in America. Why bother? Work your ass off, start a business then the government takes most of it and gives it to those who don't have the gumption you have.

Ugh, man I dispise socialism.

[Redballjets88]

Then vote for people who want to STRENGTHEN SS, not PRIVATIZE IT.

SS could be made solvent for YOUR CHILDREN by simply raising the cut off rate for the tax.

Why shouldn't people making over $110K continue to fund the program?

Or better yet, have the "donut", wherein there is no SS payroll tax from $110K - $250K, but people making over 1/4 million a year pay into the program.


But no, I suppose it's easier to bitch about seniors getting a check every month.

:gulp:

I wasn't bitching about old people being able to live. How about the years of mishandling of the program? Or the people who could work but choose to live off of social security checks instead? I'll bitch about that.

[Figs]

How about freedom of choice instead of a mandatory low return retirement plan? Well the government knows best I guess.

[LoungeMachine]

No, THE STOCK MARKET KNOWS BEST

:lol:

Is someone KEEPING you from investing in an IRA?

You HAVE freedom.

Is the SS payroll tax you pay keeping you from that new Lexus?

:gulp:

[LoungeMachine]

I wasn't bitching about old people being able to live. How about the years of mishandling of the program? Or the people who could work but choose to live off of social security checks instead? I'll bitch about that.

What mishandling?

Specifics, please.

Most succesful program in history.

Name one better.

:gulp:

[Redballjets88]

What mishandling?

Specifics, please.

Most succesful program in history.

Name one better.

:gulp:

Well if it was so great why is it running dry? Why are multitudes of people wanting to privatize?

Really they should have just kept it to the old-aged, maybe the disabled, and created other services for all the other ways to obtain ss checks. It is stretched beyond its capability, and thats why it is running out.

I would say veterans insurance is better, albeit a smaller scaled program.

[Sarge]

I don't think it's an issue anymore. You have to have a job before you worry about contributing into social security. Thus.. people are worried about keeping their jobs or finding work.
Let's all WORK UNTIL WE DIE!

Breasts,
Sarge

[LoungeMachine]

Well if it was so great why is it running dry?




I really wish you'd do your own thinking sometimes...

When SS was implemented, there were like 40 people paying in, for every person receiving funds

Now, due to baby boomers retiring, and the life span improving, it's more like 3 to 1

Get it?




Why are multitudes of people wanting to privatize?






Republican GREED, stupid.

Turn SS over to the stock market, and it becomes a GAMBLE with corporations taking massive profits regardless of the market going up or down.

It's the VIG paid to the bookie.




Jesus, kid.

:gulp:

[FORD]

Sad but true, Sarge.

Gone are the days when you could get a job and count on being there for 30 years or so and walking away with a decent retirement at 65.

[Redballjets88]

No, THE STOCK MARKET KNOWS BEST

:lol:

Is someone KEEPING you from investing in an IRA?

You HAVE freedom.

Is the SS payroll tax you pay keeping you from that new Lexus?

:gulp:

Hey some people like to have there cake and eat it too. Not work to get that "cake" then get a crumbs worth of what they put in when they turn 65.

[LoungeMachine]

I don't think it's an issue anymore. You have to have a job before you worry about contributing into social security. Thus.. people are worried about keeping their jobs or finding work.
Let's all WORK UNTIL WE DIE!

Breasts,
Sarge


People USED to be able to count on a PENSION, too...

But the RIGHT has pretty much taken care of THAT too.

The Middle Class is dying in this country, and it has always been the lifeblood of this country.

:gulp:

[Redballjets88]

I really wish you'd do your own thinking sometimes...

When SS was implemented, there were like 40 people paying in, for every person receiving funds

Now, due to baby boomers retiring, and the life span improving, it's more like 3 to 1

Get it?






Republican GREED, stupid.

Turn SS over to the stock market, and it becomes a GAMBLE with corporations taking massive profits regardless of the market going up or down.

It's the VIG paid to the bookie.




Jesus, kid.

:gulp:

Why is it greedy to want to keep what is yours?

[FORD]

In other words, forget about trying to get well off in America. Why bother? Work your ass off, start a business then the government takes most of it and gives it to those who don't have the gumption you have.

Ugh, man I dispise socialism.

Socialism? You mean like bailing out Shttibank so they can continue to fund Saudi Arabia with usury rate interest stolen from their customers?

[LoungeMachine]

Hey some people like to have there cake and eat it too. Not work to get that "cake" then get a crumbs worth of what they put in when they turn 65.

???

Again, you have no clue what you're talking about.

Most people take OUT more than they ever put into SS.

Unless they die first.

You want to put it into the hands of the people wqho brought us ENRON?????

There are people who put $300K into their retirement funds for that company, only to end up with $200.00

But you're worried about SS???

please

:rolleyes:

[Nickdfresh]

In other words, forget about trying to get well off in America. Why bother? Work your ass off, start a business then the government takes most of it and gives it to those who don't have the gumption you have.

Ugh, man I dispise socialism.

My goodness, what a shitty country America is.

Who are these fuckers that want us to pay for things like basic infrastructure, social services and security? We should just borrow to fund the 50% of the world's defense spending annually we fund and let our pissant grandkids pay it off!

[LoungeMachine]

In other words, forget about trying to get well off in America. Why bother? Work your ass off, start a business then the government takes most of it and gives it to those who don't have the gumption you have.

Ugh, man I dispise socialism.

Most?

Really?

Got any proof, or is this more of your famous EXAGGERATIONS you like to post in here.

:rolleyes:

You think SS goes to the lazy?

Are your grandparents lazy?

Hypocrite.

:gulp:

[Redballjets88]

???

Again, you have no clue what you're talking about.

Most people take OUT more than they ever put into SS.

Unless they die first.

You want to put it into the hands of the people wqho brought us ENRON?????

There are people who put $300K into their retirement funds for that company, only to end up with $200.00

But you're worried about SS???

please

:rolleyes:

Since when is every big company Enron?

If everyone got to choose what to do with the money they earned wouldn't it be nice? Why are you so gung-ho about the government having your money at their disposal?

[Nickdfresh]

Well if it was so great why is it running dry? Why are multitudes of people wanting to privatize?
...

Um, the UK "privatized" their equivalent of SS, and most people think of it's worked about as well as being ass-fucked to death...

[Figs]

Take out more than they put in...guess you never heard of the the time value of money.

[LoungeMachine]

Ugh, man I dispise socialism.

Yet you drive on raods WE paid for....

Use the military WE paid for.....

Use the fire and police WE pay for.....


And then you vote for an adminsitration that gave away A TRILLION DOLLARS PLUS TO CORPORATE WELFARE.

But grandma can eat cat food.

fucking pathetic.

:gulp:

[LoungeMachine]

Take out more than they put in...guess you never heard of the the time value of money.

LMAO

Feel free to post links proving me wrong.

:gulp:

[Ally_Kat]

No, THE STOCK MARKET KNOWS BEST

:lol:

Is someone KEEPING you from investing in an IRA?

You HAVE freedom.

Is the SS payroll tax you pay keeping you from that new Lexus?

:gulp:



I'm tired of getting my paychecks and seeing money I made go to a program I'll never see the benefit of.

Do you even need that Lexus? Don't run off to buy a new car after you finish paying off your car loan.

You can't rely on Social Security anymore. It's not even going to be a drop in the bucket when it comes to my time. I got my personal Roth IRA, I got my IRA with work, my pension with work, and the added money I pay into my pension. I may not be flying around the world, driving a BMW/Lexus/Audi, or planning a wedding overseas like the other NYC teachers, but I'm more prepared than a lot of them close to retirement age.

A little sacrifice goes a long way when you're young. Unfortunately, a lot of Americans don't educate themselves about money and banking, and even more don't look into retirement options until they're getting close to 40. Never too early to start.

[Figs]

LMAO

Feel free to post links proving me wrong.

:gulp:


OK you got me, $100 out of your check in 1990 is worth as much as $100 you'll get back in 2020.

[Nickdfresh]

Do you even need that Lexus? Don't run off to buy a new car after you finish paying off your car loan.

...

And for fuck's sake, don't even think about buying another car if you have an existing loan!

:cato::drive::spank:

[LoungeMachine]

OK you got me, $100 out of your check in 1990 is worth as much as $100 you'll get back in 2020.

Where did I say that?

Great debate technique.... The Strawman Argument.

Never saw that coming......

:gulp:

[Redballjets88]

Do you even need that Lexus? Don't run off to buy a new car after you finish paying off your car loan.

You can't rely on Social Security anymore. It's not even going to be a drop in the bucket when it comes to my time. I got my personal Roth IRA, I got my IRA with work, my pension with work, and the added money I pay into my pension. I may not be flying around the world, driving a BMW/Lexus/Audi, or planning a wedding overseas like the other NYC teachers, but I'm more prepared than a lot of them close to retirement age.

A little sacrifice goes a long way when you're young. Unfortunately, a lot of Americans don't educate themselves about money and banking, and even more don't look into retirement options until they're getting close to 40. Never too early to start.

I don't own a lexus, and I probably never will. But people buy them, Lexus shouldn't be condemned for making a nicer car, should they?

And I'm with you, plus I plan on teaching anyway, so social security may not even be in my future. How is that teachers retirement working out for ya? I have never looked into whether or not teacher prefer it to ss.

[Figs]

"Most people take OUT more than they ever put into SS."

[Ally_Kat]

I don't own a lexus, and I probably never will. But people buy them, Lexus shouldn't be condemned for making a nicer car, should they?

And I'm with you, plus I plan on teaching anyway, so social security may not even be in my future. How is that teachers retirement working out for ya? I have never looked into whether or not teacher prefer it to ss.

I wasn't saying you did and I wasn't mocking them for making a luxury vehicle. I was playing off of Lounge's post to show that we don't need to buy luxury items all the time. Unfortunately a lot of people go for stuff they can't afford. Our society feels entitled, likes brand names and the best of the best. That's how we got into this whole mortgage/bank/lender crisis to begin with, especially when the lenders bent backwards to accommodate.

I can't really help you out on the teacher's pension. Pension and pay varies state-to-state. Hell, my pension and pay is different than teachers out on Long Island. So unless you're planning to be a NYC teacher in the DOE or a charter school within the UFT, I can't help ya.

[Redballjets88]

I wasn't saying you did and I wasn't mocking them for making a luxury vehicle. I was playing off of Lounge's post to show that we don't need to buy luxury items all the time. Unfortunately a lot of people go for stuff they can't afford. Our society feels entitled, likes brand names and the best of the best. That's how we got into this whole mortgage/bank/lender crisis to begin with, especially when the lenders bent backwards to accommodate.

I can't really help you out on the teacher's pension. Pension and pay varies state-to-state. Hell, my pension and pay is different than teachers out on Long Island. So unless you're planning to be a NYC teacher in the DOE or a charter school within the UFT, I can't help ya.

Yeah, no one wants to live within their means. Not only is that evident within the mortgage crisis, but also in the fact that credit card debt continues to rise.

Yeah I figured the state to state thing would make a large difference. Hopefully Texas has a good handle on it.

[LoungeMachine]

"Most people take OUT more than they ever put into SS."

Yep.

:gulp:

[LoungeMachine]

Yeah, no one wants to live within their means. .

Certainly not the people you voted into office, and supported in here the last few years....

Grew and spent the Government into Chaos.

All on OUR credit card.


:gulp:

[Ally_Kat]

Yeah, no one wants to live within their means. Not only is that evident within the mortgage crisis, but also in the fact that credit card debt continues to rise.

Um...yeah, that's what I said... :confused:



Yeah I figured the state to state thing would make a large difference. Hopefully Texas has a good handle on it.

You can read it online. All the info and forms for payscale, benefits, and pension are in the open for all to read. Online. I suggest the Googles.

[LoungeMachine]

YES!!!!

BlueBallJets !!! GOOGLES

:gulp:

[FORD]

I don't own a lexus, and I probably never will. But people buy them, Lexus shouldn't be condemned for making a nicer car, should they?



No, only for making them in non-union red states.

[Redballjets88]

Um...yeah, that's what I said... :confused:



You can read it online. All the info and forms for payscale, benefits, and pension are in the open for all to read. Online. I suggest the Googles.

I was agreeing then adding on the credit card debt part.

[GAR]

President Obama and Vice President Biden will borrow heavily, as they are doing now $850 billion and with up to $4 trillion of more debt in the future, ensuring Social Security is solvent and viable for the American people, now and in their future administrative insolvency crises.

More on this at http://www.whitehouse.gov/agenda/seniors_and_social_security/

Whew! Obama's on the JOB he dah man! :xmas:

[Redballjets88]

No, only for making them in non-union red states.

You can still make a living without being a part of a union. People do it all the time here. But I guess it makes sense to grossly over pay people doing highly specific jobs that could be done by one person.

Here we make up for it by having lower taxes and responsible spending.

[LoungeMachine]

And high poverty rates, high abortion rates, high illegal immigrant hirings, and low education test scores.....

Go Texas!!!!

:gulp:

[Redballjets88]

You're fine with abortion so that point is null in my mind.

Its hard not to hire a lot of illegals when you have millions of them. You probably rarely come across an illegal.

And none of what you said made a shit of difference when it comes to the fact that we are fine without having unions run our businesses. In fact we are doing better economically that most anywhere else in the country.

[hideyoursheep]

Go Texas!!!!

:gulp:

Suck 'Em.:)

[LoungeMachine]

You're fine with abortion so that point is null in my mind.





Where have I said that? Stop lying.




Its hard not to hire a lot of illegals when you have millions of them. .

So you're FINE with Texas employers breaking the law out of laziness???




. In fact we are doing better economically that most anywhere else in the country.

Really? Show me.

But then again it's pretty easy to LOOK profitable when you're using ILLEGAL workers to do your work for you, instead of HAVING TO PAY AMERICANS

:heyfu:

[hideyoursheep]

You're fine with abortion so that point is null in my mind.

Its hard not to hire a lot of illegals when you have millions of them. You probably rarely come across an illegal.

And none of what you said made a shit of difference when it comes to the fact that we are fine without having unions run our businesses. In fact we are doing better economically that most anywhere else in the country.


**cough-cough**

U.S. Puts Onus On Employers Of Immigrants

By JULIA PRESTON
Published: July 31, 2006
Immigration agents had prepared a nasty surprise for the Garcia Labor Company, a temporary worker contractor, when they moved against it on charges of hiring illegal immigrants. They brought a 40-count federal indictment, part of a new nationwide strategy by immigration officials to clamp down on employers of illegal immigrant laborers.

Maximino Garcia, the president of the company, which provides low-wage laborers to businesses from Pennsylvania to Texas, stood before a federal judge here on Tuesday to answer conspiracy charges of aiding illegal immigrants and money laundering. If convicted, Mr. Garcia, who pleaded not guilty, could serve 20 years in jail and forfeit his headquarters building and $12 million.
Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents said they homed in on Garcia Labor because of a contract it had with ABX Air, a cargo airline that flies express shipments for DHL, with a fleet of 112 airplanes based at its privately owned airport in Wilmington, Ohio. From 1999 to 2005, the indictment charges, Garcia Labor sent more than 1,000 illegal immigrants, mostly Mexicans, to sort freight at ABX Air


Ohio town devastated by layoffs by German firm DHL
Tue Nov 11, 2008

WILMINGTON, Ohio (Reuters) - Scott Terry is one of 7,000 who work in the small Ohio town of Wilmington who just found out he's lost his job, and he's scrambling to figure out how his family will survive.

In every corner of Wilmington, home to the soon-to-close distribution hub of German shipping company DHL Express, townspeople are asking the same question.

"It's devastating for me and my family," said Terry, 41, who has spent the last 18 years in a job he loved at DHL's main air cargo carrier, ABX Air. "Everyone I worked with pretty much planned on retiring from there years from now. It's going to devastate Wilmington, the whole county."


The loss of 7,000 jobs from Wilmington, a town of just 12,000 set amid the rolling farmland of Ohio's southwest, has has scared a lot of people.

The economic base of the town and its surrounding area has suddenly disappeared, just as the nation teeters into recession -- making Wilmington the poster child for small towns across America facing the kind of economic crisis not seen since the Great Depression.



Since I live here, ask me anything you want.

[Redballjets88]

Texas is less effected than the majority of the U.S. in these economic times...

http://www.dallasfed.org/news/releases/2008/nr081224.cfm

And there are a lot of jobs still here, though the numbers are closing in.

5.6 unemployment rate here, as compared to the 6.5 U.S. average.

There are only 3 areas in the state where unemployment are above the national average

http://www.bls.gov/web/mmartcr1.gif

here is a national map or unemployment

Looks like we can hire legal workers and illegals and still do better than most places.

[hideyoursheep]

here is a national map or unemployment

Looks like we can hire legal workers and illegals and still do better than most places.

You'd better read my last post....

[Redballjets88]

You'd better read my last post....


Ok, they arrested a guy who was bringing in illegals, and they are cracking down. This kind of stuff happens a lot. Deporting 7,000 illegals here wouldn't even be a noticeable difference. We have millions, and the ones who get deported come back with ease.

And if they started to shut down every business that had illegal workers here it would destroy business. No more houses built, no more food services, no more hotel services. Shit without illegal work we wouldn't have enough people to work.

[hideyoursheep]

Ok, they arrested a guy who was bringing in illegals, and they are cracking down. This kind of stuff happens a lot. Deporting 7,000 illegals here wouldn't even be a noticeable difference. We have millions, and the ones who get deported come back with ease.

And if they started to shut down every business that had illegal workers here it would destroy business. No more houses built, no more food services, no more hotel services. Shit without illegal work we wouldn't have enough people to work.

:rolleyes:


You've managed to totally miss the point.


Or evade it.

[Redballjets88]

Then what is the point? I understand, it ruined a town. I doubt anyone here hears about this guy.

[hideyoursheep]

First of all, it didn't "ruin" a town.

That's some sensationalistic journalism.

Out of all the people who live here, not that damn many actually WORKED there.

Many, like myself, work outside of it.

The point is, whenever big business can get over, it will. When the free ride is over, like for DHL, they take their toys and go somewhere else.

It can happen anywhere, at any time, whenever illegals are used as the primary source of labor for cheap bastards like DHL.

They got a sweet deal from the county for buying ABX, and they totally fucked them on it.

[Ally_Kat]

I was agreeing then adding on the credit card debt part.

Which was redundant because credit card companies are lenders.

[Big Train]

Social Security you should be able to opt out from.

The amount of money it will pay me won't be enough, but I have enough by myself to not need it.

1. Why should I take from the system what I don't need?
2. By the same token, if I don't take, why should I pay in?

Voluntary opt-outs (signed waiver of benefits), letting me keep that money would be much more useful all around. If you wanted to be more militant, force anyone making over a certain amount a year for a certain amount of years ineligible and don't tax them for it.

Then you would have a system that is far more just.

[Redballjets88]

Which was redundant because credit card companies are lenders.

Sorry for agreeing with a valid point you made?

[Blackflag]

Yet you drive on raods WE paid for....

Use the military WE paid for.....

Use the fire and police WE pay for.....


I know you see the difference between saying 'let's all chip in $100 so we can have a fire department' ...and transferring funds from one individual to another individual. Then you accused others of "The Strawman Argument?" :rolleyes:

[Blackflag]

Social Security you should be able to opt out from.

That's the best idea I've heard so far.

Yet, the whole system relies on one person working harder than another person...then letting the slacker ride the other's coattails. Is it any wonder that it's failed?

[hideyoursheep]

That's the best idea I've heard so far.

Yet, the whole system relies on one person working harder than another person...then letting the slacker ride the other's coattails. Is it any wonder that it's failed?


:rolleyes:

Yeah...you're really working overtime tonight, eh?

:rolleyes:

[Nickdfresh]

Social Security you should be able to opt out from.

The amount of money it will pay me won't be enough, but I have enough by myself to not need it.

1. Why should I take from the system what I don't need?
2. By the same token, if I don't take, why should I pay in?

Voluntary opt-outs (signed waiver of benefits), letting me keep that money would be much more useful all around. If you wanted to be more militant, force anyone making over a certain amount a year for a certain amount of years ineligible and don't tax them for it.

Then you would have a system that is far more just.

Why? So those with money have a guaranteed retirement while the system flounders for anyone else?

[Nickdfresh]

That's the best idea I've heard so far.

Yet, the whole system relies on one person working harder than another person...then letting the slacker ride the other's coattails. Is it any wonder that it's failed?


Yeah, you fucking cripples who can no longer work, get off our coattails!

[Redballjets88]

Why? So those with money have a guaranteed retirement while the system flounders for anyone else?

As opposed to those with money paying for everyone else to retire? Yes.

[TongueNGroove]

Most?

Really?

Got any proof, or is this more of your famous EXAGGERATIONS you like to post in here.

:rolleyes:

You think SS goes to the lazy?

Are your grandparents lazy?

Hypocrite.

:gulp:

Apparently you have never run your own business. You do realise that your employer pays half of your SS and Medicare taxes right? Well if you are self employed (Run your own business) you pay all of it. That's 15% of everything you make right off the top. Then add in federal income tax and local income tax and YES that is MOST of it. 15%+33%+6% = 54%!

And on top of that you have to pay SALES tax on every dollar you spend. So yah, more than half of everything I make goes to taxes. We won't even go into death tax and capital gains tax and corporate and small business taxes.

Now it is about to get even worse....I feel a hankering to throw some tea bags into some bay.

[Nickdfresh]

As opposed to those with money paying for everyone else to retire? Yes.

Yeah, let's go back to the days of little old ladies eating dog food.

Dude, spare me the social Darwinist bullshit argument...

I have a better idea! Why don't we set up a system where you can earn as much money as you can in your lifetime. But, when you die, there is only a small fraction of the fortune's inheritance allowed to your children and the rest goes back to the gov't to fund education, reduce taxes to next to nothing, etc.

That would be FAIR! That would be the ultimate "fair!" A true meritocracy!

[Redballjets88]

Yeah, let's go back to the days of little old ladies eating dog food.

Dude, spare me the social Darwinist bullshit argument...

I have a better idea! Why don't we set up a system where you can earn as much money as you can in your lifetime. But, when you die, there is only a small fraction of the fortune's inheritance allowed to your children and the rest goes back to the gov't to fund education, reduce taxes to next to nothing, etc.

That would be FAIR! That would be the ultimate "fair!"

So the rich would no longer be allowed to leave all their money to their heirs?

So John Doe goes out works hard his whole life ends up being rich and then the government gives it away?

Not for me.

[Nickdfresh]

So the rich would no longer be allowed to leave all their money to their heirs?

They could leave a small something, say a couple of million...


So John Doe goes out works hard his whole life ends up being rich and then the government gives it away?

Not for me.

What does he need it for? He's dead!

Why should his spoiled little shits have to do nothing and live a life of leisure? The never earned anything. I'm not saying all rich kids necessarily do lead lives of Paris Hilton shittiness, but seriously, spare me the whole argument that the working poor are all lazy and don't deserve shit at the end of their lives...

What happened in this country was a fucking embarrassment before the Great Depression. If you got hurt at work, you were given a cheap watch, a few bucks, and told to fuckyourself and your family and people were destroyed not that long ago.

Also, SS is a reinvestment in the economy, since people spend those checks in stores. In fact, like the extension of unemployment insurance, it's one of the best "bang for the bucks" and far more efficient than "tax breaks" at stimulating consumer spending...

[hideyoursheep]

As opposed to those with money paying for everyone else to retire? Yes.

So fuck the blind, then?

[Redballjets88]

So fuck the blind, then?

No I'm fine with the blind receiving benefits.

But fuck you.

[hideyoursheep]

Apparently you have never run your own business. You do realise that your employer pays half of your SS and Medicare taxes right? Well if you are self employed (Run your own business) you pay all of it. That's 15% of everything you make right off the top. Then add in federal income tax and local income tax and YES that is MOST of it. 15%+33%+6% = 54%!

And on top of that you have to pay SALES tax on every dollar you spend. So yah, more than half of everything I make goes to taxes. We won't even go into death tax and capital gains tax and corporate and small business taxes.

Now it is about to get even worse....I feel a hankering to throw some tea bags into some bay.

If it gets WORSE for you, then you're running a shitty business or are just bitching because it won't be as easy to sit around on your fat ass waiting for the money to pour in.


Personally, I think you're too stupid to be 'self-employed'.

What moron did you convince would be a good idea if they worked for you?

[halenrox1]

i guess were gettin 3 hundred extra each now.....

[Blackflag]

So fuck the blind, then?


Yeah, you fucking cripples who can no longer work, get off our coattails!

More strawman arguments? Nobody said 'fuck the blind.' Nobody is arguing anything about 'cripples.' Nobody has a problem with taking care of the handicapped.

Guaranteed retirement because you're too lazy to get a job and save for your own retirement? Fuck you, and Buffalo, too. You probably wish being a slackjawed loser qualifies you as "mentally handicapped" now...just so you can benefit from somebody else's labor.

Buffalo. :rolleyes:

[hideyoursheep]

No I'm fine with the blind receiving benefits.

But fuck you.

I'm blind!

:cato:

[hideyoursheep]

More strawman arguments? Nobody said 'fuck the blind.' Nobody is arguing anything about 'cripples.' Nobody has a problem with taking care of the handicapped.

Guaranteed retirement because you're too lazy to get a job and save for your own retirement? Fuck you, and Buffalo, too. You probably wish being a slackjawed loser qualifies you as "mentally handicapped" now...just so you can benefit from somebody else's labor.

Buffalo. :rolleyes:

Yuckima:blow2:

[TongueNGroove]

If it gets WORSE for you, then you're running a shitty business or are just bitching because it won't be as easy to sit around on your fat ass waiting for the money to pour in.


Personally, I think you're too stupid to be 'self-employed'.

What moron did you convince would be a good idea if they worked for you?


Yah typical moronic liberal BS. If my taxes go UP that means I run a shitty business? Are you on drugs?

Sit on my ass? You don't even have a clue how hard I have worked to get this business off the ground, or how hard I still work. Yet MORE liberal BS. Have you ever tried to start a business?? OF COURSE YOU HAVEN'T. If you had you would know where I am coming from.

And I must be stupid.....sheesh, why do I even bother talking to you ignorant fucks. It's like arguing with a 3 yr old that wants her lolipop.

You sir, are a fucking moron. Please don't ever talk to me again.

[hideyoursheep]

Yah typical moronic liberal BS. If my taxes go UP that means I run a shitty business? Are you on drugs?

Sit on my ass? You don't even have a clue how hard I have worked to get this business off the ground, or how hard I still work. Yet MORE liberal BS. Have you ever tried to start a business?? OF COURSE YOU HAVEN'T. If you had you would know where I am coming from.

And I must be stupid.....sheesh, why do I even bother talking to you ignorant fucks. It's like arguing with a 3 yr old that wants her lolipop.

You sir, are a fucking moron. Please don't ever talk to me again.

You gonna try to tell me the less money your 'company' makes, the more taxes you'll be paying?!

Bullshit!

You fucking greedy fuck! Choke on it. You never fucking had to do any real work. And it shows. You're afraid of having to pay more if you make more. Tough shit. That's life in the big city.

Dumbass.

[Nickdfresh]

More strawman arguments? Nobody said 'fuck the blind.' Nobody is arguing anything about 'cripples.' Nobody has a problem with taking care of the handicapped.

Social Security is often their chief source of income! Ever speak with lawyers on the subject, and how the state often tries to habitually deny claims even while knowing these people deserve it?

And as far as strawman, in your case strawdouche!, YOU'RE the one that inventing completely factless bullshit about who collects social security! Are there people who don't need it? Yes! Are there little old ladies that don't have a pot to piss in and have worked all their lives but were never granted access to higher education or were destroyed by bad relationships that rely on SS to not be fucking completely destitute? Absolutely!!

I'M the one with the STRAWMAN argument? Quite contraire, you pussy!


Guaranteed retirement because you're too lazy to get a job and save for your own retirement?

How many jobs allow for the working poor to save for retirement, you little entitled bitch?


Fuck you, and Buffalo, too.

Leave the whoring to your mother, she's better at it, fatty!


You probably wish being a slackjawed loser qualifies you as "mentally handicapped" now...just so you can benefit from somebody else's labor.

Buffalo. :rolleyes:

Yeah, right, except I actually have four year degrees, and you're the ignorant troll that changes his story, community college bitch...

The truth is that you're just another ignorant, unfeeling reptilian douchebag unable to see anything any perspective but his own selfish little world of paying too much in taxes.

Fuck you too! You people make me sick, you live in a country that is far more stable than 90%, if not more, than the rest of the world and you don't even know how good you have it! Unlike your fat ass, I've been in the military and have been in failed states. You don't have a clue you pussybitch!. Yet, it's never enough!

Booh-fucking-hoo!

[hideyoursheep]

Hooahh!

[TongueNGroove]

You gonna try to tell me the less money your 'company' makes, the more taxes you'll be paying?!

Bullshit!

I didn't say that at all, learn to read. The goverment goes by percentages. I fmy income falls below a certain level then yes, I would enter a different tax bracket, but as I stated, the goverment (Federal and local) is already getting well over half of everything I make...around 62%(including sales tax).


You fucking greedy fuck! Choke on it. You never fucking had to do any real work. And it shows. You're afraid of having to pay more if you make more. Tough shit. That's life in the big city.

Dumbass.

Explain to me, please, how I am the "greedy one". It seems to me the government is the "Greedy" one. I mean they do get well over half of every dollar I make.

And let remind you of something, that you probably don't even realise, people like me give people like you jobs. If people like me go out of business, people like you have no job.

Then what are you going to do? Rhetorical question. People like YOU, will beg the government for money. Problem is, without people like me, the government will have no money to GIVE YOU. So think about that.

And don't forget, not only do you pay more money as you get more money, you also pay a higher percentage of that money. For someone like you that is fine, since you never plan on doing anything with your life. For those of us who do want to make something of our lifes it is a real issue.

Don't respond please, I am sure it will just be more moronic crap...but just let that sink in.

[LoungeMachine]

I.

Don't respond please, I am sure it will just be more moronic crap...but just let that sink in.

:rolleyes:

If you want to go start some self-serving blog, knock yourself out, mensa.

But this an open forum message board, not your personal soapbox for others to read, but not respond to.

:heyfu:

[TongueNGroove]

:rolleyes:

If you want to go start some self-serving blog, knock yourself out, mensa.

But this an open forum message board, not your personal soapbox for others to read, but not respond to.

:heyfu:

I see you took the time to respond, but had nothing to say.... And I was speaking to goatboy.

[LoungeMachine]

I see you took the time to respond, but had nothing to say.... And I was speaking to goatboy.

Again, you're having a difficult time comprehending how an open forum works....

Doesn't matter who you were speaking to, anyone can feel free to point out your stupidity and hypocrisy.

Like I am right now.

:gulp:

[TongueNGroove]

Again, you're having a difficult time comprehending how an open forum works....

Doesn't matter who you were speaking to, anyone can feel free to point out your stupidity and hypocrisy.

Like I am right now.

:gulp:


Again, I see words, but they have no meaning.../yawn.

[TongueNGroove]

Oopsies....

[Big Train]

Why? So those with money have a guaranteed retirement while the system flounders for anyone else?

Well, if my retirement is already all set, I'm just taking from the system. If your asking me why I'm not just giving into the system to guarantee everyone else, I'm a capitalist first. Everyone is responsible for themselves. What you put in, you should get out. I'm being taxed more than others to ensure others retirements? Are they going to do some services for me now in exchange? I think not.

[Golden AWe]

Again, I see words, but they have no meaning.../yawn.

Hello Kittykat.