Questions For Long-time Roth Fans...

[OrangeSkies]

Hi guys I'm a newbie and will do my post in the intro thread shortly. But I had some questions for the long-time people on the forum.

Some background before asking my questions. Im a huge Roth era fan love most of his work with VH. Although being in the obvious minority, will say that 1984 is the weakest Roth album imo. Love Eat Em and Smile, but everything afterward is hit or miss.

Here's my questions but be warned they have to do with Sammy Hagar...


1. Granted, most of Sammy's solo work is unsatisfactory but have any of you of guys heard his work with Montrose -

http://music.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=music.artistalbums&artistid=5842&albumid=12840998

2. Did you know Ted Templeman produced Montrose's albums with Sammy? And he was picked by the band to produce VH1 with Dave being the exception, because the rest of VH were huge Montrose fans.

3. Were you aware that Eddie was the main guy responsible for the softrock/Journeyish musical direction for the first two Hagar albums? And that Sammy only worked with the music given to him by Eddie. This doesnt excuse him for doing it given he could have been like Roth and rejected Eddie's music. But Sammy does get placed with too much of the blame for the soft music.

4. Beyond the singles released, have any of you guys listened to FUCK and Balance front to back? Have you heard songs like Judgement Day -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5sfJBw-WRE

or The Seventh Seal - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNFgs168BHI

And would you admit irregardless of hating Sammy that those songs and albums do rock?

5. What is wrong with liking both eras of VH? Roth era has obviously more quality music. But the Sammy era does have a decent amount of gems as well.

6. Why do people on here say you're a Hagar fan if one mentions Dave cant sing anymore? I love Dave, but after watching a high quality bootleg DVD compiliation of various cities on the 2007-08 tour have to agree he has lost it.

He's barely getting through songs that require minimal vocal range without cracking or gurgling on them at some point. If I have to pay close to 200 bucks for a show in this economy, Dave better be having some decent vocals. Which sorry doesnt happen.

To be fair, Im sure the new album if its released this century will have good vocals by Dave. But you can thank autotune for that. I doubt he'll be able to duplicate that on the following tour.

I love Dave, but to quote John Lennon "The Dream is Over" Why is that so hard to admit to on this forum? Would love to hear you guys feedback. But knowing this forum well, expect the usual insults. Instead of rational, well-thought out retorts. But hey maybe I'll be surprised. Counting down to the first you're a fag insult in 5...4...3...2...

[FORD]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oi7uWviS0P4

[lesfunk]

Baaaaa... Baaaaa.

[vanhalen1r2]

Wow, fuck this whole fucking time I thought I was just having a nightmare Shammy Fagar had joined Van Halen and fucked it all up. Damn I really wasn't dreaming.:fufu:



:monekyl::hagar2::monekyr::hagar1:

[PETE'S BROTHER]

not in the pen yet?

[OrangeSkies]

Jeez, I'm so surprised with the insults. It just proves everything in my post has validity when no one can give me an intelligent difference of opinion. And only just come back with attacks.

[jhale667]

You want serious answers? M'kay...

1. Yeah. "Rock Candy" is cool, as are a couple of other tunes. Can't hold a candle to CVH.

2. Yes, and that's relevant how - Being on the WB roster, Templeman would have been one of the producers they would have had their choice of, or are you suggesting that's why they signed with Warner Bros. too?

3. Sure, the singer works with the tunes he's presented, but he could have (if he had one) found his sack and done as most of us here imagine Dave did, and said "Yeah...got anything heavier?"

4. Yes. Aside from a couple of brief hints of former brilliance from EVH (usually in the solos), I'll never get those two hours back, and I'm still pissed.

5. One era defined the era, and the other....not so much.

6. Disagree. He's not shrieking like a 20-something madman anymore, but I (and most here) still like his voice. And as for your speculations on the vocals on the upcoming album, while I'm not going to say there may not be a minimal amount of pitch-correction, that's far different than the robotic-sounding "Auto-tune" you're referring to. It's probably not going to sound like a Kanye West album, don't worry.



NOW can I call you a sheep? :cool:

[vanhalen1r2]

Jeez, I'm so surprised with the insults. It just proves everything in my post has validity when no one can give me an intelligent difference of opinion. And only just come back with attacks.

Well there you go, you proved your own preconceived notion that you would get flamed on a PRO Roth website hence the name Roth Army, now maybe you like the cat by the balls vocal style of Shammy, most people here do not. The other big fallacy that you are trying to make is that Diamond Dave has lost his pipes, that is simply not true, are you jealous of the success of the 07/08 tour compared with the Shammy 04 debacle ? The cold hard truth is most people prefer DLR era Van Halen to the Van Shagar era. Maybe you could win friends and influence people on Red Shammy .com instead of this forum :umm:

http://www.rotharmy.com/forums/images/misc/head1_small.png

[hambon4lif]

Jeez, I'm so surprised with the insults. It just proves everything in my post has validity when no one can give me an intelligent difference of opinion. And only just come back with attacks.<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/I05JAL9MB-Y?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/I05JAL9MB-Y?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

[OrangeSkies]

Ok I never said Montrose was better than CVH. Their debut album is a great piece of work though. BTW Space Station No.5 kicks ass. I'm not jealous of the 07-08 tour. I was pumped for it. Until two things happened - One, the outrageous ticket prices. Two, more than one person I knew that attended the shows (and these are die hard Roth fans minds you) thought the band was tight. But Dave was the weakest link in their opinion. Plus the fact the dvd I saw had awesome quality audio unlike internet postings. My opinion was the same as my friends - band good, Roth -not so good.

I'm not expecting to him to sing like hes 26 years old anymore. At the same time I think its a reasonable expectation for his voice to not give out on every song. Which it does from what I've seen. Or when it doesnt, he rush-sings through the songs like he's going to fall apart if he doesnt. I think people's overwhelming desire to relive 1984 again has clouded their judgement to the point where a faltering vocal can be overlooked.

The people who paid 200 bucks for the shows are the ones I feel sorry for. When you're paying that amount of cash, you should be getting top quality. And all I've seen people get in return is substandard. And you know that would be fine if the band werent charging so much.

BTW do a little bit more digging, sales on the first dates of 2004 tour were strong. But due to word of mouth about Eddie's drunkeness, dropped off. That had nothing to do with Sammy. Whether you hate Sammy or not, he can still sing. To be fair he has had some off nights. But thats been due to ill health. And even his off nights vocally live are much better than Roth's.

I'm not saying anybody should pick one era over the era. A point that was made in the earlier post. Why cant people like both periods? Even if one (Roth) is better than the other. Sammy era still has some good songs. Why call someone a sheep if they like both eras?

There is nothing wrong with admitting Dave's lost the pipes. I still love his music. Just aint going to pay for the live vocal trainwreck is all.

[GAR]

Jeez, I'm so surprised with the insults. It just proves everything in my post has validity when no one can give me an intelligent difference of opinion. And only just come back with attacks.

I can't speak for the crowd here, but Sammy Hagar's jump-shark moment was his title track for the Heavy Metal animation movie, a few years before joining Van Hagar.

Have you ever had the really good freebase cocaine though, cuz whatever you're smokin with fresh threads like this can't be very good.

Now please go to the Welcome Wagon forum and start all over with a new thread titled "Sammy Ain't So Bad."

[FORD]

Given your username, sheep, maybe you should go troll a Cars board? Maybe you can make a case there for the Todd Rundgren embarrassment of a tour being better than the original band with Ric Ocasek and Ben Orr.

[GAR]

Why cant people like both periods? Even if one (Roth) is better than the other.

It's not just that Sammy was a fat tard piece of shit frontman - the whole premise of this discussion boards' existence here is based on the fact that the band wrote differently to accommodate said Fatso clown-assed drooler, and having wrecked our favorite band Van Halen we say they should have either a) called it a different band which it was, or b) called it a day.

I can't put it simpler than that. Van Hagar was a fuckin' gay fucked-up premise of a band that was an awesome thing under an awesome frontman: we know what the band did in the past and we've held expectations for better output the last 25+ years and that's that.

Having known what they can do, and having seen they can't do it and never did with Hagar, we do not ever wish to see Van Hagar in any form ever again.

[twonabomber]

the outrageous ticket prices.

the outrageous (to you, at least) ticket prices were/are not unique to the Van Halen tour (or a major arena tour) and are therefore not a factor in this argument.

i got a 12th row ticket for the Montreal show and paid nowhere near $200. okay, it was an unsold 4 star package ticket and i didn't get the (worthless) swag, but still...

[Dan]

not in the pen yet?

Yes,Straight Into The Sheep Pen For This Fucker.:D

[GAR]

The last time I had a case of the Orange Skies, it was a 48 hour fever from contracting a dose of chlamyddia after fucking a 15 year old groupie slut from Burbank High who hissed like a steam iron.

[Dave's Bitch]

Why cant people like both periods?, Did you miss the sign on the way in?,this is not the Van Halen army, this is the DAVID LEE ROTH army.A place for DAVID LEE ROTH fans to kick back and talk DAVID LEE ROTH.Like what ever the hell you want buddy,your choice but remember we are all DAVID LEE ROTH fans.You start talking pro sammy anti DAVID LEE ROTH you WILL be destroyed

mmkay honey pie ;)

[GreenBayLA]

I'm just here to ask a few questions ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[sadaist]

1. have any of you of guys heard his work with Montrose -

Yes. many here enjoy Montrose.

2. Did you know Ted Templeman produced Montrose's albums with Sammy?

Yes. Many here are Ted Templeman fans

3. Were you aware that Eddie was the main guy responsible for the softrock/Journeyish musical direction for the first two Hagar albums? And that Sammy only worked with the music given to him by Eddie.

Yes. Sammy still wrote the lyrics & harmonies. Nice to see that you realize that Van Halen with Sammy sounds more like Journey than they sound like the first 6 VH albums.

4. Beyond the singles released, have any of you guys listened to FUCK and Balance front to back?

Yes. I personally own all VH albums as do most everyone else that frequents this site.


4.5 And would you admit irregardless of hating Sammy that those songs and albums do rock?

Depends on where you would like to put them on the "rock" scale. Rock compared to Culture Club or Wham!? Absolutely. Rock compared to VHI? Absolutely not.

5. What is wrong with liking both eras of VH?

Nothing at all.

And most people I have met on these boards has no problem with people enjoying both eras. We also like Neil Diamond, Elvis, The Doors, Skynard & Willie Nelson. We just don't like it when they want to call themselves "VAN HALEN". When Dave left and Sammy joined, they should have changed their name. The music changed so drastically that it was a completely different band with a different vibe. Doesn't matter which you prefer, point is the two eras are extremely different and should not have been sold to the fans with the same brand name.

6. Why do people on here say you're a Hagar fan if one mentions Dave cant sing anymore?

Not true. But 99% of the time, posters that proclaim Dave can't sing are using that as an argument to make Sammy the winner. The problem with that whole "Dave can't sing" argument is that you miss the point of Van Halen in it's entirety. Dave could never sing..at least not in a fashion that would be considered spectacular. Daves magic is in his showmanship, his lyrics, his attitude, his harmonizing, his composition, his bluesyness, his promotion of the band, his wit, his writing, and especially his pushing Edward to be his best.


This is just my $0.02. Take it, leave it, or ignore it and troll again elsewhere. I don't care. Gives me something to respond to when I have insomnia.

:)

[OrangeSkies]

GAR, I'm not gonna deny it and nor already have that Sammy's solo career is mediocre (with the exception of the self-titled album of 78. Only because that still has a Montrose vibe to it. Before AOR creeped in)

I'd actually might have to agree with you though. I thought people here might be open to a discourse of discussion if it came from someone that is a dave fan and not a hater. Cause this forum does have a bad reputation even to diehard dave fans from other sites that hate sammy as well. But being theres a little left of the foolish optimist I am like to give people the benefit of the doub

Ford, I can already tell your lack of knowledge of when it comes to rock and roll history. Otherwise, you would know my name comes from a song by a group called Love. You know the first interracially integrated rock band in history before hendrix. With a black frontman/singer and white guys who were the backing musicians. They came out with what is considered the very first punk rock song 7 and 7 Is. Oh, and influenced a bunch of bands along the way too like The Doors, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin.

But that's probably because I like other music besides pedal to the metal rock. A little like Diamond Dave has to his credit, eclecticism. At the time Van Hagar was out in the 80's, admittedly I didnt listen to them. I was more into Jane's Addiction. Who were considered to be my generations Van Halen. (Note for the trolls, I'm not saying Janes is better than classic VH) Their music to me though picks up where the DLR era of VH left off. They had a great frontman with Perry, the sense of humor and overall badass rock and roll.

I didnt start liking Van Hagar until my older cousin played for me the FUCK album in its entirety on a road trip back around 91-92ish. While the album does have a couple of clunkers (Right Now, Spanked) It is a pretty strong rock record for the Van Hagar era. Same with Balance a good record with some stinkers - (Cant Stop Loving You, Not Enough Big Fat Money) But still contains some of the heaviest rock they've ever done.

GAR as I already mentioned before, they didnt write differently to accomodate Sammy. Its just Sammy was ok with putting words and melody to the soft rock pieces of music Eddie gave him. But I changed my mind on something I said earlier. Sammy didnt have much of a choice but to have work with the music given to him by Eddie being new to the band. For example, let's say Chris Cornell from one of my favorite bands of all time Soundgarden joined VH instead of Sammy. He would have probably written the same kind of sub-par songs as Sammy did due to Eddie's soft-rock music. These guys cant say no to his music like David Lee could. Because David Lee was one of the founding architects of the band and could get away with it at the time

Whereas now he may have a hard time saying no since hes Eddies bitch now due to his solo career going south after Vai and Sheehan left him. BTW DLR is just as guilty as Eddie in the soft rock/synthesizer dept. Anybody gone back and listen to Skyscraper lately? Or Jump or I'll Wiat

Even if the musical direction Eddie took during the first two Hagar albums later proved to be ill-advised, at least he was trying to challenge himself musically. At least he attempted to do something different, even if he failed spectacuarly at it. Which says more than a lot of his peers (bands I love) that repeat the sound of their first album with every new release.

You're calling me a sheep? How comical and hypocritical. You are so blindly devoted to the emperor, refusing to see he has no clothes. For example, I'm a big fan of Lou Reed based on his work with The Velvet Underground. But even I have to admit he sucks horribly live now. While he never had much of a voice to begin with, its completely degenerated into sounding like the crypt keeper.

Same thing with Dave. Love his music, but now hes turned into a parody of himself live. But hey just my opinion which is obviously in the minority. Outside this forum however, a huge amount of Dave fans share my opinion especially after seeing the last tour. Because as anyone will tell you the internet counts for the minority of fans, not just the majority.

[Cato]

I'm so stupid I can't figure out what this smartass is talking about.

[chefcraig]

I'm so stupid I can't figure out what this smartass is talking about.

I doubt he knows what he is talking about...



4.5 And would you admit irregardless of hating Sammy that those songs and albums do rock?

What does "irregardless" mean? http://freesmileyface.net/smiley/Unhappy/you-fool-038.gif (http://freesmileyface.net)

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Where are the fucking moderators at....

And why in the fuck is a fucking Hagarita thread doing in MAIN forum ??

Moving....

[Northern Girl]

Dude, what's your point in coming here?

Did you think you were going to come here and change people's minds about Sammy Hagar? No one here cares. If you like the Sammy era, fine. Like whatever the fuck you like. Why do you need validation from others?

Besides, the reasons why people like Dave and dislike Sammy go well beyond the music and vocal abilities.

[Terry]

There's nothing "wrong" with liking Sammy Hagar or enjoying what Van Halen did when Hagar was in the group.

The other side of that coin is there isn't anything wrong with not particularly caring for what Sammy Hagar brought to the group, either.

For me, music is a visceral thing: it either moves me or it doesn't. Sammy Hagar's material, even as far back as Montrose, just really doesn't do much for me. Nothing exceptional about it. This is putting all the bullshit barbs between Hagar, Roth and the Van Halens in the press over the years to one side: I find the tone and timbre of Hagar's voice mildly annoying and his lyrics are just banal.

Fair enough point that Roth's voice certainly isn't what it used to be, but this doesn't upgrade Hagar for me in retrospect.

Sure, the pussification of Van Halen post-1985 wasn't something Hagar alone was responsible for. Eddie got soft, and it was an intentional stylistic shift.

For myself, I'm not a huge fan of every single thing Roth has done post-1985, either. However, by and large I enjoy the vast bulk of Roth's solo career. It's all down to that gut reaction. FUCK and Balance had a few decent tracks instrumentally, but whenever Hagar starts singing it just negates whatever decent vibes Ed, Al and Mike were managing to put across. It's just nails on a chalkboard to me.

In all honesty Orangeskies, there ARE other VH-oriented sites that are more in tune with your viewpoint...sites that you might find more comfortable to post on. This site is dedicated to Classic Van Halen and David Lee Roth. The overall sentiment towards Hagar here is less than charitable, and really isn't based on some blind devotion to Roth. I'd be willing to wager most people here gave Van Halen with Hagar a fair shake/listen before concluding Van Hagar wasn't for them.

[thome]

Back in 73 or 75 whenever...? I am not even going to look up the dates..I am that unconcerned.. a older brother of a friend of mine who used to have good weed...we would sit in brothers room while he played this bad assed Red SG and he had just bought this new Montrose LP...I had never heard "Montrose the band" but had heard of Ronnie Montrose in some guitar mag and new he was good because of how the older brother said it was so.

We listened all the way thru while the older brother tried to catch the guitar liks and I am straight up honest with you I was agreeing with everyone what a awesome LP and the guitar work ...but inside I wasn't kissing ass for weed All I could do to get the fukk out of that room with that innane skreaching by some singer I would later find out was Sammy hagar.

So junior your ears are twisted and in need of perhaps a doctors visit.

I would put up with most anything to hear the brother play guitar and I have put up with lots of crap to hear one thing within a bands releases or live shows but I can only name one instance where I have felt it screws all and I cannot find anything interesting when that twit starts to sing.

Perhaps it isn't what Roth can't do but more what Sam doesn't do.

[Northern Girl]

There's nothing "wrong" with liking Sammy Hagar or enjoying what Van Halen did when Hagar was in the group.

The other side of that coin is there isn't anything wrong with not particularly caring for what Sammy Hagar brought to the group, either.

For me, music is a visceral thing: it either moves me or it doesn't. Sammy Hagar's material, even as far back as Montrose, just really doesn't do much for me. Nothing exceptional about it. This is putting all the bullshit barbs between Hagar, Roth and the Van Halens in the press over the years to one side: I find the tone and timbre of Hagar's voice mildly annoying and his lyrics are just banal.

Fair enough point that Roth's voice certainly isn't what it used to be, but this doesn't upgrade Hagar for me in retrospect.

Sure, the pussification of Van Halen post-1985 wasn't something Hagar alone was responsible for. Eddie got soft, and it was an intentional stylistic shift.

For myself, I'm not a huge fan of every single thing Roth has done post-1985, either. However, by and large I enjoy the vast bulk of Roth's solo career. It's all down to that gut reaction. FUCK and Balance had a few decent tracks instrumentally, but whenever Hagar starts singing it just negates whatever decent vibes Ed, Al and Mike were managing to put across. It's just nails on a chalkboard to me.

In all honesty Orangeskies, there ARE other VH-oriented sites that are more in tune with your viewpoint...sites that you might find more comfortable to post on. This site is dedicated to Classic Van Halen and David Lee Roth. The overall sentiment towards Hagar here is less than charitable, and really isn't based on some blind devotion to Roth. I'd be willing to wager most people here gave Van Halen with Hagar a fair shake/listen before concluding Van Hagar wasn't for them.

Exactly what I was thinking and would have articulated if I had as much free time as some people. ;)

Alas, back to work.

[chefcraig]

I really do not follow the reasoning of people all that well anymore, particularly in use of the internet. For instance, a guy joins a site called "THE DAVID LEE ROTH ARMY", posts the following, and wonders why he gets insulted:



...Why do people on here say you're a Hagar fan if one mentions Dave cant sing anymore? I love Dave, but after watching a high quality bootleg DVD compiliation of various cities on the 2007-08 tour have to agree he has lost it.

He's barely getting through songs that require minimal vocal range without cracking or gurgling on them at some point. If I have to pay close to 200 bucks for a show in this economy, Dave better be having some decent vocals. Which sorry doesnt happen.

To be fair, Im sure the new album if its released this century will have good vocals by Dave. But you can thank autotune for that. I doubt he'll be able to duplicate that on the following tour.

I love Dave, but to quote John Lennon "The Dream is Over" Why is that so hard to admit to on this forum? Would love to hear you guys feedback. But knowing this forum well, expect the usual insults. Instead of rational, well-thought out retorts. But hey maybe I'll be surprised. Counting down to the first you're a fag insult in 5...4...3...2...

Seriously, other than an exercise in some odd form of self-abuse, what does this accomplish? The fact is, the members of this site by and large made their decision regarding the superior era of Van Halen long ago, and joined this site to not only say as much, but to continue to support Dave Roth as an entertainer and (yes, for many) a role model. Yet here we have a person (who if is being honest about his age) born sometime in 1980, and having never having seen CVH other than via video clips giving us all a history lesson about Hagar and Ted Templeman. It's as if that although the accident of birth has left this guy 3 decades behind the 8-ball, it is incumbent upon everyone else to step aside for his interpretation of history. Sorry, I don't buy that bullshit nor the sense of entitlement that goes along with it.

Look, once and for all...Sammy Hagar is like the second Darren on Bewitched. He replaced the original guy, wasn't as good as the original guy and if he is remembered at all, it will be for not being the equal (let alone a fraction as good) as the original guy.

[ELVIS]

1. Granted, most of Sammy's solo work is unsatisfactory but have any of you of guys heard his work with Montrose -

Isn't Montrose in Colorado ??

2. Did you know Ted Templeman produced Montrose's albums with Sammy? And he was picked by the band to produce VH1 with Dave being the exception, because the rest of VH were huge Montrose fans.

No, it's because it's because they all smoked weed with the Doobie Brothers. It was Templeman who sold the weed and it was Dave who suggested the name Doobie Brothers. Dave is quoted as saying: "Hey guys, you should be called The Dobbie Brothers because you like to smoke weed."

3. Were you aware that Eddie was the main guy responsible for the softrock/Journeyish musical direction for the first two Hagar albums? And that Sammy only worked with the music given to him by Eddie. This doesnt excuse him for doing it given he could have been like Roth and rejected Eddie's music. But Sammy does get placed with too much of the blame for the soft music.

Edward never wrote any songs, he's a guitar player, DUH!

4. Beyond the singles released, have any of you guys listened to FUCK and Balance front to back? Have you heard songs like Judgement Day -

Never heard of FUCK and Balance, but the name sounds cool. Judgement Day is a movie, isn't it ??

or The Seventh Seal -

Does not compute. Are you illiterate ??

And would you admit irregardless of hating Sammy that those songs and albums do rock?

The members here instinctively hate Sammy Hagar without the slightest need to examine his work with Van Halen. It's like being born with a silver spoon...

5. What is wrong with liking both eras of VH? Roth era has obviously more quality music. But the Sammy era does have a decent amount of gems as well.

Do you hear voices ?? Get the gun, GET THE GUN, GET THE GUN!

6. Why do people on here say you're a Hagar fan if one mentions Dave cant sing anymore? I love Dave, but after watching a high quality bootleg DVD compiliation of various cities on the 2007-08 tour have to agree he has lost it.

That's BS and you're obviously a troll. Ed and his chubby son were the weak links on the tour...

He's barely getting through songs that require minimal vocal range without cracking or gurgling on them at some point. If I have to pay close to 200 bucks for a show in this economy, Dave better be having some decent vocals. Which sorry doesnt happen.

Sorry apparently happens in your family...

To be fair, Im sure the new album if its released this century will have good vocals by Dave. But you can thank autotune for that. I doubt he'll be able to duplicate that on the following tour.

Thanks autotune. Will dave also be using crackingtune and gurglingtune ??

I love Dave, but to quote John Lennon "The Dream is Over" Why is that so hard to admit to on this forum? Would love to hear you guys feedback. But knowing this forum well, expect the usual insults. Instead of rational, well-thought out retorts. But hey maybe I'll be surprised. Counting down to the first you're a fag insult in 5...4...3...2...

You're an illiterate Hagar loving fag...




What a dumbass...:biggrin:


:elvis:

[sadaist]

I actually don't give a shit if 99.9% of people love Sammy & hate Dave. I dig Roth and was so happy when I saw them live in Nov 2007 I can't even describe it. Was the best show I have ever seen and I enjoyed it thoroughly. They will get my money next time they tour, I will go and have a great time, and I won't even think about anyone sitting at home that doesn't like them.

When you listen to an album do you:

a) enjoy the music

or

b) while listening, think about all the people that hate it (or should hate it)

If the answer isn't A, you are listening to music for all the wrong reasons. Listen to what makes you happy. Don't listen to music you don't like. And leave everyone else the fuck alone.

[Jagermeister]

I really do not follow the reasoning of people all that well anymore, particularly in use of the internet. For instance, a guy joins a site called "THE DAVID LEE ROTH ARMY", posts the following, and wonders why he gets insulted:

Craig a guy can post just about anything here and get insulted.

[ELVIS]

Anything

[chefcraig]

Craig a guy can post just about anything here and get insulted.

True enough, man. I just don't follow the logic of setting out with that as an intended goal in the first place.

[Jagermeister]

Anything


Dumb Ass!:biggrin:

[Jagermeister]

True enough, man. I just don't follow the logic of setting out with that as an intended goal in the first place.

I don't either but the guy is new. I guess.

[VAiN]

Plus the fact the dvd I saw had awesome quality audio unlike internet postings.

There is nothing wrong with admitting Dave's lost the pipes. I still love his music. Just aint going to pay for the live vocal trainwreck is all.

OK, I'll bite - which DVD did you see? I have pretty much all of them, AND I saw them in-person 6 times in 07/08 and at no time did I feel Dave was the weak link.

[FORD]

Ford, I can already tell your lack of knowledge of when it comes to rock and roll history.

Now that's the first fucking time in my life that I ever heard THAT ridiculous accusation. I forgot more about rock n roll history after one night of binge drinking in my 20's than you'll ever know in your entire cheese eating, tequila drinking, pasture grazing life. :sheepshagger:

[Cato]

>this forum does have a bad reputation even to diehard dave fans from other sites that hate sammy as well.
knockz and blackfag?

[Diamondjimi]

Cause this forum does have a bad reputation even to diehard dave fans from other sites that hate sammy as well.

Yeah, so what's the fuckin problem?


Bad Reputation? Yer goddamn right!

[ELVIS]

Dumb Ass!:biggrin:


Proof

[jhale667]

Yeah, so what's the fuckin problem?


Bad Reputation? Yer goddamn right!


"Bad" reputation - for grinding fucking sheep into fine dust... :biggrin:

[GAR]

Anything

edit: sorrry E

[GAR]

GAR as I already mentioned before, they didnt write differently to accomodate Sammy. Its just Sammy was ok with putting words and melody to the soft rock pieces of music Eddie gave him. But I changed my mind on something I said earlier. Sammy didnt have much of a choice but to have work with the music given to him by Eddie being new to the band.

Just going from memory of articles I'd read written from 1985 thru '89, it is generally a known fact Sammy was not limited in Van Hagar songwriting function the way you described. He contributed both lyrics, vocal melody, and both modifying music structure given to him as well as providing initial format and structure in some cases.

I'm no expert in things I held serious revulsion for at the time, but I did follow it's development in the press which was a similar style of collaboration the band had with Dave.

So what I'm saying here is Sammy is fully responsible for the shitty tunes in Van Hagar and as such he must be punished.

[Diamondjimi]

STFU you rambling idiot....

[FORD]

And now a word from our sponsors.......


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMOuIhhRHfA

A shitty song by a shitty band, endorsing a shitty product. :biggrin:

[vanhalen1r2]

And now a word from our sponsors.......


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMOuIhhRHfA

A shitty song by a shitty band, endorsing a shitty product. :biggrin:


Good one FORD, you know when Ford and Vanhalen1r2 Agree, its the 100% fucking truth

[Terry]

OK, I'll bite - which DVD did you see? I have pretty much all of them, AND I saw them in-person 6 times in 07/08 and at no time did I feel Dave was the weak link.

From the show I saw in person, the two full-length boots I have on dvd and the youtube clips posted, Eddie came across to me as the one who wasn't able to rise to the occasion 100%.

[DlocRoth]

There's nothing "wrong" with liking Sammy Hagar or enjoying what Van Halen did when Hagar was in the group.

The other side of that coin is there isn't anything wrong with not particularly caring for what Sammy Hagar brought to the group, either.

For me, music is a visceral thing: it either moves me or it doesn't. Sammy Hagar's material, even as far back as Montrose, just really doesn't do much for me. Nothing exceptional about it. This is putting all the bullshit barbs between Hagar, Roth and the Van Halens in the press over the years to one side: I find the tone and timbre of Hagar's voice mildly annoying and his lyrics are just banal.

Fair enough point that Roth's voice certainly isn't what it used to be, but this doesn't upgrade Hagar for me in retrospect.

Sure, the pussification of Van Halen post-1985 wasn't something Hagar alone was responsible for. Eddie got soft, and it was an intentional stylistic shift.

For myself, I'm not a huge fan of every single thing Roth has done post-1985, either. However, by and large I enjoy the vast bulk of Roth's solo career. It's all down to that gut reaction. FUCK and Balance had a few decent tracks instrumentally, but whenever Hagar starts singing it just negates whatever decent vibes Ed, Al and Mike were managing to put across. It's just nails on a chalkboard to me.

In all honesty Orangeskies, there ARE other VH-oriented sites that are more in tune with your viewpoint...sites that you might find more comfortable to post on. This site is dedicated to Classic Van Halen and David Lee Roth. The overall sentiment towards Hagar here is less than charitable, and really isn't based on some blind devotion to Roth. I'd be willing to wager most people here gave Van Halen with Hagar a fair shake/listen before concluding Van Hagar wasn't for them.

Spot on, Terry.

Post of the year nominee.

[paulscape]

I like Sammy and his contribution to Van Halen's later years but DLR is just such a cool cat y'know? Even if he didnt sing at all and Van Halen played instrumentals live with Dave smiling and dancing Id be happy. Van Halen is about attitude and to quote DLR 'how good you look'. Roth looks better, talks better, dresses better and reminds me of so many places and times. His lyrics are not deep metaphysical saga's but they are honest, interesting and often memorably cool. Roth is multi-dimensional: he's part beatnik, part hippy, part surfer, part rocker, part sinatra, part Bard, part poet, part explorer, on and on and on. With Sammy all I can come up with is part boxer part Tequila. Sammy would be a nice bloke to have as a dad or a history teacher but Roth is the guy I would want to hang out with and make music with. Flame away...

[Seshmeister]

There's nothing "wrong" with liking Sammy Hagar or enjoying what Van Halen did when Hagar was in the group.

The other side of that coin is there isn't anything wrong with not particularly caring for what Sammy Hagar brought to the group, either.

For me, music is a visceral thing: it either moves me or it doesn't. Sammy Hagar's material, even as far back as Montrose, just really doesn't do much for me. Nothing exceptional about it. This is putting all the bullshit barbs between Hagar, Roth and the Van Halens in the press over the years to one side: I find the tone and timbre of Hagar's voice mildly annoying and his lyrics are just banal.

Fair enough point that Roth's voice certainly isn't what it used to be, but this doesn't upgrade Hagar for me in retrospect.

Sure, the pussification of Van Halen post-1985 wasn't something Hagar alone was responsible for. Eddie got soft, and it was an intentional stylistic shift.

For myself, I'm not a huge fan of every single thing Roth has done post-1985, either. However, by and large I enjoy the vast bulk of Roth's solo career. It's all down to that gut reaction. FUCK and Balance had a few decent tracks instrumentally, but whenever Hagar starts singing it just negates whatever decent vibes Ed, Al and Mike were managing to put across. It's just nails on a chalkboard to me.

In all honesty Orangeskies, there ARE other VH-oriented sites that are more in tune with your viewpoint...sites that you might find more comfortable to post on. This site is dedicated to Classic Van Halen and David Lee Roth. The overall sentiment towards Hagar here is less than charitable, and really isn't based on some blind devotion to Roth. I'd be willing to wager most people here gave Van Halen with Hagar a fair shake/listen before concluding Van Hagar wasn't for them.

I agree wholeheartedly with this post apart from the first line.

Going through life with no taste is no way to be.

The worst thing about Sammy Hagar is that I can't say in public I like Van Halen or even wear a Van Halen t-shirt without the toe curling fear that people might think I am talking about Van Hagar.

[GreenBayLA]

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRLiymUBqyNxfU9hf1lqaHb-1vYUdJCMfJSLO99zN8K_eIpzgY&t=1&usg=__PFEnW7eaheFT9g81H-mr_fGzBKA=

[ELVIS]

The worst thing about Sammy Hagar is that I can't say in public I like Van Halen or even wear a Van Halen t-shirt without the toe curling fear that people might think I am talking about Van Hagar.

~Ha!~

:elvis: