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Thread: Obama: Legalize illegals

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    Obama: Legalize illegals

    Obama: Legalize illegals to get them health care

    September 18, 2009

    President Obama said this week that his health care plan won't cover illegal immigrants, but argued that's all the more reason to legalize them and ensure they eventually do get coverage.

    He also staked out a position that anyone in the country legally should be covered - a major break with the 1996 welfare reform bill, which limited most federal public assistance programs only to citizens and longtime immigrants.

    "Even though I do not believe we can extend coverage to those who are here illegally, I also don't simply believe we can simply ignore the fact that our immigration system is broken," Mr. Obama said Wednesday evening in a speech to the Congressional Hispanic Caucus Institute. "That's why I strongly support making sure folks who are here legally have access to affordable, quality health insurance under this plan, just like everybody else.

    Mr. Obama added, "If anything, this debate underscores the necessity of passing comprehensive immigration reform and resolving the issue of 12 million undocumented people living and working in this country once and for all."

    Republicans said that amounts to an amnesty, calling it a backdoor effort to make sure current illegal immigrants get health care.


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    More utter strawman shit from the Mooney Times...
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    Republicans said that amounts to an amnesty, calling it a backdoor effort to make sure current illegal immigrants get health care.
    For once, I agree with the Republican response on this. Offering a wide-ranging lateral amnesty appears remarkably short-sited, and only seems to have one outcome: Total fuckery most fowl of an already thorny and complicated immigration issue. This is as naive sounding and so out of touch with reality that it reads about as well suited to the situation as Nancy Reagan's equally dubious remark for people to "Just say no to drugs". As if wishing a situation resolved would make it so.

    What an astounding form of leadership in play here. Let's take the one issue that is dividing this country into all sorts of odd factions (heath care) and piggy-back it onto another (immigration) that holds the same possibility.

    I do question the timing of this story, however. Seeing how this article arrived on a Friday, I look forward to viewing this Sunday's political programs, to see how the White House attempts to explain what the President really meant.
    Last edited by chefcraig; 09-18-2009 at 12:16 PM.
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    Where does Obama come even close to suggesting that?

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    You solve the immigration problem by throwing the people that hire them into jail. And I mean hard ass break rocks all day, no television jail. Of course most of our politicians would end up in jail for having illegal alien housekeepers, nannies, and landscapers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    More utter strawman shit from the Mooney Times...
    You are seriously off your game lately.
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    Here's my solution. Up the patrol on the borders and anyone caught hiring illegal aliens will be drafted for mine and bomb clearing duty in Afganistahn and Iraq.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Obama: Legalize illegals to get them health care

    September 18, 2009

    President Obama said this week that his health care plan won't cover illegal immigrants, but argued that's all the more reason to legalize them and ensure they eventually do get coverage.

    He also staked out a position that anyone in the country legally should be covered - a major break with the 1996 welfare reform bill, which limited most federal public assistance programs only to citizens and longtime immigrants.

    "Even though I do not believe we can extend coverage to those who are here illegally, I also don't simply believe we can simply ignore the fact that our immigration system is broken," Mr. Obama said Wednesday evening in a speech to the Congressional Hispanic Caucus Institute. "That's why I strongly support making sure folks who are here legally have access to affordable, quality health insurance under this plan, just like everybody else.

    Mr. Obama added, "If anything, this debate underscores the necessity of passing comprehensive immigration reform and resolving the issue of 12 million undocumented people living and working in this country once and for all."

    Republicans said that amounts to an amnesty, calling it a backdoor effort to make sure current illegal immigrants get health care.


    Jesus replied with a story:

    “A Mexican man was traveling on a trip from New Orleans to Baton Rouge, and he was attacked by bandits. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him up, and left him half dead beside the road. By chance a priest came along. But when he saw the man lying there, he crossed to the other side of the road and passed him by. A Temple assistant walked over and looked at him lying there, but he also passed by on the other side. Then a born again Christian came along, and when he saw the man, he felt compassion for him. But going over to him, born again noticed that he had been born in a different country so he kicked him in the face and said "Fucketh you illegal cunt" and left him to die.

    “Now which of these three would you say was a neighbor to the man who was attacked by bandits?” Jesus asked. The man replied, “None of them” Then Jesus said, “Yes, now go and do the same because my followers can just talk shit about doing good on Sundays and the rest of the week do whatever the fuck they like, especially to those foreign cunts.”

    Amen
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    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Where does Obama come even close to suggesting that?
    You got me there, as it is more inferred, a supposition (allegedly) made by the "Republicans" mentioned in the article. Oddly enough, for one reason or another I have yet to find any quotes by Republican statesmen in accordance with the "quote". In fact, the only reference I've found with regard to amnesty comes from an obscure blogger with the West Palm Beach Examiner.

    Odder still, the slant of the article was also shown at another news source, which uses the same quotes to infer the same view:
    CNSNews.com - Obama: Immigration Reform Will Allow Illegal Immigrants to Become Legal and Get Health Care Coverage

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    Born again believers strive to be like Jesus everyday, which includes obeying the law...

    Illegals are illegal, but I would help anyone in need. Especially if they were beaten and left naked on the side of the road...



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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Illegals are illegal, but I would help anyone in need.
    Awesome. The article you posted says that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in this country in need of health care insurance. I'm sure they will appreciate your help.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Born again believers strive to be like Jesus everyday, which includes obeying the law...

    Illegals are illegal, but I would help anyone in need. Especially if they were beaten and left naked on the side of the road...


    Render Caeser what is Ceaser's and help the Samaritans.

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    My idea of a failed government is when the government doesn't enforce it's own laws and the leaders are allowed to break it's laws and face no prosecution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guitar Shark View Post
    Awesome. The article you posted says that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in this country in need of health care insurance.
    Yeah. And I need a new car, dammit. And some nachos. I'll PM you my address, Elvis.

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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    My idea of a failed government is when the government doesn't enforce it's own laws and the leaders are allowed to break it's laws and face no prosecution.
    Doesn't it therefore follow that in accordance with your statement, every government that has ever existed (to one extend or another) is thus a failure?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guitar Shark View Post
    Awesome. The article you posted says that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in this country in need of health care insurance. I'm sure they will appreciate your help.
    I won't be seeking your representation any time soon...



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    That's ok, I don't do criminal defense anyway...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Born again believers strive to be like Jesus everyday, which includes obeying the law...

    Illegals are illegal, but I would help anyone in need. Especially if they were beaten and left naked on the side of the road...


    Gregory, would ye pull an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath?
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    Hey, where ya been, FORD? I think this may be one of your longest stretches of absence here.

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    Ye need to check thy typing, Matthew. Ye hit the "F" key when ye should hath typed "L".

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    Oh, lor luck's sake. My apofogies.

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    uhh hu u uh uh uh uhuh hu hu hu hu hu huh

    That was cool



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    Quote Originally Posted by Jesus Christ View Post
    Gregory, would ye pull an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath?
    Of course, FORD with an impostrophe L



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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    My idea of a failed government is when the government doesn't enforce it's own laws and the leaders are allowed to break it's laws and face no prosecution.
    It occurred to me that the earlier response I gave you to this really didn't really do much more than ask a hypothetical question. I wasn't trying to be a wise ass or ridicule your post. I was however attempting to make you rethink it, and I believe the following addresses that a bit better.

    One of the widest held axioms in modern political thought is the idea that "Absolute power corrupts absolutely". Considering the easiest way for the common man to achieve even the illusion of power is through government, wouldn't that, combined with the notion of basic human frailty, suggest that any or all governments are capable of corruption?

    I mean, look at the founding fathers of the United States. You can not prove to me that amongst those noble men, at least some of them were in it for their own personal gain. Be it home and hearth, sovereignty of property and land or even (Oh, yeah...) the concept of individual freedom from repression, at least a couple of these geezers had to be thinking outside the box and inside their own best interests.

    Look, maybe it's just the way I've come to see things, but I personally take little stock in the implied dignity or apparently selfless service of any public servant. In that regard I may in fact be more cynical than anyone else around here. And maybe that is why I feel that your definition of what makes a failed government inaccurate, as by that yardstick, all of them are subject to failure.

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    "Even though I do not believe we can extend coverage to those who are here illegally, I also don't simply believe we can simply ignore the fact that our immigration system is broken," Mr. Obama said Wednesday evening in a speech to the Congressional Hispanic Caucus Institute. "That's why I strongly support making sure folks who are here legally have access to affordable, quality health insurance under this plan, just like everybody else.
    The past administration's answer was a 21st century equivalent to the Great Wall Of China. Build a bigger fence, like that'll work.

    I agree with Nitro, we are going after the wrong people....don't go after the people who only want a job to fed themselves or their families, go after the people who employ them.

    However, make it easier for the illegals to get proper documentation to come to this country and work here legally. It servers two purposes; 1) We know who's in our country and have a way of tracking them. 2) We could tax them like all legal workers are taxed now....meaning more money coming in.

    It would also stop the "Coyotes" who make money to smuggle these people over here and stop them from using them as "mules" for bringing drug into this country.
    Last edited by kwame k; 09-18-2009 at 08:43 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chefcraig View Post
    I mean, look at the founding fathers of the United States. You can not prove to me that amongst those noble men, at least some of them were in it for their own personal gain. Be it home and hearth, sovereignty of property and land or even (Oh, yeah...) the concept of individual freedom from repression, at least a couple of these geezers had to be thinking outside the box and inside their own best interests.

    Look, maybe it's just the way I've come to see things, but I personally take little stock in the implied dignity or apparently selfless service of any public servant. In that regard I may in fact be more cynical than anyone else around here. And maybe that is why I feel that your definition of what makes a failed government inaccurate, as by that yardstick, all of them are subject to failure.
    You know the minute this stuff comes up anyone that hasn't been brought up on this 'founding father' mythology laughs.

    A bunch of Europeans steal a country from the indigenous population, get fed up paying tax back home so set up their own country. They do this by wiping out the people that live there and build up it's wealth by using slaves from Africa.

    After economic problems in the 1930s and being forced into joining the second world war the leadership realize that war is good for the economy and then strive to fight wars for most of the next 60 years.

    That really doesn't sound selfless or defending freedom or stopping repression to anyone that hasn't been brainwashed.

    Cheers!

    Last edited by Seshmeister; 09-18-2009 at 09:19 PM.

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    Ahhh... The suspicious view from across the pond... but a very thought provoking post, I must say...



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    I'm a fan of America but don't get this founding father mythology.

    We know that there were a lot of cunts running Britain in the 1770s, fuck there were a lot of cunts running it in the 1880s too.

    I've always been interested in history but it's nuts to put these people up as a way to act now.

    The great Scottish hero Wallace, the guy in the Braveheart film, used to hang people if they didn't want to join his army. The greatest British statesman of all time who probably saved Europe from Nazism by not signing a peace treaty was happy to gas tribesmen and wasn't a fan of Jews as a general rule.

    The past was a different world so this nonsense of putting these guys on pedestals using their ancient pronouncements as a way to live our lives is nuts. We have moved on since those days and are generally much better morally than they could ever have dreamed of.

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    I don't know about that...

    I still respect and applaud the founding documents of this country, but the government seems as though they would like nothing more than to burn them in our faces...

    Part of our problem today is, the majority of american idiots are idiots and have no idea what's going on, and the rest that have the slightest idea of what's going on could care less...

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    There are idiots everywhere.

    The US constitution was the best in the world when it came out. The UK doesn't even have a constitution.

    Both countries would be better with one of the the new ones written for countries since WWII which take the best elements and improve on them. I'm not a professor of public law although I did study it years ago but to me the US constitution is too rigid, outdated and too difficult to change but the UK could do with the protections of one.

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    Sesh would almost have a point to make if the founders of the country weren't already rich prior to starting the revolution. They had everything to lose, and not money to gain.

    But it sounds cool to shit on history, in an ignorant punk sort of way.

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    It's rigid structure and that fact that it's very difficult to change are good attributes... if the Constitution could have been easily changed, it would have been destroyed years ago...

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    Or in a glass half full mode maybe improved?

    I think the major problem rather than the constitution per se though is the money thing and the barriers to new or independent parties.

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    None of that is even in the Constitution. Man, you're on a streak tonight.

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    That's very true...

    But the media (including most talk radio heroes) are mostly responsible for keeping the left-right paridigm alive...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    I don't know about that...
    I do. As great as the founding fathers were, they endorsed slavery, had the audacity to fractionally devalue fellow human beings (1/3?), and also didn't even consider white women intellectual equals worthy of the right to vote.
    All of these things are rightly considered barbaric today. They were by no means perfect.
    Hey Jackass! You need to [Register] or log in to view signatures on ROTHARMY.COM!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackflag View Post
    None of that is even in the Constitution. Man, you're on a streak tonight.
    ..and you should go streak tonight...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    ..and you should go streak tonight...
    Betting no one in his neighborhood wants to see that...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackflag View Post
    None of that is even in the Constitution. Man, you're on a streak tonight.
    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post

    I think the major problem rather than the constitution per se though is the money thing and the barriers to new or independent parties.
    What are you drinking tonight?

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