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View Full Version : Latest BCE "terra threat" scam based on three year old info



FORD
08-03-2004, 10:41 AM
Reports That Led to Terror Alert Were Years Old, Officials Say
By DOUGLAS JEHL and DAVID JOHNSTON

Published: August 3, 2004

WASHINGTON, Aug. 2 -Much of the information that led the authorities to raise the terror alert at several large financial institutions in the New York City and Washington areas was three or four years old, intelligence and law enforcement officials said on Monday. They reported that they had not yet found concrete evidence that a terrorist plot or preparatory surveillance operations were still under way.

But the officials continued to regard the information as significant and troubling because the reconnaissance already conducted has provided Al Qaeda with the knowledge necessary to carry out attacks against the sites in Manhattan, Washington and Newark. They said Al Qaeda had often struck years after its operatives began surveillance of an intended target.

Taken together with a separate, more general stream of intelligence, which indicates that Al Qaeda intends to strike in the United States this year, possibly in New York or Washington, the officials said even the dated but highly detailed evidence of surveillance was sufficient to prompt the authorities to undertake a global effort to track down the unidentified suspects involved in the surveillance operations.

"You could say that the bulk of this information is old, but we know that Al Qaeda collects, collects, collects until they're comfortable,'' said one senior government official. "Only then do they carry out an operation. And there are signs that some of this may have been updated or may be more recent.''

Frances Fragos Townsend, the White House homeland security adviser, said on Monday in an interview on PBS that surveillance reports, apparently collected by Qaeda operatives had been "gathered in 2000 and 2001.'' But she added that information may have been updated as recently as January.

The comments of government officials on Monday seemed softer in tone than the warning issued the day before. On Sunday, officials were circumspect in discussing when the surveillance of the financial institutions had occurred, and Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge cited the quantity of intelligence from "multiple reporting streams'' that he said was "alarming in both the amount and specificity of the information.''

The officials said on Monday that they were still analyzing computer records, photos, drawings and other documents, seized last month in Pakistan, which showed that Qaeda operatives had conducted extensive reconnaissance.

"What we've uncovered is a collection operation as opposed to the launching of an attack," a senior American official said.

Still, the official said the new trove of material, which was being sifted for fresh clues, combined with more recent flows of intelligence, had demonstrated that Al Qaeda remains active and intent on attacking the United States.

The concern about the possibility of an attack was apparent on Monday. Armed guards were positioned at the five targets listed by Mr. Ridge: the New York Stock Exchange and the Citigroup buildings in Manhattan, the headquarters of the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund in Washington and Prudential Financial in Newark. The buildings were subjected to their highest level of security since the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks, with barricades, rapid-response teams and bomb-sniffing dogs providing rings of protection.

With intelligence reports specifying a possible truck bombing, police stopped and searched vehicles in the Wall Street area, while vans and trucks were banned from bridges and tunnels entering lower Manhattan.

In Washington, President Bush said the alert issued on Sunday reflected "a serious business.'' He said at a White House news conference, "We wouldn't be contacting authorities at the local level unless something was real.''

Despite the new terror warnings, the stock market gained ground, denting expectations that it would drop with the heightened security alert. The Dow Jones industrial average was up 39 points.

A sizable part of the information seized in Pakistan described reconnaissance carried out before the Sept. 11 attacks, officials said. The documents do not indicate who wrote the detailed descriptions of security arrangements at the financial buildings or whether the surveillance was conducted for a current operation or was part of preparations for a plan that was later set aside.

In a briefing on Sunday, a senior intelligence official said that the threat to the financial institutions "probably continues even today."


Federal authorities said on Monday that they had uncovered no evidence that any of the surveillance activities described in the documents was currently under way. They said officials in New Jersey had been mistaken in saying on Sunday that some suspects had been found with blueprints and may have recently practiced "test runs'' aimed at the Prudential building in Newark.

Joseph Billy Jr., the special agent in charge of the F.B.I.'s Newark office, said a diagram of the Prudential building had been found in Pakistan. "It appears to be from the period around 9/11,'' Mr. Billy said. "Now we're trying to see whether it goes forward from there.''

Another counterterrorism official in Washington said that it was not yet clear whether the information pointed to a current plot. "We know that Al Qaeda routinely cases targets and then puts the plans on a shelf without doing anything,'' the official said.

The documents were found after Pakistani authorities acting on information supplied by the Central Intelligence Agency arrested Muhammad Naeem Noor Khan, an engineer who was found to have served as a middleman in facilitating Qaeda communications. His capture led the C.I.A. to laptop computers, CD-ROM's, and other storage devices that contained copies of communications describing the extensive surveillance.

Mr. Khan had been essentially unknown to the United States as recently as May, according to information provided by a Pakistani intelligence official, who said the C.I.A. had described him to Pakistani authorities that month only as a shadowy figure identified by his alias, Abu Talha.

The lack of knowledge about Mr. Khan reflected how hard it has been for American authorities to penetrate Al Qaeda. He operated successfully without the government learning of his existence even after three years of an intensive intelligence war against Qaeda that has emphasized efforts to intercept the terror network's communications traffic.

In pursuing the new leads, intelligence and law enforcement authorities were working at several different levels, American officials said, in trying to make sense of what some described as a "jigsaw puzzle" that included first names, aliases, and temporary email addresses but little hard identifying material that could lead to suspects in the United States or overseas.

The scope of the inquiry ranged from "individuals who were orchestrating it from far-off lands to individuals who were in charge of different cells, to the actual operating of cells," a senior intelligence official said. The priority effort to identify people connected to the surveillance of the financial institutions has been under way since counterterrorism officials received the new information from Pakistan beginning Thursday evening, counterterrorism officials said on Monday.

The information, which officials said was indicative of preparations for a possible truck- or car-bomb attack, left significant gaps. It did not clearly describe the suspected plot, indicate when an attack was to take place nor did it describe the identities of people involved.

As a result, federal and local authorities began an effort to locate possible suspects who might have carried out the surveillance. Intelligence officers began interviewing Qaeda detainees asking whether they knew Mr. Khan or anyone who might have been involved in monitoring the targeted buildings and allied foreign intelligence services were asked if they had any information about the suspected plot.

At the same time, federal agents and local police began canvassing the buildings regarded as likely targets seeking to determine whether anyone recalled seeing people who appeared to be conducting surveillance. They sought lists of employees to determine whether anyone suspicious might have worked at any of the buildings and names of vendors, searching for anyone who might have visited the buildings to study security arrangements.

Senior counterterrorism and intelligence officials based in Europe said the information targeting the five buildings was developed by Qaeda operatives before Sept. 11, 2001. But a senior European counterterrorism official cautioned that "some recent information'' indicated that the buildings might remain on a list of Qaeda targets.

"Al Qaeda routinely comes up with ways to hit targets for years at a time, so it may not mean much that these buildings were first targeted more than three years ago,'' the official said.


link (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/03/politics/03intel.html)

Sgt Schultz
08-03-2004, 10:55 AM
So what?

FORD
08-03-2004, 10:59 AM
So what?? So the BCE are lying pieces of shit manipulating the American people through fear and declaring a police state in NYC to prevent protests of Junior's convention.

That's what. :mad:

JCOOK
08-03-2004, 11:08 AM
How much methamphetamine have you done already young man?

ODShowtime
08-03-2004, 11:18 AM
If we could just be SURE that these terror warnings are bullshit! Because this is not the way to live people.

Satan
08-03-2004, 11:24 AM
Of course they're bullshit. Junior's stupid, but he's not so stupid that he would willingly send his wife and kids to a known target. Nor would Bloomberg and Pataki be at the same location like a pair of sitting ducks.

Yet all of the above were at Citibank yesterday.

Only reasonable conclusion is that they knew nothing was going to happen.

Sgt Schultz
08-03-2004, 11:53 AM
Originally posted by FORD
So what?? So the BCE are lying pieces of shit manipulating the American people through fear and declaring a police state in NYC to prevent protests of Junior's convention.

That's what. :mad:

A police state? Can you say HYPERBOLE?

How many years did it take to plan and carry out the 9/11 attacks?

I just want to bonk my melon into a brick wall when I listen to the left wax incoherant about Bush the Bogeyman.

Satan
08-03-2004, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by Sgt Schultz
A police state? Can you say HYPERBOLE?

How many years did it take to plan and carry out the 9/11 attacks?



About the same amount of time it took for the German Communist party to bomb the Reichstag in 1933.

Sgt Schultz
08-03-2004, 12:03 PM
Originally posted by Satan
About the same amount of time it took for the German Communist party to bomb the Reichstag in 1933.

Nice attempt FORD but it ain't flying here. Go peddle it at the Democratic Underground where the comparison of the Bush admin. to the Nazis is well established.

ODShowtime
08-03-2004, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by Sgt Schultz
A police state? Can you say HYPERBOLE?

How many years did it take to plan and carry out the 9/11 attacks?

I just want to bonk my melon into a brick wall when I listen to the left wax incoherant about Bush the Bogeyman.

Where there is smoke there may be fire. Will you at least admit that Bush & Friends benefit politically each time such statements are made? That's why it's so suspicious. Anyone who listens to Gov't procalmations like that and not wonder why it happens or who benefits might as well just go get a lobotomy because you are certainly not using your brain.

John Ashcroft
08-03-2004, 12:20 PM
I was just going to ask a similar question...

Ford, don't you find it interesting that when national security threats are apparent, Republicans benefit politically?

Or let me ask it another way...

Don't you find it interesting that when national security threats are apparent, Democrats suffer politically?

And yet you clowns continue to try and convince Americans that you're serious about national defense.

Guess it's not working, huh? If it were, you wouldn't feel threatened by "bogus" terrorist threats.

Satan
08-03-2004, 12:32 PM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
I was just going to ask a similar question...

Ford, don't you find it interesting that when national security threats are apparent, Republicans benefit politically?

Or let me ask it another way...

Don't you find it interesting that when national security threats are apparent, Democrats suffer politically?

And yet you clowns continue to try and convince Americans that you're serious about national defense.

Guess it's not working, huh? If it were, you wouldn't feel threatened by "bogus" terrorist threats.

So in other words, not only do you acknowledge that the BCE is lying, but you don't have any problem with it??

Congratulations on becoming a loyal fascist!

John Ashcroft
08-03-2004, 12:37 PM
Nope, not the point at all. Spin doesn't work with me Satan.

Now, answer the question.

lucky wilbury
08-03-2004, 12:55 PM
then if this is the shit that fords going to pull now that some of this info is old i don't ever want to hear anything about september 11 being planned or preventable. after all the pnac bullshit ford keeps throwing out there is from 1998 or at the time of the iraq war 5 years old. and after all the idea that al qaeda wanted to crash planes inot buildings on 9-10-2001 was 7 years old. so i don't ever want to hear anything EVER about pnac or 9-11 ever again. afterall all that infomation was "old"

Satan
08-03-2004, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by lucky wilbury
then if this is the shit that fords going to pull now that some of this info is old i don't ever want to hear anything about september 11 being planned or preventable. after all the pnac bullshit ford keeps throwing out there is from 1998 or at the time of the iraq war 5 years old. and after all the idea that al qaeda wanted to crash planes inot buildings on 9-10-2001 was 7 years old. so i don't ever want to hear anything EVER about pnac or 9-11 ever again. afterall all that infomation was "old"

Apples and oranges, Agent Zimmerman....

In 1998, the PNAC'ers were just a bunch of unemployed clowns sitting around with nothing to do but masturbate while fantasizing about a global fascist empire. In 2001, they became the cabinet of the Bush Fraudministration and were then in a direct position to implement their agenda through the enaction of the "new Pearl Harbor" called for on page 63 of their manifesto.

So when "Al Qaeda" become the Board of Directors of Citibank, then we can talk comparably about that scenario.

Big Train
08-03-2004, 01:27 PM
yea, but that was different, it WORKED for his argument. The basic question I ask (and yes Ford, it goes on the LIST of questions you can't anwser), how do you know it wasn't real? Do you have a direct line to an Al Qeda cell? If so, can I have the address (I have a couple of rounds which need firing)?

The point is, what you call bullshit, can't be proven one way or another, but it was credible enough that NOT acting on it would have been just as bad. Let's reverse it for a second. Let's assume they took Ford's relaxed attitude about it (relax, I'll get to the bush part in a minute) and did nothing and then something happened. What would you say then? Get rid of them, they aren't doing their job. Right?

WHy have I heard nothing from protestors. Are you telling me this was a dry run?

Satan
08-03-2004, 01:39 PM
What I'm telling you is that George Bush willingly sent his wife and daughters to the CitiBank building yesterday.

Now any man who would deliberately risk his family knowing they were in a target zone is either a fool or a complete fucking bastard, or both. And such a person is not worthy of your support.

Or, Junior knew the building was safe and that nothing would happen to Pickles & the kids. This makes Junior a liar, and reinforces the allegation that the "terra alerts"are being used for political gain, and in the case of NYC in particular, was a preemptive action against the planned freedom of speech against the BCE convention at the end of this month. So not only is Junior lying and manipulating, but once again, wiping his ass with the Constitution. And such a person is not worthy of support.

So which is it? A heartless bastard who cares nothing for his own family? Or a manipulative tyrant attempting to silence his opposition?

John Ashcroft
08-03-2004, 01:42 PM
So, how'd it go over when I stopped using commercial airliners?

Satan
08-03-2004, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by John Ashcroft
So, how'd it go over when I stopped using commercial airliners?

Ah, now you see, the REAL Asscrotch would never admit to such a thing, because that would be admitting that he knew Al-Likuida was up to something.

Sgt Schultz
08-03-2004, 05:19 PM
Intel on 9/11 Attacks Was 6 Years Old

Both the New York Times and the Washington Post are breathlessly reporting in Tuesday editions that recently discovered intelligence on al-Qaida plots targeting buildings in New York, Newark and Washington, D.C., may be more than three years old, rendering it all but useless.

Unmentioned, however, by either the Times or the Post is this salient fact: Al-Qaida plans to attack the World Trade Center and Pentagon were at least six years old when they were implemented on Sept. 11, 2001.

When 1993 World Trade Center bomber Ramzi Yousef's computer was seized in Manila in 1995, it contained detailed plans to hijack U.S. aircraft and crash them into American landmarks. The plot, dubbed "Operation Bojinka," cited specifically designated targets, including the World Trade Center and Pentagon.

When Yousef was arrested in Pakistan later that year and brought to the U.S. to stand trial, he told his FBI captors that attempts to destroy the World Trade Center would continue despite his arrest. Yousef's uncle, Khalid Sheik Mohammed, picked up where he left off, taking his nephew's blueprint to Osama bin Laden for approval and financing.

In contrast to the Bush administration's rapid response on Sunday, however, the Clinton administration did nothing - despite clear warnings from Philippine police about Yousef's 1995 plot targeting the twin towers .

A 1998 presidential daily briefing headlined "Bin Laden Preparing to Hijack U.S. Aircraft and Other Attacks" warned that al-Qaida would use the hijackings in a bid to free the 1993 World Trade Center bombers.

On the morning of Sept. 11, a Filipino investigator who was involved in Ramzi Yousef's arrest sat watching the World Trade Center attack on TV. He was later quoted by the Washington Post exclaiming in horror, "It's Bojinka! We told the Americans everything about Bojinka. Why didn't they pay attention?"

lucky wilbury
08-03-2004, 06:04 PM
Originally posted by Satan
Apples and oranges, Agent Zimmerman....

In 1998, the PNAC'ers were just a bunch of unemployed clowns sitting around with nothing to do but masturbate while fantasizing about a global fascist empire. In 2001, they became the cabinet of the Bush Fraudministration and were then in a direct position to implement their agenda through the enaction of the "new Pearl Harbor" called for on page 63 of their manifesto.

So when "Al Qaeda" become the Board of Directors of Citibank, then we can talk comparably about that scenario.

it doesn't matter since all that info was old. the plot has new parts to it. thats what the other thread on it is on.