Annual Rock Hall Nominee Shit Show thread

[silverfish]

A post from another voter:

I’m Giving Up My Rock Hall Vote
My invitation to join the organization’s selection committee seemed like a sign of change. It wasn’t.

https://www.vulture.com/2023/04/rock...r-resigns.html

[Nitro Express]

You mean the Hall of Lame.

[twonabomber]

Fan vote is something like less than a percent toward an artist's induction.

The George Michael fanbase just mobilized better than the others. Guy could sing though.

[Nitro Express]

I don’t see why people think it’s important that some board of schmucks decides their favorite act gets acknowledged. Seems very anti-rock and roll to me. Rock and Roll is raiding the place like a band of pirates.

[FORD]

George Michael performed one song with the remains of Queen, and did a halfway decent job of it. I wouldn't say that should get him into the Rock n Roll hall of fame, but it's certainly more than fucking Whitney Houston ever did.

[Nitro Express]

George made some decent background music for the 80’s clubs. I can still taste the Stroh’s.

[silverfish]

2023 Inductees:

Kate Bush
Sheryl Crow
Missy Elliott
George Michael
Willie Nelson
Rage Against the Machine
The Spinners

In addition, Chaka Khan, Al Kooper, and Bernie Taupin will be honored with the Rock & Roll Hall of
Fame’s Musical Excellence Award. Meanwhile, DJ Kool Herc and Link Wray will receive the Musical
Influence Award. The late creator and host of Soul Train Don Cornelius is this year’s recipient of
the Ahmet Ertegun Award, which honors non-performing industry professionals.

Full story at:
https://consequence.net/2023/05/rock...me-class-2023/

[twonabomber]

It's the response to the "not enough women in the hall" complaints.

[Kristy]

Well, I'm not at all impressed.

[twonabomber]

Who do they get to sing George Michael songs? Adam Lambert?

[So this is love]

I'm not a huge fan of Iron Maiden, but they deserve to be inducted much more than most of these inductees.

[Terry]

Thankfully the organization has finally gotten woke, realized their past transgressions and nominated The Spinners...although justice won't be served until Needle Dig and the Bug Fuggers take their rightful place inside this hallowed ground.

[FORD]

Iron Maiden & Soundgarden can't get in the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame before Missy Fucking Elliot??

Even by rap standards, that's just pathetically weak. Can't even name one of her songs, let alone make any sort of case how she's "influenced" anybody, in the sense that Run DMC, NWA, or Public Enemy have.

Willie Nelson isn't rock n roll either, of course. But the guest list of his recent 90th birthday concerts is evidence of how many rock n rollers love the guy, so I'm fine with him being there.

[twonabomber]

That one Missy Elliott video was deemed "groundbreaking" and she might have gotten the MTV Video Vanguard award recently. Beyond that, I can't think of much she's done, either.

[Nickdfresh]

I barely know who the fuck she is...

[twonabomber]

https://ultimateclassicrock.com/rock...es-roundtable/

[Von Halen]

Somebody in Cleveland should burn that building of fraud down. How many rock bands or rap artists are in the Country Music Hall Of Fame? I've been by that shithole in Cleveland a thousand times, and have never stepped foot in the place. Not sure if it costs money, but they'd never get a penny from me. It's a fucking JOKE.

[twonabomber]

Somebody in Cleveland should burn that building of fraud down. How many rock bands or rap artists are in the Country Music Hall Of Fame? I've been by that shithole in Cleveland a thousand times, and have never stepped foot in the place. Not sure if it costs money, but they'd never get a penny from me. It's a fucking JOKE.

I have a membership to the rock hall, I can bring a guest for free. Any time you want to go, let me know

The HOF Foundation is in charge of the induction process and organizes the annual induction ceremony, and is separate from the museum. The Foundation does provide some funding for the museum though.

[Rikk]

Soundgarden not getting in is just plain insulting. Fucking Sheryl Crow? Sheryl fucking Crow? Her music reeks of mediocrity. The only people she influences are other mediocre songwriters.

No Iron Maiden? No Warren Zevon? No Soundgarden?

Rock Hall sucks. The one time I went to the museum, I was disappointed as well.

Soundgarden is one of the best bands ever...with one of the greatest singers, dead almost six years now.

Iron Maiden (though I prefer Priest) were amazing trailblazers. Warren Zevon was one of the great songwriters and a helluva performer too.

I do think Kate Bush should have gotten in 20 years ago.

[twonabomber]

This was in Rolling Stone, which is funny because they were never known for pushing metal. And the writer kind of admits it in the article.

Enough Is Enough. It’s Time for the Rock Hall to Recognize Metal

What Iron Maiden's second snub says about the institution's attitude toward music's loudest genre

In 2018, a journalist asked Bruce Dickinson how he felt about the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame. The Iron Maiden singer inveighed, “If we’re ever inducted, I will refuse — they won’t bloody be having my corpse in there.”

A year later, Steve Harris — the band’s bassist and only consistent member since Maiden formed in 1975 — offered a more levelheaded take: “It’s very nice if people give you awards or accolades, but we didn’t get into the business for that sort of thing. … With what we do, whatever comes of it is great. Whatever doesn’t come of it is great, too.”

This year, the Hall considered for a second time to include Iron Maiden, who have been eligible for induction since 2005. And once again, the institution’s voters snubbed them — possibly because of Maiden’s antipathy, possibly because they just don’t like metal. But much like Black Sabbath, the Sex Pistols, and Axl Rose — artists who gave the organization the middle finger but were inducted (or is it “indicted”?) anyway — Iron Maiden deserve a spot in the Hall whether they want it or not. The continued rejections, after nearly two decades of eligibility, are emblematic of continued negativity toward heavy metal by the gatekeepers of musical taste.

Metal has long been rock’s outcast genre — often willingly so — but after more than half a century, it’s time to recognize the contributions the genre has made to popular music. It’s time to expand the canon. And while Rage Against the Machine’s induction into the Hall this year is a move in the right direction, even that band’s Tom Morello has called Iron Maiden a formative influence on him — a claim many musicians could make.

Almost immediately from the release of the group’s self-titled debut in 1980, Iron Maiden have expanded the vocabularies of heavy metal and, by proxy, rock. In The Rolling Stone Illustrated History of Rock & Roll, critic Lester Bangs described metal as “the aural image of a battering ram” and wrote, “as the Seventies drew to a close, it appeared that heavy metal had had it,” before directing readers to the nascent punk scene. But because the book came out in 1980, Bangs hadn’t yet had a chance to hear Iron Maiden, who sounded not just like a battering ram, but also a fighter jet, a thousand charging horses, and an air-raid siren all at the same time.

Where the genre’s forebears like Black Sabbath, Cream, and mid-Seventies Judas Priest dealt in gloom and doom, Iron Maiden introduced a charging (and supercharged) sense of hope, resilience, and measured abandon to the genre. They raced through the labyrinthine song structures of “Prowler,” “Phantom of the Opera,” and “Iron Maiden” with pure adrenaline, inspiring Metallica, Slayer, and the rest of the thrash-metal contingency to play faster and more intricately. Kurt Cobain used to doodle their soon-to-be-ubiquitous corpse mascot, Eddie the Head, and Eddie also inspired Chuck D to design Public Enemy’s instantly recognizable logo. Plus, thanks to Paul Di’Anno’s gravelly voice, they also sounded tough.

In 1982, when they replaced Di’Anno with Dickinson, a singer with a dramatic flair that’s equal parts Shakespeare and Doctor Who, their sound grew even bigger. Unlike Sabbath, Zeppelin, and Priest whose formative records took cues from the blues, Iron Maiden’s landmark 1982 album, The Number of the Beast, felt grand like classical music. The band’s most prolific songwriter, Harris, wrote Rossini-esque galloping rhythms, and he harmonized guitar lines for Dave Murray and Adrian Smith on “The Number of the Beast” and “Run to the Hills” that obeyed Bach’s rules of counterpoint. Add Dickinson’s theatricality — similar to what Ronnie James Dio was doing in Black Sabbath and his own band, Dio — to a song like “Hallowed Be Thy Name,” and it became opera. Very early in their career, Iron Maiden struck a balance between sophistication and aggression without losing its audience.

They spent the next decade refining their sound to play up speed (“Aces High”), melody (“Wasted Years,” “Can I Play With Madness?”), texture (“The Trooper”), and, for lack of a better word, pomp (“The Evil That Men Do”), all while building a dedicated fanbase eager to see them play arenas in and around giant stage sets. Hell, they even took Samuel Taylor Coleridge’s epic poem “Rime of the Ancient Mariner” and turned it into a headbanger that holds concertgoers’ attentions for 14 minutes. Name a high school English teacher who can pull that off.

Iron Maiden have also taken musical risks that would strike fear in the hearts of most mainstream rockers and thrived doing it. In 2006, when they released their album A Matter of Life and Death, the band played the whole opus in its entirety with just a few classic songs as encores — in arenas, no less — to captivated audiences. They’ve never had a hit song on U.S. radio, and they’ve probably never wanted one. The best songs on their most recent album, 2021’s Senjutsu, run more than 10 minutes each. Yet, as uncommercial as that sounds, that album and their three previous LPs all made it into Billboard’s Top Ten. Their music has even been played to the Pope in the Vatican.

Iron Maiden’s innovation, dedication to their craft, influence, and complete refusal to compromise their artistry should have made them first-year inductees into the Hall of Fame. They’re musical visionaries in the same league as Pink Floyd, Queen, U2, and even the Beatles — just louder.

The disrespect isn’t exclusive to Iron Maiden. Mainstream institutions from the Hall of Fame to the Grammys to Rolling Stone magazine (hi there!) have traditionally been slow to warm to heavy metal, writing the genre off as crude, brash, and angry. Also, thanks to movies like This Is Spinal Tap and Wayne’s World (which are both hilarious), the genre has gotten the reputation of being made for knuckleheaded dolts, which is unfair since smart, talented people from all walks of life identify with the genre.

So far, the only metal or metal-adjacent acts to make it into the Hall have been the genre’s biggest: Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, Metallica, AC/DC, Judas Priest, Kiss, Van Halen, Rush, and Deep Purple. But so many other eligible and worthy acts (including Maiden) have been passed over, year after year: Slayer, Dio, Motörhead, Mötley Crüe, Ozzy Osbourne as a solo artist, Megadeth, Pantera, Thin Lizzy, Korn, Tool, Danzig, Anthrax, and Celtic Frost, among many, many others. These are musicians who have taken the foundational ideas of rock & roll and augmented them into something fresh. They’re also responsible for a sizable chunk of physical records sold every year since metalheads comprise one of music’s most dedicated fanbases.

The Rock & Roll Hall of Fame has made great strides in recent years of expanding the definition of rock & roll by recognizing how hip-hop, synth-pop, alt-rock, and country music have contributed to the spirit of the art form. Heavy metal should be included in the broad definition of rock & roll, and few bands embody the core tenets of the genre — individuality, rebellion, originality — as much as Iron Maiden. So if the opportunity comes around again to drag Bruce Dickinson kicking and screeching into the Hall of Fame, the institution’s voters should seize the opportunity. Up the Irons!

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/m...me-1234727881/

[silverfish]

Jann Wenner Removed From Rock Hall Board After Interview Backlash

“Jann Wenner has been removed from the board of directors of the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame Foundation,”
the Rock Hall said in a brief statement issued today.

In Friday's interview with The New York Times, Wenner explained that his new book Masters, which
is centered on conversations with "extraordinary musicians who dominated rock 'n' roll," includes only
white male rock stars because "none of [the women] were as articulate enough on this intellectual level.”

Addressing the lack of Black artists, he declared that they too "just didn’t articulate at that level." He
continued, "You know, just for public relations sake, maybe I should have gone and found one Black
and one woman artist to include here that didn’t measure up to that same historical standard, just to
avert this kind of criticism."


Full story at:
https://ultimateclassicrock.com/jann...-hall-of-fame/

[twonabomber]

It's too late, the damage has already been done.

[Rikk]

I saw this yesterday. While I consider myself pretty liberal (socially), I get pretty incensed with people being cancelled all the time from single comments or some event 15 years earlier.

But the shit Wenner said the other day was insane. Who the fuck says, "I should have found some blacks..." and goes on about his not being able to find any women or blacks to match white men...and says women "just don't articulate at that level..."

But the truth for me is that it's Wenner...and I hate the fucking guy. His being kicked out of the Rock Hall Nomination is just truly awesome.

Do I think this means that all sorts of metal and classic rock bands will all start getting in now? NO. The Rock Hall are ALL a bunch of fucking idiots. But this could help.

[Rikk]

It's too late, the damage has already been done.

I've been to the Museum once and once only.

My wife did her Undergrad at Kent. So she visits the area time to time and one time I went with her and we spent the day at the Rock Hall Museum.

I spent the first couple of hours with my eyes bugged out, looking at John Lennon's guitars and Jim Morrison's report card and Gary Rossington's Les Paul and John Paul Jones' shirt from SONG REMAINS THE SAME.

Then...as it wound down...I said to my wife, "I've seen nothing from KISS. Nothing from Soundgarden."

I don't remember seeing any Van Halen stuff (maybe I've forgotten). I don't even remember Sex Pistols stuff.

And my wife was kind of lowering her head as I raved and ranted the entire drive back to our friends' place about how much I hate the Rock Hall.

[Terry]

I dunno...I mean, has the RNRHOF seal of approval been something anyone ever needed to 'validate' them listening to whatever?

It's just a bunch of has-beens giving each other stroke jobs at $10k a seat.

[Kristy]

Somebody in Cleveland should burn that building of fraud down. How many rock bands or rap artists are in the Country Music Hall Of Fame? I've been by that shithole in Cleveland a thousand times, and have never stepped foot in the place. Not sure if it costs money, but they'd never get a penny from me. It's a fucking JOKE.

It was @$35 when I was there. That's right, $35 to see Marky Ramone's jeans and snare drum.

[Kristy]

I dunno...I mean, has the RNRHOF seal of approval been something anyone ever needed to 'validate' them listening to whatever?

It's just a bunch of has-beens giving each other stroke jobs at $10k a seat.

Don't forget about Dave Grohl's obligatory ego tripping and for being the very reason rock & roll exist at all.

[Kristy]

That one Missy Elliott video was deemed "groundbreaking" and she might have gotten the MTV Video Vanguard award recently. Beyond that, I can't think of much she's done, either.

This may have something to do with it.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-09-...tone/102867406

[Rikk]

This may have something to do with it.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-09-...tone/102867406

Really paying attention to the thread, aren't ya?

[Kristy]

Blow me.


Hippie

[Rikk]

Blow me.


Hippie

No, thanks.

[Rikk]

Joe Bonamossa on Jann Wenner's dismissal from Hall's board of directors (Twitter or X):

"This man has done more to bring down the credibility of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame than anyone else. He has been punitive, elitist and frankly kept artists out of the hall over petty grudges and ego. This is a good thing."

[twonabomber]

I've been to the Museum once and once only.

My wife did her Undergrad at Kent. So she visits the area time to time and one time I went with her and we spent the day at the Rock Hall Museum.

I spent the first couple of hours with my eyes bugged out, looking at John Lennon's guitars and Jim Morrison's report card and Gary Rossington's Les Paul and John Paul Jones' shirt from SONG REMAINS THE SAME.

Then...as it wound down...I said to my wife, "I've seen nothing from KISS. Nothing from Soundgarden."

I don't remember seeing any Van Halen stuff (maybe I've forgotten). I don't even remember Sex Pistols stuff.

And my wife was kind of lowering her head as I raved and ranted the entire drive back to our friends' place about how much I hate the Rock Hall.

I have a membership, been there a few times already this year.

Bonamossa isn't wrong and he's not the only one who's said that. I think Ahmet Ertegun kept Wenner in check, to a point. Once Ertegun died Wenner did what he wanted.

[Rikk]

I have a membership, been there a few times already this year.

Bonamossa isn't wrong and he's not the only one who's said that. I think Ahmet Ertegun kept Wenner in check, to a point. Once Ertegun died Wenner did what he wanted.

Don't get me wrong: the museum is good for what it does have. It's just a travesty for what it doesn't have.

I'll go again. We live outside Chicago now...so it's not something we can do anytime we want.

BUT YES...I'm a BIG museum person. We have memberships to the Art Institute of Chicago, the Field Museum of Natural History, the Shedd Aquarium and the Museum of Science and Industry. My boy who we lost, he loved going to the Field, so that's our favorite and we donate to them every year.

I was pissed when the George Lucas museum was pulled out of Chicago because of a really stupid environmental movement (I'm all for environmental movements, but this one was ridiculous...they were basically looking to save the Soldier Field parking lot).

Does the Rock Hall Museum have any Van Halen or KISS stuff now? (My wife keeps telling me they still have some good temporary exhibits.)

[twonabomber]

There is a VH display at the very top of the Hall but it is all current EVH stuff and nothing of his personal collection. They may as well have QR codes posted with where to buy everything, it's set up like a catalog picture. There is a video that plays and a lot of it is from the Smithsonian thing.

Bassplayer's Jack Daniels bass is in one of the displays.

I don't remember if there is any KISS stuff. Maybe just the plaque with their signatures on it.

[Von Halen]

I stayed on the same block many times over the years. Refused to ever attend that shithole based on the non rock acts in there, and the real rock acts that aren't. That joke of a rock and roll hall of fame should be burnt to the ground.

How many rappers are in the country music hall of fame? How many rockers are in the country music hall of fame?

Fuck the "Rock and Roll" hall of fame.

[Terry]

Don't forget about Dave Grohl's obligatory ego tripping and for being the very reason rock & roll exist at all.

Ugh.

He's so cloying and eager to be seen as the Good Housekeeping Seal Of Approval for all that is rock...

I mean, shit, I loved rock and roll back in the day...a lot of the stuff I liked back then I still do far as listening pleasure goes, but there's been too much drivel released in that genre over the last 30 years and too many aging bands who can't get it up flogging a dead horse onstage for decades for me to even care about where rock music is today.

I'd sooner go see Pablo Cruise opening up for Kenny Loggins these days than take in another 'farewell tour' of another aging limp rock band...which is exactly what I did last night. Kenny came out, did his soft pop set, finished it up with the Holy Trinity of that song from Caddyshack, followed by that song from Top Gun and ending with that song from Footloose (he started to play another tune after the Footloose one, but we left) and it was a lovely evening.

[Kristy]

I mean, shit, I loved rock and roll back in the day...a lot of the stuff I liked back then I still do far as listening pleasure goes, but there's been too much drivel released in that genre over the last 30 years and too many aging bands who can't get it up flogging a dead horse onstage for decades for me to even care about where rock music is today.

There are lot of new artist out there who are breaking the rules by actually writing and playing their own material unlike say, a certain duo in their 80s. You have to realize (and I think you do better than anyone else on here) that the music industry is dead. Anyone can call themselves a producer or even a professional musician with general knowledge of learning to play a few chords and a iPhone to record their crap on. As for the ones who developed a real skill in manipulating their instrument and has paid "dooos" are becoming more and more rare and the industry which has sold its soul to the commercial pop of visual instead of aural and music is all about being seen in these days an times (See: K Pop, the Masked singer, that fucking unwatchable The Voice).

The Crock and Bullshit Hall of (insert flavor of the month here) has always been abut ego tripping turning itself into a qualified bitch magnet for the likes of Dave Grohl. The concept of the place was great when it first marketed itself. It gave notion to the pioneers likes Chuck Berry (although he was a asshole), Buddy Holly, Everly Brothers, Gene Vincent which was all well and good until you start to get the vibe The Crock and Bullshit Hall of...shit just openly operates as a beauty contest. So many artist who possessed so much in the way originality and "dooo paying" are largely ignored. As far as I know Irma Thomas, Don Varner, Fontella Bass, Chuck Jackson, Eddie Hinton, Jimmy McGriff, Tammi Terrell and yes, even white limey artist like Billy Fury (huge "influence" on Bowie), The Artwoods, The Shadows (although they may be or Hank Marvin definitely belongs there) or even the Fame Gang are not in there or ever mentioned of being there. you all remember the Fame Gang, right? Give this a quick listen and guess how many people ripped them the fuck off (See; Earth, Wind and Fire)



And since I mentioned Bill Fury:


Yeah, tell me Bowie did not steal from him.*


So this is what we have: a visual media for an auditory one. As Von said the The Crock and Bullshit Hall of Slime can politely go and fuck itself. I've been there. Not much to see unless you're really into nostalgia like Joe Strummer's boxer shorts.




*Billy Fury is a limey. David Bowie is a limey. Limeys stealing from other limeys I could less than a shit about.

[Kristy]

One more mention. I love to see Phil Upchurch in there. Although he has drifted more into jazz his early days of ripping on a Strat were fucking incredible. Unfortunately, I cannot find any video of him doing so so this will have to do. Here he is with Booker T. and the MGs which is close enough for jazz:



Oh, and,


Class dismissed.

[twonabomber]

I'm surprised Upchurch isn't in. He's got the resume for it. Should at least get in via the Musical Excellence category.

UCR ran an article about 135 artists not in the HOF. Not going to nitpick the whole list, but a lot of them seem to be big sellers and not influential. They have Jon Bon Jovi, solo, on there. For what? Is his solo stuff somehow more influential than the Bon Jovi discography? Bryan Adams. Big seller, for sure. Influential? Not to me.

Unfortunately (and I've probably said it in this thread) the inductees are more about who will bring ratings to the HBO broadcast of the induction ceremony. Having John Sykes (formerly of MTV) as chairman of the board of the HOF Foundation doesn't help, either. Booting Wenner is a good start. Bands like Priest and Metallica getting in means they get to vote for their influences and contemporaries.