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Thread: The Westworld Thread

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    The Westworld Thread



    Anyone else caught up with HBO's new $100 million show yet?

    I liked the first 2 episodes, it looks great and has some good writing avoiding the obvious.

    I suspect it may not stand up to a huge amount of plot examination but we'll see how it goes...
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    Yeah I liked it , seemingly they have 5 seasons sketched out already although i don't see how they will drag it out that long.
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    Ghey.

    Another JJ Shitbrahams production.
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    Haven't seen it yet. I'll probably catch up with it during that annoying time between Thanksgiving and late February when there's nothing on TV but re-runs and Xmas specials (aside from the college bowl games and NFL playoffs, of course)
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    Quote Originally Posted by vandeleur View Post
    Yeah I liked it , seemingly they have 5 seasons sketched out already although i don't see how they will drag it out that long.
    They gotta be spending a ton of money per show. Someone mentioned the new guy in charge at HBO has been slashing budgets. Supposedly Vinyl cost too much to produce vs. the ratings it got, and they weren't willing to give it another season.

    First couple have been good.

    Not really enthused about Abrams being involved. He's getting to be like Ryan Seacrest...can't you let some other people take these jobs?
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    Quote Originally Posted by twonabomber View Post
    They gotta be spending a ton of money per show. Someone mentioned the new guy in charge at HBO has been slashing budgets. Supposedly Vinyl cost too much to produce vs. the ratings it got, and they weren't willing to give it another season.

    First couple have been good.

    Not really enthused about Abrams being involved. He's getting to be like Ryan Seacrest...can't you let some other people take these jobs?
    I kind of lost interest and drifted off after about 4 episodes of Vinyl.

    Who knows how much Abrahams is involved given all the movie stuff he does, I guess its like that thing when you see Spielberg is an exec producer it just shows there is some degree of quality control going on.

    5 Seasons seems a bit nuts but at least they have something mapped out I guess unlike Lost where I think they just made it up as they went hoping it would end up going somewhere.

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    Our Craziest ‘Westworld’ Theories

    https://theringer.com/our-craziest-w...3b0#.m8txq1g3g

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    Yeah we played guess the twist , my half arsed attempt was that they were all robots and it's a post human world and it's an experiment.

    Can any one remember the follow up movie future world? It wasn't a great movie but a canny plot having them replace world leaders. Maybe it's something like that.

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    Unless it's a really shit twist like the king under the dome book. Ok book but was worried if I fell asleep in bed and it dropped it would do some damage

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    I spy Yul Brynner. Episode 6.
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    Yeah defo a little Easter egg.
    The best episode so far but it was due one , am enjoying it I just was expecting something more.
    It's a lot of time and money for it to be yeah it's ok.

    Oh and my new theory on it either being non linear or concurrent timelines was sorting of backed last week with the thandie newton character having her injuries in the wrong order . Or not

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    No.One.Cares.


    Get a job, limey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristy View Post
    No.One.Cares.


    Get a job, limey.
    I have one I review tv shows

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    Yeah, well this TV is from AMERICA.


    Get your own.

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    Episode 7 was good although does throw everything open, is everyone a bot?

    It's maybe a bit unfair to criticise but like Game Of Thrones every so often you get a terrible CGI, anyone else notice the bit where he moves from one train carriage to another around 21 minutes in?

    They just got renewed for season 2 and have a plot outline for 5 seasons so it's hopefully not Lost whereby they try and make it up as they go and get in a terrible mess.

    At the moment it's difficult to see how this goes on for 5 seasons. Surely Anthony Hopkins isn't signed up for that long he's 78 FFS but if they kill him off...
    Last edited by Seshmeister; 11-16-2016 at 10:23 PM.

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    The best part was the black gal walking around naked for most of the episode!
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    Yeah I noticed the dodgy cgi.
    I thought the episode was great , didn't see the "surprise" coming or the fact they could kill humans.
    The Delores character seems to get hotter and hotter and the maeve character has to much bush I would want the smooth sporty model instead

    And Anthony Hopkins does a very good bad guy , he definitely channeled a bit of Hannibal near the end.

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    Showrunners Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy talk with THR about the big reveal(s) in the seventh episode of the HBO drama.

    [Warning: This story contains massive spoilers for the seventh episode of HBO's Westworld.]

    "Have you ever questioned the nature of your reality?"


















    It's a question posed throughout Westworld, as technicians and scientists analyze and diagnose the hosts. Indeed, it's a question often posed by Bernard Lowe (Jeffrey Wright), the park's main scientific mind second only to founder Robert Ford (Anthony Hopkins). It's not a question he often asks himself, however — and based on the ending of the show's seventh episode, it's certainly one he'll be asking himself a lot moving forward.

    In the episode, "Trompe L'Oeil," one of the most prevailing fan theories receives a resounding answer: Bernard is indeed a host. The reveal comes at the end of the hour, as Bernard and his colleague and former lover Theresa Cullen (Sidse Babett Knudsen) search Robert Ford's secret cottage, where he builds and houses his own off-the-grid hosts. They discover that Bernard is one such host, despite the fact that he has powerful personal memories and motivations, including grief over the loss of his young son Charlie. Making matters worse, Ford subsequently commands Bernard to murder Theresa, one of the biggest thorns in Ford's side. Bernard obliges, making this the show's first instance of a host killing a human being, at least as far as it's been presented thus far.

    For more on the massive moment, The Hollywood Reporter spoke with showrunners Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy about planning the Bernard reveal, the different kinds of horror at play in the scene, and their thoughts on telling a twisting-and-turning narrative in an age where online theorizing sometimes arrives at the answer before the show conveys the information.

    Read More
    'Westworld' Star Jeffrey Wright Goes Inside That Big Twist

    When did you land on the idea that Bernard is a host?

    Jonathan Nolan: That was always the intention with his character. We knew that Ford … as you come to know Anthony Hopkins' character in the show, you start to realize the depth of his misanthropy. He plays as a cipher for much of the season, and that's intentional. There's no actor more capable of portraying ambiguous moral standing than Tony onscreen. The idea that he would create his own collaborators felt natural to us and was baked into the story from the beginning. We only shared it with Jeffrey after the pilot. As with all of our actors, we only doled out information on a need-to-know basis. As much as possible, we tried to keep them in the present tense with the narrative. But for Jeffrey, for a number of reasons, it was important he understood the exact kind of creature he's portraying onscreen.

    How did he react to the news?

    Nolan: (Laughs.) Well, he had his own theories.

    Lisa Joy: He did have his own theories. I remember he was sitting on the couch, and he kind of took a moment: "Oh … oh!" And he kind of sat back: "Oh, I'm going to need to think about that and process it all." For me, it was hilarious. I have long been a superfan of Jeffrey Wright's, and it's been a dream getting to work with him. I remember when he first came on board, I was like, "Jeffrey, hold on, man. I know what you're capable of and you're going to do it all." It was such a pleasure to get to see him play this incredibly multifaceted role.

    What were your goals in crafting the reveal? The final scene of episode seven takes several twists and turns with multiple gut punches along the way.

    Nolan: The visual language of the show up to this point, and we established it in the pilot and onwards, has been for the most part neutral. It's not a show that's overstylized. We wanted the way the show was photographed and presented to be quite neutral — but favoring the hosts. A lot of the ways the shots are constructed, you see it most often, to this point, with Maeve (Thandie Newton) and Dolores (Evan Rachel Wood) and Teddy (James Marsden), we position the frame to allow the camera to favor them. That was a request for the [directors of photography] and the [camera] operators. What we wanted to explore is the idea in the series that … when you go back and look at the pilot, it's told almost exclusively from the perspective of the hosts. You imagine with Bernard that you're getting the [human perspective], but that pilot is really about hosts. Almost all of the major characters, most of the moments are glimpsed from their perspective. That's something that becomes very apparent in this episode. The perspective was something we talked about a lot. When Bernard walks into that room, when he walked into that cottage before in the previous episode, Ford appears seemingly from nowhere. When we come back, it's one shot that rakes across the room. Bernard walks into the room, there's no door, the camera pans back over, and Theresa brings up the door. That's a moment we talked about an awful lot, in terms of the horror of realizing that your reality has been carefully curated. Your day-to-day life, you may be missing important aspects of your reality that are hiding in plain sight. For Bernard, it's this horrifying moment that slips past: "There's a door here, and I haven't seen it." He takes it in stride because he's programmed to do so. And indeed, he takes in stride — at least at first — seeing a schematic of himself. We loved the idea of him sort of stumbling upon the place in which he was brought into the world without realizing the significance of the place. You have this wonderful dynamic between Sidse Babett Knudsen and Jeffrey, and then of course you have the wonderful Tony Hopkins who gets to wade into this scene in the middle of it and lay out a bit more of his philosophy of consciousness and whether humans are privileged in that regard or not.

    One of the promises of Westworld is that the hosts are on a journey of self-discovery. Certainly in the film, that idea manifests in the hosts physically harming the guests. It's felt that the show has been building to a similar moment, and now, here we are, albeit in an unexpected way: Bernard killing Theresa. Can you talk about using those two characters who were lovers up until very recently as the first figures involved in fulfilling the show's promise of a host killing a human?

    Joy: This example is one in which the host really didn't want to kill the human being. It's more proof of their subjugation. Bernard, as he self-identifies as a human, is a gentle and contemplative and loving soul. That kind of act of violence, especially against someone he cares about as he cares about Theresa, would be anathema to his character. The scene is terrible and devastating on a couple of fronts. One, of course, because of Theresa's death. The other is because of what it means for Bernard, who did not want to do that. There is blood on his hands that he would never want there now, and he realizes that he's a pawn in a game he can't control. There are two great victims in that scene, and for me, that really enhances the tragedy of it.



    Bernard feels so much distress and conflict as he starts piecing together the nature of his reality. And then it's a sudden shift into stone-cold robot mode. What were your conversations like with Jeffrey about how to play Bernard's reactions to this reveal?

    Nolan: We talked a lot about it. As Lisa said, Jeffrey is one of our all-time favorite actors. We were so excited when he said yes to this role. It's a slow burn with the role. As we said, he's a very gentle, thoughtful and pensive guy. And then, seven episodes in, there's this sudden flood of emotion, and then it's turned off again. It's a moment we've seen before. In interviews and to us, Evan has referred to it as the "acting Olympics," being asked to [turn it on and off]. The story we're telling, and what the actors have to do with their own process, is kind of a fascinating intersection. It's a presentation of emotion and the ability of the actor to turn it off. … It's easy to write these things, and extraordinarily difficult to portray them in front of the camera in front of Sidse Babett Kndusen and Tony Hopkins on a cold set, trying to get to that place. So we talked a lot about how authentic that emotion should feel. I think it's perfectly authentic, but coming from a character who has been built and designed to not be terribly emotional, but to be thoughtful and pensive. That's a challenge to begin with. Jeffrey has to turn it all off. It was incredible being with him on set, watching him shoot these scenes. We were incredibly excited about the place he was able to get himself to, and then pull himself out of. The cold, dead expression in his eyes as he murders Theresa and leaves was just chilling. It's a testament to his extraordinary talent.

    The question that's on Bernard's mind in this moment is also the question on the viewer's mind. What about his wife? What about Charlie? We even see a scene between Bernard and his son at the beginning of the episode. So, how do we reconcile this? If Bernard is a host, are his family members nothing more than expressions of his programming?

    Joy: It's interesting, because every host, as we've talked about before, has a cornerstone and backstory. That's what tethers them to the truth of their reality and their character. It seems that Bernard's story is his family. There are also practical things that happen. When he goes and calls his wife and they have this conversation. … It's funny, because the script is written in a way to mimic, in different words, in more naturalistic words, a conversation you would have with a grieving ex-wife. They mimic the diagnostics that the hosts are given down below. She asks him if he ever questions the nature of his reality, essentially, if he's been having dreams. Basically, while part of it is to reinforce Bernard's sense of his own backstory, part of it is also a way for Ford to check up on him and make sure he's not reaching.

    The host that's being created in this diagnostic facility — is it safe to say that this host is going to matter in the future?

    Nolan: (Pauses.) No, not in a literal sense. I think there's a suggestion here that Ford has been up to something, that he's slipped the leash of corporate control, and that his secrets permeate the park, in addition to Arnold's. We thought that gave things a creepy sense. We'll return to that much later down the road.

    It's more about the idea, then, than about the specific host?

    Nolan: Yes.

    Joy: It speaks to the kind of overarching thing that Ford is doing right now. He's making this great narrative. He's terraforming the park for parts of it. He's creating characters for it. It speaks to the idea that there's not a lot of oversight if he's creating some of these characters literally off the grid. There are not a lot of people who know exactly what he's planning for the park.

    Read More
    'Westworld': 10 Key Moments From the HBO Drama's Biggest Episode Yet

    Westworld is wrapped in mystery and secrecy. It's a show that invites speculation and theorizing. Some fans certainly have been wondering whether or not Bernard's a host. There are other theories that some fans feel they're closing in on as well — they could be very right, or very wrong. I'm curious about your perspective on that, the Reddit age of consuming a show like Westworld. If people see the bullets coming, is that distressing to you as a writer? Or is it exciting that viewers are paying close enough attention to pick up on these clues and get their suspicions rewarded in some cases?

    Nolan: I think it's both. It's very exciting when people correctly guess where the narrative is going, because you've done your job. I'm very much a believer that you have to on some level play fair with the audience. I do this for a living, so there are many movies over the years that I've guessed the ending to, and thoroughly enjoyed anyway. Lisa and I both watch and adore Mr. Robot. It's a good global example. I love Reddit. I've been reading Reddit. I don't do social media, and Reddit is sort of the non-social version of social media. I've been reading that website for the better part of a decade. But for shows I like, I don't tend to go to the subreddit while the series is ongoing, because I don't want it spoiled. The thing about theorizing is that occasionally, you're going to be right. The distinction between a theory and a spoiler becomes moot if someone guesses correctly. With a sufficient number of guesses and with an organizing mechanism like Reddit, where good guesses can get more karma, people are going to deduce things that are correct about the show — and they're going to deduce things that aren't correct. But you do have the ability to spoil it for yourself. For myself, I stayed away from the Mr. Robot subreddit, because I didn't want to know. I want to experience the show fresh. That said, [Mr. Robot creator] Sam Esmail very carefully and beautifully lays in and plays fair with the audience. He lays in the clues you'll need, not because you need to solve a puzzle, but because that show reflects the reality of the character. That character has a tenuous grip on reality. Our show is very similar. Our hosts, as we've told you from the beginning, they don't fully understand the world around them. Their reality is curated. Their memory is either nonexistent or carefully curated or accidental, so their experience of memory is something we're playing with in the show. Bernard's experience with the reality around him is something we're playing with in the show. When he walks into the cottage, twice now, in the previous episode, Ford appears as if out of thin air. Having watched the next episode, you now understand that there was a door there. There's a literal door that Bernard is unable to see until Theresa steps through it. The idea that his reality is curated is something that's been feeding the narrative from the very first episode. We wanted to lay it in as carefully as possible. Ultimately, you make these shows the way you would like to experience them. If you're playing fair with the audience, there's some indication along the way of where the narrative is going. But I also like to be surprised.

    Joy: The important thing for me, the way that I approach these things, is that it's also not just about the reveal. It's not just about whether or not you guessed that Bernard is a host. It's about what happens next, and that's not about reveals. It's all about character and emotions. We now know that he's a host, and it's an aha moment. But the thing that happens next is far more devastating. We see the implications of that reveal play out on the character level. He's forced to kill his lover, and the toll it takes on him … that, for me, is the part of the episode that truly wallops me. The twist is one thing, but the way that it lands? That's what sticks.

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    Another episode last night , the finale should be a doozy

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    Some theories. Read with caution:

    http://www.vulture.com/2016/11/westw...ine-guide.html
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  21. Thanked High Life Man for this KICKASS post:

    vandeleur (12-01-2016)


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    I have to say without listening to some podcasts during this I think I would have got lost by now and maybe given up.

    Dolores apparently being on 3 timelines present, 30 years ago and 35 years ago all at the same time while looking the same can get pretty fucking confusing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vandeleur View Post
    Another episode last night , the finale should be a doozy
    Season finale is 90 minutes long...

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    Quote Originally Posted by High Life Man View Post
    Good article

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    I have to say without listening to some podcasts during this I think I would have got lost by now and maybe given up.

    Dolores apparently being on 3 timelines present, 30 years ago and 35 years ago all at the same time while looking the same can get pretty fucking confusing.
    I had it at two timelines, it's been or is, depending on my timeline quite interesting that to watch the show you almost have to read media about it, so you go back and pick up clues. It's obviously a delebrate marketing ploy which is different . Like you say if you watched this without any other input about it it would be confusing as fuck. But up to now am enjoying the journey.

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    I've been staying out of this thread. Got stuck on episode 3, I kept falling asleep trying to watch it at the wrong time of my day.

    Got caught up today and just read the article HLM posted. I didn't pick up on the similarities that the article pointed out but noticed the logo changes.
    Last edited by twonabomber; 12-04-2016 at 06:58 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by twonabomber View Post
    I've been staying out of this thread. Got stuck on episode 3, I kept falling asleep trying to watch it at the wrong time of my day.

    Got caught up today and just read the article HLM posted. I didn't pick up on the similarities that the article pointed out but noticed the logo changes.
    Yeah it's Nora casual watch when you're tired

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    As a keyboard player I thought you would appreciate it ,you know the electronic replication of real things

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    Nora hahaha .... not a

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    Quote Originally Posted by vandeleur View Post
    As a keyboard player I thought you would appreciate it ,you know the electronic replication of real things
    They say "host," and I keep thinking "replicant." Must be time to watch Blade Runner again.

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    I'm caught up and you guys aren't? Are you a week behind?

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    Caught up last night, it was good although not many surprises since most of the main theories flying around proved to be true.

    A problem with this show is that here is a picture of Ed Harris from about 30 years ago...


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    I enjoyed it , and thought it ended well leaving lots still to be decided.

    As for the ed Harris pic , I liked the empire strikes back but Jedi was to far fetched

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Caught up last night, it was good although not many surprises since most of the main theories flying around proved to be true.

    A problem with this show is that here is a picture of Ed Harris from about 30 years ago...

    I've seen gripes about that. "William and the MIB don't look or sound alike!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by vandeleur View Post
    I enjoyed it , and thought it ended well leaving lots still to be decided.

    As for the ed Harris pic , I liked the empire strikes back but Jedi was to far fetched
    This is like young Anakin growing up to be a wookie.

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    There will have been some disappointed ladies watching last night as Rodrigo Santoro (Hector) obviously hadn't signed off on having his dick onscreen.


    It was like Austin Powers the way things kept blocking the view...



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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    There will have been some disappointed ladies watching last night as Rodrigo Santoro (Hector) obviously hadn't signed off on having his dick onscreen.


    It was like Austin Powers the way things kept blocking the view...


    Sounds like you kept a close eye on that situation.

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    I knew I would be accused of that but it was funny because about 4 times it showed pubes but no more.

    Meanwhile the snake lady was going for it big time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    I knew I would be accused of that but it was funny because about 4 times it showed pubes but no more.

    Meanwhile the snake lady was going for it big time.
    It's not cock watching if it's a robot wang .... its all ok

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    This reminds me of something but I can't remember what...


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    Really??

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