'Under siege': Trump says FBI raided Mar-a-Lago

[ZahZoo]

I see the Democrats and underlying establishment power brokers as really poor strategists in all this... If they are thinking that playing up Trump as the evil enemy will motivate their base to prevail in the mid-terms, this could backfire terribly for them in a few simple outcome scenarios.

1. They succeed in tarnishing Trump enough to prevent him from running in 2024... the current motivations and methods in this has raised some serious questions on using the DOJ & FBI as a political weapon. Sure, it fires up the far left and right but... a lot of independents and people in the moderate middle are questioning these tactics and the methods being applied. Even with Trump out... I don't see that generating a shift in the Democrat's favor. Just the opposite as many moderates don't want to see our institutions used in such a manner and have little appetite for the mismanagement of the country under the current leadership. Trump out... very few have an interest in the Biden admin bumbling through another 4 years and who do they got to fill that hole?

2. This current mess continues to dominate current events for months with no meaningful outcome. Trump plays the martyr card and continues to fire up the right and both sides further disgust the moderate middle while Trump remains non-committal on running again in 2024. This thing festers on and the Dems/establishment pull more desperate moves to undermine Trump. The mid-terms result in the predicted power shift to Republicans in both the House and Senate. At the right timing when things are heated up... Trump announces he's not running. This will create a huge vacuum sucking the air out of the Left and Democrats... opening up an even bigger swing Right with strong candidates such as Pence and/or Desantis into the mix. Again the Dems got Biden and the current mess... who are they going to field in 2024?

3. Republicans take the mid-terms... Trump runs, but gets beat out by either Pence or Desantis in the Primaries. The Left and Dems have this mess they created and who are they going to bring up..? Mayor Pete? Harris? Hilary?

Is there a viable strategy that can turn any of this in favor of the current leadership that most of the country could support?

[Terry]

As someone who has never voted Republican on a national level, I can say that the Establishment of the Democratic Party has spent the last thirty years aping or co-opting the Republican Party, always moving more toward the center than actually standing for what they say they do when it comes to legislation. There haven't been any moonshot landmark legislative reforms that smack of traditional liberalism, just tinkering with Titanic deck chairs a la ACA. Or hard left social woke chatter that puts off far more people than it attracts.

I'm of the mind that if Trump has committed crimes, he should be prosecuted for them. Real world, however, you must be able to prove them in a court of law. And even if Trump is convicted on a felony, there is contention as to if that precludes him from running in 2024. I don't know how solid Trump's support in the party is now. He still has his base, but along the same lines of what ZahZoo says re: moderates and independents, those folks who voted for him in 2016 and 2020...I wonder how many of them are now ready to move on from Trump after what happened on January 6th, 2021. Yes, they may not ever vote for Biden or any other Democratic candidate but would prefer (as ZahZoo says) a Pence or a DeSantis. Basically, Trumpism in terms of the policies minus all of the extraneous distraction Trump himself brings.

I'm not sure what the viable strategy is regarding Trump that can turn enough moderates and independents toward Biden or the Democratic Party. It's this slightly odd mod/ind segment of voters who voted for Obama twice and went on to vote for Trump twice, yet also say they like what Sanders stands for. I can't figure these folks out beyond the obvious that they don't favor typical politicians. Once gender, ethnicity and sexual orientation are removed from the equation, Mayor Pete, Harris and Hillary are all typical establishment politicians. Obama turned out to be a typical establishment politician. Trump isn't a typical establishment politician.

[Kristy]

Gotta laugh at the irony of Darth Cheney complaining about Cheeto trying to steal the 2020 election... when he stole the 2000 & 2004 elections and got away with it.

True. Only diffy being Cheney was smart enough to manipulate the Supreme Court and surrounded himself with educated yes men instead of conspiratorial Reptilian shape-shifting believing morons. He pro-actively fucked with voting machines and built upon their flaws instead of making shit up after an election.

[Kristy]

I see the Democrats and underlying establishment power brokers as really poor strategists in all this... If they are thinking that playing up Trump as the evil enemy will motivate their base to prevail in the mid-terms, this could backfire terribly for them in a few simple outcome scenarios.

You watch way too much Fox News

2. This current mess continues to dominate current events for months with no meaningful outcome. Trump plays the martyr card and continues to fire up the right and both sides further disgust the moderate middle while Trump remains non-committal on running again in 2024. This thing festers on and the Dems/establishment pull more desperate moves to undermine Trump. The mid-terms result in the predicted power shift to Republicans in both the House and Senate. At the right timing when things are heated up... Trump announces he's not running. This will create a huge vacuum sucking the air out of the Left and Democrats... opening up an even bigger swing Right with strong candidates such as Pence and/or Desantis into the mix. Again the Dems got Biden and the current mess... who are they going to field in 2024?

It's moire than likely the Republicans will take back the Senate and the Dems will retain the House - both by narrow margins. Ol' orange F A T T Y does not hold the sway he used to and many old guard Republicans see him as a liability rather than asset. Ol' orange F A T T Y will run on the condition of taking money from his rubes but will have no chance of wining knowing is legal battles will hound him for the rest of his miserable life. The only way the Republicans can hold all power - combined with the highly right-wing Supreme Court is by dumping ol' orange F A T T Y and installing someone who knows how government works to permanently bring about an autocratic/fascistic police state. Then and only then can Republicans dismantle the Constitution (especially the separation of church and state) gut Social Security, Medicare/caid, go after 401K's, pensions, HSA's, abolish public education, build more prisons, give more public and private lands to corporations, privatize transportation, and attack civil rights.

The Left and Dems have this mess they created and who are they going to bring up..? Mayor Pete? Harris? Hilary?

Which mess is that? Governing in the aftermath of ol' orange F A T T Y? The only mess I see the Dems have created is that they are too lazy and too smug to fight for those who voted them into power. Seeing Biden is a one-termer (and he is) he will not run in 2024. I personally think he is incapable of being in office and yes, it is his age

Is there a viable strategy that can turn any of this in favor of the current leadership that most of the country could support?

The only way that can happen is to do away with the electoral college. Until that happens this country will continue to have inept leaders such as Biden and ol' orange F A T T Y in another rinse and repeat election cycle

[ZahZoo]

Which mess is that? Governing in the aftermath of ol' orange F A T T Y? The only mess I see the Dems have created is that they are too lazy and too smug to fight for those who voted them into power. Seeing Biden is a one-termer (and he is) he will not run in 2024. I personally think he is incapable of being in office and yes, it is his age.

The only way that can happen is to do away with the electoral college. Until that happens this country will continue to have inept leaders such as Biden and ol' orange F A T T Y in another rinse and repeat election cycle

If your only way to win is changing the election rules in your favor then you have nothing of value to offer... What mess? Do you really want a leadership based from the liberal population centers that bought into defund the police and now suffering the current crime waves leading? Look at the infrastructure collapsing in these urban waste lands... homeless populations explosions... what mess indeed.

Do you really think most in this country want to elect more idiots who believe that a person born with a penis and testicles can get fucking pregnant..?

[Von Halen]

Do you really think most in this country want to elect more idiots who believe that a person born with a penis and testicles can get fucking pregnant..?

Last time I saw NickDelusional he looked pregnant.

[Nickdfresh]

Last time I saw NickDelusional he looked pregnant.

We can't all have that slimming AIDS and Monkey Pox Von along with your other associated social diseases, you ass-fetlching cunt...

Okay I'm chubby. I also bench press 400+ lbs. and work out though not nearly enough cardio and I still pull 20+ year old girls! Suck on that you socially awkward aging diseased gayboi!

[Nickdfresh]

I see the Democrats and underlying establishment power brokers as really poor strategists in all this... If they are thinking that playing up Trump as the evil enemy will motivate their base to prevail in the mid-terms, this could backfire terribly for them in a few simple outcome scenarios.

Well Zah, I guess a lot like the other really old people here, like Von, you watch Fox News a lot. I know, I know, you really don't you don't "really" watch but just happen to parrot their talking points. In fact it's quite usual for the party in control of the White House to lose congress seats. But yet through the slavish Trump cunt licking and the incessant drive to put Catholic white people on the Supreme Court, it seems they GOP may be fucking itself harder than Von Halen at a Boy Scout Jamboree!

1. They succeed in tarnishing Trump enough to prevent him from running in 2024... the current motivations and methods in this has raised some serious questions on using the DOJ & FBI as a political weapon. Sure, it fires up the far left and right but... a lot of independents and people in the moderate middle are questioning these tactics and the methods being applied. Even with Trump out... I don't see that generating a shift in the Democrat's favor. Just the opposite as many moderates don't want to see our institutions used in such a manner and have little appetite for the mismanagement of the country under the current leadership. Trump out... very few have an interest in the Biden admin bumbling through another 4 years and who do they got to fill that hole?

Are you fucking kidding? LMFAO! That would be great!

The DOJ/FBI as a "political weapon"? At the VERY WORST the current administration would be doing what Trump was trying to do but was thankfully thwarted. I was actually in the military with a Top Secret clearance. What do you think might have happened if the National Archives genteelly and respectfully requested I return documents I took years ago and I essentially, by malice or incompetence, only partially returned the haul? I think I might be in prison along with Manning and the other little people that also committed espionage. But according to Zah, a president is essentially a dictator that can subvert laws and do whatever he wants. Turmp was in fact given "fair warning" by a DOJ and Nat'l Archives in January. But the dumb assholes from the burbs will still cry tranny and storm the capital again and threaten valiant and patriotic FBI agents when they fucking flay blue flags and vow never to defund police. Morons...

But tell me specifically how Biden is "mismanaging" things. I am also not happy with him and think he should hang it up after this term and turn it to someone younger than Trump, you and Von. But most of the meme bullshit is exactly that! Biden didn't sign a pact with the Taliban, your boys did! He isn't responsible for supply shortages and the fact that the oil and gas industry geared itself to people not driving during a pandemic lockdown and gas prices are high all over the Western World.

But hey the stock market is going back up and Von can afford his AIDS meds again if he doesn't decide to form a rightwing militia of fellow gayboi's and kidnap Democratic politicians...

2. This current mess continues to dominate current events for months with no meaningful outcome. Trump plays the martyr card and continues to fire up the right and both sides further disgust the moderate middle while Trump remains non-committal on running again in 2024. This thing festers on and the Dems/establishment pull more desperate moves to undermine Trump. The mid-terms result in the predicted power shift to Republicans in both the House and Senate. At the right timing when things are heated up... Trump announces he's not running. This will create a huge vacuum sucking the air out of the Left and Democrats... opening up an even bigger swing Right with strong candidates such as Pence and/or Desantis into the mix. Again the Dems got Biden and the current mess... who are they going to field in 2024?

Trump's "martyr card" only fires up the assholes that voted for him the first time, which is always a minority of the electorate.

Pence? Desantis? LMFAO!!!! A wax dummy right wing closet gay (like Von) and a total fucking unlikeable asshole by everyone not fucking retarded or born in Florida (same thing really). Good luck!!!!

3. Republicans take the mid-terms... ...

AHAHAHAHA!!!! Already fucking up that wet dream with the fucking asshole policies like overturning RoevWade is showing the American people. The permanent party of opposition of angry old white people seeking to overturn elections they can no longer win....

[Nickdfresh]

You watch way too much Fox News

He's old. They do that.

It's moire than likely the Republicans will take back the Senate and the Dems will retain the House

Actually looking about 50/50 at this point...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/new-polls-show-democrats-could-win-the-2022-midterms-should-you-believe-them-100037527.html

[Kristy]

If your only way to win is changing the election rules in your favor then you have nothing of value to offer...

So all that Republican voter suppression and gerrymandering isn't good enough for you?

What mess? Do you really want a leadership based from the liberal population centers that bought into defund the police and now suffering the current crime waves leading?

Okay, name me one police department was defunded. Go on. Name me one cop who didn't get his Gestapo riot uniform this year. If anything , Biden gave MORE MONEY to police than ol' orange F A T T Y ever did.

Look at the infrastructure collapsing in these urban waste lands... homeless populations explosions... what mess indeed.

Yes, just look at it. You do know the Republicans killed the Infrastructure Bill simply because there were no provisions to privatize, roads, bridges, waterways, ports, and the internet. You think yo're paying a lot for tolls now, wait until Turtle Boy gives that over to greedy corporations. Homeless populations exploding due to Republicans killing mental health treatment, foreign greedy landlords (liek ol' orange F A T T Y's RuZZian buttbuddies) skyrocketing rent prices, financial inequality and Republicans killing any measures for wage increases.


Get the fuck out of here with your dated, boring and irrelevant Kremlin-owned Fox Spews boiler plate propaganda. You're just another middle-aged white guy who feels entitled to his bigotry ans plays the victim like a child. Like your ol' orange F A T T Y fascist.

[ZahZoo]

Okay, name me one police department was defunded. Go on. Name me one cop who didn't get his Gestapo riot uniform this year. If anything , Biden gave MORE MONEY to police than ol' orange F A T T Y ever did.



Yes, just look at it. You do know the Republicans killed the Infrastructure Bill simply because there were no provisions to privatize, roads, bridges, waterways, ports, and the internet. You think yo're paying a lot for tolls now, wait until Turtle Boy gives that over to greedy corporations. Homeless populations exploding due to Republicans killing mental health treatment, foreign greedy landlords (liek ol' orange F A T T Y's RuZZian buttbuddies) skyrocketing rent prices, financial inequality and Republicans killing any measures for wage increases.


Get the fuck out of here with your dated, boring and irrelevant Kremlin-owned Fox Spews boiler plate propaganda. You're just another middle-aged white guy who feels entitled to his bigotry ans plays the victim like a child. Like your ol' orange F A T T Y fascist.

Cities that defunded police = New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Seattle, Milwaukee, Philadelphia, Baltimore and a dozen other cities have all also reduced police spending.

Infrastructure Bill: H.R.3684 - Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act became law on 11/15/2021. https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-...ouse-bill/3684

If you are gonna argue... at least check a few facts, dumbass. At least Wiki-Nick brings more to his political banter....

[Kristy]

Cities that defunded police = New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Seattle, Milwaukee, Philadelphia, Baltimore and a dozen other cities have all also reduced police spending.

Infrastructure Bill: H.R.3684 - Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act became law on 11/15/2021. https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-...ouse-bill/3684

If you are gonna argue... at least check a few facts, dumbass. At least Wiki-Nick brings more to his political banter....

Reduced does not mean "defunded"


You're the dumbass and the Republicans killed much of that Bill


So...that makes you the dumbass.




A Kremlin-propagandized dumbass at that.

[Nickdfresh]

Cities that defunded police = New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Seattle, Milwaukee, Philadelphia, Baltimore and a dozen other cities have all also reduced police spending.

These are all local decisions and have nothing to do with Biden. The US had seen police budgets bloat by 40% in the last few decades with police pay and the militarization of dept's being the biggest liabilities. Many of the budget cuts have little to do with "defunding police" and more to do with post-pandemic restructuring and many Red areas where Democrats have made inroads politically the funding for police has actually increased overall...

here's a blurb from Bloomberg:

Disparities in policing came into full view on Jan. 6 as a predominantly white mob of President Donald Trump’s supporters stormed the U.S. Capitol in a bid to overturn the results of the presidential election. Videos emerged of officers appearing to open barricades for rioters, offering a stark contrast to scenes from summer protests, where largely peaceful demonstrators were met at times with brutal force.

Police budgets will expand this year even in cities like Atlanta, Omaha and Phoenix, where Democrats picked up more votes in the 2020 presidential race versus 2016. Out of 42 major cities where Democrats gained share, 24 increased police spending for fiscal 2021, while 18 made cuts.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2021-city-budget-police-funding/

Infrastructure Bill: H.R.3684 - Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act became law on 11/15/2021. https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-...ouse-bill/3684

If you are gonna argue... at least check a few facts, dumbass. At least Wiki-Nick brings more to his political banter....

I'm touching myself Zah! Thanks buddy..

But seriously. "defunding police" doesn't necessarily mean spending less, it means redirecting funds towards social services and medical personnel as opposed to expensive cops...

[Nickdfresh]

Reduced does not mean "defunded"


You're the dumbass and the Republicans killed much of that Bill


So...that makes you the dumbass.

This is correct. Defunded can mean redirection of funds to other areas rather than to the goons getting lots of overtime. Many departments would have cut and redirected funds Irregardless of what happened to George Floyd and the resulting fallout simply because of the lessons learned from the pandemic have increased efficiency.

The only police department ever actually defunded was the one in New Jersey where they essentially used the "defunding" as a union-busting tactic to recreate a whole new department with lower paid officers devoid of the muscle memory of systemic corruption. And it seems to have worked very well as crime dropped by a lot, but now they are gradually paying the police more so mixed. HEY! If we call "defunding police" "UNION BUSTING", maybe a lot of Republicans will get on board!!!! I can see the Koch Bother ads now!!!

[Von Halen]

But seriously. "defunding police" doesn't necessarily mean spending less, it means redirecting funds towards social services and medical personnel as opposed to expensive cops...

I realize McDonald's is paying you better these days to ask "Would you like fries with that?", but the starting pay for a police officer in the city that's worse than most third world Countries, Detroit, is $40k. Hardly "expensive" for someone that literally leaves their family every day, knowing they might not return.

You're a dumbfuck socialist Libtard that would rather see welfare sponging scum make more money by doing nothing, than the police do by risking their lives.