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Thread: Ted Templeman book out April 21

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    Ted Templeman book out April 21

    "Ted Templeman: A Platinum Producer’s Life in Music takes us into the studio sessions of No. 1 hits like “Black Water” by the Doobie Brothers and “Jump” by Van Halen, as Ted recounts memories and the behind-the-scene dramas that engulfed both massively successful acts."

    https://ecwpress.com/products/ted-templeman
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    "This autobiography (as told to Greg Renoff)..."

    That's encouraging but I doubt there will be much new there for VH fans.
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    Now that we are all getting older it's funny to think that Ted's career ended in 1988 when he was 44.
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
    "Ted Templeman: A Platinum Producer’s Life in Music takes us into the studio sessions of No. 1 hits like “Black Water” by the Doobie Brothers and “Jump” by Van Halen, as Ted recounts memories and the behind-the-scene dramas that engulfed both massively successful acts."

    https://ecwpress.com/products/ted-templeman
    Never Heard this Black Water ! whooaa! number one ! for me Doobie Brothers = Long train Running, I know with live in the dark in Europe
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    [QUOTE=vaijuju;1943003]Never Heard this Black Water ! whooaa! number one ! for me Doobie Brothers = Long train Running, I know with live in the dark in Europe [/QUOT

    ah!ha!.. It was my first reaction too...whats this black water song? I have a best of DB and listened to it …it is ok but I mean they could have mentionned: listen to the music, taken it to the streets, it keeps you runnin, and I would have understood? unless what they meant it was their first hit, I dont know and I'm not a fan enough to search for it...
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    I definitely heard the song "Black Water" before but never knew it was the Doobie Brothers lol
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    How Producer Ted Templeman Angered Prince

    https://ultimateclassicrock.com/prince-ted-templeman/

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    "Black Water" was one of the Doobies' biggest hits. I would have thought it was a hit internationally as well, although maybe the sound wasn't compatible with radio airplay elsewhere. It was sort of a country/delta blues vibe as opposed to typical rock n roll. The way the vocals were recorded on it though... classic Ted Templeman production. Similar to what he would do with the Van HALEN records later.



    There was a rumor going around a few years back that Van Halen was supposedly recording a cover of this song, even an alleged documentation of the tune being listed among VH's published titles at Warner Music. The alleged recording never materialized, so it was probably bullshit, but I could actually hear them doing this song.... at least if Sobolewski was still around for the vocal parts.
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    Kindle version $14. Haven't seen it on the torrents yet.
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    Ted Templeman Says Sammy Hagar Is Best Rock Singer on the Planet

    “Sammy’s a helluva singer. Sammy may be the best singer out there. Period,” Templeman proclaimed.
    “To me, he’s a combination of Robert Plant and James Brown. That guy can sing like nobody. I’m telling
    you, nobody. I’m talking just as a singer. He doesn’t know how good he is even. The guy is, I think, the
    best rock singer on the planet. Period.”

    https://ultimateclassicrock.com/ted-...r-best-singer/

    Like twona, I'll be checking torrents for this one.

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    I'll maybe pick it up on Audible. Less inclined to do so now after that crazy Hagar statement...

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    lol I was on YouTube the other day and one of the recommendations was Trunk's top 5 singers. I randomly clicked on the timeline and Trunk is gushing over Hagar. I mean, wipe the jizz off your face, Eddie...didn't listen to the rest of the list.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
    Ted Templeman Says Sammy Hagar Is Best Rock Singer on the Planet

    “Sammy’s a helluva singer. Sammy may be the best singer out there. Period,” Templeman proclaimed.
    “To me, he’s a combination of Robert Plant and James Brown. That guy can sing like nobody. I’m telling
    you, nobody. I’m talking just as a singer. He doesn’t know how good he is even. The guy is, I think, the
    best rock singer on the planet. Period.”

    https://ultimateclassicrock.com/ted-...r-best-singer/

    Like twona, I'll be checking torrents for this one.
    LOL More like a combination of Janis Joplin and howler monkies having sex with her...
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    Has anyone read the book yet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfish View Post

    Like twona, I'll be checking torrents for this one.
    I bought the Kindle version. Only looked on the torrents to see if it showed up yet, but that was day of release.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
    How Producer Ted Templeman Angered Prince

    https://ultimateclassicrock.com/prince-ted-templeman/
    Prince was a weirdo. Ha! Ha! Weirdo Prince hungry to take Wacko-Jacko down. Oh well, that's show biz. People with issues trying to outdo each other. Not that different than politics.
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    Sammy can sing in the high range because he never had any balls.

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    Having a good range does not make you a great rock singer. Michael Anthony has tremendous range. Did anyone seriously consider him for frontman? His backing vocals are great but his lead "duet" vocals on Beer Drinkers and Hell Raisers are good, but you need Dave there. And I now love Mike and wish more than anything he was back in the sister act. Pete Townsend has a "better voice" than Roger Daltrey, but not live and not for the majority of The Who material...

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    I don’t miss a chance to see Cheap Trick. Still a great band even if they are old. Robin Zander can still sing. I would say he’s probably my favorite rock and roll singer. But yeah, Sammy isn’t a good singer. He’s kind of like Rod Stewart. A mediocre talent and you really wonder why they were so successful.

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    I’m reading the book right now, skipping to the VH chapters. Really enjoying it and it’s the kind of stuff I’ve wanted to read about for years. Awesome reading for the hardcore VH fan. I’m up to the recording of WACF, timeline-wise.

    In the section about the first album he emphasizes how hard he and Landee had to work with Dave to get the comp'd vocal performances that are on the record. Dave had (has) huge issues with pitch, consistency, etc. Says he did marathon sessions to get usable takes, with just him, Dave, and Landee present, because he didn’t want the rest of the band to see how much Dave was struggling. But he praises Dave highly as a songwriter and creative genius and says outright that “Van Halen never would have made it without Dave fronting the band.” He makes numerous references to his intelligence, personality, and way with lyrics as being a huge part of the band's appeal.
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    I feel better learning about the fact it took him juge efforts to record his vocals. They are nothing near easy.
    Cheers!
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    Quote Originally Posted by degüello View Post
    I’m reading the book right now, skipping to the VH chapters. Really enjoying it and it’s the kind of stuff I’ve wanted to read about for years. Awesome reading for the hardcore VH fan. I’m up to the recording of WACF, timeline-wise.

    In the section about the first album he emphasizes how hard he and Landee had to work with Dave to get the comp'd vocal performances that are on the record. Dave had (has) huge issues with pitch, consistency, etc. Says he did marathon sessions to get usable takes, with just him, Dave, and Landee present, because he didn’t want the rest of the band to see how much Dave was struggling. But he praises Dave highly as a songwriter and creative genius and says outright that “Van Halen never would have made it without Dave fronting the band.” He makes numerous references to his intelligence, personality, and way with lyrics as being a huge part of the band's appeal.
    I don't think even the most ardent Roth fan would take issue with the opinion that Roth had issues with pitch and consistency. Roth always had a unique style, and always struck me as somebody who wasn't naturally gifted as a singer and had to work very hard to sort of turn himself into one.
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    I never really understood why so many people have said Sammy had such a "great range" as a singer.

    As others have mentioned, he has a ball-less bottom end in terms of his tone. He has his mid-range natural singing voice, and used to have a decent scream far as rock vocalists go.

    His natural singing voice is obviously higher than Roth's in terms of octaves, but...so?

    I mean, lyrics to one side, I wouldn't say strictly in terms of voice that Hagar was a terrible rock singer...but one of THE top rock singers of all time? To each his own, I guess, but...no.

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    I've always considered rock singers a necessary evil... something I've tolerated to enjoy great guitar playing!

    It's a tough call to say who's the "Top Rock Singers" of all time... most of the greatest had multiple singing flaws if you were to judge only on the accuracy of octaves, notes, range, timing and timbre... things that can't be hidden where instruments are involved. Enthusiasm and showmanship are performance elements not necessarily in the realm of quality where actual singing is concerned...

    It's all subjective...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZahZoo View Post
    I've always considered rock singers a necessary evil... something I've tolerated to enjoy great guitar playing!

    It's a tough call to say who's the "Top Rock Singers" of all time... most of the greatest had multiple singing flaws if you were to judge only on the accuracy of octaves, notes, range, timing and timbre... things that can't be hidden where instruments are involved. Enthusiasm and showmanship are performance elements not necessarily in the realm of quality where actual singing is concerned...

    It's all subjective...
    Dave used to frequently refer to himself as a song and dance man, and has always been (or at least he was in the 1980s) fairly self-depreciating regarding his vocals in terms of comparing what he does to, say Robert Plant or a lead singer along those lines.

    I mean, I enjoyed what Roth did on the records. Live, the lead vocals were a part of the whole frontman/showman package, alongside the karate moves and whatnot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZahZoo View Post
    I've always considered rock singers a necessary evil... something I've tolerated to enjoy great guitar playing!
    LOL but you have a point - there are a hell of a lot of people who are all about the singing. They hear the music a little but it's very much just garnish in the same way someone listening to a Frank Sinatra song rarely mentions the bass playing.

    Like you I'm very much not one of those people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZahZoo View Post
    I've always considered rock singers a necessary evil... something I've tolerated to enjoy great guitar playing!

    It's a tough call to say who's the "Top Rock Singers" of all time... most of the greatest had multiple singing flaws if you were to judge only on the accuracy of octaves, notes, range, timing and timbre... things that can't be hidden where instruments are involved. Enthusiasm and showmanship are performance elements not necessarily in the realm of quality where actual singing is concerned...

    It's all subjective...
    When was the last time any of us bought an Opera record? We want an explosion of rowdy decadence. Rock and roll is the same thing as Reving a big block powered vehicle and doing a burnout or blowing a bunch of shit up or ripping a bunch of rounds through a machine gun.

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    Rock and roll is about having the audience love you while you piss all over them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    LOL but you have a point - there are a hell of a lot of people who are all about the singing. They hear the music a little but it's very much just garnish in the same way someone listening to a Frank Sinatra song rarely mentions the bass playing.

    Like you I'm very much not one of those people.
    What's worse for me is... as my interest in audio engineering continues to grow... I not only isolate and evaluate every instrument in the mix... I pick up what's panned left, right, centered... compressed with quick or slow release, EQ'ed flat or fat, effects dry or wet... on and on.

    Somewhere inside me is that simple human that hears a catchy beat or hook that draws most people to a good song... but layered 40 stories high is all that musician, audio engineer stuff complicating a 3 minute moment of enjoyment!!

    Oh yeah... Chuck Berghofer was Frank Sinatra's bass player... look him up...

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    THE SONG THAT KEPT DAVID LEE ROTH IN VAN HALEN
    MARTIN KIELTY May 13, 2020

    Fans are aware that producer Ted Templeman wasn’t sold on David Lee Roth’s role in Van Halen when he helped sign the band in 1977.

    In fact, after the second show he attended, he started thinking about finding another singer and considered calling his friend Sammy Hagar in. But in his recent memoir Ted Templeman: A Platinum Producer’s Life in Music (via Los Angeles Magazine), he recalled how he began to warm to Roth’s talents, especially as Van Halen worked on the song “Ain’t Talkin’ ’Bout Love.”

    “As a performer and vocalist, he underwhelmed me,” Templeman said about watching Roth the night he secured their record deal with Warner Bros. boss Mo Ostin. “His stage presence was awkward, and his singing wasn’t great. … I was actually a bit nervous that Mo was going to be turned off by the singer’s antics and perhaps might pass on Van Halen. Truthfully, Roth made me nervous too. I thought, What am I going to do with this group if we sign them and the singer can’t hold up his end of the bargain? I could make the guitar player a solo artist if the worst came to pass. I found myself mulling over dumping the singer for a stronger vocalist, like Montrose’s lead singer, Sammy Hagar. I thought, Hell, he might be the perfect singer for Van Halen.”

    When studio work started, Templeman said he feared Roth was the band’s “biggest issue” and that he “couldn’t fix” it. “To be sure, he was distinctive as a singer; his train-whistle screams were identifiable in a good way," he explained. "But every time I heard him get pitchy or completely miss a note, I worried that the public was going to be turned off by this band because of his limitations.”

    Despite being tempted to pick up the phone on a number of occasions, Templeman never quite got there. And then “Ain’t Talkin’ ‘Bout Love” came up.

    “When we took breaks, I’d talk at length with him," the producer noted. "That’s when I came to appreciate his astounding intellect. He’d quote a line from Tom Sawyer and then a comic book. I still don’t know anybody who can keep those kinds of stream-of-consciousness raps going like he can.

    "The more I read his lyrics, especially ‘Ain’t Talkin’ ’Bout Love,’ the more impressed I became. His line in that song about bleeding for something you really desire just stuck with me. He was extremely well-read and smart, and that showed up in his whole approach to fronting Van Halen.”

    Eventually the producer concluded that Roth “wasn’t a conventional singer” but his “rare” gifts “outweighed his flaws.”

    “I hung in there with Dave, thinking that I’d find a way in the studio to accentuate his strengths and minimize his weaknesses," Templeman said. "That’s why I decided against calling Sammy. … If I’d tried to put him in Van Halen in 1977, I’d have made the biggest mistake in rock history, because Van Halen never would have made it without Dave fronting the band.”

    LINK

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    Dear gawd... so the perpetual "Dave vs Sammy" debate was a seed planted in 1977 before Van Halen was even launched..?

    That's a brain fart that grew legs and traveled the globe...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Having a good range does not make you a great rock singer. Michael Anthony has tremendous range. Did anyone seriously consider him for frontman? His backing vocals are great but his lead "duet" vocals on Beer Drinkers and Hell Raisers are good, but you need Dave there. And I now love Mike and wish more than anything he was back in the sister act. Pete Townsend has a "better voice" than Roger Daltrey, but not live and not for the majority of The Who material...
    Range is the variety of octaves one can reach and not how high you can sing (hence, Michael Anthony has hardly any range at all and no character even to his high octave to distinguish himself as a lead singer). I agree that singing high is not exactly an endorsement of being a better singer. What I always liked about Robert Plant is that he can sing in a high register but still had depth and can still go low while maintaining an actual tone which identifies his voice.

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    Hey all - It was awesome to get this cover project and work with Greg again. We put together a site if anyone wants to pick up an inscribed copy - www.templemanbook.com
    Hey Jackass! You need to [Register] or log in to view signatures on ROTHARMY.COM!

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    Bought the audio book so I'm not sure how you would do that.

    I can't overstate how fucking little I know about the Doobie Brothers, I'm going on Spotify as Ted goes into all this detail about them and I barely recognise even their biggest hits.

    I was very young at their peak but I don't think they had anywhere near as much impact in the UK. Wikki seems to back me up saying that for example 'Minute by Minute' didn't even chart in the UK.

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    Some of the time Ted comes across as really not being aware of how he sounds as regards money.

    You get lines about how thankful artists should be that they no longer had to just share eating beans out a can or how shortfalls meant they had to consider sacking 10% of their staff all the while the record company execs are flying on the WB private jet, have chauffeur driven limos for their commute to work.

    I'm at the bit where Ted says his substance abuse of lines of coke (at work) was probably brought on by the long chauffeur driven commute from his luxury Hollywood apartment to his Malibu mansion and I'm crying here - that poor poor man - what hell for him.

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    Ted didn't like I'll Wait and said a band like Van Halen shouldn't be doing a sub standard version of Argent's 'Hold your head up'. He confirms that the chorus and title was the contribution from Michael McDonald as Dave(and he) couldn't do anything with it.



    I have to say I'm agreeing with almost every critique (mainly)good and bad Ted makes of Van Halen and his take on the end days seems to match very closely with Crazy from the Heat.
    Last edited by Seshmeister; 05-27-2020 at 08:58 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Bought the audio book so I'm not sure how you would do that.

    I can't overstate how fucking little I know about the Doobie Brothers, I'm going on Spotify as Ted goes into all this detail about them and I barely recognise even their biggest hits.

    I was very young at their peak but I don't think they had anywhere near as much impact in the UK. Wikki seems to back me up saying that for example 'Minute by Minute' didn't even chart in the UK.
    I figured the only two songs that were big enough to be international hits would be Listen to the Music and China Grove.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Ted didn't like I'll Wait and said a band like Van Halen shouldn't be doing a sub standard version of Argent's 'Hold your head up'. He confirms that the chorus and title was the contribution from Michael McDonald as Dave(and he) couldn't do anything with it.
    Michael McDonald did to the Doobies what Hagar did to Van Halen, so it's really not much of a surprise that he played a role in ruining Van Halen as well. If "Jump" & "I'll Wait" hadn't been successful on commercial radio, it probably would have been the end of Eddie's synthesizer fetish. Instead it was the beginning of the end of Van Halen.

    Also not a coincidence.... McDonald started out as the keyboard player in Steely Dan. So he learned how to suck from professional lame musicians.

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    The first concert I ever went to was The Doobie Brothers. There were some good musicians in that band. I remember their bass player was really good. Almost everyone had at least one Doobie Brother’s album in the day.

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