VH is over for me

[Nitro Express]

Recent picture from the tool shed..wtf is wrong with this guy? Nonetheless, if you don't like VH 2012, go see the foot at a half sold out theater near you. I would take Dave in a wheelchair with a speech impediment and a touch of Alzheimer's over 99 percent of the "front-men" out there. If you don't like it, then why take the time to come here and talk shit. get a hobby dude.

Sam looks like his ass is burning from being ass fucked too much and hot sauce infused ass juice has seeped into the torn rectum tissue. Metal mouth must be his homo flavor of the week lover.

[Carmine]

I don't feel like starting a new thread on this issue, so posting it in this one will have to suffice. Here are the aspects of Dave that are getting criticized and I'd like to give you my two cents.

1) Dave's moves on stage. Off as far as the on-stage moving around goes, is the show really any less of a show without jumping splits off the drum-risers? I think Dave's being smart about things in that regard and I admire he's still able to do what he does up there. I can't do that stuff and I'm 26 years younger than he is. And if he wants to dance and slide on that linoleum floor or whatever it is, he can dance the night away all he wants. Perfectly cool, and screw anyone who criticizes him for THAT of all things. How many frontmen of any age still care to do stuff like that to entertain their fans, not many.

2a) Ad-libs, talking, etc. during songs. I'm cool with the ad-libs, as long as he's not actively upstaging Eddie. Early in the tour, he just kept rambling during the songs and he wasn't letting things breathe. It was annoying, especially when he kept talking over Eddie's solos. But he toned it down and found a happy medium. I thought he was outstanding in Greensboro. LOVED what he did during Everybody Wants Some. And the Dance The Night Away moment where he had the camera put on the little girl was priceless. Only Dave comes up with stuff like that. Only Dave cares enough about making each show a party amongst friends to do stuff like that.

2b) Forgetting the words to the songs. Well, he's always done that. Now some nights like Atlantic City it got to be excessive and wearing. He definitely was all over the place that night. They also shouldn't have done Hang 'em High in Boston if he had to literally read the lyrics off the drum riser. Now a couple screw-ups, whatever. People have theorized that he just loses his place easily and that sounds plausible to me. At the end of the day, it's not a huge deal. It's live music, he has the balls and the ego NOT to want the aid of a teleprompter, which I respect, and as an avid listener of all the old concert recordings, I'm just kinda used to it. I don't think this is an issue of not giving it his all, he just doesn't have a superior memory for lyrics.

3) Dave's vocal cords. The real elephant in the room. I'm concerned more than anything else. In 2007-08, his voice was great. Many people believe it's the best he has ever sounded, and that's saying a lot. His voice was powerful, strong, he was nailing all the notes, and given Eddie's drug/alcohol problems and Wolf's green-ness, he was the star, the alpha and omega of that tour. But it's obvious that something happened between 2008 and 2012. What could it be, anyone have any ideas? It's not like he did any touring in that four year time. I hate to see singers lose their voice like that, and I'm sure he's not happy about it either. I hope it's something correctable and that that's the reason for the postponement. But can you get back to where you were after surgery? Guys like Doc Rivers of the Celtics have had vocal cord surgery for all the shouting they have to do as a coach, yet I still don't think his voice sounds very good. Maybe it's just some kind of long-term infection that's taking forever to go away?

So to the OP, I'm sorry you're unhappy with the current tour. It's not perfect, but the clock isn't going to be turned back either. I still challenge you, however, to find me a legacy band that puts on a better facsimile of the glory days. As long as Eddie stays clean (and thank God he has this tour) there ain't many, if any. How do you not get chills when they do improvised jams such as the one during Unchained that they're doing now? How do you not see that no one, not even his son Wolf, can bring the fury out of Eddie the way Dave does? No band on earth can top that combustion, that magic when Dave and Ed are on the same stage. Even in its 2012 state, that magic still holds power over me, still makes me weak like a woman who you know is flawed, can make life miserable at times, but at the same time you just can't get her out of your head and you fall for her every single time she comes knocking on your door. That's Van Halen, the only band in the history of music that has cast a spell on me like that. As long as everyone's clean, as long as they're working their asses off and giving it everything they have, I don't see myself ever breaking free of that spell. VH is most definitely NOT over for me.

Yeah....what Lou said!

[vandeleur]

I don't feel like starting a new thread on this issue, so posting it in this one will have to suffice. Here are the aspects of Dave that are getting criticized and I'd like to give you my two cents.

1) Dave's moves on stage. Off as far as the on-stage moving around goes, is the show really any less of a show without jumping splits off the drum-risers? I think Dave's being smart about things in that regard and I admire he's still able to do what he does up there. I can't do that stuff and I'm 26 years younger than he is. And if he wants to dance and slide on that linoleum floor or whatever it is, he can dance the night away all he wants. Perfectly cool, and screw anyone who criticizes him for THAT of all things. How many frontmen of any age still care to do stuff like that to entertain their fans, not many.

2a) Ad-libs, talking, etc. during songs. I'm cool with the ad-libs, as long as he's not actively upstaging Eddie. Early in the tour, he just kept rambling during the songs and he wasn't letting things breathe. It was annoying, especially when he kept talking over Eddie's solos. But he toned it down and found a happy medium. I thought he was outstanding in Greensboro. LOVED what he did during Everybody Wants Some. And the Dance The Night Away moment where he had the camera put on the little girl was priceless. Only Dave comes up with stuff like that. Only Dave cares enough about making each show a party amongst friends to do stuff like that.

2b) Forgetting the words to the songs. Well, he's always done that. Now some nights like Atlantic City it got to be excessive and wearing. He definitely was all over the place that night. They also shouldn't have done Hang 'em High in Boston if he had to literally read the lyrics off the drum riser. Now a couple screw-ups, whatever. People have theorized that he just loses his place easily and that sounds plausible to me. At the end of the day, it's not a huge deal. It's live music, he has the balls and the ego NOT to want the aid of a teleprompter, which I respect, and as an avid listener of all the old concert recordings, I'm just kinda used to it. I don't think this is an issue of not giving it his all, he just doesn't have a superior memory for lyrics.

3) Dave's vocal cords. The real elephant in the room. I'm concerned more than anything else. In 2007-08, his voice was great. Many people believe it's the best he has ever sounded, and that's saying a lot. His voice was powerful, strong, he was nailing all the notes, and given Eddie's drug/alcohol problems and Wolf's green-ness, he was the star, the alpha and omega of that tour. But it's obvious that something happened between 2008 and 2012. What could it be, anyone have any ideas? It's not like he did any touring in that four year time. I hate to see singers lose their voice like that, and I'm sure he's not happy about it either. I hope it's something correctable and that that's the reason for the postponement. But can you get back to where you were after surgery? Guys like Doc Rivers of the Celtics have had vocal cord surgery for all the shouting they have to do as a coach, yet I still don't think his voice sounds very good. Maybe it's just some kind of long-term infection that's taking forever to go away?

So to the OP, I'm sorry you're unhappy with the current tour. It's not perfect, but the clock isn't going to be turned back either. I still challenge you, however, to find me a legacy band that puts on a better facsimile of the glory days. As long as Eddie stays clean (and thank God he has this tour) there ain't many, if any. How do you not get chills when they do improvised jams such as the one during Unchained that they're doing now? How do you not see that no one, not even his son Wolf, can bring the fury out of Eddie the way Dave does? No band on earth can top that combustion, that magic when Dave and Ed are on the same stage. Even in its 2012 state, that magic still holds power over me, still makes me weak like a woman who you know is flawed, can make life miserable at times, but at the same time you just can't get her out of your head and you fall for her every single time she comes knocking on your door. That's Van Halen, the only band in the history of music that has cast a spell on me like that. As long as everyone's clean, as long as they're working their asses off and giving it everything they have, I don't see myself ever breaking free of that spell. VH is most definitely NOT over for me.

great post

[sadaist]

1) Dave's moves on stage. Off as far as the on-stage moving around goes, is the show really any less of a show without jumping splits off the drum-risers? I think Dave's being smart about things in that regard and I admire he's still able to do what he does up there. I can't do that stuff and I'm 26 years younger than he is. And if he wants to dance and slide on that linoleum floor or whatever it is, he can dance the night away all he wants. Perfectly cool, and screw anyone who criticizes him for THAT of all things. How many frontmen of any age still care to do stuff like that to entertain their fans, not many.


.

I am one of the very few that saw Daves stint in Las Vegas / Ballys. Opening show...opening night. I gotta scan the stub to post here. Just happened to be in Vegas the week he started & had to see it.

His on stage dances were extremely similar to what he is doing now so it isn't really shocking me or standing out that much. Dave does what makes Dave happy. He just invites us for the ride along.

[Seshmeister]

3) Dave's vocal cords. The real elephant in the room. I'm concerned more than anything else. In 2007-08, his voice was great. Many people believe it's the best he has ever sounded, and that's saying a lot. His voice was powerful, strong, he was nailing all the notes, and given Eddie's drug/alcohol problems and Wolf's green-ness, he was the star, the alpha and omega of that tour. But it's obvious that something happened between 2008 and 2012. What could it be, anyone have any ideas? It's not like he did any touring in that four year time. I hate to see singers lose their voice like that, and I'm sure he's not happy about it either. I hope it's something correctable and that that's the reason for the postponement. But can you get back to where you were after surgery? Guys like Doc Rivers of the Celtics have had vocal cord surgery for all the shouting they have to do as a coach, yet I still don't think his voice sounds very good. Maybe it's just some kind of long-term infection that's taking forever to go away?

So to the OP, I'm sorry you're unhappy with the current tour. It's not perfect, but the clock isn't going to be turned back either. I still challenge you, however, to find me a legacy band that puts on a better facsimile of the glory days. As long as Eddie stays clean (and thank God he has this tour) there ain't many, if any. How do you not get chills when they do improvised jams such as the one during Unchained that they're doing now? How do you not see that no one, not even his son Wolf, can bring the fury out of Eddie the way Dave does? No band on earth can top that combustion, that magic when Dave and Ed are on the same stage. Even in its 2012 state, that magic still holds power over me, still makes me weak like a woman who you know is flawed, can make life miserable at times, but at the same time you just can't get her out of your head and you fall for her every single time she comes knocking on your door. That's Van Halen, the only band in the history of music that has cast a spell on me like that. As long as everyone's clean, as long as they're working their asses off and giving it everything they have, I don't see myself ever breaking free of that spell. VH is most definitely NOT over for me.

I know a lot can be done in the studio these days but if something did go wrong with his voice between tours, they did a hell of a job hiding it on the album which is his best studio performance in how many years? 18?

Also Lou to give your post even more credence I think you should share how many gigs in the last 2 tours you have been to, I'm guessing it's more than anyone else here(you nutter ).

[DavidLeeNatra]

I know a lot can be done in the studio these days but if something did go wrong with his voice between tours, they did a hell of a job hiding it on the album which is his best studio performance in how many years? 18?

Also Lou to give your post even more credence I think you should share how many gigs in the last 2 tours you have been to, I'm guessing it's more than anyone else here(you nutter ).

"it" happened between café wha? and the warm up gig at Henson's

[Jérôme Frenchise]

Wolfsbane: "I can't dance... I'm thinking..."

[SparkieD]

Wolfsbane are still mighty in my book.

You know how deep my love is for Wolfsbane, but come the fuck on, Dude. You have to admit that it is utterly hilarious that someone with that screen name (assuming he is referencing the band) can piss and moan that DLR isn't moving like he used to. Yes, Dave is not exactly like he used to be, but he's making it work a hell of a lot better than any other guy pushing 60 I can think of. He's still moving like a mofo and at least he cares about his appearance. At least he didn't become a drunken overweight slob and still croon wildly about getting it on with anyone who will let him.

[BumBahDeeDah]

The smile is wacky on youtube but never seems to be anything woth notocing in a negative way during a show.

[Angel]

The smile is wacky on youtube but never seems to be anything woth notocing in a negative way during a show.

That wacky smile makes me grin just thinking about it. I think it's incredible being able to witness somebody in their element.

Sent from my BlackBerry 8520 using Tapatalk

[ZahZoo]

And when Van Halen is Al, Ed and Wolfie...then what?

A VH instrumental album wouldn't be such a terrible thing...

[Jack68]

A VH instrumental album wouldn't be such a terrible thing...

Id buy it.Lottsa musical possibilities there.

[ELVIS]

I'd steal it off the net...

[ThrillsNSpills]

I'd steal it off the net...then piss and moan about it in every thread

fixed that for you

[ELVIS]

fixed that for you

You need to learn how to live with your glass half full and stop seeing only the negative aspects of your pitiful existence...

[chefcraig]

You know how deep my love is for Wolfsbane, but come the fuck on, Dude.

Completely off the subject, but speaking of Wolfsbane, what in hell ever happened to Wolfmother? That first album as a three piece kicked ass, after which they pretty much fell off of the surface of the planet entirely. Seriously, they sounded like the members of Black Sabbath and Led Zeppelin got together in 1967 or so as teenagers, downed a bunch of ludes and a couple of cases of Pabst Blue Ribbon, then decided to jam on the first thing that came into their addled brains in a very, very loud manner. I'd not heard anything as cool since listening to the second side of Black Flag's My War sometime in the mid-eighties.

[Yount]

I loved Lou's post, by the way!
But I hear you, Wolfsbane.
The ultimate VH days are behind them no doubt.
Gotta love 'em while you can.
Poor Dave, he set the bar so high (over the moon, not bad for a mighty mouse)
Let the old codger boogie around in his twilight years.
Dave, dude, you've made a difference to my attitude anyways.

[DLR'sCock]

Kick ass post Lou!!!

[jhale667]

"it" happened between café wha? and the warm up gig at Henson's

Nope, and I'm sure B would agree - Dave sounded great at the Henson gig, too.

[loucap81]

I know a lot can be done in the studio these days but if something did go wrong with his voice between tours, they did a hell of a job hiding it on the album which is his best studio performance in how many years? 18?

Also Lou to give your post even more credence I think you should share how many gigs in the last 2 tours you have been to, I'm guessing it's more than anyone else here(you nutter ).

13 gigs in 2007-08
7 gigs in 2012

Plus 2 DLR solo gigs in 1999 and 2001

[vandeleur]

13 gigs in 2007-08
7 gigs in 2012

Plus 2 DLR solo gigs in 1999 and 2001

Cant decide if I should congratulate you for your dedication to the cause or just think lucky bastard ...bit of both it is then

[DLR Bridge]

13 gigs in 2007-08
7 gigs in 2012

Plus 2 DLR solo gigs in 1999 and 2001

Holy crap! I gather you don't have any kids.

[Dave's PA Rental]

I'm just glad that Lou is back...

I refuse to give any further attention to this thread. Really? A thread complaining about Dave smiling and dancing? Really?

[sadaist]

A VH instrumental album wouldn't be such a terrible thing...

Meh. I don't know. I can see myself playing it like 1-2 times a month. NOT like ADKOT that's been on constant rotation for 3+months. I like maybe 1 instrumental mixed in between all the vocals. They need Dave just as Dave needs them.

[loucap81]

Find software that removes vocals from songs. Then listen to Van Halen III like that, and there's your instrumental album. Because basically that's what it was, an Ed solo project.

[ZahZoo]

I did do that with Nero burning software on III... greatly improved the whole record!!

[Cruiser]

great idea, what software can you get that does that...

[sadaist]

Find software that removes vocals from songs. Then listen to Van Halen III like that, and there's your instrumental album. Because basically that's what it was, an Ed solo project.

Aside from Cherone, the music on that album just didn't groove & flow. It seemed really choppy to me. Like if ADD had a sound.

[DLR Bridge]

It's too bad the music to Dirty Water Dog didn't get held in the "Save 4 Dave" cache. That riff is bad ass and has a nice Panama pounding to it in the verse.

[loucap81]

Totally agree. Objectively speaking, there were some good riffs on it. And I get that as an artist, you want to do different things. You want to play around with tones, you're always craving something new. I'll give it credit for at least trying to do something more than generic rock, which is the comfort zone that most Van Hagar songs settled into. But even if you judge it as an Ed solo album (let alone a Van Halen album), most of the songs were just jumbled messes, like a child incorrectly putting together a jigsaw puzzle. Ed can sure as hell write riffs and licks, but without a songwriter to collaborate with him, he has no idea what to do with them.

[DLR Bridge]

Word.

[nitroDave23]

It's fucking Diamond David Lee Roth for Christ's sake.....

He's always been like this, sure when he was younger it wasn't as toned down, and he would jump higher,and sprint around faster, but still, he's the same old goofy Dave we all love, with some age,experience,and like other have said, a second chance.Doesn't kick as high,or shuffle as fast,and maybe he is a little less than his prime. (Then again what artist from the 70's isn't different today by comparison?)

I bet if you could go back and ask the Dave of 1983 what he thinks of the Dave of 2012, he'd be happy as fuck that he's still alive, let alone performing.(and performing well might I add).

If I'm honest, sure- I suppose I could do without the dancing,he could be a little less campy,but I'm more than happy to just see him up there with Eddie,Alex,and Wolfie performing the songs that made him.The new album is fantastic,and this tour has been really great so far, dancing or not.

Dave's just enjoying the ride, and if he wants to wiggle his ass for the whole set, then so be it, as long as he and Eddie are happy and not tearing each others heads off, Dave could be waving his Vegas Flags around for every song for all I care.No complaints here, we have Dave back in Van Halen,and that's all we need.

Just happy to see Roth back on board and leading the way is all, just found it crazy that any fan of Dave would complain about the way he performs these days....at least he's still doing it!!

Roth On Guys.

[Diamondjimi]

The ultimate VH days are behind them no doubt.

Exactly. Can't think of a band who's been around for 30+ years who's "ultimate" days aren't behind them.

But there are quite a few who still (as =VH= do) "bring it"...

[SNIPER]

It's too bad the music to Dirty Water Dog didn't get held in the "Save 4 Dave" cache. That riff is bad ass and has a nice Panama pounding to it in the verse.

I like that tune the best on that album other then the Journey build up intro. I try to play that album every year or so but I have to shut it off mid way through One I Want.

[SNIPER]

Totally agree. Objectively speaking, there were some good riffs on it. And I get that as an artist, you want to do different things. You want to play around with tones, you're always craving something new. I'll give it credit for at least trying to do something more than generic rock, which is the comfort zone that most Van Hagar songs settled into. But even if you judge it as an Ed solo album (let alone a Van Halen album), most of the songs were just jumbled messes, like a child incorrectly putting together a jigsaw puzzle. Ed can sure as hell write riffs and licks, but without a songwriter to collaborate with him, he has no idea what to do with them.

A clear example would be Ballet Or The Bullet.

[SNIPER]

Aside from Cherone, the music on that album just didn't groove & flow. It seemed really choppy to me. Like if ADD had a sound.

I remember how I tried to push this album on everybody when it came out. I wanted to believe so badly that it kicked ass but when it was all said and done I didn't buy my BS anymore either.

[loucap81]

A clear example would be Ballet Or The Bullet.

That is EXACTLY what I had in mind. The opening riff is an attention-grabbing, crunchy, nasty piece of work that Dave could have done something well with. And then after that the song just kinda sprawls all over the place with a God-awful refrain.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

What in the hell am I reading....

[Terry]

About the only aspect of Roth's current live approach that raised my eyebrows when I saw the band last month was the choice he made to sing in that strained mid-register throughout the set, applying that range to songs that didn't always benefit from it (eg. Pretty Woman doesn't sound too hot when Dave decides to yell all the verses, especially when that is a tune he is still clearly capable of singing in the original recorded style without difficulty - I can understand him utilizing different vocal techniques to navigate verses that contained his high-pitched shrieks on the original recordings, since that part of his vocal arsenal is pretty much tapped out, but why yell lyrics on tunes that are still within his capabilities to simply sing? just makes it needlessly hard for him, and doesn't really sound too hot).

There are some other odds and ends in 2012 that aren't quite up to the standards Roth set in 2007-2008. Dave is frequently forgetting or just failing to sing verses throughout the set. This has been a longtime aspect of his live work, but it is a little bit of a letdown now because he was so focused and on-point 4 years ago far as that went. Honestly, the last tour was one where Dave exhibited such a high degree of preparation and concentration that really hadn't been on display in quite a while. His solo gigs in 2005 and 2006 were full of instances where Roth wasn't singing verses, and when he was singing he was often all over the place in terms of singing in a really low octave, then a really high octave, then back to a low octave within the same song which was originally sung in one range. It came across as if he were just bored with singing the tunes the way they were originally written and was trying to keep things interesting for himself, or he just couldn't be bothered. In 2007-2008, he buckled down and had his act wired tight. Like, honestly, with the condition Eddie was in 4 years ago, had Roth performed then like he is now THAT would have been a pretty weak display.

Matter of fact, the high point of 2007-2008, far as I was concerned, WAS Roth! Eddie wasn't up to snuff, Wolfgang was inaudible...Alex was on the money. This last time around, all of the Van Halens were charged up and fucking ready to go and Dave...just wasn't able to quite match them. Ain't referencing his physical stage presence or the relative lack of kung fu acrobatics. That aspect has been waning for years, as well it should.

All of the above may piss a few people off, and many may disagree or just aren't seeing what I did at the shows they attended this time around. Hey, that's cool. Have been on these boards more than a few years now, and anyone who knows me also (I hope) knows I have a deep, abiding appreciation for this band. However, that doesn't mean I'm gonna load up my opinions with bullshit as a way to go along and get along. Last time around, Eddie was a bit of a wreck, Wolfie was almost a nonentity, Alex served it up well and Roth was easily the strongest link. This time around, the Van Halens are fucking BRINGING it, and Roth isn't really up to par with them yet. I'm totally stoked about the new album and very grateful the band (such as it is) is still out there doing it: if someone told me in 2006 that by 2012 we would have seen two tours with Roth and a new album, I would have laughed at them. Yet it happened. Pretty fucking sweet overall. Still gotta keep the critical eye out. I wasn't someone who lowered my standards when Hagar joined the band in order to nod my head and say Van Halen was 100% as good as they could possibly be, and I'm not about to start now. The good news is that, unlike the Van Hagar years where the inclusion of Sammy was a hurdle the band wasn't gonna overcome no matter what, today's problems with Van Halen are easily fixable: Roth just needs to sing the tunes.

[Hardrock69]

OOOOOooooOOoOoOoooo.......

David Lee Roth is DANCING?

NONSTOP?


GOOD GAWD!

HEY EVERYBODY!

WOLFSBANE SAYS DAVE IS DANCING!!!!!

Gee....I did not know that......How SHOCKING!

O MI GAWD!


SHRIEK!!!


OH THE INHUMANITY OF IT ALL!!!!