The Sheep Pen

[bueno bob]

Hey everybody! Looks like rockvanhalen is getting into the courtyard exercise regiment with some of the others!

[bueno bob]

I got a letter from Johnny the Bear the other day...he asked me if we were indeed going to be inducting vanhalenrock as sheep of the week today - I told him yes - he asked me if he could treat rockvanhalen like the bitch sheep that he is...

I asked him to elaborate in the letter I sent back to him. His reply consisted only of this picture:

[bueno bob]

Whats that, vanhalenrock? You want some grain?

FUCK THAT!

[Rikk]

Okay. I'm confused. So, there's a COCKVANHALEN69 and also VANHALENCOCK. Right?

[bueno bob]

Don't worry vanhalenrock...diaper and poop boy will show you the ropes...

[diamondsgirl]

Originally posted by Rikk
Okay. I'm confused. So, there's a COCKVANHALEN69 and also VANHALENCOCK. Right?

All these sheep start to look alike after a while don't they?

[bueno bob]

Originally posted by Rikk
Okay. I'm confused. So, there's a COCKVANHALEN69 and also VANHALENCOCK. Right?

yup...

[Rikk]

Gotcha.

I'm not back yet. But I just thought I'd visit. Can I kick VANHALENCOCK on my way out of the Pen?

[bueno bob]

Feel free

He's waiting...unsuspecting stupid animals...

[guwapo_rocker]

Couldn't keep your yap shut could you Rikky......

See the Sheep in action.....

More quotes from Rikky Retardo:

Rikk
Good Enough

Member #1059
Posts: 1,775 (1.04 per day)
From: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Registered: 03.01.00
Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs


Posted 02.02.02 09:45 AM

RIGHT NOW isn't a ballad, is it? No, of course it's not. TAKE ME BACK? No, that's not a ballad. Great song, though.

I guess I'd have to say WHEN IT'S LOVE if I really have to pick one. It is extremely well-written, I'd have to say. Great hook, great melodies.




Hi Walter.

It's kind of a typical thing for bands to release longer versions of albums in overseas markets so that fans will have to shell out and buy another copy of the album. I DID! I never got the CD-single because the Japanese version of the album seemed easier to find, but it cost me a bitch (from the Inside store).

I really like CROSSING OVER. I think it's better than a lot of the stuff off of BALANCE. I've never been a huge fan of the first three tracks on that album, and feel that the album starts kicking in with AMSTERDAM. I do think that the band could have easily cut off some of BALANCE's real fluff, like STRUNG OUT, DOIN' TIME or BALUCHITHERIUM and put CROSSING OVER in its place. Sammy pushed for it do get on the album, but obviously he didn't seem to have much say anymore. Fairbairn was a great producer, but his opinion that CROSSING OVER is too dark for the rest of the album yet putting three instrumentals was a good idea just boggles my mind. It's enough to see a drum solo at a concert, but on an album? And STRUNG OUT is crap.

Oh well. It's a good song.

They did the same with BEST OF, VOL. 1. HOT FOR TEACHER appears on the Japanese version of that album but not on the American version. It's kind of ridiculous that a song like HOT FOR TEACHER (one of their best known songs) doesn't make the best of album, but something like POUNDCAKE (which is not one of my favorites and not nearly as well known) does.

I thought they were going to do the same with VH3. I thought that THAT'S WHY I LOVE YA would have ended up on the Japanese release, but it didn't.




Link



Rikk
Good Enough

Member #1059
Posts: 1,775 (1.04 per day)
From: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Registered: 03.01.00
Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs


Posted 02.13.02 09:28 PM

Hey, it's a great album. It's no 1984, FAIR WARNING, etc. But BLACK N' BLUE, CABO WABO, FEELS SO GOOD and AFU are all great songs. MINE ALL MINE is also amazing!

To this day, I still hate FINISH WHAT YA STARTED more than almost any other VH song. It's bad country. That's what it is. Plus it has some of the most moronic lyrics in history. Mind you, BLACK N' BLUE's lyrics aren't exactly Shakespeare, but the music and vocals are still amazing in that one. BLACK N' BLUE is probably my second-favorite Hagar-era VH song (after HUMANS BEING).
[ February 13, 2002 at 09:29 PM: Message edited by: Rikk ]



Link


Yeah, they do often make stupid choices for singles. While I don't like the F.U.C.K. album, releasing RIGHT NOW as the first single would have been a great decision. It was THE song of the album. I never liked POUNDCAKE...no hook to me in it. Even Eddie's work is pretty boring, and it sounds like bad arena rock (no flames, please...I just don't like it). Same with BALANCE. I really don't like any of the singles off that album. DON'T TELL ME is nowhere near the standout cut of the album for me. I would have thrown out AFTERSHOCK or even TAKE ME BACK (both great songs).


Rikk


Good Enough

Member #1059
Posts: 1,775 (1.04 per day)
From: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Registered: 03.01.00
Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs




Posted 07.28.02 07:17 PM



BLACK N' BLUE is one of my favorite Van Hagar songs. I like it so much because it is much rawer and reminds me of the Dave days. It's not nearly as polished as some of the other "corporate" stuff. It is probably the main reason OU812 is my favorite Van Hagar album. It's great to know that I'm not the only one who loves the song!

As for CAN'T GET THIS STUFF NO MORE, the music was apparently written and recorded during the BALANCE sessions as "BACKDOOR SHUFFLE." Dave recorded new vocals over it for the BEST OF (ME WISE MAGIC was brand new), and Hagar apparently later sued the band because Dave slightly borrowed the melody on the chorus from Sam's original vocal (he had an out-of-court settlement for $5000).

I agree. BLACK N' BLUE really was the last time the band released a hardcore rock n' roll single until HUMANS BEING, ME WISE MAGIC, and possibly WITHOUT YOU.


Link


I have to relisten to SUCKER IN A 3-PIECE to hear that lyric. You know, that's probably one of my most underlistened VH songs, only because there's no hook in it I really like. Good playing, though.

As for JUDGMENT DAY, the argument I was agreeing with was based on singles, not actual songs. JUDGMENT DAY was not a single (not that I know of, anyway). I'm definitely not saying that BLACK 'N' BLUE was the last rock song until ME WISE MAGIC, just the last real rock single. That's the thing with Hagar albums: too many songs to skip through to get to the good ones...especially on F.U.C.K. I agree that JUDGMENT DAY stands out, as well as PLEASURE DOME and even RIGHT NOW (though it's overplayed). But the rest of the album is a big bore for me.


I agree. I far prefer Dave, but HUMANS BEING and BLACK 'N' BLUE are amazing.


Link

I 100% agree. Sam's melodies are good, and the solo sequence is great. What an awesome riff to solo over, and then Eddie doubles the bass part making the solo riff so much heavier. I completely love the song. Great drum sound too! And it was amazing live in Toronto.


Link

Rikk
Good Enough

Member #1059
Posts: 1,775 (1.04 per day)
From: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Registered: 03.01.00
Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs

Posted 07.29.02 11:05 PM

I was at the Toronto show. Mike did have a solo. In fact, they did cut some songs for the PPV. The Canadian MUCHMUSIC broadcast aired AFTERSHOCK instead of AMSTERDAM (I was at the second show with AFTERSHOCK, not AMSTERDAM), and also aired the RUNNIN' WITH THE DEVIL/ONE WAY TO ROCK bit. JUMP was also aired, and although it is better than the horror that was included on RIGHT HERE, RIGHT NOW, I still don't feel that Sam ever pulled this song off. Anyway, the MUCHMUSIC broadcast was actually shorter, missing other songs in the actual PPV.

The show was good...I like watching the video. But when I was at the show, I was actually a little under-whelmed. It was my first VH show, and although it was very good, it was not the legendary rock spectacle that I came to know through the Roth videos I own. I guess I like live entertainment and not just a band playing their songs and smiling.

Still, it was a very professional, excellently-played concert. And the vibe by the lake was excellent. It was a nice surprise to see AMSTERDAM when I watched the video. And FEELIN' was excellent...the sun was almost down, and the vibe was amazing.

It's definitely the Hagar tour I'm glad I caught them on. And it was still 1000 times better than the VH3 show I caught three years later in Toronto.

[wraytw]

Hey, look. The Retarded Rodent.

[guwapo_rocker]

You're funny................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[wraytw]

Yeah, I am. But you're obviously not into grammar.

[guwapo_rocker]

Yawn.

[wraytw]

I couldn't have said it better, myself.

[Rikk]

Okay. One more time class. When I was younger, I used to listen to Van Hagar even though I hated Sammy. I think a LOT of people at this site have been guilty about that. I did NOT buy the new album. I did NOT go see the new tour, unlike many of Guwapo's friends. When I posted at the Links (which started five years ago), it was inevitable that I would get talking to people about Van Halen. But anyway, here is a post I put in the Sheep Pen when Guwapo first attacked me a few weeks ago. This is what most of my Links posts were like. Guwapo keeps purposefully leaving this shit out...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You want to call me a fucking bi-Halen fan? LOL!! Okay...this took me 10 fucking minutes to compile because it is so easy to find anti-Sammy, pro-Dave posts of mine at the Links.

They say that I'm a closet-Hagar fan and a hypocrite? Let's look at what the majority of my posts over there were like...Guwapo and Chelle and the others didn't really think you should see this...

Okay, first off, here's a recent post from this summer...but we'll get to the older ones later:

"I guess it still always boils down to opinion. I've heard Sammy say MANY things. I've heard him say that the original 6-pack were only good musically, I've heard him say that he'd go out and pick those albums up just for the guitar-work... Sam pretends he's a Van Halen fan, but the truth is, he doesn't even know all the band's songs. What I hate most about the Sammy-era was not just that I don't like Sam's stage-demeanor, voice, lyrics or politics...but also that the original Van Halen band was as dead as it could be. An entire song catalog was ignored, the band's image and attitude were more in-line with late 80's pop rock bands instead of the giant extraveganza they were in the late-70s and early-80s. And Sam simply acted as if this was the band. I've actually heard him in one interview call the Hagar-led Van Halen line-up "THE classic Van Halen". He really thinks he walked in and fixed up a broken band. And it disgusts me. But the thing I loved most about Van Halen in the 80s was that with all the horrible pop-rock bands around, Van Halen were sort of the rebels. They were huge, they sold tons of records...but they didn't jump on to the REO Speedwagon bandwagon...there's an episode of BEHIND THE MUSIC describing how Van Halen stood out in a cold, bleak time. Once Hagar joined...they WANTED to sound more like Journey, Styx, Def Leppard, etc. And that's fine...but you suddenly realized why the band thought Dave was controlling...he simply didn't want them going down that path."

Yeah, talk about a closet bi-Halener. And that's one of the nicest ones.

Here's one from this summer, but before I came to the Army. It's obvious how much I'm a "closet Sammy fan":

"Lyrics aren't necessarily what literally matter. I think James Brown accomplished more in his career with one song than Sam has in thirty years of mediocrity. Take SEX MACHINE...what's it about? Duh! But does it say it well? Damn straight! It's about attitude. Iggy Pop can tell you that any day. "I got a lust for life! Liquor and drugs!" Damn straight! It's not what's said, it's how it's said." People keep typing, "Nobody expects Van Halen to have intelligent lyrics." Absolutely right. But how about good lyrics? That's a totally different thing. MEAN STREET's lyrics surely aren't intelligent...but they sure are good. "Somebody said FAIR WARNING...Lord, strike that poor boy down!" Fuckin' A, Dave. That's a helluva lot more rock 'n' roll than "I can't stop lovin' you, no matter what I say or do, you no my heart is true...wo-oh...I can't stop lovin' you." C'mon...what is this? Grade 4 poetry day? Don't you think there's a reason that far more people would cringe at the second lyric? I'm not saying it's about comparing the intelligence of the two. I'm saying it's about the quality, attitude and originality. And the second lyric is about as original as taking off your clothes in a nudist colony.

Once again, it's obvious what the other idiots have been trying to prove with their witchhunt. And it's obvious that this needs to stop.

Here's me last Christmas when the new "reunion" was announced:
"Van Halen with Hagar is not a good enough reason for people to get excited again. It's like, "That line-up again? Ho hum." "

Yeah, man...I sure was lying about my past over here.

You want something older? No PROBLEM. This is the post that started a fight with Brett and made me leave the Links and VH-internet land for a year because I was always getting in trouble for fighting with Ched-heads:

"See, dummy, this is the problem. You read lyrics like that, YOU don't get it. To you it doesn't mean anything, because you don't understand the value of good wordplay, of attitude in the writing. You'll be happy if the lyrics stay as dumb and unchallenging as, "You miss a beat, you lose the rhythm." Wow, that's so profound. That's like saying, "When I go down, I'm not going up." Wow. How deep. You'll never get it, so fans like you will keep making unbelievably stupid comments like THE INSIDE is better than ME WISE MAGIC. All it's about, oh Sambo-heads, is that we think one singer is better because the music he's produced is consistently better, and maybe we think he looks better on stage.
"I can't stop lovin' you, no matter what I say or do, you know my heart is true...oh-ooh, I can't stop lovin' you." Yeah, Walt Whitman would be proud."

And here's my third-last post in VH land for a year...I'm obviously such a closet bi-Halen fan ::
"Brett, shove your forum up your ass. I knew you'd look."

Again, I'm cool with Brett because we're both people who disagreed. And I don't hate the man just because I don't agree 100% with him on his musical tastes.

I guess Pete and Guwapo forgot to cut and paste this post I made, from August 25, 2002 (when I was a Linker, "loving Hagar", and a "hypocrite"):
"Ridiculous...songs like "Voodoo Queen" are a million times better than horrible songs like "Spanked." And even with producers supervising, albums with Hagar are not nearly as timeless. Dave has been their first choice the last few years, so if it doesn't work out, music won't be the reason. There's obviously something personal. I would say Hagar will return only as a consolation prize for Dave not returning. Ed knows which of his songs are classics, and it sure ain't MAN ON A MISSION or SUCKER IN A 3-PIECE."

You know what's especially funny? I haven't had to search hard for these. It's almost like any post of mine I look at in my post list comes up with something like this...something trashing Hagar and cheering Dave. I fought with so many Ched-heads over there and finally came over here, voluntarily. I'm not banned anywhere (except at Chelle's site...LOL).

Here's yet another, kind of explaining my hatred of Sammy even though I own all the albums...my "enemies" had to look hard to find posts they could use...this one kind of puts it in perspective. This is also from 2002:

"And I don't like Sammy, so if he rejoins, I don't have to listen. It's not a matter of anger or "showing" Eddie...it's just that, after the last few months of thinking about it, I really don't want to hear more Van Halen with Sammy Hagar singing. The truth is, I just don't like the guy. I think he's an idiot and an asshole. But hey, it's just music."

Or how about this?:

"While I appreciate your idea, I just really want Dave back in the band full-time. If they don't want to do it, if they claim that can't happen, no problem. I don't have to listen."

Here's me in 2001, talking about YOU CAN'T GET THIS STUFF NO MORE:

"Be interested to hear the original version with Hagar singing. He later sued the band and won a settlement, claiming the melody Dave is singing is (in certain parts) the same one he came up with and recorded for the BALANCE album. Maybe he was just mad because the song suddenly had some balls. Old foagie."

There's SO MUCH more. I was a one-trick pony over there.

Did I post stuff about other Van Halen? Fuck yes. I've never denied a fucking thing about that. I've posted many times which shows I've been to. I've also been honest as shit about finally not being able to put up with VH anymore without Dave. And I've also been honest as hell about VH without Dave being nothing but a "consolation prize". I got into VH in 1984 when Dave appeared on my T.V. screen. Ed is a great guitar player, but I don't really care about that very much. Dave is the main reason I loved that band. I listened to the others, and as a younger person still tried to enjoy it all. But I was always loyal to one faction, and for a long time now, I've basically hated the other faction. And I always knew that there was nothing on Earth like VH with David Lee Roth. And I always hated Sammy himself. Simple to understand? I AM AND HAVE ALWAYS BEEN THE BIGGEST DAVE-LOVER ON THE PLANET. I didn't go see them Van Hagar summer, I didn't buy the horrible BEST OF BOTH WORLDS, I didn't buy their new shitty DVD.

Any other questions, class? Do you doubt it? Go look at my posting history over there. Hell, ask Brett what I was like over there and why I fought so much. He'll tell you.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Rikk]

And let's see...GUWAPO is friends with FAB. He seems to jump in everytime she attacks me. He's attacking me for being a Van Hagar fan, huh? That is total bullshit and everyone knows I fucking hate Hagar. But let's see what GUWAPO's friend FAB thinks about Dave. After all, she really wants to post here again, huh? These are all collected quotes of FAB's from HER Links days. Funny how GUWAPO managed to stay friends with her, though. I really would like to know what she's doing here.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I dont really consider myself a Roth fan... The DLR of the 80's is not the same as the DLR of today" So, that said, is it ok for me to keep ragging on him, since I'm not claiming to be a fan and stuff?"

"I'd probably NEED the beers to sit through a full show of Daveisms..."

"Oh yeah... well I know a guy who had several *AHEM* encounters of the close kind with Dave when he was in Argenitalia and he was smoking hot but as queer as a 2 dollar bill..."

"Men are from venus, Dave is from Mars."

"Absolutly NOT! Unless of course there are no guests because it'd get really old watching a show where Dave constantly out talks and interrupts them. I can't see Dave in that role because with him, it'a All Dave all the time... I doubt he'd be interested in sharing the spotlight... Without guests, the show would last 3.75 mins because after that he be back to using old material..."

"Sammy may be short but havent you ever heard about how short guys are pistols when it comes to punching... Little F%$Kers can kick butt! Dave has to turn everything into comedy... maybe that's why in REAL life he's pretty much a loner. But then again, who needs friends..."

"Doing originals is alot more noble and requires alot more talent than doing copies. Dave is out to make a quick buck...He always liked doing covers because 1/2 of the work was already done..."

"Just my opinion but Dave's been doing the same exact show for years now. I wouldn't pay a nickle to see him."

"I dont think we will EVER see EVH and DLR on the same stage ever again. I really don't think that even the RRHOF will be reason enough for Ed to ever stand by Dave again. If I were Ed I wouldn't give DLR the time of day. The way that Dave goes out and continues to talk smack about Eddie after everything that he's been going through is not the way that people should treat people. I dont believe in kicking people when they are down and I especially don' like the way that Dave has been making a living by riding on the coat tails of the original VH yet continues to slam the people who help made all of it possible..."

"We all know Dave was always into easy money while Ed was more of an earner."

"Thing about Sammy is that when he is talking badly about someone he just being blantantly honest. He isnt trying to degrade or humiliate them. He makes it perfectly clear that he's simply speaking his opinion from his experiences dealing with that individual. Dave on the other hand gets down and dirty, takes cheap shots and throws in cowardly digs at peoples personal problems. I'd really love to see Sammy and the VH brothers work it out and make some music together. I think there is a chance of that happening. As for DLR, other than his renditions of the old VH songs played with a different band, I think he's finished with VH for good and I'm not sad about it anymore."


Sammy can still sing, Dave cant
Sammy makes his own music, Dave does covers
Sammy looks his age, Dave looks 105
Sammy puts on a show, Dave just wants to get it over with and get paid...

Ever hear the same joke twice? Dave is that joke..."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Guwapo, you're one obsessed pussy. You want the Sheep Pen back? You sucked in there. But ask Matt and Bob and Bill how they feel. Of course, you also attacked them last night, didn't you? Pete even got drunk and created an anti-Matt thread in his own forum and then erased it today in embarressment. You three fucking drunks make me laugh.

[bueno bob]

I've decided to go through this little thing piece by piece and throw in my own comments and observations (look for them in brackets like these - I'll say "Bob Says:" right before I make any comments). If there's anything blatantly pro-Hagar, how cool Hagar stuff is, etc, and either direct or indirectly bashing Roth or speaking as to how Hagar is superior to Roth, I'll gladly see your point, guwapo.

Here we go. I'm going to cut out nothing from the posts, but I will cut out any inconsequential shit in order to (hopefully) avoid the fury of Sarge's Little Helper...

Originally posted by guwapo_rocker
Rikk

Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs


Posted 02.02.02 09:45 AM

RIGHT NOW isn't a ballad, is it? No, of course it's not. TAKE ME BACK? No, that's not a ballad. Great song, though. (Bob says: Right Now isn't a ballad by my definition of a ballad, either...I disagree with Rikk on Take Me Back, that one's about as close to ballad as it gets, but from a solely instrumental standpoint, the music is decent...it's not Roth Van Halen, so it's not good Van Halen to me, but I would have liked these songs had they been by written by someone other than Van Halen...it's Hagar that wrecks them. I have no problem with what Rikk said in those regards. I don't see him singing any praises to Hagar or hear him saying that Hagar Van Halen is in any way superior to Roth Van Halen).

I guess I'd have to say WHEN IT'S LOVE if I really have to pick one. It is extremely well-written, I'd have to say. Great hook, great melodies. (Bob says: Agreed, When it's Love is a ballad - again, musically, for that sort of thing, it's notationally good - but it's not what real Van Halen was about - When it's Love is closer to Bon Jovi/Def Leppard material...again, no problem with what Rikk said...again, I don't see him singing any praises to Hagar over Roth).


Hi Walter.

It's kind of a typical thing for bands to release longer versions of albums in overseas markets so that fans will have to shell out and buy another copy of the album. (Bob says: True). I DID! I never got the CD-single because the Japanese version of the album seemed easier to find, but it cost me a bitch (from the Inside store). (Bob says: I've bought every Van Halen album ever released aside from Best of Both Worlds...everything post 1991 used...so what?).

I really like CROSSING OVER (Bob says: I didn't; no big deal). I think it's better than a lot of the stuff off of BALANCE (Bob says: Even though I didn't like that song, I'd agree). I've never been a huge fan of the first three tracks on that album, and feel that the album starts kicking in with AMSTERDAM (Bob says: I agree again...Balance was a sleeper and Ed wasn't doing anything worth mentioning until Amsterdam). I do think that the band could have easily cut off some of BALANCE's real fluff, like STRUNG OUT, DOIN' TIME or BALUCHITHERIUM and put CROSSING OVER in its place (Bob says: agreed, yet again). Sammy pushed for it do get on the album, but obviously he didn't seem to have much say anymore (Bob says: When Ed Leffler died, Sammy lost his voice in that band, period). Fairbairn was a great producer, but his opinion that CROSSING OVER is too dark for the rest of the album yet putting three instrumentals was a good idea just boggles my mind (Bob says: Mine as well...stupid to have so many pointless instrumentals, better to throw in a full length track, even if it's not that great). It's enough to see a drum solo at a concert, but on an album? And STRUNG OUT is crap (Bob says: YET AGAIN, agreed).

They did the same with BEST OF, VOL. 1. HOT FOR TEACHER appears on the Japanese version of that album but not on the American version. It's kind of ridiculous that a song like HOT FOR TEACHER (one of their best known songs) doesn't make the best of album, but something like POUNDCAKE (which is not one of my favorites and not nearly as well known) does (Bob says: Exactly).

I thought they were going to do the same with VH3. I thought that THAT'S WHY I LOVE YOU would have ended up on the Japanese release, but it didn't (Bob says: I didn't know this...I thought that track WAS on the Japanese import...haven't ever heard it, though).

Rikk
Good Enough

Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs


Posted 02.13.02 09:28 PM

Hey, it's a great album. It's no 1984, FAIR WARNING, etc. But BLACK N' BLUE, CABO WABO, FEELS SO GOOD and AFU are all great songs. MINE ALL MINE is also amazing! (Bob says: Those songs are badly produced, but as far as the music itself is concerned, I don't have a problem with Ed, Al and Mike's performance...I just have a problem with the fact that THEY were performing it. Again, if it had been someone other than Van Halen, I probably would have liked it a lot more - please show me where Rikk is saying Hagar is the man for Van Halen and shittalking Roth. Nowhere? That's what I thought).

To this day, I still hate FINISH WHAT YA STARTED more than almost any other VH song (Bob says: So do I). It's bad country. That's what it is. Plus it has some of the most moronic lyrics in history (Bob says: Sing it, brother...). Mind you, BLACK N' BLUE's lyrics aren't exactly Shakespeare, but the music and vocals are still amazing in that one (Bob says: The music's decent, don't care for the vocals at all, because they're Hagar - I'm sure he puts in as good a performance as he's capable of doing, but I don't like Hagar, erego, don't like the song excepting the music elements). BLACK N' BLUE is probably my second-favorite Hagar-era VH song (after HUMANS BEING) (Bob says: Humans Being had some great guitar work in it and I actually found myself enjoying it for that...if somebody put a gun to my head and forced me to pick a Hagar era song to call my favorite, it'd be Humans Being as well...but Black and Blue wouldn't be anywhere close to second...split agreement with Rikk on this one).

Yeah, they do often make stupid choices for singles (Bob says: Yup). While I don't like the F.U.C.K. album, releasing RIGHT NOW as the first single would have been a great decision (Bob says: Yup again - Poundcake was a bad first single to choose, Right Now would have been a better lead-off single for marketing reasons...Poundcake was entirely too generic). It was THE song of the album (Bob says: If F.U.C.K. actually had A song...the whole album was a toss for me). I never liked POUNDCAKE...no hook to me in it (Bob says: That's because there IS none - agreed). Even Eddie's work is pretty boring, and it sounds like bad arena rock (no flames, please...I just don't like it) (Bob says: Yup, feel free to flame). Same with BALANCE. I really don't like any of the singles off that album. DON'T TELL ME is nowhere near the standout cut of the album for me (Bob says: Any band in the position of Van Halen, at they were at the time, had to have a standout track or three for singles purposes - Don't Tell Me, the leadoff single, was not really the best decision; agreed again). I would have thrown out AFTERSHOCK or even TAKE ME BACK (both great songs) (Bob says: Disagreed. I don't think either of those tracks were great by any terms, as Balance was a complete toss to me).

Rikk


Good Enough


Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs


BLACK N' BLUE is one of my favorite Van Hagar songs. I like it so much because it is much rawer and reminds me of the Dave days (Bob says: It is rawer, but nothing about Hagar era material reminds me of the David years - 50/50 split on that one). It's not nearly as polished as some of the other "corporate" stuff (Bob says: True). It is probably the main reason OU812 is my favorite Van Hagar album (Bob says: Favorite can almost mean most easily tolerable as opposed to any of the others...will speak to Rikk about that later and get it from the horses mouth). It's great to know that I'm not the only one who loves the song!

As for CAN'T GET THIS STUFF NO MORE, the music was apparently written and recorded during the BALANCE sessions as "BACKDOOR SHUFFLE." Dave recorded new vocals over it for the BEST OF (ME WISE MAGIC was brand new), and Hagar apparently later sued the band because Dave slightly borrowed the melody on the chorus from Sam's original vocal (he had an out-of-court settlement for $5000) (Bob says: True, so far as I was aware Still haven't found anything where Rikk's saying "Hagar Rules!" or anything even remotely close).

I agree. BLACK N' BLUE really was the last time the band released a hardcore rock n' roll single until HUMANS BEING, ME WISE MAGIC, and possibly WITHOUT YOU (Bob says: Would agree on all three songs; Humans Being showed Ed playing raw and had more gravel and grit to it than anything Hagar polished prior to it...MWM goes without saying and Without You, while it was shit-poor for writing, did have some decent EVH riffage in it, as many elements of Van Halen 3 did).


I have to relisten to SUCKER IN A 3-PIECE to hear that lyric. You know, that's probably one of my most underlistened VH songs, only because there's no hook in it I really like. Good playing, though (Bob says: Agreed, Ed, Al and Mike play it well enough for what it is).

As for JUDGMENT DAY, the argument I was agreeing with was based on singles, not actual songs. JUDGMENT DAY was not a single (not that I know of, anyway). I'm definitely not saying that BLACK 'N' BLUE was the last rock song until ME WISE MAGIC, just the last real rock single. That's the thing with Hagar albums: too many songs to skip through to get to the good ones (Bob says: Still not seeing anything where Rikk goes pro-Hagar here...As I said before, I bought all of Van Halens albums up to Van Halen 3, and that was solely to hear the music - Even though I think he's a fucking horrible human being, he's always been one of my favorite guitarists and FUCK YOU if you don't like it...Hagar was the necessary evil in order to get to it)...especially on F.U.C.K. I agree that JUDGMENT DAY stands out, as well as PLEASURE DOME and even RIGHT NOW (though it's overplayed) (Bob says: Agreed yet again...J.D., P.D. were musically decent and Right Now was overplayed ATROCIOUSLY, but the music was good - I love the piano, been playing it since I was 4...have rarely heard a released song with piano (or piano styled synth) that I haven't liked to some degree or another). But the rest of the album is a big bore for me (Bob says: agreed).

I agree. I far prefer Dave, but HUMANS BEING and BLACK 'N' BLUE are amazing. (Bob says: I wouldn't use the word "amazing", but I would use the word "listenable", so long as you can get past the Hagar thing).

I 100% agree. Sam's melodies are good, and the solo sequence is great (Bob says: Wouldn't agree that Sam's melodies are "good" because I don't like his melodies - B.F.D, doesn't mean Rikk's out there boosting Hagar and hating on Roth). What an awesome riff to solo over, and then Eddie doubles the bass part making the solo riff so much heavier. I completely love the song. Great drum sound too! And it was amazing live in Toronto.


Rikk
Good Enough

Favorite VH Album: 1984
Favorite VH Song: Drop Dead Legs

Posted 07.29.02 11:05 PM

I was at the Toronto show. Mike did have a solo. In fact, they did cut some songs for the PPV. The Canadian MUCHMUSIC broadcast aired AFTERSHOCK instead of AMSTERDAM (I was at the second show with AFTERSHOCK, not AMSTERDAM), and also aired the RUNNIN' WITH THE DEVIL/ONE WAY TO ROCK bit. JUMP was also aired, and although it is better than the horror that was included on RIGHT HERE, RIGHT NOW, I still don't feel that Sam ever pulled this song off (Bob says: agreed - because Sam CAN'T DO IT). Anyway, the MUCHMUSIC broadcast was actually shorter, missing other songs in the actual PPV (Bob says: Just sounds like an honest review of what was aired, where's the fucking problem with that?).

The show was good...I like watching the video. But when I was at the show, I was actually a little under-whelmed. It was my first VH show (Bob says: There are MANY Dave or the Grave acolytes here have HAD to go see Van Hagar just to have the chance to see Ed, Mike and Al - I'm one of them, never denied it), and although it was very good, it was not the legendary rock spectacle that I came to know through the Roth videos I own (Bob says: Agreed yet again, because it's not). I guess I like live entertainment and not just a band playing their songs and smiling (Bob says: exactly).

Still, it was a very professional, excellently-played concert (Bob says: The Van Hagar shows I saw were, also). And the vibe by the lake was excellent. It was a nice surprise to see AMSTERDAM when I watched the video. And FEELIN' was excellent...the sun was almost down, and the vibe was amazing (Bob says: Being at a concert when the sun goes down and a band plays any particular song...doesn't matter...the moment has a tendancy to stay with you, especially if you're having a good time outside of the fact, hanging out with your friends, etc).

It's definitely the Hagar tour I'm glad I caught them on (Bob says: It goes back to having to see Van Hagar just to see Ed & Co.; if Rikks glad he caught them on the Balance tour, good for him - I caught them on F.U.C.K. and the Right Here Right Now tour, and the RHRN tour was my personal favorite). And it was still 1000 times better than the VH3 show I caught three years later in Toronto (Bob says: Considering all the reports of how Gary was on stage, it probably was).

All in all, there are several things I'll HIGHLY disagree with Rikk on, but my opinions on the Hagar catalog probably vary from his and everyone elses, too. I'm not so stupid as to think that Ed, Mike and Al haven't made ONE NOTE of good music since 1984; that's beyond stupid, it's just plain ignorant. I have stuck true to my guns, however, and never supported having Hagar in the band...but, fuck, we all know that. I'm a Roth man. I don't think Van Halen's music has been anywhere near as good or motivated since he left. I don't think it ever will be. Given cause and opportunity, I'm happy to discuss my views on the post Roth music itself with other people. There are elements of Van Halen's MUSIC with Hagar (certain tones, riffs, solos, etc) that I've enjoyed, for being they what they are. The links are without a doubt the best place to discuss those things, wouldn't you agree?

That's what I've seen Rikk doing in the above posts, nothing more. He's certainly not asking why anybody still cares about Dave, because he's so washed up and such a has-been and so on, like the definition of a SHEEP would. Erego, Rikk's no sheep.

And, let's not mince words here...I'm pretty fucking strict when it comes to the definition of a sheep. There's a reason I haven't demanded Shaun's head on a silver platter yet, and that's because he's got his head screwed on straight when it comes to Van Hagar.

I'm sorry, but I haven't seen anything here to suggest that Rikk's anywhere close to being a sheep, myself.

[Rikk]

Originally posted by bueno bob
I'm sorry, but I haven't seen anything here to suggest that Rikk's anywhere close to being a sheep, myself.

Thank you, Bob. Now maybe the other post, three posts above, will explain a little clearer what kind of a poster I was usually like at the Links. Read that, and I think it'll be pretty clear that I've ALWAYS been an enemy of sheep.

Also, read FAB's little schpiel about Dave. And then ask yourself why Guwapo has no problem juming in to protect her.

And while we're at it...this sure ain't SHEEP PEN content. And it's stupid. I just don't want anyone thinking I'm a sheep because some hamster liar wants his own witchhunt. I hope the PEN gets back on topic. If not, we'll have to close it because GUWAPO can't stand the place existing without him. I'm still out, so why he still wants to spam it is beyond me.

[scorpioboy33]

someone can like some van hagar shit and not be a sheep.....big fuckin deal...I really dig right here and a few others...doesn't come close to being van halen without roth....I like Rikk and I dig rat....again big deal

[Rikk]

Originally posted by scorpioboy33
someone can like some van hagar shit and not be a sheep.....big fuckin deal...I really dig right here and a few others...doesn't come close to being van halen without roth....I like Rikk and I dig rat....again big deal

Thanks Scorpio. I'm downing a beer right now, and the next swig is on you, my friend!

[bueno bob]

I just want to reiterate that liking elements of the music does not equate into supporting Hagar. I just told Rikk in pm (and YES, I'm announcing it here) that I thought Ed's playing on "5150" (the song) was fucking great.

Please tell me in which language that translates into "I hate David, he's washed-up, and sammy's the MAN!" it fucking doesn't, period.

To think that Ed and Al and Mike couldn't buy a riff after 1984 is just fucking stupid, IMO.

Late -

[Rikk]

It's a witchhunt, dude. He spent ages finding me make a few positive comments about my Van Halen-listening days, weeding through TONS of anti-Sammy posts. Sure, there was some good music, but Sammy is horrible and I've always hated him and haven't bought into any of that shit for a few years. I also hate Ched Heads.

[bueno bob]

Originally posted by Rikk
"I'd probably NEED the beers to sit through a full show of Daveisms..."

"Oh yeah... well I know a guy who had several *AHEM* encounters of the close kind with Dave when he was in Argenitalia and he was smoking hot but as queer as a 2 dollar bill..."

"Sammy may be short but havent you ever heard about how short guys are pistols when it comes to punching... Little F%$Kers can kick butt! Dave has to turn everything into comedy... maybe that's why in REAL life he's pretty much a loner. But then again, who needs friends..."

"Doing originals is alot more noble and requires alot more talent than doing copies. Dave is out to make a quick buck...He always liked doing covers because 1/2 of the work was already done..."

"Just my opinion but Dave's been doing the same exact show for years now. I wouldn't pay a nickle to see him."

"We all know Dave was always into easy money while Ed was more of an earner."

Sammy can still sing, Dave cant
Sammy makes his own music, Dave does covers
Sammy looks his age, Dave looks 105
Sammy puts on a show, Dave just wants to get it over with and get paid...

Ever hear the same joke twice? Dave is that joke..."

Fab quotes.

Guwapo, THIS is the girl you're defending?!?!?!?

AND YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT RIKK BEING A SHEEP??????????????

Oh for Christ's sake dude, wake the FUCK UP.

Jesus Christ Bananas...

[Dan]

Page 120.

[scorpioboy33]

and I really dig IMS2`

[diamondsgirl]

Originally posted by bueno bob
I just want to reiterate that liking elements of the music does not equate into supporting Hagar. I just told Rikk in pm (and YES, I'm announcing it here) that I thought Ed's playing on "5150" (the song) was fucking great.

Please tell me in which language that translates into "I hate David, he's washed-up, and sammy's the MAN!" it fucking doesn't, period.

To think that Ed and Al and Mike couldn't buy a riff after 1984 is just fucking stupid, IMO.

Late -

saying that you like Van Halen at a Van Halen site is not an issue.
Spewing hate about Roth and then claiming to be a fan is.
Raving about how much you love Sam Hagar while at a ROTH site makes you a sheep.
Doing it here ONLY because you are not allowed elsewhere makes you a pathetic loser!!!

[HELLVIS]

You wield a very sharp sword darlin'.

[tjvhou812]

hey rikk, you fucking sheep. just wondering if you got the 1988 bootleg vh show from japan.....i know your a closet hagar fan....

and then you come on here and bash other people for liking sammy fronted halen......time to shave the wool off your eyes their fool.....


it's ok to like both rikk, but dont sit and bash other people for it


now get your cabo wabo ass in the fucking pen, you little bitch

[DavidLeeNatra]

Originally posted by tjvhou812
hey rikk, it's me again, the fucking sheep. just wondering if you got my 1988 bootleg vh show from japan.....you know I masturbate to it as I'm a gay hagar fag....

and then I come on here and bash other people for liking dave fronted halen......time to shave the wool off my undersized balls to find my little wiener.....


it's ok for me to like both rikk, dick and ass but dont sit and bash me for it


now get my cabo wabo ass in the fucking pen, you little bitch

tjvhou812, you REALLY deserve to be here...

[Mrs Houdini]

Originally posted by Rikk
It's a witchhunt, dude. He spent ages finding me make a few positive comments about my Van Halen-listening days, weeding through TONS of anti-Sammy posts. Sure, there was some good music, but Sammy is horrible and I've always hated him and haven't bought into any of that shit for a few years. I also hate Ched Heads.

A witchhunt Rikk, you mean like the one you pulled on me??? Spending ages pulling my anti Dave comments from another site during a time when I was pro- Sammy, anti roth for the lead singer for VH??? Let's see here??? HUH... You said that this WHOLE war with me started because I said Sammy was sexy in the "Finish What You Started" video. Don't tell me it had ANYTHING to do with those anti Roth posts because those were posted at the LINKS, you were a member there and you have even said you left there because of them, yet you sent me a PM HERE, after them, and before the Sam was sexy comment, saying I was a cool poster and you had no beef with me... So What is it Rikk??? Now that you have been outted for likeing some Hagar yourself it is suddenly ok??? to like a liitle Hagar??? Funny how you keep posting the SAME handful of negative Dave posts but Guwapo keeps finding MORE and MORE Hagar Loving posts of YOURS! Another thing, I may be one kind of sheep... But what about the countless other Hagar fans that you have trashed? How do you differ from THEM? Your a hypocrite. Plain and simple! I admit I made some distastful comments about Roth at time when I was turned off by his talents, I'm NOT going to explain it again. But I have always been honest about my likes and dislikes about this band. I don't SELL MYSELF OUT to try and fit in or be popular on some message board. YOUR PATHETIC!

For the record, I know you want to place all the people who are suddenly surfacing to state their hate for you as Fab supporters, hell I do too! Unfortunatly, that is not the case. While I still think Guwapo is a great poster, his beef with you is different than mine. Don't try and make light of it by trying to put it all in the Fab catagory. Guwapo and Pete have one mission, Chelle has hers and I have my own. The Fab saga is an easy out for you but the truth is, people are starting to see you for what you are. Sheesh, you call Max your friend but you even keep dragging him down with your inability to get along with people. He keeps sticking up for YOU but all your out for is yourself. No matter who you screw this site up for. But hey, as long as you enjoy it...

[diamondsgirl]

Originally posted by Mrs Houdini
I admit I made some distastful comments about Roth at time when I was turned off by his talents, I'm NOT going to explain it again. But I have always been honest about my likes and dislikes about this band.I don't SELL MYSELF OUT to try and fit in or be popular on some message board.

you had to admit it! How could you deny it???

and how the fuck are you turned off by David Lee Roth's talents less than one year ago to the point of bashing him, and now you're a fan?? What does that mean?

Selling yourself short? Yeah you did. The only reason you are suddenly pro Roth is because there are no other VH sites you are allowed to post at. So, of course you have to do a fucking 360 and LOVE all that is Roth so that you can post here and fit in and TRY to be popular on "some" message board.

LOL. Now the Army is "some message board". Not too long ago you were suggesting that it was your lifeline.

[Rikk]

Originally posted by HELLVIS
You wield a very sharp sword darlin'.

DG is beautiful, ain't she?

[Rikk]

Originally posted by tjvhou812
hey rikk, you fucking sheep. just wondering if you got the 1988 bootleg vh show from japan.....

I just got it. I'll drop it in the trough for you tonight and you can bob for it while you eat, like the other fucking sheep.

NOW SHUT THE FUCK UP AND GET BACK IN THE FUCKING PEN, OR I WON'T PLAY YOU MY JAPANESE BALANCE CD FOR YOU BEFORE YOU GO TO BED!!!!!!!

[Rikk]

Originally posted by Mrs Houdini
A witchhunt Rikk, you mean like the one you pulled on me??? Spending ages pulling my anti Dave comments from another site during a time when I was pro- Sammy, anti roth for the lead singer for VH???

Took me literally ten minutes to compile all those posts. I'm not joking. I'm sure there are plenty more. Those were just the ones I found in the first 10 minutes. Every single post was going on about how awesome it would be for Hagar to come back and how shitty Roth is. Seriously. Here they are again, if you need reminding :

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I dont really consider myself a Roth fan... The DLR of the 80's is not the same as the DLR of today" So, that said, is it ok for me to keep ragging on him, since I'm not claiming to be a fan and stuff?"

"I'd probably NEED the beers to sit through a full show of Daveisms..."

"Oh yeah... well I know a guy who had several *AHEM* encounters of the close kind with Dave when he was in Argenitalia and he was smoking hot but as queer as a 2 dollar bill..."

"Men are from venus, Dave is from Mars."

"Absolutly NOT! Unless of course there are no guests because it'd get really old watching a show where Dave constantly out talks and interrupts them. I can't see Dave in that role because with him, it'a All Dave all the time... I doubt he'd be interested in sharing the spotlight... Without guests, the show would last 3.75 mins because after that he be back to using old material..."

"Sammy may be short but havent you ever heard about how short guys are pistols when it comes to punching... Little F%$Kers can kick butt! Dave has to turn everything into comedy... maybe that's why in REAL life he's pretty much a loner. But then again, who needs friends..."

"Doing originals is alot more noble and requires alot more talent than doing copies. Dave is out to make a quick buck...He always liked doing covers because 1/2 of the work was already done..."

"Just my opinion but Dave's been doing the same exact show for years now. I wouldn't pay a nickle to see him."

"I dont think we will EVER see EVH and DLR on the same stage ever again. I really don't think that even the RRHOF will be reason enough for Ed to ever stand by Dave again. If I were Ed I wouldn't give DLR the time of day. The way that Dave goes out and continues to talk smack about Eddie after everything that he's been going through is not the way that people should treat people. I dont believe in kicking people when they are down and I especially don' like the way that Dave has been making a living by riding on the coat tails of the original VH yet continues to slam the people who help made all of it possible..."

"We all know Dave was always into easy money while Ed was more of an earner."

"Thing about Sammy is that when he is talking badly about someone he just being blantantly honest. He isnt trying to degrade or humiliate them. He makes it perfectly clear that he's simply speaking his opinion from his experiences dealing with that individual. Dave on the other hand gets down and dirty, takes cheap shots and throws in cowardly digs at peoples personal problems. I'd really love to see Sammy and the VH brothers work it out and make some music together. I think there is a chance of that happening. As for DLR, other than his renditions of the old VH songs played with a different band, I think he's finished with VH for good and I'm not sad about it anymore."


Sammy can still sing, Dave cant
Sammy makes his own music, Dave does covers
Sammy looks his age, Dave looks 105
Sammy puts on a show, Dave just wants to get it over with and get paid...

Ever hear the same joke twice? Dave is that joke..."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Rikk]

Originally posted by diamondsgirl
The only reason you are suddenly pro Roth is because there are no other VH sites you are allowed to post at. So, of course you have to do a fucking 360 and LOVE all that is Roth so that you can post here and fit in and TRY to be popular on "some" message board.

LOL. Now the Army is "some message board". Not too long ago you were suggesting that it was your lifeline.

Yup! Genius post, DG. I bet it would take me 15 minutes to find a post from there bashing the Army.

Why do you think she's going nuts to stay here? There is NOWHERE else. This bitch HATED Roth. And now we're supposed to believe she loves him coincidentally right after she was banned from the Links?

[Switch84]

Originally posted by diamondsgirl
you had to admit it! How could you deny it???

and how the fuck are you turned off by David Lee Roth's talents less than one year ago to the point of bashing him, and now you're a fan?? What does that mean?

Selling yourself short? Yeah you did. The only reason you are suddenly pro Roth is because there are no other VH sites you are allowed to post at. So, of course you have to do a fucking 360 and LOVE all that is Roth so that you can post here and fit in and TRY to be popular on "some" message board.

LOL. Now the Army is "some message board". Not too long ago you were suggesting that it was your lifeline.

:confused: Roth Broad, give it up. This one's as hopeless as a German chocolate cake at an Overeater's Anonymous meeting! Some folks just don't know when to say WHEN! What number are we on now with this pathetic attention-whore sick "alias" game?

Go away, Fab/Flab/Ombre-whatever-the-fuck/Dave hater! We get it, you don't like Roth, so stop infecting Roth sites! Hagar has sites you can hang out at, and you'll be in a more receptive environment. And I'm more than 1000% percent sure Davy Baby's not crying in his Cristal because some anonymous nutcase doesn't like him.

Find some solace in your life. Go talk to a Priest, Rabbi, Imam, Dr. Phil, WHATEVER! There's obviously an empty place in your soul that you pathetically try to fill by compulsively ranting on mediums that are supposed to be fun (and is for many of us that aren't mentally twisted.) FOR REAL.....GET SOME HELP!

[Rikk]

Switch, this next cup of strong coffee is on you!! You have a way with words!

[Switch84]

Originally posted by Rikk
Switch, this next cup of strong coffee is on you!! You have a way with words!

:bottle: Hey, I call 'em like I see 'em. It was fun at first, beastin' on her and shit, but now it's just down right pathetic. For someone to have that much emptiness in their life that they have to cling to an internet message board dedicated to a Rock Star they don't even like is some sorry-assed shit!


YOU ROCK, RIKK!!!! Let me get you a scone to go with that coffee!

[Rikk]

Originally posted by Switch84
:bottle: Hey, I call 'em like I see 'em. It was fun at first, beastin' on her and shit, but now it's just down right pathetic. For someone to have that much emptiness in their life that they have to cling to an internet message board dedicated to a Rock Star they don't even like is some sorry-assed shit!


YOU ROCK, RIKK!!!! Let me get you a scone to go with that coffee!

I love scones! You rock too! I would throw you a five-vote, but I already did a long time ago!

LOL...what is the Cadillac Led Zeppelin song?