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Thread: "The best frontman I ever saw. Nobody else came close"

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    "The best frontman I ever saw. Nobody else came close"


    "The best frontman I ever saw. Nobody else came close": The day David Lee Roth turned in the performance of a lifetime

    By Paul Elliott( Classic Rock ) published yesterday

    With a heavyweight line-up including Ozzy Osbourne, AC/DC, Van Halen, Mötley Crüe and more, Monsters Of Rock 1984 is still revered in festival folklore




    In 1997, 10 years before David Lee Roth rejoined Van Halen, the singer recalled in his autobiography Crazy From The Heat a nasty little episode that occurred some time around the early 80s, when he overheard a conversation between Eddie Van Halen, his brother Alex and an unnamed music-business figure. Roth wrote of this in the bluntest of terms: “I once heard somebody say to the Van Halens: ‘You guys play the music; the Jew sells it.’ Well, you’re fucking right.”

    Those words spoke volumes about the dynamic in the band during that era. And for British rock fans there was no greater exhibition of Roth’s showmanship than when Van Halen played at the Monsters Of Rock festival at Donington Park on August 18, 1984.

    When video footage of this performance resurfaced online in the summer of 2023, VH diehards proclaimed it “the Holy Grail”. A pro shoot from side-stage, it includes the whole set, except for a few minor cuts, plus backstage scenes from before and after. It captures all the raw power of the band; the heated atmosphere generated in the 65,000-strong audience; the element of chaos as a small number of delirious fans made it onto the stage to make a grab at their heroes. Above all else, it captures the wise-cracking, high-kicking David Lee Roth at the very top of his game.

    “As a frontman, Roth was untouchable that day,” says promoter Andy Copping, who saw the show as a 20-year-old, and has run the Download festival at Castle Donington for the past 20 years in his role as Executive President of UK Touring at Live Nation. “The way that Roth interacted with the audience was just brilliant. As the master of ceremonies, the orchestrator, he was the king.”

    But on that beautiful summer’s day, as Roth ruled that stage, there was unrest behind the scenes. Within Van Halen’s inner circle there was a growing sense that a split with the singer was inevitable, and for photographer Ross Halfin, working for the band at Donington and privy to what was going on backstage, the signs were clear. “It was always a bit weird with Van Halen,” Halfin says. “Roth was sort of separate from the rest of them. I didn’t notice this on the first tours I did with them, but I certainly did by 1984.”

    Van Halen had come a long way since they first toured in the UK in the late 70s, when Roth famously declared that Lewisham, in south London, was “the rock’n’roll capital of the world!”. But at Donington the party was coming to an end. A British audience was seeing Van Halen with David Lee Roth for the last time.

    Forty years on, the Monsters Of Rock show of 1984 is still remembered as the best Monsters of them all. The bill was incredible, with AC/DC headlining over Van Halen, Ozzy Osbourne and an impressive supporting bill featuring guitar hero Gary Moore, Californian rockers Y&T, German headbangers Accept, and, making their first appearance in the UK, the hottest new band out of Los Angeles, Mötley Crüe.

    This was Monsters Of Rock in its classic form: one day, one stage, seven bands you had to see. At least that was the idea.

    Most of those 65,000 people got there in time to see Mötley Crüe, and as Tim McMillan from Kettering remembers it: “The Crüe were loud, dumb, crude, with this snotty arrogance – everything that Kerrang! had promised!” But some people arrived late, this writer included. Eighteen at the time, I was en route from Guildford to Donington with my mate Graham and 50 other denim-clad rock fans on a double-decker bus, which got hit by a passing car on the M1. Fortunately no one was seriously injured, but our bus was stuck on the hard shoulder for an hour, maybe two. By the time we walked on the grassy slopes of Donington Park, the Crüe were long gone and Accept were on stage, banging out their homoerotic anthem London Leatherboys.

    Andy Copping arrived even later. Having spent the early afternoon DJ-ing a rock set at a club named Lazers in his home town of Lincoln, he got to Donington just in time to see Y&T end their set with a hapless roadie dressed up as a sort of robotic knight in armour. “I was gutted to miss Mötley Crüe,” he says. “But there was no way I was going to miss Van Halen. I’d seen them in 1980 at Leicester De Montfort Hall, and it was completely life-changing for me.”

    The 1984 Monsters Of Rock, more than any other before, had been hyped up as a battle of the guitar heroes – principally Gary Moore, Eddie Van Halen and Angus Young. As Copping recalls: “Gary Moore was on fire that day.” Moore threw down the gauntlet with a blistering rendition of White Knuckles, his answer to Eddie’s Eruption, and an epic version of his signature ballad Parisienne Walkways in which he held one high note that seemed to last an eternity.

    The afternoon sky was a clear blue – save for the barrages of plastic beer bottles, most of them half-filled with piss, that flew overhead regularly as a form of entertainment between bands.

    In sweltering heat, Ozzy Osbourne took to the stage. With a band that featured another emerging guitar hero, Jake E Lee, successor to the late Randy Rhoads, and a set that included Crazy Train, Bark At The Moon and Black Sabbath classics Iron Man and Paranoid, a shirtless and wild-eyed and clapping Ozzy overran his allotted time in what Copping describes as “a monumental performance”.

    Ozzy was a hard act to follow, but Van Halen were not to be upstaged. They were on a high following their US No.1 hit Jump, and a multi-million-selling album, 1984, that would also have made it to the top were it not for what turned out to be the biggest-selling album of all time, Michael Jackson’s Thriller, on which Eddie Van Halen had ripped it up with the solo in Beat It.



    The Donington crowd was buzzing, heaving, as Van Halen’s set kicked off with an explosion of wild noise, Eddie bent over his ‘Frankenstein’ guitar, his fingers a blur, Alex Van Halen pounding the drums and Michael Anthony thumping his bass caveman-style. Eddie’s trousers were as loud as the noise – banana-yellow with black tiger stripes. But the real razzle-dazzle came from David Lee Roth as he danced out to centre stage wearing a wide-brimmed hat and a glittering coat over skintight gym-bunny pants and vest. Arms raised like a prize fighter stepping into the ring, Diamond Dave sparkled in the sunshine.

    Eddie’s guitar tech Rudy Leiren delivered the high-volume introduction. “Alright, Donington! Are you ready? For the first time in five years, the mighty Van Halen!” In all this excitement, Leiren had his timing a year out. The band’s last UK tour was in 1980. But no matter. The heavyweight champions of American rock were here again at last. With Leiren’s voice still echoing, Eddie cranked out the riff to Unchained.

    It was all too much for one young woman standing close to the stage beside Mark Blake, then a 19-year-old university student from London, now an author and Classic Rock contributor. He recalls watching as a teenage blonde was overwhelmed by the sheer force of David Lee Roth’s charisma. “She let out a scream and then just keeled over,” he says. “But she was back on her feet by the end of the song.”
    More of this article at

    From https://www.loudersound.com/features...7vYpxFpxvbFB03

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    Wow, that was a great fucking read, Sesh.

    Need to dig out the "holy grail" video again and blare it in the home theater. (Especially that "Fan-Made" version, which filled in gaps with audience & BBC footage...plus improved sound.)

    WHY, WHY, WHY could this band not just find a way to keep this incredible band together?

    They were maybe the greatest thing to happen to humanity since bored cavepeople came up with oral sex.
    Roth Army Militia

    Originally posted by WARF
    Rikk - The new school of the Roth Army... this dude leads the pack... three words... The Sheep Pen... this dude opened alot of doors for people during this new era... he's the best of the new school.

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    Band burnout is what was happening to CVH by the end of 1984 tour.

    They desperately needed at least a two year break. Which wouldn't have slowed down sales. In fact 1984 continued to sell and it also boosted sales of the back catalog. With Dave's CFTH on the horizon, if that break actually happened and they got back by 1987-88 with a new album it would've been monster. Like Zeppelin IV type of monster.

    But history didn't pan out that way unfortunately.
    =V V=
    ole No.1 The finest
    EAT US AND SMILE

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinnie Velvet View Post
    Band burnout is what was happening to CVH by the end of 1984 tour.

    They desperately needed at least a two year break. Which wouldn't have slowed down sales. In fact 1984 continued to sell and it also boosted sales of the back catalog. With Dave's CFTH on the horizon, if that break actually happened and they got back by 1987-88 with a new album it would've been monster. Like Zeppelin IV type of monster.

    But history didn't pan out that way unfortunately.
    And, the truth is...Dave really didn't see it as a permanent break. He wanted time off. He didn't want to put in another year in the studio...because 1984 (as great as it was) had been (for Dave) a very tough LP to make.

    Dave wanted a year or two off to "make his movie" (let's face it...that was a stupid idea).

    Eddie drew a line in the sand and said, "Are we making an album now or not?"

    And Dave said, "No...not with the way things have been. I want some time off."

    And Eddie then said, "I ain't waiting on your ass!"

    SO...Dave was given a take-it-or-leave-it...and he left it. He left the band.

    This band needed a couple of years off...or at least a year.

    I'm sure Dave knows he fucked up big time. I wish, wish, wish that he hadn't fucking left. It just sucks.

    There are very few things in rock history that I'd like to go back in time and change like this one...though, if I had a rock-and-roll-time-machine, I'd still stop John Lennon's killer over this...or get someone to rescue John Bonham before he started puking up during his drunken stupor... BUT Dave leaving is definitely up there!!
    Last edited by Rikk; 04-03-2024 at 04:24 PM.

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    I still blame that fucking CFTH EP. If it had been a flop, Dave never would have left.

    If only he had used the band to make that album. But, as we all know from all the bitching about Diver Down, the band would not have wanted to record this EP.

    I feel so ripped off as a fan. We could have had so many more years and albums.

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    They were at different places. Roth wanted to tour the world have adventures make movies. The Van Halens wanted to sit around drinking and have a family.

    Once they were rich and successful and taking lots of coke the split was inevitable. The real failin' of Van Halen was their inability to reform soon enough, 1996 at the absolute latest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    I still blame that fucking CFTH EP. If it had been a flop, Dave never would have left.

    If only he had used the band to make that album.
    Trying to picture/listen to 1984-era VH play the CFTH songs - I dunno.
    All those songs had/have a certain vibe and I think Dave captured the feel perfectly.
    I'm not sure what Ed/Al/Mike coulda brought to those songs to make them stand out.
    Quote Originally Posted by sadaist View Post
    I don't mind that one Nickelback song. I just hate the fact that they put it on every album 10 times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
    Trying to picture/listen to 1984-era VH play the CFTH songs - I dunno.
    All those songs had/have a certain vibe and I think Dave captured the feel perfectly.
    I'm not sure what Ed/Al/Mike coulda brought to those songs to make them stand out.
    They would have Van Halenized them like they did every cover they ever did. But I agree, Dave definitely captured the feel. In fact, he captured it too well. He captured it so well, he thought he no longer needed them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Halen View Post
    They would have Van Halenized them like they did every cover they ever did. But I agree, Dave definitely captured the feel. In fact, he captured it too well. He captured it so well, he thought he no longer needed them.
    He was definitely testing the waters. I don't think the song themselves were so important to him. He was just wanting to do something separate from the band.

    It was a big hit...and then he made a very big fucking mistake.

    Sesh is right...1996 was like the last gasp of a chance for the band to make it right. By then, it had been 11 fucking years! I was SO READY for Dave to come back. I remember screaming at the top of my lungs when the DJ said, "It sounds like Sammy is out...and Dave is in."

    It was HUGE news...for a while, the news overshadowed KISS' reunion tour (which was BIG news that summer).

    Then...Eddie got his panties in a bunch, realized he wasn't going to be King Shit anymore...and destroyed the whole dream.

    (And Gary Cherone admitted in 2012 that he had already been quietly hired by the band BEFORE the whole MTV Music Video Awards debacle. I never thought Dave did anything that bad that night. He was just making a splash. They were looking for an excuse to justify NOT hiring him. They were just uncomfortable as shit on stage with him because they knew they were lying to everyone...and Dave. And I will NEVER forgive Van Halen for getting me that excited...)

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    What's really funny is that I tend to think of CFTH *as* a Van Halen adjacent release. DLR was the lead singer of the band and therefore, even though the band doesn't perform on it, it's still in the ballpark, if that makes sense?

    In my perfect world, CFTH comes out in '85, does good business...stress from the Van Halens to Roth heats up, but Warner Bros. steps in and says "Hey - we have an amazing thing going here. You guys are burnt out, you're bickering, you're coming up with stupid ideas of movies and new singers or whatever. You're all taking a step back until '86, maybe '87. In the interim, we're going to cull some performances, put out a live album, maybe a home movie. That'll sell. Ed, Al, go do a movie soundtrack if you want, whatever. We'll get back together with Ted in the studio in late '86, maybe early '87, come at it fresh and make something really cool."

    Would it have happened? Maybe. Would have been really interesting, that's for sure. Maybe they could have had Hagar open for them in '88.
    Twistin' by the pool.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bueno bob View Post
    What's really funny is that I tend to think of CFTH *as* a Van Halen adjacent release. DLR was the lead singer of the band and therefore, even though the band doesn't perform on it, it's still in the ballpark, if that makes sense?

    In my perfect world, CFTH comes out in '85, does good business...stress from the Van Halens to Roth heats up, but Warner Bros. steps in and says "Hey - we have an amazing thing going here. You guys are burnt out, you're bickering, you're coming up with stupid ideas of movies and new singers or whatever. You're all taking a step back until '86, maybe '87. In the interim, we're going to cull some performances, put out a live album, maybe a home movie. That'll sell. Ed, Al, go do a movie soundtrack if you want, whatever. We'll get back together with Ted in the studio in late '86, maybe early '87, come at it fresh and make something really cool."

    Would it have happened? Maybe. Would have been really interesting, that's for sure. Maybe they could have had Hagar open for them in '88.
    Abso-fucking-lutely.

    I think it's true...if Warners had stepped in and told the band to take a year or two off (and if Eddie/Alex had listened, which is a tall order), maybe this fucking break-up would never have happened.

    Since 1985, I have literally dreamed of an alternate universe, in which exists the NEXT Van Halen (with Roth) release. It's been up there, possibly even higher than:
    . the 1982 next Led Zeppelin album (with John Bonham)
    . the 1971 next Beatles album, the break-up never happening (songs we ended up hearing on All Things Must Pass, McCartney, Plastic Ono Band...plus Ringo's excellent It Don't Come Easy)
    . the 1981 next John Lennon album (John not being murdered...we sort of got a version of this with the under-rated Milk & Honey)
    . the 1978 next Lynyrd Skynyrd studio album that was recorded after the plane crash never happened (with Ronnie Van Zant)
    . the 1986 next Police album (although I really like Sting's Dream of the Blue Turtles)

    A 7th VH album with Dave is probably the lost album in an alternate universe I've most dreamed of for almost 40 years. Unlike some posters, I love A DIFFERENT KIND OF TRUTH...but it's still not a 7th Van Halen album, produced by Ted Templeman, engineered by Donn Landee...with Dave at the mic.

    A lot of the 5150 album's material would have been great with Dave singing. I've always been straightforward of the fact that I don't hate all the Sammy material...I just hear a lot of it as a missed opportunity. Sammy ruined a lot of great music. If Dave had sung on the music that became GET UP, BEST OF BOTH WORLDS, SUMMER NIGHTS, "5150"...that could have been a seriously-awesome follow-up to 1984.

    In this alternate universe, Sammy would never have had anything to do with the Van Halen universe...he would never have had the money to buy the Cabo Wabo cantina (or make his tequila), I wouldn't have to read bitchy comments by sheep every time I see a great YouTube clip of Dave, I wouldn't have to fight with sheep over the tired question of "Who is the best Van Halen singer?" (because Van Halen would only have ever had one singer), etc.

    Of course, in this alternate universe, the Sheep Pen would never have had to be created. And then I would never have had a friendship that continues to this day with people like Bueno Bob, Matt White, etc.

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    Speaking of which, again, DAMN GOOD TO SEE YOU HERE, BOB!!!!

    Stick around!!! (OR I will have to message you again and force you to keep coming back!!!...DON'T BE A STRANGER, MY OLD PARTNER-IN-CRIME!!)



    YOU NEVER LEAVE THE ARMY!!!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by bueno bob View Post
    What's really funny is that I tend to think of CFTH *as* a Van Halen adjacent release. DLR was the lead singer of the band and therefore, even though the band doesn't perform on it, it's still in the ballpark, if that makes sense?

    In my perfect world, CFTH comes out in '85, does good business...stress from the Van Halens to Roth heats up, but Warner Bros. steps in and says "Hey - we have an amazing thing going here. You guys are burnt out, you're bickering, you're coming up with stupid ideas of movies and new singers or whatever. You're all taking a step back until '86, maybe '87. In the interim, we're going to cull some performances, put out a live album, maybe a home movie. That'll sell. Ed, Al, go do a movie soundtrack if you want, whatever. We'll get back together with Ted in the studio in late '86, maybe early '87, come at it fresh and make something really cool."

    Would it have happened? Maybe. Would have been really interesting, that's for sure. Maybe they could have had Hagar open for them in '88.
    If the band had a strong manager like a Peter Grant then I say the band doesn't breakup.

    Noel was gone by March 1985 and Ed didn't want to work with Ted anymore either.

    So with that the writing was on the wall. There was zero band support structure in place to keep them together.

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    Monk was a useless con man and drug dealer, his presence would of done nothing.

    I agree a real manager means the band survives or does what Dave thought was agreed do his movie/soundtrack, Edward do that material he wanted that Dave hated and start the VH machine again in 88. To do that required a referee. Monk however would not of helped at all. The man was truly human garbage

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    Why Van Halen was able to survive as Van Hagar is they got Sammy’s manager Ed Leffler. That band fell apart once Ed died. Ray Daniel’s proves what the wrong manager does to a band and look what happened. Noel Monk was better than Marshall Berle but Noel was too much of a buddy of the band. Alex Van Halen said Noel Monk was completely useless in an interview. I don’t think Noel was completely useless but his band didn’t feel they needed him and he let the band situation get so out of hand it came unraveled. A good manager demands respect and they aren’t the band’s buddy. You need to have the band think they are up shit creek if they ever lost you and you could easily get a job managing someone else. If the band thinks you need them you are fucked.
    No! You can't have the keys to the wine cellar!

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    Sammy is still around because he always understood marketing. When I graduated from business school Proctor and Gambel were interviewing. One of my friends hired on with them and he got the Prell Shampoo account. No kidding. PG’s philosophy was you always could sell a product if the marketing was good enough.

    Sammy Hagar was the Prell of rock and roll but he understood how to market himself. He was smart enough to know he needed Van Halen to survive and he saw the potential of creating a Cabo Wabo brand. Sam is damn good at selling sub par products.

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    Sammy Hagar never misses an opportunity. He’s like the worst virus in the world. He keeps latching onto healthy cells and nothing can kill that guy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro Express View Post
    Sammy Hagar never misses an opportunity. He’s like the worst virus in the world. He keeps latching onto healthy cells and nothing can kill that guy.
    This.

    He's like the alien being in John Carpenter's THE THING...

    ...or the pod creatures in INVASION OF THE BODY SNATCHERS.

    The bastard walked into a situation that was already created for him. Dave did all the work, getting the name out there (ok, Eddie too...but he didn't promote the band the way Dave did)...and then Sammy walked in and reaped the benefits.

    And if Sammy were humble about it and said nothing but good things about Dave, I wouldn't really blame him. Dave DID quit.

    But it's the fact that Sammy was happy to badmouth Dave at every opportunity he could (and continues to do so to this day).

    I don't hate every single note the band did without Dave...it's just a pale imitation of the original.

    BUT...I hate Sammy as a person. He's a disgusting leech who walked into the band and then went out of his way to destroy Dave publicly. FUCKING PISSES ME OFF!! (Fuck, I wish it weren't early afternoon and I wish I still drank.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Never was View Post
    Monk was a useless con man and drug dealer, his presence would of done nothing.

    I agree a real manager means the band survives or does what Dave thought was agreed do his movie/soundtrack, Edward do that material he wanted that Dave hated and start the VH machine again in 88. To do that required a referee. Monk however would not of helped at all. The man was truly human garbage
    Exactly.

    Look at the Stones and even Queen who were on the verge of their own band breakups. Freddie was wanting to do more stuff on his own as did Roger Taylor. And both of them did. Even Brian May did his Starfleet thing (ironically with Ed involved).

    But they didn't dissolve. Queen stayed intact.

    Jagger - same thing. He did his solo thing. But the Stones came back not too long afterward.

    Dave does CFTH and the band loses their shit over an EP. Dave wants to do a movie and the band breaks up. Just stupid and comical.

    CVH with a real manager would never let them fall apart so easily.
    Last edited by Vinnie Velvet; 04-04-2024 at 02:54 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinnie Velvet View Post
    Exactly.

    Look at the Stones and even Queen who were on the verge of their own band breakups. Freddie was wanting to do more stuff on his own as did Roger Taylor. And both of them did. Even Brian May did his Starfleet thing (ironically with Ed involved).

    But they didn't dissolve. Queen stayed intact.

    Jagger - same thing. He did his solo thing. But the Stones came back not too long afterward.

    Dave does CFTH and the band loses their shit over an EP. Dave wants to do a movie and the band breaks up. Just stupid and comical.

    CVH with a real manager would never let them fall apart so easily.
    Of course, they had NO manager. They'd fired Monk. But, you're right. If they'd had an Irving Azoff then, he would have manipulated the situation there to get Dave to stay and get the band to be patient.

    The only person who was trying to do the right thing at that time was Ted. When Eddie asked him to produce 5150, he said no.

    And he admits in his book...it's NOT that he was busy producing Dave's album. It was that he could not see Van Halen without Dave...and he didn't want any part of Van Halen without Dave.

    By the time Dave asked him, VH were deep into recording with Sammy and he thought, "Fuck it. I'll work with Dave."

    He says in his book that Eddie later asked him to sequence the tracks on 5150...and no matter what one thinks of the tracks on the album, it IS sequenced right (Ted was good at shit like that).

    He did come back to salvage F.U.C.K. and record vocals...but fucked if I could tell. I still think that is the worst Van Halen album ever made. It's worse than VH 3.

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    There's a story that Eddie got really mad at Sammy around 1990 and wanted Dave to come back. (Eddie even did a radio interview in, I think, Australia in 1990 and admitted on the air that Sammy was gone and Dave was coming back.)

    Every time Dave reached out to the camp in those years, Ed Leffler put the kibosh on the whole thing.

    Ed Leffler was protecting his interests as Sammy's friend.

    Fucking shit.

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    After 88 came and went Edward spoke floated it via Dave's dad Nathan. It did not go anywhere and faded away. It was viewed more as the brothers had some issue w Sam on the OU812 tour. It was not till a few years later Edward literally saw Dave across the street in NYC he flagged him down and they spoke. I actually saw Dave that day after and he told the story somewhat speechless and said he called Ed fat. Everyone laughed and to be honest since he changed topic so fast was not sure in the moment if he was joking. Fast forward to 07 and Ed finally told the story in promotion for the tour. He was laughing and said Dave was in shock and called him fat, lol. So apparently the old man was not telling a story and the 2 of them really did randomly just bump into each other in midtown sidewalk by accident. That is just weird AF but happen.

    Leffler had VH business running as a machine at that point so he was also protecting his own work. He did a lot to clean up their business and yes benefitting Dave too. I'm sure he had bias to the guy who brought him to the dance - Sam - but he did an awful lot of good for VH business wise.

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    Think a lot of it just had to do with the band members themselves come the mid-1980's all approaching 30 years old.

    They'd been pushing toward success for ten years. Lot of hard work in addition to hard living. Takes a toll.

    Could have been nothing more than Roth and the Van Halens wanting to call more of the shots themselves and not feel constantly under the thumb of a record contract or a management contract pushing them to put out a new album and tour every year. Were that the case, a strong manager wouldn't have made the difference in terms of keeping the band together if the Van Halens wanted control. Dave and the Van Halens had simply reached the limits of their patience with each other or their tolerance of one another.

    Yeah, maybe a year or two off would have been beneficial. Maybe a year or two off would just have been forestalling the inevitable. I mean, they took an eleven-year break and THAT didn't exactly pan out too well.

    It sucked when Roth left. As to if Roth split or the Van Halens pushed him out and exactly what the chronology of the sequence of events was...I mean, regardless of how and why it went down, it sucked just the same. Because it felt like there was still creative juice left in the tank.

    But maybe it just felt that way.
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