My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

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  • Nickdfresh
    SUPER MODERATOR

    • Oct 2004
    • 49136

    My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

    No, it wasn't an "inside job," but Bush may well have known more than he has said... Did Neo Con factions in the US Gov't prevent pre-9/11 investigations in order to facilitate a terrorist strike in order to justify an invasion of Iraq? I believe it's a distinct possibility. You be the judge...

    Published on Saturday, June 1, 2002 by CommonDreams.org

    The Bush 9/11 Scandal for Dummies
    by Bernard Weiner


    Don't know about you, but all this who-knew-what-when pre-9/11 stuff is mighty confusing. So once again, I head to that all-purpose reference series for some comprehensible answers.

    Q. I've heard all these reports about the government knowing weeks and months in advance of 9/11 that airliners were going to be hijacked and flown into buildings, and yet the Bush Administration apparently did nothing and denied they did anything wrong. They claimed the fault lay in the intelligence agencies "not connecting the dots," or that it was the "FBI culture" that failed. Can you explain?

    A. Most of the "it's-the-fault-of-the-system" spin is designed to deflect attention from the real situation. Bush and his spokesmen may well be correct in saying they had no idea as to the specifics -- they may not have known the exact details of the attacks -- but it is more and more apparent that they knew a great deal more than they're letting on, including the possible targets.

    Q. You're not just going leave that hanging out there, are you? Just bash Bush with no evidence to back it up?

    A. There's no need to bash anybody. There is more than enough documentation to establish that the Bush Administration was fully aware that a major attack was coming from Al-Qaeda, by air, aimed at symbolic structures on the U.S. mainland, and that among mentioned targets were the World Trade Center, the Pentagon, the White House, the Congress, Statue of Liberty. (According to Richard Clarke, the White House's National Coordinator for Anti-Terrorism, the intelligence community was convinced ten weeks before 9/11 that an Al-Qaeda attack on U.S. soil was imminent.)

    Q. If they knew in advance that the, or at least an, attack was coming, why did the Bush Administration do nothing to prepare the country in advance: get photos of suspected terrorists out to airlines, have fighter jets put on emergency-standby status or even in the air as deterrents, get word out to the border police to stop these "watch-list" terrorists, put surface-to-air missiles around the White House and Pentagon, etc.?

    A. The explanation preferred by the government is to admit, eight months late, to absolute and horrendous incompetence, up and down the line (although Bush&Co., surprise!, prefer to focus the blame lower down, letting the FBI be the fall guy). But let's try an alternate explanation. Think about it for a moment. If their key goal was to mobilize the country behind the Bush Administration, get their political/business agenda through, have a reason to move unilaterally around the globe, and defang the Democrats and other critics at home -- what better way to do all that than to have Bush be the take-charge leader after a diabolic "sneak attack"?

    Q. You're suggesting the ultimate cynical stratagem, purely for political ends. I can't believe that Bush and his cronies are that venal. Isn't it possible that the whole intelligence apparatus just blew it?

    A. Possible, but not bloody likely. There certainly is enough blame to spread around, but the evidence indicates that Bush and his closest aides knew that bin Laden was planning a direct attack on the U.S. Mainland -- using airplanes headed for those icon targets -- and, in order to get the country to move in the direction he wanted, he kept silent.

    Q. But if that's true, what you've described is utterly indefensible, putting policy ahead of American citizens' lives.

    A. Now are you beginning to understand why Bush&Co. are fighting so tenaciously against a blue-ribbon commission of inquiry, and why Bush and Cheney went to Congressional leaders and asked them not to investigate the pre-9/11 period? Now do you understand why they are trying so desperately to keep everything secret, tightly locked up in the White House, only letting drips and drabs get out when there is no other way to avoid Congressional subpoenas or court-ordered disclosures? They know that if one thread of the cover-up unravels, more of their darkest secrets will follow.

    Q. You're sounding like a conspiracy nut.

    A. For years, we've avoided thinking in those terms, because so many so-called "conspiracies" exist only in someone's fevered imagination. Plus, to think along these lines in this case is depressing, suggesting that American democracy can be so easily manipulated and distorted by a cabal of the greedy and power-hungry. But I'm afraid that's where the evidence leads.

    Q. You mean there's proof of Bush complicity in 9/11 locked up in the White House?

    A. We wouldn't use the term complicity. So far as we now know, Bush did not order or otherwise arrange for Al-Qaeda's attacks on September 11. But once the attacks happened, the plans Bush&Co. already had drawn up for taking advantage of the tragedy were implemented. A frightened, terrorist-obsessed nation did not realize they'd been the object of another assault, this time by those occupying the White House.

    Q. This is startling, and revolting. But I refuse to jump on the conspiracy bandwagon until I see some proof. Bush says he first heard about a "lone" pre-9/11 warning on August 6, and that it was vague and dealt with possible attacks outside the U.S. Why can't we believe him? After all, the FBI and CIA are notorious for their incompetence and bungling. You got a better version that makes sense, I'd love to hear it.

    A. Bush and his spinners want us to concentrate on who knew what detail when; it's the old magician's trick of getting you to look elsewhere while he's doing his prestidigitation. We're not talking about a little clue here and another little clue there, or an FBI memo that wasn't shared. We're talking about long-range planning and analysis of what strategic-intelligence agencies and high-level commissions and geopolitical thinkers around the globe -- including those inside the U.S. -- saw for years before 9/11 as likely scenarios in an age of terrorist attacks.

    The conclusion about Al-Qaeda, stated again and again for years by government analysts, was basically: "They're coming, by air. Get prepared. They're well-organized, determined, and technically adept. And they want to hit big targets, well-known symbols of America." (There was a 1999 U.S. government study, for example, that pointed out that Al-Qaeda suicide-bombers wanted to crash aircraft into a number of significant Washington targets; during the 199 5 trial of Ramsi Yousef, the mastermind of the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, he revealed plans to dive-bomb a plane into CIA headquarters, and earlier he had told FBI agents that the list was expanded to include the Pentagon and other D.C. targets.)

    Elements in the FBI, all over the country, who suspected what was coming, were clamoring, begging, for more agents to be used for counter-terrorism investigations, but were turned down by Attorney General Ashcroft; Ashcroft also gave counter-terrorism short shrift in his budget plans, not even placing anti-terrorism on his priority list; John O'Neill, the FBI's NYC antiterrorism director, resigned, asserting that his attempts at full-scale investigating were being thwarted by higher-ups; someone in the FBI, perhaps on orders of someone higher-up, made sure that the local FBI investigation in Minneapolis of Zacaria Moussauoi was compromised. All this while Ashcroft was shredding the Constitution in his martial law-like desire to amass information, and continues even now to further expand his police-state powers.

    (Note: An FBI agent has filed official complaints over the bureau's interfering with antiterrorism investigations; his lawyers include David Schippers, who worked for the GOP side in the Clinton impeachment effort; Schippers says the agent knew in May 2001 that "an attack on lower Manhattan was imminent." A former FBI official said: "I don't buy the idea that we didn't know what was coming...Within 24 hours [of the attack], the Bureau had about 20 people identified, and photos were sent out to the news media. Obviously this information was available in the files and someone was sitting on it.")

    One can accept the usual incompetency in intelligence collection and analysis from, say, an anti-terrorist desk officer at the FBI, but not from the highest levels of national defense and intelligence in and around the President, where his spokesman, in a bald-faced lie, told the world that the 9/11 attacks came with "no warning." More recently, National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice, in a quavering voice, tried to characterize the many warnings as mere "chatter," and concerned attacks "outside the U.S." But the many warning-reports focused on terrorist attacks both inside and outside the United States; the August 6th briefing dealt with planned attacks IN the United States.

    Not only were there clear warnings from allies abroad, but the U.S., through its ECHELON and other electronic-intercept programs, may well have broken bin Laden's encryption code; for example, the U.S. knew that he told his mother on September 9: "In two days you're going to hear big news, and you're not going to hear from me for a while".

    And, the word of an impending attack was getting out: put options (hedges that a stock's price is going to fall) in enormous quantities were being bought on United Airlines and American Airlines stock, the two carriers of the hijackers, as early as September 7; San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown was warned by "an airport security man" on September 10 to rethink his flight to New York for the next day; Newsweek reported that on September 10, "a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans for the next morning, apparently because of security concerns"; many members of a Bronx mosque were also warned to stay out of lower Manhattan on September 11, etc. etc.

    Q. You're giving me intriguing bits and pieces. Can't you tie it all together and make it make sense?

    A. OK, you asked for it, so we're going to provide you with a kind of shorthand scenario of what may well have gone down, a kind of narrative that attempts to tie a lot of disparate-seeming events together. There is voluminous, multi-sourced evidence that establishes this scenario. It's scary, so prepare yourself.

    We believe that the HardRight began serious planning for a 2000 electoral victory -- and then implementation of a HardRight agenda, and the destruction of a liberal opposition -- a year or two after Clinton's 1996 victory. (The impeachment of Clinton was a key ingredient to sully Democrat opposition.) The GOP HardRight leaders decided early to select George W. Bush, a none-too-bright and easily malleable young man with the right name and pedigree. They ran into a speed-bump when John McCain began to take off in the public imagination, and so with dirty tricks they wrecked his campaign in the South and elsewhere, and continued on their merry course.

    For a while, they fully expected an easy victory over dull Al Gore, tainted goods for a lot of conservative Republicans and others because of his association with Clinton, but, given the obvious limitations of their candidate, they weren't going to take a lot of chances. In Florida, for example, where it looked as if the race might be tight, they early on arranged things -- through Bush's governor-brother Jeb, and the Bush campaign's Katherine Harris, Florida's Secretary of State -- so that George W. couldn't lose. An example: removing tens of thousands of eligible African-American voters from the rolls.

    As it turned out, Gore won the popular vote by more than a half-million votes nationwide, and, we now know, would have won Florida's popular vote had all the ballots been counted, but the U.S. Supreme Court HardRight majority, despite its longtime support for states' rights, in a bit of ethical contortionism did a philosophical reverse in midair and ordered the Florida vote-counting to stop and declared Bush the winner, installing a President rather than letting the people decide for themselves.

    Q. That's ancient history. I'm interested in 9/11, not tearing at an old scab.

    A. OK. We're merely trying to indicate that the HardRight's campaign to take power was not an overnight, post-9/11 whim but worked out long in advance. After so many near-chances to take total control, they would do anything to guarantee a presidential victory this time around -- which would give them full control over the reins of power: Legislature (where HardRightists dominated the House and Senate), the Courts (where the HardRight dominated the U.S. Supreme Court and many appellate courts), and the Executive branch, not to mention the HardRight media control they exerted in so many areas.

    They had followed the news, they knew that the Al-Qaeda terrorist network was engaged in a maniacal jihad against America, and was quite capable -- as they had demonstrated on many occasions, from Saudia Arabia to East Africa to the first attempt on the World Trade Center -- of carrying out their threats. They also knew, from innumerable intelligence reports from telecommunications intercepts, and from various commissions, CIA and foreign agents that Al-Qaeda liked to blow up symbolic icon structures of countries targeted, and that Al-Qaeda, and its affiliates, had an affinity for trying to use airplanes as psychological or actual weapons. (The French had foiled one such attack in 1994, where a hijacked commercial airliner would be flown into the Eiffel Tower.)

    By early 2001 and into the Summer, warnings were pouring in to U.S. intelligence and military agencies from Jordan, Morocco, Egypt, Tunisia, Israel, and other Middle East and South Asian intelligence sources, along with Russia and Britain and the Philippines, saying that a major attack on the U.S. Mainland was in the works, involving the use of airplanes as weapons of mass destruction.

    Indeed, in June and July of 2001, the alerts started to be explicit that air attacks were about to go down in the U.S.; even local FBI offices in Phoenix and Minneapolis began passing warnings up the line about Middle Eastern men acting suspiciously at flight schools. In July, Ashcroft stopped flying on commercial airliners and traveled only by private plane, and Bush, after but a few months in office, announced he was going to ground, spending the month of August on his ranch in Crawford, Texas. Cheney disappeared from view, and our guess is that he was coordinating the overall, post-attack strategy.

    Under this scenario, in mid-Summer 2001, Bush&Co. decided this was it. Bin Laden unknowingly was going to deliver them the gift of terrorism, and they were going to run with it as far and as fast and as hard as they could. The various post-attack scenarios had been worked out, the so-called USA Patriot Act -- which contained various police-state eviscerations of the Constitution -- was polished and prepared for a rush-job (with no hearings) through a post-attack Congress, the war plans against the Taliban in Afghanistan were readied and rolled out, the air-base countries around Afghanistan were brought onboard, and so on. All during the Summer of 2001.

    Q. I don't understand how war against Afghanistan could have been anticipated so early.

    A. Follow the money. Various oil/gas/energy companies had wanted a Central Asian pipeline to run through Afghanistan (costing much less to build, but also so it wouldn't have to go through Russia or Iran); that project was put on hold during the chaos in Afghanistan, but when the Taliban took over and brought stability to that country, the U.S. began negotiating with the Taliban about the pipeline deal. Even after sending them, via the United Nations, $43 million dollars for "poppy-seed eradication," and inviting them to talks in Texas, the Taliban began to balk. At a later meeting, the U.S. negotiator threatened them with an attack unless they handed over bin Laden and reportedly told them, in reference to the pipeline, that they could accept "a carpet of gold" or be buried in "a carpet of bombs." (The later U.S. Government spin was that the bin Laden issue and the pipeline issues were separate, and that the U.S. threats didn't mix the two and there were misunderstandings of what was said.) Shortly thereafter, bin Laden, hiding out in Afghanistan, initiated the September 11th attacks, and the U.S. bombing of that country began. Oh, by the way, in case you haven't noticed, under the new U.S.-friendly government in Kabul, the pipeline project is back on track. Oh, by the way, the pipeline will terminate reasonably close to the power plant in India built by Enron that has been lying dormant for years, waiting for cheap energy supplies.

    Q. You're saying that U.S. war and foreign policy have been dictated by greed?

    A. Among other pleasant motivations, such as hunger for domination and control, domestically and around the globe -- which always ties in with greed. That's why Bush&Co. play such political and military hardball. That's why the arrogant, take-no-prisoners, in-your-face attitude, to bully and frighten potential opponents into silence and acquiescence, even questioning their patriotism if they demur or raise embarrassing issues.

    Q. But this is a democracy, people are still speaking their minds, right?

    A. Certainly, there are areas of America's democratic republic that have not yet been shut down. But where there should be a vibrant opposition party, raising all sorts of questions about Bush Administration policy and plans, America receives mostly silence and timidity. However, as more and more of the ugly truth begins to emerge -- and Enron, Anthrax, and pre-9/11 knowledge are just the tips of the iceberg -- the Democrats (and moderate Republicans) are beginning to feel a bit more emboldened. But just a bit, preferring to run for cover whenever Bush&Co. accuse them of being unpatriotic when they raise pointed questions.

    Q. You're so critical and negative about the Bush Administration. Can't you say anything good about what they're doing?

    A. Yes. They have moved terrorism -- the new face of warfare in our time -- front and center into the world's consciousness, and have mobilized a global coalition against it. They may be making mistakes, which could lead to horrifying consequences, or acting at times out of impure motives, but at least the issue is out there and being debated and acted upon.

    Now, having said that, we must point out that the institutions in this country -- the Constitution, the courts, the legislative bodies, civil liberties, the Bill of Rights, the press, etc. -- are in as much danger as they've ever been in. And the U.S.'s bullying attitude abroad may well lead to disastrous consequences for America down the line.

    Q. So, what's to be done?

    A. The most important thing at the moment -- even, or especially when, the inevitable next terrorist attack occurs -- is to break the illusion of Bush&Co. invulnerability. The best way to do that, aside from ratcheting up the Enron and Anthrax and 9/11 investigations (and it may turn out that those scandals are deeply intertwined), is to defeat GOP candidates in the upcoming November elections. If the Democrats hang on to the Senate and can take over the House, the dream of unchallengable HardRight power will be broken. Bush&Co. will become even more desperate, overt, nasty, and in their arrogance and bullying ways, will make more mistakes and alienate more citizens. The edifice will begin to crumble even more; there will be more and deeper Congressional and media investigations; resignations and/or impeachments (of both Bush & Cheney, and Ashcroft) may well follow.

    Q. You're asking me to support ALL Democrats, even though in a particular race a moderate GOP conservative would be better?

    A. Yes. In some cases, you may have to hold your nose and send money to, canvass for, and vote for a Democrat; we can get rid of the bad ones later. The objective right now -- for the future of the Constitution, and for the lives of our soldiers in uniform and civilians around the globe -- has to be to break the momentum of the HardRight by taking the House and keeping the Senate from returning to GOP control. Doing so would be even more important than what happened when that courageous senator from Vermont, Jim Jeffords, appalled by the HardRight nastiness and greed-agenda of the Bush folks, resigned from the GOP and turned the Senate agenda over to the Democrats.

    Q. And you think if the GOP gets its nose bloodied in the November election, that will convince Bush to resign or lead to his impeachment? I don't get that.

    A. Churchill once told the Brits during World War II that "this is not the beginning of the end, but it is the beginning of the beginning of the end." There is a lot of hard work and organizing and educating to be done, but the recent exposure of Bush coverup-lies about pre-9/11 knowledge is "the beginning of the beginning of the end." With a GOP defeat in November, Democrats will be emboldened to speak up more, investigate deeper, and those inquiries will unlock even more awful secrets of this greed-and-powerhungry administration. And that will be the beginning of the end -- and the beginning of the beginning of a new era of more humane values for America and the rest of the world.

    Bernard Weiner, Ph.D., has taught American government & international relations at Western Washington University and San Diego State University; he was with the San Francisco Chronicle for nearly 20 years, and has published in The Nation, Village Voice, The Progressive, Northwest Passage and widely on the internet.
  • LoungeMachine
    DIAMOND STATUS
    • Jul 2004
    • 32555

    #2
    Re: My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

    Originally posted by Nickdfresh
    No, it wasn't an "inside job," but Bush may well have known more than he has said... Did Neo Con factions in the US Gov't prevent pre-9/11 investigations in order to facilitate a terrorist strike in order to justify an invasion of Iraq? I believe it's a distinct possibility. You be the judge...

    .

    Nick!!!!!!

    Welcome to our world.

    No, Chimpy the Dolt didn't "mastermind" an entire attack as BigWarVibe would like to insinuate we believe....

    But there are some GLARING holes in the "official" story.


    Originally posted by Kristy
    Dude, what in the fuck is wrong with you? I'm full of hate and I do drugs.
    Originally posted by cadaverdog
    I posted under aliases and I jerk off with a sock. Anything else to add?

    Comment

    • Nickdfresh
      SUPER MODERATOR

      • Oct 2004
      • 49136

      #3
      Re: Re: My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

      Originally posted by LoungeMachine
      Nick!!!!!!

      Welcome to our world.

      No, Chimpy the Dolt didn't "mastermind" an entire attack as BigWarVibe would like to insinuate we believe....

      But there are some GLARING holes in the "official" story.


      Well, I've always said that there was some funny shiite that happened around those events, and I don't necessarily agree 100% with the article...

      But it's pretty funny that the guys you mentioned above will gladly hop on the "Able Danger" bandwagon because they disbelieve the 9/11 Commission findings (for all of the wrong reasons), but oh NOOOOO!! They'll never question fearless leader. The fact is only a total blinding idiot could believe that no attack was imminent...

      And while Bush may fill that bill, some of the people in his small, insular inner-circle don't. On one level or another, THEY KNEW A TERROR ATTACK WAS IMMINENT, and did nothing so they could look like golden-heroes...

      Comment

      • Warham
        DIAMOND STATUS
        • Mar 2004
        • 14589

        #4
        Re: Re: My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

        Originally posted by LoungeMachine
        Nick!!!!!!

        Welcome to our world.

        No, Chimpy the Dolt didn't "mastermind" an entire attack as BigWarVibe would like to insinuate we believe....

        But there are some GLARING holes in the "official" story.


        'Welcome to our world', indeed.

        Nick doesn't need to be pushed over the cliff like the others here.

        Comment

        • EAT MY ASSHOLE
          Veteran
          • Feb 2006
          • 1887

          #5
          Hmmmm....
          RIM ME!!!!!!!!!!!!

          Comment

          • LoungeMachine
            DIAMOND STATUS
            • Jul 2004
            • 32555

            #6
            Re: Re: Re: My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

            Originally posted by Warham
            'Welcome to our world', indeed.

            Nick doesn't need to be pushed over the cliff like the others here.
            Simple question for you......

            Who spent more time, energy, and money fighting al Qaeda and "terorism" in general?

            Clinton in his last year in office
            or
            Bush in his first year in office


            And was the 1993 WTC attack, which occurred 38 days into Clinton's term Poppy's fault?

            And which administration has the better capture and CONVICTION track record?



            You hate to admit it, but YOUR guys were caught sitting on their thumbs.

            We just want to know if it was intentional, since they were so bent on Invading Iraq from the start.
            Originally posted by Kristy
            Dude, what in the fuck is wrong with you? I'm full of hate and I do drugs.
            Originally posted by cadaverdog
            I posted under aliases and I jerk off with a sock. Anything else to add?

            Comment

            • LoungeMachine
              DIAMOND STATUS
              • Jul 2004
              • 32555

              #7
              Re: Re: Re: My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

              Originally posted by Warham
              'Welcome to our world', indeed.

              Nick doesn't need to be pushed over the cliff like the others here.
              No, you Bush Lemmings fall over it all by yourselves
              Originally posted by Kristy
              Dude, what in the fuck is wrong with you? I'm full of hate and I do drugs.
              Originally posted by cadaverdog
              I posted under aliases and I jerk off with a sock. Anything else to add?

              Comment

              • Warham
                DIAMOND STATUS
                • Mar 2004
                • 14589

                #8
                Re: Re: Re: Re: My Big 9/11 Cuntspiracy Thread.

                Originally posted by LoungeMachine
                Simple question for you......

                Who spent more time, energy, and money fighting al Qaeda and "terorism" in general?

                Clinton in his last year in office
                or
                Bush in his first year in office


                And was the 1993 WTC attack, which occurred 38 days into Clinton's term Poppy's fault?

                And which administration has the better capture and CONVICTION track record?



                You hate to admit it, but YOUR guys were caught sitting on their thumbs.

                We just want to know if it was intentional, since they were so bent on Invading Iraq from the start.
                I think Clinton did a piss poor job in the years leading up to 9/11, and I think Bush did a piss poor job his first year on the job. Clinton had at least three chances to have bin Laden handed to him by foreign governments and refused each time, going as far back as 1996.

                Bush apparently didn't take Al Qaeda very seriously when he entered office. He was more than likely more worried about domestic matters at that point.

                The 1993 attack was the terrorists' fault, not the fault of either president.

                Which president has the better record for captures and convictions? I'll get back to you after Bush's term is over.

                Comment

                • diamondD
                  Veteran
                  • Jan 2004
                  • 1962

                  #9
                  Anyone read about the cockpit recording of Flight 93 being played in the trial today?

                  Moussaoui trial


                  ALEXANDRIA, Va. - Federal prosecutors seeking the execution of Zacarias Moussaoui figuratively placed the jury aboard doomed Flight 93 for its last searing moments, playing a recording in which the Sept. 11, 2001, hijackers were heard ordering passengers to “shut up” and “sit.”

                  The United Air Lines flight crashed in a Pennsylvania field as passengers tried to retake the plane — a cockpit voice recording played publicly Wednesday for the first time — as the jury heard evidence on whether to give Moussaoui, an admitted terrorist conspirator, the death sentence.

                  The recording began with the hijackers’ voice clearly stating “ladies and gentlemen, this is the captain ... we have a bomb on board, so sit.”

                  For the next few minutes, passengers are repeatedly told, ’Don’t move,” “Shut up” “Sit,” and “down down down.”

                  An air traffic voice says, “Is that United 93 calling?”

                  A translation of the hijackers’ Arabic words was provided to the jury. At one point a hijacker is heard to say “In the name of Allah, most merciful, most compassionate.”

                  There’s a voice in the cockpit saying “Please don’t hurt me. Oh God!” Then a few seconds later somebody says “I don’t want to die!” three times.

                  Groans from cockpit
                  Then there are what sound like groans in the cockpit. Then in Arabic a couple of minutes later, a voice of a hijiacker says “Everything is fine. I finished.” He said that around the time that the plane is turning back toward Washington.

                  As the jury heard the recording, prosecutors played a video presentation that simultaneously showed the flight path, speed and heading in a mockup similar to a flight simulator.

                  In the final minutes of Flight 93, passengers attempted to retake the plane at which point the hijackers crashed it into the western Pennsylvania field. The plane had been headed for the U.S. Capitol, according to Sept. 11 mastermind Khalid Shaikh Mohammed.

                  Moussaoui is the only person charged in this country in connection with the Sept. 11 attacks. The jury deciding his fate has already declared him eligible for the death penalty by determining that his actions caused at least one death on 9/11.

                  Even though he was in jail in Minnesota at the time of the attacks, the jury ruled that lies told by Moussaoui to federal agents a month before the attacks kept them from identifying and stopping some of the hijackers.
                  Death or life in prison?
                  Now they must decide whether Moussaoui deserves execution or life in prison.

                  Defense lawyers say the jury should spare Moussaoui’s life because of his limited role in the attacks, evidence that he is mentally ill and because his execution would only play into his dream of martyrdom.
                  Meet us in the future, not the pasture

                  Comment

                  • diamondD
                    Veteran
                    • Jan 2004
                    • 1962

                    #10
                    After several days of testimony related to the attacks on the World Trade Center in New York, the focus shifted Tuesday to the Pentagon, where the jury saw some of the most gruesome evidence in the trial.

                    Several photos showed badly burned bodies, facial features still discernible. Defense lawyers objected unsuccessfully to their display.

                    Officer testified
                    Lt. Col. John Thurman testified that when the Pentagon was hit, he thought a bomb had exploded, then later described a sensation similar to an earthquake as the plane moved under his second floor office.

                    Thurman crawled through the office, unable to lift his head above the carpet because the smoke was too intense. He said he felt an overwhelming need to take a nap and “that’s when it hit me: I’m going to die. And I got very angry. Angry that terrorists would take my life on the same day my parents were getting their first grandchild” (from his sister).

                    “I realized I had to get out. I pushed file cabinets with all of my strength and found an opening,” Thurman said.

                    Thurman left the Pentagon coughing up black soot and was taken to a hospital. He fully recovered from his injuries after a weeklong hospital stay that included a medically induced coma.

                    “I feel incredibly lucky,” he said. “But there’s guilt about getting the lucky break.”

                    Also on Tuesday, the judge issued an order requiring an unidentified individual to be produced for testimony. The order apparently applied to would-be shoe bomber Richard Reid — defense lawyers issued a subpoena last week seeking his testimony. Prosecutors had opposed the subpoena.

                    Moussaoui testified previously that he and Reid were going to hijack a fifth plane on Sept. 11 and fly it into the White House. The defense lawyers, who have tried to discredit their client’s credibility, have said Moussaoui is exaggerating his role in Sept. 11 to inflate his role in history.
                    Meet us in the future, not the pasture

                    Comment

                    • Guitar Shark
                      ROTH ARMY SUPREME
                      • Jan 2004
                      • 7576

                      #11
                      Originally posted by diamondD
                      Anyone read about the cockpit recording of Flight 93 being played in the trial today?
                      I did, and I can't wait to hear FORD's attempt to explain it all away.
                      ROTH ARMY MILITIA


                      Originally posted by EAT MY ASSHOLE
                      Sharky sometimes needs things spelled out for him in explicit, specific detail. I used to think it was a lawyer thing, but over time it became more and more evident that he's merely someone's idiot twin.

                      Comment

                      • diamondD
                        Veteran
                        • Jan 2004
                        • 1962

                        #12
                        Yep, it's hard to deny that one. It will be years before they let those tapes get played, just due to the sensitivity to the families.

                        Kinda takes the wind out of the old BSCE-govt operatives crap.
                        Meet us in the future, not the pasture

                        Comment

                        • bobgnote
                          Banned
                          • May 2005
                          • 627

                          #13
                          NO BITCH may claim 'conservatism;' anything with a CRACK better move or learn neo-con

                          Hi, ******Z, you might notice that with the illegal, INFLATIONARY power deals of 2000-1, particularly in the wake of those by arch-Zionist, former Ca.Gov.Gray Davis, YOU may not have BOTH your illegal power deals AND military aid to Israel, since you have allowed your speed-freak Democratic-Republicans to GUT YOUR FUNDING INFRASTRUCTURE.

                          That you let BRAC happen in the interim, between when Hadj knocks your asses out of your dodges and Dodger games and Doggie-Dogg dreamworld in 2008 and 9/11/2001 speaks volumes about your corruption and your need for a radical Islamic spanking, which you are going to get! Only that will ease your ******ITIS, illegally white, much too Catholic, and illegally proximate, Jackson-assholes looking to molest each other and THEN tell the Arabs they are 'anti-Semites.'

                          You GEEKS sure are stupid, white-outed ******Z! Chuckie-the-doll, inside! Scratch YOU, you're all rock ******z. Don't scratch me again, ROCK ******Z. You won't learn to PLAY, from me OR from your cool-kikes like Stern or Roth. I WON'T play, they CANNOT play rock MUSIC. But from your DUTCH, like EddieupYOURS, you will learn REAGANOMICS, as in, your hemerrhoids are gonna get a FLAREUP.

                          Sorry about your assholes, for fucking on, neo-con GEEKS inside, pretending you are the conservative-faggot-POPE or Rummy or Cheney. But in reality, you who pretend 'conservatism' are prisoners.

                          Shit-******z. With that crack up your ass reaching all the way around to that forest of dingleberries, YOU NEED A SHAVE, NEO-CON GEEKS!!
                          Last edited by bobgnote; 04-12-2006, 03:08 PM.

                          Comment

                          • Warham
                            DIAMOND STATUS
                            • Mar 2004
                            • 14589

                            #14
                            What the hell was that?

                            Comment

                            • jhale667
                              DIAMOND STATUS
                              • Aug 2004
                              • 20929

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Warham
                              What the hell was that?
                              The ramblings of a racist crackhead...pay him no mind...
                              Originally posted by conmee
                              If anyone even thinks about deleting the Muff Thread they are banned.... no questions asked.

                              That is all.

                              Icon.
                              Originally posted by GO-SPURS-GO
                              I've seen prominent hypocrite liberal on this site Jhale667


                              Originally posted by Isaac R.
                              Then it's really true??:eek:

                              The Muff Thread is really just GONE ???

                              OMFG...who in their right mind...???
                              Originally posted by eddie78
                              I was wrong about you, brother. You're good.

                              Comment

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