Giuliani: Under constitution, Trump could shoot Comey and not be indicted

https://i.imgur.com/wVVKx9P.png


Giuliani: Under constitution, Trump could shoot Comey and not be indicted
John Wagner
The Washington Post
June 4, 2018


President Trump’s lawyer Rudolph W. Giuliani reportedly said Sunday that Trump could shoot former FBI director James B. Comey in the Oval Office and still not be indicted for it while still serving as president.

The HuffPost reported that Giuliani, a former federal prosecutor, made the assertion on a day when he conducted a series of interviews in which he discussed the expansive powers granted to the president in the Constitution.

“In no case can he be subpoenaed or indicted,” Giuliani said, according to the HuffPost. “I don’t know how you can indict while he’s in office. No matter what it is.”

Giuliani said that impeachment would be the remedy for a president’s illegal behavior, offering as an example the hypothetical case of Trump shooting Comey rather than firing him, the HuffPost reported.

“If he shot James Comey, he’d be impeached the next day,” Giuliani was quoted as saying. “Impeach him, and then you can do whatever you want to do to him.”

Giuliani, who is representing Trump amid special counsel Robert S. Mueller III’s investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election, also appeared on a pair of talk shows Sunday.

On both, Giuliani argued that the president probably has the sweeping constitutional authority to pardon even himself of federal crimes.

“He probably does,” Giuliani said, when asked on ABC’s “This Week” if Trump has the ability to pardon himself. “He has no intention of pardoning himself, but he probably — not to say he can’t.”

While arguing that the president has the theoretical ability to pardon himself, Giuliani and other Trump allies on Sunday nonetheless rejected the reality of such a brash move — in part because of the political backlash they said could lead to Trump’s impeachment.

On NBC’s “Meet the Press,” for instance, Giuliani framed the pardon question as purely hypothetical and politically implausible.

“It’s not going to happen. It’s a hypothetical point,” he told host Chuck Todd.

America needs a Putin to drain the swamp. Cheeto Face might be the answer.

Putin would have to stop drowning in his own swamp - he's now mysteriously one of the world's richest men....

We might as well bring in Idi Amin to improve our human rights record...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

America needs a Putin to drain the swamp. Cheeto Face might be the answer.

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WTF? Putin is literally the biggest swamp maker in history!!!

http://uk.businessinsider.com/how-pu...fortune-2017-6


No one knows Putin's exact net worth, but many speculate he's the wealthiest person on the planet — his $1 billion palace and $500 million yacht explain why

Vladimir Putin very well may be the richest man in the world.

But it's impossible to say for sure. According to the Kremlin, the Russian president earns around $133,000 a year and lives in a small apartment.

That description doesn't jive with most accounts of Putin's lifestyle. Former Russian government adviser Stanislav Belkovsky estimated his fortune is worth $70 billion. Hedge fund manager Bill Browder, a noted critic of Putin, claimed it was more like $200 billion. A fortune that enormous would propel him straight past Amazon founder and richest man in the world Jeff Bezos, who Forbes estimates has $125.6 to his name.

So why can't we pin down Putin's net worth with any certainty? The 2015 Panama Papers revealed that Putin may obscure and bolster his fortune through proxies.

We've put together a list of all the clues that indicate Putin is likely one of the richest people on the planet:

As President of Russia, Putin's official residence is the Moscow Kremlin. However, he spends most of his time at a suburban government residence outside of the city called Novo-Ogaryovo.
http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...o-ogaryovo.jpg




Official records published in 2016 by the Kremlin would have us believe that Putin has a very modest real estate portfolio. The report said he owned a small plot of land and an apartment with a garage. But over the years, Putin has been linked to other properties. The most controversial of which is the so-called "secret palace." This was reportedly built for Putin using illegal state funds.

http://static3.uk.businessinsider.co...tate-funds.jpg


This epic mansion reportedly cost $1 billion to build. It has a private theater and landing pad with room for three helicopters.

http://static5.uk.businessinsider.co...elicopters.jpg

http://static4.uk.businessinsider.co...-grandiose.jpg

http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...as-opulent.jpg

And the following year, opposition leader and Putin critic Boris Nemtsov produced a dossier claiming that Putin owned multiple private jets, helicopters, and yachts. Nemtsov alleged that, out of the 20 state residences Putin had access to, nine were built during his tenure as president.

The president was also accused of owning 58 different types of aircraft, including a Dassault Falcon, which seats 19.

http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...h-seats-19.jpg

One of his planes was said to have an $11 million cabin fitted out by jewelers and that toilet which cost close to $100,000. This plane has room for up to 186 passengers. Putin is accused of owning five of these.


http://static6.uk.businessinsider.co...e-of-these.jpg


The dossier claimed Putin has a collection of four yachts, each costing thousands of dollars to maintain. Rossiya, one of his yachts, was upgraded in 2005. It reportedly cost $1.2 billion to do. "The Graceful," another of his yachts, (shown below) reportedly sleeps 14 people and has six bedrooms.


http://static2.uk.businessinsider.co...x-bedrooms.jpg

Then there's Olympia. He was reportedly given this 57-meter luxury yacht, worth $35 million, as a gift from Chelsea football club owner and oligarch Roman Abramovich. According to a former head of a state shipping company in Russia, Putin runs the yacht using state money.


A $1 million Patek Phillippe going up for auction in July 2017 was also said to be owned by Putin. Accompanying documentation claimed he was the owner. The Kremlin denied these claims.

http://static4.uk.businessinsider.co...ese-claims.jpg

In 2007, ex-Kremlin official Stanislav Belkovsky claimed that Putin had a $40 billion fortune hidden away in Switzerland and Liechtenstein. At the time, that would have made him the fourth wealthiest person in the world, between business magnate Carlos Slim and late IKEA founder Ingvar Kamprad.


http://static5.uk.businessinsider.co...ar-kamprad.jpg


At the time, Belkovsy said Putin secretly controlled 37% of the shares of Surgutneftegaz and 4.5% of Gazprom, two giant Russian oil companies. He also said he controlled "at least 75%" of Swiss oil trader Gunvor, the Guardian reported, but added, "I suspect there are some businesses I know nothing about." Gunvor has refuted these claims, however. "President Putin does not and never has had any ownership, beneficial or otherwise in Gunvor," a Gunvor spokesperson said in a statement to Business Insider. "He is not a beneficiary of Gunvor or its activities."

Estimates of Putin's net worth have only risen over time. Browder, the CEO of Hermitage Capital Management, believes that Putin has access to a secret fortune of $200 billion. Browder had invested in Russia in the 1990s, but ultimately came into conflict with Putin. After Browder's lawyer Sergei Magnitsky was jailed and brutally killed while investigation corruption, Browder advocated for the passage of the "Magnitsky Act" in 2012, leading to US sanctions against Russian oligarchs.

Putin's inner circle is actually the reason why no one can seem to pin down Putin's exact worth with any certainty. The Guardian reported that in 2010, "US diplomatic cables suggested Putin held his wealth via proxies," including his best friend Sergei Roldugin and banker Yuri Kovalchuk.

The repeated rebuttals have done nothing to dispel the scrutiny on Putin's alleged riches. “In a country where 20  million people can barely make ends meet, the luxurious life of the president is a brazen and cynical challenge to society from a high-handed potentate,” Nemstov wrote in one 2012 white paper. The politician, a longtime and vocal critic of Putin, was assassinated in 2015.

http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...ed-in-2015.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seshmeister

WTF? Putin is literally the biggest swamp maker in history!!!

http://uk.businessinsider.com/how-pu...fortune-2017-6


No one knows Putin's exact net worth, but many speculate he's the wealthiest person on the planet — his $1 billion palace and $500 million yacht explain why

Vladimir Putin very well may be the richest man in the world.

But it's impossible to say for sure. According to the Kremlin, the Russian president earns around $133,000 a year and lives in a small apartment.

That description doesn't jive with most accounts of Putin's lifestyle. Former Russian government adviser Stanislav Belkovsky estimated his fortune is worth $70 billion. Hedge fund manager Bill Browder, a noted critic of Putin, claimed it was more like $200 billion. A fortune that enormous would propel him straight past Amazon founder and richest man in the world Jeff Bezos, who Forbes estimates has $125.6 to his name.

So why can't we pin down Putin's net worth with any certainty? The 2015 Panama Papers revealed that Putin may obscure and bolster his fortune through proxies.

We've put together a list of all the clues that indicate Putin is likely one of the richest people on the planet:

As President of Russia, Putin's official residence is the Moscow Kremlin. However, he spends most of his time at a suburban government residence outside of the city called Novo-Ogaryovo.
http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...o-ogaryovo.jpg




Official records published in 2016 by the Kremlin would have us believe that Putin has a very modest real estate portfolio. The report said he owned a small plot of land and an apartment with a garage. But over the years, Putin has been linked to other properties. The most controversial of which is the so-called "secret palace." This was reportedly built for Putin using illegal state funds.

http://static3.uk.businessinsider.co...tate-funds.jpg


This epic mansion reportedly cost $1 billion to build. It has a private theater and landing pad with room for three helicopters.

http://static5.uk.businessinsider.co...elicopters.jpg

http://static4.uk.businessinsider.co...-grandiose.jpg

http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...as-opulent.jpg

And the following year, opposition leader and Putin critic Boris Nemtsov produced a dossier claiming that Putin owned multiple private jets, helicopters, and yachts. Nemtsov alleged that, out of the 20 state residences Putin had access to, nine were built during his tenure as president.

The president was also accused of owning 58 different types of aircraft, including a Dassault Falcon, which seats 19.

http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...h-seats-19.jpg

One of his planes was said to have an $11 million cabin fitted out by jewelers and that toilet which cost close to $100,000. This plane has room for up to 186 passengers. Putin is accused of owning five of these.


http://static6.uk.businessinsider.co...e-of-these.jpg


The dossier claimed Putin has a collection of four yachts, each costing thousands of dollars to maintain. Rossiya, one of his yachts, was upgraded in 2005. It reportedly cost $1.2 billion to do. "The Graceful," another of his yachts, (shown below) reportedly sleeps 14 people and has six bedrooms.


http://static2.uk.businessinsider.co...x-bedrooms.jpg

Then there's Olympia. He was reportedly given this 57-meter luxury yacht, worth $35 million, as a gift from Chelsea football club owner and oligarch Roman Abramovich. According to a former head of a state shipping company in Russia, Putin runs the yacht using state money.


A $1 million Patek Phillippe going up for auction in July 2017 was also said to be owned by Putin. Accompanying documentation claimed he was the owner. The Kremlin denied these claims.

http://static4.uk.businessinsider.co...ese-claims.jpg

In 2007, ex-Kremlin official Stanislav Belkovsky claimed that Putin had a $40 billion fortune hidden away in Switzerland and Liechtenstein. At the time, that would have made him the fourth wealthiest person in the world, between business magnate Carlos Slim and late IKEA founder Ingvar Kamprad.


http://static5.uk.businessinsider.co...ar-kamprad.jpg


At the time, Belkovsy said Putin secretly controlled 37% of the shares of Surgutneftegaz and 4.5% of Gazprom, two giant Russian oil companies. He also said he controlled "at least 75%" of Swiss oil trader Gunvor, the Guardian reported, but added, "I suspect there are some businesses I know nothing about." Gunvor has refuted these claims, however. "President Putin does not and never has had any ownership, beneficial or otherwise in Gunvor," a Gunvor spokesperson said in a statement to Business Insider. "He is not a beneficiary of Gunvor or its activities."

Estimates of Putin's net worth have only risen over time. Browder, the CEO of Hermitage Capital Management, believes that Putin has access to a secret fortune of $200 billion. Browder had invested in Russia in the 1990s, but ultimately came into conflict with Putin. After Browder's lawyer Sergei Magnitsky was jailed and brutally killed while investigation corruption, Browder advocated for the passage of the "Magnitsky Act" in 2012, leading to US sanctions against Russian oligarchs.

Putin's inner circle is actually the reason why no one can seem to pin down Putin's exact worth with any certainty. The Guardian reported that in 2010, "US diplomatic cables suggested Putin held his wealth via proxies," including his best friend Sergei Roldugin and banker Yuri Kovalchuk.

The repeated rebuttals have done nothing to dispel the scrutiny on Putin's alleged riches. “In a country where 20  million people can barely make ends meet, the luxurious life of the president is a brazen and cynical challenge to society from a high-handed potentate,” Nemstov wrote in one 2012 white paper. The politician, a longtime and vocal critic of Putin, was assassinated in 2015.

http://static1.uk.businessinsider.co...ed-in-2015.jpg

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Don't worry Sesh. I was joking with my comment. I was being sarcastic.

Putin is a Russian czar. That being said the Russian people have it better now than they ever did. Still better than Stalin or Ivan the Terrible. Russia has a pretty rough history. Been there in the 70's. The 90's and not too long ago. The best is now. Of course St. Petersburg and Moscow are the show pieces but even in Irkutsk things were looking better. Corruption? Plenty.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

Don't worry Sesh. I was joking with my comment. I was being sarcastic.

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I'm glad you did so I looked it up.

I was under the impression he had skimmed a few billion and 'hid' it in his daughter's name, I had no idea he had taken so much so blatantly.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

Putin is a Russian czar. That being said the Russian people have it better now than they ever did. Still better than Stalin or Ivan the Terrible. Russia has a pretty rough history. Been there in the 70's. The 90's and not too long ago. The best is now. Of course St. Petersburg and Moscow are the show pieces but even in Irkutsk things were looking better. Corruption? Plenty.

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Yeah this is the impression I get from friends who have been, Putin is popular because things were so fucked up before him.

Also of course imagine all your news media was like Fox news.

That's pretty much it. My uncle was a Russian history professor and also fluent in the language and after detant he arranged a trip to the Soviet Union in 1975 and my parents went and of course I got dragged along. Unless you saw it you have no idea how stifling that system was. They were trying to make a good impression of course but you can't hid that level of oppression. Just trying to buy something took half the day if you could find anything to buy. Then we visited in the 90's during Yeltsin's reign. The country was in chaos. There was no law and order and it was scary. It almost made you miss the KGB. At least under communism you were safe unless the government had a problem with you. Under Putin the law and order was back and the falling apart infrastructure was starting to become repaired. We couldn't believe it was the same country. Putin probably was a better leader when he first came in but the power of office has corrupted him. He's president of a country with 11 times zones. It's not an easy country to govern and I think that fact is what tends to make the leaders of Russia rule with a bit of an iron fist. It's a very big and very diverse country which can get away from you real quick if you don't grab the bull by the horns. Of course the Saudi Arabians are similar in a way. The main export is oil. You can be overthrown if you aren't thuggish. So you live well on the top and keep a boot on the throats of any potential problems. That being said you have a lot more freedom in Russia than you do in Saudi Arabia. We bitch about Putin and frankly him and Russia seem to be used as a red herring to divert the public's attention from the domestic criminals here and in Europe. Never mind my theft, look at what Putin is up to! At the end of the day Vladamir Putin probably just wants to live the good life and he probably uses us as a red herring for all his bullshit.

https://youtu.be/_aip_AtDxns

But I hear all this bitching about Putin and I just roll my eyes. I suppose people would rather have Zhironovsky run Russia. Most the countries on the planet are dictatorships. Hell, even in the west we are becoming fascists. Look at Brexit. The politicians are wiping their ass with the vote. No we are going to do what our corporate owners want not what the public votes for.

Zhironovsky has been around forever. He was the perennial fringe candidate against Yeltsin back in the 90s. Never got much of the vote even back then.

I'd call him the Russian Trump..... except the American Trump seems to have that territory claimed already.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

https://youtu.be/_aip_AtDxns

I suppose people would rather have Zhironovsky run Russia. Most the countries on the planet are dictatorships. Hell, even in the west we are becoming fascists. Look at Brexit. The politicians are wiping their ass with the vote. No we are going to do what our corporate owners want not what the public votes for.

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I must have missed the bit where the UK threatened Russia, our armed forces are now the smallest they have been since the early 1800s.

I'm not sure what your Brexit comment means but bear in mind it was a 52-48 vote and that there were massive lies told by the Yes campaign. Also old people were predominantly voting yes and and people under 40 No. You can run the stats that by the time it happens enough of the old people will have died that if you only count the votes of those still living the No's win.

Brexit was voted for by an alliance of rich media moguls, uneducated people, anarchists but mainly it was the old people that won it. The correlation with Trump is the number of people voting against their own self interests because they don't understand the world in which they live and old people voting for a time when their dick still worked and they didn't hear so many foreign voices on the bus.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FORD

Zhironovsky has been around forever. He was the perennial fringe candidate against Yeltsin back in the 90s. Never got much of the vote even back then.

I'd call him the Russian Trump..... except the American Trump seems to have that territory claimed already.

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Yup. He's pretty entertaining to watch. Hate to say it but we live in the age of celebrity. Celebrities get more attention than politicians. Celebrity is one major reason Trump won. That's the way it is in our popular culture. I think you are going to see more people seeking office mimicking Trump and political parties trying to find their own celebrity to run. The Democrats are toying with running The Rock for president. I think you are going to see a shift from identity politics to my celebrity can beat your celebrity. That's where it's going.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seshmeister

I must have missed the bit where the UK threatened Russia, our armed forces are now the smallest they have been since the early 1800s.

I'm not sure what your Brexit comment means but bear in mind it was a 52-48 vote and that there were massive lies told by the Yes campaign. Also old people were predominantly voting yes and and people under 40 No. You can run the stats that by the time it happens enough of the old people will have died that if you only count the votes of those still living the No's win.

Brexit was voted for by an alliance of rich media moguls, uneducated people, anarchists but mainly it was the old people that won it. The correlation with Trump is the number of people voting against their own self interests because they don't understand the world in which they live and old people voting for a time when their dick still worked and they didn't hear so many foreign voices on the bus.

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I just heard the Brits voted for leaving the European Union and the politicians are doing everything they can to not allow that to happen. So it seems like democracy is failing because the voters aren't getting what they voted for. From the Russian perspective the EU usurped the power of the countries who are members of it. Meaning unelected officials in Belgium have more authority and power than the elected officials in the individual countries. Russia is very nationalist. There is great suspicion of the EU there so Zheinovsky is going to take a shot at May because she's pro EU. What's funny is in many ways the conservative right in the US and the nationalist Russians have a lot in common.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

I just heard the Brits voted for leaving the European Union and the politicians are doing everything they can to not allow that to happen. So it seems like democracy is failing because the voters aren't getting what they voted for.

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It's not that the politicians are doing everything to prevent it happening, the problem is that no one thought it would happen and no one knows how to do it without wrecking our economy. As I said the people that voted for it were on the whole the least informed about what it would mean. There are also levels of Brexit ranging from pretending that the place that 60% of your trade is with doesn't exist and just backing out of the more federal aspects of membership at the other extreme. Given it was such a small majority reflecting the voters wishes would be to do the minimum. Personally I think it is vital that any deal that they make should go to a second vote but I don't think that's going to happen and the country has shot itself in the foot. I'm looking around for ways to get my family citizenship of another European country.

Back to the Guiliani approach to your constitution, does that not mean that you can go full Klingon with your leaders?

What is to stop Pence shooting President Goldfinger in the face,becoming president and then pardoning himself?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seshmeister

It's not that the politicians are doing everything to prevent it happening, the problem is that no one thought it would happen and no one knows how to do it without wrecking our economy. As I said the people that voted for it were on the whole the least informed about what it would mean. There are also levels of Brexit ranging from pretending that the place that 60% of your trade is with doesn't exist and just backing out of the more federal aspects of membership at the other extreme. Given it was such a small majority reflecting the voters wishes would be to do the minimum. Personally I think it is vital that any deal that they make should go to a second vote but I don't think that's going to happen and the country has shot itself in the foot. I'm looking around for ways to get my family citizenship of another European country.

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It was pretty funny when Merkel asked May what is your exit plan? May had no answer. If you analyze the EU in detail it benefits Germany the most. Oddly enough the EU accomplished more for Germany than tanks and troops did in WWII.

The advantage the UK has is they have the financial capitol and the Pound Sterling. The British Pound would become the reserve currency of Europe once the Euro goes and I think the Euro is toast. Britain just needs the manufacturing base Germany has to go along with it. It will take some time and of course you have to have leadership with vision and a public willing to cooperate and that seems to be the problem with the UK.

Jobs and a living wage really are the big overall problem everywhere. With automation and artificial intelligence becoming more of a reality we can replace a lot of people. We are going to have more people than jobs they can do. So what's the solution? Just pay a base living allowance? The problem with that is the politicians will use it to strong arm votes and control people. Finance is all about controlling the illusion. We could do a lot of things since we just make money from nothing. We can blow trillions on war or we can use that to make the domestic system better. People seem to like war more and you see everyone knocking themselves out to make what a few people can just make on a computer terminal with nothing backing it at all. It's all psychology when you get down to the brass tacks. Mind control is the ultimate asset.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

The advantage the UK has is they have the financial capitol and the Pound Sterling. The British Pound would become the reserve currency of Europe once the Euro goes and I think the Euro is toast. Britain just needs the manufacturing base Germany has to go along with it. It will take some time and of course you have to have leadership with vision and a public willing to cooperate and that seems to be the problem with the UK.

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We have a particularly poor crop of politicians at the moment. At least 50% of the representatives of the two main parties think/know that their leader is shit. There is a danger that London could lose the financial capital status, it's already losing a lot of EU regulator jobs. What people didn't realise that a lot of regulations and EU bureaucracy is based here.

A typical scenario is that the headquarters of drugs regulation for the 28 EU countries, the EMA, is based in London. That makes London a good place for big Pharma to have it's European base. That HQ is now being moved to Amsterdam losing a ton of good jobs. All the big pharma lobbyists will follow as in time will their HQs. Of course the real shitty thing is that if you are a drug manufacturer in the UK you will still have to meet all the regulations that the EMU come out with because otherwise you go under as you cannot sell your drugs in Europe. You will now also probably have a trade tarrif to pay and of course the UK will no longer have any say at all in whatever regulations they come up with in Amsterdam. No one had thought this through including incidentally the EMA which are contracted to pay the lease on the HQ until 2039! Knock on affects all over eg 36 000 scientists and regulators visit London each year to go to the EMA. Banking regulation has gone to Paris.

There are dozens of examples of shit like this - it's a fucking economic disaster.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

Jobs and a living wage really are the big overall problem everywhere. With automation and artificial intelligence becoming more of a reality we can replace a lot of people. We are going to have more people than jobs they can do. So what's the solution? Just pay a base living allowance? The problem with that is the politicians will use it to strong arm votes and control people. Finance is all about controlling the illusion. We could do a lot of things since we just make money from nothing. We can blow trillions on war or we can use that to make the domestic system better. People seem to like war more and you see everyone knocking themselves out to make what a few people can just make on a computer terminal with nothing backing it at all. It's all psychology when you get down to the brass tacks. Mind control is the ultimate asset.

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Yes.

To all of it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seshmeister

Back to the Guiliani approach to your constitution, does that not mean that you can go full Klingon with your leaders?

What is to stop Pence shooting President Goldfinger in the face,becoming president and then pardoning himself?

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Oh, he's definitely thinking about it.....

https://68.media.tumblr.com/798d68cc...t71ro1_500.gif

I would like to see an independent Scotland but I don't think joining the EU is any kind of independence. Scotland has some oil and gas assets. Those exports help. Also you can become a tax haven. Charge lower corporate taxes than let's say England if you are independent and play that game. You could also learn from the Swiss on the banking game. Manufacturing is going to go to places like India or be automated. But you are right. Being independent requires some creative strategic thinking and some self-discipline. You have to have the brains and will and stupid political leadership is like dropping anchor when you are trying to go somewhere.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FORD

Oh, he's definitely thinking about it.....

https://68.media.tumblr.com/798d68cc...t71ro1_500.gif

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Name the last time any big name politician ever went to jail for a crime. Hell. If they all start knocking each other off they just might be doing us a favor. You can't vote them out so just let them kill each other.

I think Gulianii is smoking a few too many bowls of good weed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nitro Express

I think Gulianii is smoking a few too many bowls of good weed.

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More concerning is he's doing all this stone cold sober...

I think I mentioned here before that Guiliani is suffering from a degenerative mental state, or is an "agent provocateur/false flag"...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nickdfresh

I think I mentioned here before that Guiliani is suffering from a degenerative mental state, or is an "agent provocateur/false flag"...

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I think Trump has Giuliani on his legal team simply to have him as a public spokesman able to make daily tv appearances and proffer the Trump bullshit extravaganza. Said extravaganza comprised of intentional misdirection, false equivalencies and whataboutery.

Trump certainly took notice of Giuliani's willingness to stick up for Trump during the nadir of his campaign after the grab 'em by the pussy tapes surfaced, and in the days between that and the general election (when virtually everybody - including Trump and his family - assumed Trump was going to lose) when party support for Trump was far less than what it was for any GOP candidate that late in the general election in my lifetime. Even far less than McCain in 2008 or Romney in 2012, when more than a few party players had a degree of certainty that their candidate would lose. Giuliani's support, along with his willingness (like Trump's) to make virtually any specious rationalization at any given moment, never wavered.

Trump expects loyalty for the privilege of being associated with the Trump name, regardless of if Trump himself does anything to earn that loyalty or not. Giuliani gives Trump the loyalty he requires unconditionally, thus Trump knew Giuliani could (and can) be counted on to do what Trump wants, regardless of how absurd it may seem. Giuliani, like Sarah Huckabee Sanders, will say ANYTHING.

Also, Rudy (like Christie) would like a shot at heading up the DOJ after Sessions leaves. Or maybe Secretary of State if Newt isn't already there by then.

Rudy may well be suffering from some sort of degenerative cognitive dissonance brought on by his advancing age, although to be fair, Rudy (like Trump) has had a long history of saying douchebaggy/untrue things and behaving in an assholish manner for a few decades now: let's not be so quick to blame these recent displays of behavior on withering dotage of the mind.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Terry

I think Trump has Giuliani on his legal team simply to have him as a public spokesman able to make daily tv appearances and proffer the Trump bullshit extravaganza. Said extravaganza comprised of intentional misdirection, false equivalencies and whataboutery.

Trump certainly took notice of Giuliani's willingness to stick up for Trump during the nadir of his campaign after the grab 'em by the pussy tapes surfaced, and in the days between that and the general election (when virtually everybody - including Trump and his family - assumed Trump was going to lose) when party support for Trump was far less than what it was for any GOP candidate that late in the general election in my lifetime. Even far less than McCain in 2008 or Romney in 2012, when more than a few party players had a degree of certainty that their candidate would lose. Giuliani's support, along with his willingness (like Trump's) to make virtually any specious rationalization at any given moment, never wavered.

Trump expects loyalty for the privilege of being associated with the Trump name, regardless of if Trump himself does anything to earn that loyalty or not. Giuliani gives Trump the loyalty he requires unconditionally, thus Trump knew Giuliani could (and can) be counted on to do what Trump wants, regardless of how absurd it may seem. Giuliani, like Sarah Huckabee Sanders, will say ANYTHING.

Also, Rudy (like Christie) would like a shot at heading up the DOJ after Sessions leaves. Or maybe Secretary of State if Newt isn't already there by then.

Rudy may well be suffering from some sort of degenerative cognitive dissonance brought on by his advancing age, although to be fair, Rudy (like Trump) has had a long history of saying douchebaggy/untrue things and behaving in an assholish manner for a few decades now: let's not be so quick to blame these recent displays of behavior on withering dotage of the mind.

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Good assessment. I don't think Rudy is helping Trump at all. He seems to be saying stuff just to bring attention to himself. Maybe Trump likes it because the focus can go on Rudy for his comments. Rudy is aging and has been treated for cancer. Who knows what that cancer treatment does to people. He seems a bit foggy and off. I don't think he's qualified to be attorney general. It's just more reality or unreality TV.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ZahZoo

More concerning is he's doing all this stone cold sober...

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I'm trying to figure out how Rudy Guliani is helping Trump. All I can think of is he's draws attention away from Trump by saying stupid shit. Well the whole federal government has become a joke so I guess it's par for the course. Rudy can just join the rest of the clowns in the circus.

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Originally Posted by Seshmeister

We have a particularly poor crop of politicians at the moment. At least 50% of the representatives of the two main parties think/know that their leader is shit. There is a danger that London could lose the financial capital status, it's already losing a lot of EU regulator jobs. What people didn't realise that a lot of regulations and EU bureaucracy is based here.

A typical scenario is that the headquarters of drugs regulation for the 28 EU countries, the EMA, is based in London. That makes London a good place for big Pharma to have it's European base. That HQ is now being moved to Amsterdam losing a ton of good jobs. All the big pharma lobbyists will follow as in time will their HQs. Of course the real shitty thing is that if you are a drug manufacturer in the UK you will still have to meet all the regulations that the EMU come out with because otherwise you go under as you cannot sell your drugs in Europe. You will now also probably have a trade tarrif to pay and of course the UK will no longer have any say at all in whatever regulations they come up with in Amsterdam. No one had thought this through including incidentally the EMA which are contracted to pay the lease on the HQ until 2039! Knock on affects all over eg 36 000 scientists and regulators visit London each year to go to the EMA. Banking regulation has gone to Paris.

There are dozens of examples of shit like this - it's a fucking economic disaster.

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The EU is win win for Germany because the Frankfort bank backs the Euro. They just cleverly expanded the Dutch Mark and used convenience to sell it. In the end the Germans have the printing press and they can eventually get the rest of Europe to default to them. Also notice Germany still has the industrial base and exports that other countries lost. It's like the Germans just waged a financial war and grabbed more loot than Hitler did with tanks and troops. I think long-term the UK is best served getting out of the EU and keeping the pound sterling but you have to keep your financial capital and you have to bring back your industrial base and without politicians with vision and a public willing to make short sacrifices for long-term gains it's difficult. The EU was a clever snow job the aristocracy of Europe made happen. What it really does is rob citizens of their votes and countries of their culture and identity. Everything becomes ran by an unelected board and the local politicians become show pieces. Really clever how they did it.