View Full Version : The real inconvenient truth
ELVIS
12-11-2009, 12:49 PM
http://a123.g.akamai.net/f/123/12465/1d/www.financialpost.com/2325855.bin?size=404x272
The "inconvenient truth" (http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=2314438) overhanging the UN's Copenhagen conference is not that the climate is warming or cooling, but that humans are overpopulating the world.
A planetary law, such as China's one-child policy, is the only way to reverse the disastrous global birthrate currently, which is one million births every four days.
The world's other species, vegetation, resources, oceans, arable land, water supplies and atmosphere are being destroyed and pushed out of existence as a result of humanity's soaring reproduction rate.
Ironically, China, despite its dirty coal plants, is the world's leader in terms of fashioning policy to combat environmental degradation, thanks to its one-child-only edict.
The intelligence behind this is the following:
-If only one child per female was born as of now, the world's population would drop from its current 6.5 billion to 5.5 billion by 2050, according to a study done for scientific academy Vienna Institute of Demography.
-By 2075, there would be 3.43 billion humans on the planet. This would have immediate positive effects on the world's forests, other species, the oceans, atmospheric quality and living standards.
-Doing nothing, by contrast, will result in an unsustainable population of nine billion by 2050.
Humans are the only rational animals but have yet to prove it. Medical and other scientific advances have benefited by delivering lower infant mortality rates as well as longevity. Both are welcome, but humankind has not yet recalibrated its behavior to account for the fact that the world can only accommodate so many people, especially if billions get indoor plumbing and cars.
The fix is simple. It's dramatic. And yet the world's leaders don't even have this on their agenda in Copenhagen. Instead there will be photo ops, posturing, optics, blah-blah-blah about climate science and climate fraud, announcements of giant wind farms, then cap-and-trade subsidies.
None will work unless a China one-child policy is imposed. Unfortunately, there are powerful opponents. Leaders of the world's big fundamentalist religions preach in favor of procreation and fiercely oppose birth control. And most political leaders in emerging economies perpetuate a disastrous Catch-22: Many children (i. e. sons) stave off hardship in the absence of a social safety net or economic development, which, in turn, prevents protections or development.
China has proven that birth restriction is smart policy. Its middle class grows, all its citizens have housing, health care, education and food, and the one out of five human beings who live there are not overpopulating the planet.
For those who balk at the notion that governments should control family sizes, just wait until the growing human population turns twice as much pastureland into desert as is now the case, or when the Amazon is gone, the elephants disappear for good and wars erupt over water, scarce resources and spatial needs.
The point is that Copenhagen's talking points are beside the point.
The only fix is if all countries drastically reduce their populations, clean up their messes and impose mandatory conservation measures.
:elvis:
ELVIS
12-11-2009, 01:05 PM
"Ironically, China, despite its dirty coal plants, is the world's leader in terms of fashioning policy to combat environmental degradation, thanks to its one-child-only edict."
Thanks to Western educational systems teaching about reproduction and how not to knock each other up from consequences of unsafe sex, we have fewer births per capita than China.
The story's truth is exactly the opposite!
More propoganda.. from the pit of Pelosi no doubt.
jhale667
12-12-2009, 04:21 AM
Uh, I understand it's everyone's right, but is it really responsible to have more than, say 2 or 3 kids? Even if you can afford them, can the world?
And uh....begs the question, are you guys worried about Chinese overpopulation from a socio-political/more clout than America rea$on, or because they're be more asians than you? ;)
:guitar:
jhale667
12-12-2009, 04:24 AM
Read the last question with a hick accent, it makes more sense...:lmao:
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 10:53 AM
Uh, I understand it's everyone's right, but is it really responsible to have more than, say 2 or 3 kids? Even if you can afford them, can the world?
:guitar:
It's sad to hear you buying into such bullshit...
So you really believe God wants the earth to be overpopulated?
If you believe God created the earth, then you also have to believe He created it a specific size, and He's not sitting up there with a Great Celestial Bicycle Pump waiting to blow it up with some more air once the population hits 8 billion.
Rather the global climate change and resulting floods caused by overpopulation (among other factors) will decrease the amount of land suitable to live on, and it's not like you can call God up and ask Him to remake the Garden of Eden in the middle of a desert somewhere. Believe me, I've driven through parts of eastern Utah, and if an entire state full of praying Mormons can't get any results, I doubt it's gonna happen.
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 11:27 AM
LMAO!
God said "be fruitful and multiply."
He didn't say, watch out for global warming, climate change, overpopulation or any of that bullshit!
:elvis:
Hardrock69
12-12-2009, 11:37 AM
Uh, I understand it's everyone's right, but is it really responsible to have more than, say 2 or 3 kids?
Sure if you are a Catholic who (according to Church propaganda) is supposed to provide as many children as possible in order to spread "The Faith".
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 11:44 AM
Catholicism is bullshit as well, but I never heard that "propaganda."
LMAO!
God said "be fruitful and multiply."
He didn't say, watch out for global warming, climate change, overpopulation or any of that bullshit!
:elvis:
He said that to some primitive people at a time when there weren't many humans on the planet. Didn't He tell Adam & Eve to be good stewards of His creation? Jesus taught a parable about the owner of the vineyard and those he left in charge of it, neglecting their duties. Sound familiar?
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 11:57 AM
Sure it does, but you're putting that parable and Adam and Eve in the light the God didn't know there would be the number of people that there are today...
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 11:58 AM
And "primitive people" ??
Where do you get off saying such a thing ??
Did Moses get God's Top 10 list an an e mail, or even overnighted by FedEx?
No, they were carved in a stone tablet. Because they not only didn't have the internet, they didn't even have paper? Well, maybe the Egyptians had papyrus scrolls or whatever, but nobody thought to grab some blank ones when they took off and started that whole 40 years wandering around the desert thing.
So yeah, the word primitive applies.
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 02:02 PM
So, if you were lost in the woods with no resources and aliens found you, you big footed ass would be primitive...
So, if you were lost in the woods with no resources and aliens found you, you big footed ass would be primitive...
By the aliens' standards, probably. If I went hiking in unfamiliar territory without a GPS or at least a cell phone, I'd probably call myself a primitive.
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 02:21 PM
I'll call you primitive now... but the people of the Bible were hardly primitive...
They honestly believed the Sun and the Moon were two big lightbulbs that God put in the sky for their convenience, and that the (flat) earth was the center of the Universe.
There's nothing inherently wrong with them believing that, because they had no means of knowing otherwise. But that is what makes them primitive. The Amish are primitive, but they do so by choice, as do the Muslims in the middle east. Not all of them, just the ones literally stuck in the 12th century.
It's not an insult to say so, just a statement of fact.
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 03:19 PM
You're really stupid...
Are you primitive because you don't really know jack shit about anything ??
The Bible actually suggests the earth is round, but that doesn't really matter much to me because the Bible is written for people and is about people and the human condition, above anything else...
Nickdfresh
12-12-2009, 03:52 PM
LMAO!
God said "be fruitful and multiply."
He didn't say, watch out for global warming, climate change, overpopulation or any of that bullshit!
:elvis:
No he didn't, disgruntled Iron Age sheep herders did. They were living in a relatively sparsely populated Middle East at the time...
Catholicism is bullshit as well, but I never heard that "propaganda."
Right! Your silly superstition is better than their silly superstition...
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 04:31 PM
Whatever dude...
And as far as God's views on the environment......
Revelation, chapter 11
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O LORD God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.
jhale667
12-12-2009, 04:47 PM
It's sad to hear you buying into such bullshit...
Bullshit? Uh, no I'm being practical, dude. And couldn't further hammer you on the religious silliness more than FORD or Nick already did. ;)
And as for this, let's take your "be fruitful and multiply" bullshit and turn it back on you....
Catholicism is bullshit as well
First of all, you're a fucktard for saying the first part of the sentence, (what makes your superstition better?) however...
but I never heard that "propaganda."
As someone who considers myself a (and I hate to use the term, because I know Ally and a couple of cool peeps around here can't stand it...apologize in advance) "recovering" (and I kinda mean it in the organized religion sense of the word, not just a denominationally-raised) Catholic, - altar boy, even (and before someone goes there, was for years, never got touched - inappropriately or otherwise; it happens)...I have heard said "propaganda".
Hell, the parochial school I went to as a kid had priest-recruitment meetings with all the male kids assembled around....8th or 9th grade I think, in addition to (local, secular) military, ROTC-type stuff? But difference was in the pastoral meetings they basically tried to guilt some of us into doing it, particularly the then-present or former altar-kids who seemingly hadn't rejected authority, or "the faith" or anything yet..."Your Church needs you." Yup, heard it said. But again, isn't that how "faith-based" recruitment works across the board?
But isn't it (recruitment meetings aside) true of all organized religions?? Everybody please pump out a litter so the religious tribe-equivalent survives?
OK, now let's take that one step further...
My late father's final wish was, being a only son, that I have a son to "carry on the name". Haven't got around to (reproducing, and yes I know...some... people are worried that I might...:lmao: )it yet. Let's say when I do get around to it:
First (hypothetical) kid's a girl. OK, by that logic, try again (this is a version based in the US on the religious interpretation, without as in the swirl-version, may or may not be worse than reported in regards to the Chinese law - killing/abandoning your 1st girl or however many tries it takes to get it "right").
2nd kid: Girl. Try again for a boy? (also assuming there's not embryonic gender-selection via in vitro fertilization, 'cause pretty sure Catholics and most religions are [still] against that too - Eugenics and whatnot)
Third time not the charm (as it was in my family)? What then, keep going? How many tries for the "heir"? And don't I need a "spare" in that mindset? :D I mean, is eight enough (insert early 80s childhood TV show joke/memory here)? Keep going?
Bueller? :lol:
Guitar Shark
12-12-2009, 04:49 PM
God said "be fruitful and multiply."
God didn't say shit, retard.
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 04:53 PM
Yes He did, asswipe...
jhale667
12-12-2009, 05:05 PM
God didn't say shit, retard.
Well, let's say he/she/it (flying spaghetti-monster scenario) does: Since I've yet to see anyone give religious/divine credit (Christian, Muslim, whatever - heard of one?) for written-language itself (the Romans did it for records-keeping, but it wasn't like the average rube knew how for centuries...)
Safe to say, He didn't tell them to read a book (read a book, read a mutha-fuckin book)...:lmao: The Bible is supposed to be the literal word, right? Yet by all religions admission, the Bible (and all its parallel theological equivalents for that matter) was passed down verbally until such a time that it was transcribed (cough...dead sea scroll) because somebody was around (Constantine trying to keep the empire in line, and essentially alive, wasn't it?) that finally had the means to...
It's a shame that this thread is taking place on a Saturday, and Jesus can't be here to speak on behalf of His Dad. :(
jhale667
12-12-2009, 05:12 PM
He said that to some primitive people at a time when there weren't many humans on the planet. Didn't He tell Adam & Eve to be good stewards of His creation? Jesus taught a parable about the owner of the vineyard and those he left in charge of it, neglecting their duties. Sound familiar?
Sure it does, but you're putting that parable and Adam and Eve in the light the God didn't know there would be the number of people that there are today...
But doesn't He know everything? And if so, how didn't he NOT see that one coming? Imagine insert "Revalation/Rapture" reference here? :biggrin:
:guitar:
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 05:16 PM
My point was He does know everything!
jhale667
12-12-2009, 05:17 PM
So wait, does Constantine get credit for the Bible, or King James for making the first widely-accepted "standardization"? :confused:
King James...there's a thread unto itself....:D
jhale667
12-12-2009, 05:20 PM
My point was He does know everything!
So, like...if we all get religion (or your version of it), God will stop global warming and overpopulation? :umm:
jhale667
12-12-2009, 05:25 PM
Speaking of global overpopulation...there's a CAP and Trade joke in there somewhere....;)
As in cap world population (or at least curtail -globally - it via planned, responsible parenthood, something most religions are against) or trade choking out the Earth and thus ourselves...
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 05:39 PM
So, like...if we all get religion (or your version of it), God will stop global warming and overpopulation? :umm:
Those things are easily in His control, but on the other hand, I don't believe in neither of those topics...
Global warming is yesterday's news as the new term is climate change, and i'm quite certain that will change pretty soon...
And what is your honest answer for overpopulation, assuming that it does indeed exist ??
BTW, God has a sense of humor...
:elvis:
sadaist
12-12-2009, 06:12 PM
LMAO!
God said "be fruitful and multiply."
:
But he had no idea the poorest people would be rewarded with monetary raises for each child they had. If a woman is on welfare with 5 kids, she should not be allowed to have any more.
Humans are like a virus. We will continue to expand & grow until we completely destroy the host body (earth).
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 06:15 PM
He had no idea ??
Seshmeister
12-12-2009, 07:48 PM
It's really quite simple.
You can sit down and work out the resources of the world in terms of water and energy.
Creating food takes up a lot of both. It takes literally a few thousand bottles of water to create even a hamburger.
You can believe in god(s) or whatever but there is the same amount of resources on the planet now as there were thousands of years ago. Water doesn't arrive from space every Tuesday. It never arrives, we have what we have.
A common way of measuring how much of this shit we have is in hectares. If you divide it up there are 14 billion hectares of resources on the planet. Think of it as 14 billion hectares of we can all share.
At the moment Americans use 9 each, Europeans 5, Chinese 2 and Africans 1.
That means if everyone lived like Americans the planet can support 1.5 billion people. If everyone lived like Africans we can support 18 billion.
At the moment there are 6.5 billion people on the planet - by the time the average person that reads this website dies in 2050 it will be 9 billion.
That 9 billion doesn't just come from people having dozens of children due to no contraception although the catholic church has a lot to fucking answer for on that front.
It comes from the fact we have a lot of young people on the planet just now and young people inevitably have kids.
And don't think that it's only going to be a bunch more kids with flies in their faces in Africa dying and we'll be unaffected apart from tedious self serving charity concerts.
The US census figures show a 30% increase in the American population in the next 30 years or so.
http://www.census.gov/population/www/projections/files/nation/summary/np2008-t1.csv
So really all this shit about climate change and people arguing about temperatures doesn't matter a huge amount because even if there is no such thing as global warming we need to stop wasting so much shit or we're going to starve to death or at least be living in poverty in our old age.
You can pretend that some god is going to appear and fix all this shit for you but that seems pretty fucking unlikely. Thinking that is like jumping out a skyscraper and expecting to be caught by him halfway down.
Cheers!
:gulp:
Seshmeister
12-12-2009, 07:53 PM
He had no idea ??
And please stop all this bible literalism, you aren't that stupid.
If god wrote the bible there wouldn't be the thousands of contradictions and mistakes that are in it. He wouldn't have allowed mistranslations and so on.
It's one thing to be part of the jewish zombie cult, I can understand that, it's a powerful cultural machine but please spare us the crazy bible literalism because it is completely and utterly fucking unarguably wrong.
jhale667
12-12-2009, 08:32 PM
Humans are like a virus. We will continue to expand & grow until we completely destroy the host body (earth).
Exactly.
What part of responsible planned parenthood did you not get, ELVIS? Perhaps something more than "Abstinence-Only" Education World-wide as a start? Women's rights to choose (when not to have a litter and the education part to know why one shouldn't)?
Oh wait, organized religion's against that...but I'd like to think (a supposedly benevolent) God isn't... :umm:
Seshmeister
12-12-2009, 08:38 PM
Educating women is everything.
Educated women have small families later.
Assuming that they haven't been damaged by one of the more dangerous religious viruses.
Baby's On Fire
12-12-2009, 10:00 PM
You're really stupid...
Are you primitive because you don't really know jack shit about anything ??
The Bible actually suggests the earth is round, but that doesn't really matter much to me because the Bible is written for people and is about people and the human condition, above anything else...
YOU believe in an invisible man in the sky no one has ever seen nor borne witness to...and an ancient publication not even fit to wipe my ass with...and you'rte asking him if he's stupid???
bueno bob
12-12-2009, 11:05 PM
LMAO!
God said "be fruitful and multiply."
He didn't say, watch out for global warming, climate change, overpopulation or any of that bullshit!
:elvis:
Can you point me out the passage where he said "Fuck your community"?
As I remember, Jesus seemed to be pretty conservative in regards to nature...
ace diamond
12-12-2009, 11:08 PM
YOU believe in an invisible man in the sky no one has ever seen nor borne witness to...and an ancient publication not even fit to wipe my ass with...and you'rte asking him if he's stupid???
the only valid historical proof to ever surface was in tibetian
sanskrit writings that are 2,000 years old and no one outside of a monestary other than national geographic sometime in the late 1980's or 1990's, has seen the actual documents in nearly 120 years.
only once was it ever translated into english.
it was published in english in the 1890's.......and the guy that translated it was laughed at all the way to his grave.
i urge anyone who wants to look it up to help yourself.
elvis, on fire here has a bit more solid ground to stand on here than you do.
Seshmeister
12-12-2009, 11:10 PM
When did what the Jewish zombie ever actually matter to the Christians?
He spent most of his time in the story talking about money.
Money money money.
How you should give all your money to the poor.
Give it away or you are really really fucked he said, again and again and again.
But the Christians on the whole ignore that bit.
They prefer to get excited about stuff that doesn't involve inconvenient shit like giving your money away. Stuff that the Jesus character never actually even mentioned like constantly worrying about where people stick their penises and into whom...
bueno bob
12-12-2009, 11:11 PM
The Bible actually suggests the earth is round, but that doesn't really matter much to me because the Bible is written for people and is about people and the human condition, above anything else...
This is where history, science and archeology will expand your limited tunnel vision thinking patterns.
The bible wasn't written for people. That's only a fraction of the story. It was written by people for the purposes of manipulating people into a particular mindset so as to me more easily manipulated.
Pretty much any IN DEPTH study of religion will show you that.
Who was it that said religion shouldn't be investigated too carefully at the risk of it bringing up VERY uncomfortable holes in the plot? Oh yeah, Abraham Lincoln.
Ah, fuck, what did HE know, right? :rolleyes:
Anybody who lets a book thousands of years old (and older) written by a bunch of sheep herders and then corrupted by governments and organized institutions for the purposes of mass manipulation in this day and age deserves what they get, as far as I'm concerned.
The unfortunate aspect is that the rest of us DO NOT.
bueno bob
12-12-2009, 11:14 PM
When did what the Jewish zombie ever actually matter to the Christians?
He spent most of his time in the story talking about money.
Money money money.
How you should give all your money to the poor.
Give it away or you are really really fucked he said, again and again and again.
But the Christians on the whole ignore that bit.
They prefer to get excited about stuff that doesn't involve inconvenient shit like giving your money away. Stuff that the Jesus character never actually even mentioned like constantly worrying about where people stick their penises and into whom...
Oh yes...Christians absolutely LOVE their money...how many mansions do the upper tiers of that division have to show for themselves?
How many churches hang on desperately to their tax-free status?
That right there says it all.
ace diamond
12-12-2009, 11:25 PM
Oh yes...Christians absolutely LOVE their money...how many mansions do the upper tiers of that division have to show for themselves?
How many churches hang on desperately to their tax-free status?
That right there says it all.
yup it does.
churches and religions are businesses just like any other government and company on the planet.
so everyone else gets taxed and they don't.:rolleyes:
i'm calling bullshit.
the churches and their religion is a fucking corporation.
i support the removal of their tax exemption.
Baby's On Fire
12-12-2009, 11:39 PM
I support removal of their heads...and their tiny dicks...cuz 99 % of those "religious" perverts are guilty of diddling young boys.
One of many dozens of reasons I despise religion......
ELVIS
12-12-2009, 11:57 PM
The bible wasn't written for people. That's only a fraction of the story. It was written by people for the purposes of manipulating people into a particular mindset so as to me more easily manipulated.
Hahahaha...
More to the point, the Bible wasn't written at all, it was compiled, from dozens of different works from different authors. Some of them, like Paul's writings, were intended as a letter to an individual or a small group of people of that time. And then there's Leviticus, which the right wingers like to use to bash the gays, which was never intended for public consumption at all, but was designed as a rule book for a specific sect of priests (called the Levites) back in the day. And the Song of Solomon? What's a love poem from some king doing in there? Particularly when the king in question was a serial adulterer, and didn't mean a word of what he was writing. 700 wives AND 300 ho's besides that? Please......
And yet the "Christian" right would tell you Solomon was more "moral" than his bisexual father King David.
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 01:00 AM
Don't you profess to be a Christian, FORD ??
None of the books of the Bible would have been written without these men being inspired by God and by that I mean, filled with Holy Spirit...
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 01:12 AM
I support removal of their heads...and their tiny dicks...cuz 99 % of those "religious" perverts are guilty of diddling young boys.
One of many dozens of reasons I despise religion......
agreed and seconded.
QUOTE=ELVIS;1409682]Don't you profess to be a Christian, FORD ??
None of the books of the Bible would have been written without these men being inspired by God and by that I mean, filled with Holy Spirit...[/QUOTE]
Did the Holy Spirit tell somebody that bats were birds, or that the earth was the center of the Universe?
I don't think so.
Of course none of those things have to do with the teachings of Jesus Christ.
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 01:20 AM
Don't you profess to be a Christian, FORD ??
None of the books of the Bible would have been written without these men being inspired by God and by that I mean, filled with Holy Spirit...
elvis, you are failing miserably and being so very seriously owned.
even by me.........nothing against sticking to your guns, but dude,
when the overwhelming amount of hard evidence is being put in front of you, hard indisputable evidence, and that doesn't get you to thinking maybe there might be something to it?
dude, your case crumbled a long time ago.
now do the smart thing and tuck tail and go lick your wounds.
:gulp:
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 01:23 AM
elvis is being owed by us "TROLLS".
therefore, i propose that a mod should re-name this thread
"REVENGE OF THE TROLLS"
:troll:
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 01:30 AM
I am sticking to my guns and I am thinking about each and every response...
What normally happens is that some pussified, so-called Christian get's upset and says some bullshit that makes no sense...
I'm not prepared to do that. I also know i'm among friends...
:elvis:
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 01:39 AM
I am sticking to my guns and I am thinking about each and every response...
SURE YOU DO. THAT'S WHY YOU KEEP COMING BACK WITH THE SAME TIRED ASS BULLSHIT.
What normally happens is that some pussified, so-called Christian get's upset and says some bullshit that makes no sense...
CONTRADICT YOURSELF MUCH?
I'm not prepared to do that. I also know i'm among friends...
:elvis:
YOU JUST KEEP TELLING YOURSELF THAT......MAYBE ONE DAY IT MIGHT
BE A WISH COME TRUE:rolleyes:
YES, ELVIS YOU ARE AMONG FRIENDS, UNFORTUNATELY FOR YOU THEY ARE ALL IMAGINARY. DUDE, IT'S ALL IN YOUR HEAD.
:gulp:
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 01:43 AM
Now, that was stupid and spoken like a real pussy...
:elvis:
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 01:48 AM
Now, that was stupid and spoken like a real pussy...
:elvis:
not without a tit job and a sex change.
and that will not be happening.
EVER.
besides, in order for you afore mentioned to hold any truth,
according to you, in your own words, i would have to be a christian in order to be a pussy.
however, i am an apache. neither of the conditions of your own criteria apply to me.
THEREFORE:
YOU FAIL AGAIN, ELVIS!!!
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 01:51 AM
Oh no!!!!!!!!!
Huge font frightens me!!!
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 01:55 AM
oh no!!!!!!!!!
Huge font frightens me!!!
grasp at straws much?
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 01:58 AM
And you are mincing my words, pussy. My point was that some lesser (maybe that is the wrong word), or some younger Christian might get upset and withdraw himself from a discussion or argument...
You have in fact said nothing that pertains to anything execpt the idea that you are an Apache. Does that make you special in the sense that you don't need God or Jesus ??
elvis is being owed by us "TROLLS".
therefore, i propose that a mod should re-name this thread
"REVENGE OF THE TROLLS"
:troll:
I'm only seeing one troll in this thread.
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 02:10 AM
Hmmm...
Apparently he doesn't have the League of Douchebags Signal equipment yet like GAyR, Sockfucker, Pedobear and the other trolls do, that always call each other in for stupidity reinforcement.
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 02:16 AM
haha...:biggrin:
Time for some saturday night entertainment!
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/DSwG9Tojg9I&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/DSwG9Tojg9I&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
:elvis:
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 02:28 AM
And you are mincing my words, pussy. My point was that some lesser (maybe that is the wrong word), or some younger Christian might get upset and withdraw himself from a discussion or argument...
You have in fact said nothing that pertains to anything execpt the idea that you are an Apache. Does that make you special in the sense that you don't need God or Jesus ??
it means that your god and your jesus and your religion means nothing to me.
i am an apache.
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk267/conjurman/satan%20stuff/bible.jpg
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk267/conjurman/satan%20stuff/336554-Christianity1.jpg
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk267/conjurman/satan%20stuff/105675-JESUSCHRIST.jpg
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk267/conjurman/satan%20stuff/2nrn0hg.jpg
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk267/conjurman/satan%20stuff/freedom-from-religion.jpg
are you starting to get the picture, elvis?
to me, your religion sounds so very stupid and insane that it is no wonder
that anyone in your religion isn't in a straight jacket and locked in a padded room, doing the thorazine shuffle.
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 02:30 AM
It's not a religion...
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 02:33 AM
It's not a religion...
bullshit.
otherwise the building where members of your religion met, a/k/a "the church"
wouldn't have a tax exempt status.
if it were not a religion, your pastor and every preacher in the usa would be paying
a whole lot of taxes they are right now exempt from.
income taxes
property taxes
state and federal taxes
payroll taxes
corporate taxes
there are more taxes but i cannot remember them all.
so what you are saying is that your christianity is not a religion, therefore
you are prepared to surrender tax exemption status?
are you sure it's not a religion.
because last time i checked, it is in fact an organised religion.
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 02:37 AM
Please explain your stance...
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 02:52 AM
Please explain your stance...
i already have.
i am an apache.
i am a native american indian.
your religion has only ever caused misery and suffering to the apache people.
and the native americans of every tribe and nation.
you called us savages and heathens.
we have long memories.
we do not forget the many horrible things your religion did to us and our brothers.
"re-education"
hair cuts
registration
small pox
influenza
pneumonia
tuberculosis
starvation
enslavement
imprisonment
being forbidden to be who we are.
not being allowed to speak our own languages
the destruction of our people, our lands, our culture, our way of life.
your religion is the worst thing to ever happen to the native people of the americas.
north and south.
it is a cancerous poison.
i hate your religion.
it is a lie.
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 03:01 AM
No it's not. I'm part German and part American Indian, asswipe, and I get what your saying even though it's a bit dumbfounded...
How are you being forbidden ??
ace diamond
12-13-2009, 04:42 AM
No it's not. I'm part German and part American Indian, asswipe, and I get what your saying even though it's a bit dumbfounded...
How are you being forbidden ??
christianity is a lie.
what i said is not "dumbfounded"-
it is historical fact.
A common way of measuring how much of this shit we have is in hectares. If you divide it up there are 14 billion hectares of resources on the planet. Think of it as 14 billion hectares of we can all share.
At the moment Americans use 9 each, Europeans 5, Chinese 2 and Africans 1.
That means if everyone lived like Americans the planet can support 1.5 billion people. If everyone lived like Africans we can support 18 billion.
So then if the rest of the world can feed its' own fucking selfish self, the US doesn't have to keep giving its wealth away to help support it> and we don't have to buy or import it's crap to sustain our own 300million people.
Sounds like you got it covered! Sesh for UN Emperor!
christianity is a lie.
what i said is not "dumbfounded"-
it is historical fact.
When did Jesus ever say that.. in what verse tell me
Sesh is so full of crap. The US grows so much shit we have trouble exporting it we have to give it away to Russia, Africa, India, China.
You got it backwards, we're feeding them.
Seshmeister
12-13-2009, 10:07 AM
Sesh is so full of crap. The US grows so much shit we have trouble exporting it we have to give it away to Russia, Africa, India, China.
You got it backwards, we're feeding them.
I could understand you being wrong if it wasn't for the fact you are on the internet.
Go and look it up.
The US is a net importer of food. Also I was talking about resources. To make food you need oil and gas to make fertilizer and run the machines.
The US is of course a net importer of oil too.
Nickdfresh
12-13-2009, 11:12 AM
Don't you profess to be a Christian, FORD ??
None of the books of the Bible would have been written without these men being inspired by God and by that I mean, filled with Holy Spirit...
Remember Elvis, just like Jesus said, "if you're not with us, then you're against us and fuck you and die!"
Oh, wait. Maybe it was different or something...
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 12:34 PM
It was very different...
No, I think that was Chimpy who said that :biggrin:
ELVIS
12-13-2009, 12:37 PM
No, Bush said "if you're not with us, you're with the terra-ists."
bueno bob
12-14-2009, 11:15 AM
Hahahaha...
You're one of the manipulated. Laugh all you like, it's your loss. As long as you continue to allow a book of collected governmental propaganda influence your life and your decisions and your thinking, you're just another one of the sheep getting herded into a particular set of views based on what somebody else with money and influence wanted your ancestors to believe a few thousand years ago.
Thousands of years later, and evolution has carried on - yet religion still holds the same grip on the herd-mentality that it always has.
You will never think clearly nor will you think for yourself as long as you let ANY religion rule your mindset.
And if you don't let it rule your mindset, at least as far as Christianity is concerned, then you're nothing more than a fucking hypocrite and not a real Christian. Thus, Hell awaits you and it'll be your home for eternity. God doesn't tolerate hypocrites.
Your tenets, not mine. Think about them.
;)
ace diamond
12-14-2009, 11:57 AM
You're one of the manipulated. Laugh all you like, it's your loss. As long as you continue to allow a book of collected governmental propaganda influence your life and your decisions and your thinking, you're just another one of the sheep getting herded into a particular set of views based on what somebody else with money and influence wanted your ancestors to believe a few thousand years ago.
Thousands of years later, and evolution has carried on - yet religion still holds the same grip on the herd-mentality that it always has.
You will never think clearly nor will you think for yourself as long as you let ANY religion rule your mindset.
And if you don't let it rule your mindset, at least as far as Christianity is concerned, then you're nothing more than a fucking hypocrite and not a real Christian. Thus, Hell awaits you and it'll be your home for eternity. God doesn't tolerate hypocrites.
Your tenets, not mine. Think about them.
;)
here, elvis, let me dumb it down so even a stupid brain washed
lemming like you can understand it:
a quote from Ronnie James Dio(Black Sabbath-era) circa 1981:
IF YOU LISTEN TO FOOLS.........THE
MOB RULES!!!
christianity has only ever fostered a "mob rule" mentality that is suscepitble
to extreme ignorance.
prime examples of this would be "the crusades", "the inquisition" and other such atrocities throughout history.
even now, the current chimpy war is a result of this.
all organised religion has ever been about is a means of controlling the masses of weak willed and weak minded. sadly, that is most of the human population of the planet.
christianity and the "mob rule" mentality is responsible for street gangs.
it is responsible because "the church" still purports a mentality of
"us against the world"
i got news for you elvis, that is the same kind of thinking david koresh had.
and look what became of him.
also the "anyone who is not for christ is against christ, and therefore is an
'anti-christ', and is therefore against us so we must eliminate all threats
(i.e., apartheid, genocide, ethnic cleansing, torture, etc.....) and we must be given the chance to be one of us or be destroyed"
destruction of native people and cultures, greed, invading and conquering
as much foreign lands as possible
subverting and destroying the truth in any way that does not coincide with the tenets of the christian religion, much is lost to history because
of this stupid and greedy religion and its' lust for gold, land, power, control, because of the greed of the christian, so many horrible atrocities have been committed.
but that's ok, because god and jesus and a ghost said it was.
:rolleyes:
elvis, it never amazes me how anyone could be so incredibly stupid enough to believe any of this shit.
elvis, how could you be so incredibly stupid as to believe this load of fucking bullshit?
especially when there is so much hard evidence to the contrary?
nurse rossetta, elvis needs his thorozine injection, so we can take him to his electro-shock therapy appointment. he is getting a frontal lobotomy in the morning.
just make sure to keep him in the straight jacket and chained down in the rubber room.
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 12:46 PM
elvis, how could you be so incredibly stupid as to believe this load of fucking bullshit?
especially when there is so much hard evidence to the contrary?
What hard evidence ??
standin
12-14-2009, 01:03 PM
Wow, Elvis. You sure do martyr yourself a lot. Are you sure you do not have a S&M thing?
Every-things is God's Elvis, including population controls such as disasters.
Over population will cause hardship.
Speaking of, what happen to the Flu scare, I had an article on the back burner loosely related to the flu scare and now it seems to have blown over. :umm:
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 01:18 PM
Every-things is God's Elvis, including population controls such as disasters.
:umm:
But everything is not God's will...
But everything is not God's will...
Well, if natural disasters are not God's will, then what caused them?
Could it be.............. GLOBAL CLIMATE CHANGE???
(or in the case of your hometown, failure to properly maintain infrastructure such as levees. Added to the global climate change)
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 01:32 PM
I didn't say natural disasters were or were not God's will because I don't really know...
But how can you say the city of New Orleans contributed to the so-called "climate change" by failing to build superior levees ??
standin
12-14-2009, 01:40 PM
But everything is not God's will...
Everything is God's, Elvis.
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 01:42 PM
Everything is God's, Elvis.
But if you jump off of a roof onto your fat head after this post, it's most likely NOT God's will...
I didn't say natural disasters were or were not God's will because I don't really know...
But how can you say the city of New Orleans contributed to the so-called "climate change" by failing to build superior levees ??
The levees were good enough when they were built. But they should have been rebuilt and they were not, because the Army Corps of Engineers budget was cut.
Also the global climate change caused Katrina, not the other way around. One of the worst hurricanes in history, during one of the warmest summers in history.... do the math.
Jesus Christ
12-14-2009, 01:56 PM
But if you jump off of a roof onto your fat head after this post, it's most likely NOT God's will...
Gregory, how do ye knoweth what My Dad's will is?
kwame k
12-14-2009, 01:56 PM
I thought God gave us free will?
Jesus Christ
12-14-2009, 01:58 PM
I thought God gave us free will?
Verily, My son. He did.
kwame k
12-14-2009, 02:03 PM
I guess I separate the two, Organized Religion and Christ's teachings........most of what he said were morality tales or parables. You can interpret it anyway you like, good or bad.
There are many people who believe in God/Christ but don't agree on the Organized part. You know the old saying, " Lord save me from your followers".
standin
12-14-2009, 02:03 PM
limited free will.
such as:
You have choice A or choice B.
With choice A, X happens, with choice B, Y happens.
It is all still God's.
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 02:05 PM
Was hurricane Camille in 1969 due to this bullcrap MAN-MADE global climate change ??
That was years before Time Magazine reported the comming ICE AGE!
kwame k
12-14-2009, 02:15 PM
Was hurricane Camille in 1969 due to this bullcrap MAN-MADE global climate change ??
That was years before Time Magazine reported the comming ICE AGE!
Since Ice Ages are cyclic we may be at the crest of another one. I've read about a mini-ice age as being plausible and we've had one in recorded history.
I've also read that global warming will lead to another ice age as the Polar Caps melt adding fresh water into the oceans the currents will change and effect our weather patterns. Meaning that not everywhere on Earth will get warmer but whether patterns will change. Colder climates will get colder and warmer climates will get warmer. Temperate climates will change, too.
You can't deny that we've fucked this Earth up.....our resources are not endless and at some point the Earth can not sustain the people on it. It's simple math...the habitable parts of the Earth will get overpopulated and not be able to sustain the amount of people on it.
I feel the truth lies in the middle.
jhale667
12-14-2009, 02:15 PM
Was hurricane Camille in 1969 due to this bullcrap MAN-MADE global climate change ??
Since we're talking about a process man has been contributing to since the age of industrialization? Probably helped...
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 02:20 PM
You can't deny that we've fucked this Earth up.....
Yes I can...
kwame k
12-14-2009, 02:22 PM
Since we're talking about a process man has been contributing to since the age of industrialization? Probably helped...
That's it! To say man has had no impact on the Earth is fucking stoopid. Strip mines, deforestation, pollutants both airborne and what has leached into the ground has effected the Earth, period. You don't need a scientist to tell you what you can see with your own eyes.
jhale667
12-14-2009, 02:22 PM
Yes I can...
Sure you could, but you'd be wrong...:tongue0011:
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 02:25 PM
I'm lost for words...
kwame k
12-14-2009, 02:25 PM
Yes I can...
Really, ever seen the parts of Russia that are so toxic that no living thing can live there? How about when the river back East caught on fire?
Nothing to see here, move on? Really ELVIS, can you honestly say man has had no impact on this Earth.
As you well know, living in New Orleans (and apparently having some ties in Florida that you have referred to in the past) hurricane season is in the summer and early fall, because they require warm ocean water to exist. Hurricanes are "normal" during these months, but warmer temperatures - which lead to warmer oceans - will result in stronger hurricanes.
Compare that to the relatively quiet hurricane season which just passed, with many areas reporting cooler than normal summer temperatures.
kwame k
12-14-2009, 02:39 PM
Along those lines, FORD. As populations built in areas that were not meant for humans to live on, you see the effects of massive hurricanes. Nature had the perfect answer for controlling floods....flood plains.
When you build below sea level or on flood plains you're asking for trouble.
ELVIS
12-14-2009, 02:40 PM
As you well know, living in New Orleans (and apparently having some ties in Florida that you have referred to in the past) hurricane season is in the summer and early fall, because they require warm ocean water to exist. Hurricanes are "normal" during these months, but warmer temperatures - which lead to warmer oceans - will result in stronger hurricanes.
Compare that to the relatively quiet hurricane season which just passed, with many areas reporting cooler than normal summer temperatures.
So what's your point ??
ace diamond
12-14-2009, 04:16 PM
Yes I can...
then you willfully choose, of your own volition,
to be ignorant and stupid.
way to go, redneck.
Igosplut
12-14-2009, 04:33 PM
Since Ice Ages are cyclic we may be at the crest of another one. I've read about a mini-ice age as being plausible and we've had one in recorded history.
I've also read that global warming will lead to another ice age as the Polar Caps melt adding fresh water into the oceans the currents will change and effect our weather patterns. Meaning that not everywhere on Earth will get warmer but whether patterns will change. Colder climates will get colder and warmer climates will get warmer. Temperate climates will change, too.
You can't deny that we've fucked this Earth up.....our resources are not endless and at some point the Earth can not sustain the people on it. It's simple math...the habitable parts of the Earth will get overpopulated and not be able to sustain the amount of people on it.
I feel the truth lies in the middle.
So do I
Best post of the thread
bueno bob
12-14-2009, 05:31 PM
I don't really know...
So you're admitting to being agnostic then?
Guitar Shark
12-14-2009, 07:58 PM
I'm lost for words...
Words that make sense, anyway.
Seshmeister
12-14-2009, 08:30 PM
Speaking of, what happen to the Flu scare, I had an article on the back burner loosely related to the flu scare and now it seems to have blown over. :umm:
It never mutated into something worse this time around and we got lucky again.
That combined with vaccinations means that it's under control.
So it will only kill about ten times as many people as 9-11 in the US over the year.
Nickdfresh
12-14-2009, 08:35 PM
Yes I can...
Go to some of your scrap yards on the outer belt of New Orleans, with literally thousands of cars piled up on one another, with leaking antifreeze, motor oil, gas, and transmission/axle fluids. Then get back to me!
Even you're not this stupid...
Igosplut
12-15-2009, 06:56 AM
Go to some of your scrap yards on the outer belt of New Orleans, with literally thousands of cars piled up on one another, with leaking antifreeze, motor oil, gas, and transmission/axle fluids. Then get back to me!
Even you're not this stupid...
The EPA has federal laws on junkyards for a few years now. I'd be surprised to know that was still the case. There are stiff fines for simple things like just leaving a battery on the ground out in the open. They also pull raids on complaints, and do normal inspections even on repair shops. This is one of the reasons you almost never see in-ground lifts anymore. That's the first thing they make you take out (no in-ground oil tanks allowed).
Seshmeister
12-15-2009, 07:07 AM
The biggest problem in the US and the reason it comes bottom of every league table is the shitty dirty power stations which waste nearly half of the energy burnt in them.
Last year flying all the way up the East coast on a clear day I could see dozens of these things one after another belching out crap all the way from Florida to NY.
It makes a complete fucking mockery of all the LA types in their Priuses.
You need to build a ton of nuclear and renewable power stations.
Or at least dozens of clean fossil fuel ones.
Igosplut
12-15-2009, 07:58 AM
The biggest problem in the US and the reason it comes bottom of every league table is the shitty dirty power stations which waste nearly half of the energy burnt in them.
Last year flying all the way up the East coast on a clear day I could see dozens of these things one after another belching out crap all the way from Florida to NY.
It makes a complete fucking mockery of all the LA types in their Priuses.
You need to build a ton of nuclear and renewable power stations.
Or at least dozens of clean fossil fuel ones.
Funny you should mention this...
Back in 98 MA changed their Auto emission laws, making them much stricter (and not as strict as they wanted which was CA IM 240). On the front page of a Cape Cod paper the were heralding (the state) the change, saying it would eliminate 100 metric tons a day of pollution. On the SAME PAGE in a much smaller article there was a report of a enviormental group that was suing COM Electric (the electricity provider for the Cape, and the owner of the plant) to clean up the Cape Cod Canal power plant. This plant (last I knew, at that time) was the dirtiest plant in the country (purchasing the most "Emission credits" from all the other plants). The company said they would voluntary put catalytic converters in the smoke stacks that would eliminate better than 100 tons a day, if they would drop the suit. The group said "no way, not nearly good enough". So things stayed the same. They have done something in the last few years (you used to see the smoke from anywhere on the Cape bay shores on a clear day, and I haven't in the last few) But it was like that forever. If I had to guess, I would say the MA politicians or relatives had an interest in the industrial sector, and it was easier to go after auto emissions (this is like many states BTW)
As an aside, on the Cape we get most of our pollution from New York. Somehow the wind patterns blow it all over here, and sometimes in the summer it stalls over us (we get warnings from newscasters)....
Seshmeister
12-15-2009, 08:20 AM
You have to ask why is the US twice as bad as the rich countries in Western Europe.
It seems to be a lot more about the power stations than the SUVs.
France is 80% nuclear the US is 20% but hasn't built a nuclear power station since 3 Mile Island in the 1970s. Instead licenses are being issued to keep existing old nuclear power stations beyond their design life.
New nuclear power stations are much safer and create much less waste than the ones we have that were built in the 1950s and 1960s.
Everyone gets very excited about the nuclear waste thing but very few people seem to know that emissions from coal fired power stations give thousands of people cancer every year.
Deadly power plants? Study fuels debate - Environment- msnbc.com (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5174391/)
Seshmeister
12-15-2009, 08:27 AM
I didn't say natural disasters were or were not God's will because I don't really know...
How could you possibly know, how could anyone?
The next step is to think 'How could I know the christian story is true, how could anyone?'
The only possible answer to that is the bible and then you have to wonder about all the hundreds of inconsistencies, historical and scientific impossibilities, insane immorality and evil teachings in that book...
Seshmeister
12-15-2009, 08:34 AM
No it's not. I'm part German and part American Indian,
So basically the bad guy in every film made up until the 1970s... :)
Nickdfresh
12-15-2009, 10:32 AM
The EPA has federal laws on junkyards for a few years now. I'd be surprised to know that was still the case. There are stiff fines for simple things like just leaving a battery on the ground out in the open. They also pull raids on complaints, and do normal inspections even on repair shops. This is one of the reasons you almost never see in-ground lifts anymore. That's the first thing they make you take out (no in-ground oil tanks allowed).
Unfortunately, Hurricane Katrina kind of fucked niceties of the EPA regulations...
Mushroom
12-15-2009, 12:17 PM
Even some of those Brits are doubting Global Warming
Daily Express | UK News :: Climate change is natural: 100 reasons why (http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/146138)
By Dan Parkinson
HERE are the 100 reasons, released in a dossier issued by the European Foundation, why climate change is natural and not man-made:
1) There is “no real scientific proof” that the current warming is caused by the rise of greenhouse gases from man’s activity.
2) Man-made carbon dioxide emissions throughout human history constitute less than 0.00022 percent of the total naturally emitted from the mantle of the earth during geological history.
3) Warmer periods of the Earth’s history came around 800 years before rises in CO2 levels.
4) After World War II, there was a huge surge in recorded CO2 emissions but global temperatures fell for four decades after 1940.
5) Throughout the Earth’s history, temperatures have often been warmer than now and CO2 levels have often been higher – more than ten times as high.
6) Significant changes in climate have continually occurred throughout geologic time.
7) The 0.7C increase in the average global temperature over the last hundred years is entirely consistent with well-established, long-term, natural climate trends.
8) The IPCC theory is driven by just 60 scientists and favourable reviewers not the 4,000 usually cited.
9) Leaked e-mails from British climate scientists – in a scandal known as “Climate-gate” - suggest that that has been manipulated to exaggerate global warming
10) A large body of scientific research suggests that the sun is responsible for the greater share of climate change during the past hundred years.
11) Politicians and activiists claim rising sea levels are a direct cause of global warming but sea levels rates have been increasing steadily since the last ice age 10,000 ago
12) Philip Stott, Emeritus Professor of Biogeography at the School of Oriental and African Studies in London says climate change is too complicated to be caused by just one factor, whether CO2 or clouds
13) Peter Lilley MP said last month that “fewer people in Britain than in any other country believe in the importance of global warming. That is despite the fact that our Government and our political class—predominantly—are more committed to it than their counterparts in any other country in the world”.
14) In pursuit of the global warming rhetoric, wind farms will do very little to nothing to reduce CO2 emissions
15) Professor Plimer, Professor of Geology and Earth Sciences at the University of Adelaide, stated that the idea of taking a single trace gas in the atmosphere, accusing it and finding it guilty of total responsibility for climate change, is an “absurdity”
16) A Harvard University astrophysicist and geophysicist, Willie Soon, said he is “embarrassed and puzzled” by the shallow science in papers that support the proposition that the earth faces a climate crisis caused by global warming.
17) The science of what determines the earth’s temperature is in fact far from settled or understood.
18) Despite activist concerns over CO2 levels, CO2 is a minor greenhouse gas, unlike water vapour which is tied to climate concerns, and which we can’t even pretend to control
19) A petition by scientists trying to tell the world that the political and media portrayal of global warming is false was put forward in the Heidelberg Appeal in 1992. Today, more than 4,000 signatories, including 72 Nobel Prize winners, from 106 countries have signed it.
20) It is claimed the average global temperature increased at a dangerously fast rate in the 20th century but the recent rate of average global temperature rise has been between 1 and 2 degrees C per century - within natural rates
21) Professor Zbigniew Jaworowski, Chairman of the Scientific Council of the Central Laboratory for Radiological Protection in Warsaw, Poland says the earth’s temperature has more to do with cloud cover and water vapor than CO2 concentration in the atmosphere.
22) There is strong evidence from solar studies which suggests that the Earth’s current temperature stasis will be followed by climatic cooling over the next few decades
23) It is myth that receding glaciers are proof of global warming as glaciers have been receding and growing cyclically for many centuries
24) It is a falsehood that the earth’s poles are warming because that is natural variation and while the western Arctic may be getting somewhat warmer we also see that the Eastern Arctic and Greenland are getting colder
25) The IPCC claims climate driven “impacts on biodiversity are significant and of key relevance” but those claims are simply not supported by scientific research
26) The IPCC threat of climate change to the world’s species does not make sense as wild species are at least one million years old, which means they have all been through hundreds of climate cycles
27) Research goes strongly against claims that CO2-induced global warming would cause catastrophic disintegration of the Greenland and Antarctic Ice Sheets.
28) Despite activist concerns over CO2 levels, rising CO2 levels are our best hope of raising crop yields to feed an ever-growing population
29) The biggest climate change ever experienced on earth took place around 700 million years ago
30) The slight increase in temperature which has been observed since 1900 is entirely consistent with well-established, long-term natural climate cycles
31) Despite activist concerns over CO2 levels, rising CO2 levels of some so-called “greenhouse gases” may be contributing to higher oxygen levels and global cooling, not warming
32) Accurate satellite, balloon and mountain top observations made over the last three decades have not shown any significant change in the long term rate of increase in global temperatures
33) Today’s CO2 concentration of around 385 ppm is very low compared to most of the earth’s history – we actually live in a carbon-deficient atmosphere
34) It is a myth that CO2 is the most common greenhouse gas because greenhouse gases form about 3% of the atmosphere by volume, and CO2 constitutes about 0.037% of the atmosphere
35) It is a myth that computer models verify that CO2 increases will cause significant global warming because computer models can be made to “verify” anything
36) There is no scientific or statistical evidence whatsoever that global warming will cause more storms and other weather extremes
37) One statement deleted from a UN report in 1996 stated that “none of the studies cited above has shown clear evidence that we can attribute the observed climate changes to increases in greenhouse gases”
38) The world “warmed” by 0.07 +/- 0.07 degrees C from 1999 to 2008, not the 0.20 degrees C expected by the IPCC
39) The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change says “it is likely that future tropical cyclones (typhoons and hurricanes) will become more intense” but there has been no increase in the intensity or frequency of tropical cyclones globally
40) Rising CO2 levels in the atmosphere can be shown not only to have a negligible effect on the Earth’s many ecosystems, but in some cases to be a positive help to many organisms
41) Researchers who compare and contrast climate change impact on civilizations found warm periods are beneficial to mankind and cold periods harmful
42) The Met Office asserts we are in the hottest decade since records began but this is precisely what the world should expect if the climate is cyclical
43) Rising CO2 levels increase plant growth and make plants more resistant to drought and pests
44) The historical increase in the air’s CO2 content has improved human nutrition by raising crop yields during the past 150 years
45) The increase of the air’s CO2 content has probably helped lengthen human lifespans since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution
46) The IPCC alleges that “climate change currently contributes to the global burden of disease and premature deaths” but the evidence shows that higher temperatures and rising CO2 levels has helped global populations
47) In May of 2004, the Russian Academy of Sciences published a report concluding that the Kyoto Protocol has no scientific grounding at all.
48) The “Climate-gate” scandal pointed to a expensive public campaign of disinformation and the denigration of scientists who opposed the belief that CO2 emissions were causing climate change
49) The head of Britain’s climate change watchdog has predicted households will need to spend up to £15,000 on a full energy efficiency makeover if the Government is to meet its ambitious targets for cutting carbon emissions.
50) Wind power is unlikely to be the answer to our energy needs. The wind power industry argues that there are “no direct subsidies” but it involves a total subsidy of as much as £60 per MWh which falls directly on electricity consumers. This burden will grow in line with attempts to achieve Wind power targets, according to a recent OFGEM report.
51) Wind farms are not an efficient way to produce energy. The British Wind Energy Association (BWEA) accepts a figure of 75 per cent back-up power is required.
52) Global temperatures are below the low end of IPCC predictions not at “at the top end of IPCC estimates”
53) Climate alarmists have raised the concern over acidification of the oceans but Tom Segalstad from Oslo University in Norway , and others, have noted that the composition of ocean water – including CO2, calcium, and water – can act as a buffering agent in the acidification of the oceans.
54) The UN’s IPCC computer models of human-caused global warming predict the emergence of a “hotspot” in the upper troposphere over the tropics. Former researcher in the Australian Department of Climate Change, David Evans, said there is no evidence of such a hotspot
55) The argument that climate change is a of result of global warming caused by human activity is the argument of flat Earthers.
56) The manner in which US President Barack Obama sidestepped Congress to order emission cuts shows how undemocratic and irrational the entire international decision-making process has become with regards to emission-target setting.
57) William Kininmonth, a former head of the National Climate Centre and a consultant to the World Meteorological Organisation, wrote “the likely extent of global temperature rise from a doubling of CO2 is less than 1C. Such warming is well within the envelope of variation experienced during the past 10,000 years and insignificant in the context of glacial cycles during the past million years, when Earth has been predominantly very cold and covered by extensive ice sheets.”
58) Canada has shown the world targets derived from the existing Kyoto commitments were always unrealistic and did not work for the country.
59) In the lead up to the Copenhagen summit, David Davis MP said of previous climate summits, at Rio de Janeiro in 1992 and Kyoto in 1997 that many had promised greater cuts, but “neither happened”, but we are continuing along the same lines.
60) The UK ’s environmental policy has a long-term price tag of about £55 billion, before taking into account the impact on its economic growth.
61) The UN’s panel on climate change warned that Himalayan glaciers could melt to a fifth of current levels by 2035. J. Graham Cogley a professor at Ontario Trent University, claims this inaccurate stating the UN authors got the date from an earlier report wrong by more than 300 years.
62) Under existing Kyoto obligations the EU has attempted to claim success, while actually increasing emissions by 13 per cent, according to Lord Lawson. In addition the EU has pursued this scheme by purchasing “offsets” from countries such as China paying them billions of dollars to destroy atmospheric pollutants, such as CFC-23, which were manufactured purely in order to be destroyed.
63) It is claimed that the average global temperature was relatively unchanging in pre-industrial times but sky-rocketed since 1900, and will increase by several degrees more over the next 100 years according to Penn State University researcher Michael Mann. There is no convincing empirical evidence that past climate was unchanging, nor that 20th century changes in average global temperature were unusual or unnatural.
64) Michael Mann of Penn State University has actually shown that the Medieval Warm Period and the Little Ice Age did in fact exist, which contrasts with his earlier work which produced the “hockey stick graph” which showed a constant temperature over the past thousand years or so followed by a recent dramatic upturn.
65) The globe’s current approach to climate change in which major industrialised countries agree to nonsensical targets for their CO2 emissions by a given date, as it has been under the Kyoto system, is very expensive.
66) The “Climate-gate” scandal revealed that a scientific team had emailed one another about using a “trick” for the sake of concealing a “decline” in temperatures when looking at the history of the Earth’s temperature.
67) Global temperatures have not risen in any statistically-significant sense for 15 years and have actually been falling for nine years. The “Climate-gate” scandal revealed a scientific team had expressed dismay at the fact global warming was contrary to their predictions and admitted their inability to explain it was “a travesty”.
68) The IPCC predicts that a warmer planet will lead to more extreme weather, including drought, flooding, storms, snow, and wildfires. But over the last century, during which the IPCC claims the world experienced more rapid warming than any time in the past two millennia, the world did not experience significantly greater trends in any of these extreme weather events.
69) In explaining the average temperature standstill we are currently experiencing, the Met Office Hadley Centre ran a series of computer climate predictions and found in many of the computer runs there were decade-long standstills but none for 15 years – so it expects global warming to resume swiftly.
70) Richard Lindzen, Professor of Atmospheric Sciences at Massachusetts Institute of Technology, wrote: “The notion of a static, unchanging climate is foreign to the history of the Earth or any other planet with a fluid envelope. Such hysteria (over global warming) simply represents the scientific illiteracy of much of the public, the susceptibility of the public to the substitution of repetition for truth.”
71) Despite the 1997 Kyoto Protocol’s status as the flagship of the fight against climate change it has been a failure.
72) The first phase of the EU’s Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS), which ran from 2005 to 2007 was a failure. Huge over-allocation of permits to pollute led to a collapse in the price of carbon from €33 to just €0.20 per tonne meaning the system did not reduce emissions at all.
73) The EU trading scheme, to manage carbon emissions has completely failed and actually allows European businesses to duck out of making their emissions reductions at home by offsetting, which means paying for cuts to be made overseas instead.
74) To date “cap and trade” carbon markets have done almost nothing to reduce emissions.
75) In the United States , the cap-and-trade is an approach designed to control carbon emissions and will impose huge costs upon American citizens via a carbon tax on all goods and services produced in the United States. The average family of four can expect to pay an additional $1700, or £1,043, more each year. It is predicted that the United States will lose more than 2 million jobs as the result of cap-and-trade schemes.
76) Dr Roy Spencer, a principal research scientist at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, has indicated that out of the 21 climate models tracked by the IPCC the differences in warming exhibited by those models is mostly the result of different strengths of positive cloud feedback – and that increasing CO2 is insufficient to explain global-average warming in the last 50 to 100 years.
77) Why should politicians devote our scarce resources in a globally competitive world to a false and ill-defined problem, while ignoring the real problems the entire planet faces, such as: poverty, hunger, disease or terrorism.
78) A proper analysis of ice core records from the past 650,000 years demonstrates that temperature increases have come before, and not resulted from, increases in CO2 by hundreds of years.
79) Since the cause of global warming is mostly natural, then there is in actual fact very little we can do about it. (We are still not able to control the sun).
80) A substantial number of the panel of 2,500 climate scientists on the United Nation’s International Panel on Climate Change, which created a statement on scientific unanimity on climate change and man-made global warming, were found to have serious concerns.
81) The UK’s Met Office has been forced this year to re-examine 160 years of temperature data after admitting that public confidence in the science on man-made global warming has been shattered by revelations about the data.
82) Politicians and activists push for renewable energy sources such as wind turbines under the rhetoric of climate change, but it is essentially about money – under the system of Renewable Obligations. Much of the money is paid for by consumers in electricity bills. It amounts to £1 billion a year.
83) The “Climate-gate” scandal revealed that a scientific team had tampered with their own data so as to conceal inconsistencies and errors.
84) The “Climate-gate” scandal revealed that a scientific team had campaigned for the removal of a learned journal’s editor, solely because he did not share their willingness to debase science for political purposes.
85) Ice-core data clearly show that temperatures change centuries before concentrations of atmospheric CO2 change. Thus, there appears to be little evidence for insisting that changes in concentrations of CO2 are the cause of past temperature and climate change.
86) There are no experimentally verified processes explaining how CO2 concentrations can fall in a few centuries without falling temperatures – in fact it is changing temperatures which cause changes in CO2 concentrations, which is consistent with experiments that show CO2 is the atmospheric gas most readily absorbed by water.
87) The Government’s Renewable Energy Strategy contains a massive increase in electricity generation by wind power costing around £4 billion a year over the next twenty years. The benefits will be only £4 to £5 billion overall (not per annum). So costs will outnumber benefits by a range of between eleven and seventeen times.
88) Whilst CO2 levels have indeed changed for various reasons, human and otherwise, just as they have throughout history, the CO2 content of the atmosphere has increased since the beginning of the industrial revolution, and the growth rate has now been constant for the past 25 years.
89) It is a myth that CO2 is a pollutant, because nitrogen forms 80% of our atmosphere and human beings could not live in 100% nitrogen either: CO2 is no more a pollutant than nitrogen is and CO2 is essential to life.
90) Politicians and climate activists make claims to rising sea levels but certain members in the IPCC chose an area to measure in Hong Kong that is subsiding. They used the record reading of 2.3 mm per year rise of sea level.
91) The accepted global average temperature statistics used by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change show that no ground-based warming has occurred since 1998.
92) If one factors in non-greenhouse influences such as El Nino events and large volcanic eruptions, lower atmosphere satellite-based temperature measurements show little, if any, global warming since 1979, a period over which atmospheric CO2 has increased by 55 ppm (17 per cent).
93) US President Barack Obama pledged to cut emissions by 2050 to equal those of 1910 when there were 92 million Americans. In 2050, there will be 420 million Americans, so Obama’s promise means that emissions per head will be approximately what they were in 1875. It simply will not happen.
94) The European Union has already agreed to cut emissions by 20 percent to 2020, compared with 1990 levels, and is willing to increase the target to 30 percent. However, these are unachievable and the EU has already massively failed with its Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS), as EU emissions actually rose by 0.8 percent from 2005 to 2006 and are known to be well above the Kyoto goal.
95) Australia has stated it wants to slash greenhouse emissions by up to 25 percent below 2000 levels by 2020, but the pledges were so unpopular that the country’s Senate has voted against the carbon trading Bill, and the Opposition’s Party leader has now been ousted by a climate change sceptic.
96) Canada plans to reduce emissions by 20 percent compared with 2006 levels by 2020, representing approximately a 3 percent cut from 1990 levels but it simultaneously defends its Alberta tar sands emissions and its record as one of the world’s highest per-capita emissions setters.
97) India plans to reduce the ratio of emissions to production by 20-25 percent compared with 2005 levels by 2020, but all Government officials insist that since India has to grow for its development and poverty alleviation, it has to emit, because the economy is driven by carbon.
98) The Leipzig Declaration in 1996, was signed by 110 scientists who said: “We – along with many of our fellow citizens – are apprehensive about the climate treaty conference scheduled for Kyoto, Japan, in December 1997” and “based on all the evidence available to us, we cannot subscribe to the politically inspired world view that envisages climate catastrophes and calls for hasty actions.”
99) A US Oregon Petition Project stated “We urge the United States government to reject the global warming agreement that was written in Kyoto, Japan in December, 1997, and any other similar proposals. The proposed limits on greenhouse gases would harm the environment, hinder the advance of science and technology, and damage the health and welfare of mankind. There is no convincing scientific evidence that human release of CO2, methane, or other greenhouse gasses is causing or will, in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating of the Earth’s atmosphere and disruption of the Earth’s climate.”
100) A report by the Nongovernmental International Panel on Climate Change concluded “We find no support for the IPCC’s claim that climate observations during the twentieth century are either unprecedented or provide evidence of an anthropogenic effect on climate.”
ace diamond
12-15-2009, 04:11 PM
that was very lucid and informative.
thank you for sharing.
Seshmeister
12-15-2009, 04:27 PM
No one reads the Daily Express, it's a fucking joke paper for idiots and lunatics.
I'd rather read Sammy Hagar lyrics.
Mushroom
12-15-2009, 05:06 PM
No one reads the Daily Express, it's a fucking joke paper for idiots and lunatics.
I'd rather read Sammy Hagar lyrics.
no one? why is the Daily Express in business? apparently, there are a lot of idiots and lunatics in Britain/U.K. Com'on Sesh, that's a weak retort for 100 points published by idiots and lunatics, based on statements by scientists. you're starting to sound like the naysayers... disregard everything presented to you because you have your mind made up.
Please proceed to next post...
Mushroom
12-15-2009, 05:09 PM
Feels So Good Lyrics
Artist(Band):Van Halen
Oh, here we go! Yeah yeah
Yesterday, I saw my love light shine
Straight ahead in front of me
You never really know
When love'll come or go
But yesterday I was alone
Suddenly I walked you home
I never really knew
What love could make me do
I'll send the message in a bottle (I'll send the message)
N' trust in the mercy of the sea (Oooh ooh ooh)
Stormy weather (Oooh ooh ooh) Oh yeah (Oooh ooh ooh)
Waitin' for love to set me free
Everyday I watch the tide roll in
Stay until it rolls away
Though nothin's on the shore
I'm runnin' back for more
I'll send the message in a bottle (I'll send the message)
N' pray for the mercy of the sea (Oooh ooh ooh)
Stromy weather (Oooh ooh ooh) Oh yeah (Oooh ooh ooh)
Waitin' for love to rescue me
Hey, Feels so good (So good) Woo!
And it feels so nice (So nice)
When love comes around
I feel good (So good) So good, so good
An' it feels so nice (So nice) Woo!
Ow! Feels so good
(Guitar Solo)
Yeah, feels so good, woo! (So good)
And it feels so nice (So nice)
When love comes around
I feel good (So good)
Hey, Gonna make her feel nice (So nice)
When love comes around
I feel good, woo! (So good)
So good, so good, so good (So nice)
Now come on baby, make me feel good
(So good)
Get up, get up, get up, get up (So nice)
Uh! Hey baby, I feel good (So good)
Woo! Now come on, now come on (So nice)
Yeah, make it nice. Ow!
So good, so good
Seshmeister
12-15-2009, 05:28 PM
no one? why is the Daily Express in business? apparently, there are a lot of idiots and lunatics in Britain/U.K. Com'on Sesh, that's a weak retort for 100 points published by idiots and lunatics, based on statements by scientists. you're starting to sound like the naysayers... disregard everything presented to you because you have your mind made up.
Please proceed to next post...
I'm not reading shit just because it's been posted in this thread.
That 'newspaper' is a national joke worse than the National Enquirer in the US.
Almost every day of the week it's front page is about the British Queens murder of Princess Diana. They have been printing these same stories every day for ten years now no matter what else was going on in the world.
Worse than that though is that earlier this year their cunt reporters tracked down the survivors of the Dunblane massacre of 16 little children on the internet. They then proceeded to print photographs, names and exerts of their online posts on sites like Facebook criticising them for drinking or having sex now that they are 18.
It was one of the most disgraceful pieces of 'journalism' of all time and I refuse to read whatever bullshit they are spurting out their hateful retarded faces on the environment.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/1vUi94QNZSw&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/1vUi94QNZSw&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.