FLASH BACK !Pelosi: Health Reform Will Create 400,000 Jobs "Almost Immediately"

[Jagermeister]

Sorry I couldn't help myself.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid...mediately.html

[Nitro Express]

Shows what a lying sack of shit she is.

[FORD]

Well, in fairness, Pelosi (who is often a spineless jellyfish) was probably referring to the bill in the House at the time, which would have included the Public Option, and that would have created the jobs in the administration of that program.

Probably some jobs will be created under the corporate mandate model too, since there would obviously be more paperwork required if millions more were covered under that plan. But in usual corporatist fashion, those jobs will probably all be in India.

[Nitro Express]

It's all about real resources. It's easy to create government jobs by hiring more paper shufflers but that only creates a weak and impotent country. It's all about the control of resources, production, and having a trade surplus to keep the money in your country. Once you have that other countries invest in you because you are well managed.

This is the first problem. The second problem is avoiding wealth hoarding. The only way to avoid this is to have laws and regulations to keep the markets as fair as possible for everyone.

What caused the US to fail is we just let those with the money buy up the country and outsource it because they bought up the politicians. Not only did we allow domestic thugs to do this we allowed offshore thugs to do this. The citizens fell asleep and not only did the store get robbed, they are now finding themselves slaves to the robbers.

[FORD]

What caused the US to fail is that we HAD regulations to protect this country and keep it strong for half a centrury. And then it was systematically destroyed, beginning in 1981 when the BCE regained the White House.

[Nitro Express]

Exactly. The regulations that were put in place to avoid another great depression were removed and we got another depression. The Bush neocons did plenty of damage. Once they killed Kennedy it was downhill from there and now we are in economic ruin, have multiple wars going, and our constitutional rights are all pretty much gone. Now the government is just doing whatever they want regardless of what the rules are.

[Seshmeister]

Defence jobs and paying mercenaries in Iraq are government jobs too.

[Nitro Express]

We just need to go back to a real free market system where the government played referee and built the playing board. Let everyone chase their own happiness, make sure the crooks don't take things over, keep the playing field fair, let the winners win and the losers lose. The best thing the government does is build infrastructure and maintain it. I would rather have the government build the roads and maintain them with taxes than stop at a toll booth every five miles. It all went to shit hard when people thought the government owed them everything. Kennedy had it right when he said ask not what your country can do for you ask what you can do for your country. Meaning get active in the process and don't expect handouts.

[sadaist]

Well, in fairness, Pelosi (who is often a spineless jellyfish) was probably referring to the bill in the House at the time, which would have included the Public Option, and that would have created the jobs in the administration of that program.

Just what we need. More government jobs. With so many of us civilians out of work, who the fuck is going to keep paying their salaries?


And Nancy Pelosi is a piece of crap. How people continue to vote for her I will never understand.

[FORD]

The salaries for those employees would be paid the same way the employees who do the similar work for a corporate insurance company would be paid, from the money that comes in to the system.

Only difference is there wouldn't be some fucking pig CEO taking an 8 digit annual salary off the top.

[sadaist]

The salaries for those employees would be paid the same way the employees who do the similar work for a corporate insurance company would be paid, from the money that comes in to the system.

Only difference is there wouldn't be some fucking pig CEO taking an 8 digit annual salary off the top.

So it wouldn't be a gain of 400,000 jobs. It would be a switch from jobs in the private sector to jobs in the public sector. if those government workers would be doing the same thing, that means someone in the public will be losing their job to make room for the government employee who will now be doing the same thing.

No thanks. the government is already way too bloated. We need to be going the other way when it comes to govt size.

[Nitro Express]

The only real estate market booming in the US right now is around Washington DC. Why? All the new government jobs being created while the rest of the country implodes. If this keeps up the only employer will be the government and that is what those in power want. They hate people who are self-sufficient and have assets they don't control. Of course the politicians are just the administrators it's the banks that are the big winners in all of this. They plan to control everything using the government as their big stick.

[FORD]

So it wouldn't be a gain of 400,000 jobs. It would be a switch from jobs in the private sector to jobs in the public sector. if those government workers would be doing the same thing, that means someone in the public will be losing their job to make room for the government employee who will now be doing the same thing.

No thanks. the government is already way too bloated. We need to be going the other way when it comes to govt size.

Some jobs probably would move over, but under a real health care system, everyone would be covered, which means there would be more paperwork, so additional jobs would be created. More doctors & nurses would also be needed, so there's private sector job creation, along with whomever handles the admin stuff on that end, in the hospitals & clinics. Not to mention the ripple effects on the economy that would be caused by both more people with living wage employment AND more healthy people able to spend money on something other than ridiculously escalating health care costs.

It's a win-win for everybody - except the greedy pieces of shit who have been destroying this country for the last 30 years.

[sadaist]

.... the banks that are the big winners in all of this. They plan to control everything using the government as their big stick.

Just look at how they have totally taken control of every person in the US by using credit reports. They are the ones that setup & finance the 3 bureaus. They really have us over a barrel.

[standin]

It's all about real resources. It's easy to create government jobs by hiring more paper shufflers but that only creates a weak and impotent country. It's all about the control of resources, production, and having a trade surplus to keep the money in your country. Once you have that other countries invest in you because you are well managed.

This is the first problem. The second problem is avoiding wealth hoarding. The only way to avoid this is to have laws and regulations to keep the markets as fair as possible for everyone.

What caused the US to fail is we just let those with the money buy up the country and outsource it because they bought up the politicians. Not only did we allow domestic thugs to do this we allowed offshore thugs to do this. The citizens fell asleep and not only did the store get robbed, they are now finding themselves slaves to the robbers.

Do you mean not making a profit off idle money and not making a profit off a speculative future <> regardless if the outcome is good or bad? Isn’t that a rather iniquitous concept?

[Nitro Express]

Do you mean not making a profit off idle money and not making a profit off a speculative future <> regardless if the outcome is good or bad? Isn’t that a rather iniquitous concept?

What I mean by wealth hoarding is monopolies. Once you have monopolies you no longer have a free market because the market becomes rigged due to most the wealth falling into too few hands. You have to have some government regulation or a few fat cats own everything and the following abuses and price increases follow. Government regulation works as long as the public stay on top of their politicians but as soon as the public gets distracted and the politicians get bought off by the monopolies you have the situation the US is in now. No real regulation except for the monopolies to run their competition out of business or seize assets.

[standin]

Perhaps pithily put you are meaning, "Corruption is bad, m'kay"

[Nitro Express]

Pretty much. Corruption is like piss in a swimming pool. Everyone knows people (especially kids) piss in public swimming pools. A certain amount of piss goes unnoticed and doesn't do too much harm. It's when the ratio of piss to water increases where you start to get problems and too much becomes a major hazard. Or dirty engine oil. If you just continue to let it get gunked up the engine eventually becomes destroyed because of the corruption.

[standin]

hahaha. I am not sure about that analogy. But corruption is a part of the sociology of society. There are factors in the why of corruption. And I suppose, those factors could apply to peeing in a pool. hahaha.

[standin]

If any one of the corners of the fraud triangle are askew then fraud is likely to occur.

[Nitro Express]

You are going to have some fraud. People aren't perfect and that's to be expected. The resulting theft from it even has a business term. It's called leakage. In fact, I fired one guy because he was incompetent and the next guy I hired was stealing from me. One of my customers told me my employee was ripping me off and I said I know but he's an excellent manager and is costing me less than the incompetent dolt was. So you accept some piss.

I think anyone who runs their own business or is in management in the US will agree with me. It's extremely hard to find good employees right now. In fact, my brother in law is closing down half his businesses not that there is no demand to keep them open but he just can't find good employees. I know someone who closed down their restaurant for the same reason. Then I got out of the residential real estate business because I was tired of dealing with crappy tenants. People I know who have been in that business for 40 years say finding good tenants now is a huge problem they rarely had 25 years ago.

So from a business standpoint everyone is seeing a general decline in societies work ethic, intelligence, and ethics. Why would the government be any different? The more piss in the pool the more difficult it is to get things done, the more expensive things become and less enjoyable thing are. That's my observation.