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Thread: Tapes that kill

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    But hopefully one eventually grows up and stops getting bothered about what other people do sexually, because who gives a shit?
    You're 100% right. Seriously, THAT is what it comes down to. Who gives a shit?

    One must ask: WHY should this remotely affect you?

    I hear people go on about how two gay guys getting married somehow takes away from their own beliefs or some other nonsense. And that is such crap.

    My wife & I met in 2005. We've been married since 2010. I love her very much. And one thing I NEVER do is measure our relationship based on other people's relationships. To do so (with a few exceptions) just makes no sense whatsoever. Whatever my wife & I share (and however we got married) is judged on the very merits of our life together and nothing else.

    Other humans being gay, getting married as a gay couple...these things have nothing to do with the life I myself am living. This also goes for people having sex changes, identifying as a different gender... I GIVE THESE THINGS AS MUCH THOUGHT AND INTEREST AS I GIVE PEOPLE THINK GOING TO VEGAS EVERY VACATION IS THE WAY TO LIVE. I don't identify with that and it's not for me. But if it's for them, I (in passing) say to myself, "OK, if that's what you want, go for it."

    Because, see, I tend to think things like the economy, mass shootings, book-banning, armed insurrections...these are things that have greater likelihood to affect me.

    One side looks for issues they know will rile people up...divide people...and then they spend all their political time chasing these non-issues because their minions will (like sheep) jump at these issues and be fooled into thinking these issues are important. And as long as they're distracted, this same political side can then make sure their minions aren't paying attention to the more far-reaching harm these politicians are doing...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikk View Post
    You're 100% right. Seriously, THAT is what it comes down to. Who gives a shit?

    One must ask: WHY should this remotely affect you?

    I hear people go on about how two gay guys getting married somehow takes away from their own beliefs or some other nonsense. And that is such crap.

    My wife & I met in 2005. We've been married since 2010. I love her very much. And one thing I NEVER do is measure our relationship based on other people's relationships. To do so (with a few exceptions) just makes no sense whatsoever. Whatever my wife & I share (and however we got married) is judged on the very merits of our life together and nothing else.

    Other humans being gay, getting married as a gay couple...these things have nothing to do with the life I myself am living. This also goes for people having sex changes, identifying as a different gender... I GIVE THESE THINGS AS MUCH THOUGHT AND INTEREST AS I GIVE PEOPLE THINK GOING TO VEGAS EVERY VACATION IS THE WAY TO LIVE. I don't identify with that and it's not for me. But if it's for them, I (in passing) say to myself, "OK, if that's what you want, go for it."

    Because, see, I tend to think things like the economy, mass shootings, book-banning, armed insurrections...these are things that have greater likelihood to affect me.

    One side looks for issues they know will rile people up...divide people...and then they spend all their political time chasing these non-issues because their minions will (like sheep) jump at these issues and be fooled into thinking these issues are important. And as long as they're distracted, this same political side can then make sure their minions aren't paying attention to the more far-reaching harm these politicians are doing...
    I dunno...it's just this thing I've always found peculiar, that being why some people are so concerned about what others do sexually...

    Like, if you think sex should be exclusively between a man and a woman and should be done solely in the missionary position strictly penis to vagina and used only for procreative purposes, fine. LIVE YOUR LIFE THAT WAY and DON'T BE TROUBLED BY WHAT OTHERS PRACTICE, because WHAT OTHERS DO IS NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS.

    Now, a caveat. I think parents should have the ultimate say as to when and how their children should be informed/taught about sexuality. School boards/politicians shouldn't be making those choices and dictating them to the parents. Parents should be informing the school boards as to that part of the curriculum, though this also entails parents getting involved with school curriculum and attending/participating in school board meetings.

    And, obviously, PDA displays of same-sex affection should be limited to women...nubile, college-aged, attractive women with athletic BMI's.
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  4. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Halford has said since that the leather thing was never his bag and KK Downing claimed it was mostly his idea. .
    Before the leather, they pretty much dressed like a bunch of hippies, and Halford was basically copying the Robert Plant look....

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    Quote Originally Posted by FORD View Post
    Before the leather, they pretty much dressed like a bunch of hippies, and Halford was basically copying the Robert Plant look....

    While I do not want to be Judas Priest's biographer, I have read a lot about them and Rob wasn't the first singer, his brother-in-law was. Rob is seen wearing his sisters shirt in multiple live videos early on and JP was never started as a "hell-bent-for-leather" heavy metal outfit but sort of morphed into one from a Zeppelin-ish hippy outfit...
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    I hope John 5 is getting paid a lot for this because it's not a good look...


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    Everyone knows John can play. He’s a hired gun slinger. He can just say he had a contract and was legally obligated to do the tour. In fact, being loyal to a contract would be better than bailing. Loyal dependable people are who acts want to hire not unstable prima donnas.
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    Anyways the people selling all this shit are totally confident the general public are so stupid they can get away with it. Nobody is throwing shit. In the old days a pissed off audience would tear you to shreds. Nowadays everyone stands there looking into a phone.

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    I never liked Motley Crue anyways. First time I saw them was at the 83 US Festival. I thought they looked stupid. They really look stupid now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    Anyways the people selling all this shit are totally confident the general public are so stupid they can get away with it. Nobody is throwing shit. In the old days a pissed off audience would tear you to shreds. Nowadays everyone stands there looking into a phone.
    Audiences are too polite these days, 'specially at rock concerts featuring old bands. I'm guessing because the audiences at those shows are on average 50+ years old themselves and want a night out with a glimmer of nostalgia: they want that old feeling to the point where they will accept fractions of an original or definitive lineup and will tolerate instruments being tuned down to accommodate aging singers. Or singers who can't sing worth a shit anymore. Or bands playing to backing tapes.

    I don't blame the bands anymore for pulling these cheesy tricks to barely get by via their live performances. I blame the audiences for showing up year after year and tour after tour and tolerating the contempt these wheezing icons of yesteryear have for them: why the fuck SHOULD these bands try any harder when they're getting by just fine half-assing it?

    John 5 is doing a job. Motley Crue fans eat shit. If they didn't, they wouldn't accept the level of musicianship onstage. Clearly, the fans must be happy with what they're getting because they keep coming back for more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Motley Crue fans eat shit. If they didn't, they wouldn't accept the level of musicianship onstage. Clearly, the fans must be happy with what they're getting because they keep coming back for more.
    A big majority of the fans going to these shows these days, just want to be able to claim on social media they saw Motley Crue, or whatever band. They may like the music, but they aren't invested in the band the way we were invested in our favorite bands. This is obvious by all the bands selling plenty of tickets when they barely have original members, if they have any at all. People are going to these shows as a status symbol for social media, and to party.

    I have a buddy that's dating a much younger woman. She hates the shows, but goes because he loves them, and because she wants to brag about it on her Facebook page. My gal loves rock and blues shows, but not some of the metal shows I like. She goes to the rock and blues shows with me and loves them as much as I do, but I go by myself or with a friend to the real heavy stuff. Of course, we don't do FB and aren't plastering our lives all over social media either.

    Concerts today are more about the individual attending than the music or show itself. IMO
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    I guess Aerosmith is coming here in January and for a second I entertained buying tickets then realized I had no desire to see Airoband...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    A big majority of the fans going to these shows these days, just want to be able to claim on social media they saw Motley Crue, or whatever band. They may like the music, but they aren't invested in the band the way we were invested in our favorite bands. This is obvious by all the bands selling plenty of tickets when they barely have original members, if they have any at all. People are going to these shows as a status symbol for social media, and to party.

    I have a buddy that's dating a much younger woman. She hates the shows, but goes because he loves them, and because she wants to brag about it on her Facebook page. My gal loves rock and blues shows, but not some of the metal shows I like. She goes to the rock and blues shows with me and loves them as much as I do, but I go by myself or with a friend to the real heavy stuff. Of course, we don't do FB and aren't plastering our lives all over social media either.

    Concerts today are more about the individual attending than the music or show itself. IMO
    I suppose part of it is these pop metal-lite 80s hair bands (we never called them hair bands back then, but whatever) were at their peak when they were in their twenties in terms of energy, ability and endurance. So it shouldn't at all be surprising that they simply can't rouse themselves physically as they get older and conjure up what is needed to recreate what they did when they were young men...that music was never designed to age well.

    But that whole genre has gone beyond the stage of that late-Elvis phase, where Presley in the last few years of his life was just this bloated joke cashing in on nostalgia while occasionally half-assedly trying to display some flashes of what turned people onto him the first place.

    However, same as with Elvis I don't blame these relics from the 1980s continuing to wheeze around up onstage, but I don't even consider them as fleecing their audiences; unlike the last years of Elvis, potential ticket buyers these days can know exactly what they're getting re: current live capabilities via free streaming. So it isn't a fleecing in that sheep require herding whereas these audiences willingly pay to see these sad spectacles.

    I may well be out of step or out of touch or whatever, but I still have a level of expectation for my ticket dollars. When I saw in 2012 that Roth could no longer cut it to my standards, I stopped going to see him since for me the concert IS still about the music and the show. I dunno...I just reach a point where I can only give so many concessions for an artist's age and my nostalgia jones no longer surpasses the ROI a concert ticket provides.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    I guess Aerosmith is coming here in January and for a second I entertained buying tickets then realized I had no desire to see Airoband...
    Yet another gaggle of wheezing geezers cashing in on a "farewell tour"...

    I kinda liked them better back in the early-to-mid 1980s when they were still fucked up. First time I saw 'em in 1985 Tyler came out swigging on Heineken and drunkenly stumbled throughout the show, failing to hit every high note and looking gray as 5-day old Arby's roast beef. About a year before that Run-D.M.C. collaboration. The crowd on the floor was in a brawling mood: literally recall somebody swinging a large chain over their head and striking other people in the floor area, which started a round of fistfights. Back when Aerosmith's audience were a rough bunch...I remember the kind of girls who liked Steven Tyler back then were the girls who came from working-class families, and these girls would wear very tight blue jeans with holes in them to school and loose-fitting concert t-shirts (with no bras) and a LOT of mascara. Poor, slutty girls who definitely weren't sitting home on school nights hoping the captain of the football team would ask them out to homecoming.

    You know, back when Aerosmith were still cool...before they hooked up with the likes of Desmond Child and John Kalodner.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    A big majority of the fans going to these shows these days, just want to be able to claim on social media they saw Motley Crue, or whatever band. They may like the music, but they aren't invested in the band the way we were invested in our favorite bands. This is obvious by all the bands selling plenty of tickets when they barely have original members, if they have any at all. People are going to these shows as a status symbol for social media, and to party.

    I have a buddy that's dating a much younger woman. She hates the shows, but goes because he loves them, and because she wants to brag about it on her Facebook page. My gal loves rock and blues shows, but not some of the metal shows I like. She goes to the rock and blues shows with me and loves them as much as I do, but I go by myself or with a friend to the real heavy stuff. Of course, we don't do FB and aren't plastering our lives all over social media either.

    Concerts today are more about the individual attending than the music or show itself. IMO
    That’s some lame shit. Hell we just went to shows because it was 15 bucks and something to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Audiences are too polite these days, 'specially at rock concerts featuring old bands. I'm guessing because the audiences at those shows are on average 50+ years old themselves and want a night out with a glimmer of nostalgia: they want that old feeling to the point where they will accept fractions of an original or definitive lineup and will tolerate instruments being tuned down to accommodate aging singers. Or singers who can't sing worth a shit anymore. Or bands playing to backing tapes.

    I don't blame the bands anymore for pulling these cheesy tricks to barely get by via their live performances. I blame the audiences for showing up year after year and tour after tour and tolerating the contempt these wheezing icons of yesteryear have for them: why the fuck SHOULD these bands try any harder when they're getting by just fine half-assing it?

    John 5 is doing a job. Motley Crue fans eat shit. If they didn't, they wouldn't accept the level of musicianship onstage. Clearly, the fans must be happy with what they're getting because they keep coming back for more.
    What’s scary is when the beyond the sell date sucky has beens really do a shitty show and the nostalgia drunk idol worshippers still think it’s great. That’s some delusional shit.

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    People get old. I’m not expecting some rock and roller in their 70’s to be good. A few can pull it off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    ...before they hooked up with the likes of Desmond Child ...
    I realize that's a dig but I'll still probably read this (or borrow if my library gets it) when it comes out:

    Livin' On A Prayer: Big Songs Big Life
    https://www.amazon.com/Livin-Prayer-.../dp/1635768535

    Figure it'll have a coupla good stories.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    You know, back when Aerosmith were still cool...before they hooked up with the likes of Desmond Child and John Kalodner.
    Have no interest in an Aerosmith tour. As much as I like the Black Crowes, I'm not going to watch the Robinson brothers with a bunch of other guys. If it was a reunion of the Southern Harmony era band, sure. Or even if Steve Gorman was included, but after his book, I'm pretty sure the brothers don't want anything to do with him.
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    And who knows what will happen to Tyler between now and January, a relapse? Decent tickets lower bowl are around $500. each here that's a $1,000 just for tickets to see a 70 year old attempt at Karaoke, I considered it for a second and then I came back to my senses.
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
    I realize that's a dig but I'll still probably read this (or borrow if my library gets it) when it comes out:

    Livin' On A Prayer: Big Songs Big Life
    https://www.amazon.com/Livin-Prayer-.../dp/1635768535

    Figure it'll have a coupla good stories.
    I'd opt for borrowing it were I of the mind to read it at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    People get old. I’m not expecting some rock and roller in their 70’s to be good. A few can pull it off.
    I'm not expecting rock and rollers in their 70's to be good, either.

    Thus, I'm not shelling out more money for tickets to see them now (and I'm talking far more money than I paid to see them back in the day even when adjusted upward for inflation) when they're not as good. Because it's not worth more to me to see a band that isn't as good as they were forty years ago. Matters not, because there's no shortage of - as you say - nostalgia drunk idol worshippers who are willing to keep paying whatever to see these old rock and rollers, because "it may be the last time" or whatnot.

    I'd sooner give Rock In A Hard Place a spin than feather Aerosmith's retirement nest...mostly because I think RIAHP is a great album (I'll take just about any track on that offering over the best of what Aerosmith came up with post-Done With Mirrors).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    People get old. I’m not expecting some rock and roller in their 70’s to be good. A few can pull it off.
    Many can to an extent, but it depends on the length of tour and venues....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Thus, I'm not shelling out more money for tickets to see them now (and I'm talking far more money than I paid to see them back in the day even when adjusted upward for inflation) when they're not as good.
    This is the thing for me, it's one thing to shell out $40 as something to do but not $400.

    I would much rather go and see Steel Panther play to a crowd of 2000 for $50 than Aerosmith play to 16000 for $500.

    I haven't seen Aerosmith since the 9 Lives tour and I think I vowed never again after that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    This is the thing for me, it's one thing to shell out $40 as something to do but not $400.

    I would much rather go and see Steel Panther play to a crowd of 2000 for $50 than Aerosmith play to 16000 for $500.

    I haven't seen Aerosmith since the 9 Lives tour and I think I vowed never again after that.
    Which, I mean, I'm not being a codger or crying poor or whatever...like, a year/year and a half ago, Missus Terry wanted to see KISS. Can't say as I had any interest myself - I wouldn't have opted to see them - but she'd never seen them before, blah blah blah. Tickets worked out to be something like $65 a pop after all the fees and whatnot. Fine. I know it's not the 1980's anymore; upwards of $100 a pop is to be expected. We saw Garth Brooks a year ago, paid maybe $100/$125 a pop. Fine.

    $400 or $500 or $1k a pop for tix? Yeah, financially I COULD meet those prices and not have to jerk off to feed the cat afterwards in terms of breaking the bank, but as I said there ain't nobody left performing worth it to me to see if the tix are at those prices. I'd sooner go down to the local Asian Massage Parlor Rub Hut and get several nuttings for that kind of dough.

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    Twenty seconds in Nikki does his signature 'play the bass with both hands in the air' move.


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    John 5 defends Sixx

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    Most I've ever agreed with Trunk. Get the dancers to stop dancing at the chorus and sing then.

    He misses a key point too that because Tommy Lee is playing to a click track that can pull all the energy out of the performance.

    Also both of Nikki Sixx hands are up so I don't get how he played even open string notes but I guess it could maybe be a video sync issue.

    How many parts of a Crue set have sirens and keyboards that have to be on a tape - why not have an off or preferably onstage keyboard guy dealing with that?

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    Is John 5 wearing black contact lenses in the still on that YouTube?

    He seems a nice enough guy and a great player but there is something a bit 'Tryhard' about his image.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Is John 5 wearing black contact lenses in the still on that YouTube?

    He seems a nice enough guy and a great player but there is something a bit 'Tryhard' about his image.
    J5 is a great dude. In his defense on the "Tryhard" issue. He's always been a hired gun. A gun slinger so to speak. I think a lot of these guitarists that have made it big as hired guns, are this way. I think Vai, Satch and a lot of the hired guns try too hard. The biggest difference is Vai and Satch had at least one solo album that made it pretty big. That makes it a little easier for them. I will give Vai credit in the fact that he seems to have accepted his role as a solo artist playing theatres and mid sized venues, for the most part. Which for me, is much more appealing than arenas and stadiums anyway. J5 never had that solo album that blew up. He's released some great stuff, but it's never been a hit to the masses. It will be interesting to hear the new stuff he is recording with Motley. While I think his guitar parts will be great, I don't hold out much hope that anything earth shattering is going to come out. Motley Crue's best days are behind them.

    I totally agree with Trunk on live music being live. I also agree that this prerecorded bullshit could kill rock music. I fucking hate this need for these bands to sound perfect live. If I want to listen to the album, I'll listen to the fucking album. I go to a live show to see musicians play live. If they miss a note, so what. They are taking the heart and soul out of the live show. They are no fucking better than Milli Vanili (Nickdboybandlovers favorite band) or Britney Spears or any of these other lip syncing frauds. I love the charm of a live show. If it's not live, there is no point in even going anymore. I don't do FaceBook so I'm sure as hell not going to live shows just so I can post on FB that I was there. Fucking people these days go to these shows more for social media purposes, than they do the live music. What a shame.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    I don't do FaceBook so I'm sure as hell not going to live shows just so I can post on FB that I was there. Fucking people these days go to these shows more for social media purposes, than they do the live music. What a shame.
    I only take a few pics at shows. Why bother recording the whole show? Everyone else is!

    I have a knack for buying a ticket behind a taller person anyways...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    Most I've ever agreed with Trunk. Get the dancers to stop dancing at the chorus and sing then.

    ....
    Yeah I get having the hot bims on stage as pseudo-strippers thing. But I've seen plenty of bands, like Pink Floyd, that had sexy background singers and they didn't have to gyrate and shake-it like white girls. Floyd's singers simply swayed back and forth or stood there, and sang great!

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    Another irony is Motley Crue are being blasted for miming, yet Motley Crue is one band that kinda needs pre-recorded tracks...outside of Tommy Lee and Mick Mars, well, the other two guys suck live. They always sucked live. Vince Neil has never been a good live singer and Nikki Sixx has never been a good bass player. That was true when I saw them in 1984 and was just as true as when I saw them in 2015.

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    Nikki Sixx auditioned for Quiet Riot in 1978 after their original bass player Kelly Garni quit the band. He didn't get the gig because he couldn't play the bass. Randy Rhoads tried to teach him, and it didn't work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Another irony is Motley Crue are being blasted for miming, yet Motley Crue is one band that kinda needs pre-recorded tracks...outside of Tommy Lee and Mick Mars, well, the other two guys suck live. They always sucked live. Vince Neil has never been a good live singer and Nikki Sixx has never been a good bass player. That was true when I saw them in 1984 and was just as true as when I saw them in 2015.
    There has also been a reinvention of Mick Mars in the current media to be honest. At least in the circles I hung out in late 80s Mick Mars was a rung above CC Deville as just better than crap. In hindsight that was maybe a bit harsh and he came up with decent riffs but to me at least it's kind of weird that he is rated so highly as a musician by the young people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshmeister View Post
    There has also been a reinvention of Mick Mars in the current media to be honest. At least in the circles I hung out in late 80s Mick Mars was a rung above CC Deville as just better than crap. In hindsight that was maybe a bit harsh and he came up with decent riffs but to me at least it's kind of weird that he is rated so highly as a musician by the young people.
    Yeah, Mars as a guitar player was...when me and my buds were learning to play in the early 80's, Mick Mars was someone we considered kinda lame. As you say, he came up with decent riffs. I liked the first two Crue albums well enough for what they were. Far as guitar solos go, Mars was the original Nigel Tufnel. I recall seeing Spinal Tap in the theater when it was released, which was shortly after Shout At The Devil was put out, and thinking when the Nigel Tufnel solo spot came onscreen that it sounded just like Mick Mars. Like, when we were learning how to play, we were trying to play stuff by Van Halen, or Rhoads, or DeMartini, or George Lynch or Malmsteen. Nobody was showing up to garage band practice and showing off a Mick Mars guitar solo.

    Doubtless, Mars didn't give a shit then and doesn't now. C.C. DeVille was arguably slightly worse, although I do remember always thinking his solo in Talk Dirty To Me was perfect for the song, much like I always thought the Cavazo solo in Cum On Feel The Noize was perfect for that song.

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    Yeah but to be fair I think some of the guitarists you mention that were fair-to-midline got better with age. Mick Mars/Deville were probably better players in 2005 than they were in 1985, because they actually started practicing...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Yeah but to be fair I think some of the guitarists you mention that were fair-to-midline got better with age. Mick Mars/Deville were probably better players in 2005 than they were in 1985, because they actually started practicing...
    True I remember the day I saw CC play something I couldn't on YouTube it was disconcerting then I remembered he had at that point been a professional musician for over 20 years,


    Another one to add to the list and it's funny the things you remember, is Tracii Guns. I distinctly remember sitting around with friends in the 1980s watching the official LA Guns live VHS commercially released live video and being amazed to see him play the riff to ATAL wrongly to a crowd of thousands. Not that he made a mistake - he just didn't know how to play it.

    This as part of a nearly 7 MINUTE guitar solo spot!!??

    The power of the internet and it wasn't a false memory you can relive it now. It's at around 39 minutes.



    What was he thinking???????
    Last edited by Seshmeister; 06-18-2023 at 09:44 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry View Post
    Far as guitar solos go, Mars was the original Nigel Tufnel. I recall seeing Spinal Tap in the theater when it was released, which was shortly after Shout At The Devil was put out, and thinking when the Nigel Tufnel solo spot came onscreen that it sounded just like Mick Mars.
    For a while around about the time of Dr Feelgood he had a solo spot that was pure Spinal Tap where he had racks of guitars lying flat and attempted to play more than one at a time and they were all heavily distorted so it was obviously just a hellish mess.

    It was fucking hilarious but I'm pretty sure it wasn't meant to be.

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    I saw the Crue the first time at the 83 US Festival. I honestly thought who are these lame fucks? Sixx was on platform shoes, fake wigs and makeup. It was like a low budget KISS rip off. Anyways a few catchy songs and good at selling themselves as the bad boys of rock and roll. Now it’s drama, tracks and flab.
    Last edited by Nitro Express; 06-18-2023 at 08:32 PM.

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