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Thread: Warner Bros are a bunch of Corksuckers!

  1. #1
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    Warner Bros are a bunch of Corksuckers!

    So I have the US Fest VH concert on a dvd. I recently transferred it onto my pc since that's where I watch most of my stuff now. It's pro-shot but horrible quality. The same we've all seen 1,000 times over here & there. So I decide to sell my dvd to someone who doesn't have the full concert version. Not for much. $10 which includes packing & free shipping anywhere in the US. So I might clear $5 for it (maybe less after eBay & Paypal fees). So I'm not looking to make money, just get rid of it to another VH fan.

    THEN I GET THIS GEM EMAIL......


    eBay Listing Removed: Copyright Violation - Unauthorized Item

    You recently listed the following auction-style listing:

    Van Halen live dvd - US Festival 1983 - full concert

    The listing was removed because it violated eBay policy. We notified members who placed bids on the item that the listing has been canceled.

    The rights owner, Warner Music Group, notified eBay that this listing violates intellectual property rights. When eBay receives a report of this type of violation, we remove the listing to comply with the law.

    Only copyright owners can copy, distribute, perform, or publicly display their work. eBay doesn't allow sellers to list unauthorized copies of copyrighted works, even if they're unpublished. Unauthorized copies include (but aren't limited to) backup, pirated, duplicated, or bootlegged copies.

    Please be aware that any additional violations of this policy may result in the suspension of your account. eBay understands that you may be concerned about this situation.We encourage you to contact Warner Music Group directly if you have any questions.

    You can send an email to: auctionqueries@grayzone.com



    Alright Warner Bros...if we can't have this concert footage, then YOU release it! Sell it for $40 and make a gaggle of money. If this were an official release, I wouldn't be burning copies or anything illegal. Just makes me mad that they claim ownership of this yet won't release a quality version to us. Then if we try to share with others we get slammed.

    It's not like I had 10 listed for sale and am burning them as fast as I can sell them. Just selling the one copy I have that I got from eBay a few years ago. How do they know it's an "unauthorized" copy? CAUSE THEY REFUSE TO RELEASE IT!
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    Bunch of wankers!
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    I feel for ya Sadaist..

    They even tried to fuck with us (The DLR Army) but they can
    FUCK OFF ! Coz we are still here

    Warner Brothers

    Sadaist, this might make you feel better, it would have cost those wankers over 100 times more
    than $5 to arrange the legal order and paperwork to remove your listing...
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    I'd say to Warner Bros. by quoting one of their most famous movies "Go ahead! Make my day!"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panamark View Post
    I feel for ya Sadaist..

    They even tried to fuck with us (The DLR Army) but they can
    FUCK OFF ! Coz we are still here

    Warner Brothers

    Sadaist, this might make you feel better, it would have cost those wankers over 100 times more
    than $5 to arrange the legal order and paperwork to remove your listing...
    True. But I can't risk being shit canned from eBay since I sell a ton of other stuff on there. Oh well. Here's to hoping for them to release some stuff in the future.

  6. #6
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    i guess there isn't a "why you shouldn't buy bootlegs" thread here.

    if you want someone to have it, offer to give it away.
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    The funny thing is the Van Halen US Fest performance has already been released on Netflix under the title Van Halen Live Rarities...the cows have pretty much already left the barn far as this performance goes; probably the single most heavily bootlegged CVH appearance.

    twonabomber is right, though. Once money exchanges hands, it kicks it up to an actionable legal level. A one-on-one trade or "free exchange" that bypasses an auction site is the way to go about it (proper etiquette being that the person wanting the title offer, on the sly, to send a reasonable "shipping & handling / copying labor" fee if an actual trade isn't involved, just as a way of being polite and making an attempt to compensate for materials, time and postage).
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    Since it is considered a "bootleg", my question is how did it get out? It was pro shot with several cameras. What's the story, if any, on how this footage originally came out?

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    the US Festival aired on Showtime. can't remember if it was live or a week after.

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    The situation is utterly idiotic. A good segment of the audience is clamoring for the material, yet Time/Warner refuses to issue it. Yet if an individual does attempt to distribute some copies, they are slapped with a cease and desist injunction by the same company. Talk about having your cake and not eating it too. In the meantime, those thirsty for Van Halen product must be content to buy sneakers, guitar gizmos or even guitars themselves, made to EVH's personal specifications. The ultimate irony being the man himself has not used one to create anything worthwhile in over a decade (some would say longer).
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    I know I'll probably get flamed for this, but I don't blame WB for taking this action.

    Protecting the things you own is pretty straightforward, and in fact in this case could mean they dont want it out there, because they are getting ready to turn a profit from it. I doubt it, but that's besides the point.

    I could see trying to sell it through a forum, or CL, but come on, something as high profile as ebay, of course is going to draw a red card.



    But just to be clear, fuck WB anyway....
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post
    I could see trying to sell it through a forum
    that's not a real good idea. i'd say 90% of forum regulars know this stuff is out there for free, if some turd showed up out of the blue and his first post was "i have bootlegs for sale" he'd take a huge amount of shit.

    just give it away. what's Media Mail cost, 85 cents?

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    I produced and shot a video that i was transferring to dvd and selling on ebay. This was all professionally done and i paid about 700 bucks for the production involved. Anyway, the subject of the interview i did had been involved in other organizations of interest. When i sold it on Ebay, in my description i noted what organizations this person had been affiliated with. Sure enough, i got the same red flag messages from Ebay advising that one organization had copyright problems with it. I called up Ebay and explained to them that i owned the fucking interview and had produced the dvd. Just because i mention that a guy used to work for someone doesn't mean that the company can come back and say i am infringing. It was insane. I had to explain the shit to 3 different people before they seemed to get it.
    My point being, Ebay is the worst about trying to catch copyright infringement, even when there is none going on, so don't be surprised if you get fucked with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post
    I know I'll probably get flamed for this, but I don't blame WB for taking this action.

    Protecting the things you own is pretty straightforward, and in fact in this case could mean they dont want it out there, because they are getting ready to turn a profit from it. I doubt it, but that's besides the point.

    I could see trying to sell it through a forum, or CL, but come on, something as high profile as ebay, of course is going to draw a red card.



    But just to be clear, fuck WB anyway....
    Totally true. I saw some others listed between $75 - $95. Geez! I didn't really think much of it other than clearing out some old stuff. I'm actually mailing it to a guy that asked a question on it before it was pulled. He's sending me a new pack of guitar strings for it. Win/Win.

    I just wish that the quality versions of this would be released. I mean hell, it's been 26 years. Shit or get off the pot WB (and Eddie).

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    Quote Originally Posted by twonabomber View Post
    that's not a real good idea. i'd say 90% of forum regulars know this stuff is out there for free, if some turd showed up out of the blue and his first post was "i have bootlegs for sale" he'd take a huge amount of shit.

    just give it away. what's Media Mail cost, 85 cents?
    Thank you. It burns my ass when some dork will come along and say "I've got videos for sale, 15 bucks (and up) each-includes sleeve...". The truth is, these guys burn an inferior quality video (usually second or third generation that they have gotten elsewhere, therefore exploiting someone else's work) onto a Grade-Z disc, print up an embarrassingly inaccurate insert with questionable artwork and ship it via snail mail to unsuspecting folks that either do not realize the material is available at sites like jamtothis.com and others, or simply feel it is cheaper/less hassle than burning their own.
    Last edited by chefcraig; 04-05-2009 at 01:14 PM.

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    Guess I should clariy......

    Wasn't talking about some dork coming along and spamming a forum.

    I meant a forum you already belong to, have relationships with the posters, and send a PM saying, hey I've got this if anyone you know wants it. Barter? Pay it Forward? Pay what you think it's worth........

    Anybody in this thread actually consider me pro-annoying troll ??



    sheesh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post
    I know I'll probably get flamed for this, but I don't blame WB for taking this action.

    Protecting the things you own is pretty straightforward, and in fact in this case could mean they dont want it out there, because they are getting ready to turn a profit from it. I doubt it, but that's besides the point.
    and for this...isn't WB one of the labels that keeps making YouTube pull videos? a lot of those are from albums that are out of print. with storage as cheap as it is, and with a proven distribution system, NOTHING should be out of print.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sonrisa salvaje View Post
    My point being, Ebay is the worst about trying to catch copyright infringement, even when there is none going on, so don't be surprised if you get fucked with.
    Which was exactly my point.

    Like offering crack for sale in a doughnut shop, and then being surprised you're doing the perp walk 20 minutes later....


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    i only worded it that way to avoid a post like this. guess i fucked up!

    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post
    Guess I should clariy......

    Wasn't talking about some dork coming along and spamming a forum.

    I meant a forum you already belong to, have relationships with the posters, and send a PM saying, hey I've got this if anyone you know wants it. Barter? Pay it Forward? Pay what you think it's worth........

    Anybody in this thread actually consider me pro-annoying troll ??



    sheesh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by twonabomber View Post
    , NOTHING should be out of print.
    I beg to differ......


    Nine On A Ten Scale 1976
    Sammy Hagar 1977
    Musical Chairs 1977
    All Night Long 1978
    Street Machine 1979
    Danger Zone 1980
    Standing Hampton 1981
    Three Lock Box 1982
    VOA 1984
    Hagar Schon Aaronson Shrieve Through The Fire 1984
    Van Halen 5150 1986
    Sammy Hagar (solo) I Never Said Goodbye 1987
    Van Halen OU812 1988
    For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge 1991
    Balance 1995
    Sammy Hagar (solo) Marching To Mars 1997
    Sammy Hagar & The Waboritas Red Voodoo 1999
    Ten 13 2000
    Not 4 Sale 2002
    Livin' It Up! 2006
    Sammy Hagar (solo) Cosmic Universal Fashion 2008
    Chickenfoot TBC




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    point taken!

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    Quote Originally Posted by twonabomber View Post
    point taken!


    Farenheit 451 comes to mind when I read that discography....


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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post

    I meant a forum you already belong to, have relationships with the posters, and send a PM saying, hey I've got this if anyone you know wants it. Barter? Pay it Forward? Pay what you think it's worth........


    Agreed, a tight-knit community of posters sharing stuff is the basic and essential lifeblood of the hardcore fan. I was speaking more of the exploitative jerks out there that pretty much act like carpetbaggers or snake oil salesmen, preying upon the uninformed fan that does not quite belong to the aforementioned community, and is therefore subject to being ripped off.
    Last edited by chefcraig; 04-05-2009 at 01:53 PM.

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    Since the US Fest was a pro shot video, intentionally made for TV distribution, I could see where WB has a legitimate claim on it - though I would think CBS - the parent company of Showtime might have a stake in it as well.

    What pisses me off is when record labels pull things off of YouTube that they should have absolutely nothing to do with. I.E. ABCKO records getting Rolling Stones videos from the 72 & 73 tours pulled off.

    Uh, the Stones left ABCKO in 1970. They have no claims to that footage.

    And some of these labels now... they put their own content on You Tube - which is fine, because it usually means you get decent picture and sound - but then they don't include the embedding code, which would allow the videos to be posted (for example) here at the Roth Army. What the fuck's up with that?? It's goddamn FLASH VIDEO, you idiots. Anybody who can install a Firefox plug in can download the content if they want to, and they aren't going to burn it on to a DVD and sell it, because it would LOOK LIKE SHIT. So put the code there, let the videos be embedded, and they can serve as the promotional tools they were intended to be, and you dumbfucks might actually sell some records.

    Ever think of that, corporate assholes??

    Oh yeah, back to WB..... Release the goddamn US Festival for real, if you say you own it. If Eddie won't help you remaster the thing for a proper release, call up Jimmy Page. He knows how to do that shit.
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    What exactly is a cork sucker?

    I'm just getting used to the fact we have a member with a gym sock fetish, and now this?


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    Quote Originally Posted by chefcraig View Post
    It burns my ass when some dork will come along and say "I've got videos for sale, 15 bucks (and up) each-includes sleeve...".

    OK. I'm starting to feel like a dickhole, so I just want to clarify. I asked $10 for it to cover my costs, free shipping which 1st class mail woulda been about $2, padded mailer $2, eBay fees about .90 cents, Paypal fees another .75 cents, dvd case $1....so I'm in it for around $7 - $8. Wasn't looking to make any profit or spice it up with some crappy photoshop cover. Just get it to someone else who would enjoy it. And it's not a dvd I made, nor am I mass burning them or anything. Have one & handing off to the next CVH fan.

    I'm probably still a dickhole, just not in this case.


    Cost to ship bootleg VH dvd = $8
    Being called out on Roth Army = Priceless


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    Quote Originally Posted by sadaist View Post
    OK. I'm starting to feel like a dickhole, so I just want to clarify...
    Again, I am not referring to guys like yourself. I'm talking about people with little or no ties to a band or community, that suddenly appear out of nowhere in order to make a quick buck or two by exploitation. They can be individuals or well coordinated, semi-legal companies like the outfit Classic Rock Legends (the company that sells all of those crummy GunsNRoses DVDs at Amazon). More often than not, the end product is slipshod and rarely worth viewing.

    Here is an example of such mediocre product. Some nitwit cobbled together bits of Live Without A Net and LRHRN, and sold it under the title of "Jump: Live". Obviously the band wasn't paid a nickel in the process, and it is nothing more than a fuzzy looking rip-off. This still is available in places, yet why anyone would purchase it is beyond me.

    Amazon.com: Jump: Live!: Van Halen: Movies & TV
    Last edited by chefcraig; 04-05-2009 at 05:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sadaist View Post
    I'm probably still a dickhole, just not in this case.


    No, you're still a dickhole.

    I have freely sent out tons of copies of the US Festival, for a lot less than the $8.00 you claim it is going to cost you. I don't give a fuck what you say, you will profit from something you don't own, and have no right to profit from.

    I am just amazed there are still people stupid enough to pay for this stuff, when there are plenty of us out there that will send it to them for free.
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    Quote Originally Posted by twonabomber View Post
    the US Festival aired on Showtime. can't remember if it was live or a week after.
    I think...THINK...that the entire concert was available via closed-circuit pay-per-view live as the actual festival was happening. If that was available through Showtime I can't remember.

    I know Showtime aired it shortly after the fact, but it was a 90 minute or so program, where each band was represented by two or three tunes of their performance that day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sadaist View Post
    Since it is considered a "bootleg", my question is how did it get out? It was pro shot with several cameras. What's the story, if any, on how this footage originally came out?
    The US Festival was aired both from start-to-finish on the dates of the festival and as an edited special shortly after. My guess is that it was recorded on VHS or Beta back then, and that's how it was leaked out.

    I bought a VHS copy in a small Mom and Pop record store back in 1992 for $30.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    I bought a VHS copy in a small Mom and Pop record store back in 1992 for $30.
    Back in the early 80's I worked for a string of new/used RECORD stores near the U-dub campus called Second Time Around.

    We had a section in the back called FAN CLUB DISCS where we kept all the boots.


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    I don't necessarily think throwing someone a few bucks for shipping is inappropriate.

    Have went on sites that were designed as trade-only sites, seen titles I wanted yet had nothing on the sites wanted lists to trade with, and offered the site owner a reasonable production and shipping fee (usually less than ten bucks a title) in lieu of an actual trade.

    There ARE a fair amount of straight-up bootleg selling sites that charge a ridiculous amount for rare and out-of-print pirated stuff, though. However, there are a lot of cool people out there that will send out copies for nothing if one says they really want something. I guess I was just lucky enough to meet decent people who were willing to send me a few free copies to get me started...

    ...just kind of funny that anyone would have trouble getting the US Festival performance...hell, when I was heavy into trading, seems like everyone and their brother had a copy of it they were willing to send to me in order to sweeten the deal on a trade; "and I'll also throw in a free copy of the US Festival, dude!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post
    Back in the early 80's I worked for a string of new/used RECORD stores near the U-dub campus called Second Time Around.

    We had a section in the back called FAN CLUB DISCS where we kept all the boots.


    I remember there was one small (rumored to be Mob owned and run) shop in my area in the early 1980s that wasn't a chain store, and the dude who owned it always had it stocked with imports and bootlegged vinyl. He kept it going until the early-to-mid 1990s. Last thing I got from him was a VH boot cd titled Dave's Back. He had the Steeler album when it first came out...titles by Accept before they broke in the states...Venom...shit the major record stores of the time wouldn't touch because they were too busy stocking 8 billion copies of Thriller on their shelves.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LoungeMachine View Post
    Back in the early 80's I worked for a string of new/used RECORD stores near the U-dub campus called Second Time Around.

    We had a section in the back called FAN CLUB DISCS where we kept all the boots.

    The biggest loss to music (aside from sound quality) since the advent of the CD has been the gradual disappearance of the independent record store. You could get bootlegs of Zeppelin, the Stones...hell just about anybody, and the content was usually superior to those artist's official live albums. You'd find import albums and singles from bands that would be the next big thing a year and a half later.

    Not to mention the neat paraphernalia available as well. I remember walking into a store called Sid's East on Fort Lauderdale beach in the late seventies, and finding a huge Pat Traverse coke mirror for sale, complete with line troughs cut into it. Imagine finding something like that in these days of staid political correctness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chefcraig View Post
    The biggest loss to music (aside from sound quality) since the advent of the CD has been the gradual disappearance of the independent record store. You could get bootlegs of Zeppelin, the Stones...hell just about anybody, and the content was usually superior to those artist's official live albums. You'd find import albums and singles from bands that would be the next big thing a year and a half later.

    Not to mention the neat paraphernalia available as well. I remember walking into a store called Sid's East on Fort Lauderdale beach in the late seventies, and finding a huge Pat Traverse coke mirror for sale, complete with line troughs cut into it. Imagine finding something like that in these days of staid political correctness.

    Or all those t-shirts in the early 80s in said stores with "Enjoy Cocaine", in the form of and a parody of the Coca-Cola logo.

    Thing that sucks, is these chain stores now try to carry it all; dvds, cds, video games.

    Virgin Megastore in Orlando does have a pretty vast collection of stuff, though. Not shabby for a corporate record store, I must say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    ...Virgin Megastore in Orlando does have a pretty vast collection of stuff, though. Not shabby for a corporate record store, I must say.
    Say goodbye to it as well...

    Virgin Megastores to close remaining U.S. stores

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    I have freely sent out tons of copies of the US Festival, for a lot less than the $8.00 you claim it is going to cost you. I don't give a fuck what you say, you will profit from something you don't own, and have no right to profit from.
    So what's worse for Warner Bros & the band? If I sell one bootleg dvd, or you sending out "tons" of copies free? We both in essence are taking profits from them. Not that I care in this case since they refuse to release the material.

    That was the whole reason Napster got targeted. Wasn't the one guy copying his buddies cassette anymore. Suddenly your one buddy was a million people.


    Look at this shit. Nearly $100 for the dvd here...
    Amazon.com: Used and New: Van Halen-"US Festival 83"DVD Rare Live

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    Quote Originally Posted by sadaist View Post
    Look at this shit. Nearly $100 for the dvd here...
    Amazon.com: Used and New: Van Halen-"US Festival 83"DVD Rare Live
    PT Barnum is laughing his fucking ass off right now.....



    Then again, who is the REAL douchebag there?

    The dickhole getting $94, or the moron shelling it out when all he had to do was send you a set of Ernie Ball Slinkys?

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    Unhappy Oh Boy!

    I also bought a copy of it on dvd from a mom and pop place back, I guess in maybe 99 or so. All I had at the time was freakin webtv so I couldn't download anything and even if I did have a computer I wouldn't have known where to look back then. I didn't get my first computer till 01. I think I paid like $20 for it and I'm glad I did. At the time I thought I had hit the motherload cause I had always looked for it but was told it was never released. I introduced my neice and nephew to it a few months ago. They love it.

    When I left the military and moved back home I missed out on those types of places cause I've yet to find one here. It's all big chains or retail places like Target and Walmart and we all know they don't have the really great stuff. I used to go walk around Planet Music for hours in Va Bch just looking cause they have or had a great selection of stuff. It wasn't a mom and pop place but they carried alot of older stuff and if you love classical or jazz that's the place to go.

    Maybe one day WB will release it in better quality than what we currently have.
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    Dunno what the fuss is about anyway, this stuff is all over Bittorrent these days. With minimal digging you could have it on your PC today.

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