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ELVIS
04-13-2010, 12:07 PM
The new federal health-care law has raised the stakes for hospitals and schools already scrambling to train more doctors. (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304506904575180331528424238.html?m od=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsSecond)

http://sg.wsj.net/public/resources/images/NA-BF445_RESIDE_NS_20100412170829.gif


Experts warn there won't be enough doctors to treat the millions of people newly insured under the law. At current graduation and training rates, the nation could face a shortage of as many as 150,000 doctors in the next 15 years, according to the Association of American Medical Colleges.

That shortfall is predicted despite a push by teaching hospitals and medical schools to boost the number of U.S. doctors, which now totals about 954,000.

The greatest demand will be for primary-care physicians. These general practitioners, internists, family physicians and pediatricians will have a larger role under the new law, coordinating care for each patient.

The U.S. has 352,908 primary-care doctors now, and the college association estimates that 45,000 more will be needed by 2020. But the number of medical-school students entering family medicine fell more than a quarter between 2002 and 2007.

Proponents of the new health-care law say it does attempt to address the physician shortage. The law offers sweeteners to encourage more people to enter medical professions, and a 10% Medicare pay boost for primary-care doctors.

Meanwhile, a number of new medical schools have opened around the country recently. As of last October, four new medical schools enrolled a total of about 190 students, and 12 medical schools raised the enrollment of first-year students by a total of 150 slots, according to the AAMC. Some 18,000 students entered U.S. medical schools in the fall of 2009, the AAMC says.

But medical colleges and hospitals warn that these efforts will hit a big bottleneck: There is a shortage of medical resident positions. The residency is the minimum three-year period when medical-school graduates train in hospitals and clinics.

There are about 110,000 resident positions in the U.S., according to the AAMC. Teaching hospitals rely heavily on Medicare funding to pay for these slots. In 1997, Congress imposed a cap on funding for medical residencies, which hospitals say has increasingly hurt their ability to expand the number of positions.

Medicare pays $9.1 billion a year to teaching hospitals, which goes toward resident salaries and direct teaching costs, as well as the higher operating costs associated with teaching hospitals, which tend to see the sickest and most costly patients.

Doctors' groups and medical schools had hoped that the new health-care law, passed in March, would increase the number of funded residency slots, but such a provision didn't make it into the final bill.

"It will probably take 10 years to even make a dent into the number of doctors that we need out there," said Atul Grover, the AAMC's chief advocacy officer.

While doctors trained in other countries could theoretically help the primary-care shortage, they hit the same bottleneck with resident slots, because they must still complete a U.S. residency in order to get a license to practice medicine independently in the U.S. In the 2010 class of residents, some 13% of slots are filled by non-U.S. citizens who completed medical school outside the U.S.

One provision in the law attempts to address residencies. Since some residency slots go unfilled each year, the law will pool the funding for unused slots and redistribute it to other institutions, with the majority of these slots going to primary-care or general-surgery residencies. The slot redistribution, in effect, will create additional residencies, because previously unfilled positions will now be used, according to the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services.

Some efforts by educators are focused on boosting the number of primary-care doctors. The University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences anticipates the state will need 350 more primary-care doctors in the next five years. So it raised its class size by 24 students last year, beyond the 150 previous annual admissions.

In addition, the university opened a satellite medical campus in Fayetteville to give six third-year students additional clinical-training opportunities, said Richard Wheeler, executive associate dean for academic affairs. The school asks students to commit to entering rural medicine, and the school has 73 people in the program.

"We've tried to make sure the attitude of students going into primary care has changed," said Dr. Wheeler. "To make sure primary care is a respected specialty to go into."

Montefiore Medical Center, the university hospital for Albert Einstein College of Medicine in New York, has 1,220 residency slots. Since the 1970s, Montefiore has encouraged residents to work a few days a week in community clinics in New York's Bronx borough, where about 64 Montefiore residents a year care for pregnant women, deliver children and provide vaccines. There has been a slight increase in the number of residents who ask to join the program, said Peter Selwyn, chairman of Montefiore's department of family and social medicine.

One is Justin Sanders, a 2007 graduate of the University of Vermont College of Medicine who is a second-year resident at Montefiore. In recent weeks, he has been caring for children he helped deliver. He said more doctors are needed in his area, but acknowledged that "primary-care residencies are not in the sexier end. A lot of these [specialty] fields are a lot sexier to students with high debt burdens."


:elvis:

kwame k
04-13-2010, 06:38 PM
OK, first they bitch about health care being some sort of 'ist take over of our country......now all they can bitch about is there's tons of employment opportunities for people that will be in demand for decades to come:pullinghair:

Seshmeister
04-13-2010, 07:30 PM
What the US will do is just import a bunch of doctors leaving poor countries with even fewer.

We've been doing it for years.

kwame k
04-13-2010, 07:47 PM
Most doctors I've seen are not from America, either......I still feel that the cost of medical schooling should be defrayed if you work for a public health care type thing. Do 2 or 3 years in a public setting or residency and get "x" amount of your college paid for. Invest in public schools for medical training and make it so people want to work in the health care industry and not have the newly graduated saddled with massive amounts of debt.

They're already talking about letting nurses have a greater role in patient care as a way of cutting costs and because there are not enough doctors. If you just need a few stitches there's no need to run every test known to man or have several specialists exam you.

Then again.....using common sense in the health care debate is a losing effort. Just look at the nonsense they have been spewing over the last year, here.

Va Beach VH Fan
04-13-2010, 10:24 PM
I've been telling my 16 year old son he needs to seriously think about the medical profession when we talk about college majors....

kwame k
04-13-2010, 10:35 PM
Shit, what better career field is there right now and for the next few decades.

Jesus Christ
04-13-2010, 10:41 PM
My Mom always wished I had become a doctor instead of the Messiah. Perhaps she was right? :jesuslol:

Anonymous
04-13-2010, 10:50 PM
My Mom always wished I had become a doctor instead of the Messiah. Perhaps she was right? :jesuslol:

Dude!

Now THIS is the cup of a carpenter is one thing...

But THIS is the cup of a medic?

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/4064/medicalurinal.jpg

That's just too sick for words.

Fuck off.

Cheers! :bottle:

BigBadBrian
04-14-2010, 07:29 AM
What the US will do is just import a bunch of doctors leaving poor countries with even fewer.



That's already being done...for years now also. Most, unfortunatelhy, are only after the $$$$ and could care less about patient care.

BigBadBrian
04-14-2010, 07:33 AM
Most doctors I've seen are not from America, either......I still feel that the cost of medical schooling should be defrayed if you work for a public health care type thing. Do 2 or 3 years in a public setting or residency and get "x" amount of your college paid for. Invest in public schools for medical training and make it so people want to work in the health care industry and not have the newly graduated saddled with massive amounts of debt.



That sounds great, but the problem with Medical Schools is also that there are not enough doctors, nurses, and other professionals willing to teach because it pays much less than practicing their specialty. I would fully support a measure by Obama to subsidize salaries for these people so more of them would be willing to teach.

BigBadBrian
04-14-2010, 07:38 AM
I've been telling my 16 year old son he needs to seriously think about the medical profession when we talk about college majors....

Tell him to major in Biology (pre-med emphasis) or Bio-Chemistry and be prepared to make mostly all A's to get into Medical Scholl. Good luck. :)

BTW, there are other Med professions in great need. Respiratory Therapists are in more demand than nurses for example. They start out around here at around $27 an hour around the Tidewater area. That's just one example.

ELVIS
04-14-2010, 09:13 AM
be prepared to make mostly all A's to get into Medical Scholl.

:)




:biggrin:

Va Beach VH Fan
04-14-2010, 09:47 AM
Tell him to major in Biology (pre-med emphasis) or Bio-Chemistry and be prepared to make mostly all A's to get into Medical Scholl. Good luck. :)

BTW, there are other Med professions in great need. Respiratory Therapists are in more demand than nurses for example. They start out around here at around $27 an hour around the Tidewater area. That's just one example.

Yeah, I try to stress that doesn't mean to "be a Doctor", lots of $$$$, not only because of health care reform, but the baby boomers retiring as well....

kwame k
04-14-2010, 01:19 PM
That sounds great, but the problem with Medical Schools is also that there are not enough doctors, nurses, and other professionals willing to teach because it pays much less than practicing their specialty. I would fully support a measure by Obama to subsidize salaries for these people so more of them would be willing to teach.

Isn't that why we need to invest in our infrastructure?

I agree, I would use the same principle for doctors who would take 2 or 3 years off of regular practice and go teach. We have to make the things we need right here at home, be it service based or manufacturing based industries. Repeal NAFTA and come up with a level playing field. I still believe if all things were equal we could out produce any country in the world. We've done it before and can do it again.

Shit, the unemployed in Michigan could, if given the opportunity, out produce anyone just by reopening the factories that are sitting vacant.

BigBadBrian
04-14-2010, 01:28 PM
Isn't that why we need to invest in our infrastructure?

I agree, I would use the same principle for doctors who would take 2 or 3 years off of regular practice and go teach.

I'm not saying all doctors and nurses should do a stint as a teacher in a medical or nursing school. I'm saying make it more lucrative to teach. Nurses instructing in nursing schools make on average $21,000 less per year than nurses in a hospital or a doctor's office.

kwame k
04-14-2010, 01:35 PM
I'm not saying all doctors and nurses should do a stint as a teacher in a medical or nursing school. I'm saying make it more lucrative to teach. Nurses instructing in nursing schools make on average $21,000 less per year than nurses in a hospital or a doctor's office.

Neither am I.....hey, I'm all for people making a buck and after years of busting your ass in college, you should make money but like you're saying, if you could entice more medical professionals into teaching positions then we have to do it.

PETE'S BROTHER
04-14-2010, 01:38 PM
I'm not saying all doctors and nurses should do a stint as a teacher in a medical or nursing school. I'm saying make it more lucrative to teach. Nurses instructing in nursing schools make on average $21,000 less per year than nurses in a hospital or a doctor's office.

well sure, that makes sense, they aren't physically workin' on people or runnin' around tryin' to keep hospital working. and from $80k to $59k ist still not to shabby. don't armed service members receive a higher "combat" pay than if they are idle stateside?

Kristy
04-14-2010, 03:25 PM
The U.S. has 352,908 primary-care doctors now, and the college association estimates that 45,000 more will be needed by 2020. But the number of medical-school students entering family medicine fell more than a quarter between 2002 and 2007.


And it wasn't like the AMA didn't see this coming. Back in the late 80/early 90's they knew there was going to be an increased burden on the health care system due to an aging baby boomer population unsure of their health benefits or that they would have any by the time of their retirement. The other side to this is the shortage of qualified doctors is on the decrease not due to the lack of medical schools but to the system itself where not only are fresh residents are in tremendous debt for their education but pay high fees of malpractice insurance before they can even be considered for Board certification; their liability premiums are through the roof causing them to abandon what they consider "high risk" procedures or patients (most of them women). Hippocratic Oath(s) aside, many do become doctors for the money and not for the general sociability of "helping people." So where is the incentive to become one when you can just as easily attend law school and place a civil suit against a M.D. and make yourself some real money, eh?

Like I said, the whole US health care system is a monster at a BDSM club abusing people and asking to be abused itself. It needs to be gutted (no pun intended) from the inside cutting out the insurgence greed and liability issues they have gotten way, way out of hand. Even with "Obama Care" not much is really going to change other than the baby boomer generation coming to drain what's left of the quality of affordable care and not the reform itself (yeah I know, what reform).

Blackflag
04-14-2010, 03:28 PM
It's no secret the AMA purposefully keeps supply low.

Seshmeister
04-14-2010, 03:45 PM
That's already being done...for years now also. Most, unfortunatelhy, are only after the $$$$ and could care less about patient care.

Racist!