What does Daylight Savings time "save"?

[FORD]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkq6shVsEUg

[chefcraig]

I got up around what I thought was seven AM, shaved, showered ect, went to the grocery store, stopped by the pub for breakfast, a couple beers and a round of Golden Tee Golf, came home to get a long-cook dinner started...

AND NOW IT'S FUCKING 2:20 IN THE AFTERNOON?

I just spent the past twenty minutes reprogramming the time on my $18 Casio watch, along with every other appliance with a clock face. Now it's going to take me and pretty much a large group of you bastards about 4-5 days to get used to this crap, and we are all going to be simply miserable as we adapt.

Fuck this shit. Keep the long winter nights year-round. After all, some of us are set in our ways as to our imbibing concerns. You really wanna screw with the economy? Change people's drinking patterns.

:guzzle::beers8::bottle::gulp:

[FORD]

Now if only they would keep winter beer year around too. Who says I don't want an ice cold Snow Cap ale in the middle of July?

[Angel]

No change for me. :) Which is bad because I tend to wake up with the sunrise. :(

[Hardrock69]

I find no valid reason for this shit. But I am not going to move to Indiana or Arizona just because I find it useless.

[Matt White]

I remember talking with my Godmother aboot it before she passed...she said the individual States voted on the idea of "Day-light savings time" in the late 60's.....she, being so fucking cool, was against it!!!

Something left over from WWII (Help me out Nick!).......less crime in the Summer, saves fuel, more business gets done etc etc etc

[sadaist]

I remember talking with my Godmother aboot it before she passed...she said the individual States voted on the idea of "Day-light savings time" in the late 60's.....she, being so fucking cool, was against it!!!

Something left over from WWII (Help me out Nick!).......less crime in the Summer, saves fuel, more business gets done etc etc etc



I was always told it had to do with kids going to school in the dark or something. Who knows. I'm happy right now we sprung forward because in the morning when I'm up early I hate the sun blazing down. I like that dark blue purpley dawn when I enjoy my first coffee & try to wake up.

When I was younger I loved it staying light out until 8:30 pm. But now I like it dark. Love night time. So I kinda like it getting dark at 4:30 or 5p

[FORD]

Well, according to the video above the original idea came from a Kiwi scientist studying bugs or something.

If Dan sees this thread, maybe he can tell us what that was all about?

[envy_me]

We don't have to change the clock yet. At least I think so. I hope we won't have to change it yet for a while, cause I set my livingroom clock to winter-time maybe 3 weeks ago.

[Nickdfresh]

I remember talking with my Godmother aboot it before she passed...she said the individual States voted on the idea of "Day-light savings time" in the late 60's.....she, being so fucking cool, was against it!!!

Something left over from WWII (Help me out Nick!).......less crime in the Summer, saves fuel, more business gets done etc etc etc

I believe it is the farm lobby that is responsible for this DLST shenanigans!

[Angel]

I believe it is the farm lobby that is responsible for this DLST shenanigans!

I always thought it was farmers too, but was told it was to save on energy.

[clarathecarrot]

I can't believe how mis=informed you all are.

It is (was) simply to get more sunlight in the mornings early while the earth tilts away from the sun during the winter months.

It is too cold at night to functuion, so the morning or DAYLIGHT hours are more important to people in the Norther parts of the USA.

These days that has all been replaced by a tool of time manipulation to make money off the NASDAC and mess with the banking moneys recieved and debts owed overseas.

Our govenment doesn't do shit without profit or loss, cooking the books; as they say, being involved.

The economic rise or fall, is a big scam. Daylight savings time is a tool on that balance sheet.

But, most of you fags seem to still think that a free shiny toaster is really free, if you open a bank account at, Nutron Bank (whattever) .

[Angel]

I can't believe how mis=informed you all are.

It is (was) simply to get more sunlight in the mornings early while the earth tilts away from the sun during the winter months.

It is too cold at night to functuion, so the morning or DAYLIGHT hours are more important to people in the Norther parts of the US.

WRONG. You get more morning daylight when you DON'T have daylight savings...and DST is in the summer, not winter.Therefore, an hour of sunlight is wasted while people are sleeping. If you have daylight savings, you turn your lights on an hour LATER than you would if you were on standard time. Ergo....save on energy.

It's not rocket science.

[clarathecarrot]

WRONG. You get more morning daylight when you DON'T have daylight savings...and DST is in the summer, not winter.Therefore, an hour of sunlight is wasted while people are sleeping. If you have daylight savings, you turn your lights on an hour LATER than you would if you were on standard time. Ergo....save on energy.

It's not rocket science.

That statement is completely wrong.

But I still like you .

[envy_me]

Daylight savings time? We call it wintertime or summertime. In spring you turn the clock towards the summer, which means you lose one hour.
In fall you also turn it towards the summer and you get an hour extra.

Is DLST wintertime or summertime?

[clarathecarrot]

Daylight savings time? We call it wintertime or summertime. In spring you turn the clock towards the summer, which means you lose one hour.
In fall you also turn it towards the summer and you get an hour extra.

Is DLST wintertime or summertime?

That statement is completely wrong.

But, I still don't know if I like you.

[envy_me]

That statement is completely wrong.

But, I still don't know if I like you.


Sober up, come back and we'll talk about it.

No, you don't like me.

[Angel]

That statement is completely wrong.

But I still like you .

Then explain to me why my sun rises AN HOUR EARLIER than Manitoba. We're in the same time zone. They have DST, we don't. You're even dumber than I thought... but I still like you.

[Angel]

Daylight savings time? We call it wintertime or summertime. In spring you turn the clock towards the summer, which means you lose one hour.
In fall you also turn it towards the summer and you get an hour extra.

Is DLST wintertime or summertime?

We call it winter and summer too. DST is the name for changing the clocks. You get sunset an hour later. That way you don't waste an hour of daylight sleeping. DST is during spring and summer months. When you turn the clocks back for the fall and winter months it's called Standard time .

[clarathecarrot]

Sober up, come back and we'll talk about it.

No, you don't like me.


,...before this get's out of hand get out in that kitchen, sammiches.

Angel, get into those sexy grannie pannies and get on that ironing board, place cigarette in corner of your sexy lips and scowel at me angrily.

( internet strategies of, clarathecarrot, how to loose friends and loose influence in one easy lesson)

[envy_me]

,...before this get's out of hand get out in that kitchen, sammiches.

Angel, get into those sexy grannie pannies and get on that ironing board, place cigarette in corner of your sexy lips and scowel at me angrily.

( internet strategies of, clarathecarrot, how to loose friends and loose influence in one easy lesson)


How can you *lose something you never had :biggrin:

[envy_me]

We call it winter and summer too. DST is the name for changing the clocks. You get sunset an hour later. That way you don't waste an hour of daylight sleeping. DST is during spring and summer months. When you turn the clocks back for the fall and winter months it's called Standard time .


Thank you, Angel.

[clarathecarrot]

Then explain to me why my sun rises AN HOUR EARLIER than Manitoba. We're in the same time zone. They have DST, we don't. You're even dumber than I thought... but I still like you.

The sun always rises at exactly the same time, we have manipulated how we, mark time, by changing what is unchangeable.

Due to a wobble in the earths rotation that creates the yearly summer and winter events as we call them.

P.S. I have wasted my whole life, contemplating the sands and trees as I like to call it ...getting in a discussion with me about the concepts of life and how mankind or, the human race, has created existence within the parameters of the earths radial mass as it corelates to the suns equatorial plateu, is a no win senario for any debate against my position and knowlege base.

I got that going for me, in a world where that doesn't apply......woe is me.

I like you still.

[clarathecarrot]

How can you *lose something you never had :biggrin:


How can you notice something that you cannot conceptualize as reality, when your vision is blurred and consumed by the reflection of your own envy, of admiration, off of your glossy shoes?

:yo:

[ELVIS]

Then explain to me why my sun rises AN HOUR EARLIER than Manitoba.

:biggrin:

[ELVIS]

Farmers' Almanac (http://www.farmersalmanac.com/astronomy/2007/10/29/how-much-daylight-are-we-really-saving/)

Have you noticed that the spring change to Daylight Saving Time happens earlier than you remember – or that the autumn shift back to Standard Time happens later?

Since 2007, when the Energy Act of 2005 took effect, more than two thirds of each year (245 days) have been in DST. Supporters of the change claim it will save the equivalent of 10,000 barrels of oil per day. But others question the accuracy of the energy-savings claim (based on US Department of Energy statistics from the early ‘70s).

How do we benefit from daylight saving time?

The idea behind moving the clocks twice a year is to take better advantage of the sun’s natural electricity (or light). Most of us get out of bed after the sun has risen and go to bed after it has set. But what if the sun rose and set later? When we spring forward and fall back, we’re not really “saving” time; we’re just giving up a little sun in the morning and adding it to the evening. So will we better utilize the sun’s illumination during this new-found sunlight?

Later sunsets cause people to get out and do more in the evenings. Some argue that this results in an increase in our gasoline consumption as we drive around more during the lighter evenings. And if it’s darker in the morning, doesn’t that mean more electricity will be needed to get ready for school and work?

Remember when?

In 1973, there was a sudden and unpredicted interruption in the supply of petroleum to the world. The result was alarming, with gas stations out of gas, long lines at the gas pumps, and people unable to use their cars. In response to “The Energy Crisis,” daylight saving time in the US was hastily begun much earlier, in both 1974 and 1975. In 1974, it started on the first Sunday of January (January 6), and in 1975 on the last Sunday of February (February 23).

It sounded like a good idea at first. The rationale was that the normally dark and dreary winter afternoons and evenings would be made a little brighter, the sun would set an hour later, and energy that might otherwise be used to light homes and offices in the late-day hours would be conserved. In addition, some believed that if we had more daylight at the end of the day, we would have fewer traffic accidents.

Nights BRIGHT, but mornings DARK.

However, having the sun set an hour later also meant that it rose later, a side-effect that apparently did not “dawn” on many folks until after the time change went into effect. The direct result for many was unacceptably dark mornings. In 1974, some cities in the western part of their time zones, like Detroit, Michigan and Boise, Idaho, didn’t see the sun rise until after 9:00 a.m. Mothers found themselves sending children armed with flashlights off to the school bus. The experiment quickly ended and in 1976 the start of DST was returned to April.

The famed philosopher and novelist George Santayana once wrote: “Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it.” Apparently, not many lawmakers today remember the lessons of more than three decades ago.

A Better Idea

It is not very likely that we’ll do away with daylight saving time anytime soon, but we at the Farmers’ Almanac believe we have a better method for scheduling it. If we wish to utilize DST to its fullest, the primary aim should be to capture the maximum amount of daylight without causing more morning darkness.

Civil twilight becomes an important consideration in this regard. Astronomers define civil twilight as: “That interval prior to sunrise or just after sunset in which enough sky illumination still exists (barring dense cloud cover) to carry on normal work out-of-doors.”

While the duration of civil twilight varies during the course of a year, at latitude 40º North—which is the median latitude for the contiguous U.S.—it generally starts about a half hour before sunrise and ends about a half hour after sunset. If we assume that most people arise to start their normal work or school days at 6:00 a.m., daylight saving time should be implemented when the start of civil twilight will coincide with that rising time. Sunrise (and full daylight) would then come a half hour later. Civil twilight at 5:00 a.m. standard time, or 6:00 a.m. daylight saving, occurs during the first week of April.

For example: If you look at sunrise and sunset times for Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (Latitude 39.9º N, Longitude 75.1º W) listed in Eastern Standard and Daylight Time, to take best advantage of Civil Twilight, we should “spring” ahead during the first week in April. Under the old rules, DST started from April 1 to April 7. Under the new rules, DST can now start as early as March 8 (as it will in 2015, and 2026). In 2007, it began on March 11. On April 7, bright morning twilight begins shortly after 6 a.m. daylight saving time. Conversely, on March 8, bright morning twilight does not begin until nearly 7 a.m. daylight saving time.

When should it end?

The astronomical conditions corresponding to early April occur in the first week of September. Logically, that is when clocks should be set back one hour to standard time. However, it makes more sense for the change to occur on the second Sunday in September, so as not to conflict with the Labor Day holiday weekend.

Even under the old rules, we stayed on daylight saving time far too long. By the end of October, just prior to when we used to push the clocks back, mornings were as dark as in early January. In New York City, sunrise on October 30 comes at 7:22 a.m. EDT, compared to 7:18 a.m. EST on January 4. And now under the new rule, which prolongs daylight saving time for up to an additional week, the latest sunrises of the year for some locations will come about 10 to 20 minutes later than they do in early January!

The late October change from daylight back to standard time is an abrupt one: On the final Friday before we “fall back,” most commuters are going home in daylight. But the following Monday is wholly different as they’re driving in darkness. Regardless of when the time change is made, the hours of daylight will continue to diminish, causing evenings to get progressively darker. Civil twilight ends earlier than 6:00 p.m. (standard time) during the second week of October. If clocks are changed in early September, it would allow people to “ease in” to the darkness over a month’s time, compared to a single weekend.

What do you think?

The question of just when to begin and end daylight saving time is rather contentious. At the Farmers’ Almanac, we are all for ideas and methods proposed to save energy, but this new change to DST doesn’t seem to fit that purpose. There also seems to be some ambivalence in that while most people enjoy having extra daylight, they also look forward to the end of daylight saving time in the fall, when they can finally regain the hour they forfeited by advancing their clocks in the spring.



:elvis:

[ZahZoo]

Wiki has more historical errr... hysterical references...

History
A water clock. A small human figurine holds a pointer to a cylinder marked by the hours. The cylinder is connected by gears to a water wheel driven by water that also floats, a part that supports the figurine.
Ancient water clock that lets hour lengths vary with season.

Although not punctual in the modern sense, ancient civilizations adjusted daily schedules to the sun more flexibly than modern DST does, often dividing daylight into twelve hours regardless of day length, so that each daylight hour was longer during summer.[20] For example, Roman water clocks had different scales for different months of the year: at Rome's latitude the third hour from sunrise, hora tertia, started by modern standards at 09:02 solar time and lasted 44 minutes at the winter solstice, but at the summer solstice it started at 06:58 and lasted 75 minutes.[21] After ancient times, equal-length civil hours eventually supplanted unequal, so civil time no longer varies by season. Unequal hours are still used in a few traditional settings, such as some Mount Athos monasteries[22] and all Jewish ceremonies.[23]

During his time as an American envoy to France, Benjamin Franklin, publisher of the old English proverb, "Early to bed, and early to rise, makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise",[24][25] anonymously published a letter suggesting that Parisians economize on candles by rising earlier to use morning sunlight.[26] This 1784 satire proposed taxing shutters, rationing candles, and waking the public by ringing church bells and firing cannons at sunrise.[27] Franklin did not propose DST; like ancient Rome, 18th-century Europe did not keep precise schedules. However, this soon changed as rail and communication networks came to require a standardization of time unknown in Franklin's day.[28]
Fuzzy head-and-shoulders photo of a 40-year-old man in a cloth cap and mustache.
G.V. Hudson invented modern DST, proposing it first in 1895.

Modern DST was first proposed by the New Zealand entomologist George Vernon Hudson, whose shift-work job gave him leisure time to collect insects, and led him to value after-hours daylight.[9] In 1895 he presented a paper to the Wellington Philosophical Society proposing a two-hour daylight-saving shift,[29] and after considerable interest was expressed in Christchurch, New Zealand, he followed up in an 1898 paper.[30] Many publications credit DST's proposal to the prominent English builder and outdoorsman William Willett,[31] who independently conceived DST in 1905 during a pre-breakfast ride, when he observed with dismay how many Londoners slept through a large part of a summer's day.[32] An avid golfer, he also disliked cutting short his round at dusk.[33] His solution was to advance the clock during the summer months, a proposal he published two years later.[34] The proposal was taken up by the Liberal Member of Parliament (MP) Robert Pearce, who introduced the first Daylight Saving Bill to the House of Commons on 12 February 1908.[35] A select committee was set up to examine the issue, but Pearce's bill did not become law, and several other bills failed in the following years. Willett lobbied for the proposal in the UK until his death in 1915.

Starting on 30 April 1916, Germany and its World War I allies were the first to use DST (German: Sommerzeit) as a way to conserve coal during wartime. Britain, most of its allies, and many European neutrals soon followed suit. Russia and a few other countries waited until the next year and the United States adopted it in 1918.

Broadly speaking, Daylight Saving Time was abandoned in the years after the war (with some notable exceptions including Canada, the UK, France, and Ireland for example). However, it was brought back for periods of time in many different places in the coming decades, widely during the Second World War. It became widely adopted, particularly in North America and Europe starting in the 1970s as a result of the 1970s energy crisis.

Since then, the world has seen many enactments, adjustments, and repeals.

[ELVIS]

No wonder Dickforbreath is a dickforbrains...

[Angel]

Thank you, Angel.

You're welcome.

[LoungeMachine]

No wonder Dickforbreath is a dickforbrains...

So tiring....

:gulp:

[ELVIS]

Shaddup...

[Sensible Shoes]

Not one bit of this matters a damn to musicians.

[Nickdfresh]

Not one bit of this matters a damn to musicians.

That's why it matters to choad fakes like Elvis...

[WACF]

We call it winter and summer too. DST is the name for changing the clocks. You get sunset an hour later. That way you don't waste an hour of daylight sleeping. DST is during spring and summer months. When you turn the clocks back for the fall and winter months it's called Standard time .

Exactly!

I wish we would change our clocks back...mid summer that is wasted golf time!

[LoungeMachine]

Not one bit of this matters a damn to musicians.

Actually, it does.....

:gulp:

If you play in bars, once a year you're expected to play later, and once a year, you're fucked out of an hour of after-show party in the bar.

First World problems..... ;)

[envy_me]

I am glad they put our transition to summertime on a holiday. Now I have two days to adjust to it before the work.