An End To Authoritarianism and Plutocracy in the United States: It's Up to Us

[ELVIS]

the social side is night and day.

There should be no social side to the federal government...

there's still plenty of reasons to dislike both. just not always the same reason...

And there's no reason to trust either side as each tries to sell you on the social issues of the day while they're busy strong arming the rest of the world...

[Dr. Love]

you said the two party choice was no choice at all. i pointed out some of the differences. and, everything i said is applicable to the candidates. yes, you can point out similarities. sometimes significant. but their proposals will be different enough.

the social side is night and day. and the domestic investment side. yes, you'll say wiretapping. or gitmo. (i wouldn't quite say the wars, because i think obama was slower than he promised, but we did wind down combat operations in iraq, which i don't think would've gone the same way with president mccain. however, i never said they were 180 degree opposites. just that there's significant differences.

there's still plenty of reasons to dislike both. just not always the same reason...

Maybe I'm looking at it in terms of what is actually done versus proposed and talked about.

At the end of the day both parties at the federal level vote to do the same thing ... whatever the republicans want. :P

[Nitro Express]

there's a pretty stark difference between the parties at this point.

it doesn't mean they don't have effectively similar positions on a number of things.

but there are a fairly large gap on a lot of issues. health care. funding education or transportation or the social safety net. environmental protections. women's issues. how to best to get the budget under control.

it doesn't mean that either of the 2 parties should appeal to anybody. i certainly get frustrated by both at times. but they're not the same...

I think the parties are divided on social issues like abortion, gay marriage, and that sort of thing. They really are the same more than they differ. Republicans say they are for small government but under Republican rule the government has intruded into our lives more and more and has spent more and more. The Democrats say they are the party of peace, transparency, and liberal freedom. They support war, are very secret, and want to take your right to free speech away.

Both parties want to control us by taking our money, not giving us any say in what they do, they want to shut us up, and say they own everything and we are to do what we are told. This is where they are the same. How they sell themselves to the public with their lies is what differs.

[knuckleboner]

There should be no social side to the federal government...

so you oppose the defense of marriage act?

[knuckleboner]

Maybe I'm looking at it in terms of what is actually done versus proposed and talked about.

At the end of the day both parties at the federal level vote to do the same thing ... whatever the republicans want. :P

the recovery act was far from perfect, but it did have some significant federal investment that today's republicans never would've supported. and the house republicans keep voting to dramatically change medicare. if there was a republican senate and a republican president right now, the only thing stopping serious changes would be the possiblity of a democratic filibuster.

though, i would have to agree, the republicans, vote-our-way-or-we'll-burn-the-house-down policy has been...effective...

[FORD]

And those should be strictly state issues...

Transportation should be a state issue?

I think you and I both know that if Eisenhower had left the Interstate Highway system up to "the states", there probably wouldn't be one. Except for maybe I-5 on the West Coast. And maybe I-95 on the East Coast. Which would probably start at the Canadian border in Maine, and end at the Virginia state line.

And even the US highway system which preceded it wouldn't have existed. No Highway 99 in the west. No Route 66, for fucks sake!

Well if you ever plan to motor west..... fuck it, you can't get there from here, because us red state asshat governors don't believe in funding roads that lead to librul sodomite California!

[ELVIS]

I don't see your point...

[jhale667]

[ELVIS]

so you oppose the defense of marriage act?

of course...

I oppose any federally unconstitutional act...

The federal government needs to stay out of such things...

[ELVIS]

[FORD]

of course...

I oppose any federally unconstitutional act...

The federal government needs to stay out of such things...

I don't remember you objecting when the 5 BCE appointees on the Federal Supreme Court decided that Florida didn't have the right to count ballots (December 12,2000).

Or when the idiot who occupied the White House because of that decision decided he would declare war on someone who "tried to kill my daddy" (which, in reality he didn't), depsite the very clear language in the Constitution that spells out that only Congress can declare war.

Or when 4 of those same Supreme Court flunkies, and the extremely unqualified corporatist Opie looking shill (who replaced the pill popping dead racist Rehnquist) declared that corporations were "people" and that money was "speech" (Shittyzens United)

[Nitro Express]

We can thank Adolf Hitler for the interstate highway system. Eisenhower just made a cheap copy of the Autobahn. Like the internet it was built for military purposes, the public just get to enjoy the use of it.

[Nitro Express]

I don't remember you objecting when the 5 BCE appointees on the Federal Supreme Court decided that Florida didn't have the right to count ballots (December 12,2000).

Or when the idiot who occupied the White House because of that decision decided he would declare war on someone who "tried to kill my daddy" (which, in reality he didn't), depsite the very clear language in the Constitution that spells out that only Congress can declare war.



Or when 4 of those same Supreme Court flunkies, and the extremely unqualified corporatist Opie looking shill (who replaced the pill popping dead racist Rehnquist) declared that corporations were "people" and that money was "speech" (Shittyzens United)

I think Saddam was working for daddy and then daddy double crossed him. He did yell on the way to the gallows he had been double crossed. At least Saddam died like a man. A Bush if put in his situation would be a whimpering crybaby.

[FORD]

If Adolf had stopped after the Autobahn and the Volkswagen, he might have been remembered as one of the greatest innovators of the 20th Century. Unfortunately he had to throw in that whole "let's execute 12 million people in concentration camps and try to invade the whole fucking planet" thing.

[Nitro Express]

of course...

I oppose any federally unconstitutional act...

The federal government needs to stay out of such things...

Here's one for you. Mormon temple marriages are not legally recognized by the state. Civil marriages are not recognized by the LDS Church as far as counting towards their eternal becoming gods program. So what Mormons do is get civilly married by buying the license and having the proper paperwork notarized and then they get married in the Mormon temple. So essentially they are married twice to satisfy both state and religious authorities.

So lets just call the legal part of marriage a civil union and then people can add whatever else they want to it. That's what the Mormons do. If a church decides they don't want gay marriage then fine. But legally we could have civil unions to cover the whole custody, visitation rights, and who gets what crap.