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View Full Version : How Lending A Friend Your Car, Then Going to Bed Can Land You a Life Prison Sentence



Seshmeister
04-14-2014, 05:22 AM
http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/lending-friend-your-car-can-get-you-life-sentence

How Lending A Friend Your Car, Then Going to Bed Can Land You a Life Prison Sentence

Florida man Ryan Holle is currently serving his 11th year of a life sentence, even with no prior criminal record.



http://www.alternet.org/files/styles/story_image/public/story_images/rholle.jpg

Several years ago I read a piece in The New York Times by Adam Liptak about Ryan Holle. Ryan, who had no prior record, is serving a life sentence with no chance of parole in Florida. He was convicted of pre-meditated murder, even though no one, including the prosecutor, disputes that Ryan was asleep in his bed at home at the time of the crime. This could only happen in America, because we are the only country that retains the Felony Murder Rule. What the Felony Murder Rule essentially says is if anyone has anything to do with a felony in which a murder takes place, such as a robbery, that person is as guilty as the person who has committed the murder. Every other country including England, India and Canada has gotten rid of it because of its unintended consequences. In America, Michigan, Kentucky and Hawaii no longer have the law. The Canadian Supreme Court ruled, when they discarded the Felony Murder Rule, that a person should be held responsible for his own actions not the actions of others.

Exactly what did Ryan Holle do? At a party in his apartment over ten years ago, he lent his car to his roommate and went to sleep. He had lent his car to his roommate many times before with no negative consequences. This time the roommate and others went to a house where they knew a woman was selling marijuana from a safe. They planned to get the marijuana, but in the course of their break-in a teenage girl was killed. Those at the scene all received appropriately harsh sentences, but so did Ryan Holle. I got involved with the case shortly after I read Adam Liptak’s piece. I have been advocating on behalf of clemency for Ryan, who was first offered a plea deal of ten years but chose to go to trial. I’m sure it was difficult for a young man, who had never been arrested, and who believed he had done nothing to accept that he should go to prison for ten years, so he went to trial, was convicted and sentenced to life in prison with no chance of parole. He is now in his eleventh year of incarceration. Again, this is a young man who was home asleep in bed at the time of the crime. I personally know of no other felony murder conviction where the person was not even present, and the pre-meditated part of the conviction suggests that Ryan knew his car was going to be used in the course of a murder, which to me, isn’t credible. To the best of my knowledge, in the entire history of the criminal justice system in America, no one has ever been convicted and sentenced to life in prison for loaning a car and going to sleep.

A few years ago I was on a television show with the father of the girl who was murdered in the robbery attempt. The father felt that it was entirely justified that Ryan Holle spend his life in prison. At the time, I couldn’t bring myself to say what I was feeling. I felt the father and mother were a lot more responsible for their daughter’s death than Ryan Holle. The mother did actually serve three years in prison for selling drugs, but both parents in no way should have been involved in selling drugs from their house. It would only be a question of time before the wrong person knocked on the door. In my judgment, parents who would do that with two teenage daughters at home have a lot more responsibility for this tragedy than Ryan Holle.


Ryan writes me from prison telling me that when he gets out, he plans to speak out against the Felony Murder Rule. Unless people of good will and common sense publicize his case, Ryan Holle will die in prison.

Note: Since writing the above, I have been told that Ryan was just denied clemency.

Angel
04-14-2014, 07:33 AM
Only in 'Murica...how sad...

Seshmeister
04-14-2014, 07:46 AM
Nuts.

Why not also put the guy that sold him the car in jail too?

And the people that made the car.

And the guy that sold them the gas.

WARF
04-14-2014, 08:27 AM
I'm very disappointed. I was expecting to see DONNIEP's face after Von Hagar lent him his buggy...

Jérôme Frenchise
04-14-2014, 12:47 PM
It all seems unfair. That law is very questionable, it shouldn't be applied to such an extent, at least...

But why should Ryan Holle die in prison, before his sentence is over? Has he got a deadly disease?

kwame k
04-14-2014, 01:01 PM
How in the fuck does this happen?

Did he have a shitty lawyer or what?

I can't believe this case hasn't made it to the Supreme Court!

Then again, since they're privatizing prisons here at an alarming rate......you have to have inmates to make a buck!

Satan
04-14-2014, 01:15 PM
Can't believe there's not a lawyer somewhere in Florida who won't take on this case just to build a career out of it, since it's obviously a steaming pile of dragonshit.

On the other horn, why didn't Holle just claim his car was stolen? It's not like his friend who borrowed it wasn't already going to prison for murder anyway, so why should a grand theft auto charge on top of that bother anybody?

kwame k
04-14-2014, 01:21 PM
Where the fuck is the ACLU when you need them?

Nitro Express
04-14-2014, 01:35 PM
How in the fuck does this happen?

Did he have a shitty lawyer or what?

I can't believe this case hasn't made it to the Supreme Court!

Then again, since they're privatizing prisons here at an alarming rate......you have to have inmates to make a buck!

I blame it on prison privatization. The US has something like a million people locked up. That's more than any other country. I think the private prison trend is changing though. Idaho just took their prison back when the state found the private company had minimal security. The prisoners called the place gladitorial school because there was no guards to protect you from the other prisoners. I guess the place was a real hell hole.

The private sector can do some things well but running prisons is a big fail. Private businesses are out to cut costs and increase business. That model doesn't work well with prisons. The state is better off running them. You have a limited budget (under public scrutiny in theory) so you want to not increase the number of prisoners but reduce them. So only the hardened criminals get prison time. With private prisons you get tossed in for smoking a joint.

Nitro Express
04-14-2014, 01:41 PM
Can't believe there's not a lawyer somewhere in Florida who won't take on this case just to build a career out of it, since it's obviously a steaming pile of dragonshit.

On the other horn, why didn't Holle just claim his car was stolen? It's not like his friend who borrowed it wasn't already going to prison for murder anyway, so why should a grand theft auto charge on top of that bother anybody?

Florida seems to have some corruption problems. The Bush family are involved in the private prison business and they seem to continue to have a hold on the state of Florida. I will bet anything the prison the guy is held in might be a Bush owned prison. Because nothing has been done it just shows what a sad state of affairs Florida is in right now.

kwame k
04-14-2014, 01:52 PM
Privatizing prisons is just ripe for abuse.......purely a money motivated business.

The alarming thing is that we have more people in prison than any other country, per capita
No country incarcerates a higher percentage of its population than the United States. At 716 per 100,000 people, according to the International Centre for Prison Studies, the U.S. tops every other nation in the world.

Link (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/13/incarceration-rate-per-capita_n_3745291.html)

Obviously we have more violent crime here than most developed countries and whenever anyone even mentions making gun ownership on par with car ownership.....the right freaks the fuck out. The businesses who sponsor the NRA go into overdrive and any sensible reform is dead before it even has a chance to be debated!

Still......the numbers are alarming and only climbing! With the huge economic incentives for sending people to prison and everyone running for office crying the mantra, "I'm tough on crime", and that's just at the local PTA elections :yo:

It's no wonder we're number 1! Go 'Murica!

Jérôme Frenchise
04-15-2014, 11:16 AM
Nuts.

Why not also put the guy that sold him the car in jail too?

And the people that made the car.

And the guy that sold them the gas.

How old the guys were when the killing happened isn't specified.

Rather than sentence someone who's materially linked with the facts like that Ryan who had lent his car, when it comes to youngsters why not responsibilize the guilty's parents, wouldn't it be fairer?
We guess the murderer didn't tell Ryan about what exactly he was going to do - OK, he didn't tell his parents about it either, but they were surely responsible for what their son was able to do by then. I think it would make more than one think twice before committing a crime, knowing their family could be charged too.
To a certain extent of course.

Nitro Express
04-15-2014, 12:48 PM
The United States main problem is the banks bought the country. Eric Holder protects them. They are using the petro-dollar to finance their geopolitical interests through the Federal Reserve System and using the US military as their private enforcement arm. They run up a huge amount of debt and slap it on the tax payer. It's obvious the oligarchs behind this shit live here and abroad.

In short. The american people have lost control of their country and their money. Corporations have become people and they are running the show. They have enough officials bought to where they can do what they want.

They buy off citizens with bread an circuses (welfare and television). They keep the rest in line with a big stick (pay your taxes or else!). They divide the country with all sorts of social and political issues and get everyone fighting over silly shit while they rob everyone blind.

It's ancient Rome. Nero just hasn't set fire to it yet.

FORD
04-15-2014, 12:51 PM
So actual murderers like George Zimmerklansman get to walk around free (and beat up their wives and girlfriends) while this kid serves a life sentence for the "crime" of being stupid enough to let a douchebag borrow his car.

He might well be an idiot, but he sure as Hell is not a murderer.

Nitro Express
04-15-2014, 12:58 PM
So actual murderers like George Zimmerklansman get to walk around free (and beat up their wives and girlfriends) while this kid serves a life sentence for the "crime" of being stupid enough to let a douchebag borrow his car.

He might well be an idiot, but he sure as Hell is not a murderer.

Or tax paying, law abiding citizens get harassed while a blind eye is turned to illegal immigrants and all the laws they break (drug running). I would say all these are signs of law and order breaking down. We have selective law enforcement or just random insanity.

Von Halen
04-15-2014, 04:23 PM
So actual murderers like George Zimmerklansman get to walk around free (and beat up their wives and girlfriends) while this kid serves a life sentence for the "crime" of being stupid enough to let a douchebag borrow his car.



Is there really NOT more to this story with this kid? He has really served this amount of time for simply loaning out his car?

If true, this is one of the most fucked up things I've ever heard of, and I can't believe it has taken this long for this to be publicized.

FORD
04-15-2014, 04:25 PM
Well, it IS Florida. Fucked up things have been happening there for a long long time now.... :(

Von Halen
04-15-2014, 04:29 PM
Well, it IS Florida. Fucked up things have been happening there for a long long time now.... :(

Yeah. Most of the politicians down there should be fed to the gators.

Seshmeister
04-15-2014, 04:29 PM
Is there really NOT more to this story with this kid? He has really served this amount of time for simply loaning out his car?

If true, this is one of the most fucked up things I've ever heard of, and I can't believe it has taken this long for this to be publicized.

The only other thing going against him is that as he lent them the car they said something about going to rob the house. He claims he thought they were joking and he (and they) was drunk which is why he went to bed.

The guy probably is a bit dumb and obviously just shouldn't have said anything but it's an insane sentence.