Gibson's offices raided by the Feds!!

[jhale667]

Feds raid Gibson offices

Iconic company investigated for illegal importation of Madagascar wood

Feds raid Gibson offices | The Law | NashvillePost.com: Nashville Business News + Nashville Political News (http://www.nashvillepost.com/news/2009/11/17/gibson_guitars_raided_by_fbi)

UPDATED: To clarify that charges have yet to be filed and identify the federal agency involved in the office search; adds statement from Gibson.

Federal agents from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service and local police today seized wood, guitars, computers and boxes of files from Gibson Guitar's Massman Road manufacturing facility.

Sources say the Nashville-based guitar manufacturer is being investigated for violating the Lacey Act, a key piece of environmental law, for importing endangered species of rosewood from Madagascar.

Rosewood is widely used in the construction of guitars and sells for $5,000 per cubic meter, more than double the price of mahogany. The island nation off Africa's east coast is a key producer of the hardwood, the export of which has links to international criminal activity.

A statement from Gibson released late Tuesday afternoon says the company is "fully co-operating" with the investigation.

"Gibson Guitar is fully cooperating with agents of the United States Fish & Wildlife Service as it pertains to an issue with harvested wood. Gibson is a chain of custody certified buyer who purchases wood from legal suppliers who are to follow all standards. Gibson Guitar Chairman and CEO [Henry Juszkiewicz] sits on the board of the Rainforest Alliance and takes the issue of certification very seriously. The company will continue to cooperate fully and assist our federal government with all inquiries and information," the company's statement said.

Madagascar has struggled financially since a January coup and new President Andry Rajoelina issued an executive order in September legalizing the export of rosewood and ebony. The move was decried by environmental groups and political leaders worldwide, as hardwood forests are key to Madagascar's unique ecology and serve as a habitat for a dwindling lemur population.

Sources tell NashvillePost.com Gibson was involved in a scheme that shipped the wood from Madagascar to Germany and then to the United States.

[Coyote]

Un-fuckin'-real...

[Seshmeister]

Will someone please think of the lemurs. :)

I always wonder what percentage of the combined sound of an electric guitar, amp, effects pedals and fingers is decided by exact type of wood of the body.

I suspect very very little.

[jhale667]

Will someone please think of the lemurs. :)

I always wonder what percentage of the combined sound of an electric guitar, amp, effects pedals and fingers is decided by exact type of wood of the body.

I suspect very very little.

The body? More than you think, actually...

[Coyote]

Fretboard wood? a bit...

[ELVIS]

Sure, the type of wood plays a part in the tone, but it doesn't necessiarily make the tone good, or desirable...

[jhale667]

However, cheap rosewood fretboards feel awful ...

[Hardrock69]

The body? More than you think, actually...


You are NOT of the body!!!!!!
http://i50.tinypic.com/21j9ms7.jpg

[Kristy]

I always wonder what percentage of the combined sound of an electric guitar, amp, effects pedals and fingers is decided by exact type of wood of the body.

I suspect very very little.

On an electric the natural tome characteristics wouldn't add up to much as they would on a dreadnought acoustic. I would not put this past Gibson though in that they would poach wood like a hunter does ivory elephant tusks too sell to a select few customers on the side in these economic times. Be interesting to see how this plays out.

[Seshmeister]

When I saw the title of the thread I assumed they were getting raided for daylight robbery.

The price of a Les Paul standard is insane.

[ELVIS]

I agree with that, especially considering the quality...

[VanHalenFan5150]

Sure, the type of wood plays a part in the tone, but it doesn't necessiarily make the tone good, or desirable...

I really like maple necks... Sadly all I have now are two rosewood-necked guitars. I've been looking for a really nice maple-necked one lately though, they seem to feel and look so much better than rosewoods. Rosewoods are... icky, because they're so common. Maple is softer, in my opinion, as well.

[jhale667]

I like primarily Ebony and then Maple fretboards, in that order....as for Rosewood, the only kind I've liked is Brazilian, doesn't seem to dry out as fast - or as much as other types. That's the only bummer about my Sunburst Strat, feels like I need to oil the fretboard every two weeks..(I've considered swapping out the neck I hate the Rosewood board so much).
I put a Pau Ferro one on my Purple Strat, like that too...looks like (lighter) Rosewood feels like Ebony!

Brazilian Rosewood is expensive though, so one could see them cutting corners... if they were the sneaky types...:rolleyes:

[ELVIS]

Maple is harder in the sense that a baseball bat is very hard maple...

For instance, scalloping a maple fretboard by hand takes maybe three or four times longer than a similar (softer) rosewood board...

A maple board Stratocaster is very much brighter sounding than a similar guitar with a rosewood board...

As far as the feel, especially when scalloped, I can't tell a difference if the demensions are the same...

[ELVIS]

I do have one rosewood board that seems to need oiling with lemon oil far more frequently than my others...

[VanHalenFan5150]

Well, what I meant was that they feel nicer, like a soft-ish feel to them. I didn't necessarily mean that the wood itself was softer. Anyway, I like maple necks more. They play much nicer and they look better anyway...

[jhale667]

I do have one rosewood board that seems to need oiling with lemon oil far more frequently than my others...

...And if it's anything like mine, when you do oil it, it sucks it up like it was dying of thirst or something...:umm:

But back on topic - sorta ;) it amazes me Gibson can justify a $6K price tag on a guitar that you're still going to have to change out the shitty tuners on if you want the thing to actually be functional...

[ELVIS]

...And if it's anything like mine, when you do oil it, it sucks it up like it was dying of thirst or something...:umm:



Yeah, two days later it looks half dry and I really work it in...

[VanHalenFan5150]

Yeah, two days later it looks half dry and I really work it in...

My rosewood neck just entirely absorbs the lemon oil.:biggrin:

[GAR]

I don't mind the Pau Ferro (fake Rosewood) fingerboards, I support the harvesting of more common hardwoods the stupid fuckers can't tell the difference of despite my own preference for the really bitchin' Gaboon Ebony slabs and illegal choice cuts of Rosewood I enjoy pushing thru the bandsaw blade for my own useage.

More for me, less for idiot newbies who can't fucking play and wont' know the difference of having fair or excellent instruments.

I mean, there is nothing at all like the touch and feel of the really reddish-purple Rosewood or black as night Gabon Ebony. On one hand, it's like splitting hairs "pot is pot, it's still marijuana" yes but when you smoke alot of pot, you come to develop preferences, and I personally know what I prefer. Kinda set in my old ways I guess so until God moves the very last tree of ebony to the sawmill, I'll say "make mine quartersawn!!!"

Hooray for Gibson. I'm behind Jusciewitz a hundred percent!

[GAR]

I do have one rosewood board that seems to need oiling with lemon oil far more frequently than my others...

E, try some Rally or Turtle Wax paste carnuba wax with silicone, just on the fingerboard top.

It's gonna oxidize the frets just a little but it should do a good pore-filling job on the rosewood because it sounds like your rosewood is East Indian, which is larger-pored than the Brazillian. You will have to buff out the frets when youre done with a good burlap rag, or a healthy cut of old Levis to rub-down after with..

I think you should try some kind of wax, saving the option of a clear Danish Oil Finish shot for the very last - because you'd have to wipe out the oils you got in there with a rubdown rag fulla acetone or lacquer thinner before oiling. But after that (as a last resort of course) you should have no trouble with open pores in that cut of rosewood. Whatever type it is.

[jhale667]

Kinda set in my old ways I guess so until God moves the very last tree of ebony to the sawmill, I'll say "make mine quartersawn!!!"

Hooray for Gibson. I'm behind Jusciewitz a hundred percent!

I'm all for wood snobbery until you start causing/contributing to the destruction of endangered species and whatnot...gotta draw the line there.

I mean, I want another 1-piece Koa body, but realistically it shouldn't and isn't gonna happen, besides that, I'd feel like a jerk no matter how good the thing sounded.

And it's Juszkiewicz...thought the wiki-master would at least get that right...:hee:

[ELVIS]

I never heard a good sounding Koa guitar. I'm sure they exist and i've seen beautiful examples, but nothing that ripped my head off like Alder, Ash, Mahogony, Korina, Maple and even basswood (as most MIJ Strats are, except for their craft Shop stuff) built guitars...

But you can line up ten Strats, ten pauls, ten whatever and one of each will sound better than the rest. I've proved that to myself and music store owners time and again...

It's not an exact science. A piece of plywood bolted or glued to a toilet seat can potentially sound great!

Gar can even relate to that...

:biggrin:

[jhale667]

I never heard a good sounding Koa guitar. I'm sure they exist and i've seen beautiful examples, but nothing that ripped my head off like Alder, Ash, Mahogony, Korina, Maple and even basswood (as most MIJ Strats are, except for their craft Shop stuff) built guitars...

Betting if you had the chance to check out mine it would change your mind...except for that whole "you're a lefty" thing...;)

(btw, Koa is Hawaiian Mahogany...)


But you can line up ten Strats, ten pauls, ten whatever and one of each will sound better than the rest. I've proved that to myself and music store owners time and again...

Agreed. Sometimes a guitar comes with mojo from...a....factory. :biggrin:


It's not an exact science. A piece of plywood bolted or glued to a toilet seat can potentially sound great!

Gar can even relate to that...

:biggrin:

Speaking of which, found a pic of GAyR's plywood Kramer AssPacer...:D

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g59/trguitar/100_0896.jpg

[ELVIS]

Hahahahaha...:biggrin:

[ELVIS]

But that's not plywood...:D

[jhale667]

But that's not plywood...:D

Shhh....it's a veneer...:hee: It's actually an early "Drop-top"...:lmao:

[ELVIS]

:biggrin:

[GAR]

I never heard a good sounding Koa guitar.

It's a really spongey tone, very acoustic and very loud at that. It's more like a Korina than a basswood. I like it, but I am not used to the light weight of such a thing.

Just like you'd have a set height about where you like a guitar to hang on you, I like to have a certain weight that I'm used to so I'd rather not go exotic like Koa.

BTW unrelatedly, at NAMM Winter show, there was this guy from Hawaii who reps for another dude there who had rights to excavate this 30,000 year old extinct-species Koa from the mud and dry it out and sell it.

It looks really strange and mineralized, anyone heard of this?

[GAR]

And it's Juszkiewicz...thought the wiki-master would at least get that right...:hee:

Tee hee hee! I get it Hale, you think I need Wikipedia the way you use the poster in your room to assist your soiling of the linens.. ha! Hee. O fuck u r dumb.

[jhale667]

the way you use the poster in your room to assist your soiling of the linens..

:confused: Are you referring to the Rhoads poster? :biggrin:

[GAR]

uh.. you have a Randy Rhoads poster?

No wonder you're a 40 year old virgin!

[jhale667]

Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better about your fat, balding, lame excuse for a life, dude..:hee:

[GAR]

I've had a life though Jay, and the way to start in that direction is letting go of the past.

You don't have to. I didn't for a long time either, but then again I now live on the ocean, got my gal here to argue with and made me dinners that I don't like.. you do like dinner dontcha?

[GAR]

Shut the fuck up, Kwappe!

[kwame k]

STFU Clay,

Signed the entire internet.

[jhale667]

I've had a life though Jay,

And like the presumptuous asshat bitch you are, you assume I haven't? :rolleyes: Nice.
Difference is I'm still living mine, and your pathetic excuse for one is nearing the end...:fufu:

But this bit....


and the way to start in that direction is letting go of the past.


What the fuck are you even prattling about?


Do us all a favor and STFU, Dr. Phail.

[GAR]

What the fuck are you even prattling about?

Jay, the capacity to know is found within the desire to know what you're missing out on. Which you do not yet have..

BTW your life called and said to come pick yourself up: in the middle of nowhere. Because it has no clue on where you're at .

[ELVIS]

Hey, your cabinet called and said to google how to wire it up the next time you get a seat in the Library...

[jhale667]

BTW your life called and said...


Really? Yours called and said "Please END ME, I'm tired of all the suck..."

[Hardrock69]

Hooray for Gibson. I'm behind Jusciewitz a hundred percent!

Figures you are behind him. So he's gay, eh? Doesn't surprise me.

Even though you worship his coch, he is a fucking idiot.

His rep in Gnashville is extremely negative. The only people here who have anything good to say about him are ass-kissers who work for him.

And they usually do not work for him for very long.

[Nitro Express]

I like a maple fret board with a light coat of tung oil and stainless steel frets. I'm not really a wood nut. I appreciate fine woods in nice furniture and such but I like simple guitars. I'm pretty much a Strat man but I do think a Les Paul Custom is a gorgeous guitar but I can't stand playing them. I think the Stratocaster is a good looking simple guitar but I also like SG's and Wolfgangs which I think are ugly but man do I like playing them.

[GAR]

His rep in Gnashville is extremely negative.

The rep Tenneseans have is of extreme laziness.

Which is easy enough to overcome. You find a j-o-b and keep it.

[ZahZoo]

Oh here we fucking go with the gawd-damned Lemur population crap again...

[Hardrock69]

The rep Tenneseans have is of extreme laziness.

Which is easy enough to overcome. You find a j-o-b and keep it.

A j-o-b is something you know nothing about, loser, unless it involves you being on your knees blowing someone.

That is YOUR reputation, Garfuckle.

[jhale667]

Wait....is the j-o-b GAyR's referring to one that can or cannot be "stolen by a migrant worker"? :biggrin:

[standin]

Oh here we fucking go with the gawd-damned Lemur population crap again...

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/87/265108031_3c66535005.jpg