As we approach the ten year anniversary on 2/20/03
Here is the UNCUT full video (20 mins) one long continuous shot from before and after the fire.
Your thoughts and reflections on one of the worst fires in American history.
As we approach the ten year anniversary on 2/20/03
Here is the UNCUT full video (20 mins) one long continuous shot from before and after the fire.
Your thoughts and reflections on one of the worst fires in American history.
I opened for JR's Great White a few months ago, and it still haunts him, and he feels terrible about it.
That's all I have to say.
Originally Posted by Kristy
My question is why did he bring "desert moon" out of retirement after promising to never play it live again. (That was the song that they were playing when the fire broke out.)I opened for JR's Great White a few months ago, and it still haunts him, and he feels terrible about it.
That's all I have to say.
He brought it out of retirement and he fell on his ass.
Last edited by WARF; 11-15-2012 at 05:25 PM.
I don't know....
But the guy shouldn't have even been onstage when this was taken. He was fresh out of the hospital.
He looks/sounds nothing like this now.
Eerie foreshadowing of the EXIT sign @ 4:14
He looks/sounds nothing like this now.
Fire codes exist for a reason. Why they lit those fireworks on that small stage in a club that packed is beyond me. Also if you are going to be using that stuff, have some people at the ready with some fire extinguishers ready to go. Sure the club owner used flammable packing foam instead of acoustical foam, the reality is, there are lots of flammable things in a building. It's kind of makes sense to not light fireworks off by wall coverings and other things that can burn.
It was just a bunch or careless mistakes that led up to a disaster. If you own a pubic building or a business, it's up to you to make sure it's safe for the people in it. That means staying on top of a lot of things including what people in your building are doing.
Pyrotechnics at a club in Perm Russian caused another 109 lives in 2009.
We also had a bad one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothenb...scothèque_fire
The heart is on the left. The blood is red.
What happened is the people at the back by the fire started to panic and rushed towards the door. It would be just like being in a crowd at a concert with everyone pushing on you. Just seeing all those people stuck in the doorway and nobody coming out, knowing the smoke and fumes are filling the building. I'm sure a lot of people just died being crushed by the crowd. Once a crowd loses it, there's nothing you can do and the way the fire was spreading there was no time. It was like having two burning christmas trees going and unless someone has fire extinguishers ready to go or the building has a sprinkler system, there is not much to stop it. The people at the back are going to panic and push towards the door and clog the exit pipe.
59 people dead at Club Santika in Thailand... the name of the party was called, "Goodbye Santika"
Moments before the fire...
Outside during the fire
Bodies piled up after the fire (Warning very graphic)
The most tragic part of this event was that there was three other doors to get out of, but it appears throughout history repeating itself the natural human instinct is to leave from the front door or the place you entered. The station has three other exits that mostly nobody else used located on both sides as well as an exit in the back by the stage. I am not sure if the back stage exit would have been usable given the circumstances surrounding this.
Every time this has come up over the last decade I think back to all the gigs I did in the 80s when our "pyro" guy's rig consisted of scoops of gun powder in coffee cans painted black with spliced electrical appliance wires hooked up to light switches bolted to a piece of plywood for a controller...(!) and I wonder how the fuck we lived through it.
And I think of Great White's guitarist, and how I probably would've been the dude running back in to save his favorite guitar, too...
The problem is the place was packed. Unless people head for all the exits in orderly fashion, you are stuck in the crowd. It's why they do fire drills in schools. So everyone knows where the fire exits are and they have a practiced routine to get everyone out. In a club you don't have that advantage. Also, the people there are drinking alcohol and some probably are on drugs. The reasoning isn't there.
I've noticed a fashion now to use CO2 effects, at the very large club gig I was at last week they had about 6 of them and it worked really well.
Seems to make sense to go for the complete opposite of a fire pyro.
I wondered if a fire broke out would they be able to actually use the stage effects to put it out?
I think the flash pots are safer than the fountain fireworks. The fountain fireworks were throwing sparks everywhere and that's how the foam caught fire. A little black powder in a tuna can is more controlled. You have to respect the stuff. Keith Moon learned that one over loading his bass drum with it.Every time this has come up over the last decade I think back to all the gigs I did in the 80s when our "pyro" guy's rig consisted of scoops of gun powder in coffee cans painted black with spliced electrical appliance wires hooked up to light switches bolted to a piece of plywood for a controller...(!) and I wonder how the fuck we lived through it.
And I think of Great White's guitarist, and how I probably would've been the dude running back in to save his favorite guitar, too...
How did that come up in conversation, did one of you mention it?I opened for JR's Great White a few months ago, and it still haunts him, and he feels terrible about it.
That's all I have to say.
I guess it's the elephant in the room but...
Pretty cool. Beats dry ice in a bucket of water.
You will get a lot of thanks clicks on this from people who did quite a lot of gigs back in the day.Every time this has come up over the last decade I think back to all the gigs I did in the 80s when our "pyro" guy's rig consisted of scoops of gun powder in coffee cans painted black with spliced electrical appliance wires hooked up to light switches bolted to a piece of plywood for a controller...(!) and I wonder how the fuck we lived through it.
And I think of Great White's guitarist, and how I probably would've been the dude running back in to save his favorite guitar, too...
The only thing is I would be a lot more forgiving if Great White and their tour manager were 20 year old kids, they really should have known much better by that point in their careers.
I feel for the people who have to live with their mistakes killed so many people. Nobody was out to hurt anyone. It just goes back to the old adage. Always respect fire. As soon as you get too careless with it, it will bite your ass.
Believe it or not the biggest killer caused by fire wasn't just the stampeding... it was caused by inward opening doors until the safety bar was permitted. The worst disaster ever in the UK was at the Victoria Hall in 1883 with hundreds of young kids all under 12 killed by stampeding.... at the end of the show they were giving free toys for the kids.... kids panicked that they weren't gonna get their free toy so they all ran down a staircase and at the bottom was just one door that opened inwards.... kids were piling on top of each other it was horrific!
I was at a concert up in front and the crowd started pushing so hard I couldn't breath. They actually stopped playing and told everyone to step back. A few years later when I was woking the barricade this is the number one thing they tell you to look for. That crowd can pack in so tight people can't breath. Large crowds of people are dangerous when the crowd starts pushing and shoving.
I worked the barricade for a couple rock shows Van Halen being one of them. People think it's great to be right at the front of the stage but you are busy. You are always watching that big sea of people seeing if anyone has a problem. There's a system for dealing with it. If it gets really bad, the lead singer usually stops the band from playing and tells the crowd to move back. You can see this in several bands happening. That lead singer can stop a riot or start one. Axle Rose being the type of asshole that starts them. The guy with the microphone has a lot of power over that crowd. Shit. Hitler did too if you watch that old Nazi footage.
Last edited by Nitro Express; 11-15-2012 at 07:38 PM.
I can't watch this....When I think of the number of small clubs I saw shows in, and that I could have been in the same situation.
Stay Frosty, muthas!
Yea. Just had back surgery. Should have never been up there. They replaced him. I like Marks playing alot. And a really great guy. Talked with him many times. He told me about opening for Guns at the Ritz. How crazy it was. He played through the same Marshalls as Slash that night. I think they were his. To bad this happened. Went to see them a few years after the fire. The original band, and they were great. They have a great catalog of music.
Last edited by 78/84 guy; 11-15-2012 at 08:57 PM.
No they don't...
They have a few good decent...
I would say if you took all their songs, they have one good album of material.
Security at a Van Halen Concert......
There's a new one.......
He did....
I mentioned that I was happy to see him so healthy and in good spirits considering...., and he started talking about the tragedy, his surgeries, the probs with GW, etc.....
He's just so humble, and really frail, and just fucking happy to be singing his songs and playing, that you couldn't help but feel for the guy. FUCK any of us in the same posotion might have crawled under a rock and just cashed the checks....
It's just so easy to judge........and it shouldn't be.
FUCK any of us in the same posotion might have crawled under a rock and just cashed the checks....
It's just so easy to judge........and it shouldn't be.
Checks? For Great White?
I really can't imagine they would be bringing in enough royalties from anything to live off of. The late 80's & early 90's they were making decent money but I would be very surprised if even Jack was ever very far over a million dollars net worth at any point. They just weren't ever that huge and even at their peak there were a lot of hands in that pie. What was leftover after everyone got paid & Uncle Sam got his? Jack a millionaire? Back when some real money was actually coming in you think they were partying or investing?
Fast forward to now and I just don't see him being able to live in anything but a camper or RV somewhere in the trees of Oregon off any checks coming in.
Without constant live shows he would go the way of Jani Lane. Some 2 buck chuck in a $29.99 motel room.
If I'm wrong I am looking forward to Lounge clarifying since he knows a helluva lot better about how it would be for these guys than I would.
“Great losses often bring only a numb shock. To truly plunge a victim into misery, you must overwhelm him with many small sufferings.”
Rest in peace to all the victims. Nightmare to even try to fathom what they went through those final moments. Horrific doesn't even begin....
These people were all of us and we are them. The victims are all exactly like ourselves and our best friends. We have all been to see these very bands in the same tiny clubs all over the country. We lost a lot of brothers & sisters that night.
I grew up in Warwick, one town over from West Warwick and the Station. West Warwick was always looked at by Warwick residents as a white trash version of Warwick. The only reason one went to West Warwick was because the town had a local DMV office and it was a shorter distance to go there than it was to go to Providence.
I'd only been to the Station several times to see shows. Most of the acts were either local cover/tribute bands or acts, like Great White, that were a decade past their heyday. The Station was a place to go if you didn't feel like dragging your ass up to Providence to go to The Living Room.
I didn't know anybody killed in the fire. I know a couple of people who did, but it's not a subject that's really talked about. I had already moved out-of-state a couple of years when the fire happened. My first thought when seeing the footage on CNN was that The Station was NOT a place where indoor pyro should have been used, period. Has little to do with being versed in indoor ignition burn rate propensities, and everything to do with common sense. The same common sense that one sees being ignored when people turn on their ovens in the middle of winter and open the oven doors in order to heat the house, or deep-fry a whole turkey on Thanksgiving in their kitchens rather than outside, and end up burning their houses down.
The Station fire is tragic in that it was totally preventable. Just a senseless waste.
Scramby eggs and bacon.
Well that's your opinion I guess. I have all their stuff for the most part. And don't dislike much of it. Can't Get There From Here, Let It Rock & Psycho City are all strong albums. Not to mention One Bitten & Twice Shy, their two biggest albums. Well thats almost as many good albums as the orignal Van Halen. So I put them up there with the great 80's band's. And Tesla. Most of the shit out of the 80's is pure rubbish. Great White had musical ability. And that comes first for me. I couldn't give a fuck about lyrics for the most part.
Dang. Jack is looking quite rough these days. I've always loved his voice. And like many other singers to their bands, it just ain't Great White without Jack. But damn dude.
Yea I have no interest in the new cd without him. He had a face lift a few years back. I think they did it on a tv show ? I think they sucked his checks in a little to much. He is a nice guy.I always would ask him how momma Russell is doing when I talked to him. She wrote for Metal Edge years ago. Kind of shy really. I'm sure he carries around alot of guilt from what happened that night. I couldn't imagine.
Terrible tragedy for all involved..............
1st thing I do these days at any show is figure out an exit plan....................
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