I guess I won't get to buy that new Camaro

**Big Train** · 03-29-2009, 06:17 PM

I actually did want to buy the 550 horse Z28, but I guess they will end up making Volts that don't entirely work right...that should turn things around, right quick. Although that said, this guy should go.

GM CEO resigns at Obama's behest
By: Mike Allen
March 29, 2009 05:23 PM EST

The Obama administration asked Rick Wagoner, the chairman and CEO of General Motors, to step down and he agreed, a White House official said.

Wagoner's departure is one of the remarkable strings attached to a new aid package the administration plans to offer GM.

The White House confirmed Wagoner was leaving at the government's behest after The Associated Press reported his immediate departure, without giving a reason.

On Monday, President Obama is to unveil his plans for the auto industry, including a response to a request for additional funds by GM and Chrysler.

Industry sources had said the White House planned very tough medicine, which turned out to be an understatement. And it went to the very top. The measures to be imposed by the government will have a dramatic effect on workers, unions, suppliers, retirees and the communities where plants are located, the sources said.

GM and Chrysler have to prove their viability as a condition of a federal bailout released under former President George W. Bush, and both have asked the current administration for more money.

Obama said Friday in an interview with CBS’s “Face the Nation,” broadcast Sunday, that the carmakers were going to have to do more.

“There's been some serious efforts to deal with a combination of long-standing problems in the auto industry,” the president told host Bob Schieffer. “What we're trying to let them know is that we want to have a successful auto industry, U.S. auto industry. We think we can have a successful U.S. auto industry. But it's got to be one that's realistically designed to weather this storm and to emerge at the other end much more lean, mean and competitive than it currently is.

See Also

Obama to bankers: 'Help me help you'
Obama: More troops not enough
VIDEO: Geithner: End booms, busts

“And that's gonna mean a set of sacrifices from all parties involved — management, labor, shareholders, creditors, suppliers, dealers. Everybody's gonna have to come to the table and say it's important for us to take serious restructuring steps now in order to preserve a brighter future down the road."

Schieffer followed up: “But they're not there yet.”

Obama added: “They're not there yet.”

© 2009 Capitol News Company, LLC

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 03:43 AM

The President has no business telling businessmen what to do...

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 03:50 AM

GM's chairman is forced out by U.S. rescue plan

Obama also sets deadlines for automakers to show viability

March 30, 2009

The Obama administration is taking another bold step into government management of General Motors, forcing out the head of the crumbling company as part of sweeping plan to reshape the American auto industry and extend additional money to GM and Chrysler to give them more time to restructure.

President Barack Obama will announce his plan for the industry Monday, setting a timetable for the ailing automakers to get on a path to viability and threatening to force possible bankruptcy or to cut off aid should significant progress not be made.

As part of the deal, the administration pushed out Rick Wagoner, GM's chairman and chief executive officer, effective immediately. The move was aimed at giving the company the chance to restart with "a clean sheet of paper," according to senior administration officials who spoke on condition of anonymity.

In addition, Obama will name a director for auto communities, a new executive-branch czar charged with providing support to laid-off auto workers and their families.

Rejecting blanket financial aid, the government is giving GM 60 more days to reach goals it has missed so far to show that it can be viable. It is giving Chrysler 30 days to reach a merger with automaker Fiat or be cut off from further aid.

Wagoner, who has been the company's top executive since 2000, has come under increasing fire over the past year as GM's financial condition has deteriorated. In his eight years at the helm, GM has lost $68 billion and the company's stock value has declined 95 percent.

Wagoner was asked to leave GM as part of that plan, said an administration official who spoke on condition of anonymity because the official was not authorized to talk publicly. No indication was given that similar leadership changes would be asked of Chrysler.

GM spokesmen would not confirm Wagoner's departure, but a source familiar with internal discussions at GM said it was likely that company President Fritz Henderson would succeed Wagoner as chief executive.

Appearing on CBS' Face the Nation, Obama said Sunday that the nation could have a "successful U.S. auto industry. ... But it's got to be one that's realistically designed to weather this storm and to emerge at the other end much more lean, mean and competitive than it currently is," he said.

With sales collapsing last fall, GM warned that it would run out of money by year's end without federal support. The Bush administration gave it $13.4billion in federal loans. Chrysler, which also requested help, received $4billion.

On Feb. 17, both companies submitted restructuring plans, including more loan requests. GM asked for up to $16.6billion in further aid, while Chrysler requested $5billion.

In nearly six weeks since then, an auto industry task force headed by Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner has been meeting with key stakeholders, including auto executives, the United Auto Workers union leadership and representatives for bondholders owed billions of dollars by the two companies.

**hideyoursheep** · 03-30-2009, 03:55 AM

Yeah, I just seen the crawl "bulletin" on Faux Noise about this...

I also have to add that Fox referred to GM as a fledgling company.

Jesus...

**Nickdfresh** · 03-30-2009, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

The President has no business telling businessmen what to do...

Then they have no business asking for fucking public loans and bailouts!

**WACF** · 03-30-2009, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

The President has no business telling businessmen what to do...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickdfresh

Then they have no business asking for fucking public loans and bailouts!

You guys are both right.

These bailouts are really changing the way business is/should be done.

A slippery slope IMO...

**twonabomber** · 03-30-2009, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickdfresh

Then they have no business asking for fucking public loans and bailouts!

not when they could have made changes on their own before they were "forced" to.

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 01:23 PM

The fucking right wingers are trying to enable GM & Chrysler to "reorganize" which actually means "fuck the unions". This will not solve the problem, and will only make things worse.

GM moving into the goddamn 21st century, rather than attempting to recreate 40 year old gas hogs that are no longer practical, is what's necessary. Also, moving to a single payer health care system would take that burden off of GM (and any other companies)

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 01:56 PM

I do say fuck the unions...

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

I do say fuck the unions...

And by saying so you're only fucking yourself.

** NURSES UNITE **

**jbriggs246** · 03-30-2009, 03:24 PM

I don't want jobs to be lost but I also don't think an ailing business should be bailed out by our government. No win situation if you ask me.

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FORD

And by saying so you're only fucking yourself.

** NURSES UNITE **

Why?

Uedcutated people assembling automobiles via computer technology should make $60 - $70 dollars an hour when I have a hard time making $20 ??

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 04:28 PM

And that nurses unite link is bullshit!

All it does is make it impossible to fire or get rid of an employee who may be abusing their job, their patients, or themselves...

Fuck that!

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

Why?

Uedcutated people assembling automobiles via computer technology should make $60 - $70 dollars an hour when I have a hard time making $20 ??

So does that mean they should give up their union jobs, or you should get one?

BTW that "$60 - 70 an hour" thing is total bullshit. Some cheap labor right wingers manufactured that number by averaging wages and benefits to all living UAW members, including retirees. It would be much like averaging a McDonalds employee with Warren Buffett and claiming their "average" salary was $100 million.

**WACF** · 03-30-2009, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

Why?

Uedcutated people assembling automobiles via computer technology should make $60 - $70 dollars an hour when I have a hard time making $20 ??

That 60-70 includes all benefits besides just wage.

I would imagine your 20 would look bigger if you took that into account.

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 04:38 PM

No sir, I have no health care...

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 04:40 PM

And that $60+ an hour is the hourly wage, not including benefits...

**WACF** · 03-30-2009, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

And that $60+ an hour is the hourly wage, not including benefits...

Ok...not was I was led to believe.

$60/ hr on an assembley line is definity ridiculous.

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 05:05 PM

Exactly!

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

No sir, I have no health care...

How the fuck does a nurse not have health care?

Do you comprehend the absurdity of that statement?

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

And that $60+ an hour is the hourly wage, not including benefits...

Wrong.

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 05:15 PM

Bullshit!

Prove it!

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 05:19 PM

I jumped the gun. but even $39 per hour is too much with benefits for a job monkeys could do...

FUCK the unions!

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 05:20 PM

The proof is at the link. It was a corporate whore media distortion, and as I said, it was based on false averages which had nothing to do with wages actually paid to currently employed UAW members.

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

FUCK the unions!

Says the nurse who works 14 hour shifts without healthcare.

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 05:23 PM

I know diesel mechanics and titanium welders who don't make that kind of money...

And FORD, if you make more than say $40 per hour for the job you refuse to report to this board, I have no reason to interact with you any further...

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FORD

Says the nurse who works 14 hour shifts without healthcare.

Make that 18-20 hour shifts...

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

Make that 18-20 hour shifts...

So you stand on your feet for 20 hours at a time, providing healthcare for others, but having none for yourself.... and you don't understand why unions are needed?

**FORD** · 03-30-2009, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

I know diesel mechanics and titanium welders who don't make that kind of money...

And FORD, if you make more than say $40 per hour for the job you refuse to report to this board, I have no reason to interact with you any further...

Shit, I fucking wish!

But then, I'm not in the UAW.

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 05:48 PM

Well...

I dunno...

**Igosplut** · 03-30-2009, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

I know diesel mechanics and titanium welders who don't make that kind of money...

Even if you go with the lowball quotes from that article, they are still at 30.00 an hour without including the bennies. I know guys that have been in the auto repair industry for years that don't make that. And they have FAR more invested in their trade (I.E. tool investment and far more extensive training/experience) than someone on a repetitive assembly line.

Bottom line, Unions can be good and bad.

For Elvis, they would be good at his point in time. For the auto industry, they are top-heavy, and bad at this point in time...

**Nickdfresh** · 03-30-2009, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

I do say fuck the unions...

Or, "fuck the middle classes, because I enjoy the warm feeling of dribbling piss on my back from ever more profitable corporate America despite falling or stagnate wages" is what you actually mean...

**ELVIS** · 03-30-2009, 07:53 PM

Well, stay with your union who keeps your wages artifically high...

Where do you think think the money comes from ??

Oh yeah, it grows on union trees...

**Nickdfresh** · 03-30-2009, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELVIS

Well, stay with your union who keeps your wages artifically high...

Where do you think think the money comes from ??

Oh yeah, it grows on union trees...

I'm not in a union any longer, and the one I was in was a bunch of cackling worthless cockbags that let themselves be bitches...

**Blaze** · 03-30-2009, 08:48 PM

Car made from disgruntled employees?
Sounds like a fine idea!
Charge it!

**Blaze** · 03-30-2009, 08:50 PM

Over stressed uncared for nursing staff?
Mine kind hospital to be at.
Can't wait to have my next hospital stay!

**Big Train** · 03-31-2009, 12:12 AM

The real truth isn't so much what they are paying them, but the legacy pension costs which makes their cost structure so much higher than the competition and has crippled them as such for many years.

**Big Train** · 03-31-2009, 12:26 AM

Hot Air » Blog Archive » New owner of GM: I’m pretty sure we’re not going to run GM

This made me laugh, but it also raises very good questions. This could cost Obama much more than he thinks..

He might have to boot a CEO now and then, but it’s not like R&D will be running the specs on the new hybrid by Geithner for approval, right? This reminds me of Steinbrenner’s infamous announcement after he bought the Yankees that he wouldn’t be involved in the day-to-day operations of the team. Before you knew it, he was firing managers left and right. Just think of Wagoner as Obama’s Billy Martin.

You know what’s always helpful, too, when trying to scare a failing industry into reforming itself? Promising that “we cannot, we must not, and we will not let our auto industry simply vanish.” Over to you, Kaus:

After visibly defenstrating GM CEO RIck Wagoner, and moving to replace the board of directors, won’t Obama now “own” the GM problem? If the company shuts down in the near future, costing tens of thousands of blue collar jobs, it will be under executives implicitly or explicitly chosen by Obama. It will be Obama’s failure, not simply GM’s failure, no? A public sector failure, not just a business failure. Doesn’t that make it harder, not easier, for the administration to walk away and force the company into bankruptcy (if, for example, the company’s plans for “viability” continue to fall short after the new 60-day deadline)? And doesn’t that, in turn, make extracting the necessary concessions (by threatening bankruptcy) more difficult as well?

Indeed. The One’s not just pumping money into this sinkhole, he’s pumping political capital. Which means that while he might control GM’s fate for the moment, increasingly GM will control his. Exit question: Did the new chairman consult with the rest of the “board of directors” before canning Wagoner? Exit answer: No, he did not.

**ELVIS** · 03-31-2009, 12:48 AM

Obahhahahhahhahhahhahhahhma...

**ELVIS** · 03-31-2009, 12:52 AM

Barack Hussein Obama II - pronounced /bəˈrɑːk huːˈseɪn oʊˈbɑːmə/;

03-29-2009, 06:17 PM	#1 (permalink)
Big Train Full Member Status Join Date: Apr 2004 Member Number: 3741 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 4,011 Thanks: 63 Thanked 92 Times in 76 Posts Groans: 28 Groaned at 53 Times in 43 Posts Rep Power: 10 Last Online: 11-24-2009 10:21 PM	I guess I won't get to buy that new Camaro I actually did want to buy the 550 horse Z28, but I guess they will end up making Volts that don't entirely work right...that should turn things around, right quick. Although that said, this guy should go. GM CEO resigns at Obama's behest By: Mike Allen March 29, 2009 05:23 PM EST The Obama administration asked Rick Wagoner, the chairman and CEO of General Motors, to step down and he agreed, a White House official said. Wagoner's departure is one of the remarkable strings attached to a new aid package the administration plans to offer GM. The White House confirmed Wagoner was leaving at the government's behest after The Associated Press reported his immediate departure, without giving a reason. On Monday, President Obama is to unveil his plans for the auto industry, including a response to a request for additional funds by GM and Chrysler. Industry sources had said the White House planned very tough medicine, which turned out to be an understatement. And it went to the very top. The measures to be imposed by the government will have a dramatic effect on workers, unions, suppliers, retirees and the communities where plants are located, the sources said. GM and Chrysler have to prove their viability as a condition of a federal bailout released under former President George W. Bush, and both have asked the current administration for more money. Obama said Friday in an interview with CBS’s “Face the Nation,” broadcast Sunday, that the carmakers were going to have to do more. “There's been some serious efforts to deal with a combination of long-standing problems in the auto industry,” the president told host Bob Schieffer. “What we're trying to let them know is that we want to have a successful auto industry, U.S. auto industry. We think we can have a successful U.S. auto industry. But it's got to be one that's realistically designed to weather this storm and to emerge at the other end much more lean, mean and competitive than it currently is. See Also Obama to bankers: 'Help me help you' Obama: More troops not enough VIDEO: Geithner: End booms, busts “And that's gonna mean a set of sacrifices from all parties involved — management, labor, shareholders, creditors, suppliers, dealers. Everybody's gonna have to come to the table and say it's important for us to take serious restructuring steps now in order to preserve a brighter future down the road." Schieffer followed up: “But they're not there yet.” Obama added: “They're not there yet.” © 2009 Capitol News Company, LLC

03-30-2009, 03:43 AM	#2 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	The President has no business telling businessmen what to do... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 03:50 AM	#3 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	GM's chairman is forced out by U.S. rescue plan Obama also sets deadlines for automakers to show viability March 30, 2009 The Obama administration is taking another bold step into government management of General Motors, forcing out the head of the crumbling company as part of sweeping plan to reshape the American auto industry and extend additional money to GM and Chrysler to give them more time to restructure. President Barack Obama will announce his plan for the industry Monday, setting a timetable for the ailing automakers to get on a path to viability and threatening to force possible bankruptcy or to cut off aid should significant progress not be made. As part of the deal, the administration pushed out Rick Wagoner, GM's chairman and chief executive officer, effective immediately. The move was aimed at giving the company the chance to restart with "a clean sheet of paper," according to senior administration officials who spoke on condition of anonymity. In addition, Obama will name a director for auto communities, a new executive-branch czar charged with providing support to laid-off auto workers and their families. Rejecting blanket financial aid, the government is giving GM 60 more days to reach goals it has missed so far to show that it can be viable. It is giving Chrysler 30 days to reach a merger with automaker Fiat or be cut off from further aid. Wagoner, who has been the company's top executive since 2000, has come under increasing fire over the past year as GM's financial condition has deteriorated. In his eight years at the helm, GM has lost $68 billion and the company's stock value has declined 95 percent. Wagoner was asked to leave GM as part of that plan, said an administration official who spoke on condition of anonymity because the official was not authorized to talk publicly. No indication was given that similar leadership changes would be asked of Chrysler. GM spokesmen would not confirm Wagoner's departure, but a source familiar with internal discussions at GM said it was likely that company President Fritz Henderson would succeed Wagoner as chief executive. Appearing on CBS' Face the Nation, Obama said Sunday that the nation could have a "successful U.S. auto industry. ... But it's got to be one that's realistically designed to weather this storm and to emerge at the other end much more lean, mean and competitive than it currently is," he said. With sales collapsing last fall, GM warned that it would run out of money by year's end without federal support. The Bush administration gave it $13.4billion in federal loans. Chrysler, which also requested help, received $4billion. On Feb. 17, both companies submitted restructuring plans, including more loan requests. GM asked for up to $16.6billion in further aid, while Chrysler requested $5billion. In nearly six weeks since then, an auto industry task force headed by Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner has been meeting with key stakeholders, including auto executives, the United Auto Workers union leadership and representatives for bondholders owed billions of dollars by the two companies. __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 01:23 PM	#8 (permalink)
FORD YEEEEAAAARRRRGGGGHHHH! ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Jan 2004 Member Number: 32 Location: Cascadia Posts: 30,177 Thanks: 783 Thanked 1,177 Times in 866 Posts Groans: 403 Groaned at 163 Times in 155 Posts Rep Power: 49 Last Online: Today 10:24 PM	The fucking right wingers are trying to enable GM & Chrysler to "reorganize" which actually means "fuck the unions". This will not solve the problem, and will only make things worse. GM moving into the goddamn 21st century, rather than attempting to recreate 40 year old gas hogs that are no longer practical, is what's necessary. Also, moving to a single payer health care system would take that burden off of GM (and any other companies) __________________ Eat Us And Smile Listen to the Mike Malloy show, and hear the truth. 6: 00 PM Pacific/9: 00 Eastern "If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." ~Thomas Jefferson

03-30-2009, 01:56 PM	#9 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	I do say fuck the unions... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 03:24 PM	#11 (permalink)
jbriggs246 Roth Army Recruit Join Date: Mar 2009 Member Number: 24385 Location: Los Angeles, California Age: 25 Posts: 4 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts Rep Power: 0 Last Online: 04-28-2009 02:28 PM	I don't want jobs to be lost but I also don't think an ailing business should be bailed out by our government. No win situation if you ask me.

03-30-2009, 04:28 PM	#13 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	And that nurses unite link is bullshit! All it does is make it impossible to fire or get rid of an employee who may be abusing their job, their patients, or themselves... Fuck that! __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 04:38 PM	#16 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	No sir, I have no health care... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 04:40 PM	#17 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	And that $60+ an hour is the hourly wage, not including benefits... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 05:05 PM	#19 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	Exactly! __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 05:15 PM	#22 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	Bullshit! Prove it! __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 05:19 PM	#23 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	I jumped the gun. but even $39 per hour is too much with benefits for a job monkeys could do... FUCK the unions! __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 05:20 PM	#24 (permalink)
FORD YEEEEAAAARRRRGGGGHHHH! ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Jan 2004 Member Number: 32 Location: Cascadia Posts: 30,177 Thanks: 783 Thanked 1,177 Times in 866 Posts Groans: 403 Groaned at 163 Times in 155 Posts Rep Power: 49 Last Online: Today 10:24 PM	The proof is at the link. It was a corporate whore media distortion, and as I said, it was based on false averages which had nothing to do with wages actually paid to currently employed UAW members. __________________ Eat Us And Smile Listen to the Mike Malloy show, and hear the truth. 6: 00 PM Pacific/9: 00 Eastern "If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." ~Thomas Jefferson

03-30-2009, 05:23 PM	#26 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	I know diesel mechanics and titanium welders who don't make that kind of money... And FORD, if you make more than say $40 per hour for the job you refuse to report to this board, I have no reason to interact with you any further... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 05:48 PM	#30 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	Well... I dunno... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 07:53 PM	#33 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	Well, stay with your union who keeps your wages artifically high... Where do you think think the money comes from ?? Oh yeah, it grows on union trees... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-30-2009, 08:48 PM	#35 (permalink)
Blaze T.W.A.T. Ambassador Foot Soldier Join Date: Jan 2009 Member Number: 24297 Location: Directly under God Posts: 744 Blog Entries: 157 Thanks: 399 Thanked 46 Times in 39 Posts Groans: 129 Groaned at 50 Times in 43 Posts Images: 1 Rep Power: 2 Last Online: 01-30-2010 02:55 AM	Car made from disgruntled employees? Sounds like a fine idea! Charge it!

03-30-2009, 08:50 PM	#36 (permalink)
Blaze T.W.A.T. Ambassador Foot Soldier Join Date: Jan 2009 Member Number: 24297 Location: Directly under God Posts: 744 Blog Entries: 157 Thanks: 399 Thanked 46 Times in 39 Posts Groans: 129 Groaned at 50 Times in 43 Posts Images: 1 Rep Power: 2 Last Online: 01-30-2010 02:55 AM	Over stressed uncared for nursing staff? Mine kind hospital to be at. Can't wait to have my next hospital stay!

03-31-2009, 12:12 AM	#37 (permalink)
Big Train Full Member Status Join Date: Apr 2004 Member Number: 3741 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 4,011 Thanks: 63 Thanked 92 Times in 76 Posts Groans: 28 Groaned at 53 Times in 43 Posts Rep Power: 10 Last Online: 11-24-2009 10:21 PM	The real truth isn't so much what they are paying them, but the legacy pension costs which makes their cost structure so much higher than the competition and has crippled them as such for many years.

03-31-2009, 12:26 AM	#38 (permalink)
Big Train Full Member Status Join Date: Apr 2004 Member Number: 3741 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 4,011 Thanks: 63 Thanked 92 Times in 76 Posts Groans: 28 Groaned at 53 Times in 43 Posts Rep Power: 10 Last Online: 11-24-2009 10:21 PM	Hot Air » Blog Archive » New owner of GM: I’m pretty sure we’re not going to run GM This made me laugh, but it also raises very good questions. This could cost Obama much more than he thinks.. He might have to boot a CEO now and then, but it’s not like R&D will be running the specs on the new hybrid by Geithner for approval, right? This reminds me of Steinbrenner’s infamous announcement after he bought the Yankees that he wouldn’t be involved in the day-to-day operations of the team. Before you knew it, he was firing managers left and right. Just think of Wagoner as Obama’s Billy Martin. You know what’s always helpful, too, when trying to scare a failing industry into reforming itself? Promising that “we cannot, we must not, and we will not let our auto industry simply vanish.” Over to you, Kaus: After visibly defenstrating GM CEO RIck Wagoner, and moving to replace the board of directors, won’t Obama now “own” the GM problem? If the company shuts down in the near future, costing tens of thousands of blue collar jobs, it will be under executives implicitly or explicitly chosen by Obama. It will be Obama’s failure, not simply GM’s failure, no? A public sector failure, not just a business failure. Doesn’t that make it harder, not easier, for the administration to walk away and force the company into bankruptcy (if, for example, the company’s plans for “viability” continue to fall short after the new 60-day deadline)? And doesn’t that, in turn, make extracting the necessary concessions (by threatening bankruptcy) more difficult as well? Indeed. The One’s not just pumping money into this sinkhole, he’s pumping political capital. Which means that while he might control GM’s fate for the moment, increasingly GM will control his. Exit question: Did the new chairman consult with the rest of the “board of directors” before canning Wagoner? Exit answer: No, he did not.

03-31-2009, 12:48 AM	#39 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	Obahhahahhahhahhahhahhahhma... __________________ Roth Army Militia

03-31-2009, 12:52 AM	#40 (permalink)
ELVIS NO ONE'S ABOVE SUSPICION ROTH ARMY MODERATOR Join Date: Dec 2003 Member Number: 14 Location: LOUISIANA Posts: 20,696 Thanks: 170 Thanked 451 Times in 352 Posts Groans: 71 Groaned at 298 Times in 192 Posts Rep Power: 31 Last Online: Today 08:30 PM	Barack Hussein Obama II - pronounced /bəˈrɑːk huːˈseɪn oʊˈbɑːmə/; __________________ Roth Army Militia

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