Women in combat (again)

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  • BigBadBrian
    TOASTMASTER GENERAL
    • Jan 2004
    • 10620

    Women in combat (again)

    Women in combat (again)
    Cal Thomas


    December 20, 2004


    Far more serious than the short-term consequences of some poorly armored vehicles in Iraq are the potential long-term consequences of putting female soldiers in ground combat units.

    Critics of placing women in combat units say the Army is manipulating language in rules governing such placement to achieve a social objective that would substantially and significantly change the way America fights wars and possibly put all soldiers - men and women - at greater risk.

    What has raised concerns is a Nov. 29 briefing by a senior Army officer responsible for Army personnel issues at the Pentagon along with a civilian. The briefing by these two people was for Lt. Gen. James Campbell, director, Army Staff. It included a phrase, "The way ahead: rewrite/eliminate the Army collocation policy." Collocation is military-speak for deploying mixed-sex non-combat units alongside all-male fighting units. The official Army policy prohibits female soldiers in units specifically designated as combat units. But some Army officers think they see a loophole large enough to drive through their social agenda.

    The linguistic questions revolve around a policy memorandum written on Jan. 13, 1994, by then-Secretary of Defense Les Aspin. After "restrict(ing) women from direct combat on the ground," Aspin wrote: "The Services may propose additional exceptions, together with the justification to the Assistant Secretary of Defense (Personnel and Readiness)." (emphasis mine)

    What the briefers at the Nov. 29 meeting suggested is that those who wish to place women in combat units alongside men may do so without authorization from the secretary of defense or the White House.

    One of the slides used at the briefing suggested the Army under Department of Defense policy "may" include service restrictions based on collocation, cost and other factors, and the Army would have to notify the secretary of defense in order to add restrictions. It also said the policy is silent on dropping restrictions.

    The language choice is significant. In Aspin's 1994 memo, the word "may" appears after the four restrictions on women in combat. The word "propose" follows "may." Aspin did not say the Army has the power to act unilaterally, as the Nov. 29 briefers apparently contended when they claimed Army policy is "silent on dropping restrictions on women in combat." Adding weight to Aspin's memo is a July 28, 1994, letter from Aspin's successor, William Perry, who said he "approves" of the Army's "proposal."

    With National Guard enlistments down and with orders to extend currently serving guardsmen and other service personnel beyond one year of duty in Iraq, there are some who apparently want to use the need for more personnel to ram through their social objective of placing women in combat.

    For all of the reasons argued against such a policy in the past, including unit cohesion, increases in sexual harassment, rape and pregnancy, and the social revulsion most feel about seeing women wounded or killed in combat (or tortured or beheaded by the enemy) - not to mention that these are policies that should be set at the top and not by lower ranking military and civilian authorities - overturning restrictions on women in combat will weaken our military and weaken its effectiveness in fighting and winning wars.

    When Congress returns, the House and Senate Armed Services Committees should hold hearings on this issue and call the briefers and Lt. Gen. Campbell (and any others who were at the briefing) to testify about whether a change in the rule governing women in combat is being contemplated. If necessary, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld should be asked whether he and the president plan to continue the policy approved during the Clinton administration, or whether they will permit the policy to be altered by people without the authority to do so.

    There are enough challenges to our military at the moment. Changing such a significant policy banning women from direct combat, especially during a time of war and with no input from those who have the power to set policy, is a bad idea that is not in the ultimate interest of women, men or the strength of our armed forces.
    “If bullshit was currency, Joe Biden would be a billionaire.” - George W. Bush
  • McCarrens
    Foot Soldier
    • May 2004
    • 704

    #2
    Most of the woman I know can't stand the site of a spider.

    Why makes them think they can handle combat?
    "The security around the hotel was ridiculous. This chick was pounding and screaming at my door until four or five in the morning....finally I said fuck it, and let her out of the room"

    Comment

    • Nickdfresh
      SUPER MODERATOR

      • Oct 2004
      • 49127

      #3
      I knew some pretty-tough women (triathletes) in the Army. Women are going to be in combat no matter what in a guerilla war like this. The attacks are coming from all directions.

      Comment

      • Angel
        ROTH ARMY SUPREME
        • Jan 2004
        • 7482

        #4
        Originally posted by McCarrens
        Most of the woman I know can't stand the site of a spider.

        Why makes them think they can handle combat?
        Where are you where your women are so "frail"? Some women can handle combat, some can't. Just like men.
        "Ya know what they say about angels... An angel is a supernatural being or spirit, usually humanoid in form, found in various religions and mythologies. Plus Roth fan boards..."- ZahZoo April 2013

        Comment

        • Big Train
          Full Member Status

          • Apr 2004
          • 4011

          #5
          My concern on this issue has never had anything to do with their abilities at all. My concern has always been their worth to enemies as hostages. Obviously, it is unfortunate to have a male held captive where he can be tortured. However, for a woman the danger is much more apparent sexually. Not only for her safety and security, but for our side as she would be percieved as a higher value target, one we would be much more likely to negotiate over.

          Comment

          • Nickdfresh
            SUPER MODERATOR

            • Oct 2004
            • 49127

            #6
            Originally posted by McCarrens
            Most of the woman I know can't stand the site of a spider.

            Why makes them think they can handle combat?
            \
            Can't get laid huh?

            Comment

            • Seshmeister
              ROTH ARMY WEBMASTER

              • Oct 2003
              • 35159

              #7
              Women have no place in the military.

              PC gone ludicrous.

              Comment

              • DEMON CUNT
                Crazy Ass Mofo
                • Nov 2004
                • 3240

                #8
                Originally posted by Pig Train
                My concern on this issue has never had anything to do with their abilities at all. My concern has always been their worth to enemies as hostages. Obviously, it is unfortunate to have a male held captive where he can be tortured. However, for a woman the danger is much more apparent sexually. Not only for her safety and security, but for our side as she would be percieved as a higher value target, one we would be much more likely to negotiate over.
                You never know. Those horny assed insurgents might just want to grease and pump your own poo hole there, Pig Train.

                We should only allow ugly women into combat. The good ones will work at the brothels for the soldiers holiday enjoyment.

                The disabled ugly ones will do the laundry and cook bacon constantly.

                In addition, they shouldn't ever vote. You know, because they are women.
                Banned 01/09/09 | Avatar | Aiken | Spammy | Extreme | Pump | Regular | The View | Toot

                Comment

                • Seshmeister
                  ROTH ARMY WEBMASTER

                  • Oct 2003
                  • 35159

                  #9
                  I agree...

                  Comment

                  • LoungeMachine
                    DIAMOND STATUS
                    • Jul 2004
                    • 32555

                    #10
                    Originally posted by McCarrens
                    Most of the woman I know can't stand the site of a spider.

                    Why makes them think they can handle combat?
                    Most of the "women" you know have Adam's Apples, 5 o' clock shadow, and charge by the hour.


                    Thanks for fueling the "just how idiotic is McCarrens?" debate
                    Originally posted by Kristy
                    Dude, what in the fuck is wrong with you? I'm full of hate and I do drugs.
                    Originally posted by cadaverdog
                    I posted under aliases and I jerk off with a sock. Anything else to add?

                    Comment

                    • McCarrens
                      Foot Soldier
                      • May 2004
                      • 704

                      #11
                      Originally posted by LoungeMachine
                      Most of the "women" you know have Adam's Apples, 5 o' clock shadow, and charge by the hour.


                      Thanks for fueling the "just how idiotic is McCarrens?" debate
                      Thanks for fueling my liberal-idiots-tend-to-make-things-up-because-they-can't-argue-logically theory.
                      "The security around the hotel was ridiculous. This chick was pounding and screaming at my door until four or five in the morning....finally I said fuck it, and let her out of the room"

                      Comment

                      • DrMaddVibe
                        ROTH ARMY ELITE
                        • Jan 2004
                        • 6658

                        #12
                        Everyone knows a women's place is in lesbian porn.
                        http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x...auders1zl5.gif
                        http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c4...willywonka.gif

                        Comment

                        • lms2

                          #13
                          haha, good point big train. However guys wasn't it in early roman society that the spartans were the ones who allowed lovers to be together and encouraged it because if they were with their lover they'd fight harder to try and impress and save their lover? Also though the roman empire fell so who knows right?

                          Comment

                          • lms2

                            #14
                            oops last post was by skittles not lms2.

                            Comment

                            • Seshmeister
                              ROTH ARMY WEBMASTER

                              • Oct 2003
                              • 35159

                              #15
                              Originally posted by lms2
                              haha, good point big train. However guys wasn't it in early roman society that the spartans were the ones who allowed lovers to be together and encouraged it because if they were with their lover they'd fight harder to try and impress and save their lover? Also though the roman empire fell so who knows right?
                              No offence but that post was fucking idiotic.

                              Go read a book.

                              Cheers!

                              Comment

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