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Guitar Shark
10-16-2009, 12:23 PM
Interracial couple denied marriage license in La.

By MARY FOSTER, Associated Press Writer Mary Foster, Associated Press Writer

Fri Oct 16, 4:50 am ET

NEW ORLEANS – A white Louisiana justice of the peace said he refused to issue a marriage license to an interracial couple out of concern for any children the couple might have.

Keith Bardwell, justice of the peace in Tangipahoa Parish, says it is his experience that most interracial marriages do not last long.

"I'm not a racist. I just don't believe in mixing the races that way," Bardwell told the Associated Press on Thursday. "I have piles and piles of black friends. They come to my home, I marry them, they use my bathroom. I treat them just like everyone else."

Bardwell said he asks everyone who calls about marriage if they are a mixed race couple. If they are, he does not marry them, he said.

Bardwell said he has discussed the topic with blacks and whites, along with witnessing some interracial marriages. He came to the conclusion that most of black society does not readily accept offspring of such relationships, and neither does white society, he said.

"There is a problem with both groups accepting a child from such a marriage," Bardwell said. "I think those children suffer and I won't help put them through it."

If he did an interracial marriage for one couple, he must do the same for all, he said.

"I try to treat everyone equally," he said.

Bardwell estimates that he has refused to marry about four couples during his career, all in the past 2 1/2 years.

Beth Humphrey, 30, and 32-year-old Terence McKay, both of Hammond, say they will consult the U.S. Justice Department about filing a discrimination complaint.

Humphrey, an account manager for a marketing firm, said she and McKay, a welder, just returned to Louisiana. She is white and he is black. She plans to enroll in the University of New Orleans to pursue a masters degree in minority politics.

"That was one thing that made this so unbelievable," she said. "It's not something you expect in this day and age."

Humphrey said she called Bardwell on Oct. 6 to inquire about getting a marriage license signed. She says Bardwell's wife told her that Bardwell will not sign marriage licenses for interracial couples. Bardwell suggested the couple go to another justice of the peace in the parish who agreed to marry them.

"We are looking forward to having children," Humphrey said. "And all our friends and co-workers have been very supportive. Except for this, we're typical happy newlyweds."

"It is really astonishing and disappointing to see this come up in 2009," said American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana attorney Katie Schwartzmann. She said the Supreme Court ruled in 1967 "that the government cannot tell people who they can and cannot marry."

The ACLU sent a letter to the Louisiana Judiciary Committee, which oversees the state justices of the peace, asking them to investigate Bardwell and recommending "the most severe sanctions available, because such blatant bigotry poses a substantial threat of serious harm to the administration of justice."

"He knew he was breaking the law, but continued to do it," Schwartzmann said.

According to the clerk of court's office, application for a marriage license must be made three days before the ceremony because there is a 72-hour waiting period. The applicants are asked if they have previously been married. If so, they must show how the marriage ended, such as divorce.

Other than that, all they need is a birth certificate and Social Security card.

The license fee is $35, and the license must be signed by a Louisiana minister, justice of the peace or judge. The original is returned to the clerk's office.

"I've been a justice of the peace for 34 years and I don't think I've mistreated anybody," Bardwell said. "I've made some mistakes, but you have too. I didn't tell this couple they couldn't get married. I just told them I wouldn't do it."

Coyote
10-16-2009, 12:32 PM
The more things change...

kwame k
10-16-2009, 12:38 PM
Offspring of interracial couples are gorgeous. Look at Keanu Reeves, Quincy Jones's daughter Rashida Jones, Thandie Swinton to name a few.

P.S. Edward and Alex Van Halen are half white and half Asian. Eddie has a cute smile. :)

Pre-Meth Mouth, of course;)

FORD
10-16-2009, 12:42 PM
Offspring of interracial couples are gorgeous. Look at Keanu Reeves, Quincy Jones's daughter Rashida Jones, Thandie Swinton to name a few.

P.S. Edward and Alex Van Halen are half white and half Asian. Eddie has a cute smile. :)


And let's not forget that guy who just won a Nobel Peace Prize. While living in the White House.

Yeah, obviously those "race mixing" kids never amount to nuthin' :rolleyes:

Nitro Express
10-16-2009, 12:49 PM
Maybe Katrina ran all the black people out of New Orleans and the KKK moved in.

Seshmeister
10-16-2009, 12:51 PM
And let's not forget that guy who just won a Nobel Peace Prize. While living in the White House.


You think Obama is 'gorgeous'?

Oh my... :)

standin
10-16-2009, 01:10 PM
He is right in some ways. I have met a lot of prejudiced black people and a lot of prejudiced white people. But the "not in my family" goes beyond black or white. Asians, Middle Eastern, Spanish and a plethra of other variants of humans and classifications of existence holds difficulties for couples that wish to marry and have children.
Often times it can be troubling for the families that try to integrate lives from different classifications.

For example an outlaw biker family of many generations daughter marrying a a guy from criminal justice centric family.

Or even as simple as a country boy marrying a city girl.

Or 2 from different socioeconomic standings.

Fact is there are some hard core racist in the black community as there is some hard core racist in the white community. The well being of the children and family coherence of a couple where one is white and the other black, depends on the families.

Should someone be able to step in and enforce separatism, no, not at all. But it does not make separatism nonexistent just because it is not enforced or we wish it away.

Seshmeister
10-16-2009, 01:11 PM
Of course. Last week there were two articles in The NY Times about our First Lady's roots. Mrs. Obama's great great great grandfather was a white slave owner. It was sad to read. Mrs. Obama didn't comment on the findings.

People always get confused with that kind of thing though choosing one ancestor over another.

Mrs Obama had 16 great great great grandfathers which would make her genetically only 3% white slave owner.

In the same way that we are all Africans if you go back far enough, and that most of us are related to Ghengis Khan and Shakespeare one way or another.

Seshmeister
10-16-2009, 01:12 PM
And why do racists always start sentences with "I'm not racist"...?

standin
10-16-2009, 01:18 PM
Of course. Last week there were two articles in The NY Times about our First Lady's roots. Mrs. Obama's great great great grandfather was a white slave owner. It was sad to read. Mrs. Obama didn't comment on the findings.


I venture solidly that in her past is also, black slave owners.
I do not know the history of her her grandfather you speak of, but he very well may had loved her grandmother. Should he had given her status as a free-woman. Yes, but I do not know if or if not he did. Moreover, if it would have worked in their favor if he had.

Guitar Shark
10-16-2009, 01:19 PM
I suggest that you venture solidly to the loony bin.

FORD
10-16-2009, 01:24 PM
You think Obama is 'gorgeous'?

Oh my... :)

No..... but Rashida Jones is alright. And let's not forget Halle Berry!

standin
10-16-2009, 01:26 PM
Do you think slavery is a white thing?

Anti-Slavery (http://www.antislavery.org/english/default.aspx)

http://www.antislavery.org/images/2008/b/bonded_labour.jpg

Seshmeister
10-16-2009, 01:28 PM
There is a sophisticated racism nowadays that is not so blatant. You can be working with one side by side everyday and not detect it. This kind of racist has a superiority/inferiority belief about a group/groups, but will make exceptions for individuals of those groups if they are not acting like that group. If for example, a white guys dates a black girl; he thinks he's not racist because of that one relationship. But he could be dating her because she doesn't "act black."

Most people are racist to a degree, hopefully most of us are only a little racist these days.

The funny thing is that you can spot the bad racists a mile away because they always use that start to the sentence. It nearly always then has a 'but' afterward.

My favorite line someone said to me once was 'I was never ever racist against black people until I met one of them...'

Guitar Shark
10-16-2009, 01:29 PM
No..... but Rashida Jones is alright.

Rashida Jones is hot, I think. I had no idea she is Quincy Jones' daughter.

standin
10-16-2009, 01:33 PM
There is a sophisticated racism nowadays that is not so blatant. You can be working with one side by side everyday and not detect it. This kind of racist has a superiority/inferiority belief about a group/groups, but will make exceptions for individuals of those groups if they do not behave in the stereotypical fashion of that group. If for example, a white guys dates a black girl; he thinks he's not racist because of that one relationship. But he could be dating her because she doesn't "act black."

That always got me. What does "act black" mean?
That is the most annoying part is getting stereotyped.
I found the one's most insecure with their ethics or life were always the one saying you don't "act {insert stereotype here}"

FORD
10-16-2009, 01:43 PM
Rashida Jones is hot, I think. I had no idea she is Quincy Jones' daughter.

I didn't know that until just recently either. If I was going to guess her ethnic background, I probably wouldn't have guessed that her dad was African American.

Her sister Kidada is hot as well.....

http://www.superqdeals.net/images/kjones.jpg

And here's both girls with dad......

http://img2.timeinc.net/instyle/images/2007/parties/060107_jones_400X400.jpg

FORD
10-16-2009, 01:47 PM
There's a clip on YouTube called "Racism At The Bus Stop," which uses humor to tackle this very issue. For some reason whenever I post a YT clip from this PC it never comes out right, so if you want to check out the clip you can search for the title there. Actually, the entire channel has funny clips dealing with racism.

Is this the one?

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/dQJwUhhUjpI&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/dQJwUhhUjpI&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

standin
10-16-2009, 01:49 PM
There's a clip on YouTube called "Racism At The Bus Stop," which uses humor to tackle this very issue. For some reason whenever I post a YT clip from this PC it never comes out right, so if you want to check out the clip you can search for the title there. Actually, the entire channel has funny clips dealing with racism.

Aw Jeepers! These are great!!!!!
That dude hit the nail on the head.


<object width="580" height="360"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/glOv4MIyNSE&hl=en&fs=1&color1=0x5d1719&color2=0xcd311b&border=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/glOv4MIyNSE&hl=en&fs=1&color1=0x5d1719&color2=0xcd311b&border=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="580" height="360"></embed></object>

Well, some of them are lame. And stereotypical themselves.
The one about the elevator, the dude is some stager getting in alone in an elevator with another person. One should always be cautious about that. Always.

Nitro Express
10-16-2009, 02:09 PM
Of course. Last week there were two articles in The NY Times about our First Lady's roots. Mrs. Obama's great great great grandfather was a white slave owner. It was sad to read. Mrs. Obama didn't comment on the findings.

Yeah. That's how most people of African decent made it to America. Most the indians died off from disease so they had to bring Africans here to work the plantations. The British, the Spanish, and The French were all using slave African labor all over in the Americas and Caribean. If slavery wasn't going on, most the black people would still be in Africa other than the ones who migrated here later after slavery. So yup, I'm sure Mrs. Obama's acestors were slaves like most black Americans. Can't blame me, my ancestors were vikings and we only used white slaves 1000 years ago.

Nitro Express
10-16-2009, 02:12 PM
Slavery still goes on. It's more rampant than people think.

ThrillsNSpills
10-16-2009, 02:16 PM
Boy oh Boy.
Reminds me of the Nixon I'm not a crook line.


GeeZ. They even use my bathroom.
You know he scrubs the hell out of it afterwards.



And can NO one else marry these people down there?

standin
10-16-2009, 02:18 PM
When Mariah Carey became big with her first album, Jet Magazine or Essence had Mariah Carey on the cover withthe headline "Why She Looks White and Sounds (or was it Sings?) Black."

I had a conversation recently, I had went through an interview about a year ago and I was told to mention certain aspects of my heritage that really should not come into play. I was like naw, I don't need that boast. After, I didn't get it and I audited the program against the same program in other sections. Yea, blatant racism in play.
Very vague on purpose. (sorry)
I went back and mentioned the aspects and asked her if that was enough. It was shameful her deceit. Sometimes being able to read people is annoying.

standin
10-16-2009, 02:20 PM
Slavery still goes on. It's more rampant than people think.

Where is the problem?
Forced labour is a global problem, although some regions have larger numbers of people affected than others. The regional distribution of forced labour is:

Asia and Pacific: 9,490,000 (77%)
Latin America: 1,320,000 (11%)
Sub-Saharan Africa: 660,000 (5%)
Industrialised countries: 360,000 (3%)
Middle East and North Africa: 260,000 (2%)
Transition countries: 210,000 (2%)

Anti-Slavery - Forced Labour (http://www.antislavery.org/english/slavery_today/forced_labour.aspx)

standin
10-16-2009, 02:24 PM
Boy oh Boy.
Reminds me of the Nixon I'm not a crook line.


GeeZ. They even use my bathroom.
You know he scrubs the hell out of it afterwards.



And can NO one else marry these people down there?

That was kinda odd.
But hey, I don't let anyone use my bathroom equally, maybe female can. But a guy, even ones I kinda know, they use the other one.

standin
10-16-2009, 02:29 PM
Wow, just wow..

Anonymous
10-16-2009, 02:37 PM
It cracks me up that the judge says he has "piles of" black friends and allows them to use his bathroom. :lmao: Can we use "pile" as a unit of measure when referring to human beings?

Apparently, we can.

Well, for blacks, anyway.

Ooer missus!

:lol:

Cheers! :bottle:

letsrock
10-16-2009, 06:43 PM
It cracks me up that the judge says he has "piles of" black friends and allows them to use his bathroom. :lmao: Can we use "pile" as a unit of measure when referring to human beings?

The Nazi's had "piles" of Jews.

Diamondjimi
10-16-2009, 07:06 PM
The minister is just your typical backwoods Hillbilly racist. Guess he figures blacks aren't part of "gods" people...

Reverend Dip:shiznit: is a poor excuse for a human being...

ThrillsNSpills
10-16-2009, 07:15 PM
That was kinda odd.
But hey, I don't let anyone use my bathroom equally, maybe female can. But a guy, even ones I kinda know, they use the other one.


what, you got newspaper on the ground in the garage? or what

letsrock
10-16-2009, 08:53 PM
The Nazi's what had the piles?

Looks like "piles". Not a joke.

letsrock
10-16-2009, 09:02 PM
You didn't understand my question. Never mind.

I admit it i didnt get the question.

Nitro Express
10-16-2009, 11:42 PM
I grew up in a predominantly black neighborhood, and the kids in my class snickered at African-sounding surnames until one of the teachers, a very light-skinned black woman, told them that their ancestors had all come over here on a boat as slaves and had to take their masters' last names; that that's why they had names like Jackson, Johnson, Jefferson, McRae, etc. That stopped the snickering.

I have some black friends and for all of them, knowing a few generations back their family was someone's property is hard to deal with. The thing is if all of us go back in our geneology far enough most of us probably had ancestors who were slaves of somebody. It's a nasty and sad story of history.

Seshmeister
10-16-2009, 11:54 PM
There is less of a difference between slaves and 90&#37; of the population toiling in abject misery in factories and mines in the 1800s than most people like to think about.

There were very few people wandering about in the big frocks that now make up most of the TV dramas.

standin
10-17-2009, 12:48 AM
That is true.
The fact is it was majorly "big business" (and small) that followed profit as a highest goal which abused their workers, be it slave or freemen.
And that goes the same today.

GAR
10-25-2009, 12:41 AM
I admit self-confidence in my own ethnicity becomes conflicted everytime my beemer flies past a black dude doing 60mph on the 70-limit freeway driving a Cadillac wearing a doo-rag on his fucking head, blaring Tupac riffs in a wife-beater teeshirt while everybody else is flipping him off for choking off traffic doing at least 75mph.

standin
10-25-2009, 01:04 AM
Hey, Standin. I was reading something that reminded me of your question "what does act mean? What I was reading made reference to an article in the Nov 2009 issue of [I]Essence Magazine entitled "Dating Like A White Girl." :)

If you are dating for color reason, you might be a racist.

I over heard this chick say to another "Once you go black you never go back"
A person blurted out. "That's racist!" lol... reminds me of some Internet pics from here and there...The girl that said "Once you go black, you never go back" Exclaimed back to the other person "I am not a racist!" the other person said "How is that not racists?" The chick that said it just kept flipping her head and saying "I am not a racist" At that point you're like, would you just explain what you mean by "Once you go black you never go back"!

What do you think it means, Chan? Does it mean that the person that choose an interracial marriage would be shunned? Are they to be held captive? do they get cooties? Does something happen where they abandoned all other races? That they have to decide at that point that no other race is a viable mating option?
It is right up there with "I am white, so always right."

What if the black guy was a mean a horrible dude? What does one's color have to do with never choosing another mate of another race?

Seemed an odd statement to me. Have you heard it before?

standin
10-25-2009, 01:09 AM
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/26/43926411_4a7b5fd6ed_o.gif

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 09:48 AM
There is less of a difference between slaves and 90% of the population toiling in abject misery in factories and mines in the 1800s than most people like to think about.

There were very few people wandering about in the big frocks that now make up most of the TV dramas.

Or of third worlders toiling in abject poverty for 60 or 70 hours a week to produce cheap goods for the West...

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:46 AM
I admit self-confidence in my own ethnicity becomes conflicted everytime my beemer flies past a black dude doing 60mph on the 70-limit freeway driving a Cadillac wearing a doo-rag on his fucking head, blaring Tupac riffs in a wife-beater teeshirt while everybody else is flipping him off for choking off traffic doing at least 75mph.

What happened to your 90-something Mazda Protodouch&#233;? Do you fill your "Beamer" with used oil too, white trash "the Mexicans stole my jobz" loser?


Can't afford a two dollar bottle of motor oil, but you're pimpin' in style in an overrated German luxury sedan? You have a better chance of seeing Jesus, dirtball...

:lmao:

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:52 AM
That always got me. What does "act black" mean?
That is the most annoying part is getting stereotyped.
...


I don't know. But the white kids, or other assorted non-African Americans, who try to do it are usually most intolerant little racist douchebags there are.

http://pix.motivatedphotos.com/2009/5/21/633785278977198300-wiggers.jpg

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 01:12 PM
Is this guy the only Justice of the peace in Louisiana? Can't they just go to an other one?
Instead they have to call a lawyer. Sounds like a bunch of assholes all the way around.

standin
10-25-2009, 02:53 PM
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2724/4043010437_968621c9fb_o.gif

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 02:55 PM
Is this guy the only Justice of the peace in Louisiana? Can't they just go to an other one?
Instead they have to call a lawyer. Sounds like a bunch of assholes all the way around.

Oh please! I'd call a lawyer too. Who the fuck is this judge? He should be impeached...

standin
10-25-2009, 03:15 PM
If he wanted to recuse himself, he should have not explained why.
A judge should be allowed to recuse himself with no explanation.

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 05:42 PM
Oh please! I'd call a lawyer too. Who the fuck is this judge? He should be impeached...

That's cuz you leftists are a bunch of troublemakers. We don't get our way so we will DESTROY YOU!

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 05:51 PM
Oh please! I'd call a lawyer too. Who the fuck is this judge? He should be impeached...

I respect the guy for doing sticking to his ethics (no matter how publically denounced) and doing what he considered to be the "right thing".

They should just get someone else to marry them and go on their way. Who cares?

standin
10-25-2009, 05:58 PM
The judge is just getting older and wants to speak his mind, imagine the times through his career that he has not spoken up. Should he sanctioned for his verbose, yes he should. Should his cases be reviewed for questionable rulings, No. Mouthiness, maybe. I bet he has told off many a person in his courtrooms and crossed over the line into "Judge, that's really not your business"

I can almost hear him
" Mr. and Mrs. Sonso I have seen your family for 15 plus years, it is my oppinion....
~10 minutes later~
I can't really do anything about it. However,...
~17 minutes later~
Therefore in the best of the courts, here is your decree."

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 07:52 PM
That's cuz you leftists are a bunch of troublemakers. We don't get our way so we will DESTROY YOU!


Sorry, I didn't know that you rightists supported keeping incompetent lawbreakers on the public dole no matter how much they such dick at their job.


:picknose:...Oh wait, you voted for Bush...

Now go "destroy" a cock, closet case...

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 07:55 PM
I respect the guy for doing sticking to his ethics (no matter how publically denounced) and doing what he considered to be the "right thing".

They should just get someone else to marry them and go on their way. Who cares?



Thanks. mindless, dickless droning sheep who would have supported Hitler (no offense)...

First, you ignore the white supremacist judge that prevented the (poor) "******" from marrying fat white marketer. And then you find yourself guarding the murder shower exits at Auschwitz. It's a slippery slope my friend...

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 07:55 PM
too bad your smiley isn't eating his booger. it's healthy and green

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 07:57 PM
Thanks, mindless dickless droning sheep who would have supported Hitler (no offense)...

That's kind of a cheap shot cuntsidering the Far Left supports those who would destroy all Jews.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:02 PM
That's kind of a cheap shot cuntsidering the Far Left supports those who would destroy all Jews.

Don't forget the far right that almost did...

FORD
10-25-2009, 08:03 PM
That's kind of a cheap shot cuntsidering the Far Left supports those who would destroy all Jews.

Actually, the far right's candidates, the BCE, are the ones who literally supported the ones who would destroy all Jews.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:03 PM
And if you like Nuremberg style "race laws." That's fine. But fucking please don't call that a "conviction."

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:06 PM
BTW, my girlfriend is black. So, as much as I detest the idea of marriage, should I have to travel around the entire fucking country to find a judge that will approve of my civil liberties and our right of getting fucking married?

If you're claiming to be a "conservative" and actually believe that, you're another hypocritical racist piece of shit who has no idea of what principles he or she is actually supposed to fucking believe!

And yes, if a judge told me we couldn't get married because of some bullshit statement that is little more than a coded anti-miscegenation clause, yeah, I'd fucking sue!! You better believe it! If you're a public servant and you fuck with peoples' civil rights, you should be sued into fucking oblivion!!

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 08:19 PM
Actually, the far right's candidates, the BCE, are the ones who literally supported the ones who would destroy all Jews.
That's one reason I despise those on the far right/ fundamentalist right or whatever we might call it.
I don't cuntsider them any better than the far left.

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 08:21 PM
BTW you're sexy when you're angry.

Terry
10-25-2009, 08:24 PM
"I'm not a racist. I just don't believe in mixing the races that way."

When someone says something like that as a rationalization for why they're not a racist, you really can't argue with them, mostly because it's clear that logic didn't play much of a role in that thought pattern.

It is useful living in the South in the aspect that many times one knows exactly where others stand regarding their feelings on race. Unlike in other areas of the country, where people have been conditioned to SAY the "right" things and that's as far as their racial tolerance extends.

Navin Johnson would be ashamed.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:24 PM
BTW you're sexy when you're angry.


I'm sexy when I'm sad and happy, too....

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 08:26 PM
Where does it say the white guy was a judge? I thought he was a justice of the peace. My dad was a justice of the peace and he was not a judge nor had he ever been a judge.

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 08:26 PM
BTW, my girlfriend is black. So, as much as I detest the idea of marriage, should I have to travel around the entire fucking country to find a judge that will approve of my civil liberties and our right of getting fucking married?

If you're claiming to be a "conservative" and actually believe that, you're another hypocritical racist piece of shit who has no idea of what principles he or she is actually supposed to fucking believe!

And yes, if a judge told me we couldn't get married because of some bullshit statement that is little more than a coded anti-miscegenation clause, yeah, I'd fucking sue!! You better believe it! If you fuck with peoples' civil rights, you should be sued into fucking oblivion!!

The dude didn't say they couldn't get married, he said he didn't want to marry them. Big difference.

I'm not offended by your overreaction, it's just another day at the Roth Army. ;) I highly doubt you think my next step is going to be shrugging my shoulders at the extermination of millions and saying that it was fine with me (though I just might! I did think that this guy not wanting to marry these people was okay, so being okay with millions of murders isn't much worse!)

In the end I just can't bring myself to care whether these people had to find another justice of the peace to issue a marriage license or not. Life is just so hard sometimes.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:35 PM
The dude didn't say they couldn't get married, he said he didn't want to marry them. Big difference.

Great! Where's his resignation letter? If Billy Joe doesn't want to do his job, then: a.) quit b.) get fired c.) cause his employer to get sued because he's a retarded asshole in a position of responsibility


I'm not offended by your overreaction, it's just another day at the Roth Army. ;)

Good. Because my goal wasn't to offend you. It was to make a point...


I highly doubt you think my next step is going to be shrugging my shoulders at the extermination of millions and saying that it was fine with me (though I just might! I did think that this guy not wanting to marry these people was okay, so being okay with millions of murders isn't much worse!)

You are correct. I doubt that was your next step. I was speaking more in terms of societal "baby steps."

There is no excuse to let anything like this incident stand...


In the end I just can't bring myself to care whether these people had to find another justice of the peace to issue a marriage license or not. Life is just so hard sometimes.

That's fine. But you posted in this thread and read it, so you cared on some level. But where do we stop? Does a DMV clerk get to deny a person a renewal of their license because they happen to be of Vietnamese origin, and might be a bad driver?

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:39 PM
Where does it say the white guy was a judge? I thought he was a justice of the peace. My dad was a justice of the peace and he was not a judge nor had he ever been a judge.

I don't give a fuck if he cleaned toilets at the local mini-mart. If he refused to do his job based on someones' skin color(s), he should be fucking: a.) fired b.) resign c.) have his employer sued because they let an asshole have one of their keys

Is it really that difficult?

standin
10-25-2009, 08:45 PM
Where does it say the white guy was a judge? I thought he was a justice of the peace. My dad was a justice of the peace and he was not a judge nor had he ever been a judge.
Louisiana Justice of the Peace Courts
Justice of the Peace Courts have limited civil and criminal jurisdiction that may vary by court.

Criminal cases generally handled by Justice of the Peace Courts include preliminary hearings for most criminal cases and litter violations, and may include other types of violations and non-felony criminal cases.

Justice of the Peace Courts share limited jurisdiction over some civil cases with District Courts, including some general civil cases within financial limits.

Justice of the Peace Courts do not have jurisdiction over certain types of cases, including probate matters, cases where the State or political subdivision is a defendant, cases where title to real estate is an issue, and other types of cases as defined by law.

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 08:52 PM
I don't think one gets paid to be a justice of the peace. If one doesn't get paid to do it, It ain't his job. If it ain't his job, he don't have to marry nobody if he don't want to.
If he was really breaking the law by refusing those nice people he should certainly be punished . CERTAINLY should be punished.
I don't like defending a racist, but Leftists have to learn that THEY CAN'T JUST PUNISH ANYBODY THEY WANT TO JUST BECAUSE THEY DON'T LIKE WHAT THEY THINK.

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 08:56 PM
Louisiana Justice of the Peace Courts
Justice of the Peace Courts have limited civil and criminal jurisdiction that may vary by court.

Criminal cases generally handled by Justice of the Peace Courts include preliminary hearings for most criminal cases and litter violations, and may include other types of violations and non-felony criminal cases.

Justice of the Peace Courts share limited jurisdiction over some civil cases with District Courts, including some general civil cases within financial limits.

Justice of the Peace Courts do not have jurisdiction over certain types of cases, including probate matters, cases where the State or political subdivision is a defendant, cases where title to real estate is an issue, and other types of cases as defined by law.
Thanks for that. It's different in my state. In CT, JOPs are basically like a notary public type that can officiate civil ceremonies and stuff. Not a paid position or particularly important in any way

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 08:59 PM
I don't think one gets paid to be a justice of the peace. If one doesn't get paid to do it, It ain't his job. If it ain't his job, he don't have to marry nobody if he don't want to.
If he was really breaking the law by refusing those nice people he should certainly be punished . CERTAINLY should be punished.
I don't like defending a racist, but Leftists have to learn that THEY CAN'T JUST PUNISH ANYBODY THEY WANT TO JUST BECAUSE THEY DON'T LIKE WHAT THEY THINK.


Dude, are you fucking kidding me? Really? He's in a position whether paid or not. If hates blacks, then quit. Let's find the statue where he can prevent consenting heterosexual couples who want to get married because of their skin color. He CAN'T!! That's a violation of their civil rights. End of fucking story!

That's like saying I'm a manager, and I believe that I shouldn't hire Jews. Or that I should be able to fire people because they're Asian or Native American. In which case, YOU CAN'T!! And you're an asshole who should quit if you have a moral prohibition against hiring people of races different from yours. And any company that keeps that manager is going to get sued...

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 09:09 PM
BTW, it's okay put forth racist policies and as long as you don't get paid for it? it's okay?

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 09:09 PM
Signs of the Times - Louisiana JP Refuses License to Interracial Couple (http://george.loper.org/~george/trends/2009/Oct/990.html)


"A justice of the peace said he refused to issue a marriage license to an interracial couple last week because of concern for the children who might be born of that relationship.

Keith Bardwell, justice of the peace for Tangipahoa Parish’s 8th Ward, also said it is his experience that most interracial marriages do not last long.

“I’m not a racist,” Bardwell said. “I do ceremonies for black couples right here in my house. My main concern is for the children.”

Beth Humphrey, 30, said she and her boyfriend, Terence McKay, 32, both of Hammond, intend to consult the U.S. Justice Department about filing a discrimination complaint.

Humphrey said she called Bardwell Oct. 6 to inquire about getting a marriage license signed. She said Bardwell’s wife told her that Bardwell will not sign marriage licenses for interracial couples.

“I simply can’t believe he can do that. That’s blatant discrimination,” Humphrey said.

The Louisiana American Civil Liberties Union and the Tangipahoa Parish Chapter of the NAACP agree.

Louisiana ACLU Executive Director Marjorie R. Esman said Bardwell’s refusal to sign the license is both “tragic and illegal.”

Pat Morris, NAACP Tangipahoa Parish chapter president, said she was shocked to hear that the choice of a spouse is still an issue in Tangipahoa Parish.

Humphrey, a Covington native, said she was discharged from the military over a year ago. McKay is originally from Franklinton. They met where she works, she said.

The couple had planned to go to South Carolina for the wedding, where they would be married in a traditional ceremony by her brother, who is a youth minister, Humphrey said. But McKay lost his job, and by the time he was re-employed he was unable to get off for the wedding.

They decided to go ahead and get married here “to make it right before God,” she said.

“We decided on a very short, simple ceremony with a couple of my friends as witnesses,” she said. “Later, when he got some time off, we would go to South Carolina for the traditional ceremony, although we would actually already be officially married.”

Toward the conclusion of her conversation with Bardwell’s wife, Humphrey said she was asked if this was an interracial marriage. Humphrey told her it was.

“I have no idea why she asked me that,” Humphrey said. “I suppose she asks everyone that question.”

Humphrey said the wife told her that Bardwell does not do interracial marriages.

“I don’t understand this because he is an elected official and discrimination is against the law,” Humphrey said.

Bardwell, who is handicapped, said he has been a JP for 34 years and has never had opposition, but this is his last term.

According to the Secretary of State’s elected officials database, his current term will expire Dec. 31, 2014.

Bardwell said from his experience, “99 percent of the time” the interracial couple consists of a black man and white woman.

“I find that rather confusing,” he said.

He said he has discussed the topic with blacks and whites, along with witnessing some interracial marriages. Bardwell said he came to the conclusion that most black society does not readily accept offspring of such relationships, and neither does white society.

“Yet, the children are innocent. They had nothing to do with that,” he said.

In many cases, he said, the grandparents or a relative ends up with the children.

“I don’t do interracial marriages because I don’t want to put children in a situation they didn’t bring on themselves,” Bardwell said. “In my heart, I feel the children will later suffer.”

He said if he does an interracial marriage for one couple, he must do the same for all.

“I try to treat everyone equally,” he said.

No one told Humphrey she and her boyfriend could not get married, Bardwell said. He said his wife even suggested she see Justice of the Peace Terri Crosby of Tickfaw, which Humphrey said she did and Crosby agreed to sign the license.

Bardwell said a justice of the peace is not required to conduct a marriage ceremony and is at liberty to recuse himself “from a marriage or anything else.”

He said the state attorney general told him years ago that he would eventually get into trouble for not performing interracial marriages.

“I told him if I do, I’ll resign,” Bardwell said. “I have rights too. I’m not obligated to do that just because I’m a justice of the peace.”

JPs do not get paid for performing marriages, although the couple may give a “gratuity,” he said.

“I’m not trying to mistreat anyone. I’m just trying to treat everyone equal,” he said.

Esman said it is indefensible for this issue to arise in 2009. No one in Tangipahoa Parish or anywhere else should have to submit to judicial approval of their choice of a spouse.

This has been the law for over 50 years, she said. In 1963, in the case Loving vs. Virginia, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that the government cannot prohibit marriages simply because of the race of the spouses.

“The government cannot discriminate based upon race, which is what is happening here,” Esman said. “The choice of a spouse is deeply personal, and the government simply cannot prevent you from marrying the person you love, based upon skin color.”

Bardwell’s decision and his position are wrong, Morris said.

“I think he went a little too far this time,” she said. “What does it matter if one is black and one is white. It’s their decision, their lives. “

According to the clerk of court’s office, getting a marriage license is a relatively easy process. Application for the license must be made three days before the ceremony because there is a 72-hour waiting period, although this can be waived by the judge, JP or minister.

The applicants are asked if they have previously been married. If so, they must show how the marriage ended, such as divorce.

A certified copy of their birth certificate and Social Security care are required. No blood test is required in Louisiana.

The license fee is $35, and the license must be signed within the State of Louisiana. Once it is signed by the minister, JP or judge, the original is returned to the clerk’s office. A certified copy is made and sent to the couple, and the original is put on file." (Don Ellzey, Hammond [La] Star, October 15, 2009)

Bolding mine.

In all seriousness (and I'll respond to your specific point momentarily, Nick), I don't see it a a big deal. He referred them to someone else to do it. I think he was obtuse for not signing it but if he genuinely believes in it, then I can admire a person for sticking to their convictions. If it becomes a huge local issue, then he should do as he said and resign. Not that it matters, given that it's his last term, but he should do it.

If it were a matter of it being illegal (like gay marriage) then I would feel as strongly as you do about it. But it's not a matter of it being illegal for them to marry, it's a matter of him not marrying them. Fine. He doesn't have to do it, and there are plenty of other people that will.

I get that people feel strongly about it being an equality issue and I can see the point. I just don't think it's a big deal.

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 09:11 PM
Great! Where's his resignation letter? If Billy Joe doesn't want to do his job, then: a.) quit b.) get fired c.) cause his employer to get sued because he's a retarded asshole in a position of responsibility



Good. Because my goal wasn't to offend you. It was to make a point...



You are correct. I doubt that was your next step. I was speaking more in terms of societal "baby steps."

There is no excuse to let anything like this incident stand...



That's fine. But you posted in this thread and read it, so you cared on some level. But where do we stop? Does a DMV clerk get to deny a person a renewal of their license because they happen to be of Vietnamese origin, and might be a bad driver?

I care about my opinion, enough to post it, not whether or not they could get married ;)

And Dallas would possibly be a better place if they denied drivers licenses to asians ... but only the women. The men are fine.

standin
10-25-2009, 09:13 PM
I don't think one gets paid to be a justice of the peace. If one doesn't get paid to do it, It ain't his job. If it ain't his job, he don't have to marry nobody if he don't want to.
If he was really breaking the law by refusing those nice people he should certainly be punished . CERTAINLY should be punished.
I don't like defending a racist, but Leftists have to learn that THEY CAN'T JUST PUNISH ANYBODY THEY WANT TO JUST BECAUSE THEY DON'T LIKE WHAT THEY THINK.

What?! First off, if he is paid one quarter that is pay.
If he is paid with authority that is pay.
There are a lot of jobs you do not get paid that not only can you be fired from, but are influential and/or important.
It does not matter if he is paid or not.
If a person takes a position, with or without compensation they agree to uphold that position. Pay has not a damn thing to do with it.

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 09:14 PM
I think the main difference really is that he is providing a service, and can decline to provide that service for any reason. It's no different than a priest or clergyman refusing to perform a marriage based on religious affiliation.

They hold the job, they should sign the license, right? Or is that a different standard?

standin
10-25-2009, 09:21 PM
No, it is not the same thing. Technically, is is misusing the recuse clause.
Moreover, like I said, he should have not stated is was recusing himself due to an illegal use of the recuse law. Had he not need to flaunt his disregard for the law allowing interracial marriages he would have died out and no one would have known one way or another unless they did an accounting on his court documents. He just had to be uppity and mouth off.

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 09:27 PM
So, in that case, do you believe that all people that have the legal ability to marry people should be required to do so as long as the people are legally marriageable in line with equality laws because they are providing a government service?

If they refuse to do so, do you think they should give up their ability to legally marry people?

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 09:27 PM
Signs of the Times - Louisiana JP Refuses License to Interracial Couple (http://george.loper.org/~george/trends/2009/Oct/990.html)



Bolding mine.

In all seriousness (and I'll respond to your specific point momentarily, Nick), I don't see it a a big deal. He referred them to someone else to do it.
I think he was obtuse for not signing it but if he genuinely believes in it, then I can admire a person for sticking to their convictions. If it becomes a huge local issue, then he should do as he said and resign. Not that it matters, given that it's his last term, but he should do it.

Okay, so his superiors knew he was racist and that he convulsed his belief system of white supremacy with an ethos masquerading as some bullshit about "marriages not working out" when in fact most marriages don't "work out" regardless of race. He should be marrying NO ONE then! That's fine, but they opened themselves to a lawsuit because apparently they're fucking stupid.

And if you admire a person for sticking to their conviction, that's fine. But again, that brings back my point for your admiration of Hitler. Because he certainly stuck to his position.

But I have no respect, because if it was his postion that he should engender a form of segregation and social engineering, and knew this was a problem he should have recused himself from his position....


If it were a matter of it being illegal (like gay marriage) then I would feel as strongly as you do about it. But it's not a matter of it being illegal for them to marry, it's a matter of him not marrying them. Fine. He doesn't have to do it, and there are plenty of other people that will.

No. It's a matter of him not being in a position to make the choice to marry them or not based solely on race. Because his superiors knew of his predilections, that only makes the suit more plausible..


I get that people feel strongly about it being an equality issue and I can see the point. I just don't think it's a big deal.

Fine. But I think it is a big deal. If NO parishes (essentially county governments for us in the 21st century) get to decide who gets married, then where does it stop? Again, can the department of motor vehicles clerk decide that a "gook" shouldn't have a license, so he'll just tell them to go to someone else? I mean, where is the accountability here? They let some asshole be a JOTP knowing he makes racist decisions? Again, where does that precedent go?

Do teachers get to ignore the "niggars" in their class because they believe blacks shouldn't be educated?

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 09:37 PM
Nick, I think you're instrumentally removing any impact the holocaust had on me by linking it routinely to mundane and un-impactful events. I gotta say there has to be some sort of middle ground between "this guy refuses to do a service that he doesn't have to do" and "you support hitler's extermination of the jews and other ethnic groups"

I wouldn't care if the guy refused to marry them because they were rednecks. He doesn't have to do it, he decided not to do it (for poor reasons), and they got someone else to do it.

If everyone refused to do it, I'd think it would be a bigger deal. One guy decided not to do it. Big deal.

If he opens some concentration camps and starts exterminating bi-racial babies, I'll retract my statements and issue a formal apology for being wrong.

FORD
10-25-2009, 09:40 PM
How about pharmacists who refuse to sell birth control pills?

Bottom line is, if you can't do the job you were hired for because of some political reason or some psycho perversion of "religious morals", then find another fucking job.

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 09:42 PM
BTW, it's okay put forth racist policies and as long as you don't get paid for it? it's okay?
It's not a question of okay. It's a question of legality. Did he break a law? If so arrest him.
It's really that simple

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 09:47 PM
Nick, I think you're instrumentally removing any impact the holocaust had on me by linking it routinely to mundane and un-impactful events. I gotta say there has to be some sort of middle ground between "this guy refuses to do a service that he doesn't have to do" and "you support hitler's extermination of the jews and other ethnic groups"

Right. And you're ignoring my more terrestrial examples such as civil servants deciding as too which people they want to serve (which you've yet to acknowledge)...

So, I own a restaurant. And if I see a mixed race couple (basically a black man and a white woman) I get to throw them out, right? I shouldn't get sued because I have the right to my own convictions of separation of the races?


I wouldn't care if the guy refused to marry them because they were rednecks. He doesn't have to do it, he decided not to do it (for poor reasons), and they got someone else to do it.

And I'm saying, where does that stop? What if everyone refused to marry them? Then they can't get married, which is a clear violation of their basic civil rights...

Just because they CAN get married somewhere else doesn't mean they should HAVE too...


If everyone refused to do it, I'd think it would be a bigger deal. One guy decided not to do it. Big deal.

So we should wait until everyone refuses to do it before they can sue? Do we have to wait for every company to fire people without cause before we can sue one for doing it too?

That makes no sense whatsoever!


If he opens some concentration camps and starts exterminating bi-racial babies, I'll retract my statements and issue a formal apology for being wrong.

Okay, so, unless someone murders people, no one can sue them for violations of basic civil rights?

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 09:54 PM
It's not a question of okay. It's a question of legality. Did he break a law? If so arrest him.
It's really that simple


Oh, okay dummy. Whether he's (or the Parish) arrested or not, he's subject to civil litigation in addition to, or in lieu of, criminal penalties. And the Parish is culpable for employing an asshole...

standin
10-25-2009, 09:57 PM
So, in that case, do you believe that all people that have the legal ability to marry people should be required to do so as long as the people are legally marriageable in line with equality laws because they are providing a government service?

If they refuse to do so, do you think they should give up their ability to legally marry people?

Legal marriage is not the same thing as a church sanctioned marriage.

A religious officiate or a magistrate may perform the ceremony.

Here are the basics that you need to know about obtaining a marriage license. The actual specifics depends on where you are getting married.
First you need to apply for a marriage license. After your wedding, once the license is recorded with the county where you were married, you will receive your marriage certificate.

He is not the same as an religious officiate. He resides over the courts. Technically, he should have recused himself from all marriages if he had conflict with American law. A marriage license expires and is limited in legality. If not filed within a certain time frame is not is not a legally binding document. Other laws may take over and legally sanction the marriage, but that is not a religious sanctioned marriage.
Just so you know, in Alabama, last I checked, 48 hours was long enough to deem common law marriage. I think they Recently changed it.

Yes, he was under legal obligation to up hold and wittiness lawful activities for purpose of documentation. Pastors of the Aryan Brotherhood or the Nation of Islam, though I do not think they are legally recognized, would not have to wittiness something against their religious laws

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 10:02 PM
Oh, okay dummy. Whether he's (or the Parish) arrested or not, he's subject to civil litigation in addition to, or in lieu of, criminal penalties. And the Parish is culpable for employing an asshole.
Sue everybody. It'll make the world a better place. Who's the dummy?
It's an ugly truth but assholes do exist and do hold positions of authority. What a revelation .
Nick, What happened to you to make you so full of hate? I'm serious.

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 10:10 PM
Dunno how other states do it -- in Texas, pastors, priests and clergymen are able to sign a marriage certificate, same as a justice of the peace. The point I was making was this -- is it okay for some people to refuse to sign and not okay for others?

If you have been granted the legal ability by the government to sign a marriage certificate, then are you obligated to do so no matter your personal views (religious or otherwise) or else give up the ability to legally officiate a marriage?

As for your request for me to acknowledge your other points, Nick, you're right, I overlooked them in my response. Not because I didn't want to acknowledge them, but because I glossed over them as not an apples to apples comparison.

If the person in the DMV is given the option to not issue a license to drive for whatever reason (as is apparently the case here) and chose to exercise it, more power to them. I wouldn't agree with their reasons any more than I agree with this dude's reasons.

But if they have that right, and choose to exercise it, I don't have a problem with them doing so. If he was legally required to do it, fine, he should have done it or been forced to resign. That doesn't seem to be the case, though.

What it looks to me like is this: You guys are arguing that he should have been forced to do something that he wasn't required to do when he didn't want to do it because his personal views don't conform to your own or those of the majority of society.

Is that basically the case?

Because from what I can deduce, he didn't have to sign it. If he did have to sign it, then yes, he should have done it, or stuck to his guns and resigned.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:12 PM
Sue everybody. It'll make the world a better place. Who's the dummy?

No douchebag, I basically said "sue" those in government that abuse their positions in clear violations of law such as the civil rights act.

And you're the dummy if you need a reminder...


It's an ugly truth but assholes do exist and do hold positions of authority. What a revelation .

Right. But you only care when they're "liberals," right asshole cliche-monger?


Nick, What happened to you to make you so full of hate? I'm serious.

Dude, are you serious? Did you read this fucking thread? Please show examples of my "alleged hate" as compared to yours or anyone elses. But maybe you can reread the part about my lovely, Carmel skinned black (Caribbean) girlfriend and my right to marry her wherever the fuck I want without a douchebag telling me how it "won't work out" as opposed to over 50&#37; of marriages that also "don't work out!"

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 10:15 PM
h.

What it looks to me like is this: You guys are arguing that he should have been forced to do something that he wasn't required to do when he didn't want to do it because his personal views don't conform to your own or those of the majority of society.

Is that basically the case?

Because from what I can deduce, he didn't have to sign it. If he did have to sign it, then yes, he should have done it, or stuck to his guns and resigned.

You know That's how i see it. I am unable to express myself eloquently like Dr. Love.

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 10:15 PM
How about pharmacists who refuse to sell birth control pills?

Bottom line is, if you can't do the job you were hired for because of some political reason or some psycho perversion of "religious morals", then find another fucking job.

I'm not sure if it's a full time job. I doubt it from what I understand of the reqs to be a justice of the peace, and the fact that he's not paid. Actually it doesn't sound much different than being a notary.

Which makes me wonder, can a notary refuse to notarize something on the basis of race/relgion/gender, etc.

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 10:21 PM
No douchebag, I basically said "sue" those in government that abuse their positions in clear violations of law such as the civil rights act.

And you're the dummy if you need a reminder...



Right. But you only care when they're "liberals," right asshole cliche-monger?



Dude, are you serious? Did you read this fucking thread? Please show examples of my "alleged hate" as compared to yours or anyone elses. But maybe you can reread the part about my lovely, Carmel skinned black (Caribbean) girlfriend and my right to marry her wherever the fuck I want without a douchebag telling me how it "won't work out" as opposed to over 50% of marriages that also "don't work out!"

To be honest I'm just enjoying watching you get so pissed off over this.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:32 PM
Dunno how other states do it -- in Texas, pastors, priests and clergymen are able to sign a marriage certificate, same as a justice of the peace. The point I was making was this -- is it okay for some people to refuse to sign and not okay for others?

Um, pastors and priests perform a ceremony at behest of their voluntary, affiliated participants. That's sectarian. A justice of the peace is a member of a government and is compelled to fulfill the sworn functions of his office. He doesn't have the right to arbitrarily decide who he'll marry.


If you have been granted the legal ability by the government to sign a marriage certificate, then are you obligated to do so no matter your personal views (religious or otherwise) or else give up the ability to legally officiate a marriage?

If you have voluntarily sought out to do such duties at the behest of state and federal law, then your personal views are irrelevant!

Again, where is the precedent for this? If you enlist in the military, and you refuse to--say--deploy to a combat zone because you believe that killing Iraqis is immoral, you get charged under the United Code of Military Justice.


As for your request for me to acknowledge your other points, Nick, you're right, I overlooked them in my response. Not because I didn't want to acknowledge them, but because I glossed over them as not an apples to apples comparison.

If the person in the DMV is given the option to not issue a license to drive for whatever reason (as is apparently the case here) and chose to exercise it, more power to them. I wouldn't agree with their reasons any more than I agree with this dude's reasons.

Okay. But that person gets fired, or the DMV gets sued. Because they're clearly violating the basic tenets of civil rights law and not doing their fucking job...


But if they have that right, and choose to exercise it, I don't have a problem with them doing so. If he was legally required to do it, fine, he should have done it or been forced to resign. That doesn't seem to be the case, though.

No, they don't have the "right." No more than I have the "right" to grab a hot young girls ass because I feel like it and she's my employee. Yeah, I can do it. But that doesn't mean I, or my organization, can't get sued by her or that I "may' do it...


What it looks to me like is this: You guys are arguing that he should have been forced to do something that he wasn't required to do when he didn't want to do it because his personal views don't conform to your own or those of the majority of society.

Is that basically the case?

Um, who said he wasn't "required" to do it? If they met the basic stipulations for marriage under Louisiana law for marriage, who is this cunt to deny them that?


Because from what I can deduce, he didn't have to sign it. If he did have to sign it, then yes, he should have done it, or stuck to his guns and resigned.

He didn't "have" to sign anything. But he CHOSE not to sign based on a prejudicial judgment call. And that's fine. Let the courts decide...

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:35 PM
To be honest I'm just enjoying watching you get so pissed off over this.

Just like I'm enjoying watching you pissed off that Obama won the election, and Republicans are floundering in a massive douchbaggary of nothing and irrelevance...

lesfunk
10-25-2009, 10:36 PM
well as long as we're both having fun.... :)

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 10:39 PM
I believe in the article it said that he could choose not to sign the license for any reason?

Again, priests/pastors/clerfy voluntarily choose to become legally able to perform marriages (to sign the marriage certificate). If they have voluntarily chosen to become able to do this, then they shouldn't be able to refuse to do it for anyone that is legally eligible to get married?

I agree that a clergyman can refuse to do a religious ceremony, but what about refusing to legally marry them and sign the certificate? Is that allowed? Sounds like you are saying that it's not allowed, though I suspect it happens much more often than this scenario occurs.

Should we all be outraged over that too, then?

Again, it doesn't seem like this is anything other than a volunteer job. He doesn't get paid and from what I can tell it's not a full time gig. And on top of that, he appears to be allowed legally to refuse to do it, and did so.

So again what's the big deal? That he's a racist douche?

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:40 PM
I'm not sure if it's a full time job. I doubt it from what I understand of the reqs to be a justice of the peace, and the fact that he's not paid. Actually it doesn't sound much different than being a notary.

Which makes me wonder, can a notary refuse to notarize something on the basis of race/relgion/gender, etc.

Sure they can. Then people can sue the their employers for granting office to blatant assholes...

You forgot to bold this BTW: "It is really astonishing and disappointing to see this come up in 2009," said American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana attorney Katie Schwartzmann. She said the Supreme Court ruled in 1967 "that the government cannot tell people who they can and cannot marry."

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 10:51 PM
I believe in the article it said that he could choose not to sign the license for any reason?

LOL You apparently forgot to "bold" that part.


Again, priests/pastors/clerfy voluntarily choose to become legally able to perform marriages (to sign the marriage certificate). If they have voluntarily chosen to become able to do this, then they shouldn't be able to refuse to do it for anyone that is legally eligible to get married?

I agree that a clergyman can refuse to do a religious ceremony, but what about refusing to legally marry them and sign the certificate? Is that allowed? Sounds like you are saying that it's not allowed, though I suspect it happens much more often than this scenario occurs.

But people don't pay taxes to fucking clerics, nor are clerics compelled to marry those that are not members of their houses of worship. We're talking about the local gov't here, so please stop using this silly analogy, 'kay?

Because no one is talking about a clergyman. We're talking about elected officials/appointees...


Again, it doesn't seem like this is anything other than a volunteer job. He doesn't get paid and from what I can tell it's not a full time gig. And on top of that, he appears to be allowed legally to refuse to do it, and did so.

So again what's the big deal? That he's a racist douche?

Okay. I'm a (hypothetically) volunteer fireman who refuses to rescue "niggars and spic's" and I've made this clear to my superiors. And a number of Hispanic kids die as a result of my clear and public refusal to run into a house to rescue them.

Can I, or my town, be sued for that?

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 11:04 PM
LOL You apparently forgot to "bold" that part.

Actually, I didn't forget. Reading comprehension required. Don't start making this personal just because you don't agree. :)


But people don't pay taxes to fucking clerics, nor are clerics compelled to marry those that are not members of their houses of worship. We're talking about the local gov't here, so please stop using this silly analogy, 'kay?

It's a volunteer government service. It's no sillier than your Hitler analogies, and I'd said a lot more relevant.


Because no one is talking about a clergyman. We're talking about elected officials/appointees...

Just wanted to know if, since you were arguing equality, would apply a different standard to different types of people that voluntarily seek out the same types of legal power. Seems like you do.


Okay. I'm a (hypothetically) volunteer fireman who refuses to rescue "niggars and spic's" and I've made this clear to my superiors. And a number of Hispanic kids die as a result of my clear and public refusal to run into a house to rescue them.

Can I, or my town, be sued for that?

Doubt it. It is a volunteer service, after all. I'm sure a lot of people would get all wound up and rant on a david lee roth message board about it though. :)


So are you upset that you think he's a douchebag, or you think he did something illegal? Or is it because you're in an interracial relationship and think you should rage against the man because someone somewhere might tell you that they don't want to marry you?

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 11:06 PM
Sure they can. Then people can sue the their employers for granting office to blatant assholes...

You forgot to bold this BTW: "It is really astonishing and disappointing to see this come up in 2009," said American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana attorney Katie Schwartzmann. She said the Supreme Court ruled in 1967 "that the government cannot tell people who they can and cannot marry."

Missed this post.

So the guy should have resigned/should resign.

standin
10-25-2009, 11:16 PM
You do understand the difference between religious law and Federal law.
And being appointed by the judicial system and being appointed by a religious system?

The JoP is a government appointee, if or if not elected.
He is bound by judicial law and an representative of the government, paid or not.
I am not sure how captains got into the conducting the marriage vows, but they too would not be an government employee (exception being a government ship and then employed by the USA government at the very least the captain of the government ship would be a sub-contractor). I assume that the USA government has ships besides military.

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 11:18 PM
...our governor david patterson...

:019:

Aside from all the other issues in this thread...

Nickdfresh
10-25-2009, 11:23 PM
What? Are you a New Yorker?

A Buffalo, New Yorker!

Dr. Love
10-25-2009, 11:25 PM
You do understand the difference between religious law and Federal law.
And being appointed by the judicial system and being appointed by a religious system?

The JoP is a government appointee, if or if not elected.
He is bound by judicial law and an representative of the government, paid or not.
I am not sure how captains got into the conducting the marriage vows, but they too would not be an government employee (exception being a government ship and then employed by the USA government at the very least the captain of the government ship would be a sub-contractor). I assume that the USA government has ships besides military.

I believe (not 100&#37; certain) that in Texas (I suspect many or most other states as well) you have to be licensed by the state to perform legal marriages. Whether you are a religious clergyman or not.

My question was simply if a person licensed by the state should be required to perform a legal marriage (not a religious one) as a condition of being licensed by the state.

standin
10-25-2009, 11:43 PM
One exception comes to mind - someone is a fetishist. I've heard white guys say they like various ethnic women because of their hair, eyes, booty, etc. It's funny to hear them say these things, yet bizarre and creepy. One guy said to me that he had always been attracted to Asian women. You look at his girlfriend - she's white. :umm::biggrin:

You know what makes my head reel was one time on a talk show, the topic was about interracial relationship, and there on the panel was a white guy and a black woman couple. When asked why he was dating outside his race, he said he "wanted the experience." Excuse me????!!!



Yes, I've heard it. In fact, our governor David Patterson said it in jest when he was talking about following in President Obama's footsteps in becoming President. The first time that I heard the "once you go black" expression was probably from a kid in my class (I grew up in a predominantly black neighborhood). It's just a humorous boastful saying. A non-black person who says this is boasting about how s/he is in such a satisfying relationship with a black person that s/he will never date another person who is not black. If it's a black person saying this, then it means s/he gives satisfaction and has "returning customers." ;) It's like my saying that after having drank Pu Erh tea, Dragon Well, Dragon Pearl Jasmine tea, I ain't going back to a Lipton teabag.

I actually heard it on the white side too. The white side, it meant that the person would not be welcomed back to the white race. And when I heard it from black people it always sounded foreboding. Like oh shit what's going to happen, invasion of the body snatchers? And usually not from a very socially diverse family. And color does not guarantee sexual ability. I can attest to that. If I judged the whole black race one experience. Well, needless to say, I did not experience one side of black culture. Not all of black people run dog fighting mills, mistreat women, have no family skills, have low self esteems, have criminal tendencies and have an inability to preform ( I assume that part), many white guys fit that description too (some parts of that is assumed too). :biggrin:


Oh, I admit if I could find someone that looked like me AND be compatible. I would be with me. I am a separatist that way. But Me's are very far and few between. And inevitably the cringe factor comes up of "Wow, we look so close alike we could be related". That conversation's pretty much a deal breaker. Just eww.

standin
10-25-2009, 11:46 PM
I believe (not 100% certain) that in Texas (I suspect many or most other states as well) you have to be licensed by the state to perform legal marriages. Whether you are a religious clergyman or not.

My question was simply if a person licensed by the state should be required to perform a legal marriage (not a religious one) as a condition of being licensed by the state.

A marriage is not binding until it is submitted to court. The ceremony and certificate is just a temporary marriage until it is registered.

Steve Savicki
10-26-2009, 09:18 AM
The more things change...

Speaking of racial issues:

Hotel owner tells Hispanic workers to change names - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_trouble_in_taos)

FORD
10-26-2009, 11:26 AM
Hey, I've always had this question that no one seemed to know the answer. How come there are no jokes (at least I haven't heard any) about the heterosexual WASP male?

But there are......

Q: Why did God create WASPs?
A: Someone has to buy retail!

Q: What do WASPs think Zimbabwe Rhodesia is?
A: A wide receiver for the Houston Oilers.

Q: How can you tell if a WASP is sexually excited?
A: The stiff upper lip.

Q: What's an American WASP's idea of open-mindedness?
A: Dating a Canadian.

Q: What's a WASP's idea of social security?
A: An ancestor on the Mayflower.

Q: Why did the WASP cross the street?
A: To get to the middle of the road.

Q: What happens when four WASPs find themselves in the same room?
A: A dinner party.

Q: What do WASPs think of the Mideast situation?
A: Well, Newport is all right, but EVERYbody goes to the Cape.

Q: How does a WASP propose marriage?
A: "How would you like to be buried with my people?"

Q: What's a WASP's idea of affirmative action?
A: Hiring South American jockeys.

Q: What do WASPs say after sex?
A: "Thank you very much. I'm sorry. It won't happen again.

Q. What do you call a WASP with a four-inch prick?
A. Well hung.

Q. How can you tell when a WASP is dead?
A. He lets go of his wallet.

Q. What do you call a WASP virgin?
A. You can't. Her number's unlisted.

Q. What's a WASP's favourite song?
A. "I'm Dreaming of a White Christmas."

Q. What does a professional WASP call her boss?
A. Daddy

Q: How many WASPS does it take to change a lightbulb?
A: Three. Two to mix the martinis and one to call the electrician.

Q: What is a WASP menage a trois?
A: Two headaches and one hard-on.

Q: Why do WASPs play golf?
A: So they can dress like pimps.

Q. What is the definition of a WASP?
A. Someone who gets out of the shower to take a leak.

Coyote
10-26-2009, 11:36 AM
Stuff White People Like (http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/)

:biggrin:

Coyote
10-26-2009, 11:57 AM
#33: :stoned-smiley:

Coyote
10-26-2009, 12:04 PM
#116 Black Music that Black People Don’t Listen to Anymore « Stuff White People Like (http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/11/18/116-black-music-that-black-people-dont-listen-to-anymore/)

Coyote
10-26-2009, 12:16 PM
Some things just hit you hard...

#106 Facebook « Stuff White People Like (http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/07/31/106-facebook/)

Jesus Christ
10-26-2009, 04:47 PM
Nobody's posted any Jewish jokes yet?

Should I thank Dad for that? :jesuslol:

Jesus Christ
10-26-2009, 04:55 PM
Verily, there are many of My people in New York, but they hardly own the place. There's at least as many Italians there, right?

Coyote
10-26-2009, 05:00 PM
http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0908/jesus-facepalm-demotivational-poster-1250225982.jpg

:D

Coyote
10-26-2009, 05:01 PM
Nobody's posted any Jewish jokes yet?

Should I thank Dad for that? :jesuslol:

"Two Jews walk into a bar..."

lesfunk
10-26-2009, 05:25 PM
What does a Jewish Child molester say?

"Hey kid, wanna buy some candy?"

Nickdfresh
10-26-2009, 07:54 PM
Oh, gawd. Say it ain't so.

What do you care? I think I'm on the other side of the frigging state, which effectively precludes us from hanging out. :)

Diamondjimi
10-26-2009, 08:09 PM
But there are......

Q: Why did God create WASPs?
A: Someone has to buy retail!

Q: What do WASPs think Zimbabwe Rhodesia is?
A: A wide receiver for the Houston Oilers.

Q: How can you tell if a WASP is sexually excited?
A: The stiff upper lip.

Q: What's an American WASP's idea of open-mindedness?
A: Dating a Canadian.

Q: What's a WASP's idea of social security?
A: An ancestor on the Mayflower.

Q: Why did the WASP cross the street?
A: To get to the middle of the road.

Q: What happens when four WASPs find themselves in the same room?
A: A dinner party.

Q: What do WASPs think of the Mideast situation?
A: Well, Newport is all right, but EVERYbody goes to the Cape.

Q: How does a WASP propose marriage?
A: "How would you like to be buried with my people?"

Q: What's a WASP's idea of affirmative action?
A: Hiring South American jockeys.

Q: What do WASPs say after sex?
A: "Thank you very much. I'm sorry. It won't happen again.

Q. What do you call a WASP with a four-inch prick?
A. Well hung.

Q. How can you tell when a WASP is dead?
A. He lets go of his wallet.

Q. What do you call a WASP virgin?
A. You can't. Her number's unlisted.

Q. What's a WASP's favourite song?
A. "I'm Dreaming of a White Christmas."

Q. What does a professional WASP call her boss?
A. Daddy

Q: How many WASPS does it take to change a lightbulb?
A: Three. Two to mix the martinis and one to call the electrician.

Q: What is a WASP menage a trois?
A: Two headaches and one hard-on.

Q: Why do WASPs play golf?
A: So they can dress like pimps.

Q. What is the definition of a WASP?
A. Someone who gets out of the shower to take a leak.

As a WASP, I find this very offensive...


"Two Jews walk into a bar..."

Careful.....


What does a Jewish Child molester say?

"Hey kid, wanna buy some candy?"

Ah dude, yer on the shit list now...

FORD
10-26-2009, 08:19 PM
As a WASP, I find this very offensive...



Careful.....



Ah dude, yer on the shit list now...

How can you be both a WASP and a Jew? :biggrin:

Diamondjimi
10-26-2009, 08:30 PM
Well ,it wasn't my shit list I was referring to... ;)

FORD
10-26-2009, 08:38 PM
Oh.... I get it....

**Ducks to avoid any stray lightning bolts coming from Heaven......**

Nickdfresh
10-26-2009, 09:12 PM
Well, as I like to say to my girlfriend: "once you go white, you'll go back." :)

Diamondjimi
10-26-2009, 09:30 PM
Oh.... I get it....

**Ducks to avoid any stray lightning bolts coming from Heaven......**

:biggrin:

Nickdfresh
10-26-2009, 10:17 PM
Thank Bodhisattva for that.

Peace. :)

Awe, c'mon. You know you love me. :)

hideyoursheep
10-28-2009, 06:57 AM
Anyone tried this Ancestry.com thing?

Is it some kind of a rip-off?

I did this 15 day trial thing...just to look up my great-grandfather who was killed before my grandmother was born and found some interesting shit, like his draft registration card from 1917. That much was legit.....it was when I dug deeper into the family roots that things seemed a little phony. Anyone else tried it?

Nickdfresh
10-28-2009, 09:24 AM
Anyone tried this Ancestry.com thing?

Is it some kind of a rip-off?

I did this 15 day trial thing...just to look up my great-grandfather who was killed before my grandmother was born and found some interesting shit, like his draft registration card from 1917. That much was legit.....it was when I dug deeper into the family roots that things seemed a little phony. Anyone else tried it?


My parents and a brother are into that stuff. Personally, I don't find it too useful other than being mildly interesting.

I have found out that I'm related to the first guy to get hit by a car and die in Buffalo, NY though. :umm:

Nickdfresh
10-28-2009, 09:25 AM
Oh, please. You can't even rhyme. :hee:

:biggrin:

I'm more of a prose guy anyways...

hideyoursheep
10-28-2009, 03:00 PM
My parents and a brother are into that stuff. Personally, I don't find it too useful other than being mildly interesting.

I have found out that I'm related to the first guy to get hit by a car and die in Buffalo, NY though. :umm:

Once I was into some unfamiliar names, I lost interest myself.

There were a bunch of one-name individuals beginning in the 1830's. People with no last names....not sure what that was all about. That's what made me think it was just a scam.

FORD
10-28-2009, 03:36 PM
If it's a genealogy site, more than likely it's a LDS church recruiting tool. Give them your address, and next thing you know, there will be a couple of young dudes in white shirts, ties, and bicycle helmets knocking on your door with Books of Mormon in hand, willing to tell you about Elohim, our Heavenly Father's plan for your life.

And then they'll baptize all your dead relatives by proxy, so you might as well be Mormon yourself, because all your ancestors now are. :biggrin: