Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
There were several issues with Van Hagar. The cheesy lyrics and Clichegar sounding pretty much the same on all the songs are a couple. But I think the biggest issue is, the songs just came too easy. I don't think they put in the work on the songs with Clichegar, that they did with Dave. Also, there really wasn't any conflict or aggression in most of those songs. I don't think it is a coincidence that the consensus among most is, Humans Being is probably one of the best songs of the Van Hagar era. Before the horrific few songs they did in 2004, Humans Being was the last song they wrote together. There was massive tension at that time, as it was the end of the road for Van Hagar. I think it makes a big difference when everything isn't always fun and games, and you're not all on the same page, even though you all have the same goal.

Not to mention my age old theory on what every great band needs, and that is chemistry. Van Hagar had okay chemistry, but Van Halen had knockdown drag out chemistry. Chemistry that was developed over many years of hard work, and playing anything and everything. It's the reason Dave era Van Halen can cover virtually any song ever written and Van Halenize it making it their own. Not many bands can cover any song, and make it as great or greater than it was originally. Dave era Van Halen could do that. I attribute that to Dave more than the Van Halens, but they also played a lot of different styles of stuff in their youth, and it helped them immensely. I do not believe Dave had great chemistry with the EEAS band, as I don't believe Van Hagar had great chemistry. For all the yapping by the ched heads about how great Clichegar's range is, and how much better of a singer than Dave he is, he cannot cover just anything. Clichegar can only cover stuff that is in his type of singing. Dave can cover ANYHING, and if it's not great, it's still pretty fucking good. I mean look at all the stuff Dave has covered over the years. Solo and with VH. He fucking nails everything.

Ray once told me when he was in the DLR Band, they'd go sit out in Dave's backyard and Dave would bring out a ghetto blaster with all different genres of music. They would sit out there and work on, and jam those songs for hours and hours, learning every single thing about them. He said Dave was adamant about being both versatile, and diverse. Dave also demanded that of Van Halen. Whether or not the VH brothers would admit that was a big part of their success, I don't know. But as Greg wrote about in his book, those guys worked their asses off honing their craft. Playing everywhere and anywhere. They never did, or had to do that, with Clichegar. They were already established, and so was he. The effort just wasn't there.
I think so...I think so...to all of what you said.

Van Hagar really only had two types of songs. Hard rock tunes (which sometimes used a combo of keyboards and guitar, but were usually guitar-oriented) and synth or piano-driven ballads with a guitar solo thrown in. I mean, I suppose one could call Finish What You Started sort of country-esque, Can't Stop Loving You was a guitar-based pop ditty and Best Of Both Worlds was a guitar-based pop rock tune. Those three were pretty much it in terms of diversity from the main two Van Hagar song types.

And as you said, it all sounded like it came way too easy. Little to no tension in any of it. Virtually none of it sounded like at any time Hagar said to Eddie "hey, that tune might need some work"...Ed plays something, Hagar says "sounds great!" and puts whatever lyrics and vocals he wants over it, end of tune.

Also as you said, Hagar has a pretty small wheelhouse in terms of his stylistic comfort zone. For whatever technical vocal shortcomings Roth may have had vs. Hagar, Hagar had a limited vocal range he was comfortable with. Hagar had no bottom end to his voice.

I mean, you look at probably the most-lamented CVH album Diver Down and look at the degree of stylistic variation on it, then try and find one Van Hagar album that is comparable in that aspect: you can't. Van Hagar albums went hard rock tune, synth ballad, couple of hard rock tunes, piano ballad, another hard rock tune, rinse, lather and repeat.

That's what made Humans Being stand out the way it did in 1996: you could hear the band trying again, and you could hear the tension in the music. By that point in Sam Halen's career, they were no longer smiling and publicly high fiving each other every 5 seconds when they were working together. Sam and Eddie weren't getting along at that point, and out of that came something by Van Hagar standards that was fairly compelling.

Maybe if Ed and Sam didn't start that instant bromance from the moment they hooked up in 1985, where every musical utterance was met with uncritical Happy Happy Joy Joy glee, Van Hagar would have produced more tunes that had that compelling tension. That lineup got too satisfied too quickly with what they were doing, and that bred the complacence that set in just as quickly.

Clearly, Eddie wasn't at his best when he was his happiest. He said he wanted to quit in 1981 during the making of Fair Warning. Listen to how that album turned out. Ed claimed he was happy during the making of Van Halen III ("Gary's a brother" blah blah blah), where he took total creative control of the band. Listen to how THAT album turned out. No, really, YOU listen (please don't make me listen again).