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Thread: ron paul=awesome/kickass?

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    Ron Paul is the least corrupt guy in Congress, that much is true.
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    There are interviews floating around of lobbyists talking about how they don't even bother to try to get Ron Paul's support because they know he can't be swayed ... he votes his convictions.
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    I believe that.

    Ron deserves a platform at the convention.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    There are interviews floating around of lobbyists talking about how they don't even bother to try to get Ron Paul's support because they know he can't be swayed ... he votes his convictions.
    THIS /\ is why he is the only choice for me. With every other candidate out there on both sides over the last few decades the US people have come second behind big business. Don't get me wrong, big companies are an important part of the dynamic but all of US should come first and sadly we do not.
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    If somebody could say this who's views I didn't agree with, at least I could respect him.

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    I said ad nauseum.....that I can't get behind his deregulate everything and let God sort 'em out policy.
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    Government Somalia style?

    After seeing him in the debate and realising just how old he is it's a pointless argument anyway. Retirement age is 65 for a reason, it's absolutely crazy to vote someone into a 4 year post 10 years after they have passed the retirement age.

    He may be fit for 76 but he's still 76. What other professions would you be happy about an 80 year old doing for you?
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    That argument doesn't really resonate with me ... I support him for the ideas and philosophy, which is ageless...

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwame k View Post
    I said ad nauseum.....that I can't get behind his deregulate everything and let God sort 'em out policy.
    And Paul never said that...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    That argument doesn't really resonate with me ... I support him for the ideas and philosophy, which is ageless...
    Fair enough but at 31 what age are your grandparents? Have you seen them decline? It often happens pretty quickly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    And Paul never said that...
    That would be his healthcare policy if he could get it through.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Fair enough but at 31 what age are your grandparents? Have you seen them decline? It often happens pretty quickly.
    They're in their 70s, and I know what you mean, I've seen it happen to 1 (who died) and another who stopped living in the present when the former died. It's very sad.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    That would be his healthcare policy if he could get it through.
    I think his policy is best described as ... government can only make things less efficient. Without federal government and the bureaucracy, he feels that private charities, communities and local government can bridge the gap effectively. He is a practicing physician and believes that the people were better able to afford and attain care before the social programs were put in place, and that waste and inefficiency have made it much harder for people to get quality, affordable care.

    I have no idea if it's true, having not been around before those programs were enacted. I personally believe there should be some form of safety net for the elderly.

    I don't think Ron Paul believes that people in need should be abandoned, but rather that when government becomes the solution, and individuals become dependent on the state, that other, more reliable solutions are overlooked and ultimately not embraced, causing more problems than we could otherwise have had.

    There are plenty of examples of when he was practicing medicine in the 60s where he donated his own time and money to provide free care for others, and that the hospital he worked at did the same routinely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    And Paul never said that...
    You know what, E....if you can't keep up with the rest of the class, please don't comment

    I'd suggest using Google and type ron+paul+deregulation....but I fear that suggestion would confuse you

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    I personally believe there should be some form of safety net for the elderly.
    That's the bit that costs the most money.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    I think his policy is best described as ... government can only make things less efficient. Without federal government and the bureaucracy, he feels that private charities, communities and local government can bridge the gap effectively. He is a practicing physician and believes that the people were better able to afford and attain care before the social programs were put in place, and that waste and inefficiency have made it much harder for people to get quality, affordable care.

    I have no idea if it's true, having not been around before those programs were enacted. I personally believe there should be some form of safety net for the elderly.

    I don't think Ron Paul believes that people in need should be abandoned, but rather that when government becomes the solution, and individuals become dependent on the state, that other, more reliable solutions are overlooked and ultimately not embraced, causing more problems than we could otherwise have had.

    There are plenty of examples of when he was practicing medicine in the 60s where he donated his own time and money to provide free care for others, and that the hospital he worked at did the same routinely.
    Doc...come on, man...really?

    Are you that desperate, grasping at straws, that you'd throw common sense to the wind and believe..........or in a Lennon voice....."Imagine there's no government"

    We are a nation of laws....they stated that at the beginning of this whole Crazy Thing we call Love

    Truth be told...I only looked at your first paragraph

    You may or may not had a point after that......50/50
    Last edited by kwame k; 01-29-2012 at 12:55 AM.

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    I was explaining how I understood Paul's point of view, and if you'd read the other half, I went on to point out that I didn't agree with it.

    In any event, Paul has said more than a few times that he isn't going to push his ideology on the nation; He's pragmatic and would do what he could to safeguard our social systems and begin transitioning us away from government dependence.

    I personally like that philosophy. We can afford our social programs if we change our imperialistic philosophy and militarism -- which is exactly what he's saying he would do.

    Paul isn't campaigning on a platform of deregulation; He's campaigning on a platform that says we need to change our foreign engagements and get our own house back in order. Spend our resources here and not everywhere else. A lot of people get caught up on what he thinks would work well in theory and forget to look at what he's saying he would do in practice.

    A lot of people here included.

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    Ron Paul is a crusty old turd.
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    The reason that Obama has largely failed in his agenda is that a) he is an outsider and b) the US system is built to stop any radicalism.

    I don't see how Paul is going to get around that either even if he wins and then wins and then stays healthy.

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    I think the reason Obama has largely failed is a) he pre-emptively compromised all his bargaining power away, b) the republicans refused to work with him and c) he didn't fight them or take his case to the public hard enough to change the course of the country


    Combined with a host of other problems with him.

    How is Paul different? Well, the US President has mostly unilateral control over the military and foreign policy. He can start by making his largest impact there. On the domestic side, it depends on how much he can work with Democrats or Republicans on whatever the agenda is and whether either side will try to be as disruptive as they have been with Obama.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warham View Post
    Ron Paul is the least corrupt guy in Congress, that much is true.
    Based on________?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    That argument doesn't really resonate with me ... I support him for the ideas and philosophy, which is ageless...
    You see him through rose-colored glasses and selectively use arguments based on buzzwards while ignoring a good deal of his ideology is about privatizing everything and turning the United States into an anarchic plutocracy....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Based on________?
    He isn't targeted by lobbyists.

    http://www.libertariannews.org/2011/...i-paid-695282/

    If you look at the lists, it makes sense. Reid, Lincoln, and Schumer are the biggest turds in the Senate and receives the most money from lobbyist. They are all Democrats, too. How interesting! The House is similar.
    Last edited by Warham; 01-29-2012 at 06:59 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warham View Post
    He isn't targeted by lobbyists.
    ....
    They don't need too. He's their wet dream of gov't self-castration...

    Thanks for the "Libertarian" source, though. Do you have any WWII history done by National Socialists?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    You see him through rose-colored glasses and selectively use arguments based on buzzwards while ignoring a good deal of his ideology is about privatizing everything and turning the United States into an anarchic plutocracy....
    Presuming that were true (and it isn't; I've discussed multiple times why), how is that different than how any one else in here acts towards their own candidates? I see a lot of blind eyes being turned in this forum these days.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    They don't need too. He's their wet dream of gov't self-castration...
    Good point, I have no idea why I didn't see it earlier!

    Now it all makes sense -- they're all donating so heavily to his campaign because he's a natural fit for their business interests! The corporate owned media is giving him so much positive coverage, and TOTALLY not dismissing him whenever they speak, because they recognize what a boon he'll be to their respective industries! The ultra-wealthy and corporate magnates are flocking to him in droves because of how his philosophy will completely empower them!

    It's not because he can't be bought, it's because he doesn't need to be bought! They can totally count on someone they can't control!

    That MUST be why the young, the military and the "average" citizens are all staying away from him!

    :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    You see him through rose-colored glasses and selectively use arguments based on buzzwards while ignoring a good deal of his ideology is about privatizing everything and turning the United States into an anarchic plutocracy....

    I'll quote what I said less than 5 posts before yours in apparent pre-response to you...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    In any event, Paul has said more than a few times that he isn't going to push his ideology on the nation; He's pragmatic and would do what he could to safeguard our social systems and begin transitioning us away from government dependence.

    I personally like that philosophy. We can afford our social programs if we change our imperialistic philosophy and militarism -- which is exactly what he's saying he would do.

    Paul isn't campaigning on a platform of deregulation; He's campaigning on a platform that says we need to change our foreign engagements and get our own house back in order. Spend our resources here and not everywhere else. A lot of people get caught up on what he thinks would work well in theory and forget to look at what he's saying he would do in practice.

    A lot of people here included.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    They don't need too. He's their wet dream of gov't self-castration...

    Thanks for the "Libertarian" source, though. Do you have any WWII history done by National Socialists?
    Actually, that site got their information from another site, which is not libertarian.

    But the trail is easy enough to follow: Money > Power > Corruption.

    Ron Paul received $352 in two payments by lobbyists in two years (2009, 2010).

    This is partially why Obama sucks. He's been bought with money from Wall Street and other interests and crony capitalism rules the roost.
    Last edited by Warham; 01-29-2012 at 02:51 PM.

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    Ron might not have much of an influence right now on the political landscape, but I think it will grow in future years. He's being heard more now than he was four years ago and his message is getting out to more people. We will go over a cliff eventually because of the spending. The one thing that drives me nuts right now is Obama gutting Social Security for this payroll tax cut he's been pushing. Why doesn't he just lower the marginal rate on the middle class?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warham View Post
    Ron might not have much of an influence right now on the political landscape, but I think it will grow in future years. He's being heard more now than he was four years ago and his message is getting out to more people. We will go over a cliff eventually because of the spending. The one thing that drives me nuts right now is Obama gutting Social Security for this payroll tax cut he's been pushing. Why doesn't he just lower the marginal rate on the middle class?
    Obama is a huge liar. He has raided medicare and social security which were true socialist programs and his health care plan is nothing more than a insurance company monopoly with the government acting as the enforcer. That's not socialism at all, it's the government becoming the bitch of corporations instead of regulating them. So this guy sells himself as a socialist but the money isn't going to the people, it's going to corporations and a lot of that money has gone overseas. People need to wake up to the Obama scam. He even has that smirk on his face when he talks. I think he actually enjoys screwing people and thinks it's fun.

    I wouldn't count Ron Paul out. The media and the political parties try to ignore him but he's holding his own with Romney and Newt. If you read up on what he has to say he's not in the lap of the corporations at all. Many say he wants to deregulate and that would cause trouble but we really don't have any regulation at all now. They deregulated the banks already and it seems like most these agencies are just harassing the smaller businesses while the corporations get a free ride. He's all for bringing the banking regulation back he just wants to get rid of the already corrupt agencies that really don't do their job anyways.

    Members of the military are the biggest Ron Paul supporters and that's funny because he wants to really cut the defense budget. The reason is the people who serve in the military have been the ones who have been abused the most by the government. Most of us have to put up with more government intrusion and more taxes and less rights but they get sent off to get killed and maimed and then the government does all it can to hide the caskets coming home and then they put you on a list of being a potential terrorists. You get shitty pay while the contractors are living well around you. You see abuse in the system all over the place. Then there is no end in sight of all these wars while home crumbles. I can see why they are fed up.
    Last edited by Nitro Express; 01-29-2012 at 03:18 PM.
    Hey Jackass! You need to [Register] or log in to view signatures on ROTHARMY.COM!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    Presuming that were true (and it isn't; I've discussed multiple times why), how is that different than how any one else in here acts towards their own candidates? I see a lot of blind eyes being turned in this forum these days.
    And you never fail to mention so...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    Good point, I have no idea why I didn't see it earlier!

    Now it all makes sense -- they're all donating so heavily to his campaign because he's a natural fit for their business interests!....
    :P
    Maybe they value their money and don't want to waste it on the unelectable?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warham View Post
    Actually, that site got their information from another site, which is not libertarian.

    But the trail is easy enough to follow: Money > Power > Corruption.

    Ron Paul received $352 in two payments by lobbyists in two years (2009, 2010).

    This is partially why Obama sucks. He's been bought with money from Wall Street and other interests and crony capitalism rules the roost.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Love View Post
    Oh fucking, PUL--LEEEEZZZZEEEE!!!! Are you guys really this naive with the silly, selective numbers:

    Pro-Ron Paul super PAC spending $1.4 million in Florida
    Posted by Chris Cillizza at 05:22 PM ET, 01/23/201

    A Ron Paul super PAC is getting into the Florida fight and so is one for Newt Gingrich, Romney has hired Bachmann’s debate coach, Brown and Warren actually agree on something. Endorse Liberty, a PAC supporting Texas Rep. Ron Paul, says it will spend $1.4 million in radio and TV ad time in Florida, even though the candidate himself is basically skipping the winner-take-all state as part of his delegate-focused strategy.

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    Jan 23, 2012
    Pro-Paul super PAC pumps $1.4M into Florida ads
    By Catalina Camia, USA TODAY
    Updated 6d 3h ago

    A super PAC trying to boost Ron Paul's candidacy says it will spend $1.4 million on radio and TV ads ahead of the Florida primary.

    Endorse Liberty says its goal is to show the Texas congressman is the only GOP candidate who has been consistent in his views.

    "We believe that as Florida Republicans learn more about the men running for president, the more they'll come to realize that Ron Paul is the only candidate who shares their core values," the group said in a statement.

    Endorse Liberty is one of two political action committees trying to boost Paul. The Texas congressman has acknowledged that Florida will be a tough state for him, given its size, costly media markets and the fact that it will award all of its delegates to the winner of the Jan. 31 primary.

    Endorse Liberty garnered attention for its Web ad of featuring impostors posing as Mitt Romney, Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum. So far, the super PAC has spent more than $3.1 million in the campaign, according to records compiled by the non-partisan Center for Responsive Politics.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Maybe they value their money and don't want to waste it on the unelectable?
    I thought I read earlier in this very thread that he who gets the most/spends the most money wins the election. There's no such thing as electability if it's a money and media game, right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Oh fucking, PUL--LEEEEZZZZEEEE!!!! Are you guys really this naive with the silly, selective numbers:

    Pro-Ron Paul super PAC spending $1.4 million in Florida
    Posted by Chris Cillizza at 05:22 PM ET, 01/23/201

    A Ron Paul super PAC is getting into the Florida fight and so is one for Newt Gingrich, Romney has hired Bachmann’s debate coach, Brown and Warren actually agree on something. Endorse Liberty, a PAC supporting Texas Rep. Ron Paul, says it will spend $1.4 million in radio and TV ad time in Florida, even though the candidate himself is basically skipping the winner-take-all state as part of his delegate-focused strategy.
    This seems to bother you quite a bit...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Jan 23, 2012
    Pro-Paul super PAC pumps $1.4M into Florida ads
    By Catalina Camia, USA TODAY
    Updated 6d 3h ago

    A super PAC trying to boost Ron Paul's candidacy says it will spend $1.4 million on radio and TV ads ahead of the Florida primary.

    Endorse Liberty says its goal is to show the Texas congressman is the only GOP candidate who has been consistent in his views.

    "We believe that as Florida Republicans learn more about the men running for president, the more they'll come to realize that Ron Paul is the only candidate who shares their core values," the group said in a statement.

    Endorse Liberty is one of two political action committees trying to boost Paul. The Texas congressman has acknowledged that Florida will be a tough state for him, given its size, costly media markets and the fact that it will award all of its delegates to the winner of the Jan. 31 primary.

    Endorse Liberty garnered attention for its Web ad of featuring impostors posing as Mitt Romney, Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum. So far, the super PAC has spent more than $3.1 million in the campaign, according to records compiled by the non-partisan Center for Responsive Politics.
    ok? how does that change who donates to him or the previous video talking about how they don't even bother with him?

    You seem to really not like the idea of Paul getting his money from non-lobbyist sources.

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