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Thread: Sammy Still Begging . . . .

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    Sammy Still Begging . . . .

    At every chance Sammy Hagar can . . . . he tells every interviewer that he lusts for a Van Halen Reunion with Dave and him trading songs. Is it possible that such an event (which I hope never happens) could create a real battle between Dave Fans and Sammy Fans? I can see a Hagar fan booing Dave or vise versa and a huge fight happening. Of course Dave Fans would kick the shit out of Sammy fans but does anyone else think that might happen if they actually toured? . . . Curious.
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    To paraphrase The Simpsons, Hagar is "rock music's answer to the question nobody asked."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grit View Post
    At every chance Sammy Hagar can . . . . he tells every interviewer that he lusts for a Van Halen Reunion with Dave and him trading songs. Is it possible that such an event (which I hope never happens) could create a real battle between Dave Fans and Sammy Fans? I can see a Hagar fan booing Dave or vise versa and a huge fight happening. Of course Dave Fans would kick the shit out of Sammy fans but does anyone else think that might happen if they actually toured? . . . Curious.
    I think it all depends on what the exact breakdown of such an audience for that hypothetical show would be.

    I mean, I could easily envision a scenario where 50% or better of the audience are casual fans of the band, really only know the hits/most played radio tunes and honestly have no real bone to pick with who is fronting the band. In point of fact, for those people, it might be a draw to see both Hagar and Roth fronting Van Halen at the same show.

    For the remainder of the audience, well...you have to figure the average age of a diehard Van Halen fan - regardless of singer/era - attending a show these days is...what? 45 to 50 years old? In all probability predominately white, suburban, middle-aged. With a few more pounds around the middle than back in the 80s or 90s. I don't see much in the way of an actual physical rumble between fan bases taking place at said hypothetical shows. People are too busy filming the shows on their smartphones to actually make the effort to punch the person standing next to them in the face because they are singing along with Why Can't This Be Love?
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    The most Sammy could ever hope for is Eddie throws him a bone like Mick Jones did to Lou Gramm on their 40th anniversary tour and let him sing a couple songs during the encore
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloomington View Post
    The most Sammy could ever hope for is Eddie throws him a bone like Mick Jones did to Lou Gramm on their 40th anniversary tour and let him sing a couple songs during the encore
    Not even... Dave wouldn't tolerate that.

    Beggars can't be choosers, anyway.
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    Hagar is just taking out a page from Dave's playbook to getting back into Ed's head... Just keep mentioning that a reunion is bound to happen enough times to any press that will listen... for enough years... who knows..?

    It worked for Dave.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZahZoo View Post
    Hagar is just taking out a page from Dave's playbook to getting back into Ed's head... Just keep mentioning that a reunion is bound to happen enough times to any press that will listen... for enough years... who knows..?

    It worked for Dave.
    I doubt it. Ed had his kid whispering that Classic Van Halen was so much better, because Ed is a savant easily confused by the scent of his own scat....

    Dave is back because of Wolfgang and the fact that Ed seems deficient in taste and needs someone to be his editor. A role Dave once filled...
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    That's a good point, Nick... you occassionally get one right.

    The path to getting back into Ed's head must pass through Wolfgang's creative filter. But I think the repititious method of keeping the hair-brained idea floating in the public realm is the key to suckcess...

    The only missing component right now is Sam and Mike need to be shamelessly touring on a predominently Van Hagar setlist filled with those timeless classics that didn't stand the test of time...

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    You guys still buy the whole Magical Mystery Earbud story?



    Same story, same music, same outcome. Both completely make believe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    I doubt it. Ed had his kid whispering that Classic Van Halen was so much better, because Ed is a savant easily confused by the scent of his own scat....

    Dave is back because of Wolfgang and the fact that Ed seems deficient in taste and needs someone to be his editor. A role Dave once filled...
    It certainly seems that without Wolfgang joining the band in 2006, none of what has happened the last ten years - whatever that was worth - would have taken place.

    1996 to 2006 is what happened when Ed was left to his own devices and 100% in control of the band.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZahZoo View Post
    That's a good point, Nick... you occassionally get one right.
    "Even a blind dog finds a bone once in a while"...

    The path to getting back into Ed's head must pass through Wolfgang's creative filter. But I think the repititious method of keeping the hair-brained idea floating in the public realm is the key to suckcess...

    The only missing component right now is Sam and Mike need to be shamelessly touring on a predominently Van Hagar setlist filled with those timeless classics that didn't stand the test of time...
    y o
    On that note, of the bone, I suspect that Sammy will someday find his and probably will appear onstage with Van Halen. But I seriously doubt it will be "every other song" or some ridiculous shit that would destroy any concert by preventing any flow and impeding any the momentum that creates a memorable performance. I guess it would just be as awkward as fuck, like a jerked off version of American Idol, which is being redundant since it's all jerked off. In any case, no one wants to see that.

    I do think that Sammy will get some form of acknowledgement that he was part of the legacy but in no way THE legacy of the band. Someone hit it on the head here, he'll get a couple of songs at some moment aka - the Mick Jones/Lou Gramm-Fucked-off Foreigner moment - and not much more...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    "Even a blind dog finds a bone once in a while"...



    y o
    On that note, of the bone, I suspect that Sammy will someday find his and probably will appear onstage with Van Halen. But I seriously doubt it will be "every other song" or some ridiculous shit that would destroy any concert by preventing any flow and impeding any the momentum that creates a memorable performance. I guess it would just be as awkward as fuck, like a jerked off version of American Idol, which is being redundant since it's all jerked off. In any case, no one wants to see that.

    I do think that Sammy will get some form of acknowledgement that he was part of the legacy but in no way THE legacy of the band. Someone hit it on the head here, he'll get a couple of songs at some moment aka - the Mick Jones/Lou Gramm-Fucked-off Foreigner moment - and not much more...
    I wouldn't be surprised if Sammy did a tour with Van Halen, either. I also tend to doubt it's going to be a co-lead singer "every other song" tour with Roth: I just don't see Dave agreeing to such a scenario. I don't even think Roth would want to do separate sets along the lines of the Sam and Dave 2002 tour. Not where Van Halen is concerned. While I'm not as certain that nobody would want to see that, I certainly wouldn't. It'd be too much of a freak show/publicity stunt type thing, and frankly the band doesn't need that angle to put asses in seats. I don't think even Van Hagar at this late date would need a novelty gimmick along those lines to sell tickets. And whatever has become of Roth's abilities as of late, I think the guy still has enough pride in what HE created with the band (and probably still has a low opinion of what the band did after he left) to not want to directly associate that with what transpired in Van Halen after Roth quit.

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    They're gonna do something, just too many noteworthy things coming together around the same time....

    First, clearly VH isn't a band that wants (or needs) to tour every single year.... I mean, look at bands like Cheap Trick, Skynyrd, KISS, and a few others.... They're touring the country EVERY year, and those bands are OLDER than VH.... Now obviously, VH probably gets a bigger cut per show, but it's clear that VH/DLR have no interest in touring other than the bare minimum to keep their bank accounts plentiful....

    Second, the 40th anniversary of VH I, combined with three years since the last tour, will probably result in SOME kind of tour....

    Third, I really don't see the VH brothers wanting to keep the band together past this upcoming tour, other than one-offs here and there... They're all in their 60's now, and financially secure.....

    The only detail, as we all know, is how Hagar will be mixed into the set... And as I said before, I disagree on the Van Hagarita songs.... No, it won't result in sellout crowds at this stage... But there's a good percentage of the middle aged concert going crowd that just likes to sit in the lawn, drink overpriced beer, and have a good time with their buddies for a few hours....

    Not that I WANT to see any of that, I just think it's inevitable....
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    About the only time since 1999 when Cherone quit that I got a real sense Van Halen had some real ambition and were really making an effort was in 2012. They put a new album out, did a club gig and a couple promo videos to launch the record, the record and the tour were advertised on tv. While the US leg of the tour got cut short, eventually they did some gigs overseas in 2013...

    By the time 2015 rolled around, they did a couple pre-tour tv appearances, but the tour itself - much like 2007/2008 -was just a standard oldies setlist.

    While I suppose Van Halen still is a band in the technical sense of the term, I've really looked at what they've been doing with Roth over the last decade as largely a business arrangement. These guys get together every 3-4 years, do a US tour, churn out the oldies, then bugger off. Apparently, there largely hasn't been the formulation of a new friendship between Roth and Eddie as the result of the reformation. It certainly hasn't resulted in a creative resurgence. Hey, I'm not expecting an album and a tour every year from these guys anymore. Or even just a tour every year anymore. Frankly, for me other older bands like KISS, Cheap Trick and Lynyrd Skynyrd have toured themselves into the ground in terms of overkill: I have no desire to see these bands anymore because they've been playing so often for so long (with comparatively little new music) that what they're doing has no chance to be special these days.

    There just doesn't seem to be much of a reason to me why Van Halen has even continued since Cherone left, other than the oldies circuit is clearly the biggest revenue stream/path of least resistance for them and...what else are they going to do? Obviously, Dave would prefer to play to respectable-sized crowds fronting Van Halen than go back to smaller theaters as a solo act. I mean, even if Eddie decided to release a proper solo album at this point, like something along the lines of what Satriani or Vai have done...THAT would feel like it was 20 (if not 30) years too late, regardless of content/"how good it is".

    I dunno if I'm explaining it properly...there's just nothing new by way of creative ground being broken with the band anymore. So, if it's going to be flat-out nostalgia, fine. Do that. Don't half-ass it, though. Get Anthony back for a tour. Clean up your live audio/video archives and release them. Don't settle for having your kid play bass and putting your Franky logo on tennis shoes. Why not go big or go home? It's the half-assedness of the band for the last 17 years that is the most disappointing aspect of all of it to me. Half-assedness wasn't a feature of the group that turned me onto them in the first place.

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    Personally, I think Dave should tell the band to go tour with Clichegar, and promptly release the John 5 album.
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    I think denying Hagar closure and legacy may be more important to Dave than releasing what is going to be a pretty niche album.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    I think denying Hagar closure and legacy may be more important to Dave than releasing what is going to be a pretty niche album.
    Would you mind posting the definition of "niche" for Zah?

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    I don't think he's going to get an arena tour from it.

    It's all relative, The Who played The Colloseum in Vegas last week and said how it was great to being playing such a small intimate venue and they could do some deep cuts.

    It holds 4300...
    Last edited by Seshmeister; 08-14-2017 at 06:29 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    I don't think he's going to get an arena tour from it.

    It's all relative, The Who played The Colloseum in Vegas last week and said how it was great to being playing such a small intimate venue and they could do some deep cuts.

    It holds 4300...
    I'd be a bit surprised, even at this late date, even hypothetically without Mike Anthony there, that Hagar fronting Van Halen wouldn't be able to fill venues with capacities around 10,000.

    I'm not saying I wouldn't have a good chuckle about it should Van Hagar tour and it turns out I'm wrong and the venues end up being half full. I think the 2004 debacle of the band playing to half empty venues had as much to do with the word having gotten out about the dreadful shape that Eddie was in as it did the choice of lead singer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    I'd be a bit surprised, even at this late date, even hypothetically without Mike Anthony there, that Hagar fronting Van Halen wouldn't be able to fill venues with capacities around 10,000.

    This is where Hagar will benefit from the name once again. They'll get their 10,000 based off of the name, plus the band still sounds good....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Va Beach VH Fan View Post
    This is where Hagar will benefit from the name once again. They'll get their 10,000 based off of the name, plus the band still sounds good....
    Yeah, well, fuck it. Let Hagar benefit from the name yet again: if 10,000 people are willing to pay money to see Van Halen with Hagar fronting them...why not?

    It'd be one thing if the band were actually creating new music with Dave, but that isn't the case.

    At this point, what difference does it make who sings for another Van Halen nostalgia tour? I suppose there are still fans who want to hear Roth fronting the band. Myself, not so much: Dave sounds pretty awful these days. Awful to the point where I can't imagine paying dollar one to see him front the group anymore. Or even see him do a solo gig...his live vocals are THAT fucking bad these days.

    To be sure, Hagar's entire career got an upgrade in commercial terms when he joined Van Halen. Oddly enough, I didn't dislike what the guy was doing before he joined the group. I wasn't a Sammy Hagar Red Rocker Superfan, but I didn't hate the material. At the end of the day, in terms of prestige, Hagar's career high point was when he joined Van Halen. Funny, because fronting Van Halen was Roth's career high point, too.

    Maybe those two guys SHOULD co-headline a tour with Van Halen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    I'm not saying I wouldn't have a good chuckle about it should Van Hagar tour and it turns out I'm wrong and the venues end up being half full. I think the 2004 debacle of the band playing to half empty venues had as much to do with the word having gotten out about the dreadful shape that Eddie was in as it did the choice of lead singer.
    Flipside now applies though. Widespread YouTube and social media would have killed the 2004 tour even more.

    I think most people must do what I do and check out recent video of bands I haven't seen for a while before buying tickets.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Va Beach VH Fan View Post
    They'll get their 10,000 based off of the name, plus the band still sounds good....
    So instead of standing on the shoulders and riding the coat tails of the band Roth built, this time he would be doing it on the back of the band Roth REBUILT.

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    As much as I would love to see Sammy relegated to the kiddie table, like Foreigner did with Lou or GNR did with Adler, I can't see his ego allowing it. I actually can see Dave letting it happen, just because it would mean he won. Sam, on the other hand, truly thinks he is Dave's equal in terms of the VH history; he's fucking delusional, but I do think he really believes it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Flipside now applies though. Widespread YouTube and social media would have killed the 2004 tour even more.

    I think most people must do what I do and check out recent video of bands I haven't seen for a while before buying tickets.
    Oh, absolutely.

    I mean, I checked out the rehearsal footage and early 2007 tour dates well in advance of them playing Tampa in 2008.

    I did the same again for the early 2012 dates, to make sure Ed wasn't shitfaced like he was the previous tour.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    So instead of standing on the shoulders and riding the coat tails of the band Roth built, this time he would be doing it on the back of the band Roth REBUILT.
    Why not? That strategy worked well enough for Hagar the first time around in the 1980s.

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    Quote Originally Posted by damngoodtimes View Post
    As much as I would love to see Sammy relegated to the kiddie table, like Foreigner did with Lou or GNR did with Adler, I can't see his ego allowing it. I actually can see Dave letting it happen, just because it would mean he won. Sam, on the other hand, truly thinks he is Dave's equal in terms of the VH history; he's fucking delusional, but I do think he really believes it.
    Hagar not only thinks he's Roth's equal, he thinks he's better. Probably too many years of spouting bullshit sales and tour attendance claims in interviews have made Hagar actually believe the lies he has told.

    I mean, at this late date, who gives a shit who was better? It was all pretty lame and ridiculous thirty years ago, now it's just ancient and pathetic.

    I don't think it will be a case of Dave "letting it happen" in terms of Hagar touring with Van Halen again, because Roth's not really in a position to dictate anything to the Van Halens anymore. It's not the CVH era, where Roth is on equal footing with the Van Halens in terms of how the band is run. To be sure, it's Roth's choice to make about a co-lead singer tour. Outside of that, the Van Halens are gonna do what they're gonna do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    I think denying Hagar closure and legacy may be more important to Dave than releasing what is going to be a pretty niche album.
    I think denying Spambot closure and legacy IS more important to EVERYBODY than releasing what is going to be a pretty niche album.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardrock69 View Post
    I think denying Spambot closure and legacy IS more important to EVERYBODY than releasing what is going to be a pretty niche album.
    I mean, is Hagar doing one more tour with Van Halen really the final step that needs to be taken to ensure Hagar's tenure with the band is considered as effective/important as that of the CVH lineup? Is one last Van Hagar tour really going to change anybody's mind about the two lineups one way or the other at this point? Is it really the case that whoever fronts the band on their last tour - Roth or Hagar - somehow 'wins' this 3 decades-long running debate?

    "oooh, Sammy toured with the band last, then the band folded, so clearly Sammy 'won'! Yay!!!"

    Honestly, fuck it. Give a tubby old tequila salesman a chance to show us all what dreams are made of one last time. Who gives a shit? Let Hagar stand up onstage with his bloated face, extended gut, ridiculous goatee, shit-eating grin and that stupid 5150 vagina hand sign while the Van Halens churn out mid-80s lame synth pop.

    However, I DO think Roth should not associate himself with such a tour. If Hagar wants to hit the road with Van Halen, let him do it under the sole draw of the Van Hagar material. Don't enable Hagar to reap any benefit of the CVH stuff via Roth co-headlining the tour. I don't even want to hear the Sam Halen lineup play ANY CVH material. Not Panama. Not Jump. Nothing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    If Hagar wants to hit the road with Van Halen, let him do it under the sole draw of the Van Hagar material. Don't enable Hagar to reap any benefit of the CVH stuff via Roth co-headlining the tour. I don't even want to hear the Sam Halen lineup play ANY CVH material. Not Panama. Not Jump. Nothing.
    No CVH, and I wonder if Ed would stipulate that there would be no solo Hagar material played.
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    God I fucking hope so...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    I mean, is Hagar doing one more tour with Van Halen really the final step that needs to be taken to ensure Hagar's tenure with the band is considered as effective/important as that of the CVH lineup? Is one last Van Hagar tour really going to change anybody's mind about the two lineups one way or the other at this point? Is it really the case that whoever fronts the band on their last tour - Roth or Hagar - somehow 'wins' this 3 decades-long running debate?

    "oooh, Sammy toured with the band last, then the band folded, so clearly Sammy 'won'! Yay!!!"

    Honestly, fuck it. Give a tubby old tequila salesman a chance to show us all what dreams are made of one last time. Who gives a shit? Let Hagar stand up onstage with his bloated face, extended gut, ridiculous goatee, shit-eating grin and that stupid 5150 vagina hand sign while the Van Halens churn out mid-80s lame synth pop.

    However, I DO think Roth should not associate himself with such a tour. If Hagar wants to hit the road with Van Halen, let him do it under the sole draw of the Van Hagar material. Don't enable Hagar to reap any benefit of the CVH stuff via Roth co-headlining the tour. I don't even want to hear the Sam Halen lineup play ANY CVH material. Not Panama. Not Jump. Nothing.
    love this
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Hagar not only thinks he's Roth's equal, he thinks he's better. Probably too many years of spouting bullshit sales and tour attendance claims in interviews have made Hagar actually believe the lies he has told.

    I mean, at this late date, who gives a shit who was better? It was all pretty lame and ridiculous thirty years ago, now it's just ancient and pathetic.

    I don't think it will be a case of Dave "letting it happen" in terms of Hagar touring with Van Halen again, because Roth's not really in a position to dictate anything to the Van Halens anymore. It's not the CVH era, where Roth is on equal footing with the Van Halens in terms of how the band is run. To be sure, it's Roth's choice to make about a co-lead singer tour. Outside of that, the Van Halens are gonna do what they're gonna do.
    Yeah. Sammy wants one more shot at glory after selling overpriced rot gut and fucking his chum Emril Lagasse up his greasy cajun ass.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    Yeah. Sammy wants one more shot at glory after selling overpriced rot gut and fucking his chum Emril Lagasse up his greasy cajun ass.

    BAM! Gay anal sex notches unknown!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    Would you mind posting the definition of "niche" for Zah?
    Yeah... help an old guy out! That must be some hipster millenial speak for something fucking ultra cool...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    BAM! Gay anal sex notches unknown!!!
    Maybe that's where the lyrics for "Up For Breakfast" came from...

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    No that was done by building sentences at random using an 11 year old boy to throw lumps of human faeces extracted from corpses at outsize Dr Seuss books and choosing the words in order of the amount that stuck to each one.

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    I think that Sam would love for this to happen because he doesn't have the wear and tear that Dave has. Dave was an unbridled animal whereas Sam was a watered-down replacement.

    Hagar thinks that he is a big rocker but he never was in Dave's class so that he can do better versions of his weak stuff NOW than Dave can do of his amazing stuff now, means nothing to the people who know anything. It might mean something to the people who were casual enough fans to not favor the Van Halen or the Sam Halen or the people who are hard onto Sam's side but it means very little to people who can actually discern what good music is & what isn't good music.
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    Quote Originally Posted by smorgdonkey View Post
    I think that Sam would love for this to happen because he doesn't have the wear and tear that Dave has. Dave was an unbridled animal whereas Sam was a watered-down replacement.

    Hagar thinks that he is a big rocker but he never was in Dave's class so that he can do better versions of his weak stuff NOW than Dave can do of his amazing stuff now, means nothing to the people who know anything. It might mean something to the people who were casual enough fans to not favor the Van Halen or the Sam Halen or the people who are hard onto Sam's side but it means very little to people who can actually discern what good music is & what isn't good music.

    I mean, if Hagar wants another crack at Van Halen in terms of a tour to at least end his association with the band on a professional and positive note...I can't really blame the guy for that. That 2004 tour was a fucking fiasco. According to everything Hagar said, he knew Eddie was in a fucked up condition in the months leading up to the tour. Apparently, Eddie couldn't even get through a full-set rehearsal. Hagar admittedly kept telling himself that Eddie would somehow get his shit together, but it didn't happen. I understand contractual obligations, but my own feeling is Hagar should have pulled the plug on the tour before the contracts were even signed and made it known he wasn't going to participate if Eddie wasn't sober.

    Whatever. The tour went ahead, to a pretty dismal result: I can't even imagine Van Hagar fans - low as their standards of excellence may be - could have been too happy with what transpired onstage from the clips I saw.

    If Hagar's motivation now is to repair his relationship with the Van Halens and end the Hagar era of the band on a better note than it did 13 years ago, I get that. If Hagar's co-headlining tour idea springs from a genuine spirit of having everybody - Roth included (as well as fans of both lineups) - get along and wind down the band on a positive note for everybody...well, a pretty tall order, but I can appreciate the spirit of it.

    If Hagar's motivation is to simply show up Roth (and, let's face it, Roth isn't what he was even ten years ago far as singing and performing goes) and put some bizarre final stamp on who the best singer for Van Halen was...even for a cheeseball like Hagar, THAT would be beyond ghey at this stage of his life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    If Hagar's motivation now is to repair his relationship with the Van Halens and end the Hagar era of the band on a better note than it did 13 years ago, I get that. If Hagar's co-headlining tour idea springs from a genuine spirit of having everybody - Roth included (as well as fans of both lineups) - get along and wind down the band on a positive note for everybody...well, a pretty tall order, but I can appreciate the spirit of it.

    If Hagar's motivation is to simply show up Roth (and, let's face it, Roth isn't what he was even ten years ago far as singing and performing goes) and put some bizarre final stamp on who the best singer for Van Halen was...even for a cheeseball like Hagar, THAT would be beyond ghey at this stage of his life.

    I honestly think it's both.....

    I think he's sincere that he wants to mend the fences with the brothers, but I don't think that applies to DLR. I think he wants to humiliate him night after night... That's why IMO he wants to play a few Van Hagar songs, then bring DLR on for Van Halen songs, etc.

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