Potential EDDIE VAN HALEN Tribute Concert

EDDIE VAN HALEN been dead for two weeks, and there have been tributes of all sorts (Zahzoo just posted about an upcoming tribute conversation with a bunch of musicians like the Appice brothers, Steve Morse, Kulick, etc.). I keep reading, however, about ideas for an Eddie Van Halen tribute concert...and I don't think I really feel good about this idea...especially because the way most of these tribute concerts are done, they suck:

1) THE GUITAR PROBLEM: Part of what makes Eddie worthy of such praise & tribute is that he simply was unbeatable and really not copyable on that-there guitar. I've seen some really good players in guitar shops who can really simulate Eddie's sound/playing. And bands like Atomic Punks do a great job of sounding like VH. But tribute concerts don't usually bring out such technicians (nor do I see the point in having faceless technicians just copy Eddie). In the end, these shows bring out famous musicians (popular by modern music-standards) playing those songs. And, frankly, I don't want to watch a concert in which people like The Edge, Jack White, Dave Grohl, Richie Sambora, etc. play classic VH songs. I like U2 (though the only album I've liked in the last 20 years is NO LINE ON THE HORIZON) and I like Jack White...but let's face it: they'll get the currently-popular/cool rock guys to do this tribute instead of getting people who could pull off at least some of the technical shit. They could get Steve Vai, Satriani (putting aside any Chickenfoot bitterness, I actually think Sammy's done worse things), Dweezil (he's a great player and loves Eddie)...but they won't get those guys. They'll get shit like Maroon 5 to desecrate JUMP. They'll get Dave Grohl...and he'll ruin AIN'T TALKIN' 'BOUT LOVE.


2) THE SINGER PROBLEM: These tribute things usually suck. The Freddie Mercury Tribute Concert in 1992 was admittedly good...not perfect, but good. Classic Bowie/Ronson/Hunter footage, for one...and a lot of good Queen stuff (anyone can make fun of me, but the George Michael & Queen thing was good...and Robert Plant singing CRAZY LITTLE THING with the band was also awesome).

But the only sort-of-worthy VH tribute concert for me would be Dave, Michael, Wolf & Alex on stage (or Dave, Wolf & Alex, but I bet a million dollars that Wolf would make sure Mike is invited, especially after the 2019 overtures), joined by a few truly amazing hard rock/metal guitarists. And if Wolf really has learned a lot of his Dad's stuff, it would be fun to see him maybe play a couple of songs on guitar. It wouldn't be the same, but hey...it would be better than what they usually do. But...yes, mainly just Dave.

I don't want to see Miley Cyrus, Taylor Swift, Dave Grohl (I don't hate the guy...I loved the THEM CROOKED VULTURES show...but he's simply not on-level with some of heavy rock's biggest legends except his drumming) singing Van Halen songs. If you want a tribute to Eddie, you know people mostly want to hear the classic material. And, I'm sorry, the only singer I know who does those songs justice is Dave. If they really wanted to make sure they cover the whole Eddie catalog, I guess they could invite Sam out to sing HUMANS BEING and "5150"...I guess I wouldn't mind that. But stop there. Fine, let him fucking sing RIGHT NOW. But most people who casually know the band and might watch this thing on T.V. would switch to another station if the band spends an hour letting Sam sing WHEN IT'S LOVE, WHY CAN'T THIS BE LOVE, LOVE WALKS IN, CAN'T STOP LOVIN' YOU, DON'T TELL ME (WHAT LOVE CAN DO) and on and on and on.

And don't even consider inviting Gary Cherone. Outside of hardcore Eddie fans (I am a hardcore Eddie fan who mostly pays attention to 7 of his albums, 8 if you count the recent live-LP), nobody on Earth would be able to name one song from their 1998 album...

I have to admit, if they didn't make it just Dave, I'd even rather Sam sings a few songs than having to listen to goddamn Sheryl Crow sing I'LL WAIT, Bono sing JUMP, Beyoncé sing PANAMA, and on and on. Even if they made it more of a metal thing, as much as I love Rob Halford, Brian Johnson (Bon is still better), James Hetfield (fuck you, Metallica-haters), Bruce Dickinson, I don't really need to listen to a concert with those guys trying to do Dave songs. That said, if Sam didn't show and Dave refused to do any of Sam's songs (which he would) and they still wanted to play a few non-Dave songs, it would be pretty awesome to hear Rob Halford do something like RIGHT NOW and have it not sound nearly as lame (though the lyrics still suck). Still, at the end of the day, Van Halen is Van Halen with Dave.


3) THE WHOLE IDEA IS POINTLESS: Even if the actual members of Van Halen did this concert...even if they kept it mostly Dave singing...even if they pulled off the guitar thing and had a few people we all respect play serviceable guitar-renditions of the classic material with maybe Wolfie helping...IT WOULD BE OKAY TO WATCH WHEN IT HAPPENS AND THAT'S IT. How many of us would want to go back and watch this again (and again)? Anytime I'd want a VH fix for my home-theater, I wouldn't watch this. I'd dig out any of the classic concerts (Montreal '84, Sao Paulo, US Festival) and blast that. It would be an even greater injustice if this thing aired on TV and then got released on Blu-ray/4K. Imagine if the only Van Halen concert with Dave one could purchase in stores or Amazon (or stream) would be a concert that doesn't even feature Eddie Van Halen playing. Even worse, imagine if a bunch of young people who don't know Van Halen watched this thing and then concluded, "I don't get what's so amazing about this band? The guitar is fine but it's not blowing my mind!"


I still maintain that the best two tributes they could do for Eddie once the dust has settled a bit (pardon the pun) would be:

a) Release a few classic Eddie concerts (e.g. Oakland) on Blu-ray, stream said shows, do a T.V. airing on VH-1, Palladia, etc.
b) Dig out the A DIFFERENT KIND OF TRUTH outtakes (allegedly 12 more songs they worked on, though I read one source saying they recorded a ton of material and then Eddie in one interview claims they used most everything they actually recorded, with much more written) and then get Dave into the studio to turn the outtakes into finished songs with vocals. Then they could get Wolf & Michael Anthony to lay down a bunch of solid backing vocals to Dave's new lead vocals. If not A DIFFERENT KIND OF TRUTH outtakes, they could instead go through the tons of material still in the archives and do a lot of digital work to turn everything into a bunch of finished masters (new drums from Alex, if necessary), again with Dave singing and the others doing new backing vocals. In other words, a new VH album with Dave...AND with Eddie, playing his heart out. I read someone say that if they dig into the archives, there's no way they could get Dave to sing on instrumental outtakes from the Sam years...but that's fucking bullshit. I read Eddie in an interview say there were four finished recordings left off the crappy FOR UNLAWFUL CARNAL KNOWLEDGE, even more outtakes left off BALANCE, and I think two guitar songs left off OU812 (to make way for the keyboard stuff). Where is it written that Dave couldn't take these songs and do the vocals, even ignoring anything Sammy originally sang on them? And you know why I think such a rule is bullshit? Do you know why I don't think Eddie would give a shit? Because CAN'T GET THIS STUFF NO MORE is a BALANCE outtake called BACKDOOR SHUFFLE, originally completely finished and even having a finished Sammy vocal on it. Eddie took out the recording, mixed out Sammy's vocal (maybe he even wiped it off the multi-track, who knows?) and let Dave put new vocals on it and make it his own. Sam was apparently pissed and their awful manager at the time sent Sam a check for $35,000 to shut him up. This was all verified in interviews. I don't think it makes a fucking difference when it was recorded. If Eddie was happy to let Dave take a Sammy outtake and make it his own (and CAN'T GET THIS STUFF NO MORE rocks and is truly a David Lee Roth Van Halen song), then those making a new album with Dave from the archives should be fine with the idea too.


I'm not really interested in any tributes to Eddie, concerts or albums, unless Eddie is playing.

We at this site have declared a million times over the years: It ain't Van Halen without Diamond David Lee Roth. Well, I can't believe we've come to the point that we have to add to this: It ain't Van Halen without Eddie Van Halen.

By the way, it's been 3,179 days since Kristy last got laid.

A benefit concert thing won't work and its a silly idea.

Wolf needs time to heal and has an album to finish up and release. Its time for him to move on without the shadow of his dad's band.

Also, anything involving Hagar with Dave on the same bill - is awkward. Current VH management (Azoff) knows that and would never push for it. Let Ed and VH RIP and not be the subject of the circus that it became with lead singers.

Also, Alex will never play the drums in a live setting ever again. He's retired. And has, and will never, play with anyone other than Ed.

The only way I can see a benefit concert happening is that it doesnt involve ANY of the VH members - past and present.

I mean, if various professional, name brand rock musicians wanna hold an Eddie Van Halen tribute concert...okay.

I would have thought countless guitar players around the world playing Eddie's licks for the last 40 years would have been tribute enough.

It wouldn't be something I'd be interested in seeing or hearing: if I wanna hear someone play Eddie's licks, I'll listen to Van Halen.

That Freddy Mercury tribute concert in 1992 WAS pretty good. I tend to think an EVH one wouldn't be along those lines, though...and by the time the second guest guitarist the second song into the set put both hands on the fretboard, I'd be reaching for the mute button.

There's ten million youtuber guitar players who have uploaded videos of them playing along with Eddie's stuff...shit, the second half of the 1980s saw virtually every rock guitarist you would see on MTV trying to cop a Van Halen. Far as tributes go, the sheer degree of visible/audible influence Ed had on rock guitar was tribute enough to his talent.

I don't think this will happen, and if it does and has to be virtual...it's gonna suck.

I agree that Al is done. He can cash his royalty checks and be okay.

Hagarelli will end up making this about him, putting together a touring tribute and while claiming "I don't need the money," will continue to charge exorbitant prices for tickets.

If it did happen the one person guaranteed to show up is Hagar.

Also funnily enough, the Freddy tribute was probably the highlight of Cherone's career,

As far as Dave, Alex, and Wolfie putting out a new record, it might work if the instrumentals are already recorded, even if it's more demos from the old days like ADKOT, where the new stuff is mostly the vocals (and presumably the bass tracks overdubbed because they didn't want to pay Sobolewski).

But if it comes down to raw tapes of Eddie riffs and somebody else trying to turn those into songs via edits, I'm thinking that's a bad idea. Two examples of how this could go wrong: the posthumous Hendrix albums released in the early 70s with Jimi's guitar backed by some studio hacks who he probably never met. Second example: the "new" songs on the Beatles Anthology albums, where they took a raw John Lennon demo and the surviving band members built a track around it, and somehow it ended up sounding more like the Traveling Wilburys because they let that idiot Jeff Lynne produce it. John was technically on the songs, but he obviously had no say in how they were put together, and the end result is that it didn't really sound like The Beatles, despite all 4 of them being on the tracks.

Haven't heard the new Ac/Dc album yet, which supposedly is built from tracks Angus & Malcolm recorded before dementia robbed Malcolm of his guitar abilities. Maybe they can change my mind about this cut and paste approach with musicians who aren't able to be actually present for the recording process.

As for a tribute concert..... I'm ambivalent about that. It could be really good or really bad, and given the soap opera that Van Halen has been since 1985 or so, I'm leaning towards the really bad.... especially if Hagar is involved, and I don't know how he could NOT be. Queen's tribute show worked because all they had to do was rotate stand in singers behind the microphone. Nobody was going to sound like Freddie, but they all gave it their best, and the rest of the band sounded like themselves. In a hypothetical Eddie tribute show you'd be rotating guitarists in and out, presumably vocalists, and odds are it would all end up sounding really fucking weird. I suppose the easiest approach would be if you brought in Brian Young or the guys who were recently playing with Dave in Vegas, since they should know the songs. But do Alex & Wolf really want to play with Ed imitators? It' would be weird enough if Ed were just a missing band mate, but being their dad & brother that just adds a whole new level to the thought of anybody else playing that stuff on stage with them.

Just my two cents... not like I'm going to be summoned to Howdy Doody Mountain to coordinate this thing, if indeed it ever happens. :gulp:

Dude, you threw down the best rant I've heard anywhere in months. :flame::rockon:

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Originally Posted by FORD

Haven't heard the new Ac/Dc album yet, which supposedly is built from tracks Angus & Malcolm recorded before dementia robbed Malcolm of his guitar abilities. Maybe they can change my mind about this cut and paste approach with musicians who aren't able to be actually present for the recording process.

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Angus has stated publicly that Malcolm is not on the new record. Yes, they used songs or riffs or ideas, that he and Malcolm wrote, but Malcolm's actual playing isn't on the new album. The spirit is there, but not the actual playing by Malcolm. I applaud Angus for not only making this new album with the current band, but admitting there's no Malcolm on it. Fuckin' ballsy move and shows a lot of integrity, in my mind.

The ONLY way I am interested in any tributes to EVH, are if the singers on record are involved, and Wolf plays Ed's part in it. Al, Mike, Wolf and original singers. No, I won't care much for the Hagar or Cherone portions of the "Tribute", but maybe other people will and it was a part of Ed's legacy, whether I preferred it or not. I'm sure Ed was proud of his music, even if Clichegar cheesed it up and Cherone just didn't have the chemistry to make it work.

How about a Hologram? Seems to be all the rage these days. NOOOOOOO!!!

In all honesty and full disclosure. I haven't been thrilled with Dave's singing of these songs for at least the last couple of tours. Doesn't mean I want Grohl or anyone else up there singing them. I don't. At this point, give me an official release of Oakland, South America, US Festival, Montreal and or fucking LARGO! The Largo show is PHENOMENAL!

The absolute best thing about there not being a "Tribute" show is, then Clichegar doesn't get yet another opportunity to make the passing of EVH, about himself.

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Originally Posted by Viking

Dude, you threw down the best rant I've heard anywhere in months. :flame::rockon:

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Much obliged, hombre.:metalbang:

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Originally Posted by Von Halen

...fucking LARGO! The Largo show is PHENOMENAL!...

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Indeed it is. I'm surprised I forgot that. In the inventory sheet from back in '85 of their vaults, one of the 2-inch VHS tapes listed in their collection is another Largo show, shot by the in-house crew just like Largo '82, but from the 1984 tour. An entire pro-shot show from the 1984 tour. Fucking release that. I'll shut up and leave them the fuck alone about releases or tributes for like 10 years if they just release that fucker!

There was a great interview with Ed in Guitar World from 2012 all about ADKOT.
They had at least 35 demos. According to Ed they could play them all and they were all ready to go.
He left it up to Wolfgang and the producer to pick the songs.
What that means though in terms of quality is anybody's guess.

I'm not crazy about a tribute concert. Most of the time they just end up in the dust bin of history.
I hope we don't end up with "alternate take of Hot for Teacher solo", like they've started to do with Hendrix.

As for Hagar, I recall they did some new tracks for Best of Both Worlds and they were the worst stuff I've ever heard from Van Halen. Just awful.

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Originally Posted by nick500

As for Hagar, I recall they did some new tracks for Best of Both Worlds and they were the worst stuff I've ever heard from Van Halen. Just awful.

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Truly embarrassing. Especially the "breakfast" song. Possibly the worst lyrics ever written.

One interesting thing cheesehead about the sessions for those three new songs: he says Ed played him stacks of instrumental multi-track recordings before they started to choose songs. They played him more than a dozen songs with guitar, bass & drums. And they took three of those and started putting "vocals" on them.

Apparently when they started working with Dave on the two songs from BEST OF, Eddie played Dave stacks of what were described as "finished recordings"...songs with guitars, bass & drums. Most of the things Ed played Dave were new...many epic recordings with multiple parts and many guitar overdubs (including finished solos or potential solos). ME WISE MAGIC was the first thing Eddie played for Dave because it was the one about which Ed was most excited. Dave didn't like it...at first. Ed played him many other new recordings. Eventually, Dave asked Ed to "play that first one again...maybe I'll hear something I can do in it now." Ed also dug out finished recordings from the BALANCE sessions that hadn't been used for the album...and that's where CAN'T GET THIS STUFF NO MORE came from.

The point is, in just these two pockets of time, both singers said they heard tons of full-band recordings that just needed vocals and only a few of which were used each time. Add to that the (documented in interviews) finished recordings left off various albums, and then all those years Ed was at home just hanging out in his studio day after day...I'm sure he wasn't just sitting there making finished masters (without vocals) of every day he jammed or came up with...BUT, I'm sure there have to be dozens of songs laid down with Al, some in the earlier years with Mike too...with Wolf in the later years...

Ed was apparently putting down his own bass tracks on most of the outtakes between maybe '96 and '04. And even if many or most of these songs don't have finished bass tracks, big deal? That's where 5150 would be used when compiling potential posthumous studio albums: either Wolfie could lay down bass parts now OR (if he was up for this) he could actually invite Mike down to put down some bass parts. I'm sure Mike would happily accept the invite.

Honestly, I think Wolf is a really solid bass player. I've listened closely to the bass parts on ADKOT, as well as his renditions (some with different basslines) of the classic material live. He's a badass on the instrument. It would be great if he asked Mike to come down and lay down some bass (and backing vocals). But I wouldn't require it for authenticity or anything. I'd be just as happy with Wolf doing the bass on material for any posthumous albums.

I think Wolf absolutely inherited the Van Halen musical gift of playing instruments. Like his Grandfather, Father and Uncle, he's a very talented musician. Will that translate to the creative side of things? Who knows? I guess we will find out when his album eventually comes out. However, it's almost a no win for him, because his name is Van Halen, and he's already said his music isn't Van Halen. Which is what a lot of people are going to expect. I'm not big on one man bands, and I know Wolf also stated he plays every instrument on his forthcoming album. Musicians and bands tend to overlook one of the most important factors that most all highly successful bands have, and that is chemistry. Van Halen with Dave had chemistry. Unbelievable chemistry. It was pure fucking magic. Their worst songs, like Jump, were even magical. It was magic the way they could cover any song and Van Halenize it. I hope Wolf's album is stellar. But I just don't see how you have chemistry with yourself, when you are doing every part on the album. But, if anyone can do it, a Van Halen probably can.

I hope these complete songs you guys are talking about, less vocals, do exist. I would love for Dave and Wolf and whoever else, to go in and finish them. Maybe bring back Ted Templeman!

I still cannot comprehend the fact that EVH is gone. I just cannot wrap my head around it. I cannot seem to accept it. I am still in disbelief. I am still shaken to the core.

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Originally Posted by Von Halen

I think Wolf absolutely inherited the Van Halen musical gift of playing instruments. Like his Grandfather, Father and Uncle, he's a very talented musician. Will that translate to the creative side of things? Who knows? I guess we will find out when his album eventually comes out. However, it's almost a no win for him, because his name is Van Halen, and he's already said his music isn't Van Halen. Which is what a lot of people are going to expect. I'm not big on one man bands, and I know Wolf also stated he plays every instrument on his forthcoming album. Musicians and bands tend to overlook one of the most important factors that most all highly successful bands have, and that is chemistry. Van Halen with Dave had chemistry. Unbelievable chemistry. It was pure fucking magic. Their worst songs, like Jump, were even magical. It was magic the way they could cover any song and Van Halenize it. I hope Wolf's album is stellar. But I just don't see how you have chemistry with yourself, when you are doing every part on the album. But, if anyone can do it, a Van Halen probably can.

I hope these complete songs you guys are talking about, less vocals, do exist. I would love for Dave and Wolf and whoever else, to go in and finish them. Maybe bring back Ted Templeman!

I still cannot comprehend the fact that EVH is gone. I just cannot wrap my head around it. I cannot seem to accept it. I am still in disbelief. I am still shaken to the core.

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My friend, I know exactly what you mean. Some posters have said it's been too difficult to listen to the music these last two weeks, and I understand that. Or a couple of posters have said they've listened to that music so much throughout their lifetime that they did not really put it on these last two weeks.

I have listened to virtually nothing but VH these last two weeks. I've listened to it constantly (when not helping daughter with school, doing work, etc.).

I was so proud of my daughter the other day: we were watching YouTube music vids in the home theater, and she asked (as she always does) me to put on the vids for JUMP, PANAMA, HOT FOR TEACHER...and that day, I also put on the original YOU REALLY GOT ME video. She was jumping around the room, dancing as well as a six-year-old girl can. Then I said, "Let me put this on for you. It's also Van Halen. If you like it, cool." I just wanted to see her reaction.

She sat down and I put on the video for WHEN IT'S LOVE. I sat there watching this while keeping an eye on her to see her reaction. I even realized I was tapping my foot because Al is drumming, Ed's solo is ok (not great but it's still Ed) and I even admitted to myself, "Well, it's a catchy chorus...even if it's Van Hagar." But I've always thought this song is typical Van Hagar: catchy, but kinda generic and with none of the wit or groove that the real Van Halen had. And a terrible video. But I was trying not to influence her.

Well, she'd danced to the first four songs (JUMP, PANAMA, HFT, YRGM), jumping up and down...kept saying, "David Lee Roth is so handsome." (She's a girl.)

When we watched WHEN IT'S LOVE, however, she just stayed sitting. No getting up to dance. No tapping her feet. She asked about a minute in, "Is that David Lee Roth?"

"No, honey," I said quietly.

She looked confused. "Is that the guy you were complaining about to mommy last night when we were making dinner?"

"Yes," I mumbled quietly.

She sort of frowned at the screen. Then she asked, "What does he have that silly red suit?"

"I really don't know."

More frowning. "Why is he dancing like that? He looks stupid."

Normally, I would correct her for using that word, but what could I say? "I know, honey."

Then she said, "This song isn't like JUMP or PANAMA, is it?"

"Why do you think that?" I asked her.

She bit her lip and then said, "The singer just looks silly. And (she really said this) he isn't handsome...like Dave."

I pinched myself, so proud of her.

Then she finally said, "Can I go play now?"


Von, I am sure there are a ton of songs described. The tapes Ed pointed at on his studio wall (in both the '98 studio tour vid and the similar vid with him & Wolf from '12) are multi-track tapes. Master tapes. They are definitely not just tape recordings of Eddie playing riffs or wanking. Hell, I'm sure there's a lot of that in the vault too. They've probably already surveyed a lot of this material. Otherwise, Azoff wouldn't have already mentioned that quickly that Al & Wolf are going into the studio to take stock of what they have. Their manager would not say such a thing so quickly unless the band (probably Ed discussing this with them, knowing the end was near) was already thinking of compiling an album (or more) from the material already recorded. Azoff said Ed basically didn't record for the last two years. This means the stuff that's in there is probably a vault full of finished or partly-finished material that's been stockpiling for decades. There have just been too many interviews with different band members, producers & engineers referring to demos and masters of full-band multi-track recordings that just hadn't been released for one reason or another.

As for Wolf's stuff, absolutely it won't be the band Van Halen. I have to say, though...sometimes, albums put together by one-man bands can be pretty amazing and really fool people. A lot of Hendrix fans don't realize this, but his masterpiece album ELECTRIC LADYLAND featured bassist Noel Redding on only four songs (out of 16). More than an hour of the material on that amazing album is Mitch Mitchell playing drums (Buddy Miles on one song) and Jimi playing everything else...not just guitars, but bass parts, simple piano parts, etc. There are some other session musicians on there...but if one listens to the amazing song "1983 (A Merman I Should Turn to Be)," that epic piece of music that sounds like a killer band is actually recorded by two people. I've played in a band, recording tons of material (mostly hard rock, some psychedelia, acoustic music, funk, etc.)...and I do love the recordings that are played by the full band (especially when the music is cut live by the whole band). But one of the things I always love is when people can't tell (unless I tell them) which songs are full band recordings and then which songs feature me playing the drums, my Hammond B3, some piano (on the keyboard), percussion, all the vocals...leaving all the guitar and bass parts to my lead guitar player. It can end up being 10 instruments and lots of vocals but still really sound like a full band. But I totally understand what you're saying: solid recordings of a full-band playing in a room can have an unbeatable groove that can't be replicated. But I do have faith in one-man-band recordings being amazing (Wolf's) if the musician in question is truly multi-talented.

I'm excited to hear Wolf's album...but I'm still most excited to hear a possible new VH album down the road. When the time is right, I want to hear more Eddie. I'm totally broken up that he's gone. I watched some of the Hollywood Bowl concert last night (the one Hardrock posted)...the band's last show ever...and I have no shame admitting that I had a tear in my eye more than once just watching this incredible guitarist play his amazing music, Dave standing right next to him and singing (singing well!!...I'm so fucking sick of the Hagar-ites claiming he didn't sing anything well anymore since coming back to the band...total fucking bullshit).

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Originally Posted by Rikk

She sort of frowned at the screen. Then she asked, "What does he have that silly red suit?"

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You should have told her he calls himself the RED ROCKER and see what she says to that!

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Originally Posted by twonabomber

You should have told her he calls himself the RED ROCKER and see what she says to that!

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I'm gonna go ask her that now...

Yeah, what YOU ALL said....

Rikk, I am so proud of you.

I would say your daughter is a chip off the old block.

"Is this the guy you were complaining about at dinner the other night?" :lmao:

But hey.....her reaction is a sign of extreme intelligence and good taste! :D