Mikes input was probably equal to his solo output
Mikes input was probably equal to his solo output
fuck your fucking framing
You guys are amazing, I cant even recall whatever I read in Circus and Guitar Player back in the days... thanks for the memories...Its always great to have a couple of drinks and read about VH. RNR! ....Oh! lol and I should mention I did not have time to read the book yet.
Last edited by So this is love; 08-24-2017 at 10:08 PM.
Now who`s that babe with the fab-u-lous shad-ow?
Diamond Mafia Forever - 4. To restore fullbug to the prominent place in this board, after various serious attacks by hitch1969 have now damaged his reputation and now is reguarded as a "Retarded, Stoned, Canadian, Dog finger bangin' fuckup"
I'm sure Anthony must have had some ideas at some point.
Like, did he come up with the RWTD bass intro? Sure, that is as basic as it comes in terms of technique, but whenever Mike played those 8 open low E notes live, the crowd went nuts. Did Mike come up with that intro, or did Ed tell him to do that? Who knows? What about the bass intro and the rest of the Push Comes To Shove track? Was that something Mike came up with, or did Ed tell him what to play? Or did Ed actually play the bass tracks on Fair Warning (as sometimes rumored)?
Scramby eggs and bacon.
I think if the scenario was that Ed was showing the band a tune that Ed first worked on alone, then showed the idea to Al and they jammed on it with just guitar and bass, and then Ed showed Mike the tune in the context of Ed, Al and Mike messing around and Mike just followed along with the tune...I wouldn't really consider that writing in terms of Mike coming up with the tune. I'd consider that Mike coming up with the bass parts to a tune that Ed had already written.
I agree whole heartedly that the Sheehan idea would have been a terrible combo and I'm glad it never played out...
Here's a perfect example of where I think Mike and Al's contribution to song writing is overlooked... Take Runnin With the Devil as one of the prime examples. Give it a good listen and isolate the vocals and Ed's simple guitar rhythm rift out and focus your ears on Mike and Al's parts. They aren't playing in reaction to Ed's guitar... Ed's actually layered on top of the tight rhythm section.
Pay really close attention to the timing between Al's snare, Mike's bass note and Al's kick drum in that order... There's even a ghost note coming from Mike's picking hand that was captured in the original recording and the timing signature is pure Van Halen magic!! None of that magic comes from Ed or Dave. All of those key rhythmic elements and critical parts were "written", created and produced by each member.
You can even hear those same elements in live recordings with Mike. It really stood out to me when I heard the band with Wolfgang on bass... Wolf sounds like every other guy "trying" to cover what sounds like a the simplest bass riff known to man... and missing the magic.
"If you want to be a monk... you gotta cook a lot of rice...”
The thing about RWTD, particularly on the record, is that the rhythm is...not quite lumbering, but sort of JUST barely behind the beat. It doesn't come across as right on the nuggets far as the timing goes, and that's part of the charm: it grooves.
It is one of those tunes, especially where the drums and bass are concerned, that it is simple to the point where when I've heard other bands (bar bands, etc.) try to cover it...they inevitably play it right on the beat and overplay it. It's all too easy for others to overplay it, and the tune loses the swing it has. AC/DC, The Ramones and The Rolling Stones have a ton of tunes like that as well, where the timing is barely behind the beat and the tunes groove and swing when they do it, but playing a simple/straightforward rhythm that grooves is - in some ways - just as tough as a complicated display of technique.
So I guess my question is: What did Al do to retain his chunk of the earnings that Mike didn't do?
Eat Us And Smile - The Originals
"I have a very belligerent enthusiasm or an enthusiastic belligerence. I’m an intellectual slut." - David Lee Roth
"We are part of the, not just the culture, but the geography. Van Halen music goes along with like fries with the burger." - David Lee Roth
Al initially was the first one of the two brothers to play the guitar, and Eddie played the drums. The story is that Al had a paper route back then, and while Al was out delivering the newspapers, Eddie picked up Al's guitar and started playing it. Soon enough, Eddie demonstrated his ability with the instrument and Al switched over to drums.
Exactly!!
;;;;;;
It's the tension created in the timing signatures which gives great music what's referred to as a groove, soul, hook, etc... Also referred to as a back-beat. It's an attribute that rock inherited from blues and jazz. It's hard to learn and even more difficult to teach... Metronomes and classical musical training suck the air/life right out of a great groove. When I play guitar I focus my timing specifically on the kick and snare from the drummer and totally ignore the bass player. When you've got a great bass player hitting his timing marks inside the drum beat you can litterally feel the groove... but the timing anchor is the drums.
;It's not just the timings though... there's also the tonal frequencies between the various drums and bass notes plus the secret ingredient I call air or commonly known as silence between the beats/notes. You create mud if every space of the sound-scape is filled... there has to be gaps between the notes/beats which are more important than the noise itself.
Most people assume Eddie's guitar is the root/foundation of VH's music with Al and Mike playing off of his guitar parts... That's an incorrect assumption. What makes Ed's guitar style sound so amazing is his playing on top of Al & Mike massive rhythm section. This is why Ed sounds totally out of place when he plays with other bands/musicians... like a fish out of water. Dave's vocal timing signatures also work best on top of Al/Mike rhythm section... also why a lot of other musicians had such a hard time working with Dave musically.
Mmm...
With Van Halen, I think the musical foundation of the band is the relationship between the guitar and the drums. Ed and Al playing with and off each other.
On the record, I'd agree the tonal frequencies are a part of what made Van Halen work. But I think those tonal frequencies would be more specific to the instruments/equipment the band was playing/recording with than the technique. And obviously the band didn't use the exact same equipment they played during the recordings when they toured. I think I'd agree more with what you said regarding HOW Anthony and the Van Halens played the music, but I think even in that respect Anthony was following - or following along with - what the Van Halens were doing. Both Ed and Al said in interviews that when playing live they had mostly what each other were doing piped through their own individual stage monitors, largely to the exclusion of what Anthony and Roth were doing during performances.
Another little-known fact is that Alex came up with ALL of those zany one-liners (sometimes known as 'Rothisms') that Dave would say during interviews. Al would type out answers to hypothetical questions Roth could expect during interviews and have Roth memorize what Al had typed out.
Al was also the guy who taught those karate moves - the leaps, jumps, splits - to Dave. He also encouraged Dave to promote an image of being a cool, hip womanizer. Al even came up with Roth's stage name, 'David Lee Roth'. About the only aspect of Roth's celebrity Al DIDN'T contribute to was Roth's fashion sense and the clothes [Roth] wore.
And that was how Hymie Lipschitz - a barely closeted/same sex advocate, 98 pound weakling from Beverly Hills - eventually transformed into David Lee Roth. It also explains the ass less leather chaps, the obsession with spandex and the lack of women who came forward later with tell-all books.
Well it was Sammy who turned Ed into a homo and that explains why Ed got another one (Gary Cherone) after his gay lover Sammy dumped him.
I have yet to read Monks book, but I did read Greg Renoff's. Books from anybody (even band members) are just the one side of a multiple-sided story of a frame of time in a band. While it's nice to get some inside story's, most often the truth is in between the lines.
Chainsaw Muthuafucka
Reading it now. I like Monk's terse writing style and it seems to be a good overview. The guacamole incident made me piss myself!
Last edited by Nickdfresh; 12-28-2017 at 09:32 PM.
Noel is apparently a bit upset, posted on Facebook:
My agent Frank Weiman at Folio Literature will not pay me my royalties or give me the book sales or accounting on “Runnin’ with the Devil “ even with my Jan in ICU.
What a horrible fuck he is, like most book agents.
Matt at Harper Collins goes along with his actions.
He recommended Frank to me...
So....I am a little late to the party...I had some time off this week and finally read both RWTD and VH Rising. Although I enjoyed reading both books it is not like I really learned something unexpected or new...These guys were young and idiots, I agree and copy davidleenatra on this.....EVH is the only reason why WB signed VH in the first place and I must admit EVH is why I was attracted to this band anyway...DLR was the drive behind this band from the get go and in summary VH is really EVH and DLR, no contest about that...The best part of my readings is the following quote: "Hoping from a little beach time, both bands (VH & Y&T) got to the club early on Jan 17. Haze says Dave and I were sitting out on this brick wall that was by a cement walkway. There was sand on one side and you've got street on the other. We were smoking a joint, like Dave and I usually did. Eddie comes walking out. He's sitting there smoking with us. After the three got high, Edward pulled out a harmonica. Haze says He goes Man I just bought this thing. And he`s blowing like he's played that thing forever. Dave goes, Doesn't that just piss you off man? ....I will spare you the following saxophone and drum stories. EVH is a genious thats it. Damn, I wish I could be better to describe my readings (ala Terry) but that's all I can give you when I'm wasted, lol.
Audiobook on YouTube. Eleven hours worth...
Writing In All Proper Case Takes Extra Time, Is Confusing To Read, And Is Completely Pointless.
A bit ironic reading comments from people saying how they enjoyed the stories of fighting bootleggers...
More views than I would have thought, hope he made some money from the book before this went up.
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