David Lee Roth people vs. Sammy Hagar people

[Seshmeister]

I think a lot of that was Mick Jones stepping into some of the space Roth left.

Compare a Mutt Lange produced Bryan Adams album to one he did with Def Leppard.

Sometimes producers are the most important influence on an album and remember the reason Roth left in the first place was the Van Halens being on a serious booze binge...

[cadaverdog]

Sometimes producers are the most important influence on an album and remember the reason Roth left in the first place was the Van Halens being on a serious booze binge...

I thought he admitted he quit to make a movie that never got made in an interview years ago. Sounds like Dave's been doublie dipping at the excuse bar.

[Seshmeister]

Link?

In his book he claimed it was the waiting with Templeman for them to turn up for weeks. This is suppported a bit by the fact that Templeman did EEAS but the movie thing may have been a factor as well as unhealthy sized egos and all sorts of other shit and resentments built up over the years.

[Sarge]

Awesome.
I live by the same creed.
Breasts,

[FORD]

Loathe as I am to talk about music on here
After hearing 5150 I have the same opinion of people who listened to further cd's as I have of people who touch wet paint because they read a do not touch wet paint sign.... Tough shit you were warned its your own daft fault .

I remember the day very well....

5150 and the Stones' "Dirty Work" were released on the same day in 1986. Bought them both on vinyl that day. It was devastating to be so disappointed by two of my favorite bands at the same time

[cadaverdog]

Link?

In his book he claimed it was the waiting with Templeman for them to turn up for weeks. This is suppported a bit by the fact that Templeman did EEAS but the movie thing may have been a factor as well as unhealthy sized egos and all sorts of other shit and resentments built up over the years.

If I looked hard enough at the hundreds of interviews Dave has done since that happened I might find the one admitting the movie was the reason he quit but then again I might not. I'm sure there was more to it but I doubt you'd get a straight answer out of Roth or the brothers if you asked them. Sammy would tell you what he thought happened but he wasn't there. Mikey might have an unbiased answer but I'm not sure who he has given it to. I think Valerie Bertinelli had a part in it too. I'm not saying she was the main cause but I've heard she encouraged Ed to "stand up to" Dave because he (or she or both) felt Dave was pushing Ed around. Maybe somebody else has the straight truth on what happened and can provide a link.

[Von Halen]

and remember the reason Roth left in the first place was the Van Halens being on a serious booze binge...

That couldn't be further from the truth.

Dave fucking left the band because CFTH sold a zillion copies, the videos were being played over and over on MTV, and Dave's head got even bigger than it already was. He also got the bright idea that it would be easy to turn a 3 minute video into a major motion picture. Fortunately, the studio that supposedly was going to back this horrendous idea, realized what a mistake it would have been, and did what Clichegar's Dad should have done, pulled out. Don't believe it was a bad idea? Go watch "No Holds Bar-B-Que", and report back to me.

Just because this is a DLR forum, doesn't mean you have to twist the truth and absolve Dave from his responsibility for fucking up the greatest band ever. It's no secret the guy is a colossal fucking douchebag. Just look at the trail of former friends, employees, and band members left in his wake. Try to find ANYONE that was ever once associated with this guy, that is still associated with him. I bet fucking Russell has already run away from home!

Damn Sesh. I can understand some of these other Dave suck dicks wallowing in the half truths of Dave, but I never expected that from you.

We can bash Clichegar for turning VH into a mostly sappy love song band that cared more about Top 40 hits than doing anything remotely original or groundbreaking, but had Dave never had the success of CFTH, I'm betting he'd never have left VH. Oh, and if you want to claim the VH brothers didn't want to work, and that's why Dave did CFTH, I ain't buying that bullshit either. How fucking much hard work was it for Dave to slap together a few cover songs? Shit, he didn't even do a full fucking albums worth of covers.

Now let's talk about more recent stuff in regards to this band. They have all been lazy as fuck since reuniting. Rehashed old songs for an album? LAZY! A horrible version of a live album? LAZY! Dave's vocal performances on the last couple of tours? LAZY! The production of the show on the last couple of tours? LAZY!

This fucking band has to be by far, the worst band in the world, to be a super fan of. I blame all those motherfuckers for that. Not just the brothers. Not just Dave. All of them. They fucking suck, and they can suck my fucking balls.

[cadaverdog]

This fucking band has to be by far, the worst band in the world, to be a super fan of. I blame all those motherfuckers for that. Not just the brothers. Not just Dave. All of them. They fucking suck, and they can suck my fucking balls.

Don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel.

[Terry]

That couldn't be further from the truth.

Dave fucking left the band because CFTH sold a zillion copies, the videos were being played over and over on MTV, and Dave's head got even bigger than it already was. He also got the bright idea that it would be easy to turn a 3 minute video into a major motion picture. Fortunately, the studio that supposedly was going to back this horrendous idea, realized what a mistake it would have been, and did what Clichegar's Dad should have done, pulled out. Don't believe it was a bad idea? Go watch "No Holds Bar-B-Que", and report back to me.

Just because this is a DLR forum, doesn't mean you have to twist the truth and absolve Dave from his responsibility for fucking up the greatest band ever. It's no secret the guy is a colossal fucking douchebag. Just look at the trail of former friends, employees, and band members left in his wake. Try to find ANYONE that was ever once associated with this guy, that is still associated with him. I bet fucking Russell has already run away from home!

Damn Sesh. I can understand some of these other Dave suck dicks wallowing in the half truths of Dave, but I never expected that from you.

We can bash Clichegar for turning VH into a mostly sappy love song band that cared more about Top 40 hits than doing anything remotely original or groundbreaking, but had Dave never had the success of CFTH, I'm betting he'd never have left VH. Oh, and if you want to claim the VH brothers didn't want to work, and that's why Dave did CFTH, I ain't buying that bullshit either. How fucking much hard work was it for Dave to slap together a few cover songs? Shit, he didn't even do a full fucking albums worth of covers.

Now let's talk about more recent stuff in regards to this band. They have all been lazy as fuck since reuniting. Rehashed old songs for an album? LAZY! A horrible version of a live album? LAZY! Dave's vocal performances on the last couple of tours? LAZY! The production of the show on the last couple of tours? LAZY!

This fucking band has to be by far, the worst band in the world, to be a super fan of. I blame all those motherfuckers for that. Not just the brothers. Not just Dave. All of them. They fucking suck, and they can suck my fucking balls.

I think Roth and the Van Halens had gotten on each other's nerves for years, were never particularly friendly to begin with and it just came to a head in early 1985. The Van Halens never thought much of Roth's vocal abilities from the day he started playing with them, and by the time 1985 rolled around doubtless Roth had a huge ego. Apparently Roth ALWAYS had a huge ego, even before the band got signed, but when CFTH got released and Roth was at his career peak in terms of public relevance I wouldn't be surprised to find out that Roth just plain felt he didn't need to deal with the Van Halens anymore: that the friction of working together/compromising with them wasn't worth the musical results anymore, and Roth probably felt he would be better off going on his own and being able to call all the shots.

Basically, Roth and the Van Halens couldn't work together anymore because they couldn't stand being in the same room with one another.

But Roth quit the band in 1985. There's no doubt about that.

To be a super fan of Van Halen since 1996 has been a masochistic undertaking, to say the least. And I'd have to agree that the output of the band since Roth rejoined in late 2006 has overall been underwhelming, from Ed not being in decent playing shape on the first reunion tour, to Roth's waning/shitty live vocal output from the 2012 up to today, to the live album released last year chock full of shitty lead vocals (the only upside being that clearly it wasn't touched up/re-recorded post-performance). ADKOT was about the best thing to result from Roth rejoining the band.

Basically, the band blew their best opportunity to reunite and come back strong, which was in 1996. They diddled away too many years between 1996 and 2006 at a point where time wasn't on their side and they didn't have it to waste. Ed took himself to the brink of death with drugs and alcohol, and Dave frittered away a decade waiting for the band to reunite. By the time they got their shit together, there wasn't much juice left in the tank: now, they're running on vapors. A lame way for them to end, but this band has been consistently fucking up for 20 years, so it won't be shocking when they finally go out with a whimper. The 2015 tour was the first tour I couldn't be bothered going to, because what Van Halen currently have left to offer live is no longer worth my time and money. Sad but true.

Luckily, the music they recorded from 1978 to 1984 still resonates like a motherfucker and delivers the goods the band no longer can.

[Sarge]

Don't believe it was a bad idea? Go watch "No Holds Bar-B-Que", and report back to me.
They fucking suck, and they can suck my fucking balls.

We used to have the CFTH movie script here.
It was ridiculous. There is no way that would have worked.
Lol at the sucking balls thing.

Breasts,

[VHscraps]

Spamulous Flatulous - or whatever the fuck he is called - is both wrong and right when he goes on about sales figures and Van Halen.

The big fib he tells is that Van Halen sold more as a band when he was in the band, and that is partially true ... without pointing out that this was because the Van Halen (Roth-era) back catalogue was racking up substantial sales after he joined Van Halen.

Now, in my opinion, this is not necessarily anything to do with Hagar and the band having a number 1 hit album with 5150 as much as it is to do with the fact that none of the Roth-era albums had previously been released on CD before 1985!!

Not even 1984, at the dawn of the CD-era, was originally released on CD. Vinyl and tape only. It might not have came out on CD until '86 ... they had already sold 8m copies of the fucker in 1984, and who knew that people would re-buy CDs of albums they bought on tape or vinyl just two years before.

So, yer, there was an increase in VH sales in the Hagar years - particularly in the back catalogue - and he counts all of that as 'when I was in the band'.

Van Halen had two big years before Hagar - 1979 and 1984. Those years they were top 10 on everything at the end of the year. You can look up the Billboard end of year archives on Google. It's all in there. They were HUGE in 1979. And the 1979 big year was because VH1, a slow burn from the year before, was selling in huge quantities in 1979 at the same time as VHII was sailing high on the charts.

WACF and FW were relative bombs - even though they were both platinum US albums. But they did close to zilch outside the US, in all probability. DD was a bigger album - it probably ranks fourth album of the Roth-era behind 1984, VH1, and VHII, in terms of sales (for what that's worth - I don't think sales equate to 'quality' either).

I'm just amazed that Hagar is still getting mileage out of his VH tenure. But, you have to give the guy his due, he has shown that he knows how to profit out of whatever circumstances he finds himself in. The guy's like one of those bugs that you just can't kill. Whatever you throw at him, he comes back at you again. I mean, FFS, the guy's career should have been in the toilet in 1975 when he was chucked out of a failing band - Montrose - but 30-40 years later he ends up one of the richest guys in rock'n'roll.

[Seshmeister]

We used to have the CFTH movie script here.

Breasts,

We still do...

[twonabomber]

I'm just amazed that Hagar is still getting mileage out of his VH tenure. But, you have to give the guy his due, he has shown that he knows how to profit out of whatever circumstances he finds himself in. The guy's like one of those bugs that you just can't kill. Whatever you throw at him, he comes back at you again. I mean, FFS, the guy's career should have been in the toilet in 1975 when he was chucked out of a failing band - Montrose - but 30-40 years later he ends up one of the richest guys in rock'n'roll.

Hagar's rich because of his business deals, and from riding Van Halen's coat tails. Not because of his solo albums.

[VHscraps]

Hagar's rich because of his business deals, and from riding Van Halen's coat tails. Not because of his solo albums.

This is absolutely true. If you haven't read his book, the autobiography, you might find it interesting in that respect - in what he reveals about his motivations. He's pretty honest and upfront about it, and it's maybe because his family background was dirt poor.

But even in the dog days of his early solo career, when he was in London in 1975 making an album, he details how he ended up buying up fine wines and shipping them home - but not for any future rock'n'roll excesses, or anything like that. But as investments. Someone introduced him to the market in fine wines, so he started collecting.

Same with his investing in tour travel companies, and fire protection companies in the 1980s ... he always seemed to act on the basis that the rock'n'roll thing wasn't ever going to come in with a big payday, or provide anything like the security he would need to retire one day. That's what I mean about Hagar's savviness. If he had never got into music, I am sure he would have done alright for himself, whatever he decided to do. Maybe not as well as he has done, but he's a businessman.

He made the most of his connections to Van Halen, and he out-manoeuvred them on the Cabo San Lucas business opportunity, which really ended up - with the spin-off Tequila, and selling that brand later for mega-millions - making him richer than anything else he has done.

All a missed opportunity for the others in the band, who let him buy them out in the belief that it was a waste of money.



His inclinations were more business. Theirs - Ed and Alex at the time, for sure - were more rock'n'roll, probably.

[twonabomber]

I wonder how much input Ed Leffler had in some of Hagar's business deals.