South Dakota Closer to Outlawing Abortion

[LoungeMachine]

S.D. Abortion Bill Takes Aim at 'Roe'
Senate Ban Does Not Except Rape, Incest

By Evelyn Nieves
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, February 23, 2006; Page A01

South Dakota lawmakers yesterday approved the nation's most far-reaching ban on abortion, setting the stage for new legal challenges that its supporters say they hope lead to an overturning of Roe v. Wade .

The measure, which passed the state Senate 23 to 12, makes it a felony for doctors to perform any abortion, except to save the life of a pregnant woman. The proposal still must be signed by Gov. Mike Rounds (R), who opposes abortion.



Rep. Roger Hunt, a sponsor of the bill, said momentum is building for a change in national policy on abortion. (By Doug Dreyer -- Associated Press)

The bill was designed to challenge the Supreme Court's ruling in Roe , which in 1973 recognized a right of women to terminate pregnancies. Its sponsors want to force a reexamination of the ruling by the court, which now includes two justices appointed by President Bush.

"The momentum for a change in the national policy on abortion is going to come in the not-too-distant future," said Rep. Roger W. Hunt, a Republican who sponsored the bill. To his delight, abortion opponents succeeded in defeating all amendments designed to mitigate the ban, including exceptions in the case of rape or incest or the health of the woman. Hunt said that such "special circumstances" would have diluted the bill and its impact on the national scene.

Kate Looby, director of Planned Parenthood of South Dakota, which plans to immediately challenge the ban, said that while she was not surprised, she was still a "little shocked" by the vote. "Clearly, this is a devastating day for the women of South Dakota," she said. "We fully expected this, yet it's still distressing to know that this legislative body cares so little about women, about families, about women who are victims of rape or incest."

National abortion rights organizations said the South Dakota vote has set the stage for a new fight to keep abortion legal at the federal level and in the states. "When you see them have a ban that does not include exceptions for rape or incest or the health of the mother, you understand that elections do matter," said Nancy Keenan, president of NARAL Pro-Choice America. "We will be very active in '06 and in '08 in electing candidates that represent the views of most Americans."

The antiabortion movement has focused primarily in recent years on a state-by-state effort to enact restrictions on access to abortion, including pushes for parental-notification laws and waiting periods before the procedure may be performed. A 1992 Supreme Court decision again affirmed a right to abortion in a Pennsylvania case, known as Planned Parenthood v. Casey , that said states cannot put an "undue burden" on women getting access to abortions.

Not all antiabortion groups agreed with the South Dakota supporters' effort to directly challenge Roe .

"If you're just reading the law as it stands now, South Dakota's law doesn't really stand any chance under Roe or Casey . I have to agree with those who think it's remote," said Chuck Donovan, executive vice president of the Family Research Council and a former lobbyist for the National Right to Life Committee.

He said there is not a consensus for a national approach to finding a way to overturn Roe . "There are lots of voices out there and nobody has a single strategy, so South Dakota has stepped in to fill that void," Donovan said.

Still, some abortion opponents are more confident than they have ever been that Roe could be overturned with two new conservative members of the high court, Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. and Justice Samuel A. Alito Jr. Roberts has not publicly expressed his view on abortion rights. Alito opposed Roe as a young Reagan administration lawyer and had a mixed record on abortion rights while a federal appeals court judge.

On Tuesday, the Supreme Court agreed to decide whether a federal law banning a procedure that opponents call "partial birth" abortion is constitutional. The law passed Congress in 2003 but has been struck down by three federal appeals courts and has yet to take effect.

South Dakota is the first but not the only state to consider new abortion restrictions this year. Ohio, Indiana, Georgia, Tennessee and Kentucky have introduced similar measures.

Rounds has indicated that he would sign the South Dakota measure if it does not jeopardize existing abortion restrictions while the legislation is challenged. In 2004, he vetoed a similar bill because of concerns that abortion restrictions would be eliminated during legal wrangling. Hunt said his bill has addressed the governor's concerns.

Hunt has also said that when the inevitable challenge to the ban is filed in court, the ban's supporters will be prepared for a costly court fight with $1 million already pledged by "an anonymous donor."

Even without this latest ban, South Dakota was already one of the most difficult states in the country in which to get an abortion, those on both sides of the issue say. It is one of three states with only one abortion provider (Mississippi and North Dakota are the others), and its one clinic, the Planned Parenthood clinic in Sioux Falls, offers the procedure only once a week. Four doctors who fly in from Minnesota on a rotating basis perform the abortions, since no doctor in South Dakota will do so because of the heavy stigma attached.

About 800 abortions are performed each year in South Dakota, which has a population of 770,000 spread out over 77,000 square miles. Last year, South Dakota passed five laws to restrict abortions, including one that would compel doctors to tell women that they would be ending the life of a "whole, separate, unique human being." That law has been blocked by a lawsuit filed by Planned Parenthood.

[BITEYOASS]

Well seeing that ole SD is a backwards rural red state, I'm not suprised that they want to prevent abortions for women who are victims of incest.

[jhale667]

Originally posted by BITEYOASS
Well seeing that ole SD is a backwards rural red state, I'm not suprised that they want to prevent abortions for women who are victims of incest.

...Said the guy from Alabama! :lol: Sorry---I agree with you, but couldn't help noticing the irony...;)

It IS seriously backward thinking...and I also didn't notice any mention of increasing SD Planned Parenthood's budget towards education on contraception....dumbasses.

[Nitro Express]

Nobody is more religiouse right wing than my mom. She used to work as a nurse when abortions were illegal and saw the horrors of backroom illegal abortions first hand.

My mom will be the first to tell you abortion is murder but she will also fiercely defend a woman's rights to have a legal abortion if she wishes.

Abortion can carry some heavy guilt to a woman that has had one. It's a seriouse matter. Children can be put up for adoption and theres plenty of good parents waiting to adopt.

What we need is some basic sex education that drives it home "You Can Get Pregnant!" "You Can Get the Girl Pregnant!" and then go into all the emotional and responsibility realities. I think abortion as birth control should be highly preached against and the realities of safe sex and contriception preached. Sex is great but with it comes responsibility. Unresponsible sex errodes the foundation of any society and the end result is poverty in the long run.

People are going to have sex. Some in the religiouse right want absinence. Fine. But the reality is people are going to boink nomatter what religion they were raised under and they need to know the facts of sex.

Any woman in need of an abortion is in a horrible state. It's a tough choice with long-term emotional trauma. But the reality is sometimes abortion is needed and in the end, the mother needs the freedom to make that seriouse decision herself and live whith her decision.

I think we can have legal abortion without cheapening human life. What cheapens human life is trivalizing abortion.

[Nickdfresh]

Well, now the the asstards in South Dakota can rape their daughters, and not have to worry about her having an abortion...

[scamper]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Well, now the the asstards in South Dakota can rape their daughters, and not have to worry about her having an abortion...

Fuck you. You have no fucking idea you puss.

[scamper]

Originally posted by BITEYOASS
Well seeing that ole SD is a backwards rural red state

Fuck you too, dumbass

[Roy Munson]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Well, now the the asstards in South Dakota can rape their daughters, and not have to worry about her having an abortion...


This, coming from a guy who lives in Baffalo.

:rolleyes:

[BITEYOASS]

Originally posted by jhale667
...Said the guy from Alabama! :lol: Sorry---I agree with you, but couldn't help noticing the irony...;)

It IS seriously backward thinking...and I also didn't notice any mention of increasing SD Planned Parenthood's budget towards education on contraception....dumbasses.

Well I'm originally from Jackson, Michigan. But I moved to Alabama because I fell in love with a big-titty woman who is 16 years older than I am! And we're both not republican. :D

[BITEYOASS]

Of course everyone blames the fuckin south for the incest crap, when it actually happens more often with rich cunts from other parts of the country or nutcase religious folks.

[BITEYOASS]

Of course if this was the civil war era, than them yankees would shoot me for treason! :D

[Cathedral]

You people amaze me with your excuses and labeling of people who are absolutely NOT religious, as being religious.
There is but one map that can bring you back to reality, but you refuse to read it.

Anyway, this thread is the winner of my 1 post per day if at all on this site, and here goes.

The responses so far project this idea that since abortions will happen whether or not it is legal it should be ok because it's a womans right to choose, and that excuse is flat out rediculous.
By that logic then, since murder happens everyday in every town we should just go ahead and draw up some legal guidlines that says it's ok to kill one another, it's the same thing if you really think about it.

Murder is murder, the big moral difference is that you support the weakest of our society, the fetus, being exterminated legally under the guise of a "Woman's Right".
The liberal communist mindset is that there is never a victim, that is until YOU become one yourself and then your point of view takes a hard (RIGHT) turn as YOU then seek JUSTICE for YOURSELF.

In your ignorance you all ignore the fact that God will judge you as he does the murderer because you support the murderer in your heart.

Let me tell you all something you probably don't know while you swim your life away in ignorance...YOU can't please everyone in this world, so YOU may as well please God...it's only his judgement that matters as when we die we leave this earth and arrive at his court to be judged.
where will all your liberal communist friends be then?
Huh?
Tell me, who are you going to band with when it's just you and almighty God standing face to face and YOU have absolutely no choice but to listen to all the charges you are guilty of in his eyes?

Don't argue other points, answer the questions I asked or don't bother to reply at all cause i won't acknowledge talking points on this issue about Bush or war killing innocent people.

The topic is abortion, so try to stay focused for once.

[Roy Munson]

Originally posted by Cathedral
You people amaze me with your excuses and labeling of people who are absolutely NOT religious, as being religious.
There is but one map that can bring you back to reality, but you refuse to read it.

Anyway, this thread is the winner of my 1 post per day if at all on this site, and here goes.

The responses so far project this idea that since abortions will happen whether or not it is legal it should be ok because it's a womans right to choose, and that excuse is flat out rediculous.
By that logic then, since murder happens everyday in every town we should just go ahead and draw up some legal guidlines that says it's ok to kill one another, it's the same thing if you really think about it.

Murder is murder, the big moral difference is that you support the weakest of our society, the fetus, being exterminated legally under the guise of a "Woman's Right".
The liberal communist mindset is that there is never a victim, that is until YOU become one yourself and then your point of view takes a hard (RIGHT) turn as YOU then seek JUSTICE for YOURSELF.

In your ignorance you all ignore the fact that God will judge you as he does the murderer because you support the murderer in your heart.

Let me tell you all something you probably don't know while you swim your life away in ignorance...YOU can't please everyone in this world, so YOU may as well please God...it's only his judgement that matters as when we die we leave this earth and arrive at his court to be judged.
where will all your liberal communist friends be then?
Huh?
Tell me, who are you going to band with when it's just you and almighty God standing face to face and YOU have absolutely no choice but to listen to all the charges you are guilty of in his eyes?

Don't argue other points, answer the questions I asked or don't bother to reply at all cause i won't acknowledge talking points on this issue about Bush or war killing innocent people.

The topic is abortion, so try to stay focused for once.

Ok, Cat. I agree with you but what is your stance on capital punishment?

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by Roy Munson
Ok, Cat. I agree with you but what is your stance on capital punishment?

Killing is wrong, for any reason.
Yes, that means my point of view has changed as i did support execution, and war based on political theory as recently as last week.

I've seen first hand with the rest of the world what a false christian is capable of when in power. A true born again chrisitan could not do as Bush has done and sadly it took 6 years to learn that.
After a ton of thought and soul searching it has become clear to me that a true christian would have went with diplomacy until someone raised their hand towards us, not the way things went down the last 6 years.

How can i support a war machine that delivers death, or anything that delivers death and serve God obediently?

The answer is simple...I can't.
It was after all a government that sentenced an innocent Jesus to death, so in the end i have to believe that no true obedient servant of God can ever serve as leader of a nation that serves both God and Satan, as our lesser of TWO evils political system offers.

[FORD]

Just a reminder that "this liberal communist mindset" was invented by Prescott Bush, who was one of the originators of Planned Parenthood, as part of his fascist based ideology of "Eugenics", basically a "master race" theology brought about by aborting the children of "inferior" races.

And depsite the image they project to get religious reich votes, the BCE's position on abortion and eugenics has not changed one degree since the 1930's.

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by FORD
Just a reminder that "this liberal communist mindset" was invented by Prescott Bush, who was one of the originators of Planned Parenthood, as part of his fascist based ideology of "Eugenics", basically a "master race" theology brought about by aborting the children of "inferior" races.

And depsite the image they project to get religious reich votes, the BCE's position on abortion and eugenics has not changed one degree since the 1930's.

So what?
Planned Parenthood has nothing to do with it, in fact it is a failed organization, and it failed me personally in 1987 when my fiance' was allowed to abort a healthy baby simply because she woke up depressed one morning in a panic...something i might add that she later regretted and still regrets to this day because i was lied to by her and the doctor who killed my son. needless to say, that relationship ended horribly.

Ford, do you actually know what goes on inside planned parenthood?
Have you ever been inside one?
Well, as i said, it is a failed organization and i would support it being dismantled.
I've believed that for almost 20 years and the proof is in the numbers of fetus' that were ripped/sucked from their mothers since its creation.

Why is it always your point to place blame instead of trying to change something?
"Prescott Bush this, BCE that, Oh it's a conspiracy nobody see's but me"...Hey, here's an idea, instead of being the guy who knows who to blame how about trying to be the guy who delivers an alternative that protects everyone, ESPECIALLY our unborn in the womb?

Oh, that's right, you vote for people who support it and fight tooth and nail to protect Roe vs. Wade.
Well, I blame myself for buying into the lies that either party cares about the unborn in this country.

They don't, none of them do unless it is politically advantageous to do so.
I said before that i would never keep my voice silent at the polls, but i am seriously re-thinking that if there isn't a choice i can stand by morally...the lesser of the evils isn't good enough for me to bet my eternal soul on anymore.

Maybe the huge numbers of people that don't go to the polls are the true christians...not the one's spreading their activist poison all over the place. hey, the bible says where we are headed, so why risk our souls putting support behind people who can't alter God's plan?

Seems more like an exercise in futility to me, but hey, it's all about who's to blame anyway, right?
Does it matter who or when things started in the wrong direction?
If you could steer something off the path of destruction would you try?
Or would you just be there to offer the play-by-play after the fact and be proud to tell everyone who was to blame for the disaster?

I honestly feel for the souls of the women who have aborted a child and never dropped to their knee's and begged God for forgiveness.
I pray they confess their sin and ask God for forgiveness, i really do.

There is not much difference in a doctor aborting a child then there is hiring a hit man to kill a spouse, in principle it is the same thing, killing a member of your family by proxy.

[Nitro Express]

Killing is fine as long as the hit has the blessing of the Godfather and does not conflict with the intrest of The Commission.

[FORD]

Originally posted by Cathedral
So what?
Planned Parenthood has nothing to do with it, in fact it is a failed organization, and it failed me personally in 1987 when my fiance' was allowed to abort a healthy baby simply because she woke up depressed one morning in a panic...something i might add that she later regretted and still regrets to this day because i was lied to by her and the doctor who killed my son. needless to say, that relationship ended horribly.

Ford, do you actually know what goes on inside planned parenthood?
Have you ever been inside one?
Well, as i said, it is a failed organization and i would support it being dismantled.
I've believed that for almost 20 years and the proof is in the numbers of fetus' that were ripped/sucked from their mothers since its creation.

Why is it always your point to place blame instead of trying to change something?
"Prescott Bush this, BCE that, Oh it's a conspiracy nobody see's but me"...Hey, here's an idea, instead of being the guy who knows who to blame how about trying to be the guy who delivers an alternative that protects everyone, ESPECIALLY our unborn in the womb?

I'm the only one on this board who has ever even mentioned a VIABLE alternative. All your side wants to do is continue to vote for the bastards who created the problems in the first place. And all that most Liberals want to do is view it as a "right" that someone's trying to take away.

Bottom line is that NOT ONE FUCKING ABORTION WILL EVER BE PREVENTED BY SOME NAZI JUDGE MAKING A COURT DECISION. But 99% of them could be avoided if there were no unwanted preganancies.

And to reduce unwanted pregnancies, some people are going to have to shut the fuck up and be realistic. And yes I'm pointing directly at Rome, Salt Lake City, and Virginia Beach when I say that. Encourage abstinence all you want, but don't depend on it, because that is a fucking fairy tale (pardon the pun). Birth control exists. Use it. Encourage it. Educate teenagers on HOW to use it.

Eliminate unwanted pregancies = Eliminate abortions. So simple even George Bush Jr could understand it.

Oh, that's right, you vote for people who support it and fight tooth and nail to protect Roe vs. Wade.
Well, I blame myself for buying into the lies that either party cares about the unborn in this country.

They don't, none of them do unless it is politically advantageous to do so.
I said before that i would never keep my voice silent at the polls, but i am seriously re-thinking that if there isn't a choice i can stand by morally...the lesser of the evils isn't good enough for me to bet my eternal soul on anymore.

The people who are born deserve some consideration as well. How about those in their late teens and early 20's who are dying every day for a BCE lie?


Maybe the huge numbers of people that don't go to the polls are the true christians...not the one's spreading their activist poison all over the place. hey, the bible says where we are headed, so why risk our souls putting support behind people who can't alter God's plan?

Seems more like an exercise in futility to me, but hey, it's all about who's to blame anyway, right?
Does it matter who or when things started in the wrong direction?
If you could steer something off the path of destruction would you try?
Or would you just be there to offer the play-by-play after the fact and be proud to tell everyone who was to blame for the disaster?

I don't assume all of those who I vote for are saints, but I know damn well that those I oppose are some of the most evil bastards to ever walk the planet

I honestly feel for the souls of the women who have aborted a child and never dropped to their knee's and begged God for forgiveness.
I pray they confess their sin and ask God for forgiveness, i really do.

There is not much difference in a doctor aborting a child then there is hiring a hit man to kill a spouse, in principle it is the same thing, killing a member of your family by proxy.

Then do as I suggest and help reduce unwanted pregnancies. It's the only way you'll ever get rid of abortions.

[jhale667]

Originally posted by FORD



Bottom line is that NOT ONE FUCKING ABORTION WILL EVER BE PREVENTED BY SOME NAZI JUDGE MAKING A COURT DECISION. But 99% of them could be avoided if there were no unwanted preganancies.

And to reduce unwanted pregnancies, some people are going to have to shut the fuck up and be realistic. And yes I'm pointing directly at Rome, Salt Lake City, and Virginia Beach when I say that. Encourage abstinence all you want, but don't depend on it, because that is a fucking fairy tale (pardon the pun). Birth control exists. Use it. Encourage it. Educate teenagers on HOW to use it.Then do as I suggest and help reduce unwanted pregnancies. It's the only way you'll ever get rid of abortions.

Thank you! And anyone who thinks abstinence is a viable alternative (or will EVER catch on) needs to step away from the crack pipe....slowly....:rolleyes:

[Unchainme]

I don't know, According the bible murder is Illegal and a sin. So Both Bush and The Abortion Doctors are just as guilty as each other, Bush has killed thousands in Irag, While Abortion Dotors have killed X amount. I believe both are wrong and wish that more people knew before abortions there is always the option of giving the kid up for adoption before killing he/she. Although I belive Joe Thunder should've been aborted LMMFAO..

[jhale667]

Originally posted by Unchainme
Although I belive Joe Thunder should've been aborted LMMFAO..

Yeah, but that falls under "Humanitarian" acts...it would've been doing society a favor...;)

The real debate is here is whether life beings at conception or not...I tend to believe not, but that's me.

[FORD]

I only wish Prescott Bush would have practiced Eugenics within his own family. God knows nothing remotely "superior" has come from that sewer of a gene pool.

[BITEYOASS]

I can't agree with the extremes on either side. I believe that abortion and the death penalty should only be used in extreme circumstances. Abortion should only be used in cases of rape, incest or a birth that could result in the death of the mother even if cesaerean section is an option, it definitely should not be used for women who sleep around all over the place and those who didn't bother with or had a mistake with Birth Control.
As for the Death penalty, it should be used for those who have done multiple murders, killing kids, treasonous offenses resulting in death and those sick fucks who like to play with or eat other people's body parts. But if it's the case of one scumbag killing another scumbag, someone catching they're significant other in bed with someone else, or a single murder for robbery purposes being a first time offense than that should only result in life imprisonment.

[4moreyears]

Originally posted by FORD
Just a reminder that "this liberal communist mindset" was invented by Prescott Bush, who was one of the originators of Planned Parenthood, as part of his fascist based ideology of "Eugenics", basically a "master race" theology brought about by aborting the children of "inferior" races.

And depsite the image they project to get religious reich votes, the BCE's position on abortion and eugenics has not changed one degree since the 1930's.

Like anyone sane thinks you have an ounce of credibility.

[FORD]

Originally posted by 4moreyears
Like anyone sane thinks you have an ounce of credibility.

Then look it up yourself (http://www.google.com/search?q=Prescott+Bush+Eugenics), troll.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by scamper
Fuck you. You have no fucking idea you puss.

Fuck me? No, fuck you. YOU HAVE NO IDEA...

You don't have to carry a baby to term if some fucker holds you down and forces it into you, do you?

And of course, if a girl is molested and impregnated by her father, well he can prevent her from aborting it, can't he? (Which is one of the reasons why underage girls are allowed to get abortions without parental consent).

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Roy Munson
This, coming from a guy who lives in Baffalo.

:rolleyes:

Um, I don't live in 'Baffalo' phonics boy...

And living in very Catholic "Baffalo," I am well aware of the talking points regarding abortion because this area has been a major battle ground since the late 80's, often making national headlines with the sometimes violent Pro-Life protests. "Pro-life" terrorists have murdered Abortion providers here (Dr. Bernard Slepian) and in neighboring CANADA...

And for the record, I hate the idea of abortion and find it absolutely nauseating. But it's not my body that has to carry the fetus to term... And I'm also well aware of the hypocrisy of people that care more for gestating fetuses than they do actual children in their communities. So go fuck yourselves hypocrites, and spare me your lip-service lectures...

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by FORD
Then do as I suggest and help reduce unwanted pregnancies. It's the only way you'll ever get rid of abortions.

We're not so far apart on this issue actually, i agree with some of what you say but i cannot justify abortion or even sending kids to war, not anymore.
The only thing that gives me comfort, and i only use that term for lack of a better one, is the fact that soldiers volunteer to serve, but a fetus is at the mercy of the mother.

Incest, well, there is a high probability that birth defects can result from that so i would agree to abortion in that instance, but i'm still not comfortable with it at all.
But as for rape, adoption is a better option than abortion, and i'll tell you why.
I know a girl who was raped by a black man and she did get pregnant.
She gave every option available to her a lot of thought and decided she couldn't kill it, it just wasn't her nature.
The baby was a little girl and she's entering adulthood now and is a very smart and intelligent kid...she's a beautiful young lady with a very bright future ahead of her....When you look at her she is a pretty damn good argument for NOT aborting a child just because she is the product of a rape.
I mean c'mon, the rape was bad enough, you can't compound the trauma by killing the baby, there is no justification for that at all.

And Nick, no offense bro, but i'd probably kill any doctor who touches my daughters womb without my knowing about it first.
There are ways to deal with incest, like removing the child from the home, it happens every day with a single call to Child Welfare Services.
My niece Dawn was molested by her father for 3 years, and when my cousin, her mother, happened to catch on to what was happening his ass was going down for it so he killed himself by drinking a glass of Anti-Freeze... either that or my Uncle poured the shit down his throat.

I'm still not sure if i buy that Vicky didn't know Dawn was being molested since it went on for 3 years, but that's a whole other issue.

The point is, NO doctor has any right to touch a minor without parental consent, and i don't care how you or anyone else tries to justify that concept, it is wrong.

Killing is wrong no matter if it is by bomb, or scalpel, or gun, or knife, or by my own hand in defense of my child...it's flat out murder and there is no excuse for it...not even by right of choice, nobody has the right to kill, nobody.

I'm not advocating that a woman has no right to choose. I'm advocating a limit on when that choice is no longer valid.
And i'm advocating that the government never had any right to make a ruling on such an issue. Abortion is Federally Sanctioned Murder, it's unconstitutional, and you cannot convince me otherwise, nobody can.

I remember the days when coat hangers were the weapon of choice, and i also know what a murder charge is...and as much as most would like to believe, laws don't stop crimes because they aren't designed to stop crimes. laws are designed to punish criminals who commit them.

I've shared more personal info on this issue in this forum than i was really comfortable with, but i believe it is neccessary to get my point across. it's an issue that i feel very very strongly about and against because i believe that every life should be given a chance after it is concieved...my conscience will not allow me to see it any other way.

But regardless, South Dakota passed the ban, and that is a very good start in my opinion and the precedent has been set for all other states to follow suit.
Children are a blessing, and God will punish those who harm them, that is a fact not to be taken lightly.

[scamper]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Fuck me? No, fuck you. YOU HAVE NO IDEA...

You don't have to carry a baby to term if some fucker holds you down and forces it into you, do you?

And of course, if a girl is molested and impregnated by her father, well he can prevent her from aborting it, can't he? (Which is one of the reasons why underage girls are allowed to get abortions without parental consent).


Ya don't get do ya, my response is not about abortion it's about you labeling a state load of people. Calling us backward child molesters, you have no idea what the people here are like, but that doesn't stop you from grouping us into some little demented uneducated hick state. Where's the tolerance? By the way this abortion thing is not something we're voting on. Before you start throwing out labels why don't you come on over for a visit and see what you're talking about.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by scamper
Ya don't get do ya, my response is not about abortion it's about you labeling a state load of people. Calling us backward child molesters, you have no idea what the people here are like, but that doesn't stop you from grouping us into some little demented uneducated hick state. Where's the tolerance? By the way this abortion thing is not something we're voting on. Before you start throwing out labels why don't you come on over for a visit and see what you're talking about.

I was referring to the legislators...

[DLR'sCock]

There are two major things that will decress the number of unwanted preganancies.

Contraception and REAL sex education and being honest, open, and lovign with your kids so that they trust you.


The other is, well if you want to prevent the number of abortions, GO OUT AND ADOPT AS MANY KIDS AS YOU CAN.

Adoption and sex education are the only real viable answers.

[Cathedral]

Hey Ford, maybe you can edit this thread title to say, "South Dakota Bans Abortion?"

HAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

SCORE ONE FOR THE UNBORN BABIE'S, BABY!

God is great, God is Good, Amen and Goodnight. :)

[FORD]

God had nothing to do with this. In fact, from what I hear, the so called "pro-lifers" in this case used some very sleazy tactics. Jesus never had to decieve anyone to make His points.

And there's no point in changing the title until the governor signs the bill.

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Does anyone have any idea the ratio of White men in this country who support abortion, and the ratio of black men who do?

What about white men to white women? white men to black women? black men to white women?

Or just good old fashioned men to women...

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Fuck off.......

[4moreyears]

........trolls.

[FORD]

Originally posted by EAT MY ASSHOLE
Does anyone have any idea the ratio of White men in this country who support abortion, and the ratio of black men who do?

What about white men to white women? white men to black women? black men to white women?

Or just good old fashioned men to women...

Interesting questions.

Why don't you go research the answers? It would give you something better to do than being a troll.

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Originally posted by 4moreyears


Hey! Back off! I'm the only troll who gets to make fun of FORD around here, understand, bitch???!??

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Originally posted by FORD
Interesting questions.

Why don't you go research the answers? It would give you something better to do than being a troll.

Well, seeing as you know everything, I thought I'd just ask you.

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by FORD
God had nothing to do with this. In fact, from what I hear, the so called "pro-lifers" in this case used some very sleazy tactics. Jesus never had to decieve anyone to make His points.

And there's no point in changing the title until the governor signs the bill.

I'm just ribbin ya little man, though i am happy about this news and the governor already said he was inclined to sign it.

The thread title is fine, it's dated.

But i think i should remind you, God has everything to do with everything on this earth. ;)
As for the deception, that was actually done back in '74 when the government said it was OK for women to kill their children.

By the way, Ford. if you didn't have a yard and you planted seeds in your neighbors yard with permission; how would you feel if they decided to claim them and destroyed them without your consent?...would you feel cheated?

I think i'm just lucky to have only been with one woman who thought so little of me or my feelings. It takes two, not one.

[vheddyrmv8]

Originally posted by BITEYOASS
I can't agree with the extremes on either side. I believe that abortion and the death penalty should only be used in extreme circumstances. Abortion should only be used in cases of rape, incest or a birth that could result in the death of the mother even if cesaerean section is an option, it definitely should not be used for women who sleep around all over the place and those who didn't bother with or had a mistake with Birth Control.
As for the Death penalty, it should be used for those who have done multiple murders, killing kids, treasonous offenses resulting in death and those sick fucks who like to play with or eat other people's body parts. But if it's the case of one scumbag killing another scumbag, someone catching they're significant other in bed with someone else, or a single murder for robbery purposes being a first time offense than that should only result in life imprisonment.

That's the best comment I've read on this thread. Lemme give you guys a kid's point of view. I'm not gonna get into what I have done...but in health class, these planned parenthood people came in and showed us these billions of contraception units. There's tons of them! And most of them anyone can buy at target or any place with a pharmacy. If I had known this before, my life would have been different.

You want to know why teens have sex and get pregnant? Parents. They are the cause of it all. I know it sounds childish but hear me out. Parents preach abstenance all of the time and scold you for being anywhere near a member of the opposite sex. Kids will do the opposite of what you tell them. Kids are curious...if you see it all the time on TV and your parents preach so much about it you wonder wow what is it like that it causes all of this controversy?

Let me tell you if parents were leniant and gave their kids birth control, condoms, ect, the rate of teen pregnancy would be cut in half I garuntee. I know it's hard for parents to imagine their kids having to do this stuff, but that's how life is. As a parent, you should be ready for it.

[scamper]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
I was referring to the legislators...

oh, nevermind

[4moreyears]

Edit Boy strikes again. Strike a chord with your lack of female intimacy Ford buddy!!!

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by vheddyrmv8
That's the best comment I've read on this thread. Lemme give you guys a kid's point of view. I'm not gonna get into what I have done...but in health class, these planned parenthood people came in and showed us these billions of contraception units. There's tons of them! And most of them anyone can buy at target or any place with a pharmacy. If I had known this before, my life would have been different.

You want to know why teens have sex and get pregnant? Parents. They are the cause of it all. I know it sounds childish but hear me out. Parents preach abstenance all of the time and scold you for being anywhere near a member of the opposite sex. Kids will do the opposite of what you tell them. Kids are curious...if you see it all the time on TV and your parents preach so much about it you wonder wow what is it like that it causes all of this controversy?

Let me tell you if parents were leniant and gave their kids birth control, condoms, ect, the rate of teen pregnancy would be cut in half I garuntee. I know it's hard for parents to imagine their kids having to do this stuff, but that's how life is. As a parent, you should be ready for it.

Well said...

I think it's just stupid when I hear about people in this forum complaining about schools showing teens how to put a condom on a cucumber, then in the same breath, decry abortion...

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by vheddyrmv8
That's the best comment I've read on this thread. Lemme give you guys a kid's point of view. I'm not gonna get into what I have done...but in health class, these planned parenthood people came in and showed us these billions of contraception units. There's tons of them! And most of them anyone can buy at target or any place with a pharmacy. If I had known this before, my life would have been different.

You want to know why teens have sex and get pregnant? Parents. They are the cause of it all. I know it sounds childish but hear me out. Parents preach abstenance all of the time and scold you for being anywhere near a member of the opposite sex. Kids will do the opposite of what you tell them. Kids are curious...if you see it all the time on TV and your parents preach so much about it you wonder wow what is it like that it causes all of this controversy?

Let me tell you if parents were leniant and gave their kids birth control, condoms, ect, the rate of teen pregnancy would be cut in half I garuntee. I know it's hard for parents to imagine their kids having to do this stuff, but that's how life is. As a parent, you should be ready for it.

I agree with you on one point, it is the parents fault if their kid comes home pregnant.
The only kids that don't come home pregnant before they are married are the one's that were raised with some self respect.
The kids that can go to their parents about anything and everything without being judged.
The job of a parent isn't to just sit back and expect the kids to experiment with sex, drugs and alcohol, or be "lenient", as you suggest, that is the excuse a child will use to run around and be irresponsible.
No responsible parent is going to give them the tools to go running off into the world and dive right into things they are not emotionally ready for.

That is society talking, and in a socialist atmosphere you make perfect sense.
Pregnancy is not the only risk involved with pre-marital sex, we're talking about STD's, HIV, and all out AID'S, you know, things that can actually kill you.
Any parent that is "lenient" as you suggest, and in that regard, is a worthless parent who doesn't really give a rats ass about the lives or futures of their children.
Parents and schools who think of sexual contact in a social sense are not teaching the kids what they should be teaching them.
Like how sex is something special between two "LOVING" and "MARRIED" people, not something to do on the weekends with someone you "like" a whole lot. it's a lack of responsibility, period.
My kids haven't and won't go running about screaming they weren't educated and hopping from bed to bed, I took care of that by being open and honest with them when they asked the tough questions. and why do i do that?
Because it is MY responsibility not to fumble the issue for their sake.

I respect your opinion, but you're only addressing one issue, teen pregnancy, and that tells me you are missing the most important points based on the social mindset that has been programmed into you.

Kids are lost because the parents allow them to take that first step in the wrong direction, it isn't about NOT being educated on safe sex practices, that is the excuse of a foolish parent/child relationship.

Your parents apparently didn't spend much time on the subject with you because to them it was probably due to the common stigma most parents have that prevents them from doing so, and it's called embarrassment.

When my oldest daughter started dating I sat her boy down and i told him about the values and the understanding i had with my daughter. I also told him what i expect from him when he is with my daughter and the consequences of violating any of that.
I didn't stand in the way of them growing up, but i made my children look for something long lasting and meaningful, not just short term and i certainly didn't hand the boy a pack of condoms and say, "Be Careful!"....That's rediculous, but it does happen in todays liberal society and any boy who enters my childs life thinking like that is easy to spot, all you have to do is watch how he looks at your daughter when her back is turned to him.
You can literally see the saliva run down their chins, and i'm dead serious.

Schools aren't the one's who are to arm your children with the knowledge of how to be responsible, that's the job of the parent, but being "lenient" is not the way to do it.
If a kid steps off into the wrong direction they need to be corrected, they need to be educated (at home) by people who have experience in the area.
And i don't just mean saying, "Don't do this" and then walk away, I man sitting down with them and explaining all the good points and bad points of what a sexual relationship involves.

And another thing, the trust to be able to have these discussions begins when they are exposed to sex, which due to society and what they see on television is getting younger and younger every day.
with my oldest she asked me about sex when she was 12...my youngest began asking about it at 9.
The point is, a parent who ignores what they are taking in and fails to address will result in them trying to gain this mutual respect and trust when the "curiosity" as you put it has already set in, and 9 times out of 10 they'll end up giving their innocence to the wrong person.

So your right, the parent is at fault, just not in any way for the reasons you stated.
What you propose is what you get from parents who aren't interested in parenting enough to put the stigma's to rest and their childrens futures suffer because of it.

And another thing, those who aren't a parent don't have any right telling me anything about being one because they don't have a clue what they are talking about at all.
They would be better served keeping their mouths closed until they can speak from experience and not some socialistic viewpoint where anything and everything goes.
I did my job and i'm still doing it today and let me tell you, my kids know what is right and what is wrong and if they don't they have no problems coming to me for any reason.
And that is only because I didn't just turn them loose for their heads to be filled with moral value I don't respect.

Next, you'll be telling me that by sticking my nose into their business i am invading their privacy, right ?

Well, I'd agree with you because until they reach 18 years of age and move out on their own they are legally MY responsibility and they do NOTHING i am not aware of.
but again, My relationship with my daughters was never about keeping secrets and doing things behind my back, it was about mutual respect for one another.

"Leniency" is the tool of the foolish parent and that parent will lose control right around puberty if they don't sow the seeds of self respect when that "curiosity" you speak of begins to tug at them through their friends.

I lost my oldest in car a crash a few years ago, but before and since then i have seen all but one of her friends give birth before they graduated high school. the thing that makes me break down and weep is when the one who didn't get pregnant told me she was sad for the one's that became parents and that she followed Tabitha's lead when everyone else was bedding down...and she knew it was because of how open our relationship was...she told me it was because MY daughter gave more thought to her future than she did having sex with her boyfriend.
At her funeral this kid told me she wishes she had a Father like me, and it broke my heart, but filled me with pride that i had done my job right....because i really didn't know until that moment that i was successful.

My daughter had too much respect for me to risk ruining her life and destroying all possibility of becoming any of the many things i knew she could be in life and what she wanted to be.
I support my children with everything i have inside me. I never took my attention and focus off of their lives for any reason and i damn sure never used "leniency" in raising them, and i never will in the remaining 8 years i have left to raise my baby.

When she is 18 years old she can make her own choices, but i know they will be well thought out and executed choices because I took being a parent seriously.

Anything less results in catastrophy, and the blame falls flat in the lap of the parents.
There are a lot of posts in this thread by people who dont even have kids, and they are the same one's who are taking the liberalist's point of view on the issue of sex and abortion.
That's hardly the viewpoint any parent should be listening to on such matters, y'all need to just shut up.

To all the liberal thinkers on this subject i say this, "It is better to remain silent and be guessed a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt".

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Well said...

I think it's just stupid when I hear about people in this forum complaining about schools showing teens how to put a condom on a cucumber, then in the same breath, decry abortion...

Strong words coming from a person who has no kids.

[FORD]

Originally posted by Cathedral

Schools aren't the one's who are to arm your children with the knowledge of how to be responsible, that's the job of the parent, but being "lenient" is not the way to do it.


And what happens when parents refuse to take that responsibility?

I'm sure I've mentioned this story in a previous abortion thread, but it's still a great example.....

This girl who lived up the street from me was from a Catholic family. Her mother physically pulled her off the school bus the Monday morning of the week where sex education was to be taught in school. Within a year, that girl was pregnant. She probably wasn't even 15 at the time. And she would have two more kids while still a teenager. Probably went on Welfare, if I remember correctly.

Obviously, her parents did not take the responsibility to educate their daughter. And they wouldn't allow the school to do so.

So the kid went on her own knowledge, or what her friends told her, which was probably something like "Oh you can't get pregnant the first time" (or whatever).

If the parents HAVE done their job, then I don't see what harm could come from a kid hearing the facts in school. If the parents have NOT done their job, it could make a world of difference.

[Nitro Express]

When I was a freshmen in college they came into our biology lab and showed us all the different kinds of birth control. I'll never forget some dude grabbing a canister of contraceptive foam and slipping it into the back pocket of some hot chick. She didn't notice and she went walking around campus with a canister of cotraceptive foam stuck to her hot ass. LOL!

[Nitro Express]

The bottom line is kids need to know that when the horny as hell boy shoots his love cream into the girl's holy of holies, things happen. It may be old fashioned but kids need to learn to keep the hormones in check; especially now with a huge list of venerial diseases. Even meningitus has been linked to kissing multiple partners.

There's just some dirty pussy, tongues, and asshole out there and the worst case scenerio is dying a slow agonizing death from AIDS. Genital warts and herpes don't sound fun either.

As far as condoms go. They suck. Nobody is going to use them the Planned Parenthood way either. Who wants to put spermicide in the girls pussy, wait 15 minutes, roll the condom on propperly and then fuck what feels like a rubber glove being stuck into some sloppy green Jello? Naw, we want bare tissue rubbing each other and blowing the kak all over the place. Having sex with a condom is like buying a Koler multiple head shower experience and wearing an industrial fishing raincoat and boots in it.

Naw, God wanted us to fuck natural and he created marriage to do it in. Anyone who goes against God will be tortured with the results of their own actions. What can I say. God is an asshole! LOL!

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by FORD
And what happens when parents refuse to take that responsibility?

I'm sure I've mentioned this story in a previous abortion thread, but it's still a great example.....

This girl who lived up the street from me was from a Catholic family. Her mother physically pulled her off the school bus the Monday morning of the week where sex education was to be taught in school. Within a year, that girl was pregnant. She probably wasn't even 15 at the time. And she would have two more kids while still a teenager. Probably went on Welfare, if I remember correctly.

Obviously, her parents did not take the responsibility to educate their daughter. And they wouldn't allow the school to do so.

So the kid went on her own knowledge, or what her friends told her, which was probably something like "Oh you can't get pregnant the first time" (or whatever).

If the parents HAVE done their job, then I don't see what harm could come from a kid hearing the facts in school. If the parents have NOT done their job, it could make a world of difference.

I'm not saying sex education is a bad thing. I had sex ed in health class my freshman year and it wasn't about condoning sex at all. it showed the reality of child birth, the consequences of engaging in a sexual relationship before your mind has had the chance to mature emotionally etc.
That is not the message being taught today, what is being taught today comes from the perspective of, "Well, since you're going to have sex anyway, here's how to do it", and that's such a crock.
It's basically saying, "We give up, so go forth and fornicate".

Society and it's liberal attitude that all things are proper from programming on tv, to billboards, to magazine ads, to whatever the eye can see or hear outside the home contributes to the problem.

Pardon me for saying this, but when our nation embraced some biblical principle's things like this weren't so rampant. that is not to say it didn't happen, but it was a rare occurance.

What needs to happen is that parents need to be educated on how to deal with these issues.
And in a worse case scenario, if a child gets knocked up by her boyfriend she shouldn't be allowed to discard the baby.
It's like saying, "Oh darn, you got pregnant, well we'll spare you learning the facts of life by taking that mean old baby out of you".

Give me abreak!

Look, instead of passing laws that make abortion legal we should pass laws that say, "If your daughter gets pregnant then that young mothers parents are legally responsible for raising it until the young mother is an adult".
I guarentee you that a change in how people think of their kids will change and that alone would take a chunk out of the number of abortions happening each year.

When a juvenile gets in trouble for damaging property the parents have to pay the damages. make that apply to teenage pregnancy and parents will step up to the plate and manage their kids far better than the average person does now.

That won't end abortion, but it is one of many things that can be done to reduce it.
And it still says nothing about the government having no right to give permission to anyone to kill a fetus.

The moment a seed produces a root it is considered a plant, same goes for the seed that produces a fetus.
Once the seed sprouts, you have life, period.

There are many ways to combat abortion and teen prgnancy, none of which are being explored or promoted by our government or liberal society.
I don't know how many Conservatives Politicians truly oppose abortion, but i know plenty of conservative voters that do with a vengance.

The starting point should be by placing the responsibility for how kids turn out on the parents who raise them until they reach the legal age of 18.
Parenting doesn't come with auto-pilot as an option.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Cathedral
Strong words coming from a person who has no kids.

Ahhh, the wonders of birth control...:)

[jhale667]

Originally posted by Cathedral
Strong words coming from a person who has no kids.

Strong and true. And sorry Cat, obviously your intentions are noble, but if you think your sitting down with your daughter's dude means he now wants to F*** the dogshit out of her any LESS, or won't try....well, you've forgotten what it was like to be a teenage boy.

[vheddyrmv8]

Originally posted by Cathedral
I agree with you on one point, it is the parents fault if their kid comes home pregnant.
The only kids that don't come home pregnant before they are married are the one's that were raised with some self respect.
The kids that can go to their parents about anything and everything without being judged.
The job of a parent isn't to just sit back and expect the kids to experiment with sex, drugs and alcohol, or be "lenient", as you suggest, that is the excuse a child will use to run around and be irresponsible.
No responsible parent is going to give them the tools to go running off into the world and dive right into things they are not emotionally ready for.


Sorry wrong word I don't mean for them to let kids run around and fuck but rathar not bug them constantly when they are at dances or things like that and aren't even doing anything.




That is society talking, and in a socialist atmosphere you make perfect sense.
Pregnancy is not the only risk involved with pre-marital sex, we're talking about STD's, HIV, and all out AID'S, you know, things that can actually kill you.
Any parent that is "lenient" as you suggest, and in that regard, is a worthless parent who doesn't really give a rats ass about the lives or futures of their children.
Parents and schools who think of sexual contact in a social sense are not teaching the kids what they should be teaching them.
Like how sex is something special between two "LOVING" and "MARRIED" people, not something to do on the weekends with someone you "like" a whole lot. it's a lack of responsibility, period.
My kids haven't and won't go running about screaming they weren't educated and hopping from bed to bed, I took care of that by being open and honest with them when they asked the tough questions. and why do i do that?
Because it is MY responsibility not to fumble the issue for their sake.

Yes STDs are even worse than pregnancy IMO and teaching kids about that is good as well...seeing graphic videos on what can happen will really ingrave it in someones head. And once again I didn't mean letting them do whatever they want, you sound like a great parent, but there are actually parents out there that abuse kids, i have friends that want to hurt themselves because their parents call them worthless pieces of shit and bitches all of the time...and yes those are their exact words. Acting like that will make a child seek attention from someone else...and where else but a boyfriend or girlfriend and they will do anything just to have a relationship to have someone that cares, thats another big one on the pregnancy statistics that people sometimes don't look into.


I respect your opinion, but you're only addressing one issue, teen pregnancy, and that tells me you are missing the most important points based on the social mindset that has been programmed into you.

Kids are lost because the parents allow them to take that first step in the wrong direction, it isn't about NOT being educated on safe sex practices, that is the excuse of a foolish parent/child relationship.

I respect your opinion as well...but i talk to kids every day that have sex all of the time, and after seeing these STD videos and getting contraception information has changed how they act, so I know that it works. Just telling kids to completely ignore it is foolish I would agree there. You can't just tell a drug addict to stop taking drugs, you need to help them and show them the immense consequenses of taking drugs.


Your parents apparently didn't spend much time on the subject with you because to them it was probably due to the common stigma most parents have that prevents them from doing so, and it's called embarrassment.

Yes my parents do that's how I have my opinion on how to stop teen sex. My mom had her first kid at 16 and when i got a girlfriend she hounded me constantly and it just made me want to do more with her. My mom has never had any embarassment talking about it.


When my oldest daughter started dating I sat her boy down and i told him about the values and the understanding i had with my daughter. I also told him what i expect from him when he is with my daughter and the consequences of violating any of that.
I didn't stand in the way of them growing up, but i made my children look for something long lasting and meaningful, not just short term and i certainly didn't hand the boy a pack of condoms and say, "Be Careful!"....That's rediculous, but it does happen in todays liberal society and any boy who enters my childs life thinking like that is easy to spot, all you have to do is watch how he looks at your daughter when her back is turned to him.
You can literally see the saliva run down their chins, and i'm dead serious.

Yes I agree that is rediculous...but tell me what is more rediculous? Giving your child a box of condoms because most animals on the plannet cant control the urge to reproduce, it isn't any different with humans, especially with hormones raging during the teenage years, or your kids finding ways to have unprotected sex behind your back (which is a lot easier than most parents recognize)? I think, as a caring parent which you seem to be since you are so strong on the issue, that you would rathar take the first route. Now not all kids are doing it, that would be crazy, but a lot of kids are. If you got a bunch of kids in a room, a lot would say they have lost their virginity at around 14 or 15 which is surprising. Now tell me what is wrong with making sure your kids don't have sex...but also protecting them at the same time?


Schools aren't the one's who are to arm your children with the knowledge of how to be responsible, that's the job of the parent, but being "lenient" is not the way to do it.
If a kid steps off into the wrong direction they need to be corrected, they need to be educated (at home) by people who have experience in the area.
And i don't just mean saying, "Don't do this" and then walk away, I man sitting down with them and explaining all the good points and bad points of what a sexual relationship involves.


I would disagree that it's not the schools job...school's purpose is to prepare kids for life..all parts of life, not just math and science. Most parents don't know a lot of this information about stds or contraception, since a lot of it wasn't known when they were kids. Most teachers are parents too so why wouldn't they be fit to teach them? I agree they shouldn't be the only ones, you are right that parents need to educate just as much as schools do.


And another thing, the trust to be able to have these discussions begins when they are exposed to sex, which due to society and what they see on television is getting younger and younger every day.
with my oldest she asked me about sex when she was 12...my youngest began asking about it at 9.
The point is, a parent who ignores what they are taking in and fails to address will result in them trying to gain this mutual respect and trust when the "curiosity" as you put it has already set in, and 9 times out of 10 they'll end up giving their innocence to the wrong person.

I 100% agree.


And another thing, those who aren't a parent don't have any right telling me anything about being one because they don't have a clue what they are talking about at all.
They would be better served keeping their mouths closed until they can speak from experience and not some socialistic viewpoint where anything and everything goes.
I did my job and i'm still doing it today and let me tell you, my kids know what is right and what is wrong and if they don't they have no problems coming to me for any reason.
And that is only because I didn't just turn them loose for their heads to be filled with moral value I don't respect.


True I don't have any right. But parents don't have any right to claim to know what really happens with kids these days since they aren't kids. It goes both ways. I wasn't in any way making this out to be directly at you or anyone else here. I am giving the kids' point of view. How can you stop this issue if you don't listen to the people in question?


Next, you'll be telling me that by sticking my nose into their business i am invading their privacy, right ?

Well, I'd agree with you because until they reach 18 years of age and move out on their own they are legally MY responsibility and they do NOTHING i am not aware of.
but again, My relationship with my daughters was never about keeping secrets and doing things behind my back, it was about mutual respect for one another.

No I'm not giving parenting classes, I have no plans to be a parent anytime soon, and I certainly have no right to preach about it. Parents should be wondering what their kids are doing. But invading everything in their life is no better than the government listening to everyone's phone conversations or emails. The thing called the mind...how parent's act towards their children will determine how it grows. If you raid your kids room every day, ask a ton of questions about where they are and what they are doing every day, you can leave a big emotional toll and then have a kid who is always insecure. Now before you go and say "oh you're saying I'm ruining my kid's mind?" No, I'm not, none of this was directed at anyone here in the first place, only at the parents I know.



I lost my oldest in car a crash a few years ago, but before and since then i have seen all but one of her friends give birth before they graduated high school. the thing that makes me break down and weep is when the one who didn't get pregnant told me she was sad for the one's that became parents and that she followed Tabitha's lead when everyone else was bedding down...and she knew it was because of how open our relationship was...she told me it was because MY daughter gave more thought to her future than she did having sex with her boyfriend.
At her funeral this kid told me she wishes she had a Father like me, and it broke my heart, but filled me with pride that i had done my job right....because i really didn't know until that moment that i was successful.

I am very sorry to hear that, that is a terrible thing to happen, I couldn't evenb begin to imagine the pain that you have gone through. But once again, I'm not directing this at you. You seem to be a great parent, and if this isn't happening to your kids for sure, then you have nothing to worry about.


My daughter had too much respect for me to risk ruining her life and destroying all possibility of becoming any of the many things i knew she could be in life and what she wanted to be.
I support my children with everything i have inside me. I never took my attention and focus off of their lives for any reason and i damn sure never used "leniency" in raising them, and i never will in the remaining 8 years i have left to raise my baby.

You have a great daughter then, and since you do it would be hard for you to believe, but most kids don't. Some kids never learn respect for anyone, and that's how we end up with people like Joe Thunder, a lot of kids haven't developed it by that time, a lot of kids just go with their feelings without thinking of the reprecussions.

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh


when I hear about people in this forum complaining about schools showing teens how to put a condom on a cucumber,


I bet that turns you on, doesn't it?

Fag.

[Nickdfresh]

Yeah, but at least you don't need birth cuntrol when asking guys to 'eat out your asshole'...

I bet your little sister gets a coat hanger every once in a while though, after your father bangs her...

On the bright side, you can't get your nephew pregnant...

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by jhale667
Strong and true. And sorry Cat, obviously your intentions are noble, but if you think your sitting down with your daughter's dude means he now wants to F*** the dogshit out of her any LESS, or won't try....well, you've forgotten what it was like to be a teenage boy.

LOL, I think i'm a bit smarter than that.
I will admit that i have been lucky because my first child had good taste and great judgement in who she chose to date.
And my knowing exactly how I was at their age is a great tool i use to my advantage.

Hey, I know what my dates parents said to me didn't matter once i got her out the door. most of the time it was the girls who initiated things anyway.

And therein lies the key...I am doing my best to ensure my daughter remains in control of herself and acts responsibly. I can't see the future of course, but i have faith in my Li' Pumpkin not to become a whore.
Both my daughters are very different, and i'll admit that my baby girl is a little bit more like me than her sister was...and that aspect does give me concern as she gets older.

Believe me, I don't claim to be Super Dad or anything like that, but i'm not one to take chances with my kids future.

And say she does make the mistake and falls for the crap boys always lay down....Abortion will never be an answer, and she WILL finish school and go to college if i have to raise the child myself until she gets her degree.

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by vheddyrmv8
Sorry wrong word I don't mean for them to let kids run around and fuck but rathar not bug them constantly when they are at dances or things like that and aren't even doing anything.





Yes STDs are even worse than pregnancy IMO and teaching kids about that is good as well...seeing graphic videos on what can happen will really ingrave it in someones head. And once again I didn't mean letting them do whatever they want, you sound like a great parent, but there are actually parents out there that abuse kids, i have friends that want to hurt themselves because their parents call them worthless pieces of shit and bitches all of the time...and yes those are their exact words. Acting like that will make a child seek attention from someone else...and where else but a boyfriend or girlfriend and they will do anything just to have a relationship to have someone that cares, thats another big one on the pregnancy statistics that people sometimes don't look into.



I respect your opinion as well...but i talk to kids every day that have sex all of the time, and after seeing these STD videos and getting contraception information has changed how they act, so I know that it works. Just telling kids to completely ignore it is foolish I would agree there. You can't just tell a drug addict to stop taking drugs, you need to help them and show them the immense consequenses of taking drugs.



Yes my parents do that's how I have my opinion on how to stop teen sex. My mom had her first kid at 16 and when i got a girlfriend she hounded me constantly and it just made me want to do more with her. My mom has never had any embarassment talking about it.



Yes I agree that is rediculous...but tell me what is more rediculous? Giving your child a box of condoms because most animals on the plannet cant control the urge to reproduce, it isn't any different with humans, especially with hormones raging during the teenage years, or your kids finding ways to have unprotected sex behind your back (which is a lot easier than most parents recognize)? I think, as a caring parent which you seem to be since you are so strong on the issue, that you would rathar take the first route. Now not all kids are doing it, that would be crazy, but a lot of kids are. If you got a bunch of kids in a room, a lot would say they have lost their virginity at around 14 or 15 which is surprising. Now tell me what is wrong with making sure your kids don't have sex...but also protecting them at the same time?




I would disagree that it's not the schools job...school's purpose is to prepare kids for life..all parts of life, not just math and science. Most parents don't know a lot of this information about stds or contraception, since a lot of it wasn't known when they were kids. Most teachers are parents too so why wouldn't they be fit to teach them? I agree they shouldn't be the only ones, you are right that parents need to educate just as much as schools do.



I 100% agree.




True I don't have any right. But parents don't have any right to claim to know what really happens with kids these days since they aren't kids. It goes both ways. I wasn't in any way making this out to be directly at you or anyone else here. I am giving the kids' point of view. How can you stop this issue if you don't listen to the people in question?



No I'm not giving parenting classes, I have no plans to be a parent anytime soon, and I certainly have no right to preach about it. Parents should be wondering what their kids are doing. But invading everything in their life is no better than the government listening to everyone's phone conversations or emails. The thing called the mind...how parent's act towards their children will determine how it grows. If you raid your kids room every day, ask a ton of questions about where they are and what they are doing every day, you can leave a big emotional toll and then have a kid who is always insecure. Now before you go and say "oh you're saying I'm ruining my kid's mind?" No, I'm not, none of this was directed at anyone here in the first place, only at the parents I know.




I am very sorry to hear that, that is a terrible thing to happen, I couldn't evenb begin to imagine the pain that you have gone through. But once again, I'm not directing this at you. You seem to be a great parent, and if this isn't happening to your kids for sure, then you have nothing to worry about.



You have a great daughter then, and since you do it would be hard for you to believe, but most kids don't. Some kids never learn respect for anyone, and that's how we end up with people like Joe Thunder, a lot of kids haven't developed it by that time, a lot of kids just go with their feelings without thinking of the reprecussions.

You have made some extremely valid points, and i appreciate your understanding of my post. I did not take your initial comments personally of course, but i do understand that what goes on in my home isn't practiced in all homes.
I wish all parents would do right by their kids, but you're right, a hell of a lot of them just don't care and never will.

I'd like to think I had all the answers, but I just don't, not for anyone but my children and the lives i am responsible for.

My downfall is my passion for children to be treated fairly and with unconditional love by those who should care the most.

I just believe with all my heart that things could be better if they hadn't been allowed to decline for so long.
I do kind of see the entire situation as hopeless, but deep down inside me i can't accept that and will always feel as strongly about it.

But hey, we have to start somewhere and i believe there are better alternatives to what we have in the works now.

Great post by the way, I didn't mean to imply that your parents failed you in any way since i can clearly see by your posts they did a pretty good job...whether we agree or not. ;)