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Thread: Bush To FINALLY visit Viet Nam

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    Question Bush To FINALLY visit Viet Nam

    By DEB RIECHMANN, AP

    WASHINGTON (June 21) - President Bush opened the Oval Office on Tuesday to the highest-ranking official from communist Vietnam to visit since the end of the war that divided America and claimed the lives of more than 58,000 U.S. troops.



    Bush said he would visit Vietnam next year.

    The president and Prime Minister Phan Van Khai talked about the continuing search for American soldiers' remains to close what Bush called a ''sad chapter.'' But they focused their attention on Vietnam's desire to join the World Trade Organization as well as its human-rights record, which some lawmakers say remains tainted.

    ''The Vietnamese economy is growing quite substantially,'' said Bush, who announced plans to attend an Asia-Pacific economic summit next year in Hanoi. ''We talked about our desire for Vietnam to join the WTO. We talked about security issues and a mutual desire to coordinate in the war on terror.''

    The president also noted the Vietnam Religious Freedom Agreement, an accord signed in May that Bush said would make it easier for people to worship freely in Vietnam.

    Sen. Sam Brownback, R-Kan., and 44 other members of Congress sent a letter to Bush urging him to keep pressuring Vietnam to improve its human-rights record and noting that last year, for the first time, the State Department designated Vietnam a ''country of particular concern'' for violating religious freedom.




    Human Rights Watch says hundreds of dissidents have been jailed on criminal charges for advocating democratic reforms or using the Internet to disseminate proposals for human rights and religious freedom.

    In the House, Rep. Chris Smith, R-N.J., called Khai a ''master of deception'' and pledged to hold hearings in Congress between now and the summit in Hanoi to see if the agreement was being implemented. ''It won't take long to find out if this is a public-relations coup on the part of Khai or whether it's sincere,'' Smith said.

    White House press secretary Scott McClellan said Bush discussed the importance of moving forward on improving human rights and expanding religious freedom. ''Vietnam has taken some steps,'' McClellan said. ''We welcome those steps. There is more to do.''

    As the two leaders met, several hundred protesters across from the White House demonstrated against repressive conditions in the communist nation. The noisy protesters chanted and carried signs that said ''Stop Religious Repression'' and ''Vietnamese Communist Party = Nazi Party.''

    John Wheeler, who chaired the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund to build the memorial wall in Washington, expressed dismay at the demonstration. ''Vietnam is making real progress,'' said Wheeler, who graduated from West Point and served in the war in 1969 and 1970. ''This visit is an historic transition. Vietnam is becoming a friend and even a possible ally.''

    In addition to Khai, Vietnam's other top leaders include President Tran Duc Luong and Nong Duc Manh, the head of the ruling Communist Party.

    Officials with the Vietnam Veterans of America Foundation said they were encouraged by Khai's visit and trade and economic developments. In 1981, the group's founders became the first delegation of Vietnam veterans to visit after the war which took its toll on both nations: Nearly 60,000 American dead; nearly 224,000 South Vietnamese killed; 1.1 million communist fighters killed; and nearly 2 million civilians killed.

    During his weeklong trip to the United States, Khai visited The Boeing Co. plant south of Seattle and met with Microsoft Corp. Chairman Bill Gates in Redmond, Wash. Later this week, Khai is ringing the opening bell at the New York Stock Exchange - evidence of Vietnam's economic gains.

    In the 10 years since diplomatic ties were restored, the United States has become Vietnam's top trading partner. Last year, two-way trade was worth $6.4 billion.

    ''We have a population of 80 million people, which means a huge market for American businesses,'' Khai said.

    Khai and the Vietnamese delegation joined Commerce Secretary Carlos Gutierrez to witness the formal signing of a series of business deals, including a Vietnam Airlines agreement to buy four new jetliners, valued at $500 million, from Boeing.

    After talking with Bush, Khai was at the State Department to sign an agreement to cooperate on adoptions.

    He also met with Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld at the Pentagon. Military ties between the two countries have included periodic docking of U.S. warships in Vietnam, plans for U.S. military training of Vietnamese officers, intelligence sharing and cooperation on counterterrorism activities.
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    Hope he still has his flight suit from the USS Lincoln

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    I've been to Vietnam. Much like China was when I was there in 1980. It's still the same governmental mentality we fought against in the 1960's, but now they want to make money and our corporations want their cheap labor. I find it sad that we are going to forget all those people killed and the people tortured by the Vietmese just so a few rich corporate leaders can make some $$$$$$. The average American or Vietmese won't bennefit at all over any economic deal made. It just drives it home all those names on the Vietnam memorial died for nothing.

    You bet your ass there are human rights violations in Vietnam. We might as well take our business elsewhere and let them starve in their puke pond than give them access to our markets. We still need to say "Fuck You!" to Vietnam.
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    " Sure, NOW he wants to go" - National Guard Troops

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    " I'd like from hence forth be known as a Viet Nam Vet" - G.W. Bush

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    LOL!
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    Perhaps if he had gone like he was SUPPOSED TO back in the day, he might have gotten shot by some Viet Cong, and the U.S. would not be in the mess it is in today....

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    :p

    Are you kidding? He would never have gone in the jungle had he gone over there. He would have probably taken on some cushy position that allowed him to indulge in the herb and bourbon.
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    Originally posted by Rikk
    :p

    Are you kidding? He would never have gone in the jungle had he gone over there. He would have probably taken on some cushy position that allowed him to indulge in the herb and bourbon.
    Or been allowed to type stories from the barracks for "Stars & Stripes" like Algore did!

    "Military service
    Gore served as a field reporter in Vietnam for five months.
    Enlarge
    Gore served as a field reporter in Vietnam for five months.

    Gore served in the Army from August 1969 to May 1971. The chronology of his military service is as follows:

    * August 1969: Enlisted at the Newark, New Jersey recruiting office.
    * August to October 1969: 8 weeks of basic training at Fort Dix, New Jersey
    * Late October 1969 to December 1970: Fort Rucker, Alabama, on-the-job occupational training at the Army Flier newspaper.
    * January 1971 to May 1971: field reporter in Vietnam, part of the 20th Engineer Brigade, stationed primarily at Bien Hoa Air Base near Saigon.
    * May 24, 1971: Discharged, after granting of early discharge request, as part of general troop reductions.

    Gore stated many times that he opposed the Vietnam War, but chose to enlist anyway. Some observers have noted that Gore could have avoided Vietnam in a number of ways. Gore considered all these options, but said that his sense of civic duty compelled him to serve. Some have suggested that Gore already foresaw that military service might be advantageous in his future career in politics.

    During the 2000 presidential election, some conservatives accused Al Gore of insufficient military service, because he was "only" a journalist and spent only five months in Vietnam, which some sources have characterized as "less than half the standard 12 month Vietnam tour." Although this is true, Gore served in the Army only 75 fewer days than the standard two-year term. Gore was not shipped immediately to Vietnam after completing basic training, spending most of his term in Fort Rucker.

    Because Gore was a journalist, he was never exposed to front-line combat, and some allege that his famous father's influence helped him to obtain this position. However, others argue that any man who enlisted with a Harvard degree had a good chance of being assigned a support specialty rather than an infantry position.

    Once in Vietnam, some also allege that Gore received special treatment as a former Senator's son (Gore Sr. lost the 1970 election, and was no longer a Senator by the time Gore arrived in Vietnam). According to combat photographer H. Alan Leo, Gore was protected from dangerous situations at the request of Brigadier General Kenneth B. Cooper, the 20th Engineer Brigades Commander. Leo stated that Gore's trips into the field were safe, and that Gore "could have worn a tuxedo." These remarks seem to contradict Gore's public statements that he "walked through the elephant grass" and "was fired upon."

    For his part, Gore has stated that he knew Leo but rarely traveled with him in Vietnam, and that he never felt that he was being given special protection. On the other hand, Leo's testimony is that Cooper gave the orders before Gore arrived, so Gore would not know about them. The question of whether Leo frequently traveled with Gore or not still has not been conclusively answered."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Gore
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    So Gore didn't see the front lines, but at least he volunteered and signed up. Congratulations on making Junior look like even more of a pussy coward
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    Bush did sign up..ANG.

    Let's go down this path again. Talk about beating a dead horse!

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    Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
    Bush did sign up..ANG.

    Of course SIGNING up and SHOWING up are 2 completely different matters.....

    But hey, why split hairs where LIVES are on the line

    Your pathetic attempt to defend him and his record by deflecting to Gore's actually GOING OVER THERE is mindblowing....


    But then hey, the Viet Cong COULD have made it to our mainland, in which case the AWOL Bush would have come back to defend us!!!

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    Originally posted by Rikk
    :p

    Are you kidding? He would never have gone in the jungle had he gone over there. He would have probably taken on some cushy position that allowed him to indulge in the herb and bourbon.
    You mean like the 5 month rear area journalist assignment algore's father got him? Remember: the normal tour over there was 13 months. algore did five.

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    Originally posted by FORD
    So Gore didn't see the front lines, but at least he volunteered and signed up. Congratulations on making Junior look like even more of a pussy coward
    Your service?

    Lounge?


    Pussies.


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    Originally posted by BigBadBrian
    Your service?

    Lounge?


    Pussies.

    If I was a raving neocon warmonger demanding that others die for corporate profits and/or Zionist Likud expansionism, you would have a valid point.

    But since I am opposed to any and all wars that are not specifically for the defense of the United States of America, I don't ask others to do that which I would not do myself. Unlike most of the neocons on this board (yourself being an exception) and about 99% of the scumbags over at Free Republic and other Busheep sites.

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    Originally posted by FORD
    If I was a raving neocon warmonger demanding that others die for corporate profits and/or Zionist Likud expansionism, you would have a valid point.

    But since I am opposed to any and all wars that are not specifically for the defense of the United States of America, I don't ask others to do that which I would not do myself. Unlike most of the neocons on this board (yourself being an exception) and about 99% of the scumbags over at Free Republic and other Busheep sites.



    C'mon FORD, I was just messing with you. Don't get your panties in a bunch.

    Actually, all this military service crap concerning any political candidate pisses me the hell off. It should be off the table concerning a candidates qualifications. Being a vet, it didn't bother me in the least that Clinton had no military experience ( actually, I was active duty under Clinton). That's the way our nation is set up.

    Both sides need to knock this crap off. I WAS a member of two veteran's organizations and quit going to the meetings because all they ever did was bitch at each other. That and drink beer.


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    I registered for the draft in 1979 as required by law. It was at the US Post Office on either Pike or Pine St. downtown. I remember being handed something outside by someone telling me I could be a cont. objecter.

    Had I been drafted, I would have served as opposed to running and hiding.

    But as FORD stated, I too am opposed to all wars, ESPECIALLY this one we're in now.

    My grandfather served in the Pacific in WWII, my father in Nam.

    I'm not a pussy. I just hate the thought of killing someone who POSES NO THREAT TO ME, MINE, OR MY COUNTRY. [i.e. Iraqis]

    Flame away, Brie

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    Originally posted by LoungeMachine
    I registered for the draft in 1979 as required by law. It was at the US Post Office on either Pike or Pine St. downtown.
    Weird, I had no idea I was speaking to a fellow Seattleite.

    Beautiful weather we're having today, eh?

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    Lounge, how bout mixing in a job or atleast go the fuck outside once in a while. Sitting in front of your computer bitching about our great president simply ain't getting it done. You had your chance to vote. What the fuck happened to your here jim kerry. He got buried by one of the biggest margins in presidential history. He made an ass of himself, much like you do here on a regular basis with all your whining nonsense. thank you.
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    Originally posted by Guitar Shark
    Weird, I had no idea I was speaking to a fellow Seattleite.

    Beautiful weather we're having today, eh?
    Raining sideways, counselor

    Not quite the light show we had yesterday

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    Originally posted by doyousuckdick?
    Lounge, how bout mixing in a job or atleast go the fuck outside once in a while. Sitting in front of your computer bitching about our great president simply ain't getting it done. You had your chance to vote. What the fuck happened to your here jim kerry. He got buried by one of the biggest margins in presidential history. He made an ass of himself, much like you do here on a regular basis with all your whining nonsense. thank you.
    Joe Thunder returns

    What's this joey, your 6th alias?

    Still claiming to own this site? Ready for ANOTHER banning????

    Go back to posting to yourself on the Wall, fuckstump

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    Originally posted by doyousuckdick?
    Your new alias is quite revealing, joey.

    I guess you've decided to "come out" ??

    good for you. Just stay away from the kids this time, or your parole will be revoked again

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    Originally posted by LoungeMachine
    Your new alias is quite revealing, joey.

    I guess you've decided to "come out" ??

    good for you. Just stay away from the kids this time, or your parole will be revoked again
    Joe Thunder, he is what he eats.

    Dick.

    Pathetic fucking loser.
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    Originally posted by LoungeMachine
    I registered for the draft in 1979 as required by law. It was at the US Post Office on either Pike or Pine St. downtown. I remember being handed something outside by someone telling me I could be a cont. objecter.

    Had I been drafted, I would have served as opposed to running and hiding.

    But as FORD stated, I too am opposed to all wars, ESPECIALLY this one we're in now.

    My grandfather served in the Pacific in WWII, my father in Nam.

    I'm not a pussy. I just hate the thought of killing someone who POSES NO THREAT TO ME, MINE, OR MY COUNTRY. [i.e. Iraqis]

    Flame away, Brie
    No flames here. My tanks to fuel my flamethrowers are out of gas.

    Actually, I have no opposition to people who oppose the war. :eek:

    It's just their logic that spellbounds me sometimes.

    The entire issue revolves around the support of one man, not the issue itself.

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    Originally posted by BigBadBrian


    The entire issue revolves around the support of one man, not the issue itself.
    No it doesn't. While it's true that George Bush Jr is an arrogant fascist dumbass, the problem with Iraq is the treasonous criminal PNAC agenda, and the LIES which allowed the invasion to happen. Junior is the frontman for that crime, but he by no means takes all the blame for it.

    It is very much the ISSUE of invading a sovereign nation which presented NO threat to the United States of America.

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    haw haw. thou fools and curs. thine day of reckoning is almost at hand. huzzah.
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    "Many people argue that Vet-naam is a country still residing in an archaic communist place. Contrary to popular belief, their economy has advanced much. I myself will be staying in the luxery Hilton Hotel in beautiful downtown Hanoi."
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