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Hardrock69
08-09-2010, 09:10 AM
That is the intelligent thing to do. Unfortunately, there are no intelligent people in the US Federal Government regarding this issue:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/aug/04/mexico-legalisation-debate-drug-war




Mexico looks to legalisation as drug war murders hit 28,000

President joins calls for debate after figures reveal extent of violence since launch of military offensive against cartels in 2006

Mexico's president, Felipe Calderón, has joined calls for a debate on the legalisation of drugs as new figures show thousands of Mexicans every year being slaughtered in cartel wars.

"It is a fundamental debate," the president said, belying his traditional reluctance to accept any questioning of the military-focused offensive against the country's drug cartels that he launched in late 2006. "You have to analyse carefully the pros and cons and key arguments on both sides." The president said he personally opposes the idea of legalisation.

Calderón's new openness comes amid tremendous pressure to justify a strategy that has been accompanied by the spiralling of horrific violence around the country as the cartels fight each other and the government crack down. Official figures released this week put the number of drug war related murders at 28,000.

Until recently the government regularly played down the general impact of the violence by claiming that 90% of the victims were associated with the cartels, with the remainder largely from the security forces. In recent months it has started to acknowledge a growing number of "civilian victims" ranging from toddlers caught in the cross fire to students massacred at parties.

Momentum behind the idea that legalisation could be part of the solution has been growing since three prominent former Latin American presidents signed a document last year arguing the case.

César Gaviria of Colombia, Fernando Cardoso of Brazil and Ernesto Zedillo of Mexico urged existing governments to consider legalising marijuana as a way of slashing cartel profits.

This year Mexico's national congress began a debate on the possibility that resurfaced again this week during a series of round table discussions between the Calderón, security experts, business leaders and civic groups.

The "Dialogue for Security: Evaluation and Strengthening" is part of a new government effort to counter the growing perception in Mexico that the president's drug war strategy is a disaster.

"I'm not talking just about legalizing marijuana," analyst and write Hector Aguilar Camin said during the Tuesday session, "rather all drugs in general."

After accepting the need to directly address the proposal, Calderón made it clear he did not support it. "It requires a country to take a decision to put several generations of young people at risk," he said, citing a likely increase in consumption triggered by lower prices, greater availability and social acceptability.

He added that the predicted "important economic effects by reducing income for criminal groups" would be limited by the integration of Mexican drug trafficking into international markets where drugs remain largely underground.

Calderón did not mention current moves to soften drug laws in the US, including a planned vote in California in November on an initiative that would allow marijuana to be sold and taxed. Nor did he address the home grown argument that legalisation would remove the roots of the violence raging in the country.

"Legalisation would render the war pointless as drugs would become just another product like tobacco or alcohol," Jorge Castañeda, a legalisation advocate and former foreign minister, told W Radio. He added that even if it did prompt an increase in drug use. "It is worth considering whether this is preferable to having 28,000 deaths."

The new death toll, which was not broken down, is significantly higher than the informal counts kept by newspapers. Milenio newspaper put the number of drug-related deaths in July at 1,234.

Some leading critics of Calderón's strategy, however, do not believe legalisation is the key to reining in the cartels and the violence, preferring to emphasize the need to increase efforts to go after money laundering and political corruption.

Edgardo Buscaglia, and expert in organised crime around the world, argues that the recent diversification of the Mexican cartels into other criminal activities ranging from systematic extortion to people trafficking would give them ample reason to keep fighting each other, even if drugs were legal. "Legalising drugs would be good public policy," he said, "but it would not be a tool with which to combat organized crime."

Nitro Express
08-09-2010, 01:47 PM
A certain percentage of the population are going to want drugs and with get them whether they are legal or not. By making them illegal it only enriches criminals to the point where they start to take over politically. A historical example would be Al Capone. Illegal alcohol made him so powerful, he basically ran the city of Chicago behind the scenes.

Destroy the market value and you destroy the power of the criminals. It's simple as that. I would say this so called drug war costs us a lot more in money and lives than providing rehab services to the junkies. Make it legal, warn the public about the dangers, set some money aside for those who need rehab. I don't think people are going to be using more drugs if they suddenly become legal.

Hardrock69
08-09-2010, 02:09 PM
Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_on_Drugs


A 2008 study by Harvard economist Jeffrey A. Miron has estimated that legalizing drugs would inject $76.8 billion a year into the U.S. economy — $44.1 billion from law enforcement savings, and at least $32.7 billion in tax revenue ($6.7 billion from marijuana, $22.5 billion from cocaine and heroin, remainder from other drugs).[47][48] Recent surveys help to confirm the consensus among economists to reform drug policy in the direction of decriminalization and legalization.[49]



Talk about hypocrites....


U.S. government involvement in drug trafficking
Further information: CIA drug trafficking

The CIA, DEA, State Department, and several other U.S. government agencies have been implicated in various drug trafficking enterprises, which were used to fund illegal covert activities in several nations.
[edit] CIA and Contra cocaine trafficking
Further information: CIA and Contra's cocaine trafficking in the US

A lawsuit filed in 1986 by two journalists represented by the Christic Institute showed that the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) and other parties were engaged in criminal acts, including financing the purchase of arms with the proceeds of cocaine sales.[50]

Senator John Kerry's 1988 U.S. Senate Committee on Foreign Relations report on Contra drug links concludes that members of the U.S. State Department "who provided support for the Contras are involved in drug trafficking...and elements of the Contras themselves knowingly receive financial and material assistance from drug traffickers."[51] The report further states that "the Contra drug links include...payments to drug traffickers by the U.S. State Department of funds authorized by the Congress for humanitarian assistance to the Contras, in some cases after the traffickers had been indicted by federal law enforcement agencies on drug charges, in others while traffickers were under active investigation by these same agencies."

In 1996, journalist Gary Webb published reports in the San Jose Mercury News,[52] and later in his book Dark Alliance,[53] detailing how Contras, with the assistance of the U.S. government have distributed crack cocaine into Los Angeles to fund weapons purchases. Webb's premise regarding the US Government connection was widely debunked with the Mercury News editor admitting that the series was " poorly written and edited and misleadingly packaged." [54]

In 1998, CIA Inspector General Frederick Hitz published a two-volume report[55] that refutes nearly all of Webb's claims. A report later that same year by the Justice Department Inspector General also arrives at similar conclusions.
[edit] Heroin trafficking operations of the CIA, U.S. Navy and Sicilian Mafia
Further information: Collaborations between the United States government and Italian Mafia

During World War II, the United States Navy, concerned that strikes and labor disputes in U.S. eastern shipping ports would disrupt wartime logistics, released the mobster Lucky Luciano from prison, and collaborated with him to help the mafia take control of those ports. Labor union members were terrorized and murdered as a means of preventing labor unrest and ensuring smooth shipping of supplies to Europe.[56]

In order to prevent Communist party members from being elected in Italy following World War II, the CIA worked closely with the Sicilian Mafia, protecting them and assisting in their worldwide heroin smuggling operations in exchange for the mafia's assistance with assassinating, torturing, and beating leftist political organizers.[57]
[edit] CIA/KMT opium smuggling operations

In order to provide covert funds for the Kuomintang (KMT) forces loyal to Generalissimo Chiang Kai-Shek, who were fighting the Chinese communists under Mao, the CIA helped the KMT smuggle opium from China and Burma to Bangkok, Thailand by providing airplanes owned by one of their front businesses, Air America.[58][59]




At least 500 economists, including Nobel Laureates Milton Friedman, George Akerlof and Vernon L. Smith, have noted that reducing the supply of marijuana without reducing the demand causes the price, and hence the profits of marijuana sellers, to go up, according to the laws of supply and demand.[67] The increased profits encourage the producers to produce more drugs despite the risks, providing a theoretical explanation for why attacks on drug supply have failed to have any lasting effect. The aforementioned economists published an open letter to President George W. Bush stating "We urge...the country to commence an open and honest debate about marijuana prohibition... At a minimum, this debate will force advocates of current policy to show that prohibition has benefits sufficient to justify the cost to taxpayers, foregone tax revenues and numerous ancillary consequences that result from marijuana prohibition."

The declaration from the World Forum Against Drugs, 2008 state that a balanced policy of drug abuse prevention, education, treatment, law enforcement, research, and supply reduction provides the most effective platform to reduce drug abuse and its associated harms and call on governments to consider demand reduction as one of their first priorities in the fight against drug abuse.[68]

Despite over $7 billion spent annually towards arresting[69] and prosecuting nearly 800,000 people across the country for marijuana offenses in 2005[citation needed](FBI Uniform Crime Reports), the federally-funded Monitoring the Future Survey reports about 85% of high school seniors find marijuana "easy to obtain." That figure has remained virtually unchanged since 1975, never dropping below 82.7% in three decades of national surveys.[70] The Drug Enforcement Administration state however that the number of users of marijuana in the U.S. declined between 2000 and 2005






Usage:

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/node/67


(1997-1999) "The figures for cannabis use among the general population reveal the same pictures. The Netherlands does not differ greatly from other European countries. In contrast, a comparison with the US shows a striking difference in this area: 32.9% of Americans aged 12 and above have experience with cannabis and 5.1% have used in the past month. These figures are twice as high as those in the Netherlands."


Comparing Important Drug and Violence Indicators
Social Indicator......................................... ............Comparison Year....................USA.......... Netherlands
Lifetime prevalence of marijuana use (ages 12+)...............2001.........................36 .9%.............17.0%
Past month prevalence of marijuana use (ages 12+)..........2001..........................5.4%.. .............3.0%
Lifetime prevalence of heroin use (ages 12+)....................2001...................... ....1.4%...............0.4%
Incarceration Rate per 100,000 population........................2002............ ..............701.................100
Per capita spending on criminal justice system (in Euros)...1998..........................€379....... .........€223
Homicide rate per 100,000 population Average ...............1999-2001..................5.56.................1.51

Unchainme
08-09-2010, 03:00 PM
I don't understand why pot is illegal.

Think of all the jobs and money could be made due to this stupid little plant being legalized.

Here you go, legalize it, make it illegal to smoke under age 18, and then tax it, have it go to every last one of our national debt.

Crime will go down, as will our debt. Simple as hell.

jhale667
08-09-2010, 03:25 PM
I don't understand why pot is illegal.


For one, the pharmaceutical industry can't control a medication you can grow yourself (without all their bullshit additives) in your back yard (or indoors in a Hydroponic chamber).

Hardrock69
08-09-2010, 03:27 PM
Watch what happens when Cali posts their tax revenues from it after they legalize it this November. All the other states will go "Hmmmmmm..............DROOL!!!! $$$$$$$$$!!!!"

ace diamond
08-09-2010, 04:10 PM
That is the intelligent thing to do. Unfortunately, there are no intelligent people in the US Federal Government regarding this issue.

THAT'S A MAJOR UNDERSTATEMENT.
all drugs should be fully legalised in every country around the world so that they can be taxed just like smokes and booze.
the tax revenue the gov't would get would go a long fucking way towards drastically cutting down the crime rate, greatly
depopulate the prison system, and help the economy rebound out of the fucking hole it is in.

just a thought.

at least it would free up the cops and feds time and resources for more important things like capturing muderers,
child molesters, burglars, rapists, thieves, etc...

bueno bob
08-09-2010, 10:10 PM
THAT'S A MAJOR UNDERSTATEMENT.
all drugs should be fully legalised in every country around the world so that they can be taxed just like smokes and booze.
the tax revenue the gov't would get would go a long fucking way towards drastically cutting down the crime rate, greatly
depopulate the prison system, and help the economy rebound out of the fucking hole it is in.

just a thought.

at least it would free up the cops and feds time and resources for more important things like capturing muderers,
child molesters, burglars, rapists, thieves, etc...

Hmm...well, you're still a worthless fuckwit for your bullshit at Ronnie's funeral, but at least your head is on straight with this...my respect for you just went up 4%, which places you at 6% total...

hambon4lif
08-09-2010, 11:52 PM
Talk about hypocrites...

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Blaze
08-10-2010, 10:30 PM
Where is my party doctor?