View Full Version : New Election Process
4moreyears
06-07-2005, 01:06 AM
The Associated Press
Updated: 12:15 a.m. ET June 7, 2005
The nation’s election administrators say it’s time to restructure elections to reflect the way Americans live, scrapping neighborhood precincts and Election Day for large, customer-oriented “vote centers” where people could cast ballots over a period of weeks.
In a new, sweeping report, state and local officials focus much of their attention on voters and poll workers rather than voting machines — the subject of so much debate ever since the 2000 presidential stalemate in Florida.
“We are looking forward, we are looking at ways to make elections better,” said Dawn Williams, who oversees voting in Marshall County, Iowa. She co-chaired a task force of officials and former officials from 15 states that was set up by the Houston-based Election Center.
So-called “universal vote centers,” introduced two years ago on a limited basis in Colorado, could end some of the biggest flaws in the way Americans vote if widely implemented, administrators said.
Such centers eliminate confusion over where to vote, since everyone in a county can vote at any center; reduce lines by allowing for more equipment and staff at fewer locations; and prevent mistakes by better marshaling well-trained election officials along with day workers.
“It addresses what happened in Florida in 2000 better than the (federal) Help America Vote Act” — the law Congress passed to fix elections three years ago, said Larimer County (Colorado) Clerk Scott Doyle, who came up with the idea. “It’s the way America lives. Why shouldn’t America vote that way?”
‘Save millions of dollars’
Doyle sought and won a change in state law that allowed him to replace 143 precincts with 20 vote centers. Larger facilities — hotel ballrooms and state fairgrounds — allow easier access and parking for voters, and more efficient concentration of resources for administrators.
“There’s an opportunity here to better meet our voters’ needs and save millions of dollars,” Doyle said. With vote centers, the county can save several hundred thousand dollars by buying fewer handicapped-accessible voting machines, since the new federal law requires one at each polling location, he said.
The report, to be officially released Tuesday, also backs a growing trend toward voting over days and weeks, rather than just Election Day.
At least 30 states have already broadened their balloting rules, expanding absentee voting to “no excuse” voting — so anyone who wants to vote absentee is allowed. In some places, residents can also vote early, in person, as much as a month ahead of Election Day.
“We’ve got to look at how we make this better for voters at all points. Don’t try to fix the symptoms but say, ‘What is causing the problem and how do we fix them?”’ said Doug Lewis, executive director of the Election Center, which trains election officials.
“Here are some concepts. They’re not revolutionary concepts, they’re evolutionary,” Lewis said.
The report also urges state legislators to consider an “independently verifiable” record of each voter’s ballot from ATM-style touchscreen voting machines that could be electronic, video or some other form — pointedly downplaying a widespread push for paper receipts from touchscreens.
Elections administrators have taken a fair share of blame for the nation’s electoral troubles in recent years.
Machines’ faults
Many critics say local and state officials have been complacent or worse about threats to the electoral system, including worries that people seeking to manipulate elections could hack into computerized machines and rig the results.
The faults in the machines are real and can’t be ignored, said Avi Rubin, a Johns Hopkins University computer science professor. Election officials should heed the computer science community’s warnings, he said.
The Election Center has come in for criticism after reports that the nonprofit, nonpartisan group accepts contributions from voting machine manufacturers. Two members of the task force are former local election administrators who’ve formed their own election-related businesses.
The task force also suggested that states:
* Prohibit companies that register new voters from getting paid by the number of registrants and punish those that misuse the process.
* Assist felons by providing them with a faster way to regain voting rights, where allowed, and better election information.
* Share voter registration information between states to avoid duplication and safeguard against fraud.
The report is one of several continuing efforts to improve elections as disputes continue over 2004 results.
Most prominent among those was the 129-vote victory of Washington Gov. Christine Gregoire, who won office on the third count of the votes. A state judge upheld her victory Monday.
The solution is simple
1) Election Day is a national holiday.
2) ALL votes will be on paper ballots
3) Polling Places will be setup adequately to accomodate every registered voter in the precinct. Nobody should have to stand in line for hours to vote in this country, and it's obvious that the situations where this has been the case, have been set up to deliberately discourage voting.
4) Nobody gets more than one vote. In the last election, rich Republicans bragged about how they would vote from two different states, claiming residence in both.
5) NO NEWS COVERAGE of national elections will be allowed until the polls are closed in Hawaii. Period. No projections, no predictions, no Bush cousins on FAUX spinning it for the family.
This might be someone inconvenient to East Coast viewers, but you guys can worry about the state races until everyone else has had their say.
Can anybody give me one reason why these 5 things cannot be the rules for 2006 & 2008?
Redballjets88
06-07-2005, 01:40 AM
and w/e no state is won by 1 vote
Originally posted by Redballjets88
and w/e no state is won by 1 vote
Florida was in 2000.
It was a 5-4 vote of the Supreme Court.
hollywood5150
06-07-2005, 01:42 AM
the fucking people in florida dont know how to vote.........how many fucking recounts did they have????
Originally posted by hollywood5150
LOL you tell em kidd
Take the cheerleading shit to PM. I'm trying to start a serious discussion about saving Democracy here.
Redballjets88
06-07-2005, 01:42 AM
you know i mean regular vote....why do dems have to be such technical assholes
Originally posted by hollywood5150
the fucking people in florida dont know how to vote.........how many fucking recounts did they have????
None, since they never got a complete one.
Redballjets88
06-07-2005, 01:44 AM
saving democracy? look its in no trouble in 2 1/2 years what you call hell and what i call the US having a backbone will be over and u can be happy
Originally posted by Redballjets88
you know i mean regular vote....why do dems have to be such technical assholes
Shit happens when your country becomes a fascist dictatorship on a "technicality"
4moreyears
06-07-2005, 09:38 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Shit happens when your country becomes a fascist dictatorship on a "technicality"
Even if 2000 was won on a "technicality", 2004 our country was a clear victory for President Bush. He swept, winning more states, more popular vote, and the electoral college. I cant wait for your bitchey, whinny, response.
JH
Nickdfresh
06-07-2005, 09:55 AM
Originally posted by hollywood5150
the fucking people in florida dont know how to vote.........how many fucking recounts did they have????
The fucking state officials in Florida didn't know how to set up a vote either!
Originally posted by 4moreyears
Even if 2000 was won on a "technicality", 2004 our country was a clear victory for President Bush. He swept, winning more states, more popular vote, and the electoral college. I cant wait for your bitchey, whinny, response.
JH http://www.oilempire.us/graphics/diebold.gif
TEUFEL HUNDEN
06-07-2005, 10:42 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Take the cheerleading shit to PM. I'm trying to start a serious discussion about saving Democracy here.
Hey FORD, we have a REPUBLIC not a democracy in this country. I dont pledge, " And to this democracy for which it stands"....
Originally posted by TEUFEL HUNDEN
Hey FORD, we have a REPUBLIC not a democracy in this country. I dont pledge, " And to this democracy for which it stands"....
Well, whatever you used to call it, it ceased to exist on December 12, 2000 when 5 BCE appointees on the Supreme Court stopped the legal and constitutional process of counting votes, in order to install their favored candidate.
That is neither Democracy OR Republic.
4moreyears
06-07-2005, 10:54 AM
Originally posted by FORD
http://www.oilempire.us/graphics/diebold.gif
Just like I thought. There is proof that Rossi won the election in Washington, but the peoples choice will not get to lead that state. There is no proof that Diebold influenced the election. Just your psychotic theories.
4moreyears
06-07-2005, 10:56 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Well, whatever you used to call it, it ceased to exist on December 12, 2000 when 5 BCE appointees on the Supreme Court stopped the legal and constitutional process of counting votes, in order to install their favored candidate.
That is neither Democracy OR Republic.
YOu forget the people spoke loud and clear and re-electeed the president this past November. It still exists.
Originally posted by 4moreyears
There is proof that Rossi won the election in Washington
No there is not. And a conservative judge said so yesterday :) Also the conservative Secretary of State's office has said so repeatedly.
Unlike the partisan thieves Harris of Florida and Blackwell of Ohio, the Secretary of State here is an elected official, and can't be the chair of a candidate's campaign (as both Cruella and Uncle Tom were)
TEUFEL HUNDEN
06-07-2005, 10:59 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Well, whatever you used to call it, it ceased to exist on December 12, 2000 when 5 BCE appointees on the Supreme Court stopped the legal and constitutional process of counting votes, in order to install their favored candidate.
That is neither Democracy OR Republic.
I'll agree with you on that one. Some people say we have an oligarchy in this country now because the Supreme Court is practically making law which is supposed to be done only thru Congress. That 2000 vote should have gone to the House I believe.
Originally posted by 4moreyears
YOu forget the people spoke loud and clear and re-electeed the president this past November. It still exists.
Half the people didn't speak at all. And of those who did, the Chimp's alleged victory was 50.8%
Even assuming that was an accurate count (which it wasn't) that's hardly "loud and clear".
4moreyears
06-07-2005, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by FORD
Half the people didn't speak at all. And of those who did, the Chimp's alleged victory was 50.8%
Even assuming that was an accurate count (which it wasn't) that's hardly "loud and clear".
YOu mean half the people chose not to vote. If they chose not to speak does that quilify as having a voice???
JH
Originally posted by TEUFEL HUNDEN
I'll agree with you on that one. Some people say we have an oligarchy in this country now because the Supreme Court is practically making law which is supposed to be done only thru Congress. That 2000 vote should have gone to the House I believe.
I'll bet you felt differently about the House deciding such things before 1994, didn't you?
It's true that Congress makes laws and the judicial interprets them. The 7-2 vote of the Supreme Court which said that Florida should have one uniform standard was a reasonable interpretation of the law. The 5-4 decision to stop the vote count, rather than establish that standard was NOT.
Originally posted by 4moreyears
YOu mean half the people chose not to vote. If they chose not to speak does that quilify as having a voice???
JH
No, it qualifies as the system being so corrupted by fascist corporatist pigs, that half the voters don't bother.
A real candidate might have brought them out. Judas IsKerryot and Junior the Trained Monkey certainly didn't.
TEUFEL HUNDEN
06-07-2005, 11:10 AM
Going along with the title of this thread. I would be very cautious to change any process AS LONG as its in step with how it was originally done. Weve strayed in doing this. Our Founding Fathers researched their history on how things were done, then they used the best example that would safeguard our liberties. BUT when the people (us) dont take the time to teach our children these things then thats when tyranny comes in.
TEUFEL HUNDEN
06-07-2005, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by FORD
I'll bet you felt differently about the House deciding such things before 1994, didn't you?
FORD, all I know is when I read the Constitution and see the specific 18 numbered powers that Congress has. What the states specifically arent allowed to do.Then its easy to see that both the Republicans & the democrats are guilty of not following their oath of office and therefore little by little they erode our liberties. I say we are now Land of The Safe and Home of The Weak.
Originally posted by TEUFEL HUNDEN
I say we are now Land of The Safe and Home of The Weak.
And I'm sure you remember what Ben Franklin said about that...
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety".
Fortunately, he also said...
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
So if the reality of the first quote is too depressing, at least embracing the second will make you feel better for a little while :gulp:
steve
06-07-2005, 01:59 PM
With a Republican Congress and EXec Branch, the laws will never change to make it more convenient for working class people to vote.
Originally, voting was on Tuesday because it was "Court Day" - and it was CONVINIENT for farmers. Now it is about the least easy day for folks that have jobs, kids, etc.
Not to mention, DC will never attain gain representation with a Republican controlled Congress and Exec Branch...it is totally partisan.
Senator Herb Kohl (Democratic senator from Wisconsin) has been trying to get a weekend voting act passed for a DECADE...but with no luck.
http://kohl.senate.gov/~kohl/voting.html
Kids aren't tought Civics in school any more. Today's generation is not empowering themselves in their own democracy. Until that changes, things like this, symbolic of Democratic institutions slipping away from control of of the middle class, will continue to happen.
TEUFEL HUNDEN
06-07-2005, 04:37 PM
Originally posted by FORD
And I'm sure you remember what Ben Franklin said about that...
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety".
Fortunately, he also said...
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
So if the reality of the first quote is too depressing, at least embracing the second will make you feel better for a little while :gulp:
good 'ol Ben had one hell of a sense of humor! These Founding Fathers didnt take shit from anyone when it came to their freedoms. In fact I think good old Ben would have gone apeshit over the new Supreme Court ruling about mary jane. If anything that is left up to the states or the people to decide if it is illegl or not. Not the Oligarchy.
Warham
06-07-2005, 05:03 PM
Originally posted by FORD
The solution is simple
5) NO NEWS COVERAGE of national elections will be allowed until the polls are closed in Hawaii. Period. No projections, no predictions, no Bush cousins on FAUX spinning it for the family.
Glad you mentioned the news coverage before Hawaii closes. I remember Dan Blather on CBS proclaiming Al Gore won Florida in 2000 before the polls even closed in THAT state.
Warham
06-07-2005, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by FORD
None, since they never got a complete one.
They got plenty, and the AP and every other news organization went down there and counted, and Bush still came out on top.
:rolleyes:
Warham
06-07-2005, 05:13 PM
In the 2000 election, all of the networks “called” Florida for Democrat candidate Al Gore when the polling places in the state’s Eastern Time Zone closed, but while the polls were still open for one hour more in the rabidly pro-Bush Panhandle, which is in the Central Time Zone. It is highly likely that thousands of Bush voters, upon hearing that the race was lost, were discouraged from voting.
While the 2000 early call in Florida did not cause the 36-day Democrat Siege of America, including the chad scam, it did make it easier for the Democrats and their media lackeys to sell the siege.
The ultimate official count, whereby after several recounts George W. Bush won Florida by only 537 votes, was nonsense on stilts. During several “recounts,” Democrat Florida election officials fraudulently took over one thousand Bush ballots and “reinterpreted” them as Gore votes. In some cases, the fraud was obvious; in other cases, officials handled ballots so much that, as one observer noted, the “chads” eventually gave way. (The chads were the semi-attached pieces of paper that were punched out when a citizen voted for a candidate.) Several thousand felons, over 70% of whom registered as Democrats, voted illegally; several hundred students attending segregated, black colleges engaged in election fraud, by voting both from their home and their college addresses; and a few thousand military ballots from heavily Republican-registered voters, were never counted. Hence, Bush’s Florida margin of victory should lawfully have been ten times what it was, without even speculating on the Panhandle losses.
As I wrote on November 13, 2000, in my Toogood Reports column, “Jesse Jackson on How to Steal a Presidential Election, and Live Happily Ever After,” at the end of election night, at 4 a.m., a weary Peter Jennings of ABC News interviewed an exhausted Jackson, who talked in slogans:
"Bush, Cheney, Strom Thurmond, Jesse Helms, Orrin Hatch, this is the same thing, states' rights, the denial of a woman's right to choose, attacks on affirmative action ..."
At no time did Jackson say, ‘Peter, this so-called victory by George Bush is nothing but a case of voter fraud. My associates and I have been fielding calls all day from black Florida voters who were intimidated out of voting, or barred from polling places….’
By November 9, the Rev. Jackson had heard yet more voices. According to Left-of-Castro columnist, Juan Gonzalez, in the November 10 New York Daily News, "As the Rev. Jesse Jackson told me yesterday, it may be that the television networks projected Florida's results correctly the first time, but failures in the voting systems of Palm Beach and Broward Counties led to thousands of Gore votes not being counted."
But how could thousands of Gore votes be counted, if the voters were barred from, or intimidated out of voting?
About eight hours after Jesse Jackson whined about abortion rights and white racism, he was claiming to have been receiving calls throughout Election Day from black voters complaining that they’d been disenfranchised.
I don’t know if the 2000 Florida Disenfranchisement Hoax was formulated in the middle of election night by Gore campaign strategists, or as is more likely, earlier as an electoral fail-safe, to be unleashed the day after a close election. In any event, Jackson clearly didn’t receive his talking points until sometime between 4 a.m. and noon following the election.
At the time, all sorts of wild stories surfaced. Al Gore’s black campaign manager, Donna Brazille, insisted that Florida police had kept black voters from the polls with guns and dogs. Though Brazille was guilty of foisting a stupendous lie on the world, she did not suffer for it. One month later, she was a guest on Ted Koppel’s ABC News show, Nightline, where she was treated with respect by Koppel, who never brought up her little exercise in racial arson.
The NAACP claimed to have “thousands of affidavits” from black voters who had been “intimidated” out of voting or otherwise “disenfranchised.” To my knowledge, none of the “affidavits” ever materialized.
When champion race-baiter and “historian” Mary Frances Berry, the chairwoman of the U.S. Civil Rights Commission, held public hearings in January, 2001 on black disenfranchisement, only three black voters gave testimony. All three admitted that they had been able to vote without any difficulties. One woman testified that she’d been stopped at a state police roadblock, but that was only AFTER she’d voted. Neither Berry nor the NAACP was able to produce a single disenfranchised black Florida voter. And yet, the legend of 2000 lives on.
Along with the 1987-88 Tawana Brawley Hoax and the Racial Profiling Hoax, which was begun in its present form in 1999 and remains influential, the 2000 Florida Disenfranchisement Hoax was one of the three most destructive race hoaxes in recent American history.
During the 36-day post-Election Day siege of 2000, Democrats used the legal system to subvert the law, e.g., demanding that Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris not abide by the legal deadline for recounting ballots, and then using the Democrat-dominated Florida Supreme Court to run roughshod over Florida state law.
At one point during the siege, Democrat Palm Beach County election officials sought illegally to move the “recount” to a private room, where the public could not observe it. When Republican activists protested, and got the election officials to stop the illegal, private recount, leftist politicians and journalists – who previously had never met a rioter they didn’t like – smeared the activists with the charge that they’d “rioted.”
When the Florida case reached the U.S. Supreme Court and in separate decisions, the justices voted 7-2 and 5-4 to put a stop to the endless, illegal recounts, the Dems and their media outlets invented the legend whereby George W. Bush was “selected, not elected.” New York Times staffers spoke constantly of the 5-4 USSC decision, while conveniently developing amnesia regarding the high court’s 7-2 decision, the fact that it was the Democrats who had decided to get Al Gore “selected, not elected,” and the lawless partisanship of the Florida Supreme Court.
Since November 2000, the Democrat party and its house organs have kept hoax alive, and preserved Florida as an example of how to try and steal an election. Indeed, John Kerry announced months before the election, that he would contest the results in Florida. However, Kerry was beaten so soundly in the Sunshine State that apparently he and his brain trust considered instead doing to Ohio, what the Gore campaign had four years earlier done to Florida.
If “calling” only one state an hour early could have the far-reaching consequences the practice had in 2000 in Florida, imagine the opportunities for mischief through calling many states several hours early via fraudulent exit polls.
Nicholas Stix
http://www.webcommentary.com/asp/ShowArticle.asp?id=stixn&date=041114
hollywood5150
06-07-2005, 05:15 PM
I agree with Warham............however I would like to know why Ford is so obsessed with the politics in the US..........if he is Canadian....
if I am not mistaken he is Canadian..........
However all Ford did yesterday was personally attack poeple who posted anything that went againsthis idea or beliefs..........
why cant he just debate in a mature manner
Why can't you spell at a 4th grade level?
hollywood5150
06-07-2005, 05:18 PM
Thank you Ford you just proved my point
And you continue to prove mine. You are an alias here to stir up shit and have no interest in legitimate discussions of anything. And that goes for your prepubescent girlfriend too.
4moreyears
06-10-2005, 09:20 AM
Originally posted by hollywood5150
I agree with Warham............however I would like to know why Ford is so obsessed with the politics in the US..........if he is Canadian....
if I am not mistaken he is Canadian..........
However all Ford did yesterday was personally attack poeple who posted anything that went againsthis idea or beliefs..........
why cant he just debate in a mature manner
Because he is a baby that can't get over Bush election of 2000. This past election was great because it proves the majority of the country supported the presidents agenda. At least more than they would have the Kerry agenda that was???
He is also a hypocrite. He will close threads that contradict his point of views but keep similar duplicate threads open that support his views.
JH
Nickdfresh
06-10-2005, 10:24 AM
Originally posted by 4moreyears
Because he is a baby that can't get over Bush election of 2000. This past election was great because it proves the majority of the country supported the presidents agenda. At least more than they would have the Kerry agenda that was???
He is also a hypocrite. He will close threads that contradict his point of views but keep similar duplicate threads open that support his views.
JH
I'd watch who I hitch my wagons too....
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