ron paul=awesome/kickass?

[flappo]

http://i.imgur.com/vroba.jpg



oh faaaaaaaaaaaakkkkkkk!!!!!!!!!

[ELVIS]

Texas Congressman leaps to 20 per cent in new poll, Santorum collapses to 7 per cent

Paul Joseph Watson (http://www.infowars.com/south-carolina-ron-paul-surges-past-santorum-into-top-tier/)

Friday the 13th

Ron Paul has surged past Rick Santorum into the top tier in South Carolina, gaining a staggering 11 per cent in the last week alone to climb to third with a total of 20 per cent, with Mitt Romney’s first place position at 29 per cent looking increasingly vulnerable.


A new American Research Group poll released today illustrates how Paul’s second place finish in New Hampshire has catapulted him to onto the heels of frontrunners Romney and Newt Gingrich, who is in second with 25 per cent.

“Paul has climbed 11 percent in the last week and Perry has gained seven percent. Santorum, who was tied for second in last week’s poll at 24 percent, plummeted into fifth place in the current poll,” reports the Hill.

After being heralded as a favorite in South Carolina, Santorum has sunk to just 7 per cent. Having at one stage been as low at 8 per cent, Paul clearly has the greatest momentum going into next Saturday’s primary.

A top tier finish by Paul in South Carolina will send shockwaves through the establishment, which had largely written off his chances in a supposedly “socially conservative” state. Perhaps voters are finally starting to realize that Paul has the most conservative voting record out of all the candidates and unlike Gingrich and Romney, does not have a history of supporting gun control, socialist health care, abortion and big government.

As The Street highlights today, Ron Paul is also more conservative than Rick Santorum. A 2004 VoteView study of the two candidates found that Paul was ranked almost 700 places higher than Santorum in terms of conservatism out of a list of 3,320 individuals.

“Four or five times he voted to raise the national debt, so that tells you how conservative he is,” Paul said Saturday about Santorum. Based on the survey, Paul could question pretty much any politician’s conservative record against his own.”

A separate Rasmussen survey released today also shows Ron Paul has entered the top tier, polling at 16 per cent in equal third with Santorum.

A national Reuters/Ipsos poll released yesterday showed Paul climbing to joint second place overall, equal with Newt Gingrich, once again debunking the myth that the Texan Congressman is not electable, as the establishment media has constantly claimed.

Polls have consistently shown that Paul virtually ties with Romney in first place as having the best chance out of all the candidates of defeating Barack Obama in a hypothetical run off.


:elvis:

[LoungeMachine]

And?

:gulp:

[ELVIS]

And the propaganda media machine has said after both Iowa and New Hampshire that it was down hill from there for Paul yet he's still gaining ground...

[Nickdfresh]

Ron Paul Surges Past Santorum Into Top Tier

That's not saying much...

[LoungeMachine]

And the propaganda media machine ..

You're calling FOX NEWS propaganda now?

:gulp:

Never thought I'd see the day...

[ELVIS]

I have the cheepest version of Dish because I refuse to pay for FOX...

[LoungeMachine]

I have the cheepest version of Dish because I refuse to pay for FOX...

You understand they're on the internets, too.....

:gulp:

[ELVIS]

Yeah and I see how they are totally for Romoney and blatently omit and bash Paul...

[Dr. Love]

I can see inauguration day.

"President-elect Paul will never swear the oath of office and become the official president. The Chief Justice will never swear him in."

- Lounge Machine

[ELVIS]

GAFFNEY, S.C.— Ron Paul’s record on abortion is “one of the worst in the United States Congress,” Rick Santorum charged Friday.

And that’s not all: campaigning here in this state where social conservatives hold sway, Santorum leveled a broad argument against Paul for not doing enough to oppose gay marriage, the repeal of “don’t ask don’t tell” and a host of other issues.

Sparked by a question from a Paul supporter about votes he cast in the Senate that included Planned Parenthood funding, the former Pennsylvania senator — and proponent of complete abortion restrictions — blasted his rival for putting his libertarian views over “Judeo-Christian values.”

“He doesn’t vote for anything restricting abortion on a federal level because he doesn’t think the federal government should be involved in restricting abortion,” Santorum said. “Well, that’s just wrong! The bottom line is that we need to have restrictions on abortion.”

The encounter at a town hall here started Santorum on an extended tear punctuated only by a whispered comment from his wife Karen.

“Well, he’s opposed a lot of pro-life bills,” Santorum said in response.

“The bottom line is I am for defunding Planned Parenthood,” he told the crowd here. “I am for a federal marriage amendment, which Ron Paul is not. I am for reinstating ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ – which Ron Paul is not. I’m just telling you there are clear differences on someone who is going to go out and speak about the Judeo-Christian values that this country holds, and Ron Paul will not.”

Santorum defended his own voting record and then accused Paul of earmarking.

“The program that he’s talking about is a program called Title X, and it’s a program that is in appropriation bills that allows for funding of birth control,” Santorum said. “I am not for federal funding of that, but it’s in a big bill that provides a lot of things. Did I vote for that overall bill? Yes, I did. Ron Paul doesn’t vote for any spending. That’s fine. But he also earmarks more than anybody else in the Congress, and then doesn’t vote for the spending that the earmarks are in.”

He received the biggest applause and cheers of the day when he declared, “There is nobody that’s been a stronger pro-life leader in the United States Congress than I was.”

Minutes after Santorum left the restaurant where the event was held, his campaign blasted a press release announcing the endorsement of former chairman of the National Organization for Marriage Maggie Gallagher.

Paul spent lots of money airing an advertisement in Iowa that highlighted his personal opposition to abortion. It features the former OB-GYN recalling a late-term abortion that he witnessed.

But Santorum wasn’t only focused on Paul’s views on social issues — he also took issue with Paul’s foreign policy views — saying Paul “appeals to the Dennis Kucinich wing of the Democratic Party on national security” — and wrote off Paul’s second place finish as irrelevant.

“Ron Paul’s been running in New Hampshire since 1937,” he joked.

Santorum’s looking to consolidate conservative support ahead of the Jan. 21 primary to give him the same kind of surge that propelled him to a virtual tie in the Iowa caucuses Jan. 3. At a lunchtime event at a diner in York during part of his swing through the conservative upstate of South Carolina, he expressed confidence that would happen.

“We know the values of this state,” Santorum said. “We know, particularly here in the upstate, those rock-ribbed, traditional values.”


:elvis:
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0112/71435.html#ixzz1jOUNLjDV

[Dr. Love]

Interesting, Santorum spews frothy fecal matter from his mouth, too

[dazzlindino]

seems to me ron paul is the only one running that will even attempt any type of change...the democrats and republicans are no longer blue and red, but since thay are all in bed with lobby monies, and against the american citizen, they are all PURPLE.....and dont give a rats hiney about the defecit, abortion, gay rights, education or the poor...the dems have run on education and stopping poverty...but if they ever did they would lose the po' boy vote....and the repubs could care less about stopping abortions..cause if they did they would lose their built in church goer voter block.....and so they keep at this fake tug o war to keep everybody arguing whilst they have one hand stuck out behind them through the curtains to get their lobby monies.....

[Dr. Love]

Ron Paul has surged to 20% (3rd place) in South Carolina. With Romney falling in the race and 9 days to go this could get really interesting and bloody!

http://americanresearchgroup.com/pres2012/primary/rep/sc/


Presidential Primary Preference:

South Carolina
Likely Republican
Primary Voters Jan 11-12
2012
Gingrich 25%
Huntsman 1%
Paul 20%
Perry 9%
Romney 29%
Santorum 7%
Other 2%
Undecided 7%


Mitt Romney leads the South Carolina Republican presidential primary with 29%. Newt Gingrich is in second place with 25% and Ron Paul is in third place with 20%.

Paul has gained the most and Rick Santorum has lost the most since the last American Research Group survey on January 4-5. In that survey, Paul was at 9% and Santorum was at 24%.

Gingrich and Romney are tied among self-identified Republicans with 29% each, followed by Paul with 18%. Paul leads among independents and Democrats with 29%, followed by Romney with 27%, Gingrich with 12%, and Rick Perry with 11%.

Gingrich leads among those likely primary voters saying they are supporters of the Tea Party with 28%, followed by Romney with 24%, Paul with 20%, and Santorum with 11%. Romney leads with 33% among those saying they are not supporters of the Tea Party or are undecided about the Tea Party, followed by Gingrich with 23%, and Paul with 21%.

Gingrich leads among evangelical Christians with 40%, followed by Perry with 15%, Romney with 13%, Santorum with 12%, and Paul with 10%. Among likely voters saying they are not evangelical Christians, Romney leads with 48% and followed by Paul with 33%.

Gingrich leads among men with 29%, followed by Paul with 23%, Romney at 18%, and Santorum with 14%. Among women, Romney leads with 38%, followed Gingrich with 22%, and Paul with 18%.



Comparison to Past Surveys:

South Carolina
Likely Republican
Primary Voters Apr
2011 Jul
2011 Oct
2011 Nov
2011 Jan 4-5
2012 Jan 11-12
2012
Bachmann 5% 13% 5% 3% ni ni
Barbour 2% ni ni ni ni ni
Cain 1% 10% 26% 10% ni ni
Daniels 1% ni ni ni ni ni
Gingrich 9% 3% 8% 33% 24% 25%
Giuliani 4% 6% ni ni ni ni
Huckabee 20% ni ni ni ni ni
Huntsman - - - 3% 2% 1%
Johnson - * - - ni ni
Karger - ni ni ni ni ni
Palin 10% 16% ni ni ni ni
Pataki - ni ni ni ni ni
Rand Paul 2% ni ni ni ni ni
Ron Paul 1% 2% 7% 8% 9% 20%
Pawlenty 2% - ni ni ni ni
Perry ni 6% 15% 8% 2% 9%
Roemer - 2% - - ni ni
Romney 18% 25% 25% 22% 31% 29%
Santorum 1% 2% 1% 1% 24% 7%
Trump 13% ni ni ni ni ni
Other/Undecided 11% 15% 13% 12% 8% 9%


Preference by party:

South Carolina
Likely Republican
Primary Voters Republicans (79%) Independents (21%)
Gingrich 29% 12%
Huntsman 1% 3%
Paul 18% 29%
Perry 8% 11%
Romney 29% 27%
Santorum 7% 8%
Other 2% 2%
Undecided 6% 8%


Preference by Tea Party support:

South Carolina
Likely Republican
Primary Voters Supporter (47%) Not/Undecided (53%)
Gingrich 28% 23%
Huntsman - 3%
Paul 20% 21%
Perry 9% 8%
Romney 24% 33%
Santorum 11% 3%
Other 2% 2%
Undecided 6% 7%


Preference by Evangelical Christian:

South Carolina
Likely Republican
Primary Voters Yes (56%) No/Undecided (44%)
Gingrich 40% 7%
Huntsman - 3%
Paul 10% 33%
Perry 15% 1%
Romney 13% 48%
Santorum 12% 1%
Other 2% 2%
Undecided 8% 5%

[BITEYOASS]

I guess SC would rather vote for a lying sack of shit with a wig (Gingrich), than vote for Ron Paul.

[Dr. Love]

give 'em time

[LoungeMachine]

Ron Paul....

"See, and you thought Sara Palin was a wack job".....

:gulp:

I love how he's for small government unless you're a uterus.

[Nitro Express]

Ron Paul Surges Past Santorum Into Top Tier

Surging past santorum? It sounds more like Sammy Hagar.

[Dr. Love]

Ron Paul....

"See, and you thought Sara Palin was a wack job".....

:gulp:

I love how he's for small government unless you're a uterus.

I think Sarah Palin is stupid and uninformed. Ron Paul is neither.

I'm glad you love his positions, though I honestly couldn't care less about what he thinks about uteruses :)

[Nitro Express]

Palin got caught setting up a slush fund for herself while governor and paying her legal expenses out of it. She should go to prison. A friend of mine in Alaska can't stand the bitch and said the rumor up there was she resigned as governor because she was in trouble and the dirt was starting to get uncovered. I heard she has a home in Arizona now.

[gbranton]

Lead Guitarist for Aerosmith Says Ron Paul Has His Vote

Lead guitarist for Aerosmith, Joe Perry, has been tweeting:

@AdmiralPerry
All the kids I talk to are into Ron Paul . They like his voting record. He's not a smiling grinning talking head spewing party BS.

@AdmiralPerry
Obama hasn't done anything close to what he promised he'd do.didn't get my vote and I got lotta grief. Well,my votes for Ron Paul.

@AdmiralPerry
Media is trying to crush Paul. It's so transparent. They will smear himevery chance.beware! Get your news from lot of different sources.

So Joe Perry and I agree on one thing (Paul) and disagree on whether or not Done With Mirrors is a good album. He says it's shit and I like it.



I don't believe a word the other candidates tell me. They are in this for themselves, and they will lie, cheat, steal and manipulate things to get into office. Obama lied to people. We have to accept that. I thought he would take things in a different direction, but in a lot of ways, he's been worse than Bush was. In other ways, not as bad. But on the balance, it's more of the same.

Santorum, Perry, Newt ... those guys would be just as bad as Obama in different ways. None of them want to change the course we're on. None of them would even try. Things would simply get worse, slowly and inexorably.

For me, that leaves Paul. I look at him, read about him, watch his positions now and in older interviews, and the guy is consistent. I don't agree with all of his points of view, but they are logical and thought out. And he believes it. I know what I'm getting. I know what he'll try to get done. And a lot of it is good.

/\ That's it, right there. A vote for anyone other than Ron Paul is a vote for the same old failed-assed shit that we've been getting.


The way I see it is during World War II the US built up this huge military machine and after the war we went into the cold war which justified the big military machine. Once the iron curtain came down we didn't need the big military machine anymore so when 9/11 happened that was a perfect excuse to keep the big military machine going. What I would have done was increased border security and deported the illegal aliens. I would have increased the security on people entering this country. I would have left Iraq alone and used intelligence and special operatives to go after the real terrorists. I really don't buy the terrorism threat because the big juicy target in this country is the power grid. If you know anything about it it would take years to replace the big transformers if enough of them were damaged. So guess what you target and it could be done easy. It hasn't happened and there is zero security around the main power hubs to this date. So it's all a joke to me. Just an excuse for the military industrial complex to make more money and they seem to like to invade countries full of oil, drugs, and natural resources that are in demand (lithium).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y06NSBBRtY

[Dr. Love]

Ron Paul scores highly sought endorsement!



TRENDING: Paul scores sought-after endorsement in South Carolina
Posted by
CNN Political Reporter Shannon Travis
Myrtle Beach, South Carolina (CNN) – Six days before South Carolina's presidential primary, Ron Paul scored one of the most sought-after political blessings in the state.

On Sunday, state Sen. Tom Davis endorsed the Texas congressman in Myrtle Beach. Davis is a rising star in Republican circles and a highly regarded fiscal conservative who holds sway over many tea party activists.

[LoungeMachine]

A Texas congressman endorsed Ron Paul????????

:gulp:

Welp, it's all over now, folks


:lmao:

[LoungeMachine]

Davis is a rising star in Republican circles and a highly regarded fiscal conservative who holds sway over many tea party activists.

oh, shit.

:gulp:

[Dr. Love]

A Texas congressman endorsed Ron Paul????????

:gulp:

Welp, it's all over now, folks


:lmao:

South Carolina State Senator, whom all the other candidates had been courting. :)

[LoungeMachine]

South Carolina State Senator, whom all the other candidates had been courting. :)

So Ron Paul is a lock now, then.....

Ron Paul will be the GOP Nominee.....

It will be Paul v. Obama.

:gulp:

Here we go!!!

[fifth element]

I guess SC would rather vote for a lying sack of shit with a wig (Gingrich), than vote for Ron Paul.

the problem is that neither of them are fit to vote for.

[FORD]

So Ron Paul is a lock now, then.....

Ron Paul will be the GOP Nominee.....

It will be Paul v. Obama.

:gulp:

Here we go!!!

Then it goes back to what I say..... we need a Congress full of Feingold/Sanders/Grayson/Kucinich types to prevent a Randtard nightmare, should Ron Paul win (or Diebold steals) the election.

And if Obama is re-elected, he will no longer have an excuse to not act like a Democrat.

It's a win either way. Even with Paul in the White House, SOME things would get better.

But with Paul and a teabagger/Wall Street whore Congress, everything will get worse.

And I'll be praying the Mayans were right. Because the world ending on 12/21/2012 is preferrable to the Disunited States of Ayn Rand beginning on 1/20/2013

[Dr. Love]

Obama fucked things up when he had a democratic majority the first time. What makes you think he'd do any better this time? The guy is a corporate shill.

[FORD]

Obama fucked things up when he had a democratic majority the first time. What makes you think he'd do any better this time? The guy is a corporate shill.

He didn't really have a Democratic majority. Harry Reid is a spineless coward, Ted Kennedy and Robert Byrd were on their death beds (and rarely even showed up to vote) and then you have pieces of shit like Lieberman, Nelson (both of em), Baucus, Blanche WalMart, Mary Landrieu, and Diane Feinstein, who may call themselves "Democrats" but rarely if ever actually vote like one. Hell, even Ron Wyden from Oregon -who really should know better- recently signed on to the Jockstrap Ryan plan to destroy Medicare.

They need to go just as much as the Repukes do.

[Nickdfresh]

Obama fucked things up when he had a democratic majority the first time. What makes you think he'd do any better this time? The guy is a corporate shill.

He "fucked things up?" WHAT?! Things were incredibly fucked the moment he stepped into office...

[fifth element]

He "fucked things up?" WHAT?! Things were incredibly fucked the moment he stepped into office...
I agree...and will add to it:

As in..."already fucked up", "had been fucked up"....
and for the last 7-8 years....
you can't blame Obama for the mess that he took on simply by taking office....
that which was what was already screwed up to start with...

well, you can...but it's not logical.

[ELVIS]

He "fucked things up?" WHAT?! Things were incredibly fucked the moment he stepped into office...

Dude, shut the fuck up...

[Dr. Love]

He "fucked things up?" WHAT?! Things were incredibly fucked the moment he stepped into office...

His legislative agenda; I wanted Obama to go in and change things ... in his earnest quest to get bipartisan consensus he gave away much and got almost nothing in return. Healthcare, Bush tax cuts, consumer protection, bank regulation ... every area he should have been strong and use the high ground to push the GOP into line with his agenda (and the dems), he fucked it up and conceded point after point ... and then the GOP didn't vote for it anyway!

The guy is a pushover. He fucked up whatever mandate he had and refused to play tough.

Say what you will about Bush and the GOP (and there's a lot to say!) but those guys know how to get their way ... and apparently they don't need a majority to do it.

[Dr. Love]

oh, and he signed the NDAA this year ... despite "reservations" about how it allows indefinite detention of americans.

And he had an american citizen assassinated on foreign soil.

He's recently come out against SOPA ... but then, it's election season and he has to play to his base somehow. I don't trust the guy. He doesn't care about you are me .... he's in it for himself, and he's in it to keep things how they are.

[Dr. Love]

It's an indication of how aggravated I am with this turd that I'm still thinking of shit to post.

When he came into office he had the financial industry on its heels; They were taking gobs of money from the government and he had the high ground and could have pushed through the legislation and regulations we needed to keep the country safe. And what did he do? He appointed those fuckers to his cabinet! He didn't stand up for us at all! He could have attached more strings to the money and pushed through genuine change. Instead, he chose to serve his financial benefactors... who contribute more money to him to this very day.

I don't agree with Ron Paul on deregulation... but the guy will not be bought, and he will fight for me.

[LoungeMachine]

Dude, shut the fuck up...

Dude, fuck off

:gulp:

[Nickdfresh]

Dude, shut the fuck up...

Inbred sister-fucker says what? Seriously, stick to attempting to master words with more than two syllables and let the adults talk here, jackoff...

[LoungeMachine]

It's an indication of how aggravated I am with this turd that I'm still thinking of shit to post.

When he came into office he had the financial industry on its heels; They were taking gobs of money from the government and he had the high ground and could have pushed through the legislation and regulations we needed to keep the country safe. And what did he do? He appointed those fuckers to his cabinet! He didn't stand up for us at all! He could have attached more strings to the money and pushed through genuine change. Instead, he chose to serve his financial benefactors... who contribute more money to him to this very day.

I don't agree with Ron Paul on deregulation... but the guy will not be bought, and he will fight for me.



I share your frustration with Obama.....

I agree the crazy old man Paul can't be bought....

:gulp:

But Obama will be re-elected, and Paul will never get the GOP Nom.

[Nickdfresh]

His legislative agenda; I wanted Obama to go in and change things ... in his earnest quest to get bipartisan consensus he gave away much and got almost nothing in return. Healthcare, Bush tax cuts, consumer protection, bank regulation ... every area he should have been strong and use the high ground to push the GOP into line with his agenda (and the dems), he fucked it up and conceded point after point ... and then the GOP didn't vote for it anyway!

The guy is a pushover. He fucked up whatever mandate he had and refused to play tough.

Say what you will about Bush and the GOP (and there's a lot to say!) but those guys know how to get their way ... and apparently they don't need a majority to do it.

Firstly, Bush's domestic agenda was fueled by a massive terrorist attack. Whatever else he had planned (like privatizing Social Security) fell apart. Secondly, Obama was always beholden to his pledge of bipartisanship, which he seems to be slowly disdaining. In any case, he has achieved a modicum of nearly everything you've listed....

[Seshmeister]

It's possible though that if Paul gets the nomination running against him he could impact on Obama's policies for the second term in a good way.

[ELVIS]

Inbred sister-fucker says what? Seriously, stick to attempting to master words with more than two syllables and let the adults talk here, jackoff...

Fuck off bitch!

Go suck Obama's dick...

[LoungeMachine]

Fuck off bitch!

Go suck Obama's dick...

Is that what you did here for 8 years?

:gulp:

Did you "sock" [sic] Bush's dick?

[LoungeMachine]

It's possible though that if Paul gets the nomination running against him he could impact on Obama's policies for the second term in a good way.


Which is why I hope the little pit bull stays in until the bitter end...

:gulp:

He can shape the debate. He just can't win.

[LoungeMachine]

Why the need to edit "if you want to defend him" ??

:gulp:

Don't be such a pussy, ELBOW

[Nickdfresh]

Fuck off bitch!

Go suck Obama's dick...

You are truly a wordsmith, Elvira...

I was hoping you could come up with something less indicative than the cliche ramblings of a sad, mental case drifting through life looking for a crutch and a lifeboat to deal the normality he clearly can't handle without drugs or cults...

[Nitro Express]

Which is why I hope the little pit bull stays in until the bitter end...

:gulp:

He can shape the debate. He just can't win.

Ron Paul has already said if he doesn't get the nomination he won't run as an independent. You can't win without the backing of a major party and that right there is the problem. The big money buy the parties.

Another term of Obama will mean more record level spending, more wars, more bailing out the banks and sticking the taxpayer with the bill and more rights taken away in the name of safety and fairness. Romney will do the same thing. Obama should just come out and tell everyone he's a Neocon Republican.

Ford is the smart one. He knows there is no difference between the two so he will vote for Rocky Anderson to wash his hands of the whole mess and when it continues to go to hell in a hand basket at least he can say he didn't enable it.

[Nitro Express]

He "fucked things up?" WHAT?! Things were incredibly fucked the moment he stepped into office...

True but two wrongs don't make a right. Right now things are so fucked up I don't think one side is any better than the other.

[LoungeMachine]

True but two wrongs don't make a right. Right now things are so fucked up I don't think one side is any better than the other.

Obama owns the first 2 years....

The Repuke, do nothing Congress own the last 2.....

:gulp:

Doen't mean we turn it over to Mittens.

[Dr. Love]

Firstly, Bush's domestic agenda was fueled by a massive terrorist attack. Whatever else he had planned (like privatizing Social Security) fell apart. Secondly, Obama was always beholden to his pledge of bipartisanship, which he seems to be slowly disdaining. In any case, he has achieved a modicum of nearly everything you've listed....

I think we deserve more than a modicum of progress... and we would have gotten more than a modicum if he'd stood up for what he believed in instead of engaging in one-sided compromise.

[Dr. Love]

I share your frustration with Obama.....

I agree the crazy old man Paul can't be bought....

:gulp:

But Obama will be re-elected, and Paul will never get the GOP Nom.

if our only choice is to vote for one of the Obamneys then we get what we deserve as a country... more of the fucked up same

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Another discussion about what the President didn't do, without including Republican filibusters into it....

[LoungeMachine]

if our only choice is to vote for one of the Obamneys then we get what we deserve as a country... more of the fucked up same

As opposed to thinking the crazy doctor from Texas can fix it?

:gulp:

Until this country takes back our elections/congress with REAL reform this is what we get.

[Dr. Love]

Another discussion about what the President didn't do, without including Republican filibusters into it....

Both sides are fine with the filibuster rule and don't change it when the senate convenes... and neither side challenges it and forces a filibuster to actually shut down the Senate and answer to the people when they do.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for a bunch of gasbags that don't even TRY

[Dr. Love]

As opposed to thinking the crazy doctor from Texas can fix it?

:gulp:

Until this country takes back our elections/congress with REAL reform this is what we get.

It has to start somewhere. Ron Paul is a cause candidate -- and I support the cause (and the candidate). If he doesn't get it, I have faith someone else will take up the banner and keep pushing.

[LoungeMachine]

Both sides are fine with the filibuster rule and don't change it when the senate convenes... and neither side challenges it and forces a filibuster to actually shut down the Senate and answer to the people when they do.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for a bunch of gasbags that don't even TRY


Nor do I....

Now please explain to us how President Paul, with no support or coalition would get anything passed?

:gulp:

[LoungeMachine]

It has to start somewhere. .

It starts with REFORM....

not a nut.

:gulp:

[Nitro Express]

Obama owns the first 2 years....

The Repuke, do nothing Congress own the last 2.....

:gulp:

Doen't mean we turn it over to Mittens.

You are the guy that thinks the same beer is better as long as it's in a bottle with your favorite brand name on it. Go ahead and believe all the political theater. That's all it is.

[Nitro Express]

Nor do I....

Now please explain to us how President Paul, with no support or coalition would get anything passed?

:gulp:

Use all the new power Bush gave the presidency. Obama sure seems to be enjoying it. :biggrin:

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Both sides are fine with the filibuster rule and don't change it when the senate convenes... and neither side challenges it and forces a filibuster to actually shut down the Senate and answer to the people when they do.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for a bunch of gasbags that don't even TRY

Actually, even if they forced a fillibuster, there's not much that the Democrats could do once they forced it. This article explains it pretty well:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/23/the-myth-of-the-filibuste_n_169117.html

And since they can't invoke cloture with 60 votes, they're fucked.....

[Nitro Express]

if our only choice is to vote for one of the Obamneys then we get what we deserve as a country... more of the fucked up same

They will rob and steal until the lid finally blows off. We can either solve it politically or we can blow each other's heads off. The latter happens after the political process fails.

[Dr. Love]

Nor do I....

Now please explain to us how President Paul, with no support or coalition would get anything passed?

:gulp:

Ron Paul shares agenda items with both republicans and democrats. In a deeply divided congress, he could work with both sides to get the country moving on the left and the right.

Agenda items like:

Bringing the troops home
Cutting spending across the board
Decriminalizing marijuana
Lowering taxes


...


the list goes on, but the point is, he can move the ball in multiple areas by having shared issues with both sides.

[LoungeMachine]

You are the guy that thinks the same beer is better as long as it's in a bottle with your favorite brand name on it. Go ahead and believe all the political theater. That's all it is.

No, but I look forward to you telling us how you worked for years as a master brewer.....

:gulp:

[LoungeMachine]

Ron Paul shares agenda items with both republicans and democrats. .

You mean like tax cuts?

Ask Obama how well the Repuke congress helped him "move the ball" on that one....

:gulp:

[Dr. Love]

Actually, even if they forced a fillibuster, there's not much that the Democrats could do once they forced it. This article explains it pretty well:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/23/the-myth-of-the-filibuste_n_169117.html

And since they can't invoke cloture with 60 votes, they're fucked.....

I read the article, but I think this can be addressed 1 of 2 ways:

1. Amend the rules
2. When a party threatens to shut down government ... call the bluff. Let them make endless quorum calls. The people aren't dumb ... when they see it happening, they will express their anger over it.

[Dr. Love]

You mean like tax cuts?

Ask Obama how well the Repuke congress helped him "move the ball" on that one....

:gulp:

I seem to recall Senate Republicans and President Obama working together to push House Republicans into line on that recently...

[Dr. Love]

I'll say this ... watching the republican debate ... god Ron Paul is a horrible speaker most of the time. :)

[LoungeMachine]

I seem to recall Senate Republicans and President Obama working together to push House Republicans into line on that recently...

"working together" ?

Hardly

:gulp:

File it under "calling their bluff" and "running for cover"

[Nitro Express]

I read the article, but I think this can be addressed 1 of 2 ways:

1. Amend the rules
2. When a party threatens to shut down government ... call the bluff. Let them make endless quorum calls. The people aren't dumb ... when they see it happening, they will express their anger over it.

How about we fire all the mother fuckers. One thing that is killing the economy is businesses can't make a five year plan because they have no idea what their taxes are gong to be for that period thank's to the jackass politicians not able to come up with a budget. So you hold off on hiring.

Also, what has ruined the political system is allowing corporations to donate to a campaign. It should only individual people who can donate and then set a cap on the amount to keep the ones with deep pockets from taking over the system.

[Nitro Express]

I think Mitt will get the nomination and win. I'm waiting to see how the election goes but seriously, if it doesn't turn this election nothing is going to get fixed. The politicians will do what they can to rally the economy in 2012 because they want to get re-elected and then all hell breaks loose in 2013. Then they will re arrange the chairs on the Titanic some more while she sinks. People are already leaving the US. Especially retired people. The system has been going down hill the last 40 years and now they are taking away basic constitutional rights and coming for the internet next. If this keeps up there isn't going to be anything here worth staying here for.

[knuckleboner]

I think we deserve more than a modicum of progress... and we would have gotten more than a modicum if he'd stood up for what he believed in instead of engaging in one-sided compromise.

not true.

it was hard enough getting health care reform through the democratic house. and for everyone calling it socialism, the fact is liberals hated that reform. but it could not have passed as anything else. so it's more incremental changes than anything.

[Dr. Love]

You don't think we deserve more than a modicum, or incremental change? You don't think Obama sat on his thumb and wasted time while it was torn apart across the nation rather than stand up and fight and twist arms and sell it to the people?

I want something better. I believe we deserve something better than what Obama is selling.

[LoungeMachine]

I want something better. I believe we deserve something better than what Obama is selling.

While you focus on the "figurehead" I focus my ire and disdain on the REAL problem......

Lobbyists, Campaign Finance Reform, and a Bribed Congress that doesn't give a rat's ass what's good for the country....

:gulp:

We don't butter their bread.

[Dr. Love]

I focus on the most powerful man in the country (if not the world), with the ability to fight on my behalf against those interests, educate the people and take to task a complicit congress to get real "change I can believe in".

I focus on him to AT LEAST TRY

[LoungeMachine]

I focus on the most powerful man in the country (if not the world),

Speaker of the House?

Think about it.

:gulp:

[Nickdfresh]

I think we deserve more than a modicum of progress... and we would have gotten more than a modicum if he'd stood up for what he believed in instead of engaging in one-sided compromise.

Oh please, you think he had a choice? I just heard that 2011 was the least productive year in the history of congre$$, and that's saying a lot!!

[Dr. Love]

definitely not ... he can't even control his own caucus :)

Maybe the most powerful person is any one of 100 individuals in the senate... one of them decides something shouldn't get done ... it doesn't happen.

[Nickdfresh]

You don't think we deserve more than a modicum, or incremental change? You don't think Obama sat on his thumb and wasted time while it was torn apart across the nation rather than stand up and fight and twist arms and sell it to the people?

I want something better. I believe we deserve something better than what Obama is selling.

So you want to vote for a guy that gets wet over the thought of unrestrained Robber-baron capitalism and would have led us into a depression if he had won in 08?

[LoungeMachine]

Lest we forget.....

President Romney would have let the US Auto Industry DIE.......

:gulp:

[Dr. Love]

Oh please, you think he had a choice? I just heard that 2011 was the least productive year in the history of congre$$, and that's saying a lot!!

I expected him to do more than he did to try, instead of constantly trying to rise above the fray and constantly try to work with people whose stated goal was to see him be a 1 term president. Do you guys not think he should have done more than he did?

[Dr. Love]

So you want to vote for a guy that gets wet over the thought of unrestrained Robber-baron capitalism and would have led us into a depression if he had won in 08?

I support RP for different reasons ... :)

[LoungeMachine]

I support RP for different reasons ... :)

Desperation isn't a reason....

:gulp:

It's called Republicanitis.

[Dr. Love]

Desperation isn't the reason.

[Nitro Express]

So you want to vote for a guy that gets wet over the thought of unrestrained Robber-baron capitalism and would have led us into a depression if he had won in 08?

Nick we are in a depression now. It's just that with things like welfare, unemployment insurance, and food stamps it's not as obvious. Robber-baron capitalism is here and now. When you have bankers who sit on a central board of a central bank that can print money at will and call it the US dollar, you can buy lots of things. At least Ron Paul is the only one pointing that problem out. I might add the Democrats are just as guilty. 100 times leverage was made legal by Bill Clinton which opened the door to the derivatives abuse.

Obama is as much of a corporate fascist as Bush was. He just sells socialism because that is what most you Democrats want but what he has really done is given more power to the corporations. He works for General Electric and Goldman Sachs, and BP. He let BP run the whole show during that spill. If there is any socialism with Obama its socialism for the rich.

The politicians will rally the economy in 2012 because they all want to get re-elected. Then in 2013 it will drop back into reality. Sure they can do short-term stimulus.

But yes, the world financial system is in trouble because it was allowed to get out of touch with reality due to deregulation.

[ELVIS]

Excellent post, Nitro!

[Seshmeister]

But yes, the world financial system is in trouble because it was allowed to get out of touch with reality due to deregulation.

My understanding is that the response to this by the Republican candidates is to deregulate even more?

[Dr. Love]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KfDJfvYH6CY#!

lol...

[Nitro Express]

My understanding is that the response to this by the Republican candidates is to deregulate even more?

I think the only one not bought off by the corporations is Ron Paul. That's why they ignore him and the Republican propaganda station here tells everyone not to vote for him because Mitt Romney is the only one that can beat Obama.

It's not really about regulation anymore. It's corporations buying most the politicians to where the government becomes their enforcer. The EPA bars small electric car manufactures from getting their approval to sell cars. Small farmers are harassed and ran out of business by the FDA. All the agencies have their own military like thugs now. So it's corporate fascism and regulation was a thing we talked about in the past.

All the Republicans talk about is beating Obama. They don't say much about how they really are going to fix things. Remember real capitalism is owning your own property, producing a good and service and selling it to someone in exchange for something. The corporations have actually destroyed capitalism by taking over the government and using what used to be legitimate regulatory agencies and using them as thugs to run the competition out of business.

The whole Democrat and Republican thing is a thing of the past really. Both parties no longer care about the average person all they care about is the corporations who of course are tied to the central banks. In other words, they can print their own bailout but they have to saddle the citizens with some of it to make it look legitimate. It's the end result of fractional reserve banking. You can do endless damage with it.

Like I said, the only politician running that seems to really get the problem is Ron Paul. Nothing changes as long as the corporations are in charge of the money making machine.

The United States is not a government. It's governments. It no longer unified and all these different pieces are doing their own thing. As long as you can move huge amounts of money under the table this is the situation so you have to have the money supply itself in the open. So really we have a fictional money system that most people still believe in. I mean you still can trade Federal Reserve notes at the store. It's the ignorance of the little people actually that is the problem. They enable the same system that is screwing them. I mean with people that stupid of course the wolves are going to have a heyday and until the little people wake up, it's business as usual on steroids and of course the wolves will try to take more because the theft has been so easy.

Face it. People don't take notice until it affects them personally. I think more people need to be ran over by the greed train and then you have the problem of someone riding in on a white horse to save the day which usually is Hitler or Napoleon. History just repeating itself basically.

The biggest mistake Democrats make is they actually still think the government is a government of the people. So they willingly give more power to the government which is now the corporations so they actually make what they are trying to fight stronger by just giving it more power over themselves. This is the biggest flaw of the current Democratic mindset.

Of course the Republicans will vote in their flavor of thug because they want the Democrat thug gone.

See it's the same beer but it's marketed differently under two different brand names. The parties are no deeper than that anymore. They are just brand names owned by the same corporate conglomerate. Politics itself has gone corporate.

[LoungeMachine]

Back when I was a K Street Lobbyist.......

:gulp:

[Dr. Love]

http://i.imgur.com/v2mWc.jpg

[FORD]

Lest we forget.....

President Romney would have let the US Auto Industry DIE.......

:gulp:

Which is truly pathetic, considering its the industry that made his father a rich man.

[FORD]

I think the only one not bought off by the corporations is Ron Paul.

The corporations don't have to buy him. His Randtard Libertarian Fairy Tale agenda would destroy all regulations and they would be free to do whatever the fuck they wanted.

The only corporations who hate Ron Paul are "defense" contractors (because there would be no more wars of imperialism) and maybe the pharmaceutical companies, because he would end the war on a harmless plant which renders many of their over priced toxic chemicals useless. But by abolishing the FDA, they would make up their profit margin in record time, so they would be fine with him in the long run.

[Nitro Express]

I hate to break it to you Ford but the corporations already own the federal regulatory agencies. It's already happened. The US Forrest Service is arming itself and closing roads. There has been showdowns between local sheriffs and the Bureau of Land Management over their armed thugs harassing ranchers. The horse you are worrying about has left the barn already my friend. That can all be fixed but first we might just have to get rid of these agencies and start over. The biggest problem are the derivatives and the banking system. That's the jugular vein to the corrupt corporations which hold so much derivative debt they have to get backdoor money from Ben Bernanke and saddle the tax payer to get going. Bank of America, Wells Fargo, JP Morgan Chase, Citigroup are so far in the hole they should just dissapear and Ron Paul's strategy will do them in.

You want to slap these guys on the hand and Ron Paul knows how to take their heads off. So of course they are going to have their propaganda machine sell him as a nut.

[LoungeMachine]

You want to slap these guys on the hand and Ron Paul knows how to take their heads off. .

Let's hear it....

Please explain how he'd do it, with all scenarios.....

House, Senate, controlled by either party.

[Nitro Express]

:gulp:

I should sue your ass off for misquoting me asshole! Lounge should get a job at MSNBC. :biggrin: Or be the Alan Combs type character at FOX. Both are lying sacks of shit networks.

[Nitro Express]

Let's hear it....

Please explain how he'd do it, with all scenarios.....

House, Senate, controlled by either party.

Declare the Federal Reserve board terrorists and have them arrested and the organization seized under the Patriot Act. Thanks to Bush, the president can do a lot of things without the congress now or if you are Obama, you just go ahead and do it.

[LoungeMachine]

Declare the Federal Reserve board terrorists and have them arrested and the organization seized under the Patriot Act. Thanks to Bush, the president can do a lot of things without the congress now or if you are Obama, you just go ahead and do it.

More Fantasyland Politics......

:gulp:

That explains the RP fixation.

Thanks for confirming.

[knuckleboner]

You don't think we deserve more than a modicum, or incremental change? You don't think Obama sat on his thumb and wasted time while it was torn apart across the nation rather than stand up and fight and twist arms and sell it to the people?

I want something better. I believe we deserve something better than what Obama is selling.

could obama have worked harder to set the agenda? yep. though, it doesn't mean he'd have gotten anything done. in fact, there's a strong argument that he'd have gotten less done. congressional republicans made little secret from the get-go that their primary goal was to make obama a 1 termer. the more he said, "this is my plan," there's certainly a chance that the republicans would've fought tooth and nail against it. whatever it was.

that said, i would say that obama could've been a little more involved, but that doesn't mean that there was any easy, or even feasible, path to much larger change. there wasn't.

[Dr. Love]

that's quitter talk!

I see Gingrich was out talking about the gold standard today. That rapscallion! Trying to destroy the US economy.

[Nickdfresh]

Newt was actually talking about snorting "gold dust" off a hooker's ass...

[knuckleboner]

that's quitter talk!

I see Gingrich was out talking about the gold standard today. That rapscallion! Trying to destroy the US economy.

dude, being a realist isn't exactly quitting.

ron paul (sincere as he is) can wow people about how liberty is great in the ideal, but in the real world, things are a bit more complicated...

[ELVIS]

So just vote for more status quo then...

[LoungeMachine]

So just vote for more status quo then...

As opposed to a wasted vote for RP?

:gulp:

Explain how the results will be different.

[ELVIS]

Ron Paul will reduce the size of the federal government and stop the war mongering...

[LoungeMachine]

Ron Paul will reduce the size of the federal government and stop the war mongering...

How?

HES. NEVER. GOING. TO. WIN.

:gulp:

Jesus christ, wake up

[ELVIS]

Does FOX pay you to keep repeating that ??

[dazzlindino]

I think the only one not bought off by the corporations is Ron Paul. That's why they ignore him and the Republican propaganda station here tells everyone not to vote for him because Mitt Romney is the only one that can beat Obama.

It's not really about regulation anymore. It's corporations buying most the politicians to where the government becomes their enforcer. The EPA bars small electric car manufactures from getting their approval to sell cars. Small farmers are harassed and ran out of business by the FDA. All the agencies have their own military like thugs now. So it's corporate fascism and regulation was a thing we talked about in the past.

All the Republicans talk about is beating Obama. They don't say much about how they really are going to fix things. Remember real capitalism is owning your own property, producing a good and service and selling it to someone in exchange for something. The corporations have actually destroyed capitalism by taking over the government and using what used to be legitimate regulatory agencies and using them as thugs to run the competition out of business.

The whole Democrat and Republican thing is a thing of the past really. Both parties no longer care about the average person all they care about is the corporations who of course are tied to the central banks. In other words, they can print their own bailout but they have to saddle the citizens with some of it to make it look legitimate. It's the end result of fractional reserve banking. You can do endless damage with it.

Like I said, the only politician running that seems to really get the problem is Ron Paul. Nothing changes as long as the corporations are in charge of the money making machine.

The United States is not a government. It's governments. It no longer unified and all these different pieces are doing their own thing. As long as you can move huge amounts of money under the table this is the situation so you have to have the money supply itself in the open. So really we have a fictional money system that most people still believe in. I mean you still can trade Federal Reserve notes at the store. It's the ignorance of the little people actually that is the problem. They enable the same system that is screwing them. I mean with people that stupid of course the wolves are going to have a heyday and until the little people wake up, it's business as usual on steroids and of course the wolves will try to take more because the theft has been so easy.

Face it. People don't take notice until it affects them personally. I think more people need to be ran over by the greed train and then you have the problem of someone riding in on a white horse to save the day which usually is Hitler or Napoleon. History just repeating itself basically.

The biggest mistake Democrats make is they actually still think the government is a government of the people. So they willingly give more power to the government which is now the corporations so they actually make what they are trying to fight stronger by just giving it more power over themselves. This is the biggest flaw of the current Democratic mindset.

Of course the Republicans will vote in their flavor of thug because they want the Democrat thug gone.

See it's the same beer but it's marketed differently under two different brand names. The parties are no deeper than that anymore. They are just brand names owned by the same corporate conglomerate. Politics itself has gone corporate.

awesome post..too bad its so true.....

[dazzlindino]

How?

HES. NEVER. GOING. TO. WIN.

:gulp:



Jesus christ, wake up

yep...just what the dems and repubs were hoping youd say....

[Dr. Love]

Old Man Lounge drank his haterade today ;)

No vote is a waste vote. You have a say in the direction of the country. The idea that voting for someone is wasting a vote/voting for someone else is a logical fallacy.

[ELVIS]

No, it's all grown up Lounge drank his Haterade© today...

[Nickdfresh]

Old Man Lounge drank his haterade today ;)

No vote is a waste vote. You have a say in the direction of the country. The idea that voting for someone is wasting a vote/voting for someone else is a logical fallacy.

You mean like the votes for Ralph Nader in 2000, effectively springing the chimp into office over Al Gore?

Do you think Gore would have invaded Iraq in 2003? I doubt it!

[Dr. Love]

GWB became President because people voted for him, not because people voted for Ralph Nader.

Not all of us believe we have to pick between the two parties that the majority seems inclined to waste time on. If Ron Paul weren't running, I wouldn't vote for Obama or whomever the GOP nominee would be. I would find someone I believed in and vote for them. It's a genuine shame more people don't vote that way, instead of "choosing between the lesser of two evils" and then wondering why they get what they get.

Don't like the choices presented by the 2 main parties? STOP VOTING FOR THEM!

[Nickdfresh]

GWB became President because people voted for him, not because people voted for Ralph Nader.

Yeah, less people than for Al Gore...

The precious Constitution at work, BTW.


Not all of us believe we have to pick between the two parties that the majority seems inclined to waste time on.

You don't have to pick well meaning, but certifiable, metal-cases either...


If Ron Paul weren't running, I wouldn't vote for Obama or whomever the GOP nominee would be. I would find someone I believed in and vote for them. It's a genuine shame more people don't vote that way, instead of "choosing between the lesser of two evils" and then wondering why they get what they get.

Don't like the choices presented by the 2 main parties? STOP VOTING FOR THEM!

Oh, the fickle American public...

[ELVIS]

Metal-cases ??

[Dr. Love]

:)

You guys may disagree with my choice, but I'm the only one advocating for someone ... I don't hear much in the way of alternative vision from you guys. Unless you're still standing by Obama?

And if so, I'd wonder: Is it because you like Obama's record and performance, or because you don't want what you perceive as the "greater of two evils"?

[ELVIS]

:)

but I'm the only one advocating for someone ...

No you're not...

[Dr. Love]

you're right, my apologies. :)

[ELVIS]

Ron Paul OWNED Santorum tonight...

[LoungeMachine]

:)

You guys may disagree with my choice, but I'm the only one advocating for someone ... I don't hear much in the way of alternative vision from you guys. Unless you're still standing by Obama?

And if so, I'd wonder: Is it because you like Obama's record and performance, or because you don't want what you perceive as the "greater of two evils"?

I'm sorry, I thought this was the ronpaul=awesome thread....

:gulp:

And it's not an either/or answer.....it's both

[LoungeMachine]

Ron Paul OWNED Santorum tonight...

Yeah?

How many delegates is that worth again?

[Dr. Love]

I'm sorry, I thought this was the ronpaul=awesome thread....

:gulp:

And it's not an either/or answer.....it's both

awesome/kickass

I guess some people just want to settle for the choices other people give them. :P

[Panamark]

To show my total ignorance of the state of US politics,
(other than the carrier pigeons news that told Australians Obama sucks)

Is Ron related to Les ? :)

I know, its deep. Possible cross forum possibilites, US politics in gear street.....

[DRD]

Yes he did own him big time Elvis.

[DRD]

Ron Paul - Watch this presentation to see why so many people are endorsing Ron Paul for President

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=92OV3RbU3ek#!

[Dr. Love]

I'm watching the recast of the debate, noticing a few things.

Gingrich really is a condescending asshole. Jaysis.

Gingrich, Romney, Santorum all say "I". Paul says "We".

Gingrich gave maybe an honest answer on doing something different in retrospect. Santorum and Romney were BS. Paul said he wished he was a better speaker. I think that was the most honest.

Ron Paul is still a rambler. How many times are you going to say "but" and change the subject...?

haha, Ron Paul busted Santorum's balls on the abortion issue. It was great to see the audience shouting for him to speak when they were going to skip him. He did a goofy wave which doesn't really help his case... lol.

Santorum attacks Gingrich and Romney relentlessly... I guess he doesn't think he can get Paul supporters as easily as he can Romney/Gingrich supporters.

Santorum doesn't like the internet. Well, we don't like him either.

Does anyone else think Mitt Romney has a creepy, plastic stare? And Gingrich, when he grins, looks like a giant baby.

I find it bizarre to hear Newt call Romney a moderate. Isn't Newt a big government conservative?

[Julius]

I think Ron Paul is the only likable candidate, I'd vote for him over his opponents.... but seriously, folks... with this bunch to choose from we're destined for another 4 years of Obama.

[LoungeMachine]

awesome/kickass

I guess some people just want to settle for the choices other people give them. :P

You make it sound like you picked Ron Paul out of obscurity and had him run....

I don't begrudge your like of the guy. I like 80% of his stances too.....

BUT HE CAN'T WIN

:gulp:

You're in love, so you can't see clearly.

[gbranton]

I find it bizarre to hear Newt call Romney a moderate. Isn't Newt a big government conservative?

You could say that he's a big government guy. A conservative? Not hardly.

[LoungeMachine]

Funny thing is.....

IF Paul had decided a year ago to make a serious 3rd Party Run I'd actually admit he might have a chance.

But he's NEVER going to get the GOP Nomination.....never.

:gulp:

[Dr. Love]

I don't think he'll win, but I like his strategy. I'd like to see it be a race between romney, paul and gingrich all the way to the convention. If we get there and no one has enough delegates to clearly win, then they have to broker ... and paul could become a kingmaker and get a lot of his positions adopted. That's what I'm rooting for.

[Dr. Love]

You make it sound like you picked Ron Paul out of obscurity and had him run....

I don't begrudge your like of the guy. I like 80% of his stances too.....

BUT HE CAN'T WIN

:gulp:

You're in love, so you can't see clearly.

people support Ron Paul.

There are dozens of us! Dozens!!

[Hardrock69]

Well, my 2 cents....Ron Paul at least has clear ideas about how to tackle various issues....while the other candidates do nothing but yell and scream the same old rhetoric without offering any specific solutions, Paul has always got a plan. Something none of the other idiots seem to want to bother with. Sort of like the current Retardlican assholes in Congress. Instead of doing their jobs during the Obama term, they have spent all their energy trying to stop Obama from doing anything.

In fact, this Congress has actually done less in the way of legislation than any other Congress in history.

They were elected to do a job, and have FAILED. Big time. They should all be run out of DC on a rail with much tar and feathering.

Not saying Paul does not engage in his share of rhetoric, and I certainly do not agree with his policies on everything, but out of all the Retardlican candidates, he appears to have more sense than the others. A lot of his suggestions I have seen over the years are "Common Sense" suggestions....which is why he is feared by the Retardlicans, who don't want anyone elected that "gets any ideas".

Paul always seemed more of an independent candidate who was not a sheep, was not afraid to vote differently than the Retardlican asshole party line....

So I see him as the lesser of Retardlican evils. And on one front, he is in favor of ending the waste involved with the "War On Drugs", something Mobama refuses to consider, despite his admission on Jay Leno to smoking pot:

Jay Leno: Did you inhale?

Obama: Well, that was the point, wasn't it?

[sadaist]

Funny thing is.....

IF Paul had decided a year ago to make a serious 3rd Party Run I'd actually admit he might have a chance.

But he's NEVER going to get the GOP Nomination.....never.

:gulp:


Tonights top story on Yahoo was about the debate & mostly Gingrich responses to ex-wife. I read whole story. Included lines about Romneys taxes, Santorums jabs at Newt, etc. Anyways, I get to the comments after....

#1 - umm...no mention of Ron Paul? Was he there?

#2 - Candidate mentions in article

Gingrich 15
Romney 13
Santorum 8
Ron Paul 0

Once you realize the guy gets zero respect, it really becomes blatant.

[LoungeMachine]

Tonights top story on Yahoo was about the debate & mostly Gingrich responses to ex-wife. I read whole story. Included lines about Romneys taxes, Santorums jabs at Newt, etc. Anyways, I get to the comments after....

#1 - umm...no mention of Ron Paul? Was he there?

.

Would it really matter if he was?

:gulp:

[Dr. Love]

I was so distraught to hear that Lounge didn't like Colbert ... but then I found out why, and it all made sense.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43hlXKg5FOo

[LoungeMachine]

Because even HE has a better chance than Ron Paul??

:lmao:

[ELVIS]

So what happens when Paul ends up with the most delagates ??

[kwame k]

Same thing that happened to Gore or Kerry.......

[sadaist]

So what happens when Paul ends up with the most delagates ??


The Supreme Court comes in and hands them over to Jeb Bush?

[mewisemagic]

I think its really cool to see all the Ron Paul support in here....

[kwame k]

The Supreme Court comes in and hands them over to Jeb Bush?

Even looking back to the '08 nomination of McCain......he had it all but wrapped up by Feb.

Remember, the term, "smoked filled room", came into being because of the Warren Harding Republican nomination.

The GOP likes to have a nominee early and taking it to the delegation floor of the convention isn't the image the GOP wants to send going up against Obama in the general. Fractured parties don't play well in the media or to the Party faithful. A fractured Party usually leads to Moderates or on-the-fence voters looking somewhere else.

That's why no matter what happens with Paul......he will never be the nominee, they won't allow it, period!

[LoungeMachine]

So what happens when Paul ends up with the most delagates ??

You're made a webbie here....

:gulp:

[hambon4lif]

but seriously, folks... with this bunch to choose from we're destined for another 4 years of Obama.Alot of people have yet to snap out of denial to realize it, but that's exactly how it's going down.
There have already been subtle hints of this, but if you're quick, you'll catch them.
Two weeks before Huntsman cheesed out, he was asked by every single media outlet if his campaign was just a dry run for a 2016 shot. Every single last one of them.
I found that interesting why they would even ask him something like that.
Let's just say (for laughs, if nothing else) that Obama doesn't get re-elected. What would Huntsman run as in 2016? A Democrat this time?
They asked him that because even they've conceded that this pack of fucking brainless bozos (that the GOP scraped the absolute bottom of the barrel to find) don't have a fucking chance in hell.

Add to that the fact that somewhere in the last 30 years or so, Americans have developed a very bad habit of giving our Presidents two-terms, whether they deserve it or not, though alot of that can be attributed to how ridiculous going through this process every four years is.
Also add to that the fact that everyone seems to have forgotten how formidable 'campaign Obama' is. How he's done his job once he got it depends on your perspective, but the guy is undeniably a campaign ninja, He will completely annihilate and embarass these waterheads within the first 5 minutes.
The only one that has a shot of having Obama on the ropes and holding his feet to the fire is Ron Paul, but like Lounge is trying to tell everyone, he has no chance. Not because we don't believe in him or what he says. It's because his plans and ideas throw a monkey-wrench into 'the plan', one that has been in effect for quite some time now, and they will never let Ron Paul or anyone like him, get in the way of that. Never Never Never.

You really have to pay attention to catch these beams of light, but they're bright enough for you to see the writing on the wall.

[Nickdfresh]

Metal-cases ??

Fucking AYE!!!!

[Nickdfresh]

Ron Paul OWNED Santorum tonight...

That's sort of like bragging about giving a retard a weggie...not really saying much...

[ELVIS]

You're right on that one...:biggrin:

[ELVIS]

Campaign ninja ??

Well. Ron Paul is a campaign AK47...

[Seshmeister]

What are odds of a video coming out showing Santorum sucking off Bachman's husband backstage before a debate? 60-40? 70-30?

[knuckleboner]

:)

You guys may disagree with my choice, but I'm the only one advocating for someone ... I don't hear much in the way of alternative vision from you guys. Unless you're still standing by Obama?

And if so, I'd wonder: Is it because you like Obama's record and performance, or because you don't want what you perceive as the "greater of two evils"?

a little of both.

i was never an obama is going to change the world kind of guy. but i thought he was the best of the bunch in 2008.

am i a little disappointed by his performance thus far? eh...in some instances. he certainly hasn't been perfect. but he's had a hellacious situation. started in the middle of the worst recession in 3 generations. (ron paul's the only candidate who can say he remembers when it was worse...;)) plus, make no mistake, the republicans were out since day one to impede his progress. not easy when every position you take is vigorously opposed because the other side wants to make you a 1-termer.

that said, while the stimulus bill was far from perfect, it's helped. no doubt. there are hundreds of thousands of police, firefighers and teachers who didn't join the unemployed thanks to it. hundreds of thousands of construction jobs who had work. hundreds of millions of Americans who had lower taxes because of it.

the American auto industry exists because the obama administation stepped up. and for very little net investment, GM is back again as the world's #1 car company. that's a helluva turnaround.

he wound down the 2 wars in a way that was responsible, but got the job done. could it have been quicker? sure. but it happened.

he killed osama.

he took out qaddaffi.

he repealed don't ask don't tell.

and he got the ball rolling on the first significant (though by NO means socialist) health care reform in about 100 years.

best president ever? no. definitely not. but out of the republican crowd of 2012, i'd take obama every time. (and i'd take obama's dog over bachmann.)

[hambon4lif]

What are odds of a video coming out showing Santorum sucking off Bachman's husband backstage before a debate? 60-40? 70-30?Marcus has a face that looks like it's been used as a catchers mitt for cocks, so if it were reversed to have Michelle's wife blowing Sanitorium, you can kick those odds up to 80-20 easy.
90-10 odds says they try blowing each other at the same time and both fall off the couch.:thumb:

[ELVIS]

What are odds of a video coming out showing Santorum sucking off Bachman's husband backstage before a debate? 60-40? 70-30?

60-40

But I wonder how many people in Scotland have that same thought...

[kwame k]

a little of both.

i was never an obama is going to change the world kind of guy. but i thought he was the best of the bunch in 2008.

am i a little disappointed by his performance thus far? eh...in some instances. he certainly hasn't been perfect. but he's had a hellacious situation. started in the middle of the worst recession in 3 generations. (ron paul's the only candidate who can say he remembers when it was worse...;)) plus, make no mistake, the republicans were out since day one to impede his progress. not easy when every position you take is vigorously opposed because the other side wants to make you a 1-termer.

that said, while the stimulus bill was far from perfect, it's helped. no doubt. there are hundreds of thousands of police, firefighers and teachers who didn't join the unemployed thanks to it. hundreds of thousands of construction jobs who had work. hundreds of millions of Americans who had lower taxes because of it.

the American auto industry exists because the obama administation stepped up. and for very little net investment, GM is back again as the world's #1 car company. that's a helluva turnaround.

he wound down the 2 wars in a way that was responsible, but got the job done. could it have been quicker? sure. but it happened.

he killed osama.

he took out qaddaffi.

he repealed don't ask don't tell.

and he got the ball rolling on the first significant (though by NO means socialist) health care reform in about 100 years.

best president ever? no. definitely not. but out of the republican crowd of 2012, i'd take obama every time. (and i'd take obama's dog over bachmann.)

I'd add to that the Auto-Industry has hired/ is hiring back most of the people laid off and they paid back most of the bailout money, too!

He's also put us back on the right track as far as foreign policy goes......he's willing to compromise and has been better at diplomacy than Dubya's, "You're either with us or against us.", cowboy diplomacy.

No terrorist attacks on our soil and key terrorists have been killed or jailed.

He's not my favorite President, either but considering the alternatives....he has my vote.

Newt has stated publicly that he'd send troops back to Iraq and invade Iran.....other than the fact he's a complete hypocrite and a first rate asshole....his war mongering leaves him out on that fact alone.

Mitt.....if he ran on his record he might have a chance but he's a self-serving lying douche bag who'd do or say anything to get elected.......A capitalist with no soul.......nope!

Ronny boy......I like about 60% of what he says and the other 40% scares the shit out of me and the fact that if he ran as an Independent [doubt it] he'd take away votes from Obama giving Mitt or Newt the Top Job......nope.

Paul will never be the GOP nom so he's a non-issue.

[Dr. Love]

a little of both.

i was never an obama is going to change the world kind of guy. but i thought he was the best of the bunch in 2008.

am i a little disappointed by his performance thus far? eh...in some instances. he certainly hasn't been perfect. but he's had a hellacious situation. started in the middle of the worst recession in 3 generations. (ron paul's the only candidate who can say he remembers when it was worse...;)) plus, make no mistake, the republicans were out since day one to impede his progress. not easy when every position you take is vigorously opposed because the other side wants to make you a 1-termer.

that said, while the stimulus bill was far from perfect, it's helped. no doubt. there are hundreds of thousands of police, firefighers and teachers who didn't join the unemployed thanks to it. hundreds of thousands of construction jobs who had work. hundreds of millions of Americans who had lower taxes because of it.

the American auto industry exists because the obama administation stepped up. and for very little net investment, GM is back again as the world's #1 car company. that's a helluva turnaround.

he wound down the 2 wars in a way that was responsible, but got the job done. could it have been quicker? sure. but it happened.

he killed osama.

he took out qaddaffi.

he repealed don't ask don't tell.

and he got the ball rolling on the first significant (though by NO means socialist) health care reform in about 100 years.

best president ever? no. definitely not. but out of the republican crowd of 2012, i'd take obama every time. (and i'd take obama's dog over bachmann.)

I think this kind of glosses over his first 2 years where he had majorities in the house and senate and pre-emptively conceded items to the republicans. And then, with the 2010 elections, he lost control of the house and close on the senate -- and he deserved to -- because he couldn't effectively make the case for where he wanted to go, and people were upset with his direction, and ultimately put the opposition in power. He could have campaigned from a position of power and authority to drive an agenda. Presidents in the past have done this much, much more effectively.

What you're saying sounds nice but I really think it's kind of apologetic about what happened and lets Obama off the hook. The buck stops with him. Leadership is about ownership, responsibility, and ultimately, accountability.

He hasn't owned the situation. He hasn't proactively pushed a vision to resolve the situation, so ultimately, he's accountable for the situation. It may have crashed before he became President, but he still could have owned it more effectively.

[Seshmeister]

As an aside the problem with signatures is that they don't last forever.

Now there are maybe 50 posts saying how they love the tits in your signature and for the next how many months people are going to think that they are homoerotic trekkies.

[Dr. Love]

That's how I troll

Plus the image I had got taken down unfortunately. I'm in transition looking for the next great sig.

[ELVIS]

The killing Osama thing was a TOTAL MADE UP LIE!!

Osama died in 2001. It was reported on FOX and CNN...

Obama was not living in a military compound totally unnoticed in Pakistan...

You are being lied to!!!


:elvis:

[Seshmeister]

Well that's great news for someone's publisher.

[ELVIS]

It's old news, as i'm sure you know...

[Nitro Express]

The killing Osama thing was a TOTAL MADE UP LIE!!

Osama died in 2001. It was reported on FOX and CNN...

Obama was not living in a military compound totally unnoticed in Pakistan...

You are being lied to!!!


:elvis:

Hmmmm. Obama bags Osama right after the media attention is on his birth certificate again. There is no evidence and they get rid of the so called body quickly by dumping it in the ocean. Again no proof. Then the SEAL team members who were involved on the operation all get killed shortly after. Dead men tell no tales.

Since our government is currently being ran by compulsive liars why should I believe them? I will believe when they have evidence instead of making it disappear.

[ELVIS]

Exactly!

[ELVIS]

BTW, the term "African American" was not yet born in 1961

That is a fact...

[Nitro Express]

My brother in law is an African American. His dad is from South Africa. They were a dutch family that settled in Africa and then immigrated to the US. Not all African Americans are black. He's a smart ass too. He applied for an African American scholarship and was turned down because he was the wrong color. He raised hell because it was an African American scholarship and nowhere in the paper work did it state skin color as a requirement. LOL!

[Seshmeister]

Hmmmm. Obama bags Osama right after the media attention is on his birth certificate again. There is no evidence and they get rid of the so called body quickly by dumping it in the ocean. Again no proof. Then the SEAL team members who were involved on the operation all get killed shortly after. Dead men tell no tales.



Fuck I must be drunk to even ask this but you say that the SEAL team members have all been killed. What is your 'evidence' for that? It's January I could do with a fucking laugh,

[ELVIS]

My point was Obama's birth certificatate should say negro, negroid or black, not African American...

[gbranton]

My brother in law is an African American. His dad is from South Africa. They were a dutch family that settled in Africa and then immigrated to the US. Not all African Americans are black.

My wet dream. I would sue the fucking world if this were me. Stomping on the dicks of politically correct asswipes would be my full time mission in life.

[ELVIS]

SEAL Team 6, unit that killed Osama bin Laden, died in helicopter crash

Saturday, August 6, 2011

The Associated Press reported that the majority of the 31 American troops killed Saturday when the Taliban shot down a military helicopter over Afghanistan were members of SEAL Team 6, the elite team that killed Osama bin Laden in May.

Afghan President Hamid Karzai delivered news of the 38 total fatalities, the highest single-day U.S. death toll in the decade of U.S. military involvement in Afghanistan.

The AP cited only “AP sources” in reporting that the dead troops were part of SEAL Team 6. NATO acknowledged that the crash had happened, but did not give a reason why, or release names yet. NATO has also not released their own fatality count.


The elite special forces group came to the public’s attention this spring, when details of the raid on bin Laden’s compound were leaked to an awestruck country.

:elvis:

[Nitro Express]

My point was Obama's birth certificatate should say negro, negroid or black, not African American...

It's obvious the birth certificate is a photo shopped hodgepodge. Whoever came up with the idea of running Obama was brilliant. I wonder if it was George Soro's idea or Zibignew Brzenski's. They were smart enough to know if you had a black president he would be untouchable. If a white guy's birth certificate came under scrutiny and a photo shop hodgepodge was released he would be out on his ass. I'm sure it's very hard to find a person who can do the presidential dog and pony show and still be loyal to your agenda. I mean it's obvious Obama has much to hide. He won't release his grades. Apparently his grades from Occidental College are poor. He's using the social security number of a dead guy who lived in Connecticut. Lot's of questions about this guy.

Oh well. His backers got trillions of dollars from Barry which are all in off shore accounts. It doesn't matter if he just lasts one term. He stole more money than any other president.

[ELVIS]

Can you say affirmative action ??

LMAO!

[sadaist]

he took out qaddaffi.


I thought we were just helping a coalition to provide a no-fly-zone only? Funny how easy it was to see through that. Especially once that video of Hillary saying "we came, we saw, he died..." came out. Surprised it got almost zero airplay in the media O.o

[Nickdfresh]

SEAL Team 6, unit that killed Osama bin Laden, died in helicopter crash

Saturday, August 6, 2011

The Associated Press reported that the majority of the 31 American troops killed Saturday when the Taliban shot down a military helicopter over Afghanistan were members of SEAL Team 6, the elite team that killed Osama bin Laden in May.

Afghan President Hamid Karzai delivered news of the 38 total fatalities, the highest single-day U.S. death toll in the decade of U.S. military involvement in Afghanistan.

The AP cited only “AP sources” in reporting that the dead troops were part of SEAL Team 6. NATO acknowledged that the crash had happened, but did not give a reason why, or release names yet. NATO has also not released their own fatality count.


The elite special forces group came to the public’s attention this spring, when details of the raid on bin Laden’s compound were leaked to an awestruck country.

:elvis:

None of the SEALs that died that day took part in the op to kill Bin Laden IIRC...

[Nickdfresh]

I thought we were just helping a coalition to provide a no-fly-zone only?...

Why would you "think" that?

[sadaist]

Why would you "think" that?


Obamas own words. You mean we can't take everything a politician says as truth? Hey, maybe that's what the new VH album title means.

[knuckleboner]

Obamas own words. You mean we can't take everything a politician says as truth? Hey, maybe that's what the new VH album title means.

and the winner for best post political thread on a van halen message board goes to...sadaist. congrats!

[knuckleboner]

I think this kind of glosses over his first 2 years where he had majorities in the house and senate and pre-emptively conceded items to the republicans. And then, with the 2010 elections, he lost control of the house and close on the senate -- and he deserved to -- because he couldn't effectively make the case for where he wanted to go, and people were upset with his direction, and ultimately put the opposition in power. He could have campaigned from a position of power and authority to drive an agenda. Presidents in the past have done this much, much more effectively.

What you're saying sounds nice but I really think it's kind of apologetic about what happened and lets Obama off the hook. The buck stops with him. Leadership is about ownership, responsibility, and ultimately, accountability.

He hasn't owned the situation. He hasn't proactively pushed a vision to resolve the situation, so ultimately, he's accountable for the situation. It may have crashed before he became President, but he still could have owned it more effectively.

well, i think you're being a little bit overly harsh, but i'd generally agree with your point.

yes, obama has not blown my political socks off in large part because i don't think he led enough, so fair point.

but again, i think that's somewhat mitigaged by the fact that it was a really challenging time with intractable opponents. and remember, in the senate, he had 60 votes only for a very short time. franken wasn't seated immediately, and kennedy died before too long. sure, snowe and collins would cross party lines, but only if it was a relatively moderate issue.

it was hard enough to get energy legislation (cap and trade) through the much more democratic house. the senate was unlikely to touch it. now, could obama have pushed harder? sure. and maybe that's a fault. but on the other hand, spending political capital only goes so far.

that said, again, i generally agree with you. but for me, it's why i'm not gung ho for obama, but given the circumstances i still think he did a reasonably good job, especially considering the alternatives.


(and by the way, i was going to ask who let the 2 conspiracy theorists in here, but then i remembered this was "a ron paul is awesome" thread...;))

[Nickdfresh]

Obamas own words. You mean we can't take everything a politician says as truth? Hey, maybe that's what the new VH album title means.

Initially, that's what it was. When the British and French air forces began running out of ammo (bombs), things changed. The U.S. did provide an enormous amount of logistical know-how and support, but he was essentially correct that very little in the way was done in direct action by U.S. forces...

[Dr. Love]

well, that was disappointing, especially after he did in the first two, but I suppose it's a different electorate/dynamic. I don't think he'll get any delegates. I think he'll skip FL and head on to the caucus states next.

[ELVIS]

It's almost a direct correlation to how much you spend on TV ads...

But yeah, looks like Paul is basically planning on ignoring Florida...

And I don't see how Santorum gets any support...

As far as Romoney, I'm not 100% sure I'd vote for him over Obama...

[Dr. Love]

I don't plan on voting for Romney, Gringrich, Santorum or Obama...

[LoungeMachine]

RON PAUL'S ONLY PRAYER

http://www.americanselect.org/official-documents

:gulp:

[Seshmeister]

SEAL Team 6, unit that killed Osama bin Laden, died in helicopter crash

Saturday, August 6, 2011

The Associated Press reported that the majority of the 31 American troops killed Saturday when the Taliban shot down a military helicopter over Afghanistan were members of SEAL Team 6, the elite team that killed Osama bin Laden in May.

Afghan President Hamid Karzai delivered news of the 38 total fatalities, the highest single-day U.S. death toll in the decade of U.S. military involvement in Afghanistan.

The AP cited only “AP sources” in reporting that the dead troops were part of SEAL Team 6. NATO acknowledged that the crash had happened, but did not give a reason why, or release names yet. NATO has also not released their own fatality count.


The elite special forces group came to the public’s attention this spring, when details of the raid on bin Laden’s compound were leaked to an awestruck country.

:elvis:

The casualties were from the same unit but NOT the same people. There are 120 in the unit.

You need a new conspiracy.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2023123/Special-forces-helicopter-shot-Afghanistan-mission-rescue-fellow-Navy-SEALs.html

[LoungeMachine]

Sesh...

You're really going to present FACTS to Swamp Boy?

:gulp:

Waste of keystrokes

[ELVIS]

I just posted a news article...

The conspiracy is that the Obama got Osama story is a lie...

[Dr. Love]

Guess I should start looking at Rand Paul's positions :P

[LoungeMachine]

Guess I should start looking at Rand Paul's positions :P

2016 isn't that far away....

:gulp:

[ELVIS]

Guess I should start looking at Rand Paul's positions :P

No, you should sign up with the Campaign For Liberty and continue to promote the cause...

Freedom is infectous and the movement can only continue to grow from here...

:elvis:

[ELVIS]

I don't plan on voting for Romney, Gringrich, Santorum or Obama...

Neither do I... I was just speculating...

[Dr. Love]

I was joking ... I'm not giving up on Ron Paul. :)

[ELVIS]

The Campaign For Liberty is Ron Paul...

[LoungeMachine]

The Campaign For Obscurity is Ron Paul...

:gulp:

Fixed it for you.....

[ELVIS]

And the Campaign to continue the current corrupt war mongering, nation building, one world government status quo is Obama, Romney, Gingrich and Santorum...


:elvis:

[Dr. Love]

Lounge be trollin', E.

[ELVIS]

I seez dat, Doc...


:elvis:

[kwame k]

And the Campaign to continue the current corrupt war mongering, nation building, one world government status quo is Obama, Romney, Gingrich and Santorum...


:elvis:

What war has Obama started?

[Va Beach VH Fan]

What war has Obama started?

Actually, there hasn't been a "war" since 1945....

[ELVIS]

That's incorrect...

[kwame k]

Actually, there hasn't been a "war" since 1945....

Technically, but there's millions of dead people who would beg to differ:(

[Va Beach VH Fan]

U.S. Congress hasn't declared war since World War II.....

[ELVIS]

No...

The last time Congress passed joint resolutions saying that a "state of war" existed was on June 5, 1942, when the U.S. declared war on Bulgaria, Hungary, and Rumania...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

So how is my statement incorrect?

[ELVIS]

Anyway, my point regarding liberty is that we as Americans need to face the truth and stop this illegal war mongering bullshit...

[ELVIS]

So how is my statement incorrect?

Your last one was correct...


:cool:

[LoungeMachine]

And the Campaign to continue the current corrupt war mongering, nation building, one world government status quo is Obama, Romney, Gingrich and Santorum...


:elvis:

Please tell me how Obama is war mongering and nation building, Swamp Boy.

:gulp:

Without linking Fox, Drudge, or Washington Times

[LoungeMachine]

That's incorrect...

No, it is not

:gulp:

[LoungeMachine]

Anyway, my point regarding liberty is that we as Americans need to face the truth and stop this illegal war mongering bullshit...

So the 8 years of BushCO where WE were saying this, and YOU were calling us every name in the book and telling us how wrong we were was what?

:gulp:

Time to drain the swamp.

[sadaist]

U.S. Congress hasn't declared war since World War II.....


Isn't that a total trip to everyone? Look how many "wars" we've had in the last 70 years and never been officially at war. Vietnam, Korea, Iraq, Afghanistan all whoppers of wars. And a slew of others. Non-stop practically. Fucking crazy.


Ron Paul understands this.

[LoungeMachine]

Isn't that a total trip to everyone? Look how many "wars" we've had in the last 70 years and never been officially at war. Vietnam, Korea, Iraq, Afghanistan all whoppers of wars. And a slew of others. Non-stop practically. Fucking crazy.


Ron Paul understands this.



And I LOVE Ru Paul's foreign policy......

:gulp:

But after that, he goes off the rails into crazy old coot territory.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Isn't that a total trip to everyone? Look how many "wars" we've had in the last 70 years and never been officially at war. Vietnam, Korea, Iraq, Afghanistan all whoppers of wars. And a slew of others. Non-stop practically. Fucking crazy.


Ron Paul understands this.

Quite frankly, we might not EVER see Congress declare war again...

Couldn't do it after 9/11....

The only possibilities, if at all, are if either Iran or North Korea were to do something, and even that would have to be pretty major event...

For example, if Iran fired missiles at a Navy ship in the Strait of Hormuz.... Would that provoke a Congressional declaration of war? I really doubt it, unless Iran continued to escalate it....

And for North Korea, it would have to be a massive invasion of the South....

[ELVIS]

So the 8 years of BushCO where WE were saying this, and YOU were calling us every name in the book and telling us how wrong we were was what?

:gulp:



Me looking into it and changing my mind...

I initially bought into the war on terror bullshit and I was wrong...

Asshole...

[ELVIS]

Please tell me how Obama is war mongering and nation building, Swamp Boy.

:gulp:

Without linking Fox, Drudge, or Washington Times

By continuing the war in Iraq with troops until recently. By keeping countless military industrial contractors there building God knows what and sucking off the taxpayer...

Pretending to conduct a humanitarian peace mission in Lybia while killing Gaddafi over oil...

By killing Anwar al-Awlaki with no due process...

Saber rattling at Iran over a Nuke lie when we know it's about Oil...

And continuing the oil and poppy seed war in Afghanistan...

Did I miss anything LoungeMistake ??

[Dr. Love]

Quite frankly, we might not EVER see Congress declare war again...

Couldn't do it after 9/11....

The only possibilities, if at all, are if either Iran or North Korea were to do something, and even that would have to be pretty major event...

For example, if Iran fired missiles at a Navy ship in the Strait of Hormuz.... Would that provoke a Congressional declaration of war? I really doubt it, unless Iran continued to escalate it....

And for North Korea, it would have to be a massive invasion of the South....

Don't you think we shouldn't go to war unless the whole country is behind the action and pushes the Congress to declare? Why should 1 man be able to decide for everyone in the nation if we should invade another country and spend years fighting them?

[Nitro Express]

Don't you think we shouldn't go to war unless the whole country is behind the action and pushes the Congress to declare? Why should 1 man be able to decide for everyone in the nation if we should invade another country and spend years fighting them?

That is the way it's in the supreme law of the land. Only congress can declare war. The president is the commander in chief head of the military machine but he does not have the power to declare war. So what has happened in the last 50 years is the executive branch has continued to break the law until the public thinks its the law using all kinds of excuses to justify it.

Why the law is written this way is it's the citizens who will get their blood spilled in a war and not the president. The congress has to answer to the the people in their home states and districts. Also it keeps one hot head from doing something stupid.

The US continues to run 800 military bases overseas and is fighting wars on multiple fronts. The only way to finance this mess is to print more money out of the Federal Reserve and then saddle the public with enough of the debt to create the illusion that the debt is legitimate. It's nothing more than one big deadly ponzi scheme with a few contractors getting rich. It's also a convienient red herring to take the public's attention off the politicians domestic failures. Supposedly there is this big boogie man that is going to get us unless we invade multiple countries and pay for this huge bloated military machine when in reality, the government leaves our borders wide open. It's almost like they are hoping a real terrorist attacks happen so they can declare martial law and with the new illegal powers they have given themselves they have all the ducks in a row.

I think it's all one grand scam to take everything over before the American pubic wake up and realize they have been sold a bunch of shit over all these years. It's nothing more than a bunch of desperate has beens trying to stay in power even while their whole house of cards is falling apart.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Don't you think we shouldn't go to war unless the whole country is behind the action and pushes the Congress to declare? Why should 1 man be able to decide for everyone in the nation if we should invade another country and spend years fighting them?

Yes, of course I agree with that....

[Dr. Love]

That is the way it's in the supreme law of the land. Only congress can declare war. The president is the commander in chief head of the military machine but he does not have the power to declare war. So what has happened in the last 50 years is the executive branch has continued to break the law until the public thinks its the law using all kinds of excuses to justify it.

Why the law is written this way is it's the citizens who will get their blood spilled in a war and not the president. The congress has to answer to the the people in their home states and districts. Also it keeps one hot head from doing something stupid.

The US continues to run 800 military bases overseas and is fighting wars on multiple fronts. The only way to finance this mess is to print more money out of the Federal Reserve and then saddle the public with enough of the debt to create the illusion that the debt is legitimate. It's nothing more than one big deadly ponzi scheme with a few contractors getting rich. It's also a convienient red herring to take the public's attention off the politicians domestic failures. Supposedly there is this big boogie man that is going to get us unless we invade multiple countries and pay for this huge bloated military machine when in reality, the government leaves our borders wide open. It's almost like they are hoping a real terrorist attacks happen so they can declare martial law and with the new illegal powers they have given themselves they have all the ducks in a row.

I think it's all one grand scam to take everything over before the American pubic wake up and realize they have been sold a bunch of shit over all these years. It's nothing more than a bunch of desperate has beens trying to stay in power even while their whole house of cards is falling apart.

That's why it's important to support someone like Ron Paul when they stand up, apart from everyone on the right AND the left, and support their drive to push this country back onto the right course.

His domestic agenda aside (which has to be cleared with Congress), he would have the unilateral power to scale back our foreign involvement to the right levels.

[LoungeMachine]

His domestic agenda aside

.


Wow.

:gulp:

That's a might big...ahem..."aside"

[Dr. Love]

The domestic agenda is set by the Congress. A President like Paul would only be able to do what the Congress and the people would authorize. You know that.

[ELVIS]

They know that...

They also think they know "he can't win."

[kwame k]

So what you're saying is....yes, you know Paul's domestic agenda is crazy but since he won't be able to influence Congress [basically an ineffective President] you'll vote for him because his agenda will never get through:headlights:

Circular argument, anyone?

[Dr. Love]

No, I'd vote for him because he can make a big difference in foreign policy, and his domestic ideas would be heavily tempered by the Congress and have a good chance of making it through. I like the idea of removing power from the federal government and giving it to the states. I think that's a domestic policy he can be successful on.

You guys should resist the temptation to over-simplify everything.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Don't you guys think you should be taking into account what parties have a majority in both houses of Congress ??

[Seshmeister]

From 4 years ago, not a lot seems to have changed.

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[ELVIS]

That wont matter as much when Paul is President...

[LoungeMachine]

The domestic agenda is set by the Congress. .

So the RePukes' cries "President Obama, where are the jobs?" is all bullshit?

:gulp:

I'm shocked.

[LoungeMachine]

That wont matter as much when Paul is President...

:lmao:

God you're an idiot....

:gulp:

Even for a Swamp Dweller.....

[Dr. Love]

Yes, it is bull shit. Do you suddenly think I'm going to defend the GOP or something? :)

[LoungeMachine]

Don't you guys think you should be taking into account what parties have a majority in both houses of Congress ??

A "majority' doesn't matter in the Senate anymore....

:gulp:

Get rid of the [not in the Constitution] Filibuster rule and we can talk....

[kwame k]

No, I'd vote for him because he can make a big difference in foreign policy, and his domestic ideas would be heavily tempered by the Congress and have a good chance of making it through. I like the idea of removing power from the federal government and giving it to the states. I think that's a domestic policy he can be successful on.

You guys should resist the temptation to over-simplify everything.

I'm all for the States rights to govern themselves but I can not agree with his policies/agenda, period!

How is my statement an over-simplification?

You disagree with a major portion of his platform, yet, you have a naive hope that Congress will reign him in and not let him push his agenda forward.

So you support someone you hope will not get his way:headlights:

[LoungeMachine]

Yes, it is bull shit. Do you suddenly think I'm going to defend the GOP or something? :)

No, you're too bright for that.....

:gulp:

But shilling for a wack-job with ZERO chance of winning the White House is just plain stupid.

I agree with supporting the ideas, but Ron Paul is unelectable plain and simple.

duh.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

A "majority' doesn't matter in the Senate anymore....

:gulp:

Get rid of the [not in the Constitution] Filibuster rule and we can talk....

Well, that was what I was alluding to....

When Obama is reelected, and if you assume that the Reps keep the House (which is in jeopardy) and the Dems control the Senate, you're right, it won't matter, 'cause the Reps will just block everything for another four years.....

[ELVIS]

:lmao:

God you're an idiot....

:gulp:

Even for a Swamp Dweller.....

The idiot is your mom...

But Paul is not sold out to a political party, fool...

[LoungeMachine]

They know that...

They also think they know "he can't win."

He can't, Swampthing.

:gulp:

Tell you what, let's make a Romoney style bet....

IF Ron Paul wins the White House, I'll never darken this site again.....

IF Ron Paul doesn't win the White House.....you leave forever.

:gulp:

DEAL????

[Dr. Love]

No, you're too bright for that.....

:gulp:

But shilling for a wack-job with ZERO chance of winning the White House is just plain stupid.

I agree with supporting the ideas, but Ron Paul is unelectable plain and simple.

duh.

In the US, you have to support the people that espouse the ideas that you support; With a large swell of support for the individual (especially like Ron Paul), people begin to look at and take the ideas more seriously. Look at what you see in the campaign, with Newt recently endorsing the idea of a return to the gold standard, with other republicans (like jim demint) calling for other republicans to adopt ideas from his platform.

I don't think Ron Paul will be elected, but I want a lot of the things he talks about to be a major part of the discussion this election cycle. To me, that is a big victory.

[LoungeMachine]

The idiot is your mom...

But Paul is not sold out to a political party, fool...

My mom is dead, swamprat.

:gulp:

I never said Ron Paul sold out, you inbred, idiotic mouthbreathing racist troll.....


I said he can't win the White House.

Learn to read, Cracker.

[ELVIS]

He can't, Swampthing.

:gulp:

Tell you what, let's make a Romoney style bet....

IF Ron Paul wins the White House, I'll never darken this site again.....

IF Ron Paul doesn't win the White House.....you leave forever.

:gulp:

DEAL????

No, I don't bet...

[LoungeMachine]

I don't think Ron Paul will be elected, but I want a lot of the things he talks about to be a major part of the discussion this election cycle. To me, that is a big victory.

Which is exactly what I've been saying.....

:gulp:

I agree with him on most things..... BUT HE CANT WIN

Jesus fucking christ.

[LoungeMachine]

No, I don't bet...

Of course you don't....

:gulp:

Because you're a sac-less windbag full of shit.

[ELVIS]

My mom is dead, swamprat.

:gulp:

I never said Ron Paul sold out, you inbred, idiotic mouthbreathing racist troll.....


I said he can't win the White House.

Learn to read, Cracker.

It's you that misreads my posts...

[Dr. Love]

I'm all for the States rights to govern themselves but I can not agree with his policies/agenda, period!

How is my statement an over-simplification?

You disagree with a major portion of his platform, yet, you have a naive hope that Congress will reign him in and not let him push his agenda forward.

So you support someone you hope will not get his way:headlights:

Do you agree with every political stance of every candidate that you vote for/support? Or do you focus on the issues that matter most to you? I am certain there things that your favored politicians do that you disagree with. Does that mean they don't deserve your support? (I suppose it depends on what they do)

I'm a pragmatist; I think there is merit to a lot of what Dr. Paul talks about. The things he can do unilaterally, I support. The things he can't do unilaterally, I don't necessarily support in full but I think that it merits a discussion.

I think issues like monetary policy, fiscal policy, regulation, foreign interventionism, military spending, federal/state rights and a host of other things should be discussed and the appropriate legislation should be enacted as a result.

I support someone who I think will get some of his way, but not all of it, at least, not in the areas I'm not in full alignment on. And I think that's a very pragmatic and realistic point of view to take given the system we operate under.

[ELVIS]

Of course you don't....

:gulp:

Because you're a sac-less windbag full of shit.

You must be drunk...

[kwame k]

Well, that was what I was alluding to....

When Obama is reelected, and if you assume that the Reps keep the House (which is in jeopardy) and the Dems control the Senate, you're right, it won't matter, 'cause the Reps will just block everything for another four years.....

I think this election will be a wake up call for the obstructionist in both the House and the Senate......Americans are sick and tired of this nonsense. With Congress' disapproval rating at a historic high of 80% people are not going to reelect those obstructionists......be it in Nov or the mid-terms in 2 years.

[Dr. Love]

Which is exactly what I've been saying.....

:gulp:

I agree with him on most things..... BUT HE CANT WIN

Jesus fucking christ.

I know what you're saying. I've read it at least a few dozen times by now. :)

But until enough people are vocal and actively supporting the positions he holds that they agree with (regardless of the candidate), the issues won't be heard by the rest of the political system.

For the record, if and when Paul loses the nomination, I'll probably vote for Gary Johnson. I'm still researching him.

[LoungeMachine]

Do you agree with every political stance of every candidate that you vote for/support? Or do you focus on the issues that matter most to you? I am certain there things that your favored politicians do that you disagree with. Does that mean they don't deserve your support? (I suppose it depends on what they do)

I'm a pragmatist; I think there is merit to a lot of what Dr. Paul talks about. The things he can do unilaterally, I support. The things he can't do unilaterally, I don't necessarily support in full but I think that it merits a discussion.

I think issues like monetary policy, fiscal policy, regulation, foreign interventionism, military spending, federal/state rights and a host of other things should be discussed and the appropriate legislation should be enacted as a result.

I support someone who I think will get some of his way, but not all of it, at least, not in the areas I'm not in full alignment on. And I think that's a very pragmatic and realistic point of view to take given the system we operate under.

I agree with everything in this post....

:gulp:

Doesn't change the facts that RP can't win, and ELBOW is a Swamp dwelling moron.

[Dr. Love]

I think this election will be a wake up call for the obstructionist in both the House and the Senate......Americans are sick and tired of this nonsense. With Congress' disapproval rating at a historic high of 80% people are not going to reelect those obstructionists......be it in Nov or the mid-terms in 2 years.

Not if people vote for the status quo. What possible incentive will they have to change their habits if people aren't voting them out and replacing them with people that don't behave the same?

[LoungeMachine]

You must be drunk...

You must be stupid....

[LoungeMachine]

Not if people vote for the status quo. What possible incentive will they have to change their habits if people aren't voting them out and replacing them with people that don't behave the same?

You're putting the onus on the people

When we both know that until there is real campaign finance reform no Ron Paul can ever get elected.

:gulp:

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Not if people vote for the status quo. What possible incentive will they have to change their habits if people aren't voting them out and replacing them with people that don't behave the same?

Agreed, it's not going to change....

[Dr. Love]

everything has to start and end with the people ... We elect the people who appoint the judges who have put us in this situation... and until we elect people that will enact what we want, we'll have what we have now ... and it will continue to be status quo.

[LoungeMachine]

everything has to start and end with the people ... We elect the people who appoint the judges who have put us in this situation... and until we elect people that will enact what we want, we'll have what we have now ... and it will continue to be status quo.

Agreed.....

But you're trying to start AT THE TOP with a presidential nomination destined for the Hagar infested cut-out bin.....

:gulp:

If Ron Paul was running for City Council, you'd have something.

[kwame k]

Do you agree with every political stance of every candidate that you vote for/support? Or do you focus on the issues that matter most to you? I am certain there things that your favored politicians do that you disagree with. Does that mean they don't deserve your support? (I suppose it depends on what they do)

Of course I don't agree with everything a candidate believes but when a major part of their platform is reckless, to say the least, I start looking elsewhere for someone to support.


I'm a pragmatist; I think there is merit to a lot of what Dr. Paul talks about. The things he can do unilaterally, I support. The things he can't do unilaterally, I don't necessarily support in full but I think that it merits a discussion.

And that's your right....I personally can't support him on the issues I disagree with to the point where I'll never vote for him.


I think issues like monetary policy, fiscal policy, regulation, foreign interventionism, military spending, federal/state rights and a host of other things should be discussed and the appropriate legislation should be enacted as a result.

I agree whole heartily......The problem is, no one is giving Paul any print on these issues and his party is violently opposed to these views. If your own party doesn't want you elected....well, what else is there to say!


I support someone who I think will get some of his way, but not all of it, at least, not in the areas I'm not in full alignment on. And I think that's a very pragmatic and realistic point of view to take given the system we operate under.

So you're hoping he gets his way only for the things you agree on and pray he doesn't get his way on the things you disagree with......my question to you has to become then.....what IF he does get his way with the things you disagree with!

Are you really willing to risk that?

[Dr. Love]

There is a lot of merit for having ideas discussed on a national stage, listened to by people who believe in the idea even if it doesn't win this time, who can then turn and change the system from the bottom up by electing people who share the same philosophy.

I think there is more promise in making a national impact when things are discussed nationally, rather than starting locally and slowly bubbling up.

[Nitro Express]

The Chinese have a saying "That you may live in interesting times." Indeed we do. I think the You Tube above best describes where we are now and what the situation really is. Nobody saw the internet coming. It just happened. It caught huge high tech companies like Microsoft by surprise. It created new companies like Google and Amazon over night. Type and click search has been with the average Joe for about 15 years and it's changed the world. People are indeed awakening and the old ways of doing things are desperately trying to hang onto business even to the point of being very brutish and thuggish. Like dictators of the past, they hate free speech and a open media format they don't control.

People are indeed awakening and now it's all about the details of what that really entails. That is one reason this won't be an election as usual. Ron Paul is the first internet candidate that has held his own against the more traditional big media candidates. It's the new vs the old duking it out.

Of course the old guard like Zibignew Brezinski want to spin the new awakening back into an old guard system they control but they clearly know the situation we are now in. In short, nobody knows where it's going to go but it sure as hell won't be the same as it was.

The internet changed the media and business world and now it's going to change the political world. The old newspapers and traditional media no longer enjoy the power they once had. Then of course the two major political parties are old too. If anything, this all exposes their biased corruption as well.