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LoungeMachine
10-10-2007, 12:56 PM
Thom Hartmann's Ten Steps To Restore Democracy To America

A Declaration of Rights for the 21st Century


1. Human rights are for humans. Corporations are not persons. We must update the 14th Amendment to insert "natural" before the word "persons" so corporations can no longer claim the "right to lie," the "right to hide their crimes," the "right to buy politicians and influence elections," and "the right to force themselves on communities that don't want them." Corporate charter laws should be amended on a state-by-state basis to reinstate the spirit of the Sherman Anti-Trust Act by again outlawing the ownership of one corporation by another, to limit the term of a corporation, to insert Corporate Code-like language requiring a corporation to place the needs of its community above its desire for profits, and, as Teddy Roosevelt so strongly urged us, to ban corporations from political activity of any sort. Similarly, corporations are not nations and shouldn't stand on an equal footing with nations. The United States should withdraw from support of treaties and agreements such as NAFTA, GATT, WTO, and its support of The World Bank.


2. We own our government and our commons. "Drowning government in a bathtub" as the neo-cons recommend may have been a good idea in the Soviet Union, but the United States is a constitutional representative democratic republic where our government is, literally, us. It was designed to work for us, be owned by us, exist solely by virtue of our ongoing approval, and must answer to us. Government functions must be transparent, and that transparency must also apply to corporations hired by government, particularly any who handle our votes. The shared commons of our nation - including our air, water, transportation routes, airwaves and cable networks, communication systems, military, police, prisons, fire services, health care infrastructure, and courts must be held either by locally-controlled non-profit corporations or by government responsive to its citizens. Because our federal legislators represent us, any benefits, rights, and privileges they have voted for themselves must apply to all of us. Similarly, just as we must balance our budgets every year except when in a crisis, so must our governments. Finally, government must not be a stepping-stone to private profiteering. We must re-institute laws against "revolving doors," particularly with regulatory agencies and the military and those they regulate or who provide military supplies.


3. In a democratic republic, government must represent the will of the majority of the citizens while protecting the rights of the minorities. To make American government more democratic, we must join the rest of the world's modern democracies and institute either proportional representation or Instant Runoff Voting systems at local, state, and federal levels. Similarly, human rights movements defending minorities and women against exploitation by corporate power structures or harm from paranoids, homophobes, and racists must be recognized, and the Equal Rights Amendment passed.


4. A strong middle class is vital to democracy. In 1792, James Madison defined government's role in promoting an American middle class, "By the silent operation of the laws, which, without violating the rights of property, reduce extreme wealth towards a state of mediocrity, and raise extreme indigence toward a state of comfort." To say that somebody who earns millions a year by arbitrage "works that much harder" than a middle-class wage earner is simple nonsense. We recommend restoring inflation-indexed income tax and inheritance tax rates to those that were extant from the 1930s to the 1960s - during the golden era of the American middle class. We also recommend that government become the "employer of last resort" by taking on public works projects and supporting the arts, as it did during that era, and establishing a truly livable minimum wage.


5. Building a civilization on liquefied fossils and then thinking it will last forever makes no sense. According to British Petroleum, world oil reserves are enough to sustain us only into our children's lifetimes, and then will run out. We must institute a Manhattan Project type of effort to create viable energy sources that are not dependent on fossil fuels, and, in the meantime, take immediate steps to reduce use of and preserve our precious stores before they're exhausted.


6. We are part of nature. The natural world - including our water and air - is our most vital and essential commons, and therefore must be protected from those who would despoil it for short-term profit. As we poison the world, we cause human cancer epidemics and degrade our own quality of life. We - through our representative government - must take immediate steps to protect the commons we share with all other life on planet Earth.


7. Education is a human right, regardless of station of birth. When Thomas Jefferson founded the University of Virginia, his vision was to provide a free education to every person interested in and capable of participating. The Founders knew that classroom education is a right - and not a requirement - for life in a democracy. Therefore, university education should be free to all who academically qualify, and primary school education should not be compulsory but neither should it be provided by for-profit corporations..


8. Health care is a human right and necessary to sustain freedom in a democracy. America should join every other industrialized democracy in the world by instituting a single-payer health care system.


9. America is not a kingdom, and we don't elect kings. To turn back from the "imperial presidency" and return the executive branch to its position co-equal with the other two branches of government, we recommend disbanding the primary instrument of presidential power - the Office Of Homeland Security - and requiring the President to meet weekly in open and public discussion with all members of Congress, as is done in the United Kingdom (“Prime Minister’s Questions”) and most other modern democracies.


10. The US Government is an instrument of secular democracy, not a religious theocracy, and has no right in our churches, homes, or bedrooms. What we do in private, among consenting adults, is our business and our business only. Prostitution, drug abuse, alcoholism, and gambling addiction are medical problems, and thus should be handled by medical authorities, and all attempts to place these in the realm of the criminal justice system should be rescinded. Similarly, the government has no right or business using the language or beliefs of any one of our many religions, or to tell any of our religions what or how they should behave or believe.




(c) Copyright 1996-2005, Mythical Research, Inc. and Thom Hartmann

LoungeMachine
10-10-2007, 12:58 PM
AMEN

:cool:

FORD
10-10-2007, 04:06 PM
Kucinich/Hartmann 2008!!

WACF
10-10-2007, 05:20 PM
Very good peice.

The only problem I have is number 10 partially.

My thoughts are that when drug and or alchohol addiction, prostitution, gambling addicitons are sometimes much bigger than medical solutions.

For example...a pimp exploiting an underage prostitute and the John involved need to be dealt with in the justice stysem...there needs to be consequences in some cases.

The Prostitute...she needs medical and social programs to hopefully get her on the right track.

My feeling is that in some cases there will need to be some overlapping of the two...

Blackflag
10-10-2007, 10:53 PM
That's the kind of "I can tell you the problem, but I can't propose a good solution" rambling that ignorant people come up with.

For example: "outlawing the ownership of one corporation by another, to limit the term of a corporation, to insert Corporate Code-like language requiring a corporation to place the needs of its community above its desire for profits"

1. What problem is that supposed to address other than an immature "corporations are bad" attitude? 2. How would you enact any meaningful legislation to make that happen, and 3. What exactly is that supposed to accomplish even if you did?

There are plenty of articles on realistic and meaningful corporate reform proposals if this guy could put down his copy of Highlights long enough to read them. Fucking childish drivel.

Oh, and I like the "Corporate Code-like language" quote. You know, there are words we have to describe that "Code-like" stuff. Maybe the author should learn them. Ass.

FORD
10-10-2007, 11:13 PM
Maybe you should try listening to Hartmann's show, and learn something?

Blackflag
10-10-2007, 11:28 PM
Yeah, he sounds pretty well-informed...kind of like a child who shits his own pants to try and get attention.

I wrote an article on this kind of reform a few years ago, but "Hartman" can probably school me on all that "corporate code type" of stuff and research efforts that are of the "Manhattan Project type."

Very articulate. We'll just draw analogies instead of stating what we mean - "type of thing." Kind of small-vocabulary type of thing.

Tell you what, I'll turn on the radio and listen to this asshat right after I listen to "Rush Limbaugh" type shows.

:D

blonddgirl777
10-10-2007, 11:40 PM
I don't really know of Thom Hartmann but I sure like what I just read!

blonddgirl777
10-10-2007, 11:42 PM
Originally posted by FORD
Maybe you should try listening to Hartmann's show, and learn something?

I don't watch TV anymore but where and when is that on?

Blackflag
10-10-2007, 11:55 PM
Originally posted by blonddgirl777
I don't really know of Thom Hartmann but I sure like what I just read!

Me, too. It makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside. Watching Sesame Street makes me feel like that, too.

FORD
10-11-2007, 12:20 AM
Originally posted by blonddgirl777
I don't watch TV anymore but where and when is that on?

He's not on TV. He's on the radio, though maybe not in Canada.

But if you go to his website, you could look at the list of affiliates, and probably listen to an internet stream from one of them.

http://www.thomhartmann.com/affiliates.shtml

blonddgirl777
10-11-2007, 08:49 AM
Originally posted by Blackflag
... It makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside...

I told you; Lay off the potato booze!

LoungeMachine
10-11-2007, 12:05 PM
Originally posted by Blackflag
Me, too. It makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside. Watching Sesame Street makes me feel like that, too.

All jokes aside, if you actually gave the guy a listen, I believe you'd change you mind.

He's quite the accomplished author as well.

Or you could just throw around your Limbaugh insults, which to those who know the difference, just shows you as ignorant of the facts.

But you've already dug in on your position, so I dont really expect you to listen and consider...

That wouldnt be the internet tough guy-know it all way.

But he's worth listening to. You'd realize how you mis-judged him, IMO

:cool:

Blackflag
10-11-2007, 01:01 PM
I'm not trying to be a dick just for the sake of dickdom, but seriously... those are just little soundbytes to tug on everybody's heart strings without any substance behind them.

Like we need "proportional representation." Who can disagree with that? I love proportional representation, you love it, everybody loves it! Hooray Hartman!

But what does that actually mean? Is he saying get rid of the senate? Is he saying the House is not proportional enough? These are issues that were dealt with 220 yrs. ago...but whatever they did sucks, because Hartman wants "proportional representation," whatever the fuck that means.

I'm in favor of holding national referrendums on issues in Congress, similiar to other countries. That's a position. "Proportional representation" is a bumper sticker.

And I'm still stuck on the 'make corporations expire' bullshit. What the FUCK is that suppoed to accomplish? Nothing. But it would look cool on a bumper sticker.

LoungeMachine
10-11-2007, 01:12 PM
Just give the guy a listen, look at his bibliography, and his background...

I'm telling you in all honesty, he's no Limbaugh.

Mike Malloy is to the Left, as Limbaugh is to the Right.

The guy is an incredible historian, economist, and political scholar...

I've got a pretty good handle on your politics in here, I believe, and I'm telling you you'd respect the guy.

Don't take a top 10 list and judge.

:gulp:

Blackflag
10-11-2007, 01:14 PM
Fair enough, I'll check it out. But he has one strike against him, because I hate people who talk and don't say anything. :cato2:

LoungeMachine
10-11-2007, 01:15 PM
And although some it seems preety obvious, we need to revisit the OBVIOUS considering we live in a country run by people who have eliminated Posse Comitatus, Habeus Corpus, and turned the country over to professional WAR PROFITEERS

LoungeMachine
10-11-2007, 01:16 PM
:cool:

Blackflag
10-11-2007, 01:22 PM
That's why I think national referrendums would help. There's also no reason you can't have federal recalls, like they do for local politicians. In the electronic age, there's no need to have somebody travel to washington to make all our decisions for us.

FORD
10-11-2007, 02:55 PM
Even Mike Malloy says that Thom Hartmann is the most intelligent guy on the radio.

LoungeMachine
10-11-2007, 02:59 PM
Can't wait to read his book Screwed.

He'll be in town at a signing this month!!

Lat days of ancient sunlight was the book that inspired DiCaprio's movie...

When Thom gets on a serious Jeffersonian bender he's a sight to behold!!!

I look forward to his show each morning, and it's no coincidence many of my threads here are directly from his show topics.

Gore / Hartmann 2008 !!!!

FORD
10-11-2007, 03:05 PM
I just wish XM would wise up and carry him live instead of Schultz.

Instead they play 2 hours of his show at 5:00, which cuts into Malloy's time slot so they can only play 2 hours of his show.

And I can't get AM radio worth a shit around here, so my only other option is streaming from the net, which works better some days than others, and ties me to the PC in either case.

LoungeMachine
10-11-2007, 04:23 PM
Originally posted by FORD




And I can't get AM radio worth a shit around here, so my only other option is streaming from the net, which works better some days than others, and ties me to the PC in either case.

Petition Gregoire to get you out of that bunker ;)

AM1090 BABY :cool:

But God, I cannot STAND Big Eddie. :rolleyes:

Give us more Maddow than the lousy 3-5pm bullshit.;

Kent Jones should have his own show, too.

FORD
10-11-2007, 06:25 PM
Rachel Maddow's show has always been a 2 hour show, so at least they carry that one live, as does XM.

I wouldn't break up Rachel and Kent Jones though. Rachel would be fairly monotonous without him, and he probably couldn't keep up his shtick for an entire show by himself.

You never know though.... a lot of people didn't think Sam Seder could carry the Majority Report by himself, but it became his show by default when Janeane went to the West Wing.

It's been great having him back on the radio every night this week. He should just tell Air America to fuck themselves and their once a week shit and move over to Nova M fulltime.

Nickdfresh
10-11-2007, 06:35 PM
Originally posted by Blackflag
Yeah, he sounds pretty well-informed...

:D

Kind of like you on the topics of American workers, outsourcing, and engineers. Huh bumpkin associates degree?

Keef
10-11-2007, 08:41 PM
Originally posted by blonddgirl777
I don't really know of Thom Hartmann but I sure like what I just read!

It's streamed on the net.

Check him out if you like:)


www.airamerica.com/thomhartmannpage/

Blackflag
10-12-2007, 12:12 AM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Kind of like you on the topics of American workers, outsourcing, and engineers. Huh bumpkin associates degree?

:D That's me...bumpkin associate degree guy. I love the irony, makes me smile. ;)

jhale667
10-12-2007, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by LoungeMachine
I've got a pretty good handle on your politics in here, I believe, and I'm telling you you'd respect the guy.

:gulp:


Originally posted by Blackflag
Fair enough, I'll check it out.

:D See, that's what I like about this place. :D

Who's warm and fuzzy now? :lol:

Nickdfresh
10-12-2007, 09:29 AM
Originally posted by Blackflag
:D That's me...bumpkin associate degree guy. I love the irony, makes me smile. ;)

You'd have to understand the concept of irony, first....

And we can add blanket statement dope to the list as well...

Oh, BTW super-informed commentator, GM autoworkers can make up to $28 and hour, which is $42 when working overtime and add generous retirement and healthcare packages on top of that and you've a nice living....

Well they did, anyways...

scamper
10-12-2007, 10:47 AM
Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Huh bumpkin associates degree?

WTF, Nick this is not your style. Is it?

Nickdfresh
10-12-2007, 11:17 AM
WUTS not my style?

Taking assholes down a notch based on their arrogance continually displayed in other threads?

It's about the context...

I'm not really bagging on AS/AA holders - just ones that think they're so far above those "stupid autoworkers, who should just be glad to give away their jobs," because he hasn't a fucking clue of what he's talking about...

Yeah, this is the guy who wrongly continued to argue with me about engineers and autoworkers. Even though apparently he knows nothing about either and knew he was wrong. My brother IS an engineer and I've had several friends who were autoworkers that made close to $100K a year. But he went on making his typical blanket generalizations masked as nuggets of homespun wisdom..

There's something uniquely irritating about Blackdouche. Maybe it's the fact that he thinks his often ignorant opinion matters more than others? Or is it that he's so callous and arrogant while offering so little?

Blackflag
10-12-2007, 11:55 AM
:cry2:

:cry:

:asshole:

FORD
09-20-2010, 01:05 AM
I'm necroposting this (despite all the BlackFag bullshit) because the 10 steps laid out in the original post are still very much needed, and still the solution to fix what's wrong with this country.

PETE'S BROTHER
09-20-2010, 01:21 AM
I'm not trying to be a dick just for the sake of dickdom,

:lmao:

BigBadBrian
09-21-2010, 10:34 AM
I'm necroposting this (despite all the BlackFag bullshit) because the 10 steps laid out in the original post are still very much needed, and still the solution to fix what's wrong with this country.

They sound even more idiotic and Marxist than before. Then again, look who posted it. J/K

Nitro Express
09-21-2010, 11:08 AM
Step 1: Turn the power back to the individual states. The Federal Government is into everything and it concentrates too much power in one area. By turning the power back to the states the power is diversified and spread out. Also, each region of the country is culturally different and by making the laws local, they better fit the local population.

Nitro Express
09-21-2010, 11:20 AM
1) Corporations exist to protect the individual investors from liability. They are a business tool and not an individual so yeah, they should be barred from the political process. I would suggest to make it illegal for corporate money to be used in elections.

3) Benjamin Franklin once said a Democracy is two wolves deciding what's for dinner. The founding fathers intentionally made the United States a Constitutional Republic based on a constitution that outlines basic human rights so EVERYONE would be protected and represented. We are not a democracy.

10) The US is not a theocracy. It's constitution clearly separates church and state. It provides freedom for individuals to make their own choices and if they fuck up and screw themselves, then they fucked up on their own. Also, it allows the freedom to succeed. So we don't need a pope or another cleric to babysit us. It allows the freedom of religion if you choose to belong but makes it clear it's not part of the government but a right allowed.

Seshmeister
09-21-2010, 11:35 AM
3) Benjamin Franklin once said a Democracy is two wolves deciding what's for dinner. The founding fathers intentionally made the United States a Constitutional Republic based on a constitution that outlines basic human rights so EVERYONE would be protected and represented. We are not a democracy.


I've never understood the great significance of people who say this and after reading about it I still don't. It's semantics and nitpicking since all modern democracies have some safeguards like international human rights laws and/or a constitution. Also people can through the electoral process change the constitution as when prohibition was enacted so the democracy is senior to the constitution.

Anyway none of this matters when your politicians are owned(see #1)

BigBadBrian
09-22-2010, 01:31 PM
10) The US is not a theocracy. It's constitution clearly separates church and state.

What article of the Constitution does that?

I'm not arguing with you on the "The US is not a theocracy" statement, btw.

ELVIS
09-23-2010, 10:44 AM
I look forward to his show each morning, and it's no coincidence many of my threads here are directly from his show topics.

Gore / Hartmann 2008 !!!!


LMAO!


:biggrin: