Jailed for $280: The Return of Debtors' Prisons

[SunisinuS]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/jailed-for--280--the-return-of-debtors--prisons.html

The dumbing down of America: We solved this problem once....now the greedy idiots with no education do it again.



How did breast cancer survivor Lisa Lindsay end up behind bars? She didn't pay a medical bill -- one the Herrin, Ill., teaching assistant was told she didn't owe. "She got a $280 medical bill in error and was told she didn't have to pay it," The Associated Press reports. "But the bill was turned over to a collection agency, and eventually state troopers showed up at her home and took her to jail in handcuffs."

Although the U.S. abolished debtors' prisons in the 1830s, more than a third of U.S. states allow the police to haul people in who don't pay all manner of debts, from bills for health care services to credit card and auto loans. In parts of Illinois, debt collectors commonly use publicly funded courts, sheriff's deputies, and country jails to pressure people who owe even small amounts to pay up, according to the AP.

[Related: 5 Strategies to Pay Down Credit Card Debt]

Under the law, debtors aren't arrested for nonpayment, but rather for failing to respond to court hearings, pay legal fines, or otherwise showing "contempt of court" in connection with a creditor lawsuit. That loophole has lawmakers in the Illinois House of Representatives concerned enough to pass a bill in March that would make it illegal to send residents of the state to jail if they can't pay a debt. The measure awaits action in the senate.

"Creditors have been manipulating the court system to extract money from the unemployed, veterans, even seniors who rely solely on their benefits to get by each month," Illinois Attorney General Lisa Madigan said last month in a statement voicing support for the legislation. "Too many people have been thrown in jail simply because they're too poor to pay their debts. We cannot allow these illegal abuses to continue."

Debt collectors typically avoid filing suit against debtors, a representative with the Illinois Collectors Association tells the AP. "A consumer that has been arrested or jailed can't pay a debt. We want to work with consumers to resolve issues," he said.

Yet Illinois isn't the only state where residents get locked up for owing money. A 2010 report by the American Civil Liberties Union that focused on only five states -- Georgia, Louisiana, Michigan, Ohio, and Washington -- found that people were being jailed at "increasingly alarming rates" over legal debts. Cases ranged from a woman who was arrested four separate times for failing to pay $251 in fines and court costs related to a fourth-degree misdemeanor conviction, to a mentally ill juvenile jailed by a judge over a previous conviction for stealing school supplies.

According to the ACLU: "The sad truth is that debtors' prisons are flourishing today, more than two decades after the Supreme Court prohibited imprisoning those who are too poor to pay their legal debts. In this era of shrinking budgets, state and local governments have turned aggressively to using the threat and reality of imprisonment to squeeze revenue out of the poorest defendants who appear in their courts."

[Related: Spring Cleaning for Your Financial Records]

Some states also apply "poverty penalties," including late fees, payment plan fees, and interest when people are unable to pay all their debts at once, according to a report by the New York University's Brennan Center for Justice. Alabama charges a 30 percent collection fee, for instance, while Florida allows private debt collectors to add a 40 percent surcharge on the original debt. Some Florida counties also use so-called collection courts, where debtors can be jailed but have no right to a public defender.

"Many states are imposing new and often onerous 'user fees' on individuals with criminal convictions," the authors of the Brennan Center report wrote. "Yet far from being easy money, these fees impose severe -- and often hidden -- costs on communities, taxpayers, and indigent people convicted of crimes. They create new paths to prison for those unable to pay their debts and make it harder to find employment and housing as well to meet child-support obligations."

Such practices, heightened in recent years by the effects of the recession, amount to criminalizing poverty, say critics in urging federal authorities to intervene. "More people are unemployed, more people are struggling financially, and more creditors are trying to get their debt paid," Madigan told the AP.

[FORD]

If they ever tried to do that to me, I'd get out on bail, go to the corporate offices of whichever criminal bank was responsible, and "retire" a few of their top executives. Hell, if they're going to send me to prison either way, might as well commit an actual crime first. :gun:

[sadaist]

Going through a divorce, foreclosure, adn LONG period of unemployment this scares me. And the ONLY way to find out if you have any outstanding warrants is to go to the police station. Umm.....no. I want to know so I can clear them up so I can't be arrested. I'm not walking right in to them to ask. Should be a way to search online but there isn't.

[Light Em' Up!]

Going through a divorce, foreclosure, adn LONG period of unemployment this scares me. And the ONLY way to find out if you have any outstanding warrants is to go to the police station. Umm.....no. I want to know so I can clear them up so I can't be arrested. I'm not walking right in to them to ask. Should be a way to search online but there isn't.

My state has a website where you can check to see if there are any warrants. I have looked at it, not because I have law breaking issues, but just curious to see if anyone I know has a warrant. Check with your County's Sherrif Website, or where they post the arrest records.
It's such a fucked up deal right now for people. Times are so tough, and jobs are even harder to come by. I wish you the best of luck, and I'm sorry you are going through all this all at once. At least on the upside, you have the Mighty Van Halen touring. That has to be a bright spot :-)

[sadaist]

At least on the upside, you have the Mighty Van Halen touring. That has to be a bright spot :-)


The Mighty Van Halen always cheers me up!

The thing about the warrants is I am claustrophobic. Not that I'm a goodie two-shoes that can't go to jail. Being locked in a cell or even worse handcuffs would send me into an anxiety attack that would kill me. So, I don't break laws that will send me to jail. But some stupid collection agency coming after me for a credit card we had 5 years ago & never paid is gonna suck. They are doing exactly like this article says here in Riverside county. They summons you to court for a stupid non-pay issue then when you don't show up you get the warrant out for you. Nasty trickery. Like fucking up your credit for 7-10 years isn't awful enough....you get arrested and now you have to list that on any job application.

It's along the same bullshit lines how companies pull your credit report to hire you. I was HIRED at Geico insurance 1 1/2 years ago. Did all the tests, drug tests, interviews. Final interview the manager said we want you to come on board.

WHEW! Sigh of relief! A job finally! and with benefits!

4 days later the offer was rescinded due to my credit report. A handful of small debts and the foreclosure.

Reasoning was "we can't have people in bad financial situations having access to customers personal info".

OK....I can understand that. "Do you check the credit reports of your current employees every year?"

Nope.

Just need to have good credit to get hired. After that, run up all those credit cards & never pay.

The rules are applied very unfairly. They make it near impossible for the people who need to earn money the most can't.

[sadaist]

I could have accepted it a lot better if the job was a Brinks truck driver or bank vault teller. But answering phone calls about auto insurance at Geico? Fucking bastards.

[Light Em' Up!]

The Mighty Van Halen always cheers me up!

The thing about the warrants is I am claustrophobic. Not that I'm a goodie two-shoes that can't go to jail. Being locked in a cell or even worse handcuffs would send me into an anxiety attack that would kill me. So, I don't break laws that will send me to jail. But some stupid collection agency coming after me for a credit card we had 5 years ago & never paid is gonna suck. They are doing exactly like this article says here in Riverside county. They summons you to court for a stupid non-pay issue then when you don't show up you get the warrant out for you. Nasty trickery. Like fucking up your credit for 7-10 years isn't awful enough....you get arrested and now you have to list that on any job application.

It's along the same bullshit lines how companies pull your credit report to hire you. I was HIRED at Geico insurance 1 1/2 years ago. Did all the tests, drug tests, interviews. Final interview the manager said we want you to come on board.

WHEW! Sigh of relief! A job finally! and with benefits!

4 days later the offer was rescinded due to my credit report. A handful of small debts and the foreclosure.

Reasoning was "we can't have people in bad financial situations having access to customers personal info".

OK....I can understand that. "Do you check the credit reports of your current employees every year?"

Nope.

Just need to have good credit to get hired. After that, run up all those credit cards & never pay.

The rules are applied very unfairly. They make it near impossible for the people who need to earn money the most can't.

I too am claustrophobic, and I am terrified of being handcuffed, and thus I also am not a lawbreaker. I can't believe that they do this shit!! How in the hell are you supposed to pay your damn bills if you can't get a job because you didn't pay your bills. WOW, what a messed up system. I wonder who comes up with this shit??? There are millions of people right now whose credit has gone to hell, so if any of these people lose their jobs, they are fucked? What the hell kind of logic is this? People want to work, they want to be able to pay their bills and to provide, let people have the chance to show they are good hard workers. I guess I would say just show up to all your "hearings"...Grrr...this stuff just pisses me off.

[DONNIEP]

Sadaist, man, sorry to hear about the problems. I used to live in San Diego and I know how high the cost of living is. And in the mid 90s there were next to no jobs either - too goddamn many colleges around churning out 22 year olds, all with the same skill set. I hope things turn around for you. But if you need a place to hide from the law consider moving to the South :) :gulp:

[FORD]

But if you need a place to hide from the law consider moving to the South :) :gulp:

What... you mean "Justified" isn't really fiction? :biggrin:

[DONNIEP]

What... you mean "Justified" isn't really fiction? :biggrin:

Down here it's considered a documentary :)

[vh rides again]

Illinois is the most fucked up state in the USA .
It's ran by a bunch of fucking money stealing nazi fucks that in reality should be jailed thierself .

They are passing laws like crazy, pretty soon it will be illegal to spit there.

They prey on the citizens of Illinois like a pack of wolves, fucking bunch of parasites.

I'm so fucking glad I don't live there any more.


Roth And Roll

[katina]

I hope things turn around for you. But if you need a place to hide from the law consider moving to the South :) :gulp:

An much more further South? Beginning with our politicians a lot of people breaks the law here, and nothing happens. Nice country for hiding, but Brazil has nicer beaches.

[DONNIEP]

An much more further South? Beginning with our politicians a lot of people breaks the law here, and nothing happens. Nice country for hiding, but Brazil has nicer beaches.

Katina, you are most definitely invited to my little slice of the South in the US!!! :)

[Nitro Express]

State troopers? I would say the main problem is the lady lives in Illinois. That state is ran by Nazis. Illinois Nazis.

[Nitro Express]

If they ever tried to do that to me, I'd get out on bail, go to the corporate offices of whichever criminal bank was responsible, and "retire" a few of their top executives. Hell, if they're going to send me to prison either way, might as well commit an actual crime first. :gun:

I would kidnap them and have some fun with my power tools and lead furnace. Hot lead poured in the ear and drilling out a knee cap would be good for starts.

[Nitro Express]

Illinois is the most fucked up state in the USA .
It's ran by a bunch of fucking money stealing nazi fucks that in reality should be jailed thierself .

They are passing laws like crazy, pretty soon it will be illegal to spit there.

They prey on the citizens of Illinois like a pack of wolves, fucking bunch of parasites.

I'm so fucking glad I don't live there any more.


Roth And Roll

Yeah we are all getting a taste of it. The whole country is being ran by the illinois mob right now. It's not just Blago that should be in jail.

[FORD]

Rahm Emanuel should be his cellmate. Throw his brother Zeke in with him, for that matter.

[Nitro Express]

Like I said before the government is ran by a bunch of gangsters who engage in racketeering. Most of us would go to jail doing what these guys get away with. What's amazing is it's so few people behind all of this. We just need to stop arguing with each other and focus our hatred on the real problem. There are way more of us than them. They can't shoot us all and Halliburton can't build enough prisons to hold us all. I would love to see some huge national strikes where everyone stocks up on some supplies and food and then we just all stay home and everything comes to a screeching halt. Another thing I would love to see is everyone just stops using Federal Reserve Notes. If nobody is going to audit the place and do anything about the banking abuse we just won't use their money. That ends their power.

I was talking to someone from Russia who said after the Soviet Union fell their money was pretty much worthless. People went months without getting paid. There was no or little food. She said the grew most of what they ate in their garden and the community set up a barter bank. People would post what they could do and barter for other things. She said it worked pretty well.

The power is will the people actually. The 1% just use us and get their power off of us having to use their systems. Who says we need them? We can cut them out of the pack and just work with each other. The money is just digital code and paper. The real value is commodities, productive work, and services. Money just makes trading these things more convenient and that's nice but when a very corrupt cabal is in charge of that monetary system, we need to get off of it and do something else.

The bankers don't keep the lights on or makes the sewers work or plant and distribute the food. The worker ants do that. The real economy is the people going to work, making stuff, doing stuff, and providing services. The money just makes the process of getting your stuff more convenient.

[BigBadBrian]

Disturbing.

[BigBadBrian]

If they ever tried to do that to me, I'd get out on bail, go to the corporate offices of whichever criminal bank was responsible, and "retire" a few of their top executives. Hell, if they're going to send me to prison either way, might as well commit an actual crime first. :gun:

FORD, I think I actually agree with you on this one. :clap:

[chefcraig]

State troopers? I would say the main problem is the lady lives in Illinois. That state is ran by Nazis. Illinois Nazis.

Jake Blues: I hate Illinois Nazis.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhozx819izU

[knuckleboner]

FORD, I think I actually agree with you on this one. :clap:

so it takes a shared appreciation of homicide to bring you guys together...

God bless America...;)

[kwame k]

:lmao:

[sadaist]

She said the grew most of what they ate in their garden and the community set up a barter bank. People would post what they could do and barter for other things. She said it worked pretty well.



It always does.

Then someone decides to make barter notes for ease of exchange of goods between all of these people. Then banks decide to start up to hold extra notes and make exchanging them even easier. Possible even a loan program to give people larger at once sums of these notes........


and eventually greed - corruption - control takes over and we are right back here again.


Did you see the South park where they all think Walmart is evil. So they burn it down and start shopping at local Joes Market. After a while Joes market grows & grows, eventually becoming the next Walmart sized place....and they ultimately burn it down just as before.

Lather - rinse - repeat

[Nitro Express]

Money works as long as you don't have too much of it or too little of it. As long as the amount matches the real economy which is really people making things and selling services. What has happened in the the US and in Europe is the central banks created money for the sake of creating money. You can make bigger fortunes easier playing games with numbers than you can actually building factories, developing products and services, and selling those things. That involves an awful lot of work. It's far easier and more lucrative to just move numbers around on computers. You drop an interest rate down and create a bubble. You issue digital money based on nothing and then you take the resulting loans and use them for collateral for hundreds of other loans. When the bubble pops and everything goes into default, you buy the real assets up cheap or just take them. To do this you need the government in on the game with you. This is what happened. It's a ponzi scheme and it's purposefully designed to fail and in the end. The central banks buy most the debt, own all the real assets and use the government as their enforcers. In other words, it's like bombing a country and taking it over with troops but instead you do it with funny money. You get everyone into a default situation and then you take it after they default. So you get real assets in exchange for the funny money you printed from nothing. That's why the richest people in the world sit on central bank boards. It's the easiest money going because you make it, everyone uses your funny money, you can get the whole country into debt and take it over eventually. The key is you have to own most the politicians so the government doesn't shut you down.

Even the people who never got themselves into bad loans have to pay once the country itself gets into debt. Most the interest we are paying in the US is not going to China, Japan or other countries, it's going to The Federal Reserve Bank and it will eventually own the whole country lock stock and barrel and have it's government thugs enforcing it's rule. It's the head of the snake. The only politician targeting it is Ron Paul. If we kill that snake, we can literally write off trillions of dollars of debt and stop this ponzi scheme. As fucked up as the US is we still have a good reputation money wise. When there is trouble people still put their money in this country. If we can end the Fed and issue US Treasury Notes again we can turn this economy around so fast it would make your head spin. If you want a real national healthcare insurance plan we can do that. If you want high speed rail that can be done. The key is the American people have to learn to work again and then the government matches the money supply to the actual demand.

Finance is simply deciding what you want the future to be. Currently our financial goals are set up to make a few people on the central bank boards rulers of the world. All we have to do is change those financial goals. As long as the citizens are willing to work in a real economy doing real things for a change everyone can live a pretty damn high lifestyle.

The key is you need good people in charge of the money supply and you need people willing to do honest work for an honest pay. Without good people you will never reach this.

[knuckleboner]

It always does.

Then someone decides to make barter notes for ease of exchange of goods between all of these people. Then banks decide to start up to hold extra notes and make exchanging them even easier. Possible even a loan program to give people larger at once sums of these notes........


and eventually greed - corruption - control takes over and we are right back here again.


Did you see the South park where they all think Walmart is evil. So they burn it down and start shopping at local Joes Market. After a while Joes market grows & grows, eventually becoming the next Walmart sized place....and they ultimately burn it down just as before.

Lather - rinse - repeat

true. but there's a lot of good that comes about from the system, too. medical advancements to end small pox will never occur if the economy perpetually stays static.

no indivudal system is perfect. the real problem is when people on either side of the political spectrum argue with dogmatic absolutes.

[fifth element]

I've come to accept the fact that, in all probability, i will NEVER get my deebts paid off in entirety,, and the fact is, if they chose to put people in myy state behind bars for being overdue on bills...it would have happened a couple of years ago.

to me...the idea is not only horrific but imbecilic...
am going to keep from launching into a full scale rant...but i have a friend now in the hospital.....has been for 38 days...ICU, 11 hour surgery, and while going through this her spouse and ALSO my friend, died from a staff infection that is resistant to treatment
She is already starting to worry about the money it is costing, which will impede the progress of her recovery...

Gotta wonder about those law breaking fools, acting as if being poor is a disease.